104 - Katie Barbera Pt 2: My Heart Was Tired

Continue with nurse educator, nurse, and Colorado, Arizona, and North Idaho native Honored Guest Katie Barbera as she talks about who inspires her most, knowing she wanted to be in healthcare since she was five years old, survival mechanisms in nursing, self care, boundaries, burnout, being refreshed by jail nursing, and more!

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Transcript

0:01

Welcome to the second part of the Katie Experience. Katie, welcome back! How are you? I'm doing good, how are you doing? I'm doing exceptionally well, not only because of what you've already brought to the table, but also because those of you who are listening and hopefully listened through that second intro, man, that was fun. As is the tradition here on this podcast, if we have someone who's more than a one-parter, we have them do something fun in the second one. I call it the Lucy rule, going way back to our first two-parter and her goof up that ended up making the intro. I mean, again, we are the most unprofessional professional podcast out there. or professional, unprofessional podcast? I don't remember how I would call it. All right, speaking of unprofessional, let's dive right in. So anyone who's listened to the last few episodes, if you are a consistent listener, you're going, Eric, this is all fine and good. But I don't know if I can trust Katie, because you have not administered your patented, not yet patented, feeding our young personality test. So no worries, listener. I will make sure that you can trust her, all right? So, Katie. You're verifying that I've not prepared you with these questions. These are five questions, the same questions I've given the last few people. And you're gonna give your spot on answer. You can give rationale if you want or not, but you are verifying you've not heard these questions before, correct? That makes this exam 100 % genuine, if you guys were wondering. All right, question number one, are you ready? Is Wham's song titled Last Christmas a Christmas song? I have no idea. I don't know that I know that song. Well, we've had a wonderful time with Katie. Thank you. We're gonna have to pick this up another time. She's gonna have to go educate herself. I thought you were educated, but apparently not. Well, but for the interest of listeners, is it a Christmas song, yes or no? Since you're asking the question, I'm gonna say no. Alright, and would you rather have the ability to fly or breathe underwater? Team Pie or Team Cake? Team pie as long as it's homemade crust. There is a qualification. First qualification I've ever gotten. Would you rather instantly learn a new language or an instrument? Good question. I'm gonna go with language. Yep have a time machine. Congratulations. Are you going to go back in time or are going to go see the future? back in time. All right, there it is everybody. The results are, she's amazing. Okay, so moving along to the less jokey-jokey opening soft lob questions. I do wanna touch on though, you are a very busy woman and have plans for more busy, busy, busy, busy in your future. But in the meantime, what are your hobbies or interests? Because I know that instructors just like students. have a life outside of school, I think, usually. So what are your hobbies and interests? What do you do when you're not otherwise occupied with all of these other things? Sure, absolutely. So I enjoy reading. I enjoy something a little bit newer to me. I've never had a green thumb before. I always used to joke around that I had this black thumb of death, but on the last couple of years, I have started collecting plants and I'm really enjoying growing plants. And I have a very fun collection of plants around my house that make me smile. And so I really enjoy that. And then beyond that, it's a lot of different things that I find to be creative outlets. So there's a lot of different crafts. I love craft projects. Silly craft projects, exciting craft projects, paint by number, crochet, knit, card making, scrapbooking. I mean, really, you name it. just, I mean, I enjoy using some level of creativity and creating things. And along those lines, My fiance and I make soap. And so that's really fun. So we've had a lot of fun creating the recipes that we want to and finding fun colors and scents and things to be able to do with that. So that's been really a great creative outlet and something we've really enjoyed learning to do together. So those are the things that I do right now. I have a history of enjoying running and in my, it's not a career goal, but it's a lifetime goal. would really, have run two full marathons in my lifetime and I would really like to do an Ironman at some point. One full Ironman. Beyond that, then I just want to do some fun runs. I enjoy running. It's not something that I can do much of right now. I do have a hernia that I need to have surgery on at some point in my lifetime and so while I'm dealing with that, running is not the safest thing for my body. So once I am able to heal from that, then really forward to getting back out there and running and then learning and training to do an Ironman. And then after that, doing fun silly races like glow in the dark races and mud runs and reindeer trots and like just all kinds of fun things that make it more exciting to be able to get out there and get some exercise. Running is a happy space for me. I definitely get that like dopamine runner's high thing. I just feel