Episode #22 Season 3 How Teachers And Administrators Build A Stronger School Team

Negativity can feel like background noise in a school building, but it quietly drains the people doing the work. I sit down with Matthew Palmer, an elementary assistant principal in South Carolina, to talk about educator wellness from a leadership perspective and to name what many teachers feel but rarely say out loud: schools run best when we stop criticizing roles we don’t fully understand and start acting like one team.

Matthew shares what challenges him most as an administrator, especially the moments when an early childhood teacher is doing everything possible for a struggling student and still feels overwhelmed. We dig into the “priceless moments” that keep educators going, why small gestures matter more than big one-week celebrations, and how daily appreciation can shift a school’s culture. We also tackle difficult parent interactions with a clear, practical takeaway: if a situation is getting tense, stop emailing and pick up the phone or meet face to face to prevent misunderstandings and rebuild trust.

We reflect on post-pandemic changes in student behavior, particularly in pre-K and kindergarten, and what schools can do with early intervention and stronger behavior supports. Matthew also explains how learning walks and peer observations can strengthen relationships, spread great teaching ideas, and replace comparison with encouragement. We close with real-world self care for educators, including boundaries, movement, letting go of late-night replaying, and a mindset shift that sticks: are you living a “get to” day or a “going to” day?

If this conversation helps you, subscribe, share it with a colleague, and leave a review so more educators can find the support they deserve.

Thanks for listening!

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:18

This is Wellness for Educators, episode 22. You need to be well, to teach well. That is the motto. Seeking a healthy balance. You matter, and so does your health. There is life beyond the classroom. This is Wednesday, May 6, 2026. Wellness for Educators, Lori Maxfield, your host. It is a real honor to interview my guest today. Mr. Matthew Palmer is presently an administrator in the Clover School District in South Carolina. This is actually a suburb of Charlotte, North Carolina. Matt has been an educator for 16 years and an assistant principal for eight of those years. He started his career in Columbia, South Carolina, also teaching in Lexington, South Carolina. Matt has been in the Clover District for 10 years. He is welcome to choose him an educator as well as an administrator. That certainly gives him a good perspective. He is a husband, a father of two special little girls. These little girls are my three granddaughters. So it is especially nice for me to have the opportunity to interview Matt and my son-in-law. I know personally when I was a teacher, I often found other teachers talking about what the administrators needed to improve upon. I also heard complaints about the special teachers, such as music art. And when I became an ESL teacher, I became one of those specialists. The teachers often complained. That is the piece about a school. It is a team, and each player has an integral part to play. Unfortunately, it is quite common to hear teachers in the teacher's lounge or in the hallways complaining about how others should do their jobs differently. I recommend to our listeners that after you listen to this episode, you attempt to walk away when you hear this negative chatter. I've shared this quote before. Great minds discussed ideas, average minds, discussed events, and small minds discussed people. Let's stop the criticism and realize we all have the positive parts to play in our school. And concept should not be a part of our daily interactions. Welcome, Matt.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

Hey, thank you so much. Thank you for having me for that great introduction.

SPEAKER_01 2:50

Sure. Sure. So just to give the listeners a little idea of your school, maybe you can just tell us a little bit about the size, the number of students, what grades you have, and that way they have a perspective of what your school is all about.

A School Works As One Team

SPEAKER_00 3:11

Yeah, sure. So we have pre-K4 all the way through fifth grade. And we have about 1,100 a little more students and 156 staff members. So we have about nine or 10 individual classes in each grade level, K to 5. We also have five pre-K four-year-old classes with about 18 or 20 students in each of those. So big building, and you know, with that many people, there's always a lot going on, fires put out, right? But in my opinion, educators are just some of the best people you'll ever meet. And to be surrounded by so many people I respect so much is just, you know, aspiring and keeps me motivated when things get tough.

SPEAKER_01 3:45

That's great. Crowder's Creek Elementary School is lucky to have you. And it really sounds like a very, very large building. So many people, I mean, just learning everyone's names would be challenging to me. So you play a leadership role in your school. What would you say is probably the most challenging piece of your job?

