114 - Maddie Depner: A Flair for the Dramatic

Join nursing student and Spokane, Washington native Honored Guest Maddie Depner as she discusses how being a theater kid helps her in nursing, the difficult transition from prereq student to nursing student, confidence, making the switch from learning mode to practicing mode, being a part of a brand new nursing program, the importance of asserting yourself, thriving using internal reflection, having an unreceptive nurse at clinical, what makes a good nurse, and more!

Contact us:
mystory@feedingouryoung.org to be featured on a future episode
q@feedingouryoung.org to send a question for possible inclusion in a future episode
thanks@feedingouryoung.org to send a note of appreciation to any of our honored guests - let them know how they touched you - I'll make sure they read your praises!
info@feedingouryoung.org to send any other inquiries
+1 509 ALL THEM (509-255-8436) text/voicemail line

Follow us:
@feedingouryoungllc Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube
@foyllc Twitter/X

Many thanks:
Jon Holland (Jomarkho - found on SoundCloud, Spotify, and the like) Music - intro/outro/sting composition
10com Web Development Logo and website design
Jeff Burton (88 Creative) Planting and watering the seeds to start this podcast

Transcript

0:02

Hello and welcome to a Saturday morning edition of Feeding Our Young. I say Saturday morning only because, you know, we could be watching Saturday morning cartoons, but we're not. Instead, we are sitting with an incredible human being. And in preparation of this, and knowing I would miss my Saturday morning cartoon time, my family and I watched some Looney Tunes last night. So, you know, we make sure that you carve out time for the important things in your life. like Looney Tunes. Anyway, enough about that. Let's not waste any more time and let's introduce today's honored guest, is Maddie. Maddie, how are you this morning? I'm having a great morning. I slept great last night. I did not watch any cartoons though. Probably. Yeah, not tortured by falling anvils and, know, wily coyotes, you know. Okay, so now, all right, now we're just gonna, I have to ask you this question, because that made me think of something else. Have you seen the movie Who Framed Roger Rabbit? I love the movie Who Framed Roger Rabbit. I love cartoons. Yes, yes, I knew it. knew it. was like, I know we're kindred spirits. I know we are. Although to say, mean, for everyone else it's gonna sound like it's coming out of that field, but I unfortunately have zero theater experience other than being dramatic every day of my life. But Maddie, rumor has it you might be a theater child, a child of theater. You're not even a child. A theater kid, you know what I mean? Tell us a little bit more about that. Yeah, I think a lot of people would say I have theater kid energy and I don't really know how to take that anymore. I was in theater in high school and I love the art. So I'm still a big time. go to local stuff in Spokane all the time. So that's what I do. I love it. And do you, let's just, let's turn this into a nursing discussion. I feel like that might be a good skill to have in the field of nursing. I genuinely, I think it set me up really well because it sort of forced me to be okay with like flying off the cuff a little bit. You know what I mean? Like to be with like fine by the seat of my pants. I'm, I feel like I'm really good at talking to patients because it's not hard for me to like improv what I'm say next, you know? Yeah, and also I feel like it's just nice because it gives you, it kind of teaches you how to talk like, in a way that is like clear and you know it's easy to it's easy to talk to other people when you've like it's not a performance but it is kind of a performance especially when you're delivering like you know information about their medications or something you know it's easy it's easy for me to slip back into that kind of like well of course this is your this is your own dance-a-tron this is you know you're so Fran you know so yeah Well, and I imagine it also allow you to interject a little bit of fun into your career. Do you see that being something that'll take place? Yeah, I have a hard time not being a comedian when presented the opportunity. I feel like I'm always there for the bit. And I do think that a lot of that came from me being in theater and like everything. I have a flair for the dramatic also. You know, I think that I love to be performative, I guess. You know what I mean? A little bit of drama spices things up, you know? most certainly. I tell my wife that every day. So, for me, not because of her, because of me, but no, no, no. No, that's fantastic. thank you for just, we're just gonna like jumping right into our hobbies. that's that. Let's pull this back around before I get too off the beaten path. What are three words, Maddie, that you would use to describe nursing school? Okay, I wrote them down. My three words are challenge, growth, and fulfillment. Challenge, Growth, and Fulfillment. Excited to hear why you picked those words at the end. But I'm kinda curious, from what perspective do you create these words? Are you already a nurse? Are you in nursing school? Have you been in nursing school? I am in my last semester of nursing school right now. I have a month left and I'm graduating in May. So that is crazy. one month left. in the meantime, man. that you're interviewing me now as I'm about to graduate and not me two years ago when I had just started. Like that's, I'm grateful for that. Okay, that's gonna be a great jumping off point here shortly. So before, we're gonna sidetrack for a second because listener, you're probably not gonna be able to hear it. But right now, we've got a beautiful kitty in the background, meowing and talking and trying to make herself known. So who is this beautiful cat and what's her name? is Selena. She's named after Tatwoman, Selena Kyle. And she's very needy. Yeah, she's into the microphone. Selena. Oh, look at it. She is just content to have you just hold her there. my gosh. Okay, so wait a second. I think she heard me having a conversation and was like, I need to be included in this. Yeah, yes, yeah. cat. she's definitely not the first cat nor the first pet to make it on the podcast. And in fact, at the very end of every episode, if people listen that long past my wife's little outro, what I call the outro, and she's given all the info on how to contact us and all the things. then you listen as the music fades. And the very last thing is kind of our unofficial mascot, Cleo. One of our cats was in the bedroom the very first time she recorded that outro. and she made this weird like meowing and I'm like, no, I'm gonna put that at end of every episode. So she is at the end of every episode. Little Cleo and now we have Selena. All right, enough of we've just rabbit trailed all over the place. I don't care. The