very like peaceful afterwards. And so I'm looking forward to being able to get back to that at some point in my life too. And yet I can guarantee you, so for the second episode in a row, you've made everybody's butt clench when you said, love running, because then everybody goes, oh great, Eric is going to talk about running now for ten full minutes. No, I'll drop the fact that yes, I might have run another half marathon before today's recording sessions, and it is my 180th in ten years. And so, and it was in 24 degree weather at the time of this recording, which is February 7th of 2025. It's fun. It's a fun thing. So, so glad you like running. I unlike you, this is where we are not kindred spirits. I have no desire to do an iron man. Thank you and have a great time with that. You're gonna have to let us know how that goes when it happens. So with that, enough of the fluff. Actually there's one more fluff I wanna address and that was who or what you kind of talked about your hero, your daddy. I love that because that's how she wrote it on the form, my daddy. But who else inspires you in life? What do you find inspiring in life? Um, so I think that the people who have inspired me the most, are people. So the two that come to mind the easiest are Abraham Lincoln and Walt Disney. And I know they're very different. Um, but the similarity that I see is two people who saw an opportunity to make the world a better place, an opportunity to change it, an opportunity to. do something that other people thought was impossible. Abraham Lincoln was president during the Civil War when this country was torn in half. to be able to figure out how to with, obviously I don't know the person, as things that were said about him, with integrity and great leadership skill to be able to guide people through their differences. to get to a place where we are still a country today. I think a big part of the fact that we're still a country today has to do with his leadership skills. And I really don't do politics and I'm not going to talk at all about what's going on currently politically in the country because it's very divisive for a lot of people. But what I will say is that it's really incredible when there are people who see beyond the differences that we all have and instead focus on the things that make us similar. and the things that, and that's the human condition. And Abraham Lincoln was able to, with great leadership and integrity, work through seeing that future and helping this country through that. And so I look up to that and then Walt Disney. So I'm a Disney princess. I love Disney. I always have, and again, not talking about politics, not talking about you know, current choices that Disney is making or what Disney has done and their acquisitions, because people can get into all that. But specifically talking about the fact that, yes, I like princesses. Yes, I'm a Disney princess. And what Walt Disney did was he saw a way to be able to, through animation, tell stories about life, to connect people, children and adults, through magic. through the magic of storytelling and animals and fairy tales, to be able to reach people and inspire people and bring joy all over the world for generations. And that is a beautiful thing that I find very inspirational. And they're both visionaries. so I really find, there's obviously many more visionaries that exist out there. And up on my list is also Florence Nightingale because obviously she She saw something and worked very hard against the grain to create the foundation of what we have today as nurses. And that takes that visionary seeing something that doesn't currently exist, seeing that there's a way to make things better and make the world a better place by living in it and working through those challenges. And so that is very near and dear and inspires a lot of what I do in my life. Incredible. And that, dear listener, is why I had to squeeze that question in. So that being said, let's dive back into the world of nursing. Nice segue there with Florence Nightingale. So thank you for that. It's almost like she saw what was coming. Let's touch on some more issues that you want to specifically talk about during your episode. I feel like you kind of covered the why nursing, why you chose nursing, and what got you in there. But How has nursing being, becoming a nurse and practicing nursing, how has that changed the way you deal with medical concerns in your own family? Well, I will touch just a little bit more as a preface to answering that question. So I have known since I was under five years old that I wanted to go into healthcare. I always thought that I wanted to be a doctor and I wanted to be a doctor before I knew what being a nurse was. And it was in a high school class that I recognized that was taught by a nurse that had been a nurse in the military that I really learned that nursing is what I wanted to be a part of. Because really what it comes down to is want to help people heal. I don't want to treat diseases, I want to help human beings heal. And so that's nursing. And so... I dedicated a lot of my life and career to figuring out how to work through all of the, if you've listened, all of the things that I saw, the loss that I saw, the challenges that I saw growing up, made the lack of control with death and with disease and with things that are very hard, really put, I think, deep into my soul, this desire to not ever feel like I was out of control. with what was going on, be