Toughness Culture: Student Athletes And Their Mental Health

If you care about youth sports, this conversation gives you a clearer playbook: safer language, smarter systems, and a path to raise athletes who love the game and themselves. This week, we sit down with Jasmine Evans, a licensed mental health clinician and lifelong competitor. Jasmine’s dual lens as a former elite athlete and practicing therapist brings clarity to messy moments: when to push, when to pause, and how to protect both performance and well-being.

Jasmine explains why tying self-worth to stats can shatter confidence and how to widen identity with roles that matter during recovery, from film study to leadership in the huddle. We also dig into the parent sideline: moving from drill sergeant to steady support. Jasmine spotlights Mental Health First Aid as a must-have for coaches and shares the qualities of mentors who make a lifelong difference.

Listen, share with your team, and tell us what change you want to see next. If this resonated, subscribe, leave a review, and pass it to a coach or parent who needs it.

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Transcript

Welcome And Topic Overview

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Tuesday Talks, your educational podcast helping parents become strong advocates for their kids and teachers to make big impacts in the classroom. Here we go. Hey everybody, thank you for joining me for another amazing Tuesday Talks. As always, share this episode with a friend, a colleague. We have a really special topic tonight. I have a special guest, and we are talking about sports and mental health, our kids who are playing and engaging in sports and team sports, individual sports. And I have a special guest tonight that has a really robust background in not only the mental health aspect of it, but also being an elite athlete herself. So I'm going to bring to the stage right now Jasmine Evans, who is a licensed mental health clinician. She is the owner and lead clinician of JPE Counseling LLC, which she started in 2022. She has nine years of experience with mental health services and specializes in working with children ages six and up, providing evidence-based support for ADHD, anxiety disorders, depression, anger management, and social emotional learning strategies. She is really known for her outgoing personality, supportive approach, and a really deep commitment to empowering individuals to reach their full potential. Welcome, Jasmine.

SPEAKER_01 1:28

Hello, guys.

SPEAKER_00 1:30

So I thought it was really important to have you on. So my son, fifth grade, 10 years old, he's come up through the rec sports kind of arena. We've done pretty much every sport you can think of to include hockey. I just wanted him to experience all types of team sports. I myself did more like track, cross country, that type of thing, which is a little bit more individual. But I wanted him to experience that because I feel like there are a lot of great life skills you can learn through sports participation. But I know right now he's kind of in that it's fun, we want to win, but there's no pressure, right? There's no scholarships on the line, there's no college acceptance on the line. You know what I mean? And as kids get older, I feel like that pressure can get on them a lot more. So before we jump into, I know we I got so many questions to ask you, but I want you to share just a little bit about your background, what sports you played, and maybe what mental health challenges you came up against and overcame.

SPEAKER_01 2:29

Yeah. So I started playing sports when I was age seven, I started running track. And then once I got to sixth grade, so I was about a 10 of 10 or 11 years old. I started playing basketball, which that is, you know, my forte. And then once I got to high four-year litterman in volleyball, basketball, and track, and received scholarship offers and with all three sports. But of course, I went ahead and signed for basketball because, of course, that's my passion. And went to college for basketball. And then, of course, after postgrad, I signed with a semi-pro team in Orlando, Florida. The team is called Orlando Boom. And after that, I began playing with the Orlando Women's Basketball Organization, who I play for right now. And I'm also also the director, one of the board members as a director of the community outreach. And yeah, so I still play basketball still to this day.

The Cost Of Toughness Culture

SPEAKER_00 3:30

I love it. So you've been involved in sports deeply for a very long time. So you know that sports culture really glorifies the toughness, played through the pain. And if I'm being honest, even for my 10-year-old, I've actually said that to him before. And just even talking with you about this topic in this episode, I started to feel bad about that because he would be like, Oh, this hurts or that hurts. And he does have a tendency to be slightly dramatic. I don't know where he gets that from. But so I have said push through, like push through. And so, how is that mindset harming student athletes? And what would it take to rewrite that narrative?

