Episode 2.6 - Bad For Good | Original Sin

Stage monsters, diva superspies and nicking your granny's apples! It's the end of Chat out of Hell series two!

The questions everyone wants to know this time:

- Has Jim Steinman ever actually been on a motorbike?

- Did the Shadow's catchphrase warrant being awkwardly shoehorned into a Steinman classic?

Who is the bigger villain, Meat Loaf's stage persona or the real Jim Steinman?

PLUS Sam tests out a new game in the quiz slot and realises that not everyone remembers the electronic dancehall smash hits of the 80s as well as him.

Chat out of Hell WILL RETURN on December 2nd. Be there or don't. Up to you.

Keep your comments, reviews and arguments flying in to chatoutofhell@gmail.com, find us on Facebook or Instagram by searching Chat out of Hell and don't forget to use the hashtag #dearA1saucepleasesendsomeofyourA1saucetosamfromthereallygoodpodcastchatoutofhell or the much shorter one #pleasegiveemmaamichaelbaybudget

Chat out of Hell is a is a review podcast: all music extracts are used for review/illustrative purposes. To hear the songs in full please buy them from your local record shop or streaming platform. Don't do a piracy.

Music extracts on this episode:
Bad for Good by Jim Steinman from the album Bad for Good (1981)
Bad for Good by Meat Loaf from the album Bat out of Hell 3: The Monster is Loose (2006)
Original Sin (the Natives are Restless) by Pandora's Box from the album Original Sin (1989)
Original Sin by Meat Loaf from the album Welcome to the Neighbourhood (1995)
Original Sin by Taylor Dayne from the album The Shadow: Original Motion Picture Soundtrack (1995)

Transcript

Sam 0:00

What is this?

Emma 0:01

This is Chat Out of Hell, the only fortnightly podcast dedicated to Meat Loaf and Jim Steinman.

Sam 0:08

Who is Meat Loaf?

Emma 0:09

Meat Loaf is a man who asked his first wife to marry him only a week after meeting her with the words,"If you won't agree to marry me, I'm going to cut my beating heart out with a carving knife and throw it in the snow". Who's Jim Steinman?

Sam 0:26

Sorry, we're making a podcast about about

Emma 0:28

that man. That man. That man. Christ. She said yes.

Sam 0:32

Jim Steinman is an American composer whose songs were described as"unnecessarily long" by Todd Rundgren. Producer of the songs.

Emma 0:40

The producer of the songs. The

Sam 0:43

of the very same songs.

Emma 0:45

Who are we?

Sam 0:46

Well, Crossland. I'm Sam Wilkinson and together we're looking forward to not having to listen to any more Meat Loaf for a while because this is the last episode in this series.

Emma 0:56

Aw, but also, yay.

Sam 1:00

to Chat out of Hell! Bow now, now, now.

Emma 1:05

Bink.

Sam 1:08

What a pair of

Emma 1:10

Indeed winners.

Sam 1:12

Hello Emma, you

Emma 1:12

right? Yeah. How are you Sam?

Sam 1:14

I'm fine. we've been messing around today.

Emma 1:18

have Doing other show stuff.

Sam 1:20

yeah. We've been doing stuff for our show, Mean Business, which is on at the Nottingham Comedy Festival, 10th of November.

Emma 1:26

6. 30pm at the Navigation. Yeah.

Sam 1:29

Brilliant. You remembered that, I haven't. We were filming silly videos, and you, had to film me walking down the street that I live on, eating cereal out of a bowl with, with, my bare hands. And dripping it down my shirt. So the

Emma 1:45

So the Neighbourhood Watch have have been peering through their various windows, and I think you've got to leave.

Sam 1:50

know, you noticed it, but there was a door that opened during the filming process. and nobody came out If you are listening, Neighbours, Eurgh.

Emma 2:00

Do you want Meat Loaf fact?

Sam 2:02

Oh, go on then.

Emma 2:03

I was watching Nevermind the Buzzcocks last night, like it was the 90s. they were talking about the most requested songs for funerals. And according to Nevermind the Buzzcocks, I believe it to be true, so Bat Out of Hell is the number one rock song requested for funerals.

Sam 2:20

We discussed this, didn't we?

Emma 2:21

I think we, yeah.

Sam 2:22

I think it was on youtube comments We found a lot of people saying play this at my

Emma 2:26

funeral Yeah. And

Sam 2:27

we both agreed it's a bit

Emma 2:29

much. It is a bit much. It's also very long.

Sam 2:32

well, that's it because the music tends to come at the end of a funeral in britain.

Emma 2:36

imagine just hanging around awkwardly

Sam 2:38

got to sit there for eight minutes. Yeah. It's

Emma 2:41

Bit much. What about, I'd do anything for love, that's an even longer God. God.

Sam 2:45

What Meat Loaf song do you want at your funeral?

Emma 2:48

Oh, that's a really tricky question because part of me I've got an answer. Have you got one? What's yours?

Sam 2:52

one? What's yours? 45 Seconds of Ecstasy. I was

Emma 2:56

I was hoping that you'd go for something really inappropriate.

Sam 2:58

Yeah. It's about 53

Emma 3:00

seconds. It's not even, it's always annoyed me that it's not 45 seconds long.

Sam 3:05

But anyway, we'll talk about that another time. Have you thought of one?

Emma 3:08

Fuck it, Paradise by the Dashboard Light. Oh God. Long and inappropriate.

Sam 3:13

Yeah. Oof.

Emma 3:15

Listeners, what Meat Loaf song would you have for your funeral? Write in and tell us chat out of hell@gmail.com? Oh, yeah. I did a call to action and I remembered our email address.

Sam 3:26

This podcast what happens on it is that every episode we both bring a song either performed by Meat Loaf or written by Jim Steinman and we listen to it together. we talk about its history, we talk about its impact on popular culture.

Emma 3:43

If any.

Sam 3:43

Yeah, it's very rare that there's any any of that. And then we rate it on our patented Meat Loaf and or Jim Steinman's song rating scales. And then we go home.

Emma 3:51

Yeah. You're already home.

Sam 3:53

I am already home, yeah, we're doing this one at my house. Somebody did message me a couple of weeks ago saying, yours is the only podcast that sets homework. I've not listened to this week's yet because I've not had 15 minutes to listen to both the songs. And it is lovely that you all want to listen along, but please don't feel obliged.

Emma 4:11

I don't know. Barry, mind your other podcast, which sets the participants a lot of homework.

Sam 4:17

This is very

Emma 4:18

This is very on brand for

Sam 4:20

Yeah, do you know what? Big fan of homework it turns out Emma, what song have you brought along today?

Emma 4:26

I have brought Bad For Good today which appears in two places in the Steinemology.

Sam 4:32

Two places?

Emma 4:33

Two places!

Sam 4:35

Oh, it's very end of term, this vibe, isn't it?

Emma 4:40

I have got games.

Sam 4:40

has let us bring a game in, yes, and we're wearing our own clothes.

