S5E7 - Beyond Compliance: Shaping a Greener Future for Healthcare

In this insightful episode of the AXREM Insights podcast, hosts Melanie Johnson and Sally Edgington are joined by Chris Taylor (Sustainability Lead at Philips UKI and AXREM Sustainability Special Focus Group Convener) and Anu Hutazari (ESG Manager at Canon Medical Systems and Vice Convener) to explore the evolution and impact of AXREM’s Sustainability Special Focus Group. 

Chris and Anu share their personal journeys into sustainability, discuss the collaborative nature of the group, and emphasise how AXREM provides a safe, inclusive space for tackling some of the biggest challenges facing the medtech sector, from circular economy models to social value. They highlight how the group’s manifesto aligns closely with NHS goals, and how the collective effort across OEMs, SMEs, policymakers, and the NHS is helping shape a sustainable healthcare future.

Listeners also hear about the significance of the group’s diverse membership spanning NHS England, NHS Scotland, the Royal College of Radiologists and beyond and how this broad collaboration helps keep the industry informed and agile in response to rapidly evolving policy and environmental expectations. 

Chris and Anu reflect on the benefits of open dialogue, continuous education, and knowledge-sharing, all underpinned by AXREM’s ethos of mutual progress over competition. Whether through innovative events like the Wilder Carbon safari or concrete initiatives around net zero and ethical practice, this episode offers an inspiring look at how united industry action can drive meaningful, lasting change.

Rad Magazine sponsor of AXREM's UKIO Drinks Reception and Leading Publication in the Medical Imaging and Oncology Space

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Transcript

Hello and welcome. I'm Melanie Johnson, and I'm here with Sally Edgington.
Today, we have the pleasure to be speaking to both Chris Taylor,
Sustainability Lead at Philips UKI,
and also AXREM Sustainability Special Focus Group Convener,
as well as Anu Huhtisaari, ESG Manager at Canon Medical Systems,
and AXREM  Sustainability Special Focus Group Vice Convener.
Welcome, Chris and Anu, and thank you for being on our show today.
Now, let's get started by handing over to you
to tell us a little bit about yourself
and what's your story. Thank you for having us.
So I'm relatively new to the health care sector,
but not new to sustainability.
So I've been in sustainability for nearly 15 years.
And I sort of started in an organization in some ways,
not too dissimilar to AXREM , a global membership organization,
but in the tea sector.
So the focus was on building kind of a sustainably sustainable tea sector
that's socially just and environmentally sustainable.
So I was involved in lots of different things during my time there,
including supporting farmers with training
on climate resilient tea growing practices
to kind of gender empowerment programs and community outreach programs as well.
So really kind of lots of lots of different things,
as well as kind of convening a number of working groups as well.
And from then, I moved to a jewelry sector again in a sustainability role.
And I was able to lead a setting up of a high jewelry rental business model,
which is really exciting because I do believe that circular economy
is a key enabler when we look at kind of tackling climate emergency.
So that was a really exciting role.
And for the past year or just under a year,
I've been with Canon Medical Systems here in the UK.
And I'm the ESG manager.
So obviously, one of the key things that I'm responsible for
is striving progress towards our net zero commitment
and lots of other initiatives as well that kind of fall under that fairly broad ESG umbrella.
And of course, I've joined the sustainability special focus group
in the last few months as a vice convener to support Chris.
Thank you. I mean, it's lovely to have you with us.
So obviously, you're quite the guru within sustainability by the sounds of it,
which is fantastic.
So how have you found, obviously, the transition into the health care sector?
I mean, in some ways, you know, sustainability, sustainability, right?
The climate emergency is climate emergency.
So kind of the building blocks and what we need to do are very similar.
And, you know, things like looking at solutions like circular economy models are the same.
But yes, of course, you know, learning, learning the ropes and understanding
who's who in the sector, of course, takes time.
And, you know, I am actually really grateful to Axreb
because it's been, you know, you've been a real source of information
and and kind of, yeah, one one stop shop almost to come to everything that's that's happening.
So so, yes, it's been it's been wonderful.
I mean, you know, hopefully I will I will remain for many years to come
because it does feel like I have found my place where I want to be.
