Chat out of Hell

Episode 5.6 - Somebody Loves Me | Good Girls Go to Heaven (Bad Girls Go Everywhere)

• Sam Wilkinson

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An end of term vibe delayed by a bit of illness brings us to this, the true end of term - Chat out of Hell series five, episode six. Meat Loaf gets all classy and covers Gershwin in the first half, then Emma has to explain that Good Girls go to Heaven is actually about self-enjoyment and ruins it for everyone. But we still have time to dive into the important questions, like:

- Which Vaudeville performer was described as "a mop gone crazy"?

- What did Emma get up to in the Girl Guides?

- Has Sam fallen off the deep end with his Mr Blobby related quiz this time?

PLUS a bit of a chat about how fun 1920s Broadway seemed and all the usual nonsense.

Keep your comments, reviews and arguments flying in to chatoutofhell@gmail.com, find us on Facebook or Instagram by searching Chat out of Hell and don't forget to use the hashtag #DearA1saucewedontneedyoursaucenowwevegotourown


Chat out of Hell is a is a review podcast: all music extracts are used for review/illustrative purposes. To hear the songs in full please buy them from your local record shop or streaming platform. Don't do a piracy. Music extracts on this episode:


Somebody Loves Me by Meat Loaf from the album The Glory of Gershwin (1993)
Somebody Loves Me by the Four Lads, single (1952)
Good Girls Go to Heaven (Bad Girls Go Everywhere) by Meat Loaf from Bat out of Hell II: The Monster is Loose (1993)
Good Girls Go to Heaven (Bad Girls Go Everywhere) by Pandora's Box from the album Original Sin (1989)
Kanashimi Wa Tsudzukanai by Megumi Shiina, single (1986)

Send us a text

Emma:

What is this?

Sam:

This is Chat Out of Hell. It's the only podcast about the musical works of Meat Loaf and Jim Steinman that I can think of without Googling

Emma:

Who's Meat Loaf?

Sam:

Meat Loaf was a singer and actor who in 2016 was awarded the incredible accolade of number 96 in VH1's top 100 Artists of Hard Rock. Yeah. 95 hard rocking artists ahead of Meat Loaf

Emma:

who.

Sam:

Do you want the list? I'm

Emma:

tired, I think, for the list.

Sam:

Who is Jim Steinman?

Emma:

Jim Steinman was a musician, composer, and all round weirdo, described by Melody Maker as an affable narcissist, which is nice.

Sam:

if you're gonna be a

Emma:

an affable. one is, Yeah. Yeah.

Sam:

Who are we?

Emma:

I'm Emma Crossland. And you are Sam Wilkinson. I'm a good girl, so I'll go to heaven. And you are a bad boy, so you'll go everywhere. Welcome to Chat Out of Hell

Sam:

Bow. Now, Now, no.

Emma:

ding. bit of a clue there.

Sam:

I always wondered what it would be like the first time I was described as a bad boy.

Emma:

How'd you feel about that? Uncomfortable.

Sam:

a 40-year-old man. This is why I could never have done Bat out of Hell Two.

Emma:

because as a 40-year-old man, you'd never describe yourself as a bad boy. Would you describe yourself as a bad man?

Sam:

That's

Emma:

That's worse, isn't

Sam:

isn't it? Stay away. He's a bad man.

Emma:

Don't go near the bad man.

Sam:

Lovely. You all right?

Emma:

Yeah. Not bad. How are you?

Sam:

Yeah, I'm fine. So we're both recovering from separate ills.

Emma:

Yes. It feels very much like we've limped to the end of this

Sam:

Well, yeah, I was think so. By the time this comes out, it'll probably three be three, maybe even four weeks late. Gosh. And that's nobody's fault, but viruses. Yeah. And, It does feel like we've been off sick the day there was an exam and we've gone back in and been yeah, you all had to do an exam, and I didn't. And the teacher said,"don't worry, you can catch up over lunch."

Emma:

Yeah. Yeah. We've been kept in at break

Sam:

Yeah.

Emma:

To do the work.

Sam:

to finish off. So I think it's fair to say both our heads switched over into holiday mode and then we went Oh we do actually have to finish the series.

Emma:

I did my homework before last night. Swot. Yeah. Only'cause I'm really busy with arts and crafts

Sam:

I finished mine half an hour before you arrived. So this is Chat Out of Hell, which honestly we do enjoy

Emma:

We do, We do,

Sam:

we're really having fun. This is Chat Out of Hell, which is a podcast where we both bring a Meat Loaf and or Jim Steinman song to our podcast discussion group. Every episode and

Emma:

group is a,

Sam:

it's a group.

Emma:

We've not even got Maisie here this It's just me and you, Sam.

Sam:

can you have a group of two?

Emma:

Listeners, can you have a group of two?

Sam:

Are you a Zenoist philosopher? Please do let me know, chatoutofhell@gmail.com. I was listening to a very interesting episode of In Our Time with Melvin Bragg, all about this very subject a couple of weeks ago. Isn't it a shame that he's retiring? Let me know. chatoutofhell@gmail.com. Anyway, yeah, we both bring a song every time to discuss and chat about and rate on our patented Meat Loaf and or Jim Steinman song rating scales Emma, what have you brought this time?

Emma:

I've brought Good Girls Go to Heaven And Bad Girls Go Everywhere from Bat out of Hell Two. Sam, what did you bring?

Sam:

I brought Meat Loaf's cover of Somebody Loves Me, which was written by George Gershwin all the way back in 1924. Lovely. A hundred and one years ago. So we're gonna start with that one. The song from the Ye Olde Past. So listeners go away and find that on your YouTubes or your Spotify. It's definitely on YouTube.'cause that's where I found the sheet music, like what they used to do in those days. We are gonna listen to it right now and then we'll come back, which is the format of the show.

Emma:

You know that?

Soundtrack:

Somebody loves me. I, she can be

Sam:

Listen, see, it's 1924, see, and that was Somebody Loves Me by George Gershwin, sung by that man Meat Loaf. Emma, what did you think?

Emma:

Gee, Sam, I just don't know.

Sam:

I don't know either.

Emma:

It's a weird one that.