Emma 4:45

I've got hungry, hungry hippos in my bag. I've brought in Bad For Good which appears twice in the Steinman timeline. Once sung by Jim Steinman himself on his own album of the same title, and once sung by Meat Loaf on Bat Out Of Hell 3. Because, there was a third Bat Out Of Hell.

Sam 5:05

And there is a reason we've not mentioned it yet. That's fantastic. And I have brought Original Sin s, which has been performed Meat Loaf, Taylor Dayne, and Jim Steinman's

Emma 5:16

Steinman's

Sam 5:17

girl band project Pandora's Box back in 1989. I've just realised why people feel the need to listen to the songs that we

Emma 5:27

So that they understand what we're talking

Sam 5:29

A, that, but also, I have a catchphrase, and my catchphrase is So listeners, go away, find that on YouTube, find it on Spotify, wherever you get your music from, dictaphone tape. Listen to

Emma 5:41

Bad for good.

Sam 5:42

And we'll see you in a few minutes. Although you don't have to listen to it. That's just my catchphrase. All right? And is there a video for this one?

Emma 5:48

There is a video for this one and you really really should watch it because it's batshit.

Sam 5:53

All right. We're gonna go watch the batshit video. See you all in a few minutes.

Laptop 5:56

I know that I'm gonna be like this forever. I'm never gonna be what I should. And you think that I'll be bad for just a little while. You think that I'll be bad for just a little while. But I know that I'll be bad for good. Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh. Know that I'll be,

Sam 6:16

we've just listened to, Bad for Good by Jim Steinman. And maybe you have too. Or maybe you got bored halfway through. Who knows?

Emma 6:25

If you watch the video, I don't think you got bored.

Sam 6:28

You got baffled.

Emma 6:30

Baffled, definitely, but not bored.

Sam 6:32

Emma, tell us about this song.

Emma 6:33

This song came from Jim's own album which he released in 1981 Bad For Good. We've talked about it several times. This was when Meat Loaf's voice was too fucked up and he was busy doing other things. And so Jim said I'll do it myself! And do it himself he did.

Sam 6:50

If you want a job doing properly, wait till Meat Loaf's back. this one of the songs that Jim actually did sing on? Yes. Okay, so this isn't,

Emma 6:59

This is

Sam 7:00

The singing didn't sound

Emma 7:01

Rory Dodd. No, this isn't Rory Dodd, this is Jim original. And you can tell when he does his special little rock voice. His ROCK VOICE! That sounds quite a lot like a Muppet.

Sam 7:10

Or Heather Small from M People. Ha ha ha!

Emma 7:13

He wishes.

Sam 7:15

ha ha! ha! But he also cracks a little bit when he's hitting the high notes. Which is, a, it's a shame.

Emma 7:21

I like the song a lot, it's been stuck in my head for a bit. It's fun, it's stupid. It's all the things you want from a Jim Steinman song. I think. It lacks a duet. But

Sam 7:31

okay. It's too long. Yes. And that is good. Yes. You get your money's My notes say there are four separate bits where it feels like the song is winding up. And then it keeps going.

Emma 7:42

One of the things that I like about this one, and some of the other Steinman songs have it, and I don't think we've mentioned it too much yet it's got a bloody good list. For the good of some thrills on a long frigid night. For the good of the fire in your soul. That is definitely a list

Sam 7:55

Oh, yes, he does do a lot of lists,

Emma 7:57

list. We've not touched on the best list yet. I think we might have to do that next series. Okay. Because that is I Want My Money Back.

Sam 8:04

Oh, that is a wonderful list.

Emma 8:06

my money back. Yes. Which is one of the best lists. And we often end up belting that bit out as we're driving past Meadowhall, I've noticed. Take not much has been written about it because it wasn't a single. It just was album track that for some reason Jim did a video for, and I feel like he's done videos for lots of these. I wonder if they're following on from each other, if there's

Sam 8:28

there's a narrative across the So there's three

Emma 8:31

diamond. I think there's a narrative. Yes! Do you want to hear what Rolling Stone Magazine had to say?

Sam 8:36

Always.

Emma 8:37

gave quite a lukewarm review of this, and they also gave a lukewarm review of Bat Out of Hell, the original and they said, Steinman's thin, reedy voice simply cannot carry the absurd precocity of the lyrics. You can't argue. No, it's, it's

Sam 8:55

true. But it's it's still good.

Emma 8:57

Oh, definitely.

Sam 8:58

Rolling Stone have said, absurd precocity, as though that's a bad thing. Yeah. that's the issue we have with some reviewers, is that all reviews say the same thing, but then at the end some of them say,"and that's brilliant." and some of them walk away confused. We're

Emma 9:14

The opening lines, the sea is whipping the sky. The sky is whipping the sea. That's really evocative. That really sets a

Sam 9:21

scene, it's a

Emma 9:21

it? It's a big storm. It is a massive storm. And you'll never hide away from me.

Sam 9:26

Have you found any recurrences of those lines, sea whipping the sky?

Emma 9:30

No, but I haven't looked. Have you found some? Yes. Go on.

Sam 9:33

Jim Steinman wrote a treatment for a film called Bat Out of Hell 2100. Of course

Emma 9:40

Of

Sam 9:40

he did. Which was another of his attempts to make a sci fi futuristic Peter pan. Yes. it features in that as some mystical, magical words that Peter says to Wendy when he's about to take her off to the magical,

Emma 9:53

Neverland? Dystopian

Sam 9:55

Neverland. that he lives in.

Emma 9:57

yeah. Wow. He's really been on this bullshit for a

Sam 10:01

long time, Yeah, he's got one idea. yeah.

Emma 10:05

it, does it ever fully develop? Mean, maybe, maybe the musical,

Sam 10:10

Yeah, I was gonna say, we'll find out April, when we go see the musical. Sorry listeners, just to give the standard disclaimer, Maisie the dog, star of the show, has once again fallen asleep on my lap, so any snoring sounds you can hear are either her or you.

Emma 10:27

That's not the only bit that's recycled into other songs. Yeah. Because we've got the Godspeeds. Ah yes. Godspeed. The Godspeeds were used in Nowhere

Sam 10:36

they? were used in nowhere Fast. This morning, emma. I was listening to the Dream engine. Dreams. Dreams.

Emma 10:46

Engines.

Sam 10:46

Dream on me, when you're The Dream Engine! The musical that he wrote in college. And That phrase is on the very first

Emma 10:58

song in that musical. Wow. Yeah.

Sam 11:01

Such a lazy bugger. And he

Emma 11:04

if you've got an idea, you might as well milk it for all it's worth. I certainly did. Welcome to chat out of hell. The song's really good. It's your classic Jim stuff in that it's just about a post apocalyptic kind a is. It's about a bad boy on a motorbike. motorbike Meat Loaf did say that the Bad For Good album was just a bad copy of the bat out Of hell Funnily enough. I have got some quotes from Meat Loaf's,

Sam 11:30

autobiography Oh, go on then. Yeah. About

Emma 11:32

this. Meat Loaf says,"At this point, Jim started creating these Bat and Bruce Springsteen clones. Songs like Stark Raving Love and Bad For Good. Now, the thing that had really nettled us in the reviews of Bat were the unfair comparisons to Springsteen."And what does Jimmy do? He writes this song, Bad For Good, which really did sound like one of Bruce's songs. I'm going, Jim, man, what are you doing? All these idiots are saying we sound like Springsteen, and now you're trying to sound like him?"

