Bridging the Divide: How NGL Turns Water Management into Energy Advantage

Doug White, Executive Vice President of Water Solutions at NGL Energy Partners, highlights how technology and teamwork are driving sustainable water solutions in the energy sector. 🔧💧

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Tomorrow's World Today - S5E01 – Water From The Desert

How NGL Energy Partners Transforms Fracking Wastewater

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What is Water Recycling?

Transcript

(0:00) Welcome to the Tomorrow's World Today podcast. (0:04) We sit down with experts, world-changing innovators, (0:07) creators, and makers to explore how they're taking action (0:10) to make tomorrow's world a better place for technology, (0:14) science, innovation, sustainability, the arts, and more. (0:18) On this episode, host George Davison, (0:20) who is also the host of the TV series Tomorrow's World Today, (0:24) sits down with Doug White, (0:25) Executive Vice President of Water Solutions at NGL Energy Partners.
(0:30) Doug shares his journey from rural Missouri (0:32) to the executive ranks of one of America's leading midstream energy companies. (0:37) He reflects on the early experiences that shaped his leadership style, (0:41) the mentors who guided him, (0:43) and the challenges of managing water in modern oil and gas operations. (0:48) Welcome, Doug.
(0:49) Good morning. (0:50) I was hoping today we could spend a little time together (0:54) and if we could just kind of reflect back on some times (0:57) maybe you and I could shed some light on how we got here, right? (1:02) I mean, it doesn't just magically snap under the fingers (1:05) and the next thing you know you're an executive inside a major corporation. (1:09) So, can we go back? (1:12) First of all, why don't we talk a little bit about your title.
(1:17) What exactly do you do? (1:20) What's your title? (1:21) That kind of thing. (1:22) Sure. (1:23) So, I'm Executive Vice President of NGL Water Solutions, (1:27) which is one of the three segments of our business, of our company.
(1:31) And so, I'm tasked with setting strategy for the growth of the business (1:35) and then putting the team together to run a strong and successful organization. (1:41) Okay. (1:42) So, the business that you're in, can you describe a little bit about the business? (1:47) Yes.
(1:48) It's a unique business. (1:52) As many people understand, the energy business, we're a part of that. (1:57) We're specifically engaged in managing water in the oil and gas fields (2:02) and the shale plays in the United States.
(2:05) Okay. (2:05) So, one day you were in high school (2:08) and from what I understand you were a football player (2:11) and having some good times like we all did in high school. (2:14) And do you have any memories of those days (2:19) that maybe kind of got you started on a journey to get you where you are today? (2:24) Sure.
(2:25) You know, it's really interesting. (2:27) You said we didn't get here that quickly, (2:30) but as you get older you realize how quickly time goes (2:34) and you think about the decisions that you made (2:38) that took you on the journey where you are today. (2:41) For me, growing up in Northwest Missouri, a small farm community, (2:47) we learned whether we liked it or not to work hard (2:50) and make decisions that even as being younger you have to make (2:57) just because of where you're from.
(2:59) I was fortunate enough to have opportunities along the way. (3:03) It wasn't a clear path. (3:04) I didn't go to high school and say, (3:07) boy, I'm going to be in the oil field.
(3:08) Never dreamed of that or even thought about that. (3:11) But I was very focused on science in school. (3:16) It made sense to me and understood it (3:18) and down to the periodic table, which is kind of interesting.
(3:22) But as I moved forward through my career, (3:26) just different opportunities that I was able to take advantage of (3:30) or maybe recognize helped me move into the business of energy early in my career. (3:36) I was actually a commodities trader in the energy space (3:40) and actually wholesale electricity. (3:44) And then I traded for a while and it's a young man's game, (3:50) a lot of risk-taking and stress.
(3:52) And as I moved through that, (3:54) I had the opportunity to move over to the management side of the business (3:57) and really enjoyed that. (4:00) And as I got the opportunity to make decisions and set strategies (4:03) and lead a team, that just really, really fit me well. (4:09) Part of success is recognizing what fits you and taking that path.