SPEAKER_01 4:14

I think when it comes to just to tough it out or no pain, no game. Of course, like you said, when you tell your son, or if coaches and when coaches tell their athletes, it's in your mind, just let it go, really plays a big role and impacts the mental aspect of the athlete. When it comes to ignoring injuries, they the student athlete tries to hide it most of the time. They downplay the symptoms of what's truly going on, and then they try to return to play too early, and they skip. Sometimes they skip rehab. So, and I think that's one big way of helping yourself physically. But when it comes to them ignoring it and trying to push through it, then that's when you have to think about the long-term effects of career-ending injuries and then also stress fractures, torn ligaments, things of that nature, then sometimes it can result in concussions, depending on what's going on. So you don't want to get the athlete to think about normalizing the pain. You don't want them to do that because the morning sides get ignored because you're told to push through it. Sometimes when it comes to the pain or injuries, the athletes think about, oh, the pain is just a weakness leaving the body. But we don't want them to frame that and have them think that's the way to go because it's not. And then we also don't want them to think that they're letting their team down because they can't perform. But sometimes it is a blurred line between discomfort versus injury. And you really want to make it a point to let the athletes know that's not the way to go. Because sometimes it's hard. Sometimes it's hard to differentiate between the two because you want to be out there playing, because you don't want to get out, you don't want to let your team down, you don't want to let your coach down, and you've spent all this time practicing and sweating and training and things of that nature. So, but also the mental health suffers, it suffers in silence when it comes to that. Yeah. When it comes to the when it comes to the toughness culture, it doesn't stop just at the bite, it extends to the emotional aspect too. So when you talk about the pressures, you talk about athletes suppressing their fears or their stresses or the anxiety or sadness, even when you can't perform at your best, when you're not the top athlete anymore, and you have to take time off. And then now you have to start over or you have to start midway. So that plays a toll on the mental aspect of an athlete.

Teaching Pain Vs Discomfort At Home

SPEAKER_00 6:46

And I think that's so important what you said about having the athlete understand the difference between that discomfort and actual pain. And I know for myself, again, my kid is younger. We're not at this make or break kind of moment with sports, but I really wanted to find a rec league that I think embodied that mindset that you just shared, like from the top, the leadership, the coaches. I wanted them to take him seriously if he really was in pain and not just push him back out there on the field. But I think it's even more important for parents to instill that mindset in their kids because we can't always control the type of coaches that our kids end up under as leaders. You can control how your kid learns to internalize pain or express pain and move through kind of that process of deciding is this actual pain or is this a little discomfort as well? What do you think about that aspect? Like, what can parents questions parents can maybe ask their kids? For me, I have my kid rate the pain on a scale of one to five. One is I can keep going, and five is we need to go to the ER right now. And then I'll have him rate it like that.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

Yeah, I think with parents just asking those questions after the end of the game or even after practice, hey, like how are you feeling? How are your arms feeling? How are your legs feeling? Are you fatigued? Are you this? Just getting into the habit of asking instead of just assuming and then waiting until the children or the athlete tell you. Because of course they're not going to tell you because they want to participate. They don't want to sit out. Because, of course, if they do, then they I their identity becomes fragile. So they don't want to lose their identity, they don't want to lose the being the strong athlete or the strong player or the leader or the team captain. They want to stay resilient. But when you make it a point to ask them about injuries or things of that nature, you would want to be able to implement that after a game or after a practice.

SPEAKER_00 8:44

And you talked a little bit about like sometimes athletes will want to skip rehab. They just want to get right back out there to get back into the game, support their team, hit the stats that they want to hit or whatever. And these injuries that sideline these athletes physically, that mental piece that you kind of talked about, can really start to shatter their self-identity, their self-worth. And so, how can programs or schools kind of disrupt that? Just rehab whatever it is and get back out there kind of mentality.