able to have the answer. And so I decided critical care was the place that I wanted to invest my career. Critical care, wanted to be able to have the answers. I wanted to know what to do. And so in critical care, that's where patients go after they code. That's where patients go. They get whisked away if they have open heart surgery or they decompensate out on the floor and something goes wrong, they get sent to critical care. So we're the place that they get sent to. So we have to know what to do in all of those situations. And so I had the privilege, I've had the opportunity to take care of open heart patients. I've had the opportunity to take care of post-neurosurgery patients that have gone through all manner of horrendous kinds of trauma in their existence that led them to hospitalization. I was a part of the ECMO team being built at Kootenay. I was a part of the ECMO team actively at Sacred Heart. For those of you that aren't sure what ECMO is, I won't go too deeply into it, but ECMO is a E-C-M-O, it's an acronym, and basically, long story short, when either your heart and or your lungs are not functioning properly, it's the most advanced form of life support that exists currently on the planet to be able to sustain life when either heart and or lungs are not functioning. And so it uses a system of machines to be able to circulate blood volume and do the gas exchange. of oxygen and CO2 and be able to provide those needs that heart and lungs do while we're figuring out what we can do for patients. And so I've had this drive to be able to always have the answer, to be able to always, I didn't want to ever find myself, I don't know what to do now. And that has helped significantly over the years because then I've been able to do things like when I was in nursing school, I put two and two together that my grandma had heart failure. and my family wasn't aware of what heart failure was. They had never heard that term. And so being able to think through that helped that knowledge base. And then we were able to work through that. She didn't end up passing away from that as is a natural part of existence for people to live a long life and pass as they get older. But then through this experience that's gone on with my mom that I was mentioning, I was able to keep an eye on her lab work, I was able to keep an eye on things and know when I needed to be able to, hey, we need more hands on this, hey, we need more attention on this, hey, somebody needs to do something about this. And so I don't need to sit and be scared that I don't know what to do. No matter what the situation is, I know how to work through it. I've taken care of patients that have, I've worked through learning and being able to use my brain. to think through some of the most critical, terrifying, life-threatening situations that exist on the planet. So that has really helped me. Now, to answer the question that you mentioned, how it's changed the way I deal with medical concerns, so it's given me those tools. But as a nurse, when you're an ICU nurse and you have two patients and one codes, and no matter how traumatic or whatever that situation looks like, no matter how hard that situation is, you still have another patient. Mm-hmm. And you have to keep thinking and you have to keep working and you have to keep functioning. And that other patient, their care can't suffer because you went through something challenging in this other room. So you have to learn how to compartmentalize. You have to learn how to put up a wall to take care of yourself so that you can continue to exist in that space with purpose as a nurse. Mm-hmm. patients are relying on you. That other critical care patient, their care can't suffer. And so putting up those walls, what that has done for me is it means, and I've shared a little bit of this with my students, this rotation in being open and transparent about what I'm facing with my mom. That means that as a nurse, I default to not being emotional about the situation. I need to have my head on straight. And so as that nurse, then I'm not emotionally processing through what's going on. So that's been a very interesting thing. And I've talked to other nurses about how being a nurse has affected taking care of or seeing things go on with their family. And it's a very, it's a, almost makes you feel like an alien in your own body in the sense that, know, this really traumatic thing is going on, but you're not feeling it. You're just doing it. You're just going through the right motions. And so I just, I just want to put out there for nursing students that are figuring out that there's, it's, that's a defense mechanism. That's a survival mechanism in order to keep functioning as a nurse. There's a certain level of having to put those walls up. And so then it becomes so, so important for your wellbeing long-term, all of our wellbeing long-term to be able to find a way to access those emotions, to find a way to be able to work through those. Um, and and having those safe places and whether that means therapy, whether that means having a close network of friends, whether that means understanding what self-care means to you. It's so valuable and important that when you're facing some of those things and you're responding as a nurse, that's okay and that's healthy, but also recognize that it's also healthy for you to then give yourself space and have a safe space that you can learn to access those emotions in a healthy way so that it