SPEAKER_00 4:08

I mean, there's always challenges, you know, managing conflicts, you know, within the school or or, you know, or with parents is a big one. It's something I've worked hard to improve. But for me right now, I'd say the hardest moment is sort of when that early childhood teacher is doing everything they can to help the child. We're still trying to figure out the right plan to support that student. Of course, a lot of these students are coming to us being new to this kind of environment, and we have kind of to build from the ground up with what they might need with supports and interventions. And so while we're testing these different strategies or supports they might need, the teacher may already be exhausted or overwhelmed, and sometimes even in tears, asking how can we make the situation better? And sometimes students just take longer than others for us to understand what all they need, what motivates them, what kind of support will help them to be successful. And to see a teacher struggle like that while they're working so hard to figure things out is really hard for me.

SPEAKER_01 5:01

It's very hard to watch. And I know that you are very empathetic, and I'm sure teachers appreciate that, and that definitely is a difficult part of your job. So I'm not sure about you, but when I became an educator, it seemed like a real opportunity to really make a difference in the world one child at a time. We know that teachers don't do this job for financial gain. It's actually a very high-stress job. But primarily, we become educators to make a lasting positive difference in students' lives. This, in my personal opinion, is the priceless piece of the job. Can you reflect upon a time where you experience one of these priceless moments? This could be as an educator or as an administrator.

Biggest Challenges For Administrators

SPEAKER_00 5:52

Oh, I mean, absolutely. There's so many meaningful moments in education. And really my growth is just being more intentional and noticing and appreciating those moments and not taking them for granted. It's so easy, I think, to take those things for granted, but it's just kind of stopping to appreciate those things more when it happens. And it means so much when a former student or a parent reaches out to say that they're doing great. You know, that of course never gets old. Just thinking, you know, one time a student in his family gave me a little puzzle piece with the words that you were the missing piece. I mean, it doesn't, it doesn't really get better than that, right? So that's one of those things that, you know, it goes on your shelf in your office and never leaves, right? And is there forever. And another thing I have like that is just to speak to how thoughtful and awesome teachers are. I mean, I had a team of special education teachers one time give me a small kind of poster they had made with a quote on it, and they all signed it. And it said something like, Today my administrator stopped by, not because something was wrong, not because he had to, but just to say hello and check on me. It was unexpected, it was uncommon, and it meant everything. So to them, that might have been been just like a little way to say thank you, to thank me for just trying my best to be visible, right? Or just seeing how they're doing. And they probably didn't think of it again. But, you know, to me, that gesture, you know, it meant the world. And I don't feel like I'm doing anything special. I'm just trying my best to help however I can because I see how hard, you know, they're they work. And you know, that was years ago, and I still have that poster in my in my hanging in my office, and I probably always will. Actually, on Friday, it was really cool. This past Friday, a second grade teacher called me in to support her class, and I went in thinking, you know, I'm gonna have to manage some behavior here. And instead, it was it was a surprise, and the whole class had made me, they all each made me a little card just to show appreciation, just out of nowhere. And, you know, they probably didn't know, but it was kind of a tough week leading up to that. And it's just amazing the impact something like that can have. And when you're on the receiving end of all these incredible gestures, I just think it's incumbent on us to pass those on to others. And I think that we do a good job of celebrating teachers during teacher appreciation week and do all these maybe larger things, but I think what's even more beneficial than that and powerful than that is just all the little things we do each and every day. Every day is teacher appreciation day, just through little things that matter so much.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

Right. I I think that sometimes they are our unspoken heroes, and it really seems like they appreciate you and you appreciate them, and that's that's really admirable. So most recently I was in Australia, and my podcast has listeners from Australia, and I happened to have a long conversation with a teacher. She was actually 75 and she was still teaching French at a high school. We got to talking, and I asked her if there were difficult parents. And she said, oh yeah, she said, we call those parents no plow parents. I had never heard this before. And she went on to explain that these this metaphor was used because the parents wanted to just plow everything out of the way so their children didn't have any harm. I know when I was teaching, we nicknamed the parents helicopter parents because they were often hovering over. Do you think this may be true in America? Snowplow, helicopter. Do you would you say that maybe these difficult parents are an unfortunately a key piece of your position? I would think administrators deal with difficulties with parents. Do you have any advice or thoughts on this?