other nice opening question I like to ask just to get a kind of a glimpse into who you are. What are three of your favorite songs in life right now? Okay, my three favorite songs. I could pick the widespread here, okay? I will by The Beatles, Slide by The Goo Goo Dolls, and then Juno by Sabrina Carpenter. That runs the gamut. Oh my gosh. I love it. I love it. It is. And that's, but it's important, right? And it just depends kind of, I'd imagine, like on what mood you're in or what you're feeling in that moment. I love music and I listen to a lot of it and I was really struggling because I was like, I can't pick three songs that have the same vibe. I can't do that. So. haven't picked my own three. People are like, okay, I need to know what your three are. And so when I get that running list or the running list, the Spotify, Feeding Our Young, you know, music list, the first three songs will be my first three songs. And I'm such an a-hole for asking this question to people because I'm like, I cannot narrow my list down to three. And I'm like, so I'm still working on it. It's a work in progress. All right. Now, you've agreed to take the following exam amidst all your other exams being almost done with nursing school. I have a brief... Maybe because this one's slightly more fun. Okay, so the unofficial patent pending, just kidding, feeding our young personality quiz. I've warned Maddie about this. She's agreed to do it. But Maddie, you've not heard these questions yet, correct? All right. So let's find out what kind of person you are. Are you ready? Okay. And you can add these are these can be rapid fire. You can give just an answer or you can give rationale if you want. All right. Would you rather instantly learn a new language or instrument? would instantly learn a new instrument. Are you team pie or team cake? I hate pie. Pie is so... This is a textural nightmare. I have to come forward with my truth about this. is like genuinely I hate pie. It's awful. It's like the worst kind of dessert because it's just the crust is so good, but the filling is always texturally a nightmare. then the filling touches the crust and that's a textural nightmare too. It's bad. It's always bad. Okay, just when you're eating like a dinner plate, are your portions or whatever different food stuffs like not touching each other? I hate it when my food touches. I'm not a picky eater at all, that is my one... I want it to all be partition. You know what I mean? I'll eat anything, it just can't be touching anything else. Maddie is very passionate about her pie and her food not touching. I love it. I love it. Well, okay. No, I'm gonna ask a follow-up question and this might have to be, because I'm waiting until the very first, like, this very first segment airs and when this very first segment airs, everyone I record with from that point forward will get different questions. So now you've just sparked in me the first of the next five questions. So this will be a preview for anyone who's listening to Maddie's episode. So now what I wanna know is when you eat your food, Do you eat different stuff at a time and circle back around? Or do you have to finish one, like the vegetables first and then the potatoes second or whatever? Okay. over. It's not one at a time. It's it's but it just has to all be separate. And I do like sauces. And I feel like sauces are sauces and condiments are like a weird like caveat to this. Because you I will I like enjoy to I enjoy dipping. It's just I want to be in charge of you know, or like, yes, exactly. Like, you know what I hate? I hate baked beans. on a big dinner plate because the juice gets everywhere. It's so, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No touching. Mm-mm. Yeah. to the actual unofficial personality test. We've already learned, I think, everything we needed to know, really, at that point. I feel like it's pretty easy to get a good sense of the kind of person I am just from not alone. people have tuned out. Some people are like, nope, I'm done, nope, sorry. Or there are others that like, I really have to hear what she has to say because food isn't allowed to touch. Okay. Yes you are. And of sanity. Anyway, would you rather have the ability to breathe underwater or fly? Mmm, I would rather be able to fly. is Wham's song titled Last Christmas actually a Christmas song. Yes, and it's not only just a Christmas song, it's the best Christmas song. It's my favorite Christmas song. And covers of it are always good. Like the original is good, but the covers are also good. so you had me halfway through. This has been a great time together, Maddie. I hope you have a great rest of your morning. This was a wonderful time. I'll air whatever we did up to this point. Swift's cover of Wham's Last Christmas is good and I'm happy to... I'll listen to all iterations of Last Christmas. I think it's all good. But in the meantime, this is the downside to not having video podcast if anyone could have seen my face because as soon she said It's the best Christmas song. I'm like like my gosh, like nobody's ever said that before in my life. It's fantastic Okay, and the last question you've been gifted a time machine. Are you gonna go back in time? Are you gonna go see the future? Um, I'm to go back in time. I feel like it's, I feel like there's a reason that we can't see the future. Oh, nice, nice. And that's it. The results are in, Maddie, and you are amazing. Go figure. All right. That's it. That concludes the one silly segment we have as a consistent thing here in our Feeding Our Young podcast. So enough with the babbling and all the things, even though all of that was very important. Let's talk nursing, shall we? I think that's probably why people are here, so I might as well give them what they want. With that being said, let's lead off with what you said. I'm gonna piggyback off what you said. you're like, I'm really glad that you're talking to me now with one month left as opposed to the me starting this adventure. You know what I mean? Why? Why is it better to talk to the Maddie of now than the Maddie of then? Oh, I'm just so much more adjusted to the chaos of being a nurse or being a nursing student. I just, you know, I feel like it's really, really hard. It's such a difficult transition from like normal prerequisite student to nursing student. And I did not handle it well. And I don't feel, yeah, I feel like I just wouldn't have had as much good insight because I would have been like, on fire, you know? So I still definitely feel like my life is on fire sometimes, but I feel like I'm just way more equipped to handle it now. I'm like, yeah, it's always on fire, okay? Yeah. Yeah. being a Washingtonian all my life. It's like when you're outside in the spring and gets, you know, the highs are like 60s, 70s, and then you hit summer, at least here in Spokane, and man, you can get 90s or 100s. And at first you're like, this is