What Death Teaches Us About Living Fully with Baci Hillyer

In this episode, we sit down with Baci Hillyer, a certified end of life doula, mentor, and founder of Live Well Leave Well, for a deeply honest and expansive conversation about death, grief, and what it truly means to live well.

Together, we explore a topic many of us avoid but one that touches every single life. Baci invites us to rethink our relationship with death, not as something distant or fearful, but as something that can bring clarity, connection, and purpose to how we live right now.

We talk about the concept of death literacy and why modern culture has become disconnected from something that was once a shared, human experience.

A key part of this conversation is what it means to prepare for a good death. Not just practically, but emotionally and spiritually. Baci shares how preparing for death can include having honest conversations, making peace with people in our lives, understanding our wishes, and being intentional about the legacy we leave behind. Rather than waiting until the end, this kind of preparation begins while we are still living.

This conversation also moves through grief in its many forms. Baci opens up about her own profound experiences with loss and how those shaped her life’s calling. We reflect on how different types of loss impact us, why grief never really leaves, and how it evolves with us over time.

We also explore:

•  What an end of life doula really does 
•  Why people fear death and how we can soften that fear 
•  The importance of having conversations before it is too late 
•  Rituals that support both dying and grieving 
•  How beliefs around death shape the way we live 
•  Why we often delay what matters most and how to change that 
•  What it means to prepare for a good death, emotionally, spiritually, and practically 

One of the most powerful reminders from this episode is simple but confronting: we all think we have time, but time is never guaranteed. And when we truly understand that, everything begins to shift.

Baci’s work is centred on helping people live well now, so they can leave well later. This episode is an invitation to reflect, reconnect, and maybe start the conversations you have been putting off.

All of Baci’s offerings are freely available, with her hope that more people begin engaging in end of life preparation while they are still living, not when it is too late.

Connect with Baci here:
https://linktr.ee/LiveWellLeaveWell

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Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Achi, what would you say to people as some advice that you could offer about doing the very intentional work of not having regrets, of not waiting until it's too late to be complete with someone, to make amends with someone, or to, you know, resolve whatever feels unresolved? Like, like I know that's scary for people too, right? They always think they're gonna have more time. Yeah. And then sometimes time runs out. So has this work informed, even in your own life, how you just get really square with people as you live and not leave things for later?

SPEAKER_00 0:38

Yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_02 0:39

So, so great. You know, the time imperative. I mean, I tell you what, it is all about time. People's biggest mistake that they make is they think they have time. We all think we have time. Whereas seriously, in 10 minutes, I could have a brain aneurysm. Something could happen in in uh today or tomorrow or next week where I get a call and I've got a life-limiting disease, I've got six months to live. It happens, it's happening everywhere, it happens all around. It's it's just a fact. So I think for me, I I mean, and my business, what I've got live well, leave well. We spend a hell of a lot of time, and um no pun intended, but we spend a lot of time living well, obsessed about our lives, about longevity, about biohacking. But we don't really spend a lot of time on how to leave well. And leaving well is the key to a prosperous life. So when we lean into death preparation, and what I mean by death preparation is conversations around, hey, you know, how do you what do you think about death? Are you scared of it? What are you most scared of? What do you want to happen? What do you think happens to you when you die? What would you like to happen to you when you die? What, what are you what in your religion, how do you want to be buried? How do you want to be remembered? What's the legacy that you want to leave behind? What's the footprint? What do you want to leave behind in people's hearts? What do you want to leave behind for people to remember you by? I think when we start to have these conversations, you're ultimately doing your death preparation. And you're also getting information about the person that you're talking to that's deep. And it changes you. Once you engage in conversation around death, it leads to preparation around death. You start to prepare, and then you can start to prepare mentally, physically, emotionally, spiritually. You can do practical things like your will, you can do your emotional will, you can do your advanced care directive things about, you know, what if I couldn't speak for myself and I had no choice or capacity? Who is going to speak for me and what do I want you to know about me?

SPEAKER_01 2:56

Welcome to the Wisdom We Share podcast, where ancient truths and modern intelligence weave together to inspire, ground, and shape us for a wiser, awakened life. I'm Angenet Amrit.