Priceless Moments And Daily Appreciation

SPEAKER_00 9:45

Sure. So, you know, let me just start by saying we have some of the best parents. So many of our parents are truly supportive, understanding, positive. They see the bigger picture, they stand behind you know the work we do. I've also gained a lot of new perspective now that I'm a parent of a child in kindergarten. Being on the other side of that table and being in a parent chair has been really eye-opening and a valuable perspective for me. So I'm kind of dealing with some things, you know, with my own daughter and advocating for her, and I I kind of keep that in mind when I'm on the administrator's side of the table and I have a parent across from me advocating for their child. So that's been a really good perspective for me too. You know, at the end of the day, parents want what's best for the kids. And we all look at it a little differently, maybe through, you know, shaped by our own upbringing or our own life experiences. So when I find myself in a moment of conflict with a parent, I try to keep in mind this is someone who cares deeply about their child and wants what's best for them. Just like we do. Right now we may not all agree on the best path forward, but we're coming from the same place of wanting that child to succeed. Are there snow plowed parents who try to clear every obstacle so their child never faces any difficulty? Sure. It happens. And it can be challenging when we're trying to work together as a team with a family to support that child. When these situations come up, I try to explain what I truly believe in in which is that facing challenging facing challenges is an important part of learning and growing. Working through a real or perceived hardship helps I I think it really helps equip you for life. And so I know these experiences, while tough in the moment, can be difficult, but they help us build that resilience and confidence later on. As far as advice for handling those you know, quote, difficult parents or not that I've figured it all out by any means. I'm st definitely still work in progress, still growing, but you know, if you want some advice from somebody who's learned a lot but also still has much to learn, I would say number one, we have to stop emailing as much as possible. And you know, I'm guilty of it too. Emailing is certainly quicker and easier. I've definitely caught myself doing this as well. But so many situations are elevated or misunderstandings arise from misinterpretations over something that was typed. And so if that little alarm starts to go off in your head that this is heading towards being contentious, it's time to pick up that phone or meet in person. We can almost always arrive in a much better place by meeting in person and making that connection more personable. And oftentimes, you know, we discover that the parent really wasn't as mad or as difficult as we even thought they were. It was just all in the way that we were reading or interpreting their email. So I just think as much as we can, calling, meeting in person, 99% of the time gets us in such a better place. And so that would be the first thing. The next thing I would say is just kind of what I touched on earlier, which is that keeping that perspective of they just want what's best for their kids, and that just might look a little differently through their lens, but just we want the same thing. So just kind of using that understanding to come to common ground together. And then lastly, and this has been a big growth for me, and and this is tough, but just understanding that you're not gonna always be able to make everyone happy. And that's really tough for me. As someone who just wants to make everyone happy so bad. But sometimes you can't be a leader and make everyone happy. And sometimes we have to make a decision based off what we think is the right thing to do and stick with it. And there may be times we don't all agree, but you have to go to bed knowing that I did what I believed was the right thing to do in that moment. And more than willing, I'm open to hear perspectives on it afterwards, and I'll listen to your feedback afterwards on it. Um of course I'll listen to that. But in that moment, I did what I thought was the right thing to do and what I believed was right, and that's all we can ask for ourselves in that moment. And so just, you know, not laying awake and tossing around at night thinking about that has been a real growth for me. And that's I think that's something that we all just have to kind of work towards just understanding that.