miserable. And then as time goes on, you're like, okay, I'm getting kind of used to it. Maybe it's kind of like that, yeah? it's exactly like that. Yeah, I would say I've just adjusted to, I mean, I feel like even nursing is just a really chaotic profession and there's just always a lot going on. And I think that like half the battle of nursing school is like learning how to adjust to and survive in that environment, you know, or like how to like become a player in an environment that already has so many moving pieces. Yeah. So, so in summation, when you enter nursing school, you're always on fire. But at first you're screaming more. And then by the end, you're like, this is fire's not so bad. I can handle this. bad. Fire's cool. I actually kind of like the fire. It kind of like, kind of brings a purpose out in me. Well, okay, and on that subject then. So, you know, you have some topics that you'd like to chat about and I'm very excited to kind of unpack those. I'm trying to, you know, I'm a reformed learning my way podcast host, meaning I'm trying not to be so formulaic. So I don't want to go through kind of my normal progression. So we're going to jump into one of those topics that you wanted to talk about. Cause I feel like that lends itself to the subject of confidence. You have a lot you want to share about that. So I'm going to stop flapping my gums. I'm going to shut my mouth. and let you take over. What do you want to tell other nursing students and listening audience about confidence? I just want to tell other nursing students that it is that everybody feels like they don't know everything, you know? I think that it can be really, really hard to go to clinical and sometimes like you, sometimes it's just busy and it can be hard to feel like you're learning or being helpful or like, know what you're, you know, like what you're supposed to do. And I just, when you get to that point, I think it's so important to just ask because you have to know what you don't know in order to learn it. You know? I feel like it's really. It's really, really, really hard to, I just did my practicum for, for reference for all of this. just, I just finished up my practicum hours. I was actually on labor and delivery at the hospital that you work at, um, on night shifts. Uh, and for those first couple of weeks, it was a, an interesting perspective that I had never had before, because when you're a practicum student, you kind of get more. responsibilities than you do when you're just like a normal on a normal clinical rotation since you're there. You're there two nights a week for like two months, you know, so the nurses there kind of get to know you a little bit and then they kind of want to help you on your way, I guess, you know, but those first couple nights that I was there, it was a hard adjustment because I realized I was like, oh, I've never been an actual participant in something like this. I've always been an observer. And so it can be hard finding or like, you know, it can be hard to know, to have confidence in what you do know. So for the first like birth that I saw for like at clinical, for lack of a better word, I was surprised because one of the doctors asked me to help find the baby's heart rate on the monitor while mom was pushing. And I was like, I don't know how to do that. Even though I've done that before dozens of times. So I was like, I don't know how to do it. I was like, I'm a nursing student. Nobody talks to me when things are happening. I stand in the corner like this. This is my job. I don't leave here. Yeah, yeah. that I think that honestly gave me, you know, because instead of being like, I don't know how to do that, I was like, I took a breath and I was like, I do know how to do that. And so I just started trying and then I found it and I was like, oh, that wasn't as hard as I thought it was going to be. And from that point, it gave me sort of a stepping stone to whenever big things started happening, whenever big nursing events started happening, I was like, I can actually be a participant. I don't have to just stand there and observe. I can actually do the things that I know how to do. I even got to start an IV on a precipitous delivery. Yes, it was very fast. The whole thing was very fast. She rolled in at like six or seven centimeters of dilation already and she was very uncomfortable and then, and then it was like 15 minutes later, baby was out and I got to start that ID and it was so cool. But like, I knew how to do that. And so even doing it under pressure, even though that was scary, it was something that I was like, yeah, I do know how to do this. I like, I can, I can be involved even in urgent situations, you know? yeah. Even though I'm not graduated, even though I don't know everything, I can have a part in this. So yeah. that is a confidence that is needed. And what you're saying, I mean, I take it to the next step. Nursing students, including Maddie, when you graduate, what do you become? Once you sit for the NCLEX and you pass the NCLEX, what do you become? The answer is a registered nurse. And you are the one doing what you're doing. And so you have to have at least some level of confidence to be able to otherwise... You know, you're gonna be crippled, gonna, you can't do, you'll be, your ability to take care of your patients will be just completely arrested. It'll be crippled, it'll be stopped, it'll be, you know what mean? So obviously you have to reach that point at some point early in your career. So why not start earlier than that, right, Maddie? Like you're saying like, hey, even in my practicum, here I am, I'm like, I don't know how to do that. And then you have this moment where you're like, wait a second. I do know how to do this. I've done it before. Is this just a different situation? It's like switching the brain from, I'm just in learning mode. I'm just, unquote, a nursing student. Yes, at a certain point you have to go from being in learning mode to being in practicing mode and like, especially, and let's talk about starting IVs because while I got so much experience starting IVs while I was on labor and delivery, even though I had literally never done it before, but I knew the theory because we talked about it. We, know, we had learned it in school. And so I watched my nurse do one and then she let me do the next one and just stood over my shoulder and gave me advice basically and told me what to do. And then after that I was like, oh, I understand because I had like, I'd already learned the theory. I'd already done it once. Now it was just time to like put it into place. It's like, and then after that I was like, you know, you have to start, you have to start asserting yourself in, especially in clinical. it's good to be assertive and to say, I do know how to do that and I would like to try again. Like I need the practice. So after that, all of the nurses, whenever they had IV starts, let me try, you know, they would let me try it. And even if you mess up, it's okay, you have to keep trying. Like you have to keep practicing to get any better at anything. But I feel like it can be really hard and it can sort of stymie your confidence a little bit if you don't do it perfect. You're never going to do anything perfect. You have to do it anyway. 