Podcast Europe Nations RR Review
Carl: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to another episode of Rugby Through Your Lease Podcast. This week we are doing a collaborative episode with Game Day Bites. Pasquale has joined us to make sure we cover everything in relation to the Rugby Europe championships. So far, we know we've had three rounds, but what are three rounds?
Carl: We are so far, and then we haven't even got started on the whole relegation and title semi-final battle. Just. Lock in now 'cause we've got plenty to go through. But Qualy, thank you so much for joining and for instigating this whole conversation. For those that know you through the bits that we've started collaborative working on, please enlighten everyone so that they can come and follow your channel as well.
Carl: And just show the love for, for everything that we do together.
Pasquale: Thanks. That's really kind of you. Hello everyone. My name's Pasqua. I'm a lifelong rugby fan and I decided at the Baker of last year, [00:01:00] uh, to launch my own, uh, Instagram and social media channels, which is Game Day Bites. Um, I've been working as a community manager at my local club in D or Spain for the last couple years, and I decided that it was time to.
Pasquale: Um, give it a, and then go, go that extra step and, uh, uh, start creating more content, get more involved within the rugby community, because I'm still flabbergasted after 12, 13 years of being in Spain, the amount of passion that there is for the game. Yet how little it's spoken about in bigger mainstream media or, or in circles that, in bigger circles than, than just the rugby family.
Pasquale: So yeah, it's a pleasure to be here and to collab, collab with you. And obviously we were lucky enough to be in Amsterdam a few weeks ago for the start of the championship.
Carl: Yeah.
Pasquale: So. Now we're at that midway point, or just past the midway point. It felt like a good time to have a chat.
Carl: Yeah. What, what, uh, what an event that was as well for, for [00:02:00] how welcoming we were made and obviously the, the, the Spanish team being there, obviously watching such a display of rugby, but the hospitality from the Netherlands and just the, just the door opening on a new era within Dutch rugby was.
Carl: It was so exciting to see, like the results haven't quite worked out on the pitch so far, but
Pasquale: yeah,
Carl: it, you could tell there's something, something brewing there.
Pasquale: It was brilliant to be there in bold with the crowd. The stadium is brilliant. The clubhouse was full, fuller history. Um, I'm still shocked at the amount of just.
Pasquale: S everywhere you looked, there was rugby history going back almost a hundred years.
Carl: Yeah.
Pasquale: Uh. It was great also to have a chat with Brian, new manager at the end of, at the end of the match. So it hasn't worked out like you said in terms of maybe results, but there's definitely been a lot of promise there from what is a very young Dutch team, and it set [00:03:00] ourself up for a great start of what has been really good free round of rugby.
Carl: I think there was what, I think they've currently had 12 new caps already in the first three games that Brian's been in charge and. Just the brand of rugby that they want to play. It didn't quite work out at the weekend, and we'll obviously get onto the Switzerland game, but
Pasquale: yeah,
Carl: just it, it, you being a Quinn fan, when Quinn, I know it's a disability.
Carl: Is, is, but you know, when Quinn had that season that they literally looked prime for g and all blacks mix where they, everything was out the back door. They looked dead and buried. And then they just went full ey and they won the league. Like there was very much an element to that in that opening game from the Netherlands.
Carl: It was very much, you might score, but we are gonna try and score one more. I think Georgia is probably the easiest way to [00:04:00] start. Um, results have gone very well for 'em. I, I think they're still beatable. I think there is a. There is a potential victory over 'em at some point. Like they Did you
Pasquale: watch the full match the other day?
Carl: I, I, I managed to switch on just after halftime. I rewatched the game though because obviously I, and I was just, Spain, missed the opportunity, I think, to take an away victory into thei there.
Pasquale: Did they miss the opportunity or was it. There was, they kept the, the scoreboard ticking over. They were in it. Not a lot of team with the kid going to the post, but they kept going to the post in the first half and then straight away after half time.
Pasquale: There was a, a great bit of brilliance by Tammy, by, um,
Carl: but, but that was the thing. Tanny [00:05:00] had to come on. Like, I, I don't think we went with the right. Nine to start with. Mm-hmm. Like obviously Tanny, Tanny's been so crucial in a lot of stretching games, stretching plays, stretching the team, being able to put the team in such a forward way of playing.
Carl: When we managed to bring in, I'm probably gonna absolutely bastard his name here, but it ista. And that's a good one for real. Yeah. So, yeah, for, for him to come in? Yes. Okay. He's been playing, he's been playing top 14 rugby and he's, he's been playing top level French rugby, but I just, I saw him against Georgia last year in Madrid, and they had his number then.
Carl: And to not start with Tanny being so influential. [00:06:00] To the way that this Spanish team has been built throughout the summer, throughout sort of the backend of the last Rugby Europe championships through the, through the Auman Internationals as well. Then for him to be sat on the bench for the, probably what was potentially a crucial first half of the, the game against Georgia I thought was.
Carl: It was obviously a calculated risk. I just don't think it panned out.