Sam:

Yes.

Emma:

Because to start with it sounds almost sinister.

Sam:

There's a bit of a spoken wordy section. When this world began, it was heaven's plan that there should be a girl for every single man.

Emma:

Yeah. It starts a bit incel.

Sam:

To my great regret, someone has upset Heaven's pretty program for we've never

Emma:

so I was expecting something a little more sinister

Sam:

It's, yeah. bit, It's very sweet, isn't it? It's nice.

Emma:

not sure if Meat Loaf's

Sam:

His voice never gets out of first gear in it. No. Which is both a good and bad thing, I think. Yeah. He just gently coasts along on the melody and the,

Emma:

but because Meat Loaf's such a dramatic creature, this sort of affable swing

Sam:

Yeah.

Emma:

Doesn't really work, I don't think. It's not badly done or anything. It's not like he's singing it in a time when his voice is shot.

Sam:

No. This recording's from 1994. It's from a compilation called The Glory of Gershwin. It's a compilation that was made for Larry Adler, who was a composer and a musician. It was made by him for his 80th birthday. He got a bunch of big stars of the day to all record a Gershwin song and doing a lovely compilation album. Which is it's nice, but it's very humble of Larry to be like. I'm 80, I can get a load of people on to make an album. Let's do some songs by my friends rather than my songs. Although I suspect songs by Larry Adler might not sell as well. He was a successful man, but he's No George Gershwin. So yeah. Made by Larry Adler, produced by George Martin out of, off of not being in The Beatles.

Emma:

Ah,

Sam:

yeah. Names on this album. Elton John, Peter Gabriel, Lisa Stansfield. Doesn't quite belong in that list. Sting John Bon Jovi, Kate Bush, Cher, Elvis Costello, Carly Simon. Chris de Burg. We're looking at some really good names. And also, also Chris de Burg, but yeah, Meat Loaf's there as well. It's hard to learn a lot about how this album came to be, but some people tend to say that Adler chose all his collaborators. Yeah. So he heard Meat Loaf and was like, get him on that. I want him singing it. Larry Adler plays harmonica on all of the tracks, so that's what kind of ties him together. He's a famous harmonicist, although he called it the mouth organ.

Emma:

That's what I grew up knowing it

Sam:

Yeah, me too. But that is a thing I think that our grandparents' generation would've called it. And I think only recently has everybody grown up enough to to call it something else.

Emma:

Mouth organ.

Sam:

The mouth organ. He was self-taught he was in films and vaudeville and that. When he toured the UK, he was so outrageously brilliant that harmonica sales apparently increased 20 fold. He met George Gershwin in 1934

Emma:

Just coming back to that point.

Sam:

Yes.

Emma:

Do you think when Jagged Little Pill was released

Sam:

that had a similar,

Emma:

a similar, effect?

Sam:

Yes, of course. The sales of antidepressants did leap twentyfold

Emma:

one of my friends at uni learn to play all of the, uh, Alanis Morissette harmonica bits sorry. Derailed now,

Sam:

was just giving you some dry facts. He played Rhapsody and Blue for George Gershwin. Don't nod. I'm doing it.

Emma:

Sam, are you sure you've not got a harmonica there in your hand? I know, it's, oh my God, it's uncanny.

Sam:

I can also do Johnny Briggs if you like.

Emma:

I like,

Sam:

Anyway. George said"the goddamn thing thing sounds as if I wrote it for you." It's nice, isn't

Emma:

Yeah.

Sam:

In the McCarthy era he was accused of a communist. Okay. And refused to cooperate with the house, un-American Activities Committee'cause he was a fucking nailed on legend. But he was therefore blacklisted and had to move to the UK. Which was a punishment. He worked on lot of film scores, but often his name was taken off them as a result of being blacklisted in Hollywood and stuff. In a 1964 interview, he was asked what he thought of the Beatles and he said, Lennon and McCartney have little musical talent. generally just a nailed on cool guy from the twenties, Vaudeville type scene all the way through to the nineties. Making a lovely album with everybody. I don't remember how we got onto this other than that, the premise of the podcast. Yeah. But it feels like you asked me a question that I half answered there and I don't remember what the question was, no. so, no. Alright. It's fine.

Emma:

I don't think I did.

Sam:

okay. Good. Well, there you are. That's the origin of Meat Loaf recording this. I guess not particularly surprising that I've not found anything about Meat Loaf talking about it or indeed Larry Adler talking about how much he fucking loved Bat out of Hell.Yeah, it's just nice.

Emma:

It's a nice, listen, it's a nice

Sam:

a lovely lesson. I think file it alongside Martha. Recorded about the same time as well. Yeah. This is songs that he could have stepped sideways into and, developed into that sort of a person in his old age rather than the old Meat Loaf that we got. I don't know how or why he went,"do you know what, let's do a bit less of that" as he got older, but he seems to have done. This is a little insight into the parallel universe Meat Loaf, who went on to sing the standards. The Great American songbook. Yeah. That sort of a thing, which would've been nice.

Emma:

It would've

Sam:

But he went and didn't do that.

Emma:

Just got angry at nothing in

Sam:

particular. this song was recommended to us by listener, Tom Wilkinson.

Emma:

any relation there?

Sam:

I haven't checked the email address. It's either my brother Tom or famous Hollywood actor, Tom Wilkinson

Emma:

It seems more likely to be famous Hollywood actor

Sam:

that I, yeah, probably.

Emma:

than your brother. I don't think your brother can be arsed to listen to this shit,

Sam:

I imagine not. But on the other hand, Tom, can you let me know what the kids want for Christmas if we are communicating via Oh,

Emma:

God, I'd love that. Does to have a podcast about something completely irrelevant to this, that

Sam:

If he does, I've got no idea about it. but yeah just let me know, yeah? So the song itself written by George Gershwin lyrics by Ballard McDonald and Buddy de Sylvia. Yeah. First published 1924 in sheet music form. It's been recorded over a hundred times Everybody's done it. It's big standard. We often compare stuff with the originals, when we're talking about covers. Yeah. But there is no original'cause it was just published in sheet music which is nice. Have you seen the series Joe Pera Talks With You

Emma:

I may have seen one or two episodes a while ago

Sam:

It's honestly one of the loveliest things ever. Yeah. But there's a joke in it where he collects sheet music and he points out that in the era before recorded music, everybody experienced pop music via their dad's hamfisted attempt to play it on the piano. Which is lovely. Yeah. You'd go out and buy the music and listen to your dad try and make it work.