100 % Oh, you're preaching it. can't I can't agree with you anymore Also You have to have that level of confidence, you have to get to that point, and you will never ever be perfect. That goes, ironically, circling all back around to the very first honored guest. know, her episode was titled Perfectionist No More, and how nursing school beats the perfectionist out of you, really, because you can't. does. Yeah, you can't be perfect. But I love that you brought up practicum and kind of to a lesser extent clinicals. So I know that was another thing you wanted to talk about. So talk to us about clinicals. Whatever it is you wanted to share, what was that like for you? Yeah. Yeah, clinicals for me have been interesting, have always been interesting. am at Eastern Washington University's nursing program, which is brand new. And I'm part of the first cohort through it, which is super cool. But it does mean that I came onto the scene at a point where a lot of people were like not ready to trust because I guess, I don't know, Gonzaga students and WSU students and SFCC students, well, they've been having clinical rotations at these sites for years now. so it can, you know, and that curriculum has been there for years now. Like it always changes, but they have relationships with those schools already. So it was interesting for me coming from Eastern because I was not, you know, coming from a different... and very new program that nurses maybe didn't trust as much or didn't have that relationship to yet. You know, so and I had a lot of interesting experiences with other clinical students where they would ask us, you know, things about like their classes that we just hadn't gotten to yet because our, you know, our curriculum is different. It's set up differently. Like They're learning things in their first year that I wouldn't learn until this semester. You know, they're learning things about critical care in their second semester that I haven't learned until just now for my fourth semester. I'm about to graduate. So. Yeah, yes, exactly. working their way through how do we make our nursing program and how do we, and so then yeah, there's constant changes, right? So. Yes, but the thing that was really important that my teachers have set up for us was they really wanted us to be able to participate in clinicals like no matter what. So we got a good dose of like a good dose of clinical knowledge at the beginning of every semester before we went just so that we would be able to participate and be able to give meds and know what meds we were giving. you know. Regular cares that happen on the kinds of floors that we were going to be on and regular problems that we were run into and you know, they gave us a good dose of all of that. Just to like help us out, but. It can still feel like you don't have enough preparation and it will probably continue to feel like you don't have enough preparation until you graduate. I took my entire my entire course load last semester was. Like was obstetrics and mom/baby and labor and delivery. And I still got to the floor and I still was like, I have no idea what is going on. But I am a firm believer that clinical is what you make of it. And that if you want to have good experiences, you need to be able to ask for them and to put yourself into them. And you have to be willing to sort of humble yourself also and say I don't know what to do but I would like you to you know talk to your preceptor and be like I don't know what to do here but I would love to know I would love to know what I'm supposed to do and how I'm supposed to do it. In order to do that you have to kind of ask you have to kind of be willing to assert yourself and put yourself in that you know into that position where you're allowed to do the things that you want to learn how to do. That d- just feel like you have to, I feel like you have to be sort of a, own captain when you go to clinicals in a way. Like you have to be able to stand up for yourself and give yourself the experiences that you want. So. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I love that because, and like what you said earlier, there's that old cliche, right? You get out of it what you put into it, but that's basically what you're saying. You know what I mean? And I tell my students, don't be nursing student Eric. I've said it before, I'll say it again. Don't be nursing student Eric. Nursing student Eric was a timid little bunny and sat in the corner and only did things when he was forced to. And you know what I mean? And you have no better time in your learning career or in your future career to learn how to do something, then to do it then under somebody else's license with somebody else's experience backing you up. put somebody else's NG tube in. I know it's scary. Do it anyway. Like, please do it. It's good for you. Because in two years when you're on a med search floor and you're expected to do it, there, of course, there are going to be people that are going to help you, but they're also going to expect you to have done it at least once before and not on a mannequin. They're going to be like, you know, there will be people that will always, there are always going to be people that will help you. But it's good for you to come from a place of having already done it once before. I believe that wholeheartedly. I did so many things on labor and delivery that I had never done before and my, you know, and I was just like, I don't, I don't even know what's going, you know, but it's, it was good for me because the next time, you know, the next time somebody said, have you heard about this before? Do you know what I was able to be like, yeah, I've had experience with it. It's been a while, but I've done it, you know? Yeah, so. and and that's just it. Even if you know you're going into a clinical opportunity that is a field that you don't wanna practice in, and maybe it's even confirmed for you while you're there. I always say keep an open mind, maybe you like it, who knows. But if you're like, no, I definitely know, like me, ER, I knew, no, this is not for me. But while you're still there, advocate for yourself like Maddie's saying, ask for those opportunities, and don't be afraid to step up to do some of those skills, even if you're like, hmm, I don't need that skill going to where I want to go. A, you don't necessarily know that's where you're headed. But B, and more importantly, the more times you do that, it builds a level of confidence, right? Maddie, I think that circles back around to what you were saying about talking to the Maddie