Rehab, Identity, And Safe Team Environments

SPEAKER_01 9:14

Yeah. So many student athletes, they internalize the belief that their worth is that equals their performance, which it doesn't. But what schools and programs can do is have incentives for the athletes when it comes to rehab, make sure that you're informing not only the fans, but you know, the team and things of that nature. And then, of course, helping the athlete know that they're safe, that they can speak up, that they can talk to the trainers, they can talk to the coaches. And then even with the fear of them losing playing time or their scholarships or just approval, making sure that you encourage them and keep a safe environment around them would definitely help in that aspect.

SPEAKER_00 9:55

Like while you were saying that, having that safe conversation with the coach or training staff, it made me think about the show on Apple TV, Ted Lasso, where the team had a mental health clinician there to talk with the athletes. Do you recall, like starting in high school through college, and into even the adult league that you play for right now? Has there been that staff person that is the safe one to go to to talk to about problems? Because sometimes that might not be the coach.

Accessing Mental Health Support In Sports

SPEAKER_01 10:23

Yeah, I've played for difficult coaches before where you don't feel comfortable with talking to them about certain things. But when you are in that environment, you try to find someone, whether it is your teammates, or if you confide in the trainer who's helping you get back to your playing field. There are personnel who are available, but of course you would have to ask. So just being transparent, my experience in college, coming from small town and small town in Texas, and having to leave and go to Florida by myself with without any family, anything of that nature, I definitely needed somebody to speak with about the anxiousness that I was that I was experiencing. I was down at times, definitely experienced some type of depression. And I asked my coach because I didn't feel comfortable with expressing myself to her, because of course, again, when we talked about not wanting to lose your identity in being the strong player, the leader, the resilient individual, I asked her if there was anyone on campus that I can talk to. And there were people there, but even with me being an athlete, and this was my mindset back then, I thought that even if I were to go to these counselors, have they played sports before? Do would they understand what I'm going through as an athlete here? I'm by myself. I'm 20, I want to say I was like 20 years old at the time, and I have no family around, and there's a lot of things happening at home to where I can't be there to help. And I was really struggling with being away from home. But I decided not to take the help. And I just, I just kind of suffered in silence, which is not a good thing at all because it did hinder my performance and other things that I had to work through. But I definitely encourage when there is that help available, take it. I encourage any athlete to take it, even if you do have the thoughts of they they wouldn't understand what I'm going through, they will.

SPEAKER_00 12:42

Yeah, I think that's what gives your practice as a licensed mental health counselor such a unique perspective when you're working with athletes, because you can speak their language. You experience what they are currently experiencing. And I think even more beneficial to your practice is that you did take the path that some would consider wrong, right? Like you internalized it, you just dealt with it. So you can explain to them how what the outcome was from that, like how it could have been different if you had reached out to somebody and give them kind of both sides of the coin to say, if you internalize it, this is how it impacted me when I did that. And if you talk about it with somebody, this is how it impacted me when I did that. So I think that gives your practice a really unique experience. And on top of all of the injuries that can lead to like doubting your self-worth and your kind of losing your identity, this social media thing is really impacting kids who don't even play sports. So I can't even imagine if you are a top athlete or you're wanting to be the top athlete or you play for a big uh school that is known to do really well. I mean, I'm here in Georgia, these kids start playing football without the womb. So, like, it's a big deal here. But social media has become kind of like that second playing field with highlight reels and public criticism. I mean, even some of the parents on the little flag football team that my kid plays for, their kids have their own Instagram handle and they're like, Yeah, tag your son. And I'm like, he ain't got no Instagram. We don't do that. I'm not judging you, but I'm just saying we don't do that. I don't have enough to do other than add on to my things to do, create highlight reels for my kid. I'm not doing that, at least not right now. But that social media has really opened it up to more pressure on kids. And so, how is this digital culture intensifying the mental health struggles for athletes? And how do we push back on that?