doesn't. just get buried deep inside you and end up coming out in ways that you don't want later down the love that you bring that up. I've talked many times about the serendipity of overlap. know what I mean? that either one honored guest that I sit with that day says and then the next one says something similar and it's all the things. You're the first honored guest of the day. yesterday we had our clinical. We were midway through our OB clinicals and I had a very wonderful student who was, let's just say their patient assignment. while totally manageable and all the things, had some sadness to it. Obviously in the OB world, it's mostly happy with a little bit of sadness. I think that ratio is still true. But that being said, when that sadness happens, it's sad. And I spoke with her before, we even started, hey, is this gonna be your, yeah, I think we'll be all right, great, wonderful. And so our job as clinical instructors, to correct me if I'm wrong, Katie, is not just to give you information. but hopefully the good ones that are caring for you and all the things. Hopefully we are all providing a safe space for you to be able to either debrief something that happens or whatever the case may be. And in this case, same thing. We went through the shift and I'm checking in on all the things, you know, I've got all the students that were and we're floating about and I get more steps in a day when I'm a clinical adjunct clinical instructor. I think that I do as a nurse to be perfectly honest and the shift is shorter. But anyway, I digress. And so end of the day, clinical conference. I, you know, again, hey, you know. But you're doing okay? Yeah, I'm doing great. And not a hint of any, like trying to hide it or stuff it down or anything like that. okay, all right, wonderful. I'm grateful for that. If you need anything, let me know. So then I come home, go on a date with the wife. And after the Mrs. and I have a wonderful time together, I come home. And when I go on a date, I like to leave the phone. I don't like to, just, whatever. We'll take a selfie. It's now our dating tradition. You have to have a selfie. And then I leave it. And so not a look at it. And I get home and about an hour and a half after this student had texted me, she said, hey, Eric. So I don't know why this is happening, but I got home. I got home and I'm thinking about what's going on. And it's is hitting me. I don't know why it's now. you know what I mean? And so I just, my heart, you know I mean? I'm going, oh my gosh, I wrote back. I'm like, I'm so sorry. And the way I phrased it, said, I wasn't wondering if it would happen. I was wondering when, because it will. If you're a human being and you're in this to care for people, you're going to feel those things. And so, you know, we had a little text debrief briefly last night and plan on calling her in between our two sessions today to make sure she's doing okay. But the long and the short of it is what I think kind of what we landed on too was like, well, the reason as to why. is because like what you're saying, she wasn't intentionally compartmentalizing, but you're busy, you're doing. And so she was doing, and she was focused and doing all the things and talking with her nurse she was with and so on and so forth. And we go through all the clinical conference and then you go home and then there's silence. And there's not that you're not doing anymore. And then the thoughts turn to the emotions come up and say, hey, and that's why I pointed out, the feelings are there. And she goes, do you have any advice? You know what I mean? And I said, I only have one bit of concrete advice, because I don't know you well enough to, you know, that's right, but the one piece of concrete advice is when those feelings come up, when it's appropriate, don't ignore them. Don't stuff them down. And when you're old enough, don't drink them away. Do not do any of those things. These are all very harmful because those feelings, what you're dealing with, that grief in a sense, or anticipatory grief, or unresolved grief, all of that will just wait. And it waits. They don't go away. They wait. And the more you shove it down, the more you push it away, student, it comes back stronger, it comes back harder, and in many ways, and I've seen it time and time again, more detrimentally. I don't wanna, I'm not trying to hijack your episode, Katie, but man, on that note, you also talk about wanting to talk about boundaries, self-care, and burnout. I just, I'm, whoop, gums are done flapping. And we're turning it back over to the star of the show, Miss Katie. So yeah, if you don't mind sharing a bit about that to us all. Yeah, absolutely. So starting with self care. And so that I think that understanding what makes you feel peace, understanding what you what makes you feel joy, understanding what makes you feel safe. Those are the things learning what those feel because those are different for every person. For some people, it's a bubble bath. For some people, it's a cold shower. For some people, it's curling up. For some people, it's going on a run. For some people, it's having some comfort food. There's so many ways. For some people, it's talking to a close friend. For some people, it's silence. It's not about the right thing. It's about what helps you feel peace, what helps you feel safe, what helps you feel comforted. So I encourage every one of you that's listening that either is in nursing school or is a human being, to sit and think