SPEAKER_03 3:14

And I'm Robin Wald. And together we bring you fascinating conversations from the world of spirituality, science, and human behavior so you can connect to your own inner wisdom, joy, and clarity, elevating the way you actually live your life.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

Today on The Wisdom We Share, we're sitting with someone whose work touches a subject we rarely speak about with curiosity, reverence, or compassion. Death. Our guest, Batchihillia, is a certified end-of-life duela and mentor who spends her days walking alongside people and families through the tender, complex terrain of dying, not just as an event, but as a deeply human experience. Baci work in her work invites us to ask, what does it mean to prepare for a good death? How does understanding our end transform how we love, how we live, and how we relate? She shines light on one of life's biggest taboos with warmth, wisdom, and fierce compassion. And today she's here to share insights that will shift how you see your life, your losses, and your legacy. Bachi, thank you for being here and welcome. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me and thank you for that wonderful intro. You're welcome. I'd love to start at the beginning. What first called you into this work and maybe explain a little bit if people don't know what a death dueler is.

What Does an End of Life Doula Actually Do?

SPEAKER_02 4:50

Okay, so great question because so many people ask what an end-of-life doeler is. We we tend to, I tend to use the word end of life because death, death really is just a breath, isn't it? It's a breath in and a breath out, and then no more breath in. So end-of-life doolering is is it it spans across a whole like 10 stages, let's say, of death from living well to a diagnosis or aging to a diagnosis, then to palliative care, maybe, and active dying stage, death, then there's after death care, and then there's after death, you know, with when you go into your honoring ceremonies and traditions and spirituality, and then of course, bereavement. So an end-of-life dueler is a non-medical role that assists in each stage of that process of the end of life, and it's really vast. Some end-of-life duelers specialise, they'll pick an area. So there'll be an end-of-life dueler that does all after death care. For me particularly, I was attracted to active dying stage, the really the very end of life. And I did a couple of a few years in palliative care. So I had have quite a bit of experience there. And then you have a lot of end-of-life duelers that specialise at the start while we're living well. And that's somewhere that I'm also attracted to, which is end-of-life preparation while we are living, not when it when a diagnosis happens or when right at the end when people come in and they're right at the end in palliative care and they think, oh, I better have that conversation now. So I really like to work upstream as an end-of-life dueler. So that's what an end-of-life dueler does. And a lot of people have heard about birth doolers, so it's really the same, but on the other end. And I think the reason people avoid talking about end-of-life duelers is because at this uh when it comes to birth dooler, there's a little surprise beautiful package generally at the end there. But when it comes to end of life, it's it's it's there's a lot of fear and a lot of sadness and a lot of grief. So the calling to this work is a great question. The the quick, simple answer is my experience. I I was launched into death at a young age. I I was 15, and the first death was my cousin who

A Life Shaped by Loss

SPEAKER_02 7:24

suicided very violently. I was about 14, and then later that year, 14, closer to 15, my father was diagnosed with a brain tumor, and he died very quickly, six months later. And then five months after my father, my brother, died in a car accident after he was spreading the ashes of my father over our family property. And that was just, you know, a complete tsunami on my life. My whole life changed, my whole family fell apart. And consequently, I've been grief walking for over 70% of my life. So when I got closer to my 50s, late 40s, I I had a calling, a spiritual calling, to work in death. And I thought it was a bit of a joke. I thought, what? What do you mean? I'm like, you know, this really happy, go-lacky, joyful person who lives life to the fullest. I thought that's a little bit depressing. And you never ignore spirit, you you listen. So I investigated and I realized, I thought, wow, you know, this is an area that I'm very comfortable in. And I didn't realize how uncomfortable people were. So I thought, okay, this is good, I can do this. So I went and became a certified end-of-life dueler, and have since been working there, and and it's it's absolutely my passion. I found it a very late in life. You know, I went, I I studied, I did commerce and I worked in advertising and I ran a travel agency. I've done, you know, a million jobs and professions, but this is the one that that I'm supposed to be in.

SPEAKER_01 9:11

Your soul's calling. It is my soul's calling, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:15

I think you need the wisdom to be able to back you. I think the reason I it happened so late is because you you require quite a bit of a bit of wisdom to work with end of life.