Social Media Pressure And Comparison

SPEAKER_01 14:43

Yeah, so I mean, even with the social media aspect, it wasn't as huge as it is now when I was playing. Thank God it was not. Because I witnessed a lot of things that these top athletes go through with within the comments and just in the media, period. It just hinders them when it comes to the mental health aspect. And social media didn't create the pressure in the sports, but it did multiply it, it did publicize it, and it made it, it made it to where you can't escape from it because you have to have open profiles, you have to kind of turn a blind eye to the negative comments or the naysayers, things of that nature. But of course, even if you put your phone down or close your laptop, then you have to look on ESPN and you have you will see everything that's going on with everyone. But also when it comes to the social media aspect, comparison becomes distorted, it becomes consistent. The highlights without context, filters, people edit certain things to make one scene better than the other. And especially with the kids, it plays a role in how they see themselves. And like we talked about with the identity you have where some people experience the imposter syndrome, anxiety, self-doubt, body image concerns. Oh, well, I'm not as small as this person, or I'm not as tall as this person, especially with basketball. So, of course, a lot of people think about height when you talk about basketball. So some kids may think, oh my God, well, he's 6'8 and I'm only 5'7, like he's better than me, or she's faster than me, or she can jump higher than me, or her highlights are better than mine, her edits are better than mine, she has more followers than I do. So, you behind the scenes, a lot of kids go through that comparison phase, which you know it it plays a big role in how they feel about themselves. And like I said, it goes back to the identity aspect.

SPEAKER_00 16:30

Yeah, so we talked about the coaches putting pressure on kids putting pressure on themselves, social media putting pressure on it, and we cannot forget about parents. Parents also put pressure on their kids as well. I know for myself, I'm giving that pep talk in the car on the way to the game. Like, do you remember your plays? Do you make sure you do this? Make and I never play football ever, but I'm just doing my best to give this pep talk so we can have a decent or good outcome at the end. But some parents are even at a young age of 10, like my kid, he plays 10 new flag football. This is like the most low investment. Like, we are not on the brink of anything right now. Like, we're not getting into schools, colleges, all that stuff. But they're out there like very much intense. And you want to say, man, I feel bad for that kid. And can that parent just like chill? But even though parents are told to cheer from the sidelines, they're told to sit in certain places to decrease interaction with the refs. What kind of role should they really play when they are looking at challenging the system that could be putting a lot of pressure on their kids and then kind of self-reflect too to see if they're contributing to that pressure that's being put on their kid too?

Parents’ Role: Supporter Not Stakeholder

SPEAKER_01 17:51

Yeah. So parents, I think that they sometimes forget that they're the supporters and they're fans and not stakeholders, right? So when it comes to a child with a problematic parent who's in the crowd, their real well-being is really at risk. They don't understand that when you are yelling at your child, even if they make a mistake, they don't understand that you bring about self-doubt, they don't understand it. And the parents' first responsibility is not to be, it's not the team's success, but it's for the child's health. So if parents understand with taking initiative to understand the emotional distress and how serious it is when a student or when their children are performing at high levels, they have to understand that they their approach is very critical when it comes to the performance of the kid. So if they interfere or intervene during a timeout or during a really heated, really heated moment in the game, you can't, that can make or break your child's focus at that time. But of course, we know cheering is optional, and but protection at the time is not. You let the coaches do their jobs and you let the refs do their jobs. But yeah, it's very stressful. It's a stressful environment. And I've worked with kids who have those problematic parents and they hate it. And I know that the parents think, oh, this is what they need, or and sometimes parents they try to live vicariously through their children and they see other parents doing it as well, and they think that's the right way to go just because they see the performance or the high level that the child, the other kid is performing it. But it definitely plays a role, a negative role in the child's mental.

SPEAKER_00 19:38

So I love what you said.

SPEAKER_01 19:40

Well, I would go ahead. They're still children at the end of the day, and they still have plenty of years to to perfect their skills. And when they do mess up, just encourage them to keep going. Encourage them to keep going and know that you are there to support them mentally, physically, and emotionally, and not just as a drill sergeant.