SPEAKER_01 14:02

Right. Well, it sounds like you have a very challenging job, and I totally agree with becoming a better administrator when you became a parent. I became a much better teacher when I had my own children. And I think that that's that's really good. I used to think that home projects were great for families until I was faced with home projects and it was really stressful on the family. It wasn't fun. And often the child was being graded on the parents' ability. And just recently, I had an adult child who was probably in his mid-30s come up to me and tell me that his father made the ship, the meme ship, and for the project. And he felt so guilty about it his whole life. And I said, it's okay. I knew that there are many parents that probably did that too. So it's just interesting. We do become better equipped when we're faced with similar roles. Right.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

Yeah, I mean, I I think that we we we sit in so many meetings and it can get kind of you know repetitive, or we want to get through a meeting or whatever. But now that I've had a couple of conferences or meetings on the parents' side of the table, and and this is the you know, little girl that's the most important thing to me on earth. It was it's it's very interesting. And so now that I have that perspective, this is I try to keep that in mind when I'm sitting across that.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Yeah, I think that I think that's really, really good good point to make. So I know you were an administrator during the pandemic. If you were to think back prior to the pandemic and now, have you seen any noticeable changes within the children? Like, is there a difference in the staff any changes, or is it pretty much you think all's pretty much the same?

SPEAKER_00 16:04

Uh I mean, I think yes and no. I mean, I think kids, kids are kids, and they they are now and they were then. And so, you know, I I want to be careful that, you know, I'm not always associating any age-appropriate behavior with just like, oh, the the the pandemic. You know, I think certainly technology and social media, I think, is a very real concerning issue as well. That could be a whole other discussion, but oh for sure. Speaking just from the realm of you know, early childhood since the pandemic in the in the last four years four four years since I've been at my present school, we are supporting pre-K and kindergarten so much more than ever before for behavior. And these are the students who were born during COVID. In fact, you know, almost two-thirds of our behavior discipline school-wide this year is just in pre-K and K.

SPEAKER_01 16:51

Wow.

Handling Difficult Parents With Care

SPEAKER_00 16:52

And so the data supports that they're requiring a lot more support and assistance. And so we're trying to do some things. We're palleting a new early childhood behavior framework to respond to these trends we're seeing. And my understanding from talking to district leadership is that this is a trend that's not unique to us and it's being seen all over. So just figuring out how can we, you know, adapt to meet this challenge.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

No, that's good. That's good. But I think sometimes I I was faced with children that had never been in school. So if you've never been in daycare or you've never learned to sit at a table or get in a line, those are all things that are unfamiliar to a child. And when they come to school and they've never been in daycare or had a babysitter, it's it's really it's really challenging. And so I think it's great that now we have these pre-K programs, it just seems like it's just adding more stress, and hopefully we can work through and it will be successful.

SPEAKER_00 17:54

Absolutely. I mean, early intervention is so important.

SPEAKER_01 17:57

Yeah, I totally agree. So when I interviewed Nell, a teacher in Spain, I mean a teacher in Maine, not Spain, Kelly, who is in Switzerland. I must be in on my foreign thoughts. They both emphasized and praised their leadership for modeling educator wellness. Is there something you have found as an administrator that you hoped has helped your staff?

SPEAKER_00 18:27

Yeah, and I think that really starts, you know, with leadership. I've been fortunate to work under several principals who, you know, make it clear through their words or their actions that, you know, family comes first and that taking care of yourself is so important. You know, one of them, Dr. Bill Kuhn at Meadow Glenn Middle School in Lexington, South Carolina, used to say the same thing every day over the intercolum. He would say, take care of yourself and take care of each other. And it's just kind of a daily reminder that we have to take care of ourselves first, kind of like putting your own oxygen mask on in a plane before you help others, right? I think our natural instinct as educators is, you know, we're here to serve others. And that's just kind of how we're wired. And because of that, it can be tough to remember that you do have to take care of yourself to be most effective. And so whether it's a you know sick day or or to take care of your family, you know, I feel like that has to be supported and never looked down on. I also had a principal, uh Will Largen at Oak Ridge Middle School in Clover, and he, you know, he would say every day, make it a great day or not, the choice is yours. And so just kind of that reminder of, you know, we all need to make a conscious choice to be happy and make the best of each day.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

My my most common episode that that has the most listeners is the one on attitude. And I think having the right attitude really is important.