about what are the things that make you feel safe, at peace, and comforted. And if you know some of those things and you rely on some of those things when you're having a hard time, because that's what your body needs, your body needs to know that you feel that you're safe. Your body needs to know that there is a way to feel comforted when you're facing some of those things. You need to know that there is a way to be able to feel some peace. And so heading into those emotions that it's okay that you're feeling those things. It's okay to feel sad. It's okay to feel angry. It's okay. Like feelings can't be wrong. Feelings exist. They just happen. Actions can be wrong, but feelings just exist. And so don't, don't vilify the feeling that you're having. Accept that you're having the feeling. Allow yourself the space to make peace with the fact that you're having those feelings and then do some things to take care of yourself. Do some things to help yourself feel safe in that moment. You may be really angry, maybe really frustrated and you need to reach out to somebody that's okay. Do those things. But give yourself like you're saying, Eric, feel, give yourself permission to feel the feeling. Don't try and stuff it down and deny it. And so to me, that's what self-care looks like. And it's all nice to be able to go to spa and go get your nails done and be able to go shopping or to do whatever those things are. And those can also be healing in their own way, but those are outward actions that you're taking. And so I think the more important part about self-care is identifying what situations and things can you do for yourself that help you feel, like I said, comforted, safe, and feel some peace. And so I think that will probably take you the farthest as a human being. Certainly things that I've had to learn about myself and nobody told me that when I was going through nursing school. Nobody told me that when I was going through some of the things that I've seen in life. It's things that I've had to figure out. And it's also really important in that part of self-care is having boundaries. And having boundaries are not about this is what I need from other people. Having boundaries are about this is what I need for me and this is the action that I'm going to take to prepare, like to take care of me. So a boundary looks like after I have a rough shift, I need to have some silence. And so if other people in your life or other situations or anything like that are pounding on that, it's about, I know that I need to have this for me. And so in order to have that, I'm gonna put that boundary first and I'm gonna make sure that I have that. So if somebody else insists on talking, then I'm gonna remove myself from the situation in order to maintain my boundary of needing quiet time. So having healthy boundaries, understanding how to take care of yourself, it's important to be able to keep hydrated, keep nourished, go to the bathroom when you need to, on shift. Like those seem silly, that's actually like, can't tell you how many times in the shift I've been busy with a patient and yeah, you don't get lunch. You don't take a break. You don't do these things because something else comes first. And those are all things that lead to burnout because those are not taking care of yourself and having boundaries around the care that you need to have to keep yourself safe. So. And those are things, I'm not some expert on it. talk like I'm some expert. I'm not an expert on it. These are things that I'm actively learning. And so it's easy to talk about them because they're things that I'm actively learning to do. It's not something that I'm perfect at. It's not something any of us are perfect at. We're human beings. But I think it's easier to be better at it the more we talk about it. And so that's why I wanted to bring it up. And that's why I wanted to get it out there because I think it's important to speak about those things, to understand boundaries, to understand what self-care looks like. And so, because without those things, then you will have burnout. you know, there's, burnout comes in different ways. Sometimes burnout looks like compassion fatigue, where it's hard to feel compassionate for patients. Sometimes burnout looks like not being able to maintain focus. Sometimes burnout looks like getting easily frustrated, easily flustered. There's a variety of different ways that burnout looks like. My personal experience with burnout with critical care, I never experienced compassion fatigue. It was almost the opposite. It was like, I was fatigued because of the level of compassion that I was feeling for the people that I was taking care of. And it was so heartbreaking to me to see these situations and I had so much compassion for them that it was wearing me out having that level of compassion, seeing, I made peace. kind of did my own exposure therapy with death after going through what I did growing up. Like critical care was almost like my own level of exposure therapy for death. Like, okay, I've helped. I mean, I've probably helped hundreds of patients over the years die with dignity. so death isn't scary to me. Death is not hard. Death is not, it's final and there's feelings with it and grief is valuable to work through. But the process of death isn't the hard part. The process for me that burned me out in working in critical care was not accepting death. When there's situations with patients where we're doing things to keep people