(4:17) I was able to do that and it's brought me to where I am, (4:22) moved up the ladder and the position I'm in today (4:26) where I get to make a lot of decisions every day (4:28) and that's something that I'm comfortable with. (4:30) You never stop thinking about it. (4:34) There's a lot that goes along with it.
(4:36) I want to understand, you came from a real small school, right? (4:40) So coming from a small school in a rural area, (4:43) that didn't really work against you. (4:46) Maybe you got a work ethic that you brought forward from that farm world. (4:51) Is that safe to say? (4:52) Sure, it is.
(4:54) And it really relates to the oil field. (4:55) The oil field is full of many, many different kinds of workers, (5:02) and it's hard work and really aligns with where I came from. (5:08) We grew up, it was me and my two brothers, (5:11) and we woke up in the morning and if we weren't going to school, (5:16) we were in the field and we were working (5:18) and we were hoeing the weeds in the garden (5:21) and feeding the cattle and things like that.
(5:24) So we grew up with that and that carries on today (5:28) into the oil field and the hard work that goes on there. (5:34) Well, I think sometimes we overthink these things, even as adults, (5:39) wondering where is my life going and how do I make a career for myself. (5:44) It really doesn't need to be that complex.
(5:47) It's like you said, it's more or less I have interests and likes (5:52) and if I can identify a few of those along the way, (5:55) maybe spend a little more time in those zones, (6:00) I might find opportunity one day. (6:03) I think that's a pretty good way to say if you chase your dreams, (6:08) take some chances along the way, but work hard, (6:11) you may just find a life that you will enjoy for what your passions are. (6:17) What about mentors? (6:19) Did you have any mentors when you were younger? (6:21) Yes, certainly.
(6:22) Obviously my father, not so much a mentor as a leader, (6:28) a very strong leader, showing us how to work hard (6:31) and what it meant and what it took as far as that goes. (6:35) Then I was an athlete and in high school, (6:38) my high school football coach was a very good mentor to me (6:43) to help actually take my talents and help create something (6:47) from talents that I had that maybe I didn't realize I had. (6:51) Then as I moved through my career, I had several different mentors.
(6:56) The first business that we bought as NGL Water, (7:01) previous to that we were High Sierra Energy, a private company, (7:04) and we purchased our very first business in the water space. (7:10) The two gentlemen that owned that company as a private company, (7:14) they stayed on for two years, and they taught me the business. (7:19) They were excellent mentors about the business.
(7:22) It was a family business, and they showed how to surround yourself (7:26) with good people and always be open and honest with our customers. (7:33) We've carried that forward as we've grown to the size we have (7:37) as a public company, and we continue to carry that ethic on in our business (7:42) and be very straightforward and honest with not only our customers (7:46) but the regulators and all those around us, (7:50) which I've benefited greatly from that. (7:53) Then, of course, our CEO, Mike Krimble at NGL.
(7:57) He's an excellent leader, been a very successful businessman, (8:01) and he's been a great mentor to me and to my team. (8:05) Literally, he comes to our office in Denver, which is our corporates in Tulsa. (8:10) Mike comes to our office in Denver two days every week and spends time with us (8:14) and just continues that mentoring of not only myself but the other people on our team.
(8:21) Really nice. It's a life of learning, right? (8:23) It's not just I go get my high school degree, and then I'm finished learning. (8:29) That's a pretty good observation if you're sitting out there listening to this dialogue right now (8:34) because you're about, how old, 50? (8:37) I'll be 50 in January, yes, sir.
(8:39) So 50, and I'm a little shy of 60, and I have mentors in my life still today too. (8:46) So it's the desire to learn, the desire to continue to make your mark in life, (8:52) and then eventually we give back, right? (8:56) Yes, sir. (8:57) If you could go back into high school and redo one thing in your life, (9:02) what mistake would you admit to us today (9:06) that maybe wasn't the best thinking that you'd like to forget about? (9:10) I would have paid attention to my math class more.