Emma:

Oh, no that's brought back a memory,

Sam:

oh,

Emma:

Not of my dad tried to make any music work, but when I was a kid I learned to play the piano. And my piano teacher was a strange chap. the books that I was given to work from had various. I guess pop songs, but not ones that I was familiar with. Okay. And so my first encounter with like Bridge Over Troubled Water was me trying to hammer it out on the piano really badly. And I think that's how I ended up in a school summer musical concert where, you know, parents like you to go and perform. How I ended up performing the song from this book that I'd learned the best

Sam:

Was it like Afternoon Delight or something like that?

Emma:

It was the theme tune to Cagney and Lacey

Sam:

Give me a few bars of Cagney and Lacey. I keep going to the Sweeney.

Emma:

Oh, so this is the like crazy saxophone. Oh,

Sam:

Oh

Emma:

Yeah. Only I played that on the piano

Sam:

listeners, if you can do a, an acapella version of the Cagney and Lacey theme, do send it in chatoutofhell@gmail.com

Emma:

such a weird thing to have appearing in the program of events, isn't it?

Sam:

If you had kids, the equivalent of that would be your kid playing the Futurama theme. Something from about 20 years ago.

Emma:

that they don't really

Sam:

what Yeah. Yeah. Oh, a joke about how funny things were in the year 2000.

Emma:

Yeah. Oh God.

Sam:

It would be the Goodnight Sweetheart theme.

Emma:

Oh, no,

Sam:

it would be the So Haunt Me theme.

Emma:

So Haunt Me it would

Sam:

over the 2.4 Children Theme, It would be the Detectives starring Jasper Carrot and that other one

Emma:

Robert Powell.

Sam:

Robert Powell. Yeah. Yeah. It's good content. This isn't

Emma:

Yeah. Great. I hope our Americans are enjoying it.

Sam:

The first recording of Somebody Loves Me four of them were released in 1924 and 25. Paul Whiteman, Ray Miller, Marion Harris, and Cliff Edwards. AKA Ukulele Ike. Yeah. So many people have recorded it. So few people that you have heard of.

Emma:

Okay.

Sam:

Tex Benicky, Margo Bingham, Boots and his Buddies. People

Emma:

don't get people called Tex anymore, do you?

Sam:

No. Dave Brubeck, Benny Carter, Sonny Clark, Alma Cogan, Nat King Cole, Perry Cuomo, Ray Coniff, Bing Crosby, Vic Damone, Doris Day, Tommy Dorsey, Roy Eldridge, Duke Ellington, Herb Ellis, Percy Faith and his Orchestra. Eddie Fisher. I've gone too American list and that is honestly. I would say 5% of the list at best. Yeah. Buddy DeFranco, Johnny Paycheck.

Emma:

Johnny Paycheck. Johnny Paycheck. That sounds like a name that Mr. Burns would come up with.

Sam:

Zoot Sims

Emma:

Zoot

Sam:

Les Paul, the Les

Emma:

What, off of the guitar?

Sam:

Out of off'f of guitars. Yeah. Anyway,

Emma:

let's not make this the whole podcast. No.

Sam:

The song was written for the show George White's Scandals, which was one of these long running revue type shows. Broadly similar to Music Hall, it's like this anarchic mix of comedy and music and dance and theatre and magic. It's proper Saturday night family fun. Loads of entertainers made their names in this kind of show. George Gershwin, WC Fields, Three Stooges, they all appeared in George White's scandals. There was a similar show called the Ziegfield Follies and that had incredible names like Nivo and Knox, Fanny Bryce, Buck and Bubbles.

Emma:

We should have looked at this when we were coming up with double act names

Sam:

I think Crossland and Wilkinson fits perfectly in that list. But this is a tradition that continues to this day. Even in the 1990s, there was an up and coming performer appearing on a review show called Noel's House Party by the name of Mr. Blobby, who went on to perform perhaps the most influential song by an eight foot F eight,

Emma:

You couldn't get through it, could you?

Sam:

the most influential song by an eight foot.

Emma:

Come on. You can do it. You can do it.

Sam:

The most influential song by an eight foot pink vaudeville performer to this day. Yep. There he is.

Emma:

Yeah. Hiya It's nice to see him,

Sam:

Genuinely, I do think that is a through line of that kind of entertainment through to the Saturday night shows that we have today. I'm a bit annoyed that I only started my homework yesterday for this one.'cause I find it, the whole story of Vaudeville and the way that people went from being Music Hall-y, Vaudeville-y performers, and some of them then transitioned into early cinema like Charlie Chaplin, and the other ones.

Emma:

other ones. The other ones, yeah. Yeah. Good.

Sam:

I just find that really interesting. I think there's like a, an HBO drama about the story of Vaudeville to be made.

Emma:

That'd be really interesting to watch. I would be for watching that. Come on. HBO.

Sam:

Come on, HBO. And also pay me to make that anyway, most famous version of this song is apparently by the Four Lads. Oi

Soundtrack:

somebody loves me. I wonder. I wonder she can be.

Emma:

Do you think as they've declared themselves Lads They're worried about who she may be'cause she might be a right munter?

Sam:

Yeah. The four lads were a Canadian male singing quartets Lovely. Who have since had their names forever ruined

Emma:

by lad culture

Sam:

by the shifting of culture. It was nice though, wasn't it? Yeah. I've got so little to, you know, you might have worked that out by the way I went deep into a conversation about the history of Vaudeville, but Yeah. I

Emma:

figured the, I kind Figured this was gonna be light on the old Meat

Sam:

one. Not a lot of insight, Emma, to be honest. I quite like it.

Emma:

I also quite like it.

Sam:

Should we do a quiz?

Emma:

Let's do a quiz.

Sam:

So you are currently three two up on the series. I could claw this into a draw. You've got a win in sight, but here's your final hurdle, right?