Pasquale: I was just about to say, do you think that was on purpose as they think longevity throughout the tournament rather than. Because what's the point of going to Georgia, getting the win, and then obviously knowing that you've got the finals back in Madrid, maybe picking up some injuries
Carl: to, to be honest, you've gotta hope, you've gotta go and do Portugal.
Carl: I was there last season for the, for the Iberian Darby in in in Lisbon to watch Spain [00:07:00] obviously overturned Portugal for a first time in a, in a while, and. They've gotta go and do it again. I think Portugal will probably potentially up for the grabs. I think they're, we're probably still seeing the same Portugal that we saw last time round.
Carl: But it's a risk to play when you've got an opportunity to go and put one on Georgia. I'd, I'd prefer I, I'd prefer to have gone and seen and tested Georgia. In their own backyard, get that home semi the home final and then put Georgia on the back foot by having to travel to potentially Lisbon with an informed Portugal,
Pasquale: which we'll get to.
Pasquale: I do feel that the reverse penalty under the posts at 63, 64 minutes change the game. Mm. Spain in the ascendancy. They've got a couple tries. Yes. Georgia hit back, but it was, they stayed composed and. [00:08:00] They were, they were they, they were, you know, they were doing damage. I dunno if it was by himself or somebody.
Pasquale: Somebody spoke back to the referee. He reversed his penalty. Mm. Georgia cleaned their lines, defensive mistake, yellow cards, two scores, and now it suddenly gets a lot more difficult, like you say, having to go to Portugal with a really informed Portuguese team to get the result. I was there two years ago when there was that dubious.
Pasquale: Try in touch or not in touch? Mm. A-T-M-O-I think, um, it's not gonna be easy crowds to, to, to go and get one over on the Portuguese now. So it, uh, I feel like the moment in sport, there's always a moment, and that was the moment they were there. They had them, they would've been at within a point or two points if they've got the, if they've got the three points.
Carl: Yeah.
Pasquale: Um, but Gutierrez was, um, he was, uh, he was doing a, it was a great job obviously coming in for the injured. Um. Oh, remind me [00:09:00] of the name. Name's gone.
Carl: Oh, what for? Uh, v. Vanessa gon Yes,
Pasquale: exactly. Gongon. Yeah. So he's come in, he he's got
Carl: what?
Pasquale: Composed.
Carl: He's different fucking gravy mate. He is so, so good, so composed with a boot and to have obviously, um, EZ sat on the bench from.
Carl: From Vere, like we've, we've got, we've got depth, but we've also not got depth at 10. And like we, we just spoke, we spoke about this during the Netherlands game, like the 10 worries me at times. Like, depends who we've got there. But I spoke to. Sevo, who's a, another bloke on, on X that covers Spanish rugby.
Carl: Really top bloke. But we spoke [00:10:00] about how exposed we potentially are at fallback as well. We've, we've completely left Georgia. We've, we've gone full Spain again, typical, but I think we are ex well we
Pasquale: are
Carl: based, yeah, I think we're, we're exposed at fallback. I, I think John Wessel vessel, vessel, bell Vessel played.
Carl: Yeah. He's very, very good. But if he gets a croc or isn't in, if he's injured, stuff like you look at the Georgian options. They brought Ninny Ash V in, they had Wow. Score
Pasquale: the tri going backwards behind the line.
Carl: Well, he's just, he is an absolute just filth. And then you've got Mac Carver on a bench at 10.
Carl: You've got ABCA Dad say, come in. And at 10 you've got the option that what, what seems to be potentially an absolute gem to have found with Tablas at 13, he seems to be like nothing gets too. [00:11:00] Tab Aase anymore, like nothing like he used to be the try machine. Nothing even needs to get past tab blaze because you're literally gonna get a try off him at 13.
Carl: It, it is just, some of the players that they've got there are just unbelievable. But
Pasquale: So
Carl: are
Pasquale: they favorites for you after the first, first group stages?
Carl: No.
Pasquale: Because I think I saw enough from, what was it really like going the second string Spanish, the starting theme anyway, in Georgia?
Carl: I, I, I think if we, to get a
Pasquale: result over them in Madrid,
Carl: I think if we get the players back that we potentially will get back for the semi and for the final.
Carl: There is, I think George, this is the time that Georgia are there for the taking.
Pasquale: Yeah, and I agree with you,
Carl: di disciplinary wise, that [00:12:00] cheap shot, that clear head shot, he was lucky to have that, whether, how long his band comes out for. Um, that yeah, that was just, again, another one. I, I just, they don't look as terrifying.
Carl: Upfront anymore, but new, new management, new future management. I don't think they are gonna go physical anymore. They're gonna want that varied ability. They've got players coming back. They've got players coming in. They've got such exciting options at nine with even, uh, love Zzi being on the bench at nine.
Carl: Just what he can do in the six puns is just, it's just terrifying for most teams. But I think the Spanish looked terrible defensively in that game, or they missed
Pasquale: 27 tackles.
Carl: They, that is just [00:13:00] unheard of. In a Spanish team. You can't with it in a, in a Spanish team recently, that is one bit that they pride themself on is defensive, str, uh, like strength that, like literally there was tackles where I saw 'em stroking the players as they went past.