of now, as opposed to the Maddie of two years ago, right? Yeah, when I first started clinical, I was scared to do anything at all, which is funny because a lot of like we started our we started our first semester was like geriatric care. And so we went to like nursing homes, which is, again, like so such low stakes as far as like taking care of people goes like there's I mean, it is high stakes because like there's you know, there's like pressure wounds to think about and like yeah. nutrition and like, you know, choking hazards and, you know, ADLs, all these things to think about, but it's not acute care. It's not acute care. It's like long-term care and it's different. And most of these patients are kind of at where they're going to be. It's not like you're trying to prevent a disease or treat a disease, you know what mean, or something along those lines. point, you're treating, you're mostly maintaining symptoms and and comfort and like making sure that people can still live like fulfilling, you know, lives, which is nice. It wasn't for me, but it was nice to learn about. But even then, I was still scared to like be involved in like, you know, I don't know, like a like a. like a change, you know I mean? Like changing the patient is something that I was still like, I don't know, I'm just, this is my first time. Like if you've ever changed a baby before, you kind of know what you're doing. But you know what I mean? It's like even stuff that was low stakes like that, I was still so freaked out about. And I was still like, I don't know what I'm doing. There just gets to, you just have to trust yourself at a point that. you're still learning and you're still practicing and that it's okay to not know exactly what you're doing the first time that you do it. As long as you're doing it, especially with supervision and you should never be without supervision when you're a clinical student. So yeah, it's great. It's such a great way to learn. It is. And I feel like there's another topic, this goes right hand in hand with another topic you wanted to talk about. And whether or not you've covered it all, let me know. But you also wanted to talk about how to thrive. Yes, how to thrive at clinical. I think that thriving at clinical has a lot to do with internal reflection. think that you can make your own clinical day good or bad based on how you think about it, right? Because even if you have a day where you feel unhelpful the whole day and you don't get to do any skills and you don't get to pass any meds and you feel like you're just standing around on the unit the whole day long, you probably still saw a lot of good nursing in action. You probably still saw a lot of good examples and like, uh, like for example, I went to the Holy family ER one time and I was hanging out there and this was still very early, very fresh in my nursing, in my nursing. I don't want to say career because I'm not even graduated yet, but it was still very early. know, I was still very, very fresh to nursing school and I didn't do anything all day long except follow my nurse around. I didn't start any IVs. I didn't pass any meds. I just kind of watched. And at the end of the day, I was debriefing with my mom who's also a nurse. And I was like, I'm just so frustrated. I'm frustrated with myself. I feel like I didn't. I feel like I didn't advocate for myself at all. I feel like I was too scared to do anything. was, you know, I felt so unsure of myself. And so like, I didn't know what to do. And she just asked me, she was like, well, what did your nurse do? She was like, what did your nurse do all day long? And I thought about it and I was like, well, I watched my nurse admit people and, and give meds and use appropriate time management. And you know, I watched her prioritize. like cares and when to give them and who to give them to and like what was important. And I watched her do an initial assessment on a patient who had respiratory issues. And I watched like how that immediately took precedence over everything else that we were doing because ABCs, know, and upon some reflection, I realized that I would, had seen. I had seen my nurse putting into action this entire clinical judgment, this entire skill of clinical judgment that we had been talking about at school and learning about. And I hadn't even realized it, but she was also making me do it with her. You know what I mean? And so after thinking about that day, I realized that I had walked away with a lot of good knowledge, even if I felt like I didn't get to do anything. Sometimes it is also okay to just be an observer and to just watch things. You can do both is what I'm saying. I believe that you have to advocate for yourself, but I believe that you also need to know when it's okay to just sit back and watch. ERs can be hard to be a nursing student in, especially a brand new nursing student. Mm-hmm. But even on days where you feel like you're not getting as much as you could be out of the day, it's up to you to find the like to find the silver lining, you know, to find the thing that you're going to take away from your day. I think that it's so important when you're at clinical to walk away with something that you're going to take away from your clinical day. And that day I took away useful clinical judgment and clinical reasoning, even if I didn't get to do it myself. I still got to see it happen. So, yeah. I love that perspective because, you know, I mean, how many times does a nursing student say, I didn't get to do a lot today. And so let me for a for a brief second here. And this is not to call Maddie out. Hey, Maddie, as of today, how many episodes of the podcast Feeding Our Young have you personally listened to? Zero. And again, not calling her out. But the reason why I bring that out good friend Jen was just on this podcast and I don't even know if her episode is out. I haven't even checked. So. And we've talked about this before. I always ask that of my honored guests because I'm like, you know what mean? Then I know if they know kind of how the flow goes or anything like that. But the running gag is I just needed to know whether or not I needed to judge you. But no, just kidding, so kidding. But the reason why I brought that up is because you hit that point of reflection home. And anyone who heard that is like, oh, of course she says that. Eric says it all the time. No, she's not heard me say it once. So, neener neener. No, but that's the, and I'm always, always almost to the point, like, I've become that instructor where, you you know those instructors that have like that one thing that they hang their hat on and they're like, you always, if you don't get anything else, get this from my clinicals and da da da da da. And they make it almost, they belabor it so much that you're like, yes, I've heard this before. Yeah. get nothing else from my podcast episode, I want you to get that you should be thinking about