Emma:

Right?

Sam:

So this song came from the 1924 George White's Scandals. Here are three other performers. Which one of these was not in George White Scandals 1924? The Shakespearean actor Barry Killerby, his whole thing was delivering hilarious monologues in a squeaky voice and accidentally smashing props in a sort of, like, like a show gone wrong thing. We've got the dancer, Tony Demarco, who along with his succession of wives, performed as the Dancing Demarcos. And we have Tom Patricola, who played the ukulele while hoofing or eccentrically tap dancing, and whose whole act was described as"a mop gone crazy."

Emma:

I'm gonna say that number one is the false performer

Sam:

that your final answer? And we'll find out after the break. Would you like to buy financial products?

Emma:

No.

Sam:

Then go to financial products.com. And we're back. So, Emma just before the break,

Emma:

break, before your little breakdown,

Sam:

you said yeah, you are. You, well done. You've won the series. Thank you. Yeah. That was, Barry Killerby was of course the actor who played Mr. Blobby.

Emma:

Oh, it feels good to have won but also I'm a little bit concerned about my Blobby knowledge.

Sam:

Did you already know it was Barry

Emma:

It was an educated guess based on the other descriptions that you put in there. Yeah. It wasn't a difficult question to, to guess. No, it You've played trickier games, Sam.

Sam:

I have. But it's also really hard to find out exactly what happened in all of these shows that were never recorded. Tony Demarco who, went through a succession of wives constantly performing as the Dancing Demarcos. He was the son of a farmer in Italy, His dad's dad had lost the family mill because he'd neglected the business to dance at folk festivals too much.

Emma:

A man's gotta dance.

Sam:

Yeah. His dad just about recovers the business. And then Tony says, do you know what actually the other, I'm gonna do dancing as well,

Emma:

then has a succession of wives. How many is a succession?

Sam:

Three that I counted.

Emma:

Oh, that's not, it's no Henry VIII is it?

Sam:

It's half of a Henry VIII, It's half of a Henry VIII If we're using that as our

Emma:

Yes. measurement that's the, you know the big famous wives guy. Yeah. Yeah. That's how I'm gonna describe him.

Sam:

The wife guy.

Emma:

The big famous wives guy.

Sam:

Do you wanna hear what the people on the internet think? About Meat Loaf covering Somebody Loves Me.

Emma:

Oh, we're

Sam:

do you remember we're talking about that? Yeah. At. Derek Wooden 4 4 0 6."I gave a copy of this album to my dentist. He said they played it many times. The patients loved it."

Emma:

Drowned out the screaming.

Sam:

was Yes. It's a good one to sing along to with your mouth open.

Emma:

Good?

Sam:

Shall we rate it? Yes. This is a song by Meat Loaf. So we're gonna rate this on our Meat Loaf song rating scale, which runs from Michael Lee Aday up at the top for his finest of songs to Michael Lee Okay. For.

Emma:

Okayest songs.

Sam:

Thank you. All the way down to Michael Lee No Way for the stuff that is deserving of burning in a bin. What's this? It's Okay. it's all right innit.

Emma:

No, argument. I think there. No,

Sam:

it's fine. It's fine. It's nice. I bet it's not the best version of this song, but by God I'm not listening to all of them. And I enjoy just dipping into the world of the 1920s and a bit of George Gershwin and getting all classy like.

Emma:

And now that's over.

Sam:

And now that's over. Emma, what song have you brought?

Emma:

I've brought Good Girls Go to Heaven and Bad Girls Go Everywhere, from Bat Out of Hell Two. Take a listen. We're gonna go for the Meat Loaf version first. But we have other exciting versions to come. And we'll see you after this bit of noise. So, Sam, that was,

Sam:

about, mate.

Emma:

Oh, that's That's what we're at the Meat Loaf shop for, isn't it? Oh,

Sam:

Oh

Emma:

It's just a perfectly brilliant banger.

Sam:

What a stupidly brilliant, stupid song.

Emma:

It's everything that I want from a Steinman song, It's dramatic. It's got some weird lyrics. It's got some horseshit in it, and you think it's about one thing, and then you look into it and it's really about wanking.

Sam:

What

Emma:

A lot of the internet agrees with me.

Sam:

Fuck. Has he hoodwinked me?

Emma:

Probably

Sam:

I've never been hoodwinked by Jim Steinman before. This is a first forever

Emma:

for everything. Where do we begin

Sam:

Um, well, I just wanna, we cover all sorts of stuff on this podcast and go to all sorts of places. Yeah. But this is a lovely reminder of why we started it, right?

Emma:

This is one of the songs that we will have played in the car on the way back from London that time. Yeah. When we decided that this might be a thing, Uhhuh, it's brilliant and ridiculous in equal measures that is what we're here for. I've given it quite a few listens it's one that I love and I really enjoy singing along to, but I remember. Being young and hearing it for the first time as well. And trying to recapture that a little bit.

Sam:

Meat Loaf memory

Emma:

the first time I heard this, because it's quite late on in the album, and so, you've gotta be committed to get to this one. you've gotta be committed to your listen

Sam:

for your lunch halfway through. listening to Bat Out of Hell Two is like climbing a mountain.

Emma:

Yes. get to this one. It's different to everything else on the album, but it also ties in really well with it. There's bits of noise in there that hark back to the very beginning of the album before. I'd D o Anything for Love kicks in that weird, not a motorbike, not really sure what it is, Monster so you get that in here. It's quite a hard rock song. There's some really heavy rock noises in there that I took for granted now.

Sam:

Yeah. I, so I agree with everything you say. I'm just gonna point out it's only hard rock by our standards.

Emma:

There's some qsort of some industrial noises yeah. Yeah, That are probably borrowing from proper actual hard rock and industrial. Yes.

Sam:

Yeah.

Emma:

So I, I quite like that because I think it works in this context. Yeah. In later albums when Meat Loaf tries to borrow from other popular genres of the day, like when it goes a bit new metal, it doesn't work. No. But because this is such over the top nineties production, it's glorious. Ah, I love this one. I know I say that about all of the tracks from Bat out of Hell Two.