alive. Being a patient in critical care is awful and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy because the things that are required in order to keep you alive are not comfortable, are not fun, they're not things that anybody wants to participate in. They're just what's necessary for survival. And so it's very hard to feel good about those things. so I needed, for many years in critical care, I felt like it was the right thing, it was the right choice. I could... help in the worst moments of people's lives and I could help people through that situation and it was so fulfilling for me and it filled my cup and it was great. And so there's a lot of value in that role. And then I got to a place where my heart is tired. I've been, you know, I've felt so much for so many patients for so long that I don't have the emotional, it's too hard for me to walk into the shift and take care of the 19 year old that was playing Russian roulette and blew his face off with a gun and then withdraw life support and help him die with peace and watch his mom and dad fall apart at the bedside. you know, somebody bleed to death after they were run over by a car and were trying to find their family and they're not there yet. And those kind of just like horrendous, traumatic, horrible things that people shouldn't have to see, living in those full time for over a decade took its toll and my heart is tired. And it's not tired from not having compassion, it's tired from having compassion. And so I had to figure out how to recognize that within myself. and be able to take a step away and figure out what I could do differently. And so I, in addition to being a Gonzaga adjunct faculty, clinical instructor, my other role right now is at the Spokane County Jail. And it sounds bizarre when I say it like this, but it's rainbows and unicorns there at the jail compared to being in critical care. Because instead of, right, But the patients there are all medically stable. If they're not, they go to the hospital. And they're dealing with the consequences of their own actions instead of dealing with somebody else that can't their head around what's going on. And it took them by surprise. And meanwhile, while the power of attorney is coping with it, we're having to basically torture their loved one to keep them alive. And that was just so hard for me. So being at the jail, It's a much more uplifting environment for me personally, and I can have good boundaries there with people. can, you know, and in how I respond and in how I connect. And I also feel like I still get to help people every day. And so there's a lot of value. And so it's been really refreshing for me and it's exactly what I need right now in my career. And so I just. wanted to talk through that, you know, there's so many things in nursing school in the nursing profession, whether you want to work on a cruise ship or whether you want to be a school nurse or whether you want to work in a hospital or in, you know, like there's, there's a million different roles that we can do in nursing. And that's what's so amazing is that the thing that fills your cup for a time, it's okay to then transition to something different and to continue to take care of yourself in the meantime, and you can still make a difference for people. So I just wanted to kind of talk through some of those things. So thanks for giving me that platform to be able to Eric. No, I appreciate that and I know the nursing students appreciate that and if you've heard any other episodes before you might have heard this. If not, you're gonna hear it for the first time and that's, mean again, back with the similarities or eerie, you know, I've made no bones about the fact, know, pediatric oncology, that was how I started in nursing and did that for 13 years. And I had a motto and my motto is always this, it was cry with those who cry, celebrate with those who celebrate and three, let it all out. And I figured as long as I did those three things that I could do that job indefinitely. And I just hearing you, hearing you say my heart is tired like that, I haven't heard it put that way. I always tell people like, and it turns out that the heart can only take what it can take. That's how I've always said it time and time again. I love the, my heart is tired. And that's exactly, that's exactly what happens. Your heart gets tired and you just reach a point where, and I guess that's where I'm gonna hammer it again, reflection isn't just for nursing students, it isn't just for nursing school. Reflect, continue to have reflection because you can have all of these things in place. I had again, supportive wife, loving support, self care, all the things, and you'll still reach a point where it becomes too much. without those things, I don't know, maybe I'd only been a peds onc nurse for. half a dozen years or less, you know what mean? Maybe I would have gotten into it and been like, ugh, ah, nevermind, I'm gone. I don't know. I don't think so. But the point is, those things I genuinely believe prolonged my career in that area. But for you, it's jail nursing that's refreshing you. That's your t-shirt. I keep thinking of these ideas of different honored guest t-shirts. I'm like, jail nursing is what refreshed me. That's not a sentence you ever expect to say in your life. For me, it was women's health, OB, postpartum specifically, which I never thought. Going into nursing school, that was not something that was on my radar. so I just know, dear