(9:15) All right. I'm sure there's quite a few of those out there. (9:19) I'm a bit dyslexic with my math.
(9:22) I flip my fives and fours or a couple other numbers once in a while. (9:25) You drove my math teacher crazy. (9:27) Like, you know the formula, but you put the wrong answer down.
Why? (9:31) Back then they didn't know what to call that. (9:33) That's right. (9:35) How about hobbies? What do you like to do in your spare time? (9:39) I work a lot, and in my spare time I spend every single minute I can get in the day.
(9:45) My wife and I have five-year-old twin daughters. (9:49) So I spend all the time I can with those two little girls. (9:54) As far as a hobby goes, I say I work a lot.
(9:58) I love what I do. It's my passion. (10:01) I'm surrounded by very, very smart, intelligent, hard-working individuals.
(10:08) The team that we have. (10:10) I spend a lot of time with them. (10:12) We strategize and we look for innovation.
(10:16) We work hard to figure out how to do it differently than we're doing today. (10:20) And how we can do it better. (10:22) We're working to squeeze every inch out of everything that we do.
(10:27) For me, people ask me, what is your hobby? (10:31) Well, my hobby is work, but that's not a bad thing. (10:34) No, no. It means you've found your passion, right? (10:37) That's right.
(10:39) When we start getting into the life of a full family experience with work, (10:44) then we get into that balance situation. (10:46) How do we balance the work with the family time and really throw a switch? (10:52) Like when I'm going to be with my family, I need to be whole. (10:55) I need to be with them so I can enjoy that time and they enjoy it with me, right? (11:00) That's right.
(11:00) So even though we like to work, we do like our family time and other activity time. (11:07) So let's say, given where we are today, (11:13) concerning where innovation is going in your industry, (11:15) what do the jobs look like in the future? (11:19) As our industry changes, there's been a lot of focus on that. (11:26) What we do in water bridges between ESG type of innovative, (11:34) maybe alternative type movements versus the traditional oil and gas business.
(11:41) So we get to be a part of both of those. (11:44) My advice would be focus on the technical side of things. (11:49) Some people are more inclined to that.
Some are not. (11:51) But even if you're not inclined to that, try to put some focus on that. (11:58) And I think not only in our industry but other industries, (12:01) technical expertise is always going to be in demand.
(12:06) So that's the math comment earlier. (12:09) And then today we do a lot with STEM and STEAM. (12:13) So science, technology, engineering, art, and math, (12:17) all basically working together with hands-on experience.
(12:21) Never hurts to have that kind of know-how going into the oil industry. (12:26) Sure, that's right. (12:27) And there are many different kinds of jobs in the oil industry.
(12:30) And that combination of using your intelligence (12:36) but also being able to use your hands and to put that together. (12:42) And that thought process that you learn through STEM and STEAM, (12:46) it really develops those skills, and that's very important for our industry. (12:50) So you mentioned earlier, at the place you are in your career now, (12:57) you mentioned strategy.
(13:00) Can you speak a little bit to how you—first of all, why do you like it? (13:05) And were there any indicators that kind of helped you (13:09) to find that that's something that you enjoy? (13:11) Yeah, strategy is, put simply, strategy is planning for the future (13:16) and making moves, making decisions on every step that you take (13:21) about how is this going to affect our future. (13:26) And I have some nephews that have come to me and said, (13:29) you know, Uncle Doug, how did you get to where you are (13:32) and how are you so successful? (13:34) And I always tell them, really, half of it is showing up. (13:40) And then the next 25% is hard work.
(13:44) And then if you show up and work hard, well, you have to have a strategy. (13:49) And if you have a strategy and you're planning and you have a plan, (13:53) that's going to take you the next 25% of the way to success. (13:57) Then the other piece is, as you do that, you create momentum.