Sam:

'Cause it's an absolute banger of an album. an

Emma:

Yeah. Do you want a proper Meat Meat Loaf memory?

Sam:

Proper Meat Loaf

Emma:

So when I was in the Girl Guides, don't laugh my patrol leader insisted that one week for our activity, we would make up a dance to this song.

Sam:

Oh, no, Emma

Emma:

I can't remember the dance. And even if I could, I wouldn't perform it for you because, that's between me and the guides.

Sam:

What happens at girl guides stays at girl

Emma:

Exactly. I was surprised to find out that she was into Meat Loaf. I think she was surprised that I was too.

Sam:

Sorry, how old were you?

Emma:

Girl guide. So maybe like 10 or 11.

Sam:

Okay. So this is a couple of years before the fateful dance to Yeah.

Emma:

Yeah. Oh yeah. Sorry, It's okay.

Sam:

parallels.

Emma:

Oh yeah. A little stab in the uh, yeah. Ooh. So yeah we spent however long the Guides session was that evening. Uhhuh pissing around, coming up with a dance to this lovely Can't remember her actual name. She insists on being called Taz. And she would like, regularly doodle the Tasmanian devil'cause that was very much the thing of the time. And I thought she was cool as fuck. Yeah.

Sam:

So everybody enjoyed the dance and you all just did a nice dance.

Emma:

We just had fun with it. I dunno if we ever actually even got around to it, but it was just so sweet. It was nice.'cause I have always hated dance. But to do it to something I liked,

Sam:

yeah.

Emma:

Showed me that dancing could actually be quite good

Sam:

That's really nice. It really shows up my opinion of you, that I assumed this would be excruciating in some way. I'm the arsehole. I'm what I'm saying, Emma. That's what I'm saying. You're not actually just some blank cipher of a sitcom person.

Emma:

Oh. It turns out you were a real girl

Sam:

Turns out you're a real person with feelings. What a twist at the end of the series.

Emma:

I know. Oh my God. They really fleshed out the Emma character. It turns out she had proper emotions and not just painful, embarrassing. So back to the wanking.

Sam:

Yeah. Now I think about it, that line. Imagine every inch of your dream.

Emma:

Yeah, if you start to look at some of the lyrics in this You're burning up in your bed, you've got a fever of love,

Sam:

and there's not an

Emma:

inside. You don't have a lot, but it's all that you've got. You turn it into more than it seems Now. I originally took that as being this being a song about you can be

Sam:

most of the most

Emma:

make the most of, make the most of what you've got. The most

Sam:

hand in life.

Emma:

But I think it might also be you've not got a lot to think about. You can turn it into more than it seems in a grubby, dirty little way under the sheets at

Sam:

thank you for using the voice. Just to clarify exactly what we're talking about

Emma:

wanking.

Sam:

And if you'd like to buy a clip of Emma saying wanking

Emma:

I, I'm prepared to, if anybody would like me to record dirty messages. Wanking

Sam:

please don't email chatoutofhell@gmail. It's Emma crossland.

Emma:

Fantasize every movement and imagine every inch of your dream. No one said it had to be real, but it's gotta be something you can reach out and feel.

Sam:

Now, can we please take issue with that at this point? Okay. Because if you can reach out and feel it, it

Emma:

is real.

Sam:

real. This is why I love this song, particularly because it has some of the highest horseshit density of any Jim Steinman

Emma:

that is really saying

Sam:

You can't get through a single frigging line in this song without going, wait, what? There's a beauty of a moon in the sky. But I guess when you've been leading such a sheltered life, you never lift your head and look so high. Yeah. Rich, sheltered people never look at the moon. I have a servant to do that for me, and he finishes at seven, so.

Emma:

I feel like as a teenager I took this in the more innocent you could be anything kind of

Sam:

I do, you know what? I, and

Emma:

still trying to stick to that. the people of the internet told me it was about wanking though, Sam,

Sam:

but the people of the internet think everything's about wanking, Emma.

Emma:

The internet is primarily about wanking, isn't

Sam:

Well, exactly. So imagine what the people it has spawned are like,

Emma:

oh God.

Sam:

Anyway. I'm aware this started with Pandora's Box.

Emma:

we're gonna come onto

Sam:

even earlier. We're that. But given the shape of the Pandora's Box project, I have always taken this to be a song about. Being a cool down and dirty punk girl. Yeah. And actually you're having a better life than the rich kids who they go to heaven, but you're

Emma:

you could go everywhere. Yeah. There's a nice element of that to it, I think. So it's...

Sam:

can wank wherever you like,

Emma:

on the bus. This was one of the songs that I would play to myself when I needed to be lifted up. As a teenager, and I, yeah. I wanted to be the bad girl that went everywhere.'cause the good girls seem really boring. And well, I made it to Leeds.

Sam:

Leeds is part of everywhere,

Emma:

yeah, yeah.. I love it. I love the music to it. I love Meat Loaf's voice on it. I think it suits him really well.

Sam:

Yeah.

Emma:

it's such a lot of fun to listen to. I love it. It's impossible to be sad listening to this one. I think. It's an uplifting track.

Sam:

It's not a Loaf funeral song, is it?

Emma:

It's not a Meat Loaf, although... maybe I could have this one. It's a daring choice.

Sam:

certainly is.

Emma:

troubling for those dealing with dead Emma.

Sam:

Think that's does

Emma:

go everywhere or does she go to heaven

Sam:

Mum, where's auntie Emma gone?

Emma:

Everywhere? She's watching

Sam:

Keep your hands out

Emma:

drown. Oh God.

Sam:

It's certainly a rough one for the people you've left behind. If this is your final message.

Emma:

Yeah. Quite tempting. Anyway um, As we've said, not the only version of this song.'cause it was recorded by Pandora's Box. Which was Jim's girl band project. It's worth a listen and there is a video available on YouTube, so I recommend you go and watch it. We're gonna play a quick clip now and we'll be back in a moment.

Soundtrack:

you don't than.

Emma:

That was the Pandora's Box version. I hope you watched the video and enjoyed it as much as we just did.