SPEAKER_00 19:46

Right. Another thing I really strongly believe in is just getting out and seeing all the great things happening in your building. I always leave observations just feeling so inspired and like mind-blown, like, wow, that was so incredible. And I just think that's an experience that shouldn't be reserved for just administrators. And so I just encourage people as much as I can to get out and just seek the good and see all the awesome things happening in your building. And so, whether you want to call that classroom tours or peer observations, you know, right now we're calling them learning walks. And it's just getting out to see all the great things happening because there's so much great things happening in the building that you may not even be aware of. And it gives you a chance to pick up new ideas, bring back tools for your own teaching, and then leave encouragement behind for others. And I think there's just so many other great benefits with this. It's just we have such a large building and people don't often know each other. They don't know who a lot of the folks are who they see at faculty meetings. And so when we get out and we get outside of our comfort zone, and we go watch that French teacher, like you mentioned, or we go and watch that art teacher, or that whole other grade level, we learn that there's such great things that we can take away from everyone, and we can build relationships in our building. And I think that really helps kind of the culture of the of the school. And it it just it feels really good. Also, I've heard a lot of feedback from teachers. I mean, just today, we had TLC today where teachers were sharing kind of what they were able to go out and see, and also how it felt to be observed by their colleagues. And so many people shared that it was just so amazing to hear feedback of things that they may not even be aware of. So some teachers were saying, you know, yeah, I I really have been kind of discouraged or felt like I wasn't being very effective. And then this colleague I didn't even really know before came in and let me know what an amazing job I did with just relating to the students or my or my or how or my my environment that I've created or whatever, and just kind of hearing that positive feedback was just such an amazing, uplifting thing for me. And so when we get out and we make it positive, it has to be focused on the positive. We're only looking for the good things, we're leaving positive, encouraging notes behind, and I just think that's so beneficial for everybody. And so we could even take this a step further, and we could kind of track that data, and we could say, okay, every time you go watch somebody, you kind of submit, or it can be a Google form or a sheet, and we say this is what stands out most about that teacher. And we can kind Keep that data to where if someone in the future comes and says, Hey, I'd really like to see something to help me on you know questioning or or grouping or how they give feedback, I can look at that data and say, Well, according to our learning data from your colleagues, this person is really great there, but let's set up a time for you to go see that person. So it's just making it more data-driven where it's not just my own biased opinion or what have you. So that's something I really believe in.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

So that's great, but how do you do that? How does somebody go and observe another class? Do they go during their planning period? What do they do?

SPEAKER_00 22:53

So it was definitely easier to do in middle school. When I was in middle school, they were able to do it during their planning period because they just had some more time.

SPEAKER_01 22:59

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Elementary is challenging. We're blessed to have lots of instructional assistance and kind of like daily kind of building subs that we're able to utilize to cover classes. So we can set up time to give you some covers. It just doesn't have to be a long time, it could be at 20 minutes, 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_01 23:20

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 23:20

Um, just to get out and see all these great things and try to take some tools back with you and leave encouragement behind. And this just kind of builds more of a community and right.

SPEAKER_01 23:30

Your school is so large that's just builds that appreciation.

SPEAKER_00 23:34

Like at the top of your show, you talked about that negativity and how it's so easy to it's so easy to fall into looking for any inequities. Criticizing this person might have a little bit more time, or you know, they have this many periods per week, and I don't think this many it right.

SPEAKER_01 23:52

I got that when I was a specialist, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

And so I think this really just builds an appreciation for one another that, you know, like, oh wow, that person really is a an effective, great teacher. It doesn't matter what their content is, we can all learn from each other.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

Right. No, I think that's great. And actually, as an ESL teacher, I would push in sometimes and I would go with a student to a class. And I just was like you said, when you make observations, I was blown away sometimes with some of the lessons. I just felt like the teachers were creative, they made it fun, the kids were engaged, and it was fun for me to observe them. So I I applaud you in doing this program where they are able to observe other teachers. I think that's a fabulous way to build community in your school, too.