Oh, lovely. And Chris.
Afternoon. How are you, man?
Yeah, I'm good. Thank you.
Lovely to have you on here.
Thank you. I'm feeling like a bit of a fraud now.
Just a Dan who's a live story that sounds quite impressive.
Hopefully they so I can follow that just as equally as well.
Oh, Chris, come on and tell us a little bit about your background.
So, yeah, I got just my my initial work started in engineering and service engineering.
I actually my first experience of action was actually on the services managers group,
which was too many years ago to mention.
So I've been working in engineering for probably 30 odd years.
And then just in my own private life, I had a keen interest in sustainability and climate.
I'm a keen hiker.
And it was one day we were out walking on a very, very hot day
and bumped into a ranger that was working in the on kinder kinder
scout, one of the more than so near where I live.
And he was looking out for wildfires.
And that's quite interesting.
I didn't know the UK had wildfires.
And this we're talking going back to probably 2016 to something around that that period.
So I started looking at wildfires, found out it was a thing.
Then I started learning about a program called Morse for the Future,
which I volunteer for in the last few years.
And that really got me interested into climate and the climate emergency.
And then back in about 2020, I think it was.
We saw Simon Stevens first document come out on the next zero agenda from the NHS.
And I remember talking to Charlie McCaffrey at the time,
who was the chair of the action at the time, and just saying,
you know, is anybody aware of this?
This is going to be a big issue for us.
I've done a lot of reading on kind of health care and and climate
and the effects of the environmental health just generally.
I started to mesh the two together and then started working with Sally.
Many months ago, I think it was about 2020, 2021, Sally, wasn't it?
Something around then that we started seeing more of an agenda.
And we kind of then created the action focus group
off the back of that around 22, if I remember rightly, Sally.
I think it is kind of I was lucky enough to convene that.
We've been working on that ever since.
So it's been a real roller coaster.
Our first meeting was April 2022.
So, yeah, we've been going over three years.
Only two minutes ago.
Yeah. Yeah.
Just shows you how much we've we've progressed.
And since then, you know, it's it's really exploded.
Phillips, thankfully, have given me after severely nagging, probably.
They've actually made this a permanent job.
It just goes to show that, you know, people do take it seriously.
Ultimately, it does allow me to to do a lot of work in this area.
And we do a lot of work with government and HSE, as it is presently
the Department of Health and Social Care.
So it's been a real, yeah, really good learning curve and really,
really rewarding, I think, of some of the work that we do do.
And it was great that, you know, we won an award last year to recognise that.
And time flies.
I was just going to say, I thought for a second
you were going to kind of say, oh, I decided actually to become a ranger
for a few years or something in that conversation then.
I'm getting on with it, Mel.
You never know. One day, I might want to start taking.
I know it takes over.
Yeah, I might take the back seat.
See you in the Moors.
Yes. Yeah, I'll be up on the Moorland.
And I was going to say time flies when you're having fun
because the last three years has flown by and so much has happened.
So I think from our listeners perspective,
it would be really good to find out a little bit more about the special focus
group and the manifesto.
And I know now the special focus group isn't just sustainability.
We also cover social value.
And I must mention, before you talk about the manifesto,
the amazing launch event that we had with the Safari
supported by Wilder Carbon at the Wilder Bleen Woods.
And we did that in conjunction with the Kent Wildlife Trust,
where we went on a safari looking for bison.
We didn't see a bison that day, but we have since adopted a bison there.
And the bison's there had babies that they didn't realize
they were going to have babies and it made sky news.
That was very exciting.
So I think that was a really great event.
And I think it shows that actually, I'm trying to do things
a little bit differently.
And I think it was really good.
And I knew I was super impressed when I got to that event.
And you turned up on your bicycle because that just said
that just had sustainability champion written all over it.
So I will hand over to you guys with Chris in the first instance
to talk a bit more about the manifesto and the special focus group.
And I'm sure and you will be able to give her thoughts on that as well.
If I remember right, Sally, we car shared.
So that's that's kind of did that to a degree as well.
No, it was a great event that we've been working on.
I've been doing some kind of back and forth with that group for a little while.