Sam 12:05

I don't know my springsteen well enough to

Emma 12:07

No, neither do i. Meh. Because I just think this sounds like continuation of Bat Out of Hell.

Sam 12:13

it is sequel to bat out of hell. It's exactly the it's bad boy on a motorbike.

Emma 12:18

You think that I'll be bad for just a little while, but I know that I'll be

Sam 12:21

bad for

Emma 12:21

good.

Sam 12:22

that's not a

Emma 12:23

real bad boy, is it? No

Sam 12:25

bad boy uses the phrase,"a little

Emma 12:28

while."

Sam 12:29

that is a bad boy who has stolen some apples from his grandma's trees.. He's gone scrumping scrumpin from his

Emma 12:37

his own grandma. He's a bad boy in 1950s twee Britain.

Sam 12:41

Yes.

Emma 12:42

You've been living your life like a girl in a cage and you whisper when I want you to shout and I wonder why you want to go on sleeping when there's nothing left to dream about. Jim does a lot of that when he's talking about these sort

Sam 12:52

sort of girls

Emma 12:53

he's involved with Yeah,

Sam 12:55

But again, so this is this is Jim's one idea is that there is the Peter

Emma 13:00

Pan on a motorbike. It's the Wendy

Sam 13:02

and he goes to get a Wendy to be rescued. Yeah. Yeah. which doesn't speak particularly well, of him that that's his only version of women. That's what the women That is what

Emma 13:12

rescued from their boring lives. That's

Sam 13:15

right, by me, Jim steinman

Emma 13:18

And my motorbike.

Sam 13:19

And my motorbike.

Emma 13:21

Did Jim ride motorbike?

Sam 13:22

I was about to ask you the same question, Listeners, I know a lot of you do know more about the lives of Jim and Meat Loaf than me. I'm prepared to bet Emma 10 now that Jim Steinman never even looked at a motorbike.

Emma 13:35

Alright, I'll take that bet. bet.

Sam 13:36

Jim Steinman drove a reliable family car all his

Emma 13:40

life.

Sam 13:41

do write in. If you find those pictures of him riding a motorbike, that will be me paying Emma 10 pounds.

Emma 13:45

And honestly, I could really do with it. Yeah. I've got another bit from his biography as well. When Bad For Good was finally ready to be released, the people over at Epic found out how genuinely wacky Jim Steinman was."As part As part of the album's promotion, he demanded that Epic buy 2000 stereo systems, identical to the one he used with the exact same speakers and the same amp and send them out with the CD for reviewers to listen to."

Sam 14:12

shit, I

Emma 14:13

insisted that this was the only way they can really hear it. It would have cost an absolute fortune.

Sam 14:19

my god, that's amaz I love that. That is incredible. He's gone into this knowing they want Meat Loaf and I'm not Meat Loaf. Loaf.

Emma 14:27

Yeah.

Sam 14:28

and most people would be on the back foot about that

Emma 14:31

a bit humble and nice.

Sam 14:33

But he's gone just gone fuck

Emma 14:35

you.

Sam 14:36

This album is amazing but only if you listen to it on in my stereo. And comedy reviewers, my jokes are very very funny if you hear them in my head. I'm afraid the rest of you

Emma 14:49

can get bent. I thought you would enjoy that. That was, I loved that. The video, it's on sound stage again. I originally thought it was the same one from Rock and Roll Dreams, but we've decided it isn't. So they just built another shit mountain. Yes. Yes. I'd written here, If you've built a shit mountain for one video, you might as well get the most out of it. But they didn't use So breaks into a woman's bedroom by throwing a guitar through a stained glass window. What's he up to here? She manages to sleep through that. that You almost wonder if Jimmy's actually going to be the main character in this video and interact with the girl, but no! No, he doesn't. Cause as soon as he starts to get in there, cue the dancing boys.

Sam 15:32

They are very good dancers. it's fucking weird., this is a, real rock and roll video. And they are all

Emma 15:38

proper

Sam 15:38

Proper ballet

Emma 15:39

dancers. It's Jim back on his theater school shit again, because as hard rock as he wants to be. It's always back to theatre school Theatre school! And all the dancers And again, going to, this is him on the back

Sam 15:55

Trying to prove himself as an act and say, I don't Meat Loaf. It is so ballsy to make a video that is just a ballet recital. Yep I've

Emma 16:06

one of them jumps on the woman's bed and wakes her up. They then spend most of the rest of the video having a dance off in the bedroom and also on the mountain set. I took a leaf out of your book, Sam. Oh yeah? I had a dig into Jim's archive. Okay. And he put together an outline for this video. Oh, sweet! I'm not going to read the whole thing because it goes on for fucking pages, but I have got part of it. So the cast is Jim, Wendy and the Lost Boys. Of course is. course it is. I'm going to read to you the mood and visual style. majestic, obsessive. Erotic. Heroic. All revved up with no place to go. Images and movements should seem more unleashed than created. A sardonic undertone. Desperate, sinuous, explosive. A combination of the muscular density of rock and roll and the luxuriant turbulence of opera. The acoustic world has been destroyed, everything is amplified. Every image and movement should seem to be born either directly before, during or after an ecstatic moment of action. And the specific action is less important than the release it provides. Tension and release is a continuous motive. Sexually rich, every movement has sexual echoes and reverberations. A world that is endlessly horny for wonder, magic and excitement. Which we've

Sam 17:40

definitely heard That's quote that's come up before.

Emma 17:42

A world where violence is carried out with such powerful balletic precision and passion as to become beautiful. And physical beauty is imbued with such anarchic childlike disregard for the limits of the ordinary as to become violent. This world should hyperventilate from beginning to end. Everything is permitted, nothing ever is taboo. And there's always something shattered when there is something breaking through. These kids are reckless and restless And lost. And the

Sam 18:21

And the shooting script said dancing. Yes. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. I've been watching a lot of Garth Marenghi's Darkplace lately, and there is a line in that in one of the retrospective clips, the producer says, this is a very ambitious script for the budget we've got, and and we've got no budget. That's amazing. Those dancers do a really good job of the job they were given. But, they can't do what he's just asked. I don't wish to speak ill of dance as an art form. But I'm not sure that dance will ever be restless and reckless and lost.

Emma 19:07

Do you think dance can represent the acoustic world being destroyed and everything is now amplified?

Sam 19:12

Yeah, good luck, all you dancers. Is

Emma 19:15

all I can say the

Sam 19:17

world should hyperventilate from end. I didn't feel much hyperventilation on that. That would have made me a bit panicky, Yeah, eight minutes of hyperventilating dancers.