Carl: Like, that does not happen in the new team under Pablo. It's just not, that wasn't, that first 40 minutes was not a Spanish display at all.
Pasquale: Did you reckon they got the hair dryer treatment?
Carl: Well, well, he, he, he had to resort to changes. Like there was a reason that he brought the changes on, but like the exciting options that we've got at Ortega.
Carl: How good was he like in the lead up to the Luc? Uh, Lucian Ardi try being able just his alertness to be able to play the ball off the deck in straight into tan by hiss hands. Just for the easy pass for him to just glide over the line for Rashdi. Like we,
Pasquale: if people haven't seen that, try it. It is like it really
Carl: is in the, of the lad of [00:14:00] the lad only champagne rugby in it.
Carl: The LAD only got a call up through what he did at the Super in the Super Cup. He was E Electric in the Super cup for the Iberians and he showcased exactly what he can do and he is now got that call. And look, we've got, we've still got options. We've got Mario's brother, Hugo PE. It again, was exceptional in the Super Cup.
Carl: Like I'd love to have seen him get a call up against Switzerland. Against the Netherlands. George did that. Like we also did that, but I don't think we went full balls deep on some of the, the options. I think there was still an error of caution that we can't go full transitional. Like everyone else says.
Pasquale: But do you feel that World Cup's a year and a bit away, a year and a half away? Most teams we're gonna see some of other teams as well in the championship [00:15:00] going through rebuilds.
Carl: They all are now. They all
Pasquale: are. Exactly. And, and that you can see that also in, in the other tiers of international rugby. So are we getting ahead of ourselves?
Pasquale: Are we gonna see the best rugby championship ever year?
Carl: No, no, no. This, this, this won't be, and the next year won't be either, because there'll be an element of you don't want to get injured in the Rugby Europe championship.
Pasquale: Yeah.
Carl: Six months or so before a well cup.
Pasquale: Exactly.
Carl: And I think this version now is gonna be probably the stronger version, but like the next one's, potentially the one that you see the likes of.
Carl: Netherlands, whoever gets outta this relegation battle, but I think they'll potentially be stronger because there won't be the focus on trying to keep players fit.
Pasquale: Okay. Well, to keep us in time, um, do you wanna go [00:16:00] over the other two teams of Paul A or do you wanna go over to B winners?
Carl: I think we, I think we cover.
Carl: I think we cover Portugal and Romania. I think we, the top, the top four are semi-final pieces.
Pasquale: Yeah.
Carl: Is probably the best way. But George all made it look easy Really in the last, the, the first three games of the tournament, Portugal. Oh. But they do, they did last time round. Romania look are a shadow of themself.
Carl: They are. They've looked. Bang. Average at best. Since the start of the last tournament, the only game they really turned up for was the Portugal third place payoff when they had to play in the rain and Portugal had already sort shot himself in the foot off the back of the Iberian Derby. Hadn't really turned [00:17:00] up then and then got served up in.
Carl: What was horrendous conditions in Lisbon? It's Romania. I just, I think there's such an aging side they had coming into the tournament. I think off the top of my head it was eight key injuries. There's players that have not even got a, an allocated team at the minute that are in the squad. So the Romanian actual domestic league is on a break.
Carl: It's been on a break since November maybe. So the new season hasn't started. You've got players outta selection, outta clubs coming in, injured, coming into a, a Rugby Europe championships that they didn't look convincing in last year. And they come into this one and they're the first game out. I called it.
Carl: I said, the first game out, they'll lose to Germany. I think it was the best option. Germany had to beat [00:18:00] 'em and if the weather hadn't come down, they'd have probably lost to Belgium.
Pasquale: Do you see the clips going viral on the Germany victory last minute German victory or the last five minutes German victory?
Carl: Yeah. Well, it was, it was coming like it, it ha it was, it has been coming Germany. Have, have put bits together. There's, they should have beat Romania the first game of last season, but they didn't.
Carl: They then should have beaten Belgium, but they didn't. They should have then probably gone and put one on. Um, I think that's a play to play the Netherlands in the other. They should have potentially done that. They didn't. They then had the full control for the first 40 plus minutes. Against Switzerland in that relegation battle.
Carl: Uh, well, the seventh, eighth player, and they threw it away and they went for a kick, missed the kick, and then, [00:19:00] uh, Porsche went and did, made that drop goal. And it's, but Romania just don't look good enough. I just don't. They're void of options. There's no progression. There's no development within Romania. I think they'll, they'll go to the World Cup and get absolutely toed.
Pasquale: Do you think Spain will do better than bro Romanian in the World Cup?
Carl: Uh, I did like the group, the way the group pool's been drawn. Probably not going into it. If, if the draw had been, if the games had gone correctly, I think the Spain one would've worked out pretty well. I think Spain would go there and probably do better, but I don't think the draws worked in their favor.
Carl: Like, you kind of want to get maybe the easier game out the way, like Canada, you'd want to get there and get a bit of confidence. You get a bit of momentum and that's
Pasquale: the last game
Carl: of the, the last game of the group stages. And it's the last one. So I, I think Romania is just going to really, really [00:20:00] struggle.