And it was following that project for years before, as you say,
very interesting to see the release of bison back into the wild.
It's quite extraordinary, really.
So, yeah, it was great to that.
So, yeah, the manifesto came about, obviously,
because a lot of our work revolves around the NHS road map.
Well, we're going with that.
Obviously, we've got a couple of milestones still left on that.
Twenty twenty seven, we've got the full scope three reporting
and then twenty twenty eight, the big one,
the comfort printing of products or that life cycle analysis piece.
So they are big parts of our manifesto.
We have I feel we're very aligned with the NHS on this.
And I know the NHS kind of appreciate our support in this and working together.
We've got some great feedback from people like Alex Hammond, for example,
and supporting her work.
So it will be interesting to see.
I think we're aligned as well with things like the design for life road map,
which myself and you, Sally, have been involved since that started.
We've also got the 10 year plan, but I think the way the manifesto worded,
we we are kind of well aligned for that.
And ultimately, the one I think that's going to give us the challenge
for the for probably this year into next is the social value piece.
We've got a new procurement act coming up in October.
So I think that alone will will be quite a lot of work.
Social value is a great idea.
I think, you know, we all support it and it's kind of what he's trying to achieve.
I think the challenge will be scaling that up
and how we do that when you think there's nearly 250.
And it just trusts stroke health boards in the UK, something around that number.
So to do that locally at such a high level is going to be a challenge,
I think, for everybody, especially when you start looking at our SME
community and how they they work and how vital the work that they do.
So I think, yeah, we we're going to have a bit of work.
But I think the manifesto was kind of set out our kind of priorities.
And I think it was a great piece.
It was another piece of collaborative work from the group.
I think we put it together quite quickly.
And it was only about a month or so, wasn't it?
Something like that, which I was quite surprised that we did it that quick.
So, yeah, I think it's well rooted to to kind of cover
where we are at this present moment, certainly for the next
probably 28 up to 30, 20, 30 period.
I think we're well aligned with NHS on that.
So I don't think there's anything to add on that.
Other than it was great on your bike.
I must admit, I'm well impressed.
If I can just cover off the core values of the manifesto.
So some of the core values within our manifesto for sustainability
is shaping the future for generations to come, which isn't just a commercial thing.
That's for, you know, our children and their children.
So it's a personal thing as well.
Equity and inclusion, community engagement,
ethical practices and empowerment.
And I think, you know, all of those titles are big titles.
And there's lots that we could say about each of them.
But the other thing that I think is really worth highlighting as well
about our special focus group is just how inclusive and collaborative it is.
And it's the most unique group in AXREM
where we don't just have member representatives,
we have representatives from organisations like NHS Scotland,
NHS Wales, NHS England, the Department of Health and Social Care,
NHS Supply Chain, the Royal College of Radiologists,
the British Healthcare Trades Association, EPSCOT, IPEM.
And I've probably missed some, but lots of external organisations.
And, you know, a couple of those people are real.
They're the policymakers of these things and the things that,
you know, the roadmaps and the things that you guys are following.
So that is a really important collaboration.
And I you can see that within the group, you know, just how joined up we are.
And actually, in our last podcast that we recorded, they were members
were talking about the fact that you've got big OEMs
that are helping and mentoring our SMEs.
And we, you know, Chris, it's one of your favourite sayings.
This is, you know, this isn't a commercial thing.
This is something we all need to win together.
And so I just think that the sustainability group
is such a great example of how industry can come together
to do the right thing by our planet, by the people, by generations.
So I will then hand over to Anu, because I'm sure that you can cover off,
especially with your experience in the past,
lots of kind of feedback and comments on that.
Yes, yeah. And just first of all, I think in my job description,
there is a small print that says, you know, cycling and trains only.
So, you know, you will be seeing me on my bike wherever I go.
But also just to say kind of a reflection on the manifesto,
because obviously I came from kind of outside.
And I think that event was actually my first introduction
to sustainability, a special focus group.
And I think the manifesto is great because, as you sort of said,
it covers it's fairly broad, but it's really aligned with what we need to do.
But also it has some specific calls, calls to action.
So I think it's a really good kind of guiding,
guiding document for us.