Sam:

I'm so happy. I'm happy. If you haven't watched the video, should shame on you. But here is my one line pitch for it. The kids from Fame go to sexy jail.

Emma:

I think if modern prisons had more dance offs and fewer gang wars, then the world would be a better place.

Sam:

Wow. Yeah. Emma out there with the controversial opinions like gang war is bad,

Emma:

Dance offs are good. So, it's set in some sort of Alcatraz esque prison.

Sam:

It's a prison,

Emma:

prison island a

Sam:

island off New York

Emma:

And Oh it's so silly.

Sam:

Oh. Of duh. It's Rykers, isn't it? Well, it's gotta be. Okay. Rykers is the famous prison island

Emma:

Ah, of New York. Ah, i've learned a thing. Yeah. So a van arrives at"Pandora's House of Detention where bad girls get put away for good", it says on the exposition sign that's very nicely put at the beginning of the video. It's dead subtle. A van pulls into the prison. busying about prisoner is taken from the back of the van by a smug mean looking guard. Who shouts."Hey girls, this is Jenny," which is a nice reference to the song. Of course. Why don't you show her the ropes? Keep it quiet" and it seems like something sinister is gonna happen.

Sam:

the first couple of scenes I thought, oh, here we go, dirty Jim again.

Emma:

Yeah,

Sam:

This is gonna be sexy filth

Emma:

prison, sex

Sam:

and... just a big dance off

Emma:

Big dance off

Sam:

everybody in jail loves dancing.

Emma:

Jenny looking moody a few times. And then when the verse changes to a bit about Johnny, then we suddenly see that there, there's been a man locked up in this girl's prison and it's not a women's prison. I feel like it's a girl's prison.

Sam:

Like in Derry Girls. It wasn't safe to put him in the Catholics prison just down the road. Yeah.

Emma:

For a bit there's a bloke, and I think he gets a bit hassled by the girls, but that's it. And it's mostly just dancing.

Sam:

It's just like a lot of prison dancing.

Emma:

And it's things like this that remind me that Jim, for all his want of being a hard rocker, he's a musical theatre nerd.

Sam:

Dancey It's very another example of that. Oh, it's very Fame. Yeah. Yeah. It's proper theatre school. 10 people dancing in lovely formation, waving their hands in the air doing claps, all that stuff.

Emma:

It's exactly what you would go to a musical to watch

Sam:

Yeah.

Emma:

What do you think of this version of the song then?

Sam:

Obviously it's not as good.

Emma:

No, it's not. Nowhere near as

Sam:

I, it's

Emma:

It feels very

Sam:

It feels quite poppy, which isn't, in itself isn't a bad thing at all, but it's a little bit at odds with what the Pandora's Box project is kind of about, which is about kick ass punk girls and Jim Steinman in a corner on his piano.

Emma:

Wanking?

Sam:

the video and the song the video pushes it a little bit towards cool, edgy, punk girls in jail, but then they're just dressed up and dancing. And it's inconsistent messaging.

Emma:

I feel like maybe this was part of the problem with the Pandora's Box project, because it was a bit inconsistent. The idea was it was supposed to be this kick ass girl punk rock group and

Sam:

with Jim Steinman on piano.

Emma:

But, then you put something out like this that sort of poppifies it. Yeah.

Sam:

I, I think it's more that the production is not to blame, but it's a very eighties pop production. Yeah. Rather than a little bit industrial rocky.

Emma:

It doesn't showcase the song to

Sam:

No.

Emma:

So, yeah. Jim had this to say about Pandora's Box."I think it's a real smoky Pagan album. I didn't want the girls to be hyperactive, like all the girls in heavy metal bands."They look like they've got a ferret in their trousers. Just trying to imitate guys. I wanted them to be real still and powerful, like ice goddesses. There are so many girly girl singers now I wanted this to be majestic and soaring." I dunno if he saw the video to it after that.

Sam:

Talk about masturbation. That is the wankiest thing we've heard all day.

Emma:

This wasn't the first version.

Sam:

Tell me more. Tell me more.

Emma:

Did you get very far? Sorry, wrong musical.

Sam:

what I queued you up for.

Emma:

so

Sam:

does he have a car? No. No he doesn't.

Emma:

Pandora's Box wasn't the first version of this song. Jim originally composed the music. For a Japanese artist called Meumi I, apologize in advance for all of the terrible pronunciation that you're about to hear. The song was called something that translates as Sadness Doesn't Last. Oh. And it was used as the opening theme tune to a TV drama called Kono Ko Dare Noko, which translates roughly as Whose Child is This. So that's what Jim originally wrote the music for.

Sam:

Is that the Japanese equivalent of the Delta House TV show? It

Emma:

feels like it might be. Was he going through a phase in his career where he was just writing for TV Although I think this was actually, a song properly recorded by the artist.

Sam:

was recorded properly and then used as the TV theme.

Emma:

don't know much about her. She was born in 1959. She's known for her work in J-Pop and Japanese AOR, which is Adult Oriented Rock, in the 1980s. She's had a load of albums and singles. I think she's probably quite well known in Japan. But finding anything about her on the internet is quite difficult because all of the websites are in Japanese. the programme that this was the theme song to... I do have a brief synopsis

Sam:

Yeah. The, video we've just seen is like the opening titles. And in that we saw a young lady running around with a baby. She fell into quicksand at one point. Yep. At another point she was lifted up and thrown around by a bunch of men. So my guess uhhuh is that she has been left a child and has to travel across Japan, looking for the child's parents and getting into scrapes every

Emma:

I wish that was a synopsis I was about to read. Trigger warning, sexual assault. Again, this is like the second week in a row I've had to do this.

Sam:

And it's also not really worth hearing either.

Emma:

No, it's dog shit.

Sam:

Yeah. But if you're not interested, skip two minutes Yeah. We're not gonna talk about it.

Emma:

So the horrific synopsis that I found, this is verbatim I found on the website, so I've not written this myself.

Sam:

Okay.

Emma:

High school students. Oh, fucking hell I'm gonna have to try and do some pronunciations here, do excuse me. High school students, Aoi and Sojiro are in love, and their parents approve of their relationship. Showing up before such a couple is Takuya. Takuya. says he's Sojiro's mother-in-law, Yuri's younger brother. Are you still following? No. Good, but he is in fact, her child.