your day. Like I want you to get that you should be reflecting on what you're actually going to take away from your day at clinical. That is so important. It's going to be so important for continuing to be in school. I think that that is even, you know, I would go so far as to say that thinking about what you. Like reflecting on what you actually learned at clinical, even if you didn't do anything, is going to make you a better student. It's just, you know, that's what I think. And a better nurse, yes. going to record you saying that. I'm going to put that on my phone so that now my future students, instead of having to hear me say it, every once in I'll just throw Maddie's voice out there. I'll see if I get somebody else's. We'll be like, boom. Just like, we'll hit it from a different angle. And I had no idea that I say that all the freaking time. No. And it is that important. Even if, like you said, that first moment for you was your mom. It was a mom-induced. self-reflection, but your mom asks the all-important question, well, what did you do? You know what mean? And then you were able to say, oh, actually I did this, and she did this, and she did this, and I saw this, and I did this, and oh, I guess it wasn't a complete waste of a day. You know what I mean? Like it's, I'm over-summarizing, but right? really, if you really feel like you have no knowledge, if you really feel like there's nothing you can do in it, if you genuinely feel like there's nothing else that you can do in clinical, the best thing to do is shut up and watch your nurse and watch what they do and watch and try to think how they're thinking. That is, or even ask them, I've asked plenty of my preceptors, what, why did you decide to do that? What were you thinking in that moment? Like, What did you decide to prioritize? Even just talking about that with your preceptor can be so valuable because it can teach you things that you didn't think to even think to think of, you know? Yeah. was the thought process behind your action there? Yeah. And I think that's why some nurses, honestly, I think that's why some nurses don't like having nursing students or give that air of not liking having you. Because it's not a, some may take it as you're questioning, know, obviously you're doing this in a respectful manner, but some of them may take it as, my gosh, they're questioning why I did it the way I did it. And sometimes, you know, if you don't have a self-confident nurse, then some nurses may look at that as like, I'm doing it the right way though, like why would they ask me that? So ignore all of that. Their response to your questioning, if done respectfully, is not your burden to bear. If that's a lack of a term, right? I think that that's and I think that that brings me to another great point, which is that you can't let having a nurse that doesn't really seem interested in teaching you ruin your whole day. I did an rotation that was a really hard day for me because I had a nurse who at the start of the day when she was assigned to me wanted nothing to do with me and basically told me as much and I was not allowed to help with I asked plenty of times if I could help with you know help with like cares or like turning the patient or you know and I was just not allowed and then I was told yes and then I was told that it's because nurses are just very protective of their patients. And then I spent about four hours of my day in this patient's chart and she had a very complicated medical history. So that's still good experience, right? I was still like, you know what? I'm still, getting in the chart. I'm learning about how doctors talk. I'm still learning about like, you know, how all of these diagnoses are interacting. Like this is still good knowledge. And then I was like, okay, well, I've been reading for four hours, so I should take a break. So I told my nurse that I was going to go on lunch and I realized that I had forgotten something at my desk and I came back to grab it and I overheard her, my nurse talking to the RT about me and she was calling me incompetent. And yeah, it was, and it was so crushing. was so defeating. was, that's the worst experience I'd ever had at nursing school. And I, Being the person that I am, I reacted very quickly and very emotionally and freaked out and ran away to the cafeteria. And I was just like, I don't know if I can go back. I don't know what to do. Like, do I have to go back and talk to this nurse and confront her? like, because I think that being a nursing student can sort of give you that mentality where you're like, okay, being like, you're okay with being told no all day. Which is, but that can also make it so that when you are told no all day long and it's maybe not appropriate, you know, like maybe you're really not being allowed to do anything that you're sort of like, maybe I like, maybe I am a problem, you know, maybe I am the problem right now. That was a, that was a really hard day for me. Um, And I called my mom again because I love my mom so much. Let's, yeah, I love my mom so much. Shout out to my mom, the best nurse ever, the reason that I am involved in nursing truly. But she told me to talk to my faculty and to just be honest about what had been happening all day long and ask what he thought about it. And so I contacted my actual school faculty. and told him what had happened. And I was just honest. And I was just like, I feel like I've been being put in a corner all day long. And it's been really, really hard. And I know I like I was like, I don't think that I can be with this nurse anymore, because I don't I was like, I'm not learning. I was like, I'm not going to be able to learn. And I only have so many days here. And he ended up just walking. me through the unit for the rest of the day and teaching me everything that he could about every individual patient. And it ended up being an okay day that I got good experience out of, but that initial, that initial encounter was just so defeating. And I was just like, maybe I'm not even cut out for this. Like maybe she's right. And I'm not competent enough to be here. That can be really hard. then later, after, you know, doing some more clinical days and getting some more experience experiences, I realized that so much of my I was taking my nurses to be frank, bad attitude about having a student and making it my fault. And you can't you just can't do that. Some days they're going to be nurses that don't that would rather have not not have a student. But we are all a community and they have an obligation to teach you as much as you have an obligation to learn from them. You know, like we owe that to each other because that's how they learned to like that's the thing. That's the thing they say you I know that they tell preceptors to remember when they were students. Sometimes that's harder because it was long a long time ago. But They learned the same way that you're learning. And