And I think, as you also mentioned, one of one of the things
that I do think is brilliant is that kind of having that sort of space
where all the key stakeholders come together.
But it is also a safe space to, you know, if there are areas that we are.
Well, I think for all companies, there are definitely still areas that,
you know, we don't have solutions for.
So there is that safe space to discuss,
raise concerns, ask questions, you know, are there opportunities
where we could also come together and try to find some of these solutions?
Because, you know, we are all facing some of the same, same challenges.
So it's great to have that kind of not just the companies,
but also the key stakeholders coming together.
That was a great list, by the way, of all the people involved.
I forget sometimes how many people we've invited.
I know when we set the group up, we were very keen to make sure
everybody in the room that we needed to be in that room had a voice
and getting all those people together was no mean feat in itself.
And I think, again, it shows the power of the group and the power of Axrem
that people want to join.
I mean, you look at some of those names there that they were,
you know, asking to be part of the group, which is great.
You know, it's and as you say, they say no one wins unless we all win,
which I try to end every meeting with.
I don't know if you've noticed that.
But it's I think it ultimately kind of sets the tone.
And the great thing about sustainability is not just it's a massive subject
that, you know, if you if you like a variety of things to learn,
it's brilliant for that because it's never ending.
But also it's the most non-competitive area.
It's it's kind of one of those we all need to win.
So it's a bit of a race song on that perspective.
But it's the one it's a it's a one of these is more of a fun run than a marathon.
So we all all need to cross that line together.
And that's one of the great things of the group.
Yeah. And I think that from a trade association perspective,
we've been real leaders in this, and I think we're seen as that.
And I think you can tell with our involvement in the Design
for Life program from the concept of it, I think me and you, Chris,
have been involved with that for probably over two years now.
And then obviously that was launched last year.
So I think it's positioned XREM really, really well to, you know,
to be a leading voice in sustainability.
And I have to give huge kudos to you, Chris,
because you have been so committed, not only, obviously,
to your full time job at Philips flying the sustainability flag,
but for all the work that you do for XREM on a voluntary basis
and all the events that you talk out for us,
I think has helped elevate our profile and the work of sustainability.
And I think if we are seen as an industry to be doing the right thing
and be a leading industry within the med tech sector that is,
you know, on the sustainability roadmap and assisting the NHS,
it's such a positive message for us to give out.
Thank you. It was, I'll be honest, that first two or three years,
I was particularly keen to get as many people
to understand the message as possible.
And there was some long, some very long weeks.
In fact, most weeks were long, to be honest, at the start.
And again, thanks out to Mark Lefwich and Jeevan
for kind of championing the position and making this permanent,
because that has certainly helped with the home life
and seeing the kids and the missus.
I'm always a preacher for their support, because they're always there to help.
But yeah, it's it has been, you know, hard work, but it's been rewarding.
I think that's the great thing about, I mean, the industry
we in is rewarding enough, but put add on sustainability.
It's like the cherry on top.
So I think that's one of the great things about the work we do.
Absolutely. And just to cap off this question,
some of the other kind of headings within our manifesto
are areas around net zero, modern slavery, promoting diversity
and inclusion, education and awareness, supporting communities,
environmental stewardship and external engagement.
So if any of you listening haven't read our sustainability manifesto, please do.
And I'm sure when this is posted online, we can put a link
to the manifesto as well. So I'll move on now.
So if we look ahead and start kind of horizon scanning,
what do you think is next for the special focus group?
And if we start with Chris and we've got the road map, of course,
which is the I think that's going to be the main things.
But also, I know we've touched on this before within the group,
but circular economy and I know I know I was just mentioned it earlier.
Circular economy is the big thing that we really need as an industry
need to look at.
And I know that's, you know, that's not just kind of product design,
but that's the way we sell to the NHS, the way we conduct our businesses.
It all needs to kind of move towards that, because ultimately strengthening
the supply chains is is one of the kind of things that we tried to do
as part of this.
And it's really keen that, you know, that we get everybody on board with that,
because it's, as we know from the the paper that we launched
with the University of Exeter, it's safe like that
as is the way of getting to net zero.