SPEAKER_00 24:42

Anything we can do to be more intentional about this is a positive place, this is a supportive place, you know, it just kind of makes you feel good coming to work each day.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

Exactly. And you want to be happy, and that's what wellness for educators is all about. You want to build your wellness, and that makes you a more effective teacher and you're happier. So we are running out of time, but our final question is one that I ask all of my guests. What do you personally do to help promote your own wellness? I realize that time is a real issue, and you wear many hats. You leave 6:30 a.m. And even tomorrow morning you're gonna leave before 5 a.m. And often you don't return until past 5 p.m. So, what do you do to help with your mental and physical health?

COVID Era Behavior Shifts In Early Grades

SPEAKER_00 25:38

Yeah, I mean, that's tough. Honestly, I'm I'm still a work in progress when it comes to taking care of my own mental and physical health. You know, one thing I struggle with, you know, is coming home and having that patience for my that my that my own family deserves after using up so much of that energy throughout the school day. And so that's definitely something I'm trying to to grow in with that area. I mean, I try to stay active. I work out three times a week, you know, twice in the mornings before school and once in the weekend. And I'm not saying that's enough or that's perfect, but it's it's where I'm at right now. No, I think that's great. And it really helps kind of clear my head. Another thing I've worked on is just letting go of that habit. I kinda I kind of mentioned earlier of replaying everything in my mind at night. I used to lie awake questioning every decision I made or thinking of what I could have done differently or what I could have done better in each kind of situation that comes up throughout the day, and really try really try to get better. And I I think I've I think I've grown in kind of accepting that I made the best decision I could in that moment. I did the best I could with that situation, and just reaching that point of peace with myself has been a big difference. At the end of the day, that's all we can really ask ourselves. And then it's just being more intentional about noticing and recognizing those moments we touched on earlier for what they are, which is priceless moments. And it's so easy to play the comparison game and you know, look at my friends in the neighborhood who work from home and have more flexibility and go work out in the garage or hit golf balls in between meetings. And I struggle with that times.

SPEAKER_01 27:16

Yeah, I get that. I get that.

SPEAKER_00 27:18

But comparison is the thief of joy, and there's so much joy in this journey if we're intentional about recognizing and appreciating it. I work with several people, so I mean so many people who just have that spirit, and you know it when you encounter it. Just kind of that spirit of being grateful to get to do this. And I think we should all just reflect and aspire to become that and model that. You know, when I come into a a classroom or any learning space, you know, my first impression is is always is this a get-to class or a going-to class? And by that I mean uh there's just such a profound difference between today we get to versus today we're going to. I want to be in a building where we get to do things. And it takes all of us to make that conscious decision, and I think it starts with leadership.

SPEAKER_01 28:07

That's wonderful. That is absolutely wonderful. So thank you very much for being my guest today on Wellness for Educators. And I think the listeners are gonna find this very beneficial. So thank you, Matt, for your time. I really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 28:26

Oh, thank you so much. It was great.

Modeling Wellness And Building Culture

SPEAKER_01 28:29

We can talk about trying to walk in someone else's shoes, but that is nearly impossible. A teacher does not truly understand the job of an administrator unless they actually become one. So that is that is how it is. We have to work together as a team. So, yes, maybe as a specialist, I was able to have a little extra time and I could stop at the bathroom. But the role of a specialist as well as an administrator is not easier. It is different with various responsibilities and different stressors. The quote I want to share is from Linda Myers I could walk a mile in your shoes, but I already know they are just as uncomfortable as mine. Let's walk next to each other instead. My hope with this podcast episode is that we see that each role in a school is valuable and important. We need to embrace empathy and understanding. I encourage you to consider one another's perspective rather than judging what or what you would not do if you were in their shoes. As we are headed toward the final days of the school year, please remember I am here cheering for you. Thanks to Ron Coleman for providing the music, and thanks to you for being a positive influence to the future generation. You are a true hero. You need to be well, to teach well, find joy in the journey. This is Lori Maxfield, and I thank you for listening to Wellness for Educators. If you have a friend who you think could benefit from this podcast, please pass it along. Until that time, please practice self care. And remember, just like Matt said, you have the ability each day to make a lasting difference in a child's life.