SPEAKER_04 9:30

And you know, personal experience, I think, is in your case and in the field of work you're doing, is probably even more valuable and pertinent for connecting and understanding what people are going through. And those three examples you gave, it's like one is death by suicide, which is its whole own different kind of trauma, right? And the violence of that, and and then there's dying

Understanding Different Types of Death and Grief

SPEAKER_04 10:01

by diagnosis, and that also came for you at way too young an age to lose a parent. Yeah, and then your brother, sibling death is a whole other category, and that was sudden. Like with your dad, at least there maybe was some runway of preparation or acceptance or what was coming down the road, but with your brother, it was incredibly sudden. So I'm wondering if you could speak because I'm sure anybody listening to this has experienced death somewhere in their lives at some point, and I'm wondering how those different types of deaths feel different and how someone can prepare for prepare for what's unexpected sometimes and sudden, or how the grieving changes or is different based on the type of death there is.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

Wow, Robin, that's that's a loaded question. That's a lot. I'll try to strip it down. Yeah, you know, it's the three separate. I think it's great that you've pointed that out because it makes a big difference. I think suicide, wow, for me, in upon reflection, and so many years later, it was interesting because if the death was just this, not just, but if the death was the suicide at that point of time, and my father and my brother didn't follow, that would have had a whole different impact. I almost didn't have time to process the the death of my cousin. I didn't understand it. I I I remember just being in absolute shock. And my brother had just recently come back, he was there in America, in Rochester, New York, and the way that it happened, which I can't speak about because it's not my story, and I haven't been given permission to do so. So out of deep respect, but it was violent and horrible, and it absolutely obliterated my uncle and his family. But I remember my father's response to that, and that was to pack up and get on a plane immediately and be there for his brother and the family. But the other part was it wasn't spoken about, it was shame, I guess, and just hidden or a mix of, you know, maybe we it's inappropriate. I mean, they told us how, and that was violent. So why not be able to talk about maybe why or what happened or if everyone's okay? My father, the cancer diagnosis was a sh the biggest shock because this sort of stuff doesn't happen to anyone, you know, not to my family. I was this really happy child, and and you heard about these stories, and as a child, people die around you. And my growing up on a farm, we we all talked about death a lot because of the animals and the need to kill animals, the rabbits with mixed motosis, and you're very close to the cycles of life. So we were very open and communicative about that. So when it came to death around us, you know, my father would always be like, Oh, I'd be happy to kick the bucket at 60, and that's good life. I'd be like, No, Dad. But 60, you know, back then was old. So it's like, Dad, I don't want you to die. And we would talk about it and how people die, and and we talked about the fear of death being around how you die, not where and when you die, not the fact that you do die. So we were all very accepting of death, but it was how and when that was the scariest. When his cancer diagnosis came in, it was a brain tumor and they had to do emergency surgery. So, really, for dad, it was sudden because he the surgery was in three days. So we had three days to say goodbye, and when he came out of surgery, he wasn't the same. And I sadly rejected him, understandably so, because I was young and immature and I didn't understand, and I was in deep grief, but it was very sudden, but then his death was eclipsed by my brother, which was really sudden. So the the three of them in in a matter of, well, my brother and my dad was in five months, and between my my cousin, it was was about 10 months, is a lot of complex post-traumatic stress disorder. And I think at the time one just got worse, it just got worse and it just got worse. But my brother's made my dad's death okay, my dad's made death made my my cousin's death okay. Isn't that crazy? But as the decades go and you start to unpack it and you start to do trauma therapy and you start to really work on yourself because of the complex post-traumatic stress disorder that hit me, and the survival that I went into, the hypervigilance that I went into as a child, and the fact that I also lost my mother because of when a parent loses a child, your parent is never the same again. So there was there's just loss, loss, loss, and huge amounts of loss and deep, deep grief. And I think the wisdom that I have with experiential knowledge as you're talking about, that I can bring to death is that wow, grief never leaves us. It lives with us, it becomes a part of us. You you grow with grief and it blindsides

Grief Over Time: What Stays and What Changes

SPEAKER_02 15:30

you at all stages of life, even now. You know, that I'm older than my father, that I reflect, and as I get older and older, I'm going to start to actually age and look grey, and then look at pictures of him and think, oh, he's young. Whereas at the moment I'm still here and I'm looking at him and he's still older, whereas I'm I've surpassed his age. It's it's it's crazy grief. It it's forever, it's mercurial and and it's yeah, I I don't know how else to answer. I I guess, yeah, it's it's something that I can talk a lot about the ages, the stages, the different types of grief that hit you when you embrace it and lean into it, when you avoid it, when you when you bury it, none of it works. You know, you can run you can run, but you can't hide.