Emma 19:27

God,

Sam 19:28

God,

Emma 19:28

Jim, I love you, but bloody hell. Ha ha So that's, Jim's version. There is a Meat Loaf version Bat Out of Hell 3, I think we should Alright. go away and have a

Sam 19:40

a listen, Okay,

Emma 19:41

if you want to. Okay. Don't feel you have to.

Sam 19:44

We're going to play you short clip of it anyway. me and Emma are going to sit through the whole thing. now.

Laptop 19:49

And you whisper when I want you to shout, And I'll never know why you wanna go on sleepin when there's nothin left to dream about. But you'd better remember if it's somethin I want, then it's somethin I want. I wasn't built for comfort, I was built for speed. If it's something I want, then it's something I need. I wasn't built for

Emma 20:16

we've just listened to Bad for Good on Meat Loaf's Bat out of Hell Three album. Sam do you know who was responsible for that guitar?

Sam 20:25

Oh, hello. it Emma?

Emma 20:27

That was Brian May. Fuck off! Yep, Brian May. Ooh! Because it sounds like

Sam 20:32

May! It's trademarked Brian May right at the end there,

Emma 20:34

yeah!

Sam 20:34

yeah. Well done, brian. Shame you couldn't have played on a better song then, but never mind..

Emma 20:41

You don't like this do you?

Sam 20:42

don't dislike it, I just jim's version is much, much better. In almost all aspects. timing of it. So this is Bats Out of Hell 3 was 2006??

Emma 20:52

Six, I think, yeah.

Sam 20:54

We've

Emma 20:55

We've done our homework. Yeah, it was 2006.

Sam 20:57

And we're definitely in era of Meat Loaf's voice falling off a cliff.

Emma 21:00

Yeah, this is the last album that I think it really properly sounds like old Meat Loaf. I think if this had been recorded for Bat Out of Hell 2, it would have been fucking The Guardian gave it four stars, which was a surprise. but the review I'm going to read for you now is from slantmagazine. com who gave it

Sam 21:18

1. 5 stars. Oh, can we just talk about the point 5 star system? Do it out of 10. If you're gonna give 0. 5s, just shift it to an out of 10 system, all right. Fucking sick of it. it Sorry, Carry on.

Emma 21:33

Good. I'm glad that out. So yeah, they gave it a 1. 5 star review. Yep. But they did have this to say Bad for Good is truly worthy of the Bat Out of Hell moniker. Written by Steinman in 1981 for the original follow up to bat 1, if we're calling it that. it that that never was. This song is a welcome flashback to the old days with jaunty piano and elaborate vocal arrangements that recalls classics like Paradise by the Dashboard Light. Brian May adds guitar and for seven and a half minutes it feels like 1977 again.

Sam 22:05

What do you think? think

Emma 22:06

I like it. But it's never gonna be A classic, I don't think.

Sam 22:13

It feels like 1970s. It doesn't feel like 77 again. Maybe it does feel like he's trying to recall 1977 in a way that just doesn't work in 2006. Perhaps that's my issue with it.

Emma 22:25

This was released after Couldn't Have Said It Better, which was a real departure from the classic bat out of hell sound, I we liked

Sam 22:32

that one.

Emma 22:32

This is an attempt to hark back to previous triumphs. Yeah. And it just doesn't quite cut it. Yeah. There's a lot to be said for quitting while you're ahead. Would you like to hear what the internet says

Sam 22:42

I'd love to hear what the people of the internet say. They are my thought leaders in all things.

Emma 22:48

Jim's version. Paul Kearns8838 has written under the video, Anyone know why he always wore gloves? Also, is it just me, or are all his vids cuckold, where he watches the hot chick with studs from afar?

Sam 23:08

It's not just you.

Emma 23:12

Do you have more to say on that later?

Sam 23:14

Not really, no.. he does like to stare at women.

Emma 23:17

He likes to watch. Christy Rollins, 983, said, Hmm. Bad for good, yeah. Good song. Meat Loaf can make me bad for good. Each to their own. BeauTy is in the eye of the beholder. Yes. But that was about all I

Sam 23:35

Yeah. It's not a lot The

Emma 23:37

people of the internet have been quiet lately.

Sam 23:39

I think it's probably time to rate this song, Emma. This is a Jim Steinman song. So we will be using our patented Organic, grade a Jim Steinman song rating scale which runs from Jim Steinman at the top Jim Fineman in the middle to Jim Declineman for for his rubbish songs. So we can agree this isn't a Jim Declineman.

Emma 24:03

Oh, it's definitely not a Jim Declineman.

Sam 24:05

What do you think?

Emma 24:07

It's got elements of a classic. It's got the list. It's got Jim being ridiculous. Mm hmm. Is it just a jim finder? Fineman? What do you think?

Sam 24:18

It's a very fun song, but neither of the recordings that we have get it quite right. I think it needed to be, on Bat Out of Hell 2, with Jim at his producing peak and Meat Loaf at performing peak. To hit jim Steinman so I think this is a

Emma 24:33

Fineman Jim

Sam 24:35

Fineman

Emma 24:36

It's alright It's Jim Fineman It's alright isn't it? Yeah It's Jim fineman

Sam 24:41

emma, that was your song, Bad For Good, and now we're going to listen to my choice, which is Original sin. Listeners, as I said, it's been performed three times. The pandora's Box one, we're gonna listen to it right now. That's the one you have to listen to the least, to be honest. If you only listen to one, I think Taylor Dayne, Emma's probably going to say Meat loaf. Yeah, we'll discuss that in a minute. But go away, listen to any version of that you like. Find it on YouTube, Spotify, whatever else. We're gonna listen to Pandora's Box now, and we'll see you all very soon.

Laptop 25:11

It's not enough to make the nightmares go away. It's not enough to make the tears run dry. It's not enough to live a little better every day. Everything that they taught us was nothing but lies. Everything that they bought us was nothing but pride. It'll all be over now. All I

Sam 25:38

so we've just listened to the pandora's Box version of Original sin.

Emma 25:42

Emma, what do we think of that? Ooh, it's dramatic,

Sam 25:46

dramatic AF. shall we go straight into a review? this is from Sounds Magazine, who called this track,"Outrageously epic and pompous. Which is exactly what you want. It's exactly what I want, yeah. So this is the

Emma 25:59

title

Sam 26:00

track of album. It's dead good, innit? it's dead good, It's epic, it's huge. On the album press kit, there's a comment here."On the title track, Steinman recorded 35 motorbikes and made a chord out of them. the result, according to Steinman,'the greatest sound I'd ever heard.' unfortunately blowing the studio console up."

Emma 26:22

Oh, why? Why is he like this!

Sam 26:26

If, I, here's the thing. If ever a track deserves some bullshit around it, it's this one, right? The band Pandora's Box is the one that he built this Weird mythology about made up stories about how one of the members was thrown out of a nunnery for something so weird that I can't even tell you what it is.