Carl: Uh, but then Portugal look electric, but how, who's actually put 'em under pressure?
Pasquale: Well, exactly. Although that back line is,
Carl: but that back line did exactly the same. They did exactly the same, but they're so quick.
Pasquale: It's incredible how quick they are. So again, is it the opposition that made them look better than what they are?
Pasquale: I guess we'll find out next week.
Carl: They, um, yeah. They, they seem to have tied together the issues that they had, but I just, I think they're, again, one defeat away from it all falling down. I think levels, the levels are in play. Again, I think they're very good against the other sides. I just don't, they're, they're gonna get a proper test against.
Carl: The Spanish, like the Iberian Derby is gonna properly test them. Spain managed to slow the game down, like and [00:21:00] nullify the way that the Portuguese love to create chaos. Like they, they create, I I, I asked this question to Simon Maddox and he didn't take it the way that I meant it. Um, I said that the Portuguese love to play chaotic rugby.
Carl: Mm-hmm. But. In a good, chaotic way. Like it's in a, it's exciting to see, like, you don't know how it's gonna cha like, but I, it, he took it as in, it wasn't a compliment, but I meant it as a compliment. It was chaotic rugby, but they're able to express it. And like, just as you said, that back line, just the passes are clinical and the speed.
Carl: They haven't even got sty back. Sty still playing over in Grenoble at the minute. Like the options that they've got to call back into that Portuguese side is phenomenal, but are they at the level that Spain are [00:22:00] now?
Pasquale: I think there's a quiet confidence about the Spanish side. Um, and I dunno if this Portuguese team has the same aura that maybe the one that went to the last World Cup had.
Carl: I think they look a lot better with Ferrero at 10 and with Marquez at nine. Obviously you've got the option of, um, Hugo Camacho coming in at nine for them as well, which is very exciting. It's like, it's like a Niko Infa option. It's very exciting when it goes well, but when it doesn't go, like I love Tanny by, I think he's exceptional at nine.
Carl: But when we played against the Irish, they literally shut him outta the game. They literally found every option to stop him outta that game. And you brought on Nico and he added a whole new level again. [00:23:00] Like he, there's, I think we've got an exciting option at nine. I just, with Marcus for Portugal, he, I'm pretty sure he is about 104.
Carl: Like he looks well, at least he looks it. Bless him. But he's phenomenal for fatigue and just steady Eddie. And he is still exciting with it. But look, that can't be the future option. Okay? Um, it is. I think there's kind of a case of you, you, they, they get through. But where is the, and then obviously if you, if they managed to lose Beckett, uh, Beckett to uh, uh, at Hooker.
Carl: They haven't got anyone that can throw, like, it's, there's too many parts. They rely on Martins as well. So if you, if Nicholas Martins gets shut out of a game, if you can't win the turnovers, 'cause the game's been slowed down with [00:24:00] multiple bits. It's, uh, it, I, I think, I love the Portuguese rugby. I think it's exceptional to watch as well.
Carl: Like the whole Iberian Peninsula way of playing rugby reminds me of the South American flare mix with Fiji Flad. Do you know what I mean? It's just, fuck it, like we'll figure it out later. Like worst case, we're gonna score 10, but we're gonna try and make sure you only score nine. Like that nine. Yeah.
Carl: It's, it's, it's, but I don't know what the remaining identity is at the minute. What are they trying to play? They've got 10, 9, 8, 9 players out. Key players. I just like they used to be just physically wanna fucking beat you up. But even now they don't look as convincing at that.
Pasquale: I think team, team and team success is all [00:25:00] cyclical.
Pasquale: Like you can't always expect the the same unless you're in like some. American University College where they have the same coach and they can go out and get the best players every year. Um, it's difficult to have that continuity. So Alex Bergeron was still talked about. It's still talked about, look at Man United and the problems that they have nowadays.
Pasquale: Exactly. Because for 20 plus years he was able to instill a system, but even he wasn't able to win. Constantly or to, you know, he, he, he changed his style of play. Um, so I guess. It all sports that happens. He still knew.
Carl: He still knew what, what star we had. He still had a variant of a main style. There
Pasquale: was, but it evolved, didn't it?
Pasquale: It did evolve. He didn't, his first man United iteration didn't play the same way [00:26:00] that his last one in 2013.
Carl: Exactly. But like there was still an identity. You still knew they were gonna go the full 90. 99 minutes or whatever Fergie time that he most, he couldn't a badge '
Pasquale: cause he knew that it was, it was, it
Carl: was united.
Carl: It wasn't over until Fergie told the ref it was over. Like
Pasquale: basically.
Carl: But Romania didn't remain. I just don't, they've got, they've got such good players at times, but I just don't know what they now are without those players. Like there is no plan B.
Pasquale: Well, that said, they still. End up coming second in the group and now have a chance of making the final.
Carl: They, they
Pasquale: played Georgia.
Carl: They got very, very lucky.
Pasquale: They got really lucky.
Carl: They got really lucky that Belgium were in an absolute quagmire like that pitch. I'm surprised they didn't come out with fucking snorkels on like it was that bad.