And it was going to be very if not impossible to get there
without adopting a circular economy model moving forward.
So I think that is going to be a big task.
It does take, you know, a change in process.
But we are seeing cases of, you know, circular and the design
circular business models are now starting to be released within the NHS.
You know, we were hearing more and more from firms like
so I know there are other ones about their circular ambitions.
So people are getting on board and appreciate
it's not not as easy as just flicking a switch.
It does take it does take time to get that created.
But I think that's that's going to be a big part of the way we move forward.
We've also at the moment obviously got quite a complex political arena globally.
I think that that is a challenge that we'll need to work with.
That's certainly making things a little bit more difficult
from a global perspective.
And we have to be aware of that as we move forward.
We're also I think one of the great things, again, about sustainability
is we're kind of linked with a load of the other FSG's.
So I don't think there's a special focus group.
It's probably not linked with in some way or form.
I mean, if you take like the digital and AI solutions, for example,
AI is going to have a massive impact on our on our market and how we deploy that.
So I think that's going to be an interesting one to see how,
you know, we can use AI from a sustainable perspective and take that forward.
So, yeah, very, very exciting to be fair.
And on top of that, you know, the 10 year plan,
we hopefully next month we'll find out from there
what what that entails from all discussions so far.
Net zero, modern slavery, social value,
et cetera, are all a key part of what the NHS are planning.
So we're we're well aligned to to to help champion
the NHS with that.
Yes, and I think I think you've sort of listed
the key priorities really well.
Yes, certainly kind of circular economy is is a big one.
But I do think that it's just also worth mentioning that kind of
the basic principle of of the sustainability special focus
focus kind of continue this amazing convening and making sure that,
you know, those webinars do take place and that kind of
being that place where where members can come and find out
all the changes that are happening because the pace of change is so fast.
And, you know, you kind of need 48 hours a day
to be able to keep up with all of it.
So I think it's it's kind of continuing that that role to to be that place
where you can go to find that all that information.
So that certainly continues into into the future.
Yeah. And I think, yes, I also think that
obviously the world's evolving and things are changing.
And as we go further down the road map,
we will probably refresh the manifesto at some stage as well.
So kind of as we look at the calls to actions, which are around
product carbon footprint, we spoke about circular economy,
corporate sustainability reporting, directive alignment
and early engagement of industry.
I think we can take a couple of those.
The early engagement of industry.
Absolutely. You know, all the different organizations we deal with know that,
you know, they can come and speak to us around sustainability.
And often they do.
So I think that there'll be a point where we'll say, you know,
we've pretty much fulfilled the calls to action within that manifesto.
And then it will evolve and we will refresh it and relaunch it
at some point in the future.
But I think education webinars, but also us having strong position
statements and supporting documents is also really important.
So we're guiding our members, but also telling the outside world
and our external stakeholders, you know, what our position is.
And if there is a challenge, you know, or a pinch point,
you know, on the road map or with, you know, some kind of legislation,
we need to make sure that we fly the flag for our members and a vocal about that.
I also think as well, we've taken sustainability in house as well,
in terms of we've got our own acts from sustainability policy
around how we conduct ourselves, how we conduct meetings.
We have more meetings virtually to save on our carbon footprint.
We print a lot less now.
We're actually trying to get to no printing.
So we've got less paper usage and staff are always encouraged
to travel on public transport via train.
So, you know, we're taking responsibility within AXREM,
as well as promoting that to our members as well.
So we're kind of practicing what we preach.
Yeah, that education piece is a great comment, because ultimately,
I think that's I know that's something we're working on at the moment,
Sally, on a little side project.
But I think educating people in sustainability is vital.
You know, there's there's a lot of misinformation out there
and there has been for many years on sustainability.
We all know that call out the fossil fuel community and their agenda.
But, yeah, countering things like that and giving people the actual facts
behind this, you know, I think it's key.
And I know we are working on that education piece because educating members
as well as the wider community is is going to be one of our, I think,
great pieces of work that we're going to do for the next few years.
And giving a platform to do that will be a very strong position again for AXREM.
And I also think there's different perception as to what sustainability is.
And we see that even with social value.
You know, members feed back just around tenders.