SPEAKER_01 16:25

Yeah. I mean, I I I relate to that as well. I've also had a lot of death around me in life. My my older brother had terminal cancer when he was nine, but he had a miracle happen in Lourdes, and he lived until he was 45. Wow. And cancer took him again when he was 45, and four plus five is nine. My father died young, my brother died young, my auntie and brother went at this within three months. And you know, like you, I don't know about you, but it took me two years to even start grieving my brother. It took two whole years. I just did a massive bypass, a spiritual bypass on it. And I think anyone listening to this, it's important that we do get some literacy around death, and you talk about death literacy. And I think that's a term that maybe a lot of us in the West have never heard, never even contemplated. So, how do you define death literacy and why

What Is Death Literacy and Why We’ve Lost It

SPEAKER_01 17:28

do you believe it's something in our culture that possibly is missing as a subject, as a context? Yeah, great question.

SPEAKER_02 17:37

I I believe that it's missing because let's wind back to history. We, as a society, we disconnected ourselves from death at the turn of the century when we outsourced it. So if we look back over 100 years ago, we were doing death better. We were all death literate. And death literacy to me is to be comfortable, death comfortable, to be aware of death, to understand that it happens, to understand how to be responsible. So response able in death. And that means the wisdom shared and passed down. Let's just say grandmother or grandfather, they were in the room, they're in the home, they're in the house, and death was happening in the house. So death was a community event, not a medical event. And sadly, I mean, I love modern medicine and I'm so grateful for it. I'm so grateful for technology. But with that came the outsourcing of something that was fundamentally a human event, and it lives deep in us. We all know how to die, and I've seen it at the end. Our body is so intelligent, but we have avoided it. We've it's turned into taboo because we've disconnected from it. So the wisdom that was shared by our elders that was passed down to us in the family home and in the community, and the fact that it was happening a lot more has been lost. And indigenous communities have not lost that. You know, the East have not lost their dis their connection with death. And sadly, we have. And this is a path and a journey that I'm so passionate about because to be death literate is to remind everybody of what lives in us. We know this. This is what we know we're going to die. Death is around us all the time, it's in the seasons, it's in our life, it's it's everywhere, and we all know somebody who's going to die. And my favorite stat is that 10 out of 10 of us are going to die. There's no, you know, disputing this, right? So, yeah, we we lost our connection. So our journey back is really about reconnecting. How do we reconnect through conversation, through preparation? And once we do that, we can really our lives change. We can really start to live more fully when we do that.

SPEAKER_04 20:14

I'm wondering if you could say something about ritual, because I saw that on your website, and I know that ritual is really, really important, especially around these major transformational life events that change

Rituals That Help Us Process Death and Loss

SPEAKER_04 20:29

us forever.

SPEAKER_00 20:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:30

And I'm wondering if you could talk about some of the types of rituals you might offer as you know, to people who are preparing for the death of a loved one or after the death of a loved one.