(14:01) And momentum, what is momentum? Moving forward. (14:04) There's positive momentum and there's some things and decisions (14:07) that you make that may slow your momentum. (14:11) And as you think strategically and you make decisions, (14:15) you're looking and saying, how do I make a decision (14:17) that will create positive momentum (14:20) and not slow our momentum as an organization or as a business? (14:25) And we focus very heavily on that.
(14:28) So, you know, really the bottom line is to be successful, (14:31) you need to have a strategy. (14:33) That's a really good way to describe it. (14:35) So thank you very much for that.
(14:38) So with that kind of thinking, do you believe anybody can be successful, Doug? (14:43) I do. And I believe we're extremely fortunate to be in this country (14:47) where opportunity continues to be offered. (14:53) And really anybody can be successful if they take advantage of their opportunities.
(14:58) And no matter how small or how large the opportunities there, (15:03) if you reach out and grab ahold of them and follow your gut, (15:07) I think you're on your way to be successful. (15:10) Agreed. (15:12) So let's kind of move into the future a little bit, if we could, (15:16) with your organization.
(15:19) And what would be something that you're working on (15:22) that you could talk in general about (15:26) that would benefit, you know, innovation that would benefit humankind going forward? (15:30) So we started our business as a recycling business (15:34) for the oil-filled wastewater back in the early 2000s. (15:38) And we really dove into it, and at the time it was very, very innovative. (15:45) And that was an operation in Wyoming (15:50) that really turned out to be just a unique experience (15:55) due to the fact of its location.
(15:57) We moved on into Colorado with the recycling effort, (16:03) and it really fell flat on its face. (16:05) It was not economic. (16:07) And after that, we looked at it and said, (16:10) boy, we're not sure we'll ever recycle to the degree we did in Wyoming again.
(16:15) We were able in Wyoming to take water from the oil field and gas field up there (16:21) and treat it to better-than-drinking-water quality (16:25) and put it back into the river. (16:28) It's a blue-ribbon trout fishing stream. (16:31) It still is today.
(16:32) And we've done that for over a decade. (16:34) Extremely successful project. (16:36) So then as our business grew and we became more involved, (16:42) there's a really big shale play.
(16:44) It's called the Delaware Basin in southeastern New Mexico (16:47) and west Texas, the Permian. (16:49) People may be familiar with that. (16:51) There's an enormous amount of water being produced out of that field down there.
(16:57) And we are working, amongst others in our industry, (17:02) but NGL is working very hard with both the political side of Texas and New Mexico. (17:09) We're supporting the water consortiums, which are New Mexico State (17:15) and other different schools, Texas Tech and Texas side, (17:19) to come up with ideas of how we can take this water and do things with it. (17:26) One item that we're working on is actually treating this water, (17:30) cleaning it with this water, and potentially putting it, (17:33) re-injecting it to the aquifers.
(17:35) There are many towns in west Texas that they are really running out of water, (17:41) even to irrigate, feed their animals, do things like that. (17:46) They're running out. (17:47) And it's a very heavily water-stressed part of our country.
(17:53) So we're working on innovative solutions to be able to bridge that gap (17:57) and take all of this oil-filled wastewater, treat it economically, (18:01) and then actually be able to have beneficial reuse of that water, (18:07) be it irrigation, re-inject it into aquifers, grow cotton, do different things with that. (18:14) So we're very focused on that. (18:16) We will get there as an industry, and we're heavily incented to do that (18:22) because, interestingly enough, there's so much water that it could become (18:27) a bottleneck to the production of oil.
(18:31) The driver is the valuable oil, and when those economics come together, (18:36) you create a solution, and that's what our industry is working on currently. (18:41) How long has that work been going on, Doug? (18:44) I would say in the Delaware Basin really the last 5 years. (18:48) Wow.
So it's young. (18:49) It is very young, yes, and we're making great strides already. (18:54) And a large part of the ability to do it, we can treat the water.