Emma 26:46

Which I feel lacks imagination Um,

Sam 26:50

lyrically, I like it. there's not a lot to make fun of, except for the line, You can fly and never land and never need to sleep. is describing an albatross.

Emma 26:59

Oh, bravo. You're welcome.

Sam 27:05

Thank you. Yeah, villainous and it's

Emma 27:08

it should have been a theme to a Bond Film..

Sam 27:11

there you go. You just stole my closing remarks.

Emma 27:13

Oh, Oh, sorry.

Sam 27:13

It's quite alright. tHis is the Bond theme that he wanted to produce, I think. But yeah, it's, oh, it's a got oomph.

Emma 27:21

It's banger. Pandora's Box we have visited before because they had the incredibly erotic video, didn't they?

Sam 27:26

We've dipped gently into them for their video for It's All Coming Back to Me Now, which as you say was described as"a porno movie" by one managers involved. And that was filth. I'm kind of glad this didn't get a a video because that would

Emma 27:42

Ooh, hello. Maybe that's why. Maybe there is a secret video somewhere. Is

Sam 27:47

Is that what she was thrown out of the nunnery for? One of the best songs on the album,

Emma 27:53

Yeah, definitely.

Sam 27:54

The Pandora's box album some of it is brilliant, some of it is real middle of the road stuff. And there's a couple of steinman monologues on there which are

Emma 28:02

are utterly insane, but I feel like the production on this and some of the noises that you hear throughout the song

Sam 28:08

is very 80s. Yeah, what, the noise of 35 motorbikes made into a

Emma 28:12

chord, ever? It's just, it's very much of its time. when I, discovered Pandora's Box while researching bits and pieces about, this podcast. at first I was delighted that I'd found another little weirdness. and I listened to it and it was interesting hearing songs that I'd only heard Meat Loaf sing filtered through a different steinman project. Yeah. that was an initial delight, but I don't feel like they live up to the potential. I think this is where we separate, because I, I'm starting to come to the opinion that Steinman works best with female voices. maybe just Loaf being a twat, I don't know. speaking of Meat Meat

Sam 28:49

Loaf, shall we move on to Yeah, shall we move on to Meat So this was on the Welcome to the Neighbourhood album in 1995. This is the latest of the three versions that we're going to listen to today. Jim Steinman wasn't involved in recording or producing this, it's just something that he covered on the album. And here it is for us, and here's a snippet for the listeners

Laptop 29:09

You can dance forever, you got a fire in your feet But will it ever be enough, you know that it'll never be enough You can fly and never land and never need to sleep But will it ever be enough, you know that it'll never be enough

Sam 29:38

so we've just listened to the Meat Loaf Cut there. It's fair to say we're both massive fans, right?

Emma 29:43

love that.

Sam 29:43

Fucking great. it's villainous, and it's mean, and you can picture him stalking around the stage like the phantom of the Opera.

Emma 29:49

This is my favourite track from Welcome to the Neighbourhood.

Sam 29:53

course it is, because of

Emma 29:54

Steinman one!

Sam 29:55

Yeah, but you know

Emma 29:57

Yeah, but you know that it's one of those albums that has a soft spot in my heart. But this one I, I remember listening to this as a teenager. Meat Loaf

Sam 30:06

Memories. It's rare that I have an

Emma 30:10

an idea. Yeah.

Sam 30:12

ha.

Emma 30:14

interesting. yeah, I used to, listen to this prime listening time for music when I was a teenager was the journey to and from school. I used to catch a train to school, so that gave a lot of time to listen to my discman. Yeah, the world's least practical portable music system. so this one would be on fairly heavy rotation in the sort of early teenage years. and this song Oh, it spoke to me because it was dark and devious And brooding And I was a brooding teenage. Is that a a surprise? surprise Everything that they taught us was nothing but lies. What a wanker it was.

Sam 30:54

I mean, that is very teenage Isn't it? teenage angst, isn't it? Everything they bought us was nothing but bribes. bribes.

Emma 31:01

Yeah, and I was, like, a little ball of teen angst for such a long time. I'm hoping that it will end soon.

Sam 31:10

The conceit of this song

Emma 31:12

it's

Sam 31:13

Steinman. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's also something quite stand up comedy about it. He's taking this everyday phrase and interprets it through naive eyes. And that's a classic comedy trope.

Emma 31:25

Yes.

Sam 31:25

As is the lists, actually. And I'm starting to wonder if that's why we like Steinman, because he uses the same tools as us. And just as successfully! LAUGHTER

Emma 31:38

Ha ha ha ha ha! Yeah. I can see that. I I do like a good list in my stand

Sam 31:45

I've been looking for an original sin. Done all the old ones till they've all been done in you can hear that as a stand up routine.

Emma 31:52

Oh, I've been looking for an original sin. I have done all the old ones till they've all been done in. So now I'm going round. Insert horrific edgelord.

Sam 32:01

Pushing my dick in X.

Emma 32:03

Indeed, yes. Oh, I feel a character coming on.

Sam 32:07

Emma male comedian.

Emma 32:12

Here's a list of the things I've put my dick in.

Sam 32:15

I wanted to talk about this song today because I've been threatening to do it for a Meat Loaf as Steinman's Monster. Yeah. I'll go first of all to some stuff

Emma 32:25

RL Grey gave us

Sam 32:27

a couple of weeks ago. I love it, R. L. R. L. When Bat Out of Hell 2 came out, Steinman said he wanted to open every live show with attendants bringing Meat on stage as some sort of snarling beast that would have to be tamed for the show to proceed. That is magnificent. That is pure Jim Steinman. You saw the Bat 2 tour, didn't you?

Emma 32:45

I was 10 at the time. and it might It might not have been the original Bat 2 tour. think I might have seen the Everything Louder tour. Yeah. but he was touring so much at point.

Sam 32:55

Yeah, fair enough. You don't remember him being wheeled on in a cage.

Emma 32:58

I remember being a little bit frightened, but don't think he was wheeled on in a cage. It would would have been quite theatrical.

Sam 33:04

Yes. RL says Steinman also tried to bloat Meat Loaf up to his late 70s proportions. As you probably noted, meat lost a lot of weight in the mid 80s or so, but steinman preferred him enormous. So during the recordings of Bat 2, he would leave jelly doughnuts around the studio, hoping Meat would not be able to restrain himself. himself

Emma 33:22

Oh, Jim, you're the worst kind of bloke.

Sam 33:25

He is awful, but I also love that he came up with a cartoon plan.

Emma 33:30

Yeah!

Sam 33:32

picturing trails of donuts leading up to the studio door and to the microphone. Yep.

Emma 33:39

hob. Lovely, hob, hob, hob.

Sam 33:41

There's this idea throughout their working together that Steinman is the brains and Meat Loaf is the

Emma 33:47

face.

Sam 33:48

There's an anecdote of Steinman's that he tells very well and very entertainingly about something quite unpleasant that happens to Meat Loaf. He tells it in a few interviews and I've made a kind of super cut of the anecdote. Okay, So Just to clarify at the end of this story, everyone is fine

Emma 34:04

Oh god!