SPEAKER_02 20:42

Okay. Great question. Ritual is really personal. I just want to wind back a little bit that ritual is a word that I didn't know when I was a teenager, but it's something that I did. So other people like to call it habits, yeah. So we create habits and some people create atomic habits, but habits ultimately with an intention is a ritual for me. It becomes sacred. So when I was 15 and dealing with this incredible huge loss, and how I dealt with it with that is I created rituals for myself. So whether I made a playlist for my brother that of our favorite songs, and I used to play that song or that that tape cassette, you know, every year on his death date. I made a little altar with my dad with photos and the medals from from the army and little special things and a card that cards that he wrote me that I loved. So the little things that I did back then, I'd go for a bike ride every day on the beach and I'd I'd watch the sunset and I'd talk to them. But I didn't know that they were that at the time. But looking back, they were so powerful. So I really encouraged people pre death to create. Create ritual, candles, light. It's really the most powerful thing. I mean, I'm I'm sitting here anytime I I do anything with anybody, I light a candle. I have a little altar, I light a candle. If I I talk about prayer for the world, for individuals, for people who are sick, for someone who's dying, something that's personal to me. I think when you're preparing for death, rituals really important to make the room as comfortable as possible so that the person is as comfortable as possible in the room. So you want to think about smell, about visual, about touch, and really tune in to these things that you can make the surrounding as beautiful and as comfortable and as meaningful as possible. And then that invites conversation and communication and connection. So I think that's really important. I know that when I was in palliative care, when I would come in and fix a room up and make the smells and essences or the favorite flowers, whatever you may bring in, pictures, or when families brought in blankets with photographs of all the family on the blankets, um, the beautiful drawings from the children and the grandchildren. You know, when I would come in and bring a salt lamp and just change the vibe and the energy of the room, we would pull cards or play songs that that were meaningful. Anything that has an intention behind it that you do becomes sacred and it becomes ritual. So post-death, wow, I think all the conversations that you should be having now while we're living well, or when a diagnosis happens, or when someone's dying, to talk about what your legacy is and what what me what is the most meaningful uh to you that you did in your life, the person who's dying, and to make sure that the post-death ritual and your sacred crossing over, it's really how you leave the world and to ensure that the body, your body is absolutely respected right until it leaves, however that may look, is talked about and discussed. And so that you can ensure that right, that final rite of passage, I think it's really important. It's it's a closure that is really significant and it changes grief. And going back to my father and my brother and my my cousin, when you have closure, and I did have that with my dad, which is what you touched on, there was an ability to say goodbye. I said goodbye to him through my eyes when he went to hospital. That's when I said goodbye to him. When he died post, that wasn't my father. He was a different man. He changed significantly because of his brain. But to have that closure is something that changed my grief journey with him, as opposed to my brother's sudden shock or death, which has affected me a lot more and a lot deeply. And I for yeah, it it's had a much larger impact on me. So ritual post, if we had have had a better ritual with my brother, in actual fact, we didn't. His ashes got left, my mother never picked them up, and I've never had a place that I could mourn my brother. So I think to speak to people that to ritual to have a goodbye, even if you have a have you heard of Living Wakes, where people who are dying actually say goodbye that they're alive? I mean, the more we talk about it, it seems to be coming a more popular choice to be doing it before you die. And that's incredible. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:08

I attended one like that. A woman in my community was very dearly beloved, and she had cancer and it was terminal, and she was getting much, much closer to death. And the rabbi organized on Zoom to everybody zoomed in with her on the couch, with her daughter and her grandson on her lap, and we all took turns sharing with her what we loved about her, our favorite memories, what our wishes were for her. You know, and and I remember at the time I said something that didn't seem odd to me. I think, at least on a spiritual level of awareness, I'm more comfortable with we all die, and this isn't the end ends, you know, that's just my personal belief. So when I was speaking to her, I wished her a wonderful journey. And I asked her to maybe like reach out to us from beyond and let us know how she's doing. And people were like, a little like, you know, whoa, what did she just say? And is that inappropriate in some way? But but my friend Harriet just smiled and she just like you could see, like it landed, and she knew she was going on a journey, and I just stated what was the truth, and you know, have you heard from her? I she has appeared to me in dreams, and sometimes I'll just get a message around something, and you'll feel and I have a reminder like once a year when it's her birthday, like I remember that it was her birthday, and I say a prayer for her, and so there is a ritual around that.

SPEAKER_02 27:49

Isn't it beautiful? Everybody does ritual, they just don't realize they're doing it, and then when you can point it out to people and say, hey, listen, really put some intention behind that and a candle with it, and it becomes really, really empowering. I I always feel that when people feel so helpless and hopeless and they're at home or they're away or they're in another country, you can light a candle and it intend to be present, send love, be there. It's it's very empowering for people, you know. Share something, send something, you know. It's um and talk to them. Talk to them, talk to them, talk to them. I talk to them exactly. Me too.

SPEAKER_01 28:31

You and I I talk to my brother all the time, and he talks to me all the time through feathers, and he comes as certain insects, so I know it's him. There's lots of ways that they can come through, and being a medium myself, it's in my family. Yeah, I talk to dead people all of the time. I don't, I've outed myself now, but but I do it just it's just the most natural thing, and so I know that there is no end after the body has been dropped, you know, it's the soul that leaves. And in the east, you know, the Buddhists do death so well, and Hindus do death so well. And I've seen all of their rituals, the indigenous rituals as well. I watched a documentary about the indigenous rituals and the rites of death, and how it's very important, and they all say the same thing in the East. This wisdom, this they all say that how you die is the same energy that you take over into the next world. And so it's important that you are surrounded by love, you're surrounded by what you know, whatever works for you, whatever is within your realm of faith or God. You know, the Buddhists chant mantras, they have a science around it, the leaving of the five elements, and the air being the last, which is why they take that breath at the end. So it's a very beautiful, and personally,

What People Fear Most About Death

SPEAKER_01 29:56

I've found that death being around so many of them is the most exquisite moment that you can experience because it's this gate of light opens up, and there's just this peace that descends, and this release and let go if we know how to do it. So I think on that, what do you think people are most scared of when it comes to death and dying in the West?