so you can't them having like a bad attitude about having a student. Like you can't let that be your fault. You can't take that home with you. You have to leave that at the door too. And I'm going to take that to springboard also to talk to my fellow nurses, especially having been in the business for long enough that, you know, I was becoming a cantankerous, bitty nurse and starting to go down that road ever so briefly enough to go, whoa, I don't want to be that. But to my fellow nurses, like you just heard right there. This is why I'm passionate about the Feeding Our Young movement, why I'm passionate about this podcast, why I'm passionate about nursing students talking to nursing students, because Yeah, okay, you had a bad day, whatever the case may be, you thought that the nursing student left and you talk about them behind their back. I mean, let's not even talk about the middle school behavior that that represents. But, because there's no excuse for that. There's absolutely none. I don't care. Yeah, but, very much so. But the I want to say about that though too, is that this is why so many, like we need nurses. Ergo, we need nursing students. Ergo, we're all human. Ergo, add those things together. This is nursing math. Mm-hmm. We nursing students have enough voices in their head doubting themselves, their own voice, other people's voices, whatever the case may be. We all do. Don't, fellow nurse, add your voice to that list. Don't be the one that they get to hear for the rest of their life going, you know what I mean? Just please don't. Don't do that. There was a very serious week after that where I was like, should I quit nursing school? like that sounds, it sounds dramatic. We talked at the top of this episode, how I have a flare for the dramatic, but you have to understand that in the context of like, I already feel like I don't know anything. And then having that confirmed by an outside source who's already been a nurse for 25, 30 years, I should just go home. It's like, you know, I should just go home. I... to flip burgers, that's for sure. You know what I mean? Or whatever. No offense to anybody out there that flips burgers. This piggyback's right into the last thing you wanted to make sure you talked about. And that was what makes a good nurse? What are you looking up to when you see a good nurse, Maddie? What is that that you wanted to share? am really lucky because I have a lot of nurses in my personal life. My mom is a nurse. Her best friend is a nurse. Her best friend has been on this podcast. And I just like a lot of people in my family are nurses. A lot of my, you know, a lot of the adults in my life when I was growing up were nurses or doctors. The thing that I have always looked up to in my mom was her determination. My mom is so resilient. My mom was a bartender for 19 years and then decided that she wanted to be a nurse. So she just went to school and became a nurse when I was like 12, which is crazy. That's crazy that she did that. But that's just the kind of lady that my mom is. And that really shows to me that anybody, any kind of person can be a nurse and a good one at that any kind of person. as long as they have that, like, you have to have that, like, fire in you a little bit. You have to be a resilient, like, fiery kind of person to be able to find a good place in this, you know, in this career, you know? So I feel like good nurses are resilient. They don't let bad days be their downfall. They don't let, you know, not knowing the right thing at the right time. You know, we're all human. We're all going to make mistakes and we're already dealing with some of the toughest, some of the toughest. It's hard to be a nurse. It's hard to see patients. You are constantly dealing with people that are sick and you have to rectify that your own way. But if you have strong inner resilience, I feel like I feel like it's easy, not easy, but like I feel like it's possible. You can get to a good place. I also feel like good nurses are very compassionate. I, for a long time, was scared that I wouldn't be a good nurse because I am too...feely. I'm too emotional. My mom, love her to death, but when I was a little bit younger, when I was in high school and thinking maybe nursing, she was like, I feel like you'd, you know, she's like, you'd have to get better about getting too attached to your patients. And I reflected on that for a long time. And then just, I have sort of come to my own conclusion about that, which is that I think that if you're going to avoid doing something hard where you have to take care of people like this, the way that you do, I feel like it's better to be compassionate and empathetic than it is to not. It's like, it's better to care about real people and their lives and the outcomes, the cares that you're giving them than it is to not. I think that that makes you genuinely, I think that that makes you a better nurse than it does a worse one. I think it makes it harder, but I think it makes your practice better. And I think that, yeah, I think that that's okay. Then also humility, I feel like is a very big, I, that's something that I really look up to when I, my, my preceptor at, my most recent preceptor for my practicum was so great because she was also kind of a newer nurse and she was very, very honest when she was like, I don't, she was like, I'm going to consult with other with the doctors, with the nurses. She was always very, very upfront with me when she was like, I'm not sure what to do here. And I think that that is so great. It's like, it's good to be honest about where you're coming from in nursing and that requires a certain level of humility because you have to sort of be able to be like, Oh, I'm not sure. You know, I'm not sure. I don't know that, but it's always better to say you don't know and get a good answer than it is to think that, you know, do something wrong and create an that outcome for somebody that I would rather I would 100 % rather be with a nurse that's willing to say that she doesn't know something when she doesn't know it then a nurse who's going to pretend like she does and then yeah and then and then you have I don't know then you have a dead patient on your hands or something you don't want that you don't want that you said, worse outcomes. We're trying to avoid all that for sure. No, that's amazing. I love those qualities of what make a good nurse. That's fantastic, Maddie. I love the wisdom that you have brought today. I hate to shut the wisdom faucet off, so before we shut the wisdom faucet off, there's a little bit more to come out of it, and we'll circle back around to those three words. You just used three words to describe great nurses to look up to. So you kind of have a bonus three words, I love that. But what were the three words you used to describe nursing school and why did you pick those? I picked challenge, growth, and fulfillment, and I sort of put them