Sam:

Okay. Right, right.

Emma:

Yuri gave birth to Takuya when she was only 14. Okay. As a result of being raped by a group of strangers on her way home from school, then one day Aoi is raped by Takuya at school and becomes pregnant. The agony of it all. And that's all I've got for you.

Sam:

Cool. Yeah.

Emma:

Yeah.

Sam:

So that doesn't sound fun at all, Emma.

Emma:

No, I'm not clamoring to watch it. I'm not planning on adding it to

Sam:

it's not going in film club? No. Yeah. Good call. the eighties. What a world. Yeah. If only it was about the quicksand thing

Emma:

That would have been much more interesting.

Sam:

Adventure of the week with a spare baby. That

Emma:

That

Sam:

would

Emma:

been great. lobbing the baby around

Sam:

Throw it up in to the air. Have an hour's worth of adventures. Catch it.

Emma:

I have got a couple of other bits. So, good girls go to heaven, but bad girls go everywhere. It's not an original line by Jim. Made its way into popular culture through entertainer Mae West.

Sam:

Oh really? Outta off of the 1920s and Vaudeville and that

Emma:

Indeed it all links. And also Helen Gurley Brown author of the book, Sex and The Single Girl. So that's where it's first come from. Jim's obviously picked up on that, but Jim is not the only person to pick up on this and use it as a song title. When I was searching around, I found at least two other songs that use the same title, but are most definitely not covers. Cheap Trick on their album, the Doctor, which came out in 1986, I sent

Sam:

yeah I'm, really sad now'cause I assumed this was a Cheap Trick cover of our song. All right. It's

Emma:

disappointing.

Sam:

All we'll give it a go then.

Emma:

So that was, that,

Sam:

that was a shrug in musical

Emma:

It really was, wasn't it? The next one I've sent you is an act called Modern Talking. And it was on their album In the Garden of Venus, and that was in 1987.

Sam:

And that was a thing.

Emma:

Yes. Yes. They were both things. They were both things. And those things were not as good as Meat Loaf.

Sam:

No, they were definitely not. I didn't enjoy them at all. No. I enjoyed them so little, it might be uncharitable to even play on the on the

Emma:

podcast.

Sam:

suffice it to say Nah,

Emma:

nah, so that was pretty much it apart from what the people of the internet have got to say.

Sam:

What do the people of the internet think about this song that's definitely just about different categories of girls and the directions in which they're headed.

Emma:

Urinezombie said,

Sam:

sorry. What?

Emma:

I know.

Sam:

You're right. We are overrunning.

Emma:

Urinezombie said this song is making a blatant reference to the sacred art of masturbating. So that's a thing. XMeatXLoafXFreakX said OMG. I totally thought this song was just about people being afraid to go for their dreams, but they do anyways. But now I reread the lyrics. It definitely seems like it's about masturbation. That is very disturbing and totally changed my thoughts about the song LOL, but it's still a great song, musically. Smiley face.

Sam:

I'm very confused by that LOL.

Emma:

And Afro Lion oh one said that intro. Is a pure eargasm for me. And of course we haven't talked about it. Sexy saxomaphone!

Sam:

Yeah the intro is 45 seconds of Sexy saxamophone.

Emma:

Oh, some of you actually playing the saxophone

Sam:

I, my,

Emma:

your musical

Sam:

revealed

Emma:

talent Yeah,

Sam:

episode, haven't I? The

Emma:

your musical instrument imitations are second to none.

Sam:

Do you think it's time to rate this song, Emma?

Emma:

I think it's time to rate this song, Sam.

Sam:

This is a song by Jim Steinman. So we bring out the Jim Steinman song rating scale for the last time, this series, which starts at the bottom with Jim Declineman. Then we move up to Jim Fineman all the way up to Jim Steinman. Yeah.

Emma:

Yeah.

Sam:

Emma, what is this? This

Emma:

is a solid gold Jim Steinman.

Sam:

A solid gold absolute nailed on 100%. Crystal Jim Steinman, send off for yours now. Only 35 99. Don't delay. Yeah, no argument is there.

Emma:

No, not at all. So good. a good song

Sam:

So that was our songs, this episode.

Emma:

It was.

Sam:

What did you think about their songs? Did you agree with us? Do you have things to add? Do you have opinions? Let us know your opinions with an email to chatoutofhell@gmail.com

Emma:

Preferably your opinions about Meat Loaf and Jim Steinman, not just your general

Sam:

No, I'll take anything. Okay. Yeah. Like this email, which came from Ashton and it's called In the Land of the Meats. The loaf is king.

Emma:

Beautifully done.

Sam:

Thankyew I dunno why I did the hangout when it's not

Emma:

it's yeah. I'm not complimenting you.

Sam:

Yeah. On behalf of Ashton, thankyew. Hi Emma and Sam. Similar to Emma, I became a Meat Loaf slash Steinman fan as a teenager with lots of emotions, and mostly kept my fandom to myself in fear of mockery until I got to uni in 2005 and subjected my housemates to Bat One, Two, and Three on repeats."

Emma:

Oh, your poor housemates.

Sam:

Are you still friends? Do let know. Couple of Meat Loaf memories. I saw him in concert at the MEN Arena in 2008. Rumor was at the time that he couldn't stay on stage longer than 45 minutes for insurance reasons. He did take a few longer breaks than you might expect, but he had sufficient energy to put on a great show."Can still feel the fire on my face from the pyro that accompanied Out of the Frying Pan." That's lovely.

Emma:

Yeah.

Sam:

I assume you were quite near the front or, yeah. The insurance were probably right. I also met Meat at a record signing in HMV Oxford for Braver than We Are. Local shopkeepers played Bat out of Hell for us while we queued outside."

Emma:

Not Braver than We Are.