Pasquale: It was. [00:27:00] It was a really bad watch. It wasn't great. And when, you know that a highlight, it was only three minutes.
Carl: Exactly.
Pasquale: You know, it had them probably in the greatest spectacle. They looked like they'd been working in the farm for a few years.
Carl: They were, uh, eight foot underwater. And the amount of mud that come up was just, it was just bonkers. Um. I, I just, I dunno. I, I just don't think Romania, Romania have got lucky that there were two other teams that weren't at the level on the day.
Carl: Okay.
Pasquale: In the other group, Paul Lee, so hold on. Pull B. Finishes with Portugal, Romania, Belgium, and Germany.
Carl: Mm. We'll
Pasquale: get to the semis in the ranking in a second. And Paul Le was Georgia. Three [00:28:00] wins outta three. Spanish won to two games, and then Switzerland. And the Netherlands.
Carl: Yeah.
Pasquale: Now Switzerland, the surprise package of the tournament so far?
Carl: Well, no. Uh, no. No. I, no, I don't, I don't think there was surprise. I think there was, there was enough from 'em last year to show. What they were. I just didn't, I, I just didn't think they'd gone away and done enough. 'cause there was, I, I think they maybe had one friendly since the last championships, but they've managed to recruit exceptionally well.
Carl: Like they've brought in a lot of players. They brought in. That the, the lad that they, that plays nine for him. Fucking, I've gotta remember his name, but he's try, he's, he's only in like a, he's not even like pro rugby. He's not even a, a national UN or pro deur blessing Muang, which
Pasquale: [00:29:00] is blessing Mutan.
Carl: Yeah.
Carl: He's. Such a good, but he's 32, 33, so it's not a future plan. I was gonna
Pasquale: say, it's not, not spring chicken.
Carl: No. He
Pasquale: definitely can transmit passion. He, he's able to transmit that passion whilst he's on the, on the pitch. He's loving the,
Carl: he loves it mate. And I think he's got, he's, he's got a future if, if somebody is able to sort of pick him up.
Carl: But there's a lot of players that have come into this squad that weren't in the squad last year. If there's, there's been a big change. I think a lot of it will depend how Porsche, if we find out how injured he was. 'cause he, it looked pretty serious at the end of the Netherlands game. Like, he went off in a stretcher.
Carl: He was down for 10, 15 minutes. Like there was a number of collisions where they were just cheap shot on him. Like after the ball, just like, fuck it. We're gonna try and stick one on him. Um, did you see the, the chip for the last [00:30:00] try, but again, just poor, potentially poor defensive options there. But in the, he swung, he swung though, didn't
Pasquale: it?
Pasquale: He swung the,
Carl: he completely went the opposite way. It was brilliant. He, he went for the drop goal again, and that's what they, they thought was gonna happen. And then obviously, but I don't like to speak ill of refereeing, but that's probably one of the. Most question I, I'll put it as one of the most questionable refereeing performances I've seen in, in such an important integral game.
Pasquale: Well, well, so see what the viewers say about that. Drop a comment inside
Carl: the uh, yeah,
Pasquale: in the comment books below. And, uh, yeah. I.
Carl: I just, some of it, like on both sides though, it wasn't just, mm-hmm. There was a lot of stuff that could have gone one way or the other. But the [00:31:00] Netherlands, to me it looked like a clear grounding that they should have won that in the last minute, or at least had the try to go 29, 28 with a kick.
Pasquale: Can we look at the stats of that game? So the Dutch had 65% possession. They made 138 completed passes to Switzerland. 66. The Swiss had four tries to are Dutch. Two. Okay. They'd say that dubious, grounding, non grounding. The rest was pretty easy. 18 to B and defenders, both turnovers were 10 to eight.
Carl: Discipline it, it's down to
Pasquale: discipline. The Swiss put in 187 tackle. Now obviously if you've got the ball, you don't need to tackle that much, but it's over a hundred and it's over a hundred tackles more than the Dutch did. So maybe they wanted it more.
Carl: I don't think it was no, 'cause when I watched it, I thought the Dutch with.
Carl: What? [00:32:00] Once they were fully in control, they were what, 13 three up after 18 minutes?
Pasquale: Yeah.
Carl: Vivic Meyer. Could you, Vic Meyer has got
Pasquale: a boot on him, mate.
Carl: Mate. Kicking it from halfway and just from it is like, but 2, 2, 2, 2 steps and like yeah, he's massive mate met him as well. Obviously they're such a no lad.
Carl: Literally. He is literally the, probably the poster. He's like, David Beckham of fucking rugby poster boy. Absolute mate. It would not surprise me if there's like Dutch, Dutch teenage girls with his poster on that wall. Like he's literally like, he's pretty big poster. Yeah. But he is like, he's, he's what could be rugby personified like that Literally the way that you wanna potentially take it.
Carl: Such a nice lad. Really clever lad as well, and can fucking kick for miles. Like you can. Why can't we poster boys like a poster boy? Like people like [00:33:00] that. Like that is the way that potentially grows to a different audience. But as soon as he got that yellow, they lost that connection. There was, they managed to then slot in and they got it through the hands a couple of times.