in that order on purpose because this was my experience. This has been my experience with nursing school. It is a challenge. It's a change because you go and you are presented with an entirely new way of thinking and you have to rewire your brain to think that way. And it's hard. It's really challenging. And then you have growth. because you have to take what you're learning and reflect on it and integrate it into yourself. that, whatever you say about nursing school, you're going to walk out of that door a different person than you were when you came in. And I am really fortunate. I love the person that I've become because of nursing school. I have grown so much more confident and assured in myself and you know ready to walk into like an adult world if you will like I'm ready to I'm ready to join a career field now and I would not have said that two years ago. And then fulfillment because I think that for me specifically nursing school has been the most fulfilling thing that I've ever done in my life. It has Created a community for me in a way that I never would have expected from any other job. I have made so many friends. I have met so many people. I've seen so many so many interesting perspectives on life and taking care of other people and what we owe to each other and how to be a nurse and be a person outside of being a nurse and how to not talk about nursing all the time, even though even though I think it's amazing and I do want to talk about it all the time. You find that person, like that fulfillment is unlike anything else I've ever felt. I feel so lucky to be in nursing school and to be about to graduate and about to be a nurse. I have found a lot of fulfillment in learning and continuing to learn and then getting to put that into practice. I love it. It is what fills my cup. So. Those are my three words. I picked challenge, growth and fulfillment. And that's because I think that that's how nursing school should feel. I hope it feels as amazing for everybody else as it has for me. you're like the perfect poster child for nursing school. Like, hey, come on in. You're like a walking, living, breathing ad. to be very clear, because I do have friends who are going to listen to this when it comes out and they're going to be like, uh, so why did you lie? It's also so hard. It's also so hard. And I've wanted to cry and throw up and rip my own hair out multiple times. At the end of the day, this is how I really feel about nursing school. Yes, it's hard. And I think that we should do it anyway. It is so fulfilling. And it is so It's so nice to be the person that your friends go to when they think they're dying. You know what? I love that! When you've been in that other side of that, you know what I mean? Where you've like, I've been the one dying and I needed to go to my mom, I needed to go to my friends, I needed to whatever, and that's... cool to be the person that people are like, I have this thing on my toe, can you look at it? Like, I love that. Yes, like I will look at that thing on your toe and tell me, tell you if you have necrosis. know what I mean? So, yeah. Yes. Yeah, everybody texts me. not, do not text her pictures of your weird rash, okay everybody? So last thing, and you might have already touched on it, you might have not, it might be something different or it might have been something you said. I feel like I know where you're going, but then again, don't know anything. So then the question is, if you had one thing that you wanted someone to walk away from your episode with. that stuck in their brain forever, what would that be? I have so many things that I want to say to nursing students. That's why this podcast, like that's why this is already so long. But I think that if you take nothing else away, I did already say this, but I think that if you take nothing else away, you should know that nursing school and clinical and really whatever in life is going to be whatever you put into it. If you can put into it your best foot, if you can put into it your open mind and your ability to learn and your capability to take the next step and willingness to be a part of a system, you will get good things out of it. I am so, so lucky. I put my everything into nursing school and I have genuinely met some of the nicest people who were willing to help propel me in ways that I never thought that I like. Even just, I went to a hiring fair the other day and I just met other nurses and we all had like, when you meet other nurses, other people who are interested in nursing, they all want to help you. They all want to help you. And I think it's so wonderful. It's such a welcoming community. So yes, what I'm saying is put into it, like if you put into it good vibes and good effort and good intention and good energy, you're going to get nothing but good out of it. You're going to get a community. You're going to get, you know, new knowledge, new skills. You're going to get fulfillment. And I, you know, so yeah, that's yes, sorry, that was probably really long and rambly, but it's just what it is. But no, and that's what it is. And your passion is evident. I look forward to seeing what your career brings. You legit, and I've said this about one or two other people before, but you make me wanna be a nurse, and I'm already a nurse. So you know what I mean? I know if you're having that effect on me, by golly. You guys, you've got this, you've got this. It is so fulfilling. Yeah. fun and it's so fun. It is also really hard and scary, but it's so fun. have to, yeah. I think that there's, yeah, you have to have a certain, if you like to meet challenges, then you will love nursing. If you like to butt heads with challenges, then you will really like nursing. So. Maddie, thank you so much. Thank you so much for giving up of your time on what was this, a wonderful Saturday morning. Much better spent than watching cartoons, which is why we, you know, this is why we watch cartoons and are off time when you have off time again. No, I mean legitimately, and I'll end saying this, you guys. Maddie is like, like, there's a reason why she hadn't listened to an episode of the podcast because she's going through nursing school. and trying to get everything done and doing it in excellence and all the things. And yet here you are, you just carved out over an hour of time with me, with the listening audience to share your heart about nursing. And that heart is big and it is evident. And I can't thank you enough. I hope you have an amazing rest of your day. Thank you. I am so glad that you had me. This was so much fun. So we get to do it again, right? We're gonna do it again a little bit down the road as long as the podcast is still doing. hit me up in like three years when I'm working on L &D at Sacred Heart and I will totally do this again. That's what I'm talking about. Alright you guys, this has been Maddie. Thank you Maddie. Have an awesome day. Yes, you do.