SPEAKER_00 20:10

Right. I love what you said about parent responsibility is not the team's success, but their child's well-being. And I think if parents can keep that in mind when they're going to the game, and you might have to, as the parent, continue to remind yourself of that throughout the game because things can get really intense. I tell my son all the time, like, I can see what you're capable of. Like your performance today, did it match what you think you you could have done out there? We'll have those conversations. And so sometimes it's it's hard to not like morph into this kind of, I don't know, vulture kind of pair where you're like, you can do better than that. Why didn't you do better? Um, but coming back to that idea that my child's well-being is the most important, and knowing your kid too, like, how much can you say, how far can you go before you start to see your kids shut down or maybe react angry to you and what you're saying? Because as you mentioned, you know, that the cheering is optional, but the protection is not. And at the end of the day, we have to protect our kids because if we talk to our kids that way, and that's how we quote, motivate them, they'll let another adult in a coaching position, support staff position, talk to them that same way. But now they have categorized that type of talk to being supportive when really it's more detrimental, maybe not right then instantly, but in the long run, it could really be more detrimental than it is helpful.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

Yeah. And even with you saying that, sometimes we as athletes we normalize how people approach us, especially when it comes to the coaches, because we look at coaches as our basically as our second parents, away from our parents. We trust that they will take care of us, we trust that they will respect us. Us. We trust that they will get us to where we're going and help us reach our goals. But sometimes I think in the sports culture, oftentimes we have things that people minimize, which could be harmful to the well-being of an athlete. So, like saying things, oh, well, that's just how the coach is. Like the coach is she's always been like that, or he's always been like that. He yells at everyone, everyone's so stressed out. And sometimes you even go as far as, well, this is what it takes. Like you have to go through this. And you and most of the time you don't. No, you don't. And the parent does play a critical role in saying things to help the child or their athlete understand that you do not have to take whatever is coming to you from that coach, no matter who that coach is, no matter how many, how many awards they have, no matter how many championships that they have, things of that nature. But you know, how you are as a coach is very important to individuals because you're not just talking about the athlete on the field, but you're talking about how they are off the field as well. Because you teach a lot of things, you teach a lot of social skills, you teach a lot of life skills. And like you said, if your parent is yelling at you or always upset with you, then of course, nine times out of 10, that child will go to a coach. And because it feels normal, they think it's okay for a coach to treat them the same way. And then they won't speak up, they won't advocate for themselves when in actuality you should be.

Coaching Styles And Athlete Well-Being

SPEAKER_00 23:31

Right. It makes me think back to you mentioned coaches a lot throughout our talk, but what type of training do these coaches have in this area of mental health? Is there any type of training that they have to go through required to do so as kids get into more elite sports? I'm talking about like high school and maybe up, because I know for younger kids, it's like pulling teeth to get parents to volunteer to coach. So at the end of the day, it's just like, oh, you want to coach? Yes, you pass the background check, you're good to go. You know you're not a sex offender, you don't have any felonies on your record. You're great. Put on the coach's jersey when we take them, but we don't really know their mindset as it relates to motivating young kids. And that is where those seeds are really planted for how they see themselves, how they categorize the type of coaching that they're given. And that is, I think that pours right into the type of athlete that they become when they get into more high-stakes sports. So, for yourself, what were some of the attributes of coaches that you found to be really helpful for your mental health? What were some of the things that they either said or did that made you feel supported, but also encouraged? Because we're not trying to minimize that push that we give kids. Some kids need that encouragement, that go get it, you're you can do it type encouragement, but there's a fine line there. Did you have any coaches that really stood out to you? And what were some of their attributes?