Carl: They got the try, like they. They turned up wanting to play Dutch rugby and ended up getting into a physical arm wrestle, which they weren't gonna win because How
Pasquale: much do you think as a separate, like, along with keeping with that, how much is it important to stay true to your club or country culture, but also have, but you have to adapt, don't.
Pasquale: At England have made, however, how many, how many tests have they won or how many World Cup semi-final finals have they reached by, been a bit so boring, I guess.
Carl: Yeah. There, there, there's, there's a [00:34:00] boring, there's an adaptability, but like if you are not, you are, if you are not geared up for arm wrestle, especially away from home, like how many times have you played a game that you know, right.
Carl: This is, this is what the coach has put in place. We know they're bigger than us. Right? Yeah. They're gonna want us to get sucked into a, a one-on-one upfront, tight, close, quarter game. We've got backs that can run them absolutely ragged. How many times have you gone and played a grassroots game and been sucked into a punch up?
Pasquale: Yeah.
Carl: 70, 75, 80% of the time.
Pasquale: Yeah. Psychology and sports is a funny way of coming to get you. So
Carl: it's funny though, it, it happened and it happened on the biggest stage because they are in a transition. They are a younger Netherland sites. Like they haven't gone out there to go front up, but they know they've probably got [00:35:00] forwards that wanted to go.
Carl: There's an element of co winging ability as well, right. Yeah, fuck it. I can, I can do this. But like when the ref's potentially against your, through decisions that you are making because you're trying to overpower your oppo when you've got backs that can run and ragged. They got sucked into a game plan that Switzerland wanted to do after 18 minutes and they couldn't get out of it.
Carl: That was simple as that
Pasquale: and obviously. That then was, it was a great game. They've even, they put up the, the full game on YouTube as well. So I definitely tell everyone to go and watch it. Mm. It was a great, I mean, just to kick him away was a great finish as well. It had loads of drama. So
Carl: Porsche absolutely rung the show like after that 18 minutes.
Carl: The Geer. The Geer absolutely run the show. And if he is out for the rest of the tournament, it, I, he's the Swiss superpower that, [00:36:00] that's my opinion. I think that could be. The end of their tournament.
Pasquale: Okay. So looking ahead, looking ahead, we've got on the seventh Switzerland, Germany, 12 local Belgium, Netherlands in the evening.
Pasquale: And then on the eighth we've got Georgia, Romania, which is 11:00 AM our local time, but 3:00 PM local and in Georgia, obviously. Mm. And then Portugal, Spain at three o'clock.
Carl: Yeah.
Pasquale: In the afternoon.
Pasquale: The ranking. Should we talk about the semi-final?
Carl: Do you wanna do that before we talk about Germany and the uh, yeah. Uh, right. So we spoke about this beforehand, so I had to actually text Rugby Europe to find out the breakdown of the who, what, whens and hows of the relegation. So the first part is [00:37:00] really simple.
Carl: If German pen and paper, everyone. Pen and paper. Pen and paper. What? Or if you just, it's gonna be one of them. Like mind maps. It's like I'm gonna st I'm gonna take notes with you. It's like Rainman, right? So if Germany lose to Switzerland in that game, Germany are relegated. Doesn't matter about the last game, right?
Carl: They're down due to ranking points over the two years. This works out okay. If Germany win, they'll obviously get into the. Fifth, sixth playoff. Okay.
Pasquale: Yeah.
Carl: But depending on how the Netherlands do in their semis, in their final, so if Switzerland lose to Germany in their, their play their game and then go and lose in the seventh and eighth playoff final
Pasquale: mm-hmm.
Carl: They will be relegated. 'cause they'll only have three ranking points. Okay. If Switzerland and them finish seventh by winning their seventh and eighth playoff [00:38:00] game, they'll end on four points. Okay? If the Netherlands lose their semifinal to Belgium, then lose the seventh and eighth playoff final at finals day, they'll finish on four points.
Carl: If the Netherlands finish seventh, they'll end on five points. If Germany finish sixth, 'cause they go and lose in their fifth, sixth playoff, they'll end on four points. If Germany finished fifth, they'll end on five points. So
Carl: everyone finished on four points. So yeah. So basically if Germany win. Yeah. And they get to the, they're safe. Fifth. Fifth. Well, yeah. They, they, they live to another weekend, but they [00:39:00] gotta win both games effectively. They need to win. So Germany need to win both games. Both games, right. So if they, if they win, but then losing the fifth, sixth playoff, they could end on four points.
Carl: Okay. If Switzerland obviously lose to Germany in their game and then beat, say the Netherlands. Yeah, they could finish seventh and end on four points. If the Dutch lose to Belgium and then also say lose to Switzerland in the seventh and eighth pla, they could all potentially leave on four points. So we'll have three teams on four points, which will then go down to points difference, which would then relegate Switzerland because of their opening day defeat on the last round to Georgia.
Pasquale: Right.
Carl: Everyone with us?
Pasquale: Yeah. I started taking notes. I got lost. I've got Germany win, lose switch, lose wins. Four points. There's four points everywhere, but I [00:40:00] think we've got ya.