nursing student and anyone listening in life, always, always, always make that safe space for yourself, process the feelings, but also continue to reflect and turn that, once you've processed feelings a bit, whether it's with the help of a counselor or just letting it out or talking to your best friend or whatever. Then take a little moment to then look inward and go, okay, was this, I feel like this is kind of within how I've been handling things? Is this how I, yeah, okay, great. And then you start realizing, oh no, I was kind of a little, I've been a little crabby lately with my family or crabby with my peers or whatever. Then you go, okay, well, there's a warning flag and all right, well, need to pay attention to that and always do that. So thank you, Katie, for bringing that up and talking about that super important subject. With that, we're gonna bring it around. I said it before and I'll say it again, I hate ending time with anybody. But with that, I know we still got a little bit more to talk about with the closing two questions. And that is, first of all, what were the three words that you chose way back in your first episode to describe nursing school and why did you choose them? great, unique. I chose, so the three words are unique, hard, and inspiring. And I chose unique because there's nothing else like nursing school. Other majors, those of you that are in nursing school, your other friends that are not nurses, the things that they're going through in school are not the things that you're going through in school. The things that you are seeing, the things that you are learning, the demands, it's unique. It's just its own unique field. It's a unique experience in school. There's not a lot of other opportunities in school where you see and do the things that nurses do. So, very unique. It's it's very demanding. I was kind of going back between hard and demanding. But hard, it's because it forces you to think in ways that you didn't used to think in. It forces you to evaluate things that you didn't used to evaluate. It pushes you to do things. There's so much to learn and integrate and figure out. It's hard. It's really, really difficult. And so is a career in nursing. It is really, really difficult. So it's preparing you for that on purpose, but hard things are worth doing. you know, because the outcome of doing those hard things is valuable. Like you, I don't think that you'll regret it. So it's hard. And then inspiring because whether I was inspired by nurses that I saw as preceptors and some of my preceptor experiences, whether, know, whatever the case was, whether it was any of the conversations that I had, whether it was my instructors, my clinical instructors, you know, lecture teachers, people that I saw in the clinical experience. You know, whatever that was, I was either inspired to understand this is what I definitely, I know that I don't ever want to be like this. So I'm going to rise to something better. I'm going to rise to something bigger. I'm not ever going to act like this, or this is exactly how I want to be when I grow up and be a nurse. And so either way, it inspired me, inspired me because I learned about things that I didn't realize existed. It inspired me, um, fields of nursing that I wasn't aware of perspectives that I wasn't aware of. There is a great deal of inspiration from so many different ways during nursing school. So those are the three words that I chose and why. Mm-hmm. And you inspired me. That's, again, I call this just a vanity project. Like, I like just sitting down and talking with people. And like, I know that if it inspires me, it's inspiring someone else, 100%. That being said, man, we've talked roughly an hour and a half, a little less than that right now. And there's been so much amazing things, so many, so much amazing things. Let's go grammarly, shall we? So many amazing things that anyone listening can take away. from our time together, from their time with you. That being said, there's that last closing question always, of course. If you have one thing that you would want a nursing student to take away from your episodes, listening to you, what would that thing be? Trust yourself. know, it's so many nursing students that I run into and I remember it being in nursing school, questioning yourself, wanting to be more confident, wanting to feel confident in your own shoes. You have intuition. You have knowledge. You know more than you think you do. I promise you know more than you think you do for everyone that's sitting here listening to this. So, I really encourage you to be purposeful about allowing that to flourish. Be purposeful about taking steps towards trusting the intuition that you have. Reflect back on that and use it as building blocks for your confidence to learn to trust in your own intuition. That is what will save lives. That is what is going to help guide you through your career. Learn to trust who you are. You're here for a reason. You chose nursing for a reason. Trust yourself. very well said. You And you bringing that up makes me think about too, like trust yourself, don't be afraid to be wrong. But I think the evidence of this too is of what you're saying, Katie, is when, I mean, how many times in your life, anyone who's listening, have you been in a situation where someone's asking for an answer to a question, whether it's an instructor, a teacher, somebody asking you something or a friend or whatever, and you like, Or, you know, asking