Training Coaches In Mental Health First Aid

SPEAKER_01 25:03

Yeah, so my favorite coach, my favorite coach, I just love him so much. His name is uh Coach Paul Ridge. He was my and you coach from middle school all the way up until until I graduated high school, but also he was not only a coach to me, but he was like a second father to me, the male figure that I needed in my life. And he he was to me, he was perfect. He was definitely a perfect coach because he understood me, he understood my struggles, he understood my background. He didn't just say, Oh, she's a difficult, a difficult player. He saw beyond that. And his he was very open, he was very transparent, he was very forgiving, but he was also knowledgeable about the game. And when you have a coach who can relate to you, you have a better, you build a better rapport with them, and then your relationship goes far and beyond. So I really love the fact that he really loved the game, he really loved each player that he's ever coached. And it was not only him just being a coach, but he was family to a lot of us. So if he would give us the shirt off his back, which would probably fit three of us at one time, but you know, that's neither here or there. But he was very giving and open to his home, to his family, and things of that nature. So I think when it comes to a lot of these coaches, not only do they need the proper training to be able to handle different personalities, different kids from different backgrounds, cultures, things of that nature. But when you get a coach that you can relate to, it's that's better. So when it comes, when it comes to the question that you asked about what proper trainings and things, I know that they do a training for first aid. So mental health, first aid. I know that they do it in a lot of businesses and companies, more so schools. And a lot of coaches can benefit from that because they show you you're you're more aware of the signs of mental health or mental crisis when it comes to the performance of an athlete, when it comes to the academic-wise, when it comes to just their social aspect and just the behaviors that they portray on a daily basis. So the first aid, mental health first aid for youth, and then they also have mental health first aid for adults as well. So, of course, when you get to college, you're adults. So coaches should, and I would definitely suggest that all coaches take that training.

SPEAKER_00 27:27

That's good to know. I didn't know that was a training that was available. So definitely good to know. And I love that you still remember your you coach, like after all of these years, that just tells me the type of impression that he left on you and hopefully helped get you on track to when you were in college to know, like, I need to talk to somebody at that time.

SPEAKER_01 27:49

He would be the one that I would call. Like he didn't mind when you asked me that, but at the time I wasn't thinking, but he would be the one that I would call from it, didn't matter what time of night, but even still now we have a great relationship. We talk, he gives me life advice still, even to this day. When I when I have big decisions to make, I always make sure that I call him to to kind of hype me up or to talk me out of something.

Lasting Coach-Athlete Relationships

SPEAKER_00 28:14

I love that, like a lasting relationship that be into life. We talked about how playing sports teaches you a lot of life skills, and so your coach went from being a basketball coach to now almost like a life coach type relationship. So that's really good. I hope that there are places out there or parents who are listening who have coaches in their kids' life that could also leave that type of impact as well. I know this is such a heavy layered topic. We are gonna have to have you back because I want to dig further into the stats that kids feel like they have to keep up when they are playing sports, how the system kind of celebrates wins, and what do you do as a parent, even as a coach, about panic attacks, depression, burnout? I also want to talk about kind of that athlete who might be drowning, like in the moment in a sport, and how are they going to take the steps to kind of reclaim their mental health without fear of losing their spot or their status? So we are going to have a part two, ladies and gentlemen, because I want to dive into that and even really talk a little bit more in depth about your personal struggles as well as a student athlete, too. So thank you for joining us today for a great episode. This was really insightful. Anyone listening, if you are a parent of an athlete, please share this with other parents on your child's team. Share this even with their coach because sometimes coaches don't know what they don't know, like all of us. And so you might not even see yourself as being this kind of dogmatic coach that's really pushing players further than they might need to go in the moment. And some of what we talked about today, I think it really helped them reflect. And then I know as a parent, I won't say those things to my son again, like, push through the pain, you could do it, or reframe it. Because sometimes, like I said, it's just being a little dramatic. We're not at a five where we need to go to the emergency room. You really can push it off.

SPEAKER_01 30:13

Yeah, we can talk about, we can also talk about the reframing aspect too. Like, how do you reframe, like you said, reframe how to approach your child or your student athlete when it comes to pushing through that? So, yeah, I'm looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_00 30:25

Awesome. So we will follow up with the part two here to give you all some practical strategies, how to reframe your words, how to self-reflect, and really make sure that sports remains a healthy outlet for kids to not only achieve their goals, but also go on to become great adults as well, and then love the game enough to go back into coaching so they could pour into the next generation as well. Thank you, Jasmine, for joining me today for our episode. Be sure everybody to like, subscribe, share all that social media stuff. And I will see you next week with a brand new Tuesday talks. See ya. All right, see ya. Be sure to share this episode and join me next week for a brand new Tuesday talks. See ya.