And what actually is social value and what does that look like?
So so, yeah, I think it's important that we are all clear.
But also, there's lots of aligned messages coming from our industry.
And I think that's where AXREM has a role to play
in making sure that all of our member companies
have got the right information and are fairly aligned.
I would say if you look at their company websites, I would say
they're all pretty aligned, which is great.
Yeah. So just before I move on, I just obviously just want to remind members
that we have obviously held a number of sustainability webinars,
which obviously you've alluded to already.
So obviously that they do need access.
Please do reach out to myself
or Naomi or any of the team.
And obviously we can share that with them.
We've still got the slides from those.
So again, we've got that education to share with you.
So please do reach out. We have helped them.
They've been really, really well attended and they're so informative.
So, yeah, reach out.
Should you need them? They're all here for you.
Yeah, I think there's anything as well as specific from anybody.
I put my teeth in when I say that.
For anybody that if anybody's got a question or, you know,
they're struggling in one area, then yeah, reach out because we're here.
We're here to help.
You know, we want people to not make the mistakes that we've made along the way.
You know, if you can, if you do it first time right,
which is one of the things that the NHS is trying to do more and more these days.
So learn, you know, learn what we what we've done wrongly.
And so you don't do it.
So if anybody needs any additional help,
don't be afraid to reach out, I would say as well.
That leaves me lovely into my next question, actually.
So benefits have been involved in special focus groups and acts round generally.
Obviously, like you've just alluded to there, Chris,
you can obviously have different members that you can reach out to for information,
advice, et cetera.
But let me hand over to Sohanu, would you like to go first?
Yes. And I guess we've mentioned some of these already as we've been chatting,
but it's kind of worth repeating.
So maybe if I'll say three and then I'll hand over to Chris as well.
But maybe the first one is that I think it's just wonderful to have that space
for collaboration, because it's not always natural for companies
to come together to have that kind of platform.
Then to have those conversations is is absolutely brilliant.
From my own perspective, as I sort of said, I'm relatively new
to this industry.
That kind of access to information and updates,
I think is just absolutely brilliant.
And then kind of the third one I wanted to mention is that
that safe space to have those discussions.
You know, we've we've mentioned that already.
But again, I think it's just so important to have that opportunity
to ask those questions, because as Chris, you were saying as well,
you know, it is a journey.
It's it's unlikely that you get it right for the first time.
And it's also being able to share some of those challenges
transparently and and find kind of opportunities to collaborate
and think about, well, are there ways that we could maybe do it
do it better or, you know, learn learn from each other?
So I think that's that's really important.
So, yeah, I'll hand over to to you, Chris, to add to the list.
Yeah, yeah, I think you covered much that I knew.
But yeah, I think that that safe space is sustainability
can be quite depressing to cover.
To be honest, you start reading
about the kind of future and the future leaving you for your kids.
And it can be it can be really depressing, he says laughing.
But yeah, it can.
If you look into the kind of science of it and really heavily in.
So I think having a space where we can all come together
and just for a start, we're all kind of talking about the same thing
and it and it can lift your mood.
And I think that's a great thing of collaboration and team.
And I think, you know, the definitely the focus group is
just feel like a great team kind of sport, for one of the better word.
And I think, you know, if you, you know, you're reading the news
or you're seeing the latest kind of climate
the projections, it can feel, yeah, very lonely.
And when you've got this this extra team behind you,
I think that's what's great because you've got that support.
You know, you're not alone.
There are other people and you hear their stories and, you know,
the work that they're doing and they give examples,
which, you know, we can all share, but it's not competitive.
It's it's about progression and moving us forward.
I think that can lift the mood.
So I think that we can't underestimate that aspect.
When we when we're talking about sustainability.
Plus, just to quote probably a circular economy model
that, you know, it gives that kind of idea
where we can eliminate the waste.
Identify value and then learn how to create that value,
which is ultimately how circular economy looks to work.
So we're kind of learning a lesson as we're going along.
And I think that's what we do really well.
And I think, you know,
I think it shows that, you know, the increasing membership
that we're getting and the fact that people want to join,
that we're kind of getting that balance right.