Carl: So basically Germany have gotta win both to survive. Switzerland have got a win to survive. It's just, it's in Germany's hands to kill himself effectively.
Carl: Okay. But they could get to finals. They already relegated.
Pasquale: And what about the, so yeah, just blown my mind away. We, all that information, there's a good couple of rules in there for that.
Carl: Yeah, there's, there's plenty in there. Um,
Pasquale: plenty of points.
Carl: Yeah. There's just points. Lemme
Pasquale: just plug in the laptop for.
Pasquale: I mean, it's, they don't help themselves making it. So, um, [00:41:00]
Carl: no, especially 'cause in the rugby Europe trophy, Luxembourg got relegated last season in the middle of a two year cycle, but it's a two year cycle to get promoted, but not to get relegated.
Pasquale: Yeah, because Switzerland's last year came up, isn't it?
Carl: Yeah, that, yeah.
Carl: The year, year before they, they won, but yeah, last year was their first year.
Pasquale: Yeah. Okay, so those are the semi-finals to stay up. What about semi-finals between Portugal, Spain and Georgia? Romania? Are we saying it's a third and Georgia in the final?
Carl: A hundred percent. I, I, I think Georgia put an absolute cricket score on Romania.
Pasquale: Okay. Like, without even trying or having to score a try falling backwards or over try line.
Carl: Oh, I, I think they could prob, I think ni Ash Philly could literally just float from one end of [00:42:00] the pitch to the other. Like, that kid has got so much talent.
Pasquale: And what about the Iberian Peninsula Derby?
Carl: Fuck me. Um.
Carl: Obviously being biased, uh, about the
Pasquale: Spanish in Madrid for the final,
Carl: uh, being biased, I think the Spanish come out on top. I just don't think it'll be as convincing as last year. They, uh, they, they managed to do an absolute number of on on Portugal last year. I think it, a lot of it will depend on players called up.
Carl: It depends on who, who is back available from the French leagues? If Rashad's available at 10, et cetera. I think they, they go and they, they, they go and manage to beat Portugal.
Pasquale: Okay. [00:43:00] What do you and, uh, close off with?
Carl: Pro, I think we'd probably pick a game at a tournament so far, I think.
Pasquale: Yeah. Okay.
Carl: Um,
Pasquale: what is game tournament for you?
Carl: Oh, very good question. There's plenty of options. Um,
Pasquale: it wasn't Belgium, Germany from the other day.
Carl: Uh, well, it depends. It's a proper rugby purist, like even Belgium against Germany was, uh, was a, was a proper purist day out.
Carl: If you love a, if you love a, a line cru, a line out more, a love a line out, the only way that that would've been better is if all of those tries were scored off scrums. Like that would've been the only, that would've capped it for me. But, um. I, if I was going to, if I was gonna pick a game at a tournament, it'd have to probably be the Germany, Romania game just because of how it ended.
Carl: [00:44:00] But I am actually gonna pick one half of rugby.
Pasquale: Okay.
Carl: And that was the Switzerland first half against Georgia. Which, which was, I think they kept them to three points or 7, 7, 7, 7 3, 7 0.7 3, 7 3 or something like that. It was just everything but what they, like, Switzerland just couldn't get that final bit.
Carl: But to hold a team like Georgia to that score line after 40 minutes and they, they went and done another 40 minute display. Over in Spain as well. 'cause what they were, yeah, they were the first half. Yeah, they're, they're ahead twice. Like if you could have bonded those two together, like I think Switzerland have been absolutely exceptional this first half of the tournament so far.
Carl: I, I just really, I, I do hope for them that Porsche's not crocked [00:45:00] and not out for the, the rest of the tournament. 'cause I think he's crucial to, to how they play. Um. Just, and again, like I just dunno how there's even the thought process that this could potentially be dropped back down to six teams, like from 2028 they're on about that there's poten, it's not confirmed, but it's a potential that the Rugby Europe championships will be reduced back down to six.
Carl: I think it's impossible to argue after how good this first three rounds have been. There's a lot of people who've said that this. This has been wasted games. I just don't think it has. I think it's been extremely exciting. I think anything could have happened,
Pasquale: I think, apart from situation in Placencia with the pitch that we obviously knew wasn't gonna be great and they still decided to carry on until the day before then change it.[00:46:00]
Pasquale: Apart from that, it's been, it's been great. It's been great to see. Fans in the stands for us as well. We were there in Amsterdam.
Carl: Yeah,
Pasquale: it was brilliant. It was brilliant the way that the, there's a real community vibe about it. Uh, and it was some brilliant rugby. There has been some absolutely brilliant rugby.
Pasquale: Um, that Spanish try on 53 minutes. If you haven't seen it from the game against Georgia, go and watch it. You know, I don't wanna be over the top and say the All Blacks would be, you know, proud of it. But that was, that's the way that you always think, well you always told that rugby should be played, you know, free flowing, quick, quick hands, good hands.