Sam 34:05

Yeah! But also, how Brechtian ha ha! a level

Emma 34:13

Ha ha ha!

Sam 34:14

Steinman says,"On the tour for the first album, Meat Loaf would huge tantrums about,'I'm not the Frankenstein monster!' Because people would say that I was Dr. Frankenstein and he was the Frankenstein monster. He keeps using the phrase the Frankenstein monster and not the phrase Frankenstein's monster, I love that I'm correcting him on the name of the monster, but not in the normal way."I would have to soothe him and say,'No, no, You're Marlon Brando and I'm Francis ford Coppola. the best was in Pittsburgh, I remember. It only the third week of the tour, but he was going through so many identity crises because he was really freaked out by the idea that I might be Dr. Frankenstein and he was the Frankenstein monster. I'd staged the show very carefully and I thought it very true to him and the music that he wasn't allowed to speak, essentially."Because when Meat speaks, he's just a good old boy from Texas and the, character he was on stage, to me, was a heroic mythic figure. It would kill for him to go,'Hi, y'all!'"Meat Loaf stalks onto the stage like an animal and it was thrilling. But I think it got to him after a while that he couldn't talk. So in Pittsburgh he started, all of a sudden I hear,'You motherfuckers having a good party?'"And I thought,'holy shit, what happened to that mythic character?' Meat didn't understand. He really thinks he's Sammy Hagar or David Lee Roth. So the manager went to have a talk with him after the show and said, Meat, you have to shut up.' And he just went berserk, screaming,'I'm not a Frankenstein monster! Steinman's not Dr. Frankenstein! Now, I do want to clarify, He does the impression of Meat Loaf in the interview. This is me doing an impression of Jim Steinman doing an impression of Meat Loaf. Okay?

Emma 35:48

god!

Sam 35:50

'I'm not gonna do meat Loaf! I'm Meat Loaf!' He's trying to convince himself!'I'm Meat Loaf! I'm Meat Loaf!' To us, it was simply artistic. It wasn't interesting him saying, You ready to party tonight? It just didn't fit this great Marvel Comics character. It's like batman saying,'Hey Gotham City, you ready to party? Hey robin, come on, let's boogie!' Now I'd like to clarify, at this point in 1979, the biggest piece of batman media is the Adam West TV show, every week. Brilliant. Batman in popular media is in popular media is not dark and grim at this point.

Emma 36:25

No, He's camp and has a dance.

Sam 36:29

"Meat Loaf went berserk He threw a chair through the window, I think. He broke it, stuff, mirrors. Then he stalked out of the room."I remember we had to go find him. I was entranced by Pittsburgh because it's where night of the living Dead was filmed. I was amazed that Night of the Living Dead turned out to be so much a documentary about Pittsburgh, because the people look like that all the time." Ha ha! You You arsehole."We were in the worst area of Pittsburgh, it was like a toxic chemical experimentation factory. All you saw around you were these horribly coloured toxic fumes coming out of, factories? Or steel mills? Blue, purple, green, it was scary. It was like pure science fiction where you expected mutants to emerge around every corner. We were in this huge parking lot next to the motel, which was totally deserted, fumes everywhere, and we're like a search party in the Frankenstein movie. We were We all had flashlights and there's eight of us and we're going around saying Meat, Meat, Meat, And what I remember was a nice touch was this station wagon pulls up with this little old couple. They look like the Grant Wood painting of America. That's american Gothic. Like one of them should have a pitchfork. They pull up and were probably looking for directions and they suddenly see eight people with flashlights going, MEAT! MEAT! MEAT! And speed out of there, having come across this rare group of cannibals from Pittsburgh. LAUGHTER I see this figure crouched down in a hunched position, basically like a running back in football. Meat was a football player, and boy, he was powerful. And he was set positioned down like a rhino or an elephant, something about to charge. Meanwhile, way on the other side of the parking lot, there's this huge truck. It's one of those enormous trucks you could get a small country into. It had an amazing front that someone spent a lot of time on, where they did a customised front with the special fenders, and it had a devil's head. Huge head on the front, and the fenders have been made. I hope I'm using the right term, but those things, basically, the breasts. The huge nipples that stick out.

Emma 38:31

Okay.

Sam 38:32

I was with him up until the breasts arrived. arrived. They were turned into these amazingly sharp fangs, so there are fangs on either sidea devil's head, it is the perfect truck. The guy had gone in to get Hostess Twinkies, or whatever these satanic truck drivers eat. It's just there, idling, and meat is aimed directly at those fenders. I could see, and he goes,'I'm not a Frankenstein monster!' grrr, and I realised. I shouldn't interfere with this, something's coming. And I just moved aside And he charged. And it seemed like a hundred miles an hour, he went full force, had to run at least a hundred yards, gathering up speed, and he's a fast, strong guy, and rammed headfirst into the truck.

Emma 39:16

Fuck.

Sam 39:17

Into the sharp, piercing fender. I remember the forehead exploding, blood pouring out like firecrackers, and all I remember thinking was, Oh God, look at the way the red of the blood mixes with the fumes of green and purple in the devil's head. And it was a wonderful image to me. Blood everywhere, we had the red mixed with the orange, a huge gap in his head, 17 stitches. The truck, though, was a disaster. Blood all over it with this great bend in the spike. Wow. That is Jim Steinman telling the story of his best friend going through a very dangerous time of his life.

Emma 39:55

life. Yes. Oof. Yeah. Ever the sympathetic, ever the sympathetic, yeah, wow,

Sam 40:03

Hey. Jim's, yeah, Jim is capable of saying some very lovely things about people. but he also, he seems to view them all as just tools.

Emma 40:16

Jim seems to lack a bit of empathy.

Sam 40:18

there's a word that we're both dancing around here.

Emma 40:20

is.

Sam 40:21

Neither of us are medically qualified to apply it.

Emma 40:23

But we've both read Jon Ronson's book about it. it. right.

Sam 40:27

right! Yeah. He is a great storyteller, but why are you telling that story?

Emma 40:36

Why are you telling the story of your friend's mental breakdown and subsequent violent accident? Chuckle, chuckle, chuckle, chuckle

Sam 40:45

chuckle. Classic!

Emma 40:46

Oh, bants!

Sam 40:49

that's that story. Continuing in the Monster theme, so the song was

Emma 40:53

recycled for

Sam 40:54

Tanz der Vampyre. Ah,

Emma 40:56

Ah yes, I've seen mention of that on Jim's site.

Sam 40:59

I was very excited to, to learn more about this, because, I immediately read that as Dance of the Vampires because I can read a little bit of German and that.