(18:59) Economics is a large driver. (19:02) Obviously $100 oil really helps drive that (19:05) because now there's more value in the commodity, (19:08) of which then more money can be spent on things like water treatment. (19:12) But the other part of it is the social license to operate, to do things.
(19:18) Produced water, it's not typical things people are aware of or understand. (19:25) So there's a lot of education going on through the consortium, (19:29) so the Produced Water Consortium in New Mexico, (19:32) Produced Water Consortium in Texas. (19:34) We've taken the higher educational entities like Texas Tech and New Mexico State, (19:40) and we have supported their labs in testing the water, (19:45) looking for testing mechanisms that maybe don't exist today (19:48) to understand the constituents in the water (19:51) so that we're making sure whatever we do with that water, (19:54) it's safe for human consumption.
(19:57) So for the audience, they may never have heard the term produced water. (20:02) Would you please describe what that means (20:04) so they understand what we're trying to get across? (20:06) In fracking, fracking is the way that oil and gas is produced (20:12) in the shale place here. (20:14) Typically, if you go to Saudi Arabia, there are large reservoirs, (20:18) subsurface of oil, and it's like they take a straw, (20:22) drill a hole, you take a straw and put it in there and pump that oil out.
(20:26) Mostly here in North America, those commodities or the oil products (20:31) are in the ground in shale between little smaller reservoirs. (20:39) So they have to take water and sand and pump down into those formations, (20:45) and then they basically, I always say, (20:47) it's like you take a bowl of Lay's potato chips, (20:50) and you smash them, and they fall, (20:54) and then obviously those air spaces would be where the oil is, (20:58) and that oil and gas gets produced out. (21:00) You use water to do that, to carry the sand, (21:03) to carry the constituents to, quote, frack.
(21:07) But also in those formations where you're producing the oil, (21:11) there's also water. (21:12) It's been there for a very long time. (21:14) It's typically very brackish and salty, so saltwater.
(21:21) And I don't know how much you know about saltwater, (21:24) but if you took saltwater and you put it in your garden, (21:26) your plants would die. (21:27) So that high salinity has to be handled. (21:33) That high salinity water has to be handled appropriately, (21:36) and we don't want it on the ground, (21:39) and you don't want it anywhere that you're trying to maintain grass (21:45) or wheat.
(21:46) We're out in New Mexico, and it's the desert, (21:48) but there's still desert animals, desert plants, things like that, (21:51) and that water has to be handled appropriately. (21:54) So we take that water and we put it on pipelines, right, (22:00) so that it's just like a sewage system even in the city. (22:04) That comes out of the ground.
(22:06) That water's produced. (22:08) When it comes out, it goes straight into tanks. (22:12) Then our pipelines are tied into the tank batteries, (22:15) and then we move those waters through pipelines to a lot of reuse.
(22:20) So reuse meaning that goes right through our batteries. (22:25) You take out the small constituents that still remain. (22:27) There's a little bit of oil left in it.
(22:30) Of course, there's going to be some solids and things left in as well. (22:33) So when they say produced water, it is truly produced out of the ground. (22:38) Some of it from the frack, but down in the Delaware Basin, (22:43) there's a lot of, I think it's four barrels of water (22:46) to one barrel of oil produced.
(22:48) You end up with four barrels of water. (22:50) So they're producing a lot of oil out of that area, (22:54) so there's an extreme amount of water being produced, (22:57) and that's why we call it produced water. (22:58) It's interesting.
(23:00) Now that it's a young area, five years old, (23:04) it'll be, from my perspective anyway, (23:06) really interesting to see what can come from that. (23:10) If you're in areas where there isn't a whole lot of water yet, (23:13) you go down, you do the fracking, (23:15) you have basically a new water supply as long as it's clean. (23:21) But all these little steps take time and money, (23:24) and like all technology in the beginning, (23:27) it's usually complex and doesn't work as efficiently, etc., etc.