Pasquale: No,
Carl: but it, it was even like thet, the tally boy try as well, when it was just a case of it, he's
Pasquale: really fast. Can't believe how quick he's,
Carl: and, and to outpace. He, he, he did just come on. It was ta ta ta say, so he'd literally been on three minutes. Received the ball and just kicked to space and it was just [00:47:00] like gone.
Carl: And you think there's Mo, like if that was in the Six Nations, you'd have seen that on fucking, yeah. You would've seen that all over. Oh, everywhere. And it's just, yeah, there is so much excite, like even the Portuguese side, you just watch that back line, just go through, through the hands and like if you want-to
Pasquale: pinto insane.
Carl: A Marty, just even Mark it's electric, bro. And look, you wa you, you watch Camacho or Marquez get to the line and the pullback is just you. If you want your kid to go and learn how to make that pass, just go and watch what Portugal had done in the Rugby Europe championships. Making it to the line and literally that pullback pass to create depth and just explosivity is just phenomenal.
Carl: It's, I just fucking love it.
Pasquale: And I mean. For somebody born and raised in the uk
Carl: Yeah,
Pasquale: to gone to school and to, obviously the usual, the usual lot that play [00:48:00] rugby. But to be here now, this day and age, being able to watch and get really excited and be involved. Portuguese rugby, Spanish rugby, Switzerland, things that we wouldn't have heard when I was at school.
Pasquale: I'm sure that you weren't at school. We would've heard of that much.
Carl: No.
Pasquale: Bloody brilliant. Brilliant. So I think a word to everyone. Stay tuned next week, semi-finals weekend. We shall hopefully be in finals in Legis.
Carl: Yeah,
Pasquale: if your angle gets better,
Carl: I'll be at both. I'm gonna, I've, we've got Keith's coming over as well, so we are gonna be awesome.
Carl: We are gonna be covering both angles, so we're gonna be in both, whether one of us is half in one, half in the other for the. For the bit, but we, we are gonna be across both, both stadiums, both stadium for the full day. So Yeah.
Pasquale: And remind everyone who's thinking maybe of coming and spend the weekend in Madrid or in Spain, what the, the final final with in Leese for the [00:49:00] fourth place as well is in Inese.
Carl: Yeah. Uh, well, obviously I, I did it for the Island Day game and they just set it up outside fan zone. For those that haven't been to the aad, ael. It reminds you of a gladiator stadium of, uh, old time Rome. God, they can throw a party, they put on bars left, right, and center open air as long as the weather's good, which it's starting to turn back to goods.
Carl: Yeah. But I think the, we've
Pasquale: had a good, we've had
Carl: a good week. I think the snow's obviously been down south a bit better, but like I don't, we've already
Pasquale: had any that
Carl: much. No. Like we've had a little bit, but nothing,
Pasquale: it has not stopped raining for a month. It's
Carl: probably
Pasquale: closer to the UK than what you'd expect from Spanish weather.
Pasquale: But it. But it is a great day out, so anyone watching that fancies it come to Madrid.
Carl: Tickets are cheap as well. I'm just double checking what the prices were, because
Pasquale: both matches is 45 quid, I think 45 euros [00:50:00] for both. The further and for and the final.
Carl: How much is it for all? Uh, so tickets. Tickets for kids is 10, euros for all
Pasquale: 10.
Carl: So is 10. It is 10 euros for the, um, for the seventh and fifth, and then from 25 for the, you get hospitality for night euros for two games at gans.
Pasquale: Mad, isn't
Carl: it? And then if you wanted to go and do the Great Stadium, got Oh, great stadium. Oh, so good. Are you doing a press conference? You coming for the press conferences?
Carl: Uh, pr, potentially not. I think I've got, um. I've got a game the day before for the, my sixteens dollar coach. But yeah, 10 euros for an adult, for two games for the fifth and the seventh playoff as well at his study or nothing that, um, what about an hour across, on the train? Roughly? Yeah. So he might have to leave the, the fifth place game a little bit early, but.[00:51:00]
Carl: To get across, but it, it's just, just do it. It's a hundred percent worthwhile. Um, but yeah, obviously we, we've only likely touched on the Germany, um, side of the tournament, but what a performance from them in the first game. It didn't pan out in the other two. Belgium have looked, bang, average, um, obviously managing to grind out a critical result against Germany.
Carl: Let's find out how they're going and do the Dutch it, it's, it's full rebo build mode in Rugby Europe, but it's still exciting me. I fuck it. I just love it. It's just so good.
Pasquale: And we hope our listeners and viewers stay in tune with us and enjoy the rest of the show. So
Carl: yeah, plenty more to come. Two more
Pasquale: weeks to go.
Carl: Yeah. Yeah, plenty more. And obviously there's plenty of other stuff that we've done and everything, so go and check out the other stuff on YouTube and obviously go and check out Game Day Bites. And obviously if you like what we do on rugby, TTL, just [00:52:00] make sure you like, follow and subscribe, all that stuff.
Carl: But yeah, rugby Europe, we ain't going nowhere, going nowhere. It's getting bigger. Right? Everyone, thank you for joining us. Make sure you go like, comment and subscribe and uh, I've probably clicked baited a few of you into some comments. So hopefully speak to you soon.
Take care.