a group of people. Excuse me, let me back up. It's not you specifically. They're asking a group of people. And you're like, oh, I think it's this. Yeah, but I'm not totally sure. So I'm not gonna, I don't want to bring it up if I'm wrong. Like, I don't want to. For whatever reason, you know, you're afraid to look stupid or you're just not, you know, who cares? Point is, and then they, someone else's like raised their hand and they're like, whoa, no, no, no, no, no. And you're like, yeah, I knew it. I knew that. And so how many times does that happen? I mean, maybe I'm the only one. Katie, has that ever happened to you? Yes. think it happens to everybody and that's the kind of purposeful steps I'm talking about. In those moments, use that as a way to tell yourself, I knew the right answer. I can trust myself. Give yourself that grace to say, I did know that. I can trust myself. Build that intuition. Nobody is right all the time. Not a one of us, not a single human being on the planet is right. Don't be afraid to be wrong. It's okay. Part of learning to trust yourself is recognizing the times that you're wrong. That's not a failure, that's a learning opportunity. Learning how to figure that out. So when you are correct, when that moment that you just beautifully stated and illustrated, when that does happen, use that as a tool to say, I can trust myself. Say that in your own mind. I can trust myself. And it starts to build that and recognize that if you're wrong, that's okay, that's a learning opportunity. It's not a failure. And it's through learning and growing and being open that you will learn over time to trust yourself more and And that's the evidence. That's the evidence right there of what you're talking about. In those moments, you're like, okay, yes, yes, yes, yes. And again, if you have it wrong, be bold about it. Just think it out, and if it's wrong, guess what? You weren't the only one that had that idea or a question, or you know what mean? You were gonna respond that way. Someone else was. And so, like you said, then you go, okay, well, I wasn't totally right on that one. But then the win from that is, okay, but I had the confidence to step up and give it a go. And you know what? Who cares if someone thinks I'm wrong? You guys, I can't even. So our last BSN orientation meeting, no joke, okay? I am north of 40, still south of 50, but not by much, but north of 40 years old. And there were like three or four of us sitting in our little whatever, and I don't remember what the situation was, but we were talking about something and somebody was like, I don't even really know, it might've been as trivial as what's the name of that movie, what's the name of this or that or the other. And the idea popped in my brain, but I wasn't 100 % confident. And even at my age, it was like I just hopped in a little time machine. all the way back to middle school and was like, I'm not confident enough to say that. And these are people that I respect. It's not like, and I knew they wouldn't like think less of me if I was wrong, but in that moment I couldn't spit it out. And then, know, somebody pulling up the Google on there like, oh, it's da da da da. And I went, dang it, I knew it. I knew I was right. And so again. This is something you get to play with your entire life. I'm looking forward to being between 50 and 60 years old when I'll be 100 % intuitive and accurate all the time, right? Like that's how that's supposed to work maybe? Nope! let me know if that happened. Yeah, I was gonna say let me know because that sounds amazing because I certainly am not there anytime soon. So it's a human condition. instructors, you guys. Your instructors are dealing at times with the same things you're dealing with. As much as we're all different, we're still very much similar. And the one way we're all similar is that we're human beings. Congratulations. That's part of being this amazing species. So Katie, one last curve ball for you. If anyone from the nursing education community, instructors or nurses for that matter, are listening to your episodes. I say if, but I know they are, some are. What's the one thing you would want them to take away from your episode? there's no way to measure the impact that they've That they have no doubt made a positive difference far bigger than they have any idea. Because sometimes the biggest changes that you make in people's lives, the biggest impact that you make, you don't ever hear about. I don't know that the clinical instructor that inspired me to like who I wanted to be when I grew up, that I wanted to, made me want to be a clinical instructor someday. I don't know if she knows that. I don't know if she knows how much she's inspired my life. And so there's always the goal of wanting to be able go back and share that, but in all reality, you just, there's no way to measure the impact that you've had. So if you're sitting and listening to this, you're doing what you're doing for a reason. And I guarantee you. that you have made a bigger positive influence, a bigger positive impact than you have any idea. So thank you. Amen. Hallelujah. The end. That's it. That's all that needs to be said. Katie, you're amazing. Thank you so much for giving up your afternoon. We did confirm this afternoon. Yes, we did. Thank you for giving up your afternoon to just impart wisdom by the truckload, really. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. was a pleasure and a great conversation. To you too.