Emma 41:08

Ooh, get you

Sam 41:09

yeah, I know. And then I realised this was a stage musical version of the film the Fearless Vampire Killers by Roman Polanski. Ooh. And so my theme of uh, stage monsters has been interrupted by an actual monster monster in the middle of it all. So we'll park that whole thing for another day. But the song is sung by the villain Count von Krolok. in the english language version of the, show. Jim Steinman wrote the music, he did the lyrics for the English version by recycling a load of his old songs, And his website calls the show a surreal orgasmic infusion of Stein music. Stein music! Finally, we've got the term for it! Yeah. Stein music! Yeah. Stein music! So yeah, that's the Meat Loaf version

Emma 41:57

I love it, it's my favourite version of the song.

Sam 41:59

Yes.

Emma 41:59

It's booming, it's villainous, it's it's sinister. I also feel it's suitable for Meat Loaf at this stage. Exactly,

Sam 42:06

yes.

Emma 42:07

it's not a song about being a teenager.

Sam 42:09

Count von Krolock sings it as an immortal vampire, I've been evil forever, ha ha ha ha ha. And that is exactly what Meat Loaf is in Bat Out of Hell 2 slash Welcome to the Neighbourhood I've been at rock and roll for 30 years, ha ha ha ha ha. It is perfect for him at that time, I think it's the right combo and it all works really well. but in a second, listeners, we are going to listen to Taylor Dayne's version, which was from 1994. And appeared on the soundtrack to the film the Shadow. Shadow. starring

Emma 42:42

Alec Baldwin. Baldwin.

Sam 42:45

And I think it's worth a listen. find it if you want, don't, see if I care,

Laptop 42:51

one with a twist that's been in since I've come along. Now I'm drunk again. I'm

Sam 43:15

my notes here say, here we go. this absolutely whips. don't argue

Emma 43:20

can I I argue that

Sam 43:22

Yeah, you can.

Emma 43:23

Okay. So it's good. I like it, It's perfect for a film soundtrack, I I think. But what pisses me off. Uh huh. Is the shoehorning of awful lyrics.

Sam 43:38

The lyric in the original version is,

Emma 43:41

not enough to make the nightmares go away. It's not enough to make the tears run dry. It's not enough to live a little better every day. Everything that they taught us was nothing but lies. Everything that they brought us was nothing but bribes.

Sam 43:52

Yeah, and Taylor Dayne, because she's singing to the Shadow soundtrack. sings who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men today? It's a city of shadow, it's a city of light, it's a city of secrets, it's a city of pride. Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men is the catchphrase of the shadow.

Emma 44:12

Okay. just It ruins the flow for me.

Sam 44:15

It is a little bit ham fisted. But do you know who's responsible for that ham fisted lyric? lyric? Is it jim? Is it Jim?

Emma 44:21

Yeah, I thought it might be. Jim did produce this

Sam 44:24

Larry Flick reviewing for Billboard, stated that Dayne's over the top vocal style is a perfect match for jim Steinman's melodramatic kitchen sink production Dayne chews through an arrangement of grand piano lines, thunderous guitars and shrill choir chants with impressive energy. Don't be surprised if this bombastic track propels her back onto the pop charts in a huge way.

Emma 44:45

Did It

Sam 44:46

It got to number 63 in the uK, did not chart in the US. Good. I think that's a disgrace. This is jim Steinman's Bond theme. Yeah. think you're right that the changed lyrics are a bit hamfisted and rubbish, but she

Emma 45:04

really gives

Sam 45:05

it some oomph that it deserves it this real kind of Tina Turner vibe. I genuinely am a bit baffled that it just disappeared, and I do wonder if it was the lacklustre film that it's taped to that sunk it a little bit.

Emma 45:18

I guess we'll find out when we do Film Club.

Sam 45:20

We will find out when we do Film Club, yeah. Emma, Emma, would you like a quiz?

Emma 45:23

Yes. Yes, I would because I've not heard anything about Scatman yet.

Sam 45:27

Taylor Dayne's biggest hit was 1987's Electronic Dancehall Smash, Tell It To My Heart. Okay. Tell I'm the only one, is this really love or just a game? But how did it fare against Chat Out Of Hell's favourite Electronic Dancehall Smash, Scatman, Ski Bop Bop Badop Bop, by Scatman John? So we're going to play higher or lower. We're going to twist things up a bit. I'm going yep, so I'm going to go through various charts, I'm going to tell you how Scatman did, and I want you to tell me whether Taylor Dayne did higher or lower for Tell It To My Heart.

Emma 45:58

This is tenuous, isn't it?

Sam 45:59

Listeners, play along at home. in the UK Singles

Emma 46:01

a Meat Loaf and Jim

Sam 46:02

Starlin. Ha ha In the UK singles chart Scatman John got to number 3 with Scatman Ski bop ba ba da bop. But did

Emma 46:11

Taylor

Sam 46:11

dayne's Tell It to My Heart get higher or lower?

Emma 46:14

Well number 3's quite high. Lower? It actually got the same. the same. the same. Okay. So that

Sam 46:21

an option. Hey! You get

Emma 46:23

Aye!

Sam 46:24

for a pair not in this game. Scatman got to number 60 in the US Billboard 100. Taylor dayne, higher or lower?

Emma 46:31

Oh, I think she did much better.

Sam 46:33

She did much better. She got to number 7, that's

Emma 46:34

seven. That's one point. Sweden, Scatman John got to number two.

Sam 46:37

don't

Emma 46:37

think I don't think she's beating number two.

Sam 46:40

She got to number 3 in sweden. You're on two points. Australia, Scatman john got to number eight.

Emma 46:45

I think she did better.

Sam 46:47

She did not. She got to number 10. In Austria, scat man got to number one.

Emma 46:54

Did she do the same?

Sam 46:55

did! Number 1 hit to both of them.

Emma 46:57

Yeah. Yeah. you only catch me out once.

Sam 46:59

You're You're on three points. Belgium, he got to number 1. She got to number two. France, he got to number one. People love Scatman John.

Emma 47:10

People of Europe love Scatman John. Maybe

Sam 47:14

But how do they feel that? how

Emma 47:19

did they feel about Taylor Dayne, Emma? I think she didn't do as

Sam 47:22

Number 11, there's only one more of these. he got to number 39, but where did she get to? Higher or lower?

Emma 47:29

I I think She did better.

Sam 47:31

She did better. She got to number seven. four points. There's a little score chart here. So listeners, if you got zero to two points, you got, is this really love or just a badly thought out game. Oh, you spent so much time on Three to four points. So you landed

Emma 47:49

here.

Sam 47:50

I won't taylor deign to comment on your score. Anybody who got four to six points at home earns scatman! that's a decent score And if you got seven or eight, well done. You have earned ski bad bad brilliance Oh,

Emma 48:05

Oh, wow. Yeah? what a way to end the series.

Sam 48:09

Awesome.

Emma 48:11

Oh Sam I think you need a break from this don't you? Shall we hear what the people of the internet think about Original sin? Yes.

Sam 48:20

Pandora's Box. no interesting comments whatsoever. Against Meat Loaf, lukeyPup95Productions53

Emma 48:27

Crikey.