SPEAKER_02 30:23

From your experience, I think it's definitely what I was saying earlier is is how we die and when we die. So no one wants to die before the linear timeline. And as we know, if we follow the linear timeline, what a privilege. If we get to 9095 and we're happy and we've had a wonderful life, that's that's the linear timeline. So when you are robbed of that and you're taken too young, that's that's what people are scared of. They don't want to die too young, or no parent wants to bury a child. And the other thing is how, like cancer, in a fire, being murdered, you know, all of these these things in a war. How we die is really scary for people, yeah. And and being robbed of, or, and then also just the regret, you know. Of course, I don't want to die yet because I haven't done. Or or you know, it's it's or die by suicide. I mean, that's horrendous to to for somebody to have to reach a point where they have to take their own life. I mean, imagine the state that they were in for that to happen. It's it's horrific. So I I think there's so much fear, also because they may not have a faith, they may not have something that they follow or they really believe in. I mean, there's a saying from World War One that there's no atheist in a foxhole, and it does happen very often in palliative care where a family member says, Oh my gosh, you know, dad was never into religion, and he's like, call in the priest, call in the priest, like just in case there is a hell. I think it's really important before we die and while we're living to really think about what our beliefs are, what we believe in and what we are aligned to. I mean, I I'm I'm so my mother was Buddhist, my father's Catholic, my studied shamanism, I'm really into earth medicine. I converted to Judaism. I'm across all religions and experiences, and I I love it all, and I know what my personal belief is, and I just truly believe there's an afterlife. And I truly believe in karma. I'm I truly know there is because I see things and I speak to dead people and I speak to spirits, and it took me a really long time to come out and say that because I want it to be taken seriously, and the minute you sort of say these things, people go, Oh, they're woo-woo, they're mad. But um man, I I've had so many experiences that I cannot ever even think otherwise. And I I also think even if you don't believe in it, what's the harm to you hear about all these reports from people who've had near-death experiences and they all come back and say the same thing. How wonderful to think that that's that that that your loved ones come together you as they as they cross you over, over the river, across the bridge, whatever you're doing. How wonderful. I mean, to believe that is so special. And as you say, death is a it's a sacred rite of passage. We need to be honoring it all as that, and it is an absolute privilege to witness. Yes, it's sad, yes, it's it can be so horrific and so grief-stricken and horrible, but when we look at it as their journey in and we don't make it about us, it's about them, it's their final passage from life through to the afterlife, and they may be coming back again and we may see them again. We can talk to them when they're across, they're not here physically. When we start to really finalize our beliefs or investigate and be curious at least, you know, open to the possibilities, it really does dissolve a lot of the fear that we have, and we can really start to relax a lot more around those fears. That's the only way. I mean, I invite everybody to be curious enough to investigate the possibility that this isn't the end. And there's a lot of people. My stepfather, when he died, he said, I said, Heine, what do you think happens? And he said, We live and we die, and that's it. And he's a Holocaust survivor. And as he was dying, and I was doloring him and he was in liminal space, he was seeing his family, and it was amazing to watch. And I made him promise me, I said, Will you come back and tell me that there's an afterlife? He said, Yes. I said, How? And he said, You'll know. And of course, I was sitting with my mum in in the of the breakfast table where we always sat, and a crow came and landed, and it yodled, it went, YOLU, and I went, Oh, I told you, I told you there was an afterlife. And recently we're in Japan, and and my mother, yeah, we were in this beautiful mos temple in Japan, and it was so it's silent, and you're walking. And my mother just was there, and she was she said to me, I was thinking of Henry and Heine, and she looked at me, she had tears, and a crow just swooped past, and I went, There he is. So, I mean, I have a lot of stories like this, as you would right. We've got it's there, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 36:04