Sam:

Yeah, I was one of the last in the line, and Meat was suffering from significant back problems at the time. So I understand he would've been tired and in pain, but I still got a personal message from him on the album, it says, To Ashton. Cool! Meat Loaf". Aw, that's nice. Lovely. And speaking of someone who was suffering from significant back problems earlier this if you'd come to me, I would've told you to get fucked. So good on Meat Loaf. From the last episode, a couple of stories about in The Land of the Pig, which is one of my favorites from Bat Three, alongside Bad For Good."Listen to the recording from the Bat Out of Hell Show album. It's really good. It's from a cut scene where Falco tortures the Lost, after capturing them at the end of the first act. It included waterboarding, in a pool which I think doubles as a fountain of youth at the Lost's hideout."In the original ending. Falco dives into it and comes out again, all cool and youthful for the finale." That explains everything. Yep. Because see, I think we've mentioned this in the version we saw, he just got changed. Yeah. I think even on stage she was just like, do you know what, I'm young now.

Emma:

Oh, I would love to have seen the original version.

Sam:

Yeah. Also featured electrocution with a car battery. Combine that with the fact that he originally actually kills Tink."

Emma:

Sorry. But It's

Sam:

right.

Emma:

But fuck Tink.

Sam:

Combine that with the fact that he originally actually kills Tink, Falco's evil is significantly toned down" in the version we saw,"and I think the show is worse for it." Absolutely agreed. Last year my sister and I went to Meat Loaf by Candlelight in Peterborough Cathedral. I've also seen, I think we've talked about them briefly and then I think we maybe did try to go once, but we couldn't make it. But it tours a lot. Yeah. So Ashton saw it in Peterborough Cathedral. it's a tour with West End Singers."There was something gothically appropriate singing the end of the Bat out of Hell chorus underneath a huge effigy of Christ." Jim would've loved that.

Emma:

He would really be into that.

Sam:

Yeah,"but the most glorious point was when the singers said, Meat Loaf and Jim Steinman are responsible for some of the world's best, most powerful love ballads. This is not one of them. This is In the Land of the Pig. Given the demographic of the audience, I think we were the only two who knew it and we loved it. It was like a private performance just for us.

Emma:

Aw.

Sam:

And Ashton has also sent a link to some stuff about Todd Rundgren's Motivations for producing Bat Out of Hell, which thank you for that. But just to summarize it, Todd really wanted to have a go at Bruce Springsteen."Love the show. If you do go back to songs from the musical, try What Part of My Body Hurts the Most. Which is one I do want to cover at some point. So that's going on the list. Thank you Ashton. Yep.

Emma:

Yeah, lovely email. Thank you

Sam:

Thank you for the email. We do need to go see the Meat Loaf candlelight thing. Yes. I think it tours quite a bit and it's one of those things that I've been like, is this shit or just really bad? But actually it might be quite good. it might

Emma:

be good.

Sam:

Yeah, we should make an effort.

Emma:

We'd have a good time.

Sam:

Yeah, I know. we are dorks,

Emma:

colossal dorks.

Sam:

Anyway, if you wanna be like Ashton, drop us a line. chatoutofhell@gmail.com. You could tell us about the songs that we've heard this time or you could hear me talk through the admin about what's happening next.'Cause we've just reached the end of series five and it is time for our regular short break. But you've also noticed that snow is appearing in the sky and jingly bells are in the air.

Emma:

It's Christmas advert season.

Sam:

Christmas advert season. Traditionally we would come back after six weeks with a Film Club. But I'm not sure when I'll put this show out. Let's pretend six weeks from now is the 22nd of December and we're gonna do a sort of slightly Christmasy film club. They're not Christmas films, but they are films that you would probably only watch at Christmas. Christmas is the time for watching Die Hard and Muppets Christmas Carol and that sort of thing. And it's also the time for spending three days not moving from the sofa, eating chocolate, and watching whatever's Emma and I are gonna be watching Meat Loaf in two music themed movies of the nineties. We're gonna be watching Spice World, the Spice Girls film, and we're gonna be watching Wayne's World.

Emma:

right. It's a war of some worlds

Sam:

It's a war of some world. Oh, you've been sitting on that all day, haven't you?

Emma:

Just came up with it now.

Sam:

Wow. She's a comedian, so if you'd like to join us in watching those they're not rubbish films either, probably Wayne's World isn't. So if you wanna join us in watching those, we'll be discussing them on our Christmas Film Club 22nd of December. And look out for some other cheeky bonus Christmas content in your feeds. Content. TBC. cause we've not recorded it yet,

Emma:

but it should be fun.

Sam:

ideally,

Emma:

Ideally. And also rest assured that it won't be as No. Dangerously sexy as last year's Christmas special. If you haven't heard it yet, why haven't you heard it

Sam:

If you spent all of last Christmas so aroused that you went to heaven and everywhere, don't worry about it this time.

Emma:

I made my husband listen to it on the drive down to my parents on Christmas day.

Sam:

That's on you. Anyway, it won't be as good as that.

Emma:

could ever be as good as that.

Sam:

Series six of the podcast will start on January the 12th. So Emma, what songs are we gonna be kicking off the new year with?

Emma:

I'm gonna bring Read'Em and Weep from Dead Ringer. How about you, Sam?

Sam:

I'm gonna be going back to Meat Loaf's final album Braver than We Are, and I'm gonna be bringing, Going All the Way is Just the Start, a Song in Six Movements that's 11 minutes long. But don't worry, somebody else sings it quite well earlier on. So let us know your opinions on those. Give us five stars on your podcast app of choice. Recommend us to your friends and family over Thanksgiving dinner, if you're American, or if you're not, recommend it to them over Thanklessness dinner. Did you see Meat Loaf playing Toe Jam and Earl on his Sega Mega Drive mini release 2019? Let us know. chatoutofhell@gmail.com. Emma loves Toe Jam and Earl, look at your face.

Emma:

I've even got like the Kickstarter version that they brought out a few years ago. I backed it and everything.

Sam:

If you have opinions on Toe Jam and Earl Emma would love to hear them. chatoutofhell@gmail.com That's us done. We're tired. We'd like to go away. Thank you so much for listening to series five of Chat Out of Hell. We'll be back on the 22nd with our Christmassy Film Club. Yay We'll see you all then. Bye

Emma:

bye

Sam:

Bow. Now. Now, Now

Emma:

him.