Sam 48:28

Crikey. Agreed. I like Meat Loaf's version, never heard pandora's box version or Taylor Dayne's. Dayne's. Useful comment. Yeah, yeah. Thanks. on dayne's version. At browderfan, How this wasn't number one worldwide is beyond me. It's as good as Total Eclipse of the Heart and most of meat Loaf's songs. Jim Steinman is a genius.

Emma 48:49

To which,@GermanSausagesAretheWurst

Sam 48:51

replied Jim

Emma 48:53

Steinman was a genius. He's gone now. I like that name as well.

Sam 49:02

At kiefer Suv 1985 marks,

Emma 49:04

Jesus

Sam 49:05

christ, this song is awesome Jesus Christ! People are on my side on this one, Emma

Emma 49:12

But

Sam 49:12

the lyrics are wrong! And finally, this is from Steve eckstein douglas drive, and it is a mouthful. Okay. This is all in caps. It's littered with insane punctuation. Okay. Which I will try my best to do. Yes! Less than sign. After these years gone by, open brackets, loss of some hearing, less than sign, sight and arthritic fingers, question mark, jaw, open bracket for tenor, closed bracket, less than sign, still love, quotation mark, ms, greater than sign, leslie Wunderman, close brackets, open brackets, Taylor Dayne, open brackets, from quotation mark, Queens, colon, myself, colon, the bronx, and long Island, close brackets, full stop, my reality, colon, you, less than sign, nor any great lady voices will never record my songs. Greater than sign, quotation mark, que sera, less than sign, sera, quotation mark. greater than sign. Still love you and your Voice, Greater than sign. greater than sign, However, less than sign, your quotation mark. Back up african lady singer, still sends me into musical heaven. Less than than sign, even though, open brackets. we. Paragraph break, both have aged! Six exclamation marks. I think a dalek has broken in. I

Emma 50:42

think someone's cat just wandered across their

Sam 50:45

And that's what the the people of the internet think.

Emma 50:47

The people of internet need to shut up.

Sam 50:50

They do wang on, don't they? And speaking of wanging on, Emma, shall we rate this song? we're going to rate this once again on our jim steinman rating which runs from Jim Steinman at the top for his best songs, don't you dare go for anything else, Jim Fineman in the middle, or Jim Declineman at the bottom. I am now accepting submissions.

Emma 51:11

is

Sam 51:12

Jim steinman, right? We can argue about which one's the best, but it's pure jim stein. Oh, I'll do it in a villainous way. pure Jim Steinman! MWAHAHAHAHAHA! Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men today?

Emma 51:30

we done? Yeah. Good!

Sam 51:36

that was episode 12, the end of series 2 of chat out of hell. Woo! I asked you this at the end of the last I think we should return to it again.

Emma 51:46

What do you

Sam 51:47

of Meat Jim Steinman now? We've covered a wide variety of stuff now from their works. we've introduced some

Emma 51:54

of Jim's

Sam 51:54

work with other artists. We've talked about the theme for hulk hogan that he did. We have talked about that.

Emma 52:04

a lot.

Sam 52:04

do you feel differently about the two of them? yeah, I think I, I think I probably do. I still really enjoy the music.

Emma 52:11

sometimes you really do have to separate the art from the

Sam 52:15

Yes, it's getting more under, I'm surprised actually that, and maybe it's just cause I've done more of the steinman research and you've done more of the meat Loaf stuff that The more I learn about jim steinman, the more an unpleasant little slimeball he is. Yeah.

Emma 52:30

it's an interesting journey that we're on.

Sam 52:32

is an interesting journey

Emma 52:33

I

Sam 52:33

I

Emma 52:33

like if you dig too deep into anybody, you're going to find things that you're not going to

Sam 52:37

dug that. Look, come on. Come

Emma 52:38

we? It's mostly just wikipedia doing the

Sam 52:41

to his own website. It's

Emma 52:43

It's the fact that he puts all of this up

Sam 52:44

up. Yeah.

Emma 52:46

this up.

Sam 52:46

Quite interesting, isn't it? He is. very much archivist, and the things he has chosen to share

Emma 52:52

are choose to share.

Sam 52:54

Exactly. We all do have the horrible moments and the,

Emma 52:57

There are so many things that I regret saying and doing. Things that and

Sam 53:00

yeah. There's a point where, about whether or not he's a megalomaniac. Starting to be undeniable, really. The only man that exists in

Emma 53:08

Jim Steinman's world is Jim Steinman, Yeah.

Sam 53:11

the rest of us are toys for him to play with.

Emma 53:13

In Neverland.

Sam 53:15

In neverland, where he's an eternal teenage boy. Despite all that, would you like to come back and do another series?

Emma 53:22

Yes, yes, I would.

Sam 53:23

Thank heavens for that. I'd love to, Emma. So we're taking

Emma 53:26

a

Sam 53:26

week break now between series, so Chat Out of Hell will return on the

Emma 53:30

2nd of

Sam 53:31

December, we're going to start Series 3 with a special on Jim Steinman's weird monologues. So we're going to bring four of those to the table. They are Wasted Youth, which is also called Love, Death and an American Guitar. and that is on Bad For Good or Bat out Of Hell 2. There is nocturnal pleasure, which appears on the album Dead Ringer and also on the Pandora's Box album. There is I've Been Dreaming Up A Storm lately, And finally, the want ad, which again is Pandora's Box. So if you can find those listeners, you can listen to them. We're probably going to read the whole things out to you, they're all very short. so we'll see you all on December 2nd for those. But before then just like last time, we decided to take a break and then decided to do loads of work in the middle of it. We'll be back with chat out of Hell Film Club, where we will watch some films with tangential relationships to our chosen artists. So I'm gonna bring the film the Shadow, which had a jim steinman produced song as its main theme. Emma, what are you gonna bring?

Emma 54:35

I'm going to bring Fight Club starring meat loaf

Sam 54:37

oh, god. Well, we to watch it some time. Sigh. Sigh. So we'll see you all for Film club at some point between now and December 2nd. But thank you all, as always, for listening to Chat out Of Hell. Were we right or wrong about today's songs? Would you have rated them differently? Which of us is right about the best version of original Sin? Do let us know, chatoutofhellatgmail. com What Meat Loaf song you like at your funeral? ChatOutOfHellAtGmail. com And do you have proof that Jim Steinman ever rode a motorbike? chatoutofhellatgmail. com I might extend that to proof that he ever saw a motorbike, because I'm quite doubtful of that. As always, keep your general Meat Loaf thoughts and anecdotes flying in. Did you see Meat Loaf at the Horniman Museum admiring their overstuffed spherical walrus? Give it a Google, it looks very silly. Let us know, chatoutofhellatgmail.Com and that is it, that's the end of series two. We are both quite tired. Anything to add? No, Lovely. Thank you all for listening, as always. We genuinely enjoy doing doing this, it is stupid fun and it's really good having

Emma 55:41

a

Sam 55:41

little crowd of people along with us on our ridiculous journey. So we'll see you all in December.

Emma 55:47

Bye! Bye

Sam 55:49

Bow, now, now, now. now.

Emma 55:52

Bing!