So many stories, yeah, and and I think it's important that we share these stories because, and by the way, we've banned the word woo-woo on our on our podcast. No, no, it's we've banned it, we've banned it because it's just it's just BS. And so um and so the same though, it's the same with me, you know, being a formal lawyer. I don't want people thinking that I'm I'm some crazy person when I can talk to dead people, but only yesterday I was getting ready to go to a satsang community gathering. This this thing in my this person was like waving jewelry at me. I'm going, This person needs some jewelry, someone needs some jewelry. And I'd met this woman a couple of days ago, and her father came to her, and we I'd passed on some messages. And I went to Satsang and she was there with her mother, and they came up and said, Oh, thank you so much. And then I said, Oh, he he came to me this morning. That's why I'm he he brought me to Satsang. I never go there, and so he's like, You have to go there and tell them. And he had you know a message about Jury, and they were like, We don't know about Jury. And I said, But he's very insistent, and then she went, Oh, yes, the watch. We haven't been giving it to our nephew because we think he's too young. He's like, No, he wants him to have it so he can connect more with him, more strongly with him. His mom was crying, and and so there is there is no end. I I agree, it's just about being curious about that and being open.

SPEAKER_02 37:34

Be open, just be open. You don't know. We can't when you shut it down. That's when the fear comes in. When you open up to all the possibilities and the beauty and the magic, and then the witnessing, you know, to not be afraid. Yes, there's pain and suffering, but there's pain and life is pain and suffering. I mean, come on, we're all I mean, the Buddhists have it right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:59

Yeah, they do.

SPEAKER_04 38:00

There's so many, Pachi, what would you say to people as some advice that you could offer about doing the very intentional work of not having regrets, of not waiting until it's too late to be complete with someone, to make amends with someone, or to, you know, resolve whatever feels unresolved? Like, like I know that's scary for people too, right? They always think they're gonna have more time. Yeah. And then sometimes time runs out. So has this work informed, even in your own life, how you just get really square with people as you live and not leave things for later?

SPEAKER_00 38:41

Yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_02 38:42

So, so great. You know, the time imperative. I mean, I tell you what, it is all about time. People's biggest mistake that they make is they think they have time. We all think we have time. Whereas seriously, in 10 minutes, I could have a brain aneurysm. Something could happen in in uh today or tomorrow or next week, where I get a call and I've got a life-limiting disease, I've got six months to live. It happens, it's happening everywhere, it happens all around. It's it's just a fact. So I think for me, I I mean, in the and my business, what I've got live well, leave well. We spend a hell of a lot of time, and I no punny intended, but we spend a lot of time living well, obsessed about our lives, about longevity, about biohacking. But we don't really spend a lot of time on how to leave well, and leaving well is the key to a prosperous life. So when we lean into death preparation, and what I mean by death preparation is conversations around, hey, you know, how do you what do you think about death? Are you scared of it? What are you most scared of? What do you want to happen? What do you think happens to you when you die? What would you like to happen to you when you die? What, what are you what in your religion, how do you want to be buried? How do you want to be remembered? What's the legacy that you want to leave behind? What's the footprint? What do you want to leave behind in people's hearts? What do you want to leave behind for people to remember you by? I think when we start to have these conversations, you're ultimately doing your death preparation. And you're also getting information about the person that you're talking to that's deep. And it changes you. Once you engage in conversation around death, it leads to preparation around death. You start to prepare, and then you can start to prepare mentally, physically, emotionally, spiritually. You can do practical things like your will, you can do your emotional will, you can do your advanced care directive things about, you know, what if I couldn't speak for myself and I had no choice or capacity? Who is going to speak for me? And what do I want you to know about me? Do you want to turn off that life machine? Like my kids know absolutely everything. I have filmed my eulogy in case of a sudden and unexpected death because I want people to be at my funeral and to listen to me. And I go, hey, if you're watching me, I've died. And oh my God, I can't believe you're watching this, and I don't know how I died, and I hope it wasn't too traumatic for you. But I want you to know that I'm okay for dying. I've lived a beautiful life, I've got beautiful relationships, I've talked about that. So I've wanting to make people feel comfortable with my death because I'm comfortable with it. And I know that in palliative care, the more comfortable or the more that you've leaned into death and had those conversations, had the important and tough conversations, the more you are comfortable with it, the better everybody else that you leave behind are able to deal with it. They're more responsible and that they know that your wishes, that you've had these conversations. And even if you're not really up for it, write it down because a lot of people don't want to talk to the people. And forgiveness is really difficult. But if you can forgive, forgive yourself, forgive others, forgive what they've done to you, what they've done to you. And we're not talking about forgetting what they've done, to forgive, to actually understand that it is ruining my life, the precious life that I have. And I, when I leave, I want to leave feeling resolved within myself. The more we can all do this work, and there's so many modalities to help us, right? It's like when when we were younger, there was no gluten-free, there was nothing about food. Now there's everything. And it's the same with death and dying. We've got so many modalities that we can reach out to that help us with our fear.