(23:32) But in time, if you put enough human beings on it (23:36) that want to really solve a problem, (23:40) STEM's team, look at that challenge, (23:43) and maybe that would get you started on saying, (23:46) hey, I think I could help solve that challenge (23:48) and get on the bandwagon and try to help out. (23:52) There are lots of challenges out there, right? (23:53) That's right. (23:55) All right, so what about just for the general industry as a whole? (24:02) What's the next big innovation coming? (24:05) Well, one interesting innovation is in the drilling rigs in the oil field.
(24:11) A drilling rig is a large expense of an oil well, (24:17) and labor is a big expense in the oil field. (24:21) And so there's always innovation around how do we become more efficient. (24:27) One of the things they're doing, (24:28) they've been testing it the last couple of years, (24:30) are drilling rigs that are run remotely.
(24:34) So they started with drilling rigs saying, (24:36) hey, let's not run a rig off of diesel. (24:38) Let's run off of electricity. (24:41) So they've done that.
(24:42) It becomes less emissions. (24:46) And now they've taken the next step and said, (24:48) hey, let's get all these people off of the drilling rig. (24:51) Down on the floor of the drilling rig is very dangerous, (24:54) a lot of risk for personal injury, (24:58) which is in the oil field, lost time incidents due to injury (25:02) are very, very serious, and we take it very seriously (25:05) and work very hard to make sure everyone comes home safely at night.
(25:09) But now they've got to the point where they're able to run remote drilling (25:14) from central command centers that are not even in the same area. (25:19) They may be in Midland running out of the command center in Midland, (25:22) and they're in New Mexico running a drilling rig. (25:25) So that is an extreme amount of efficiencies they have found for drilling rigs, (25:31) not even on the environmental side.
(25:34) Hey, let's get rid of the diesel-driven rigs. (25:36) Let's get to electric. (25:38) Now it's, boy, let's run this from a command center.
(25:42) When I've gone to the drilling rigs, (25:44) typically what you see is a very young engineer, (25:47) and they're running it with a joystick. (25:49) And it's really interesting to think, you know, you see, (25:54) I'm going to be 50, so I'm going to date myself a little bit here, (25:57) but you see the kids playing the video games. (25:59) And, you know, as a parent, you're going, oh, my gosh, (26:02) I don't want my kids playing video games all the time.
(26:04) But you can see where that's applied on the drilling rig. (26:08) And now they've taken it into a remote command center, (26:12) and it's much like playing a video game. (26:15) Their screens are up.
(26:16) They're looking where they're drilling and where they're deviating from the plan. (26:21) It's all GPS. (26:23) They're processing information from these screens continuously, (26:27) running the drilling rig from a joystick.
(26:30) So that's extremely innovative and very exciting for the industry. (26:35) That is exciting. (26:37) Just out of curiosity, how many employees are we talking about at NGL? (26:41) In the water business, NGL Water Solutions, we have about 215 employees.
(26:46) All of NGL, we're just under 1,000. (26:49) Just under 1,000. Are you hiring? (26:52) We're always hiring.
(26:54) See? There's plenty of opportunity out there for you. (26:58) That's right. (26:58) Especially right now, obviously, our services are in very high demand.
(27:04) Delaware Basin has about 50 years of runway of development ahead of us. (27:11) So a lot of companies are heavily investing in that area, (27:15) and that takes human capital as an investment as well. (27:20) Sure does.
(27:22) Well, Doug, I would like to thank you for your time today (27:24) and sharing your insights with our audience. (27:26) Do you have anything left to say? (27:29) I don't know. I just appreciate being here, (27:30) and we're very excited about our business, (27:33) excited about the innovations of the oil and gas industry, (27:37) and we're really excited about the future.
(27:41) So are we. Bye, everybody. (27:44) Thank you for listening to this episode of Tomorrow's World Today podcast.
(27:48) Join us next time as we continue to explore the worlds of inspiration, (27:52) creation, innovation, and production. (27:54) Discover more at tomorrowsworldtoday.com, (27:57) connect with us on social media at TWT Explore, (28:00) and find us wherever podcasts are available.