You know, we're not here to do carbon shaming, which, you know,
I know some people do still use that.
I mean, in the right environment, that is all fine.
But, you know, I think we're all here making the best intentions
and looking at the best ways to move forward.
Yes, we make mistakes,
but we learn from them and we look forward.
Yeah. And just to add to that, in terms of that safe space
you were both talking about, obviously, AXREM are governed
by strict competition or guidance.
So, you know, we conduct all of our meetings with being able
to create that safe space for industry, but knowing what we can
and can't talk about.
And like you say, Chris, you know, it's not a competitive thing
in terms of sustainability, so the space is very safe
and we can have quite open and transparent conversations,
which I think is really important.
Yeah, especially in this kind of
topic, we need to, you know, we need to have those discussions
knowing that we're not going to infringe on anything.
Yeah, I think that is fine.
I'm just going to kind of change up the kind of atmosphere
at the moment and go on to my quirky question.
So if you had a time machine, would you choose to go back in the past
or would you go to the future and why?
So Anu, would you like to go first?
Yeah, sure. This is such a fun question.
And it felt like a very AXREM question.
I think there's always, you know, we cover lots of serious topics,
but there's also always some, you know, fun involved as well.
So it's brilliant.
I found this actually really tricky.
I grew up in Finland, I was born in Finland, grew up there.
And there's a place where kind of our family has people
from the extended family have lived for, they can trace it back
to 500 years or something like that.
And I've always sort of thought about, oh, wouldn't it be fun to go and see,
you know, what they were up to and what the place looked like 500 years ago?
But then I am in the space of sustainability
and I kind of do want to go to the future and see whether,
you know, we can come together and we can find solutions
to some of these challenges that we are we are facing.
So, you know, is AI going to help us solve some of the, you know,
issues that we are facing around climate?
And, you know, will the leaders be able to come together?
Are all companies finally going to become force for good as well?
So I think, although I was debating, but I think future it will be.
And hopefully, hopefully I won't be disappointed.
But I think in this job as well, as Chris was kind of alluding to,
you have to be kind of an eternal optimist because otherwise
it can be a little bit depressing.
So, so, yes. Yeah. Thank you for this fun question.
Wonderful. Thank you. And Chris?
I'm a bit with Anu on this one, I must admit.
I kind of want to go back because I think we can learn a lot from history.
I think a lot of our answers lie in history, to be fair, to this,
especially to sustainability.
You look back at things like now we're talking about, you know,
disinfecting equipment, reusing things, making it more robust, et cetera,
which is a lot how we used to work.
So actually going back might be quite useful.
But I would like to pull the three series back to the future kind of thing
and mistakenly end up in the future, because ultimately we would like to know
that this actually works out and, you know, that our future generations
that are going to appreciate this work and, you know, and see that,
you know, as as a kind of generation that we we have taken this seriously
and we have worked hard to to give them that future.
And I think it would be nice to know that that's going to happen.
Sadly, I don't think I'll be about for most of that.
But I think we're going about the right way.
So, yeah, I'll go with history just to learn.
Yeah, I think there's some some great lessons to learn
that will that really help from sustainability perspectives.
I do love the fact that you're both so optimistic about the future, though,
because you can speak to different people and some people are so just
so scared of what the future holds.
So it's nice to hear some optimism.
So, yeah, and yes, it is a scary subject.
And I'm going to end the podcast differently to normal, which Mel doesn't know.
But I've just found a really inspiring quote.
And the quote is there must be a better way to make the things
we want a way that doesn't spoil the sky or the rain or the land.
And that was said by Paul McCartney from The Beatles.
So there we go.
I thought that might be a quote of inspiration.
And anyone that's listening to this, whether they're on a walk,
whether they're on the treadmill, whether they're in the car.
I hope you feel more inspired.
So I think we've all found out a lot more today about Chris and Anu.
So thank you very much.
And we've got some further insights into AXREM Sustainability
Special Focus Group and the really important work the group is doing.
So a big thank you to Chris and Anu and thanks for joining us.
And thanks to all our listeners.
Join Sally and I again next week when we will be speaking to David
Kinnerston and Dan Baines about the AXREM Radiotherapy Special Focus Group.