SPEAKER_04 42:50

Yeah. And your website is actually amazing. So I want you to be able to tell people how to find you because on your website, you have a lot of tools and you have all kinds of resources and links to read and to listen and to meditate and to write. It's it's so wonderful as a place to start. So I appreciate that you took the time to put that together to serve people. So tell tell us where do you want people to find you and what kind of work do you do with individuals who might reach out?

SPEAKER_02 43:19

Well, you can find me at um dedicate.com and it's felt dead. And I had a lot of people in in marketing saying, hey, Barce, you can't do that. I'm like, Yes, I can. Well, first of all, I'm dedicated to all things death and dying. I'm dedicated to bringing life, death back to life because we killed it. And we need to bring it back to life because death is life, it's a part of life. And it's spelt dead, so it's dedicate. And on there, you'll find my podcast, which is called Live Well, Leave Well. And it talks about end of life prep, it talks to all different people from all walks of life. And it's really interesting. I I really encourage everybody to go and listen. To that, the first episode's about event an end-of-life doula. So that's information on end-of-life doers. In America, you do do laying so well. Your death doer community. I just I bow down to. I went to an Endwell conference recently, and the the the doula community is next level. I want to bring that type of passion and community building back to Australia. We're still a little bit behind. You you're, I think maybe because your healthcare system isn't so great. We've got a really good healthcare system here, but it it stunts us. It keeps us into the white coats, um, into the doctors. And whereas everyone over there has got to really rally together. It takes a lot of people to help someone die at home. I have an AI assistant called Lowell. She stands for Live Well, Leave Well, Love Well. And it's my voice. And it's you can go in and tell Lowell anything. You can tell her whatever you're feeling. You can ask Lowell for resources. At the moment, it's only in Australia. I've just kept it very, very trustworthy information because of AI. People are very fearful. So I've kept it very Australian-based. But you can go in and still have a chat to me about death and dying, and I'll I'll chat with you about it. There's there's grief bots, there's, you know, there's an incredible resource list on AI as well as human. I think obviously a mixture of both is the best because what AI does is it helps us to access things faster, get more information, and and that also helps the generations that are looking after their parents and their children. We're our age, you know, aging population is about to double in 2030 and double again in 2050. So there's a lot of pressure. So I think AI really helps the tools help you in, you know, meetings with doctors to record things and transcribe things. So there's a whole wealth of information there. I've got information on voluntary sister dying. And soon I'm in the middle of and the process of, which will be released in the next couple of months, death meditations. Yeah. Amazing, beautiful music. Yeah, amazing. Watch out for that.

SPEAKER_01 46:22

It's called Timeless Transitions. Wonderful, wonderful resources. I really encourage everyone to go on your website, dedicate. And whether someone around you're dying, whether they're not dying, whether you're far away from death where you think you are, I believe it helps us live a much better life when we embrace death. And so thank you so much, Bachi, for being here.

SPEAKER_02 46:47

Pleasure.

SPEAKER_01 46:48

Thank you for the depth and the tenderness and the humanity you brought to this space. I mean, for me, this convert conversation reminds us that death awareness, it's really not about endings, it's about presence, it's about honesty and love while we're still here. And for anyone who wants to explore your work, learn more about death literacy, walk this path with support, please go and find Bachi. And may this conversation invite you, our listeners, to live a little more awake, speak a little more honestly, and live just a little bit more bravely. Until the next time, this is the wisdom we share. Thank you so much. Beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 47:29

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 47:33

Thank you so much for tuning in to the Wisdom We Share podcast. We hope today's episode sparked some new insight, imagination, and practical tools you can integrate into your daily life.

SPEAKER_01 47:47

Continue this journey with us by subscribing, sharing, and dropping us a review. Until next time, stay wise.