{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.1,"endTime":3.97,"body":"Hear how a drunken night in New York"},{"startTime":0.1,"endTime":3.97,"body":"was the catalyst"},{"startTime":3.97,"endTime":7.407,"body":"to starting a huge family law firm."},{"startTime":10.41,"endTime":12.612,"body":"Welcome back to the Revenue Road Map."},{"startTime":12.612,"endTime":14.18,"body":"My name is Tyler Dolf."},{"startTime":14.18,"endTime":19.786,"body":"I am the CEO of Rocket Clicks,"},{"startTime":14.18,"endTime":19.786,"body":"a hyper focused digital marketing agency"},{"startTime":19.786,"endTime":24.391,"body":"that works exclusively with family"},{"startTime":19.786,"endTime":24.391,"body":"law firms looking to grow"},{"startTime":24.691,"endTime":27.494,"body":"and build their firms to to larger"},{"startTime":27.494,"endTime":30.497,"body":"and more profitable"},{"startTime":27.494,"endTime":30.497,"body":"than they ever thought imaginable."},{"startTime":30.83,"endTime":34.868,"body":"Today we are continuing our interview"},{"startTime":30.83,"endTime":34.868,"body":"series with Jaclyn Neumann."},{"startTime":35.068,"endTime":39.039,"body":"She is the managing partner"},{"startTime":35.068,"endTime":39.039,"body":"of a large law firm in New York"},{"startTime":39.039,"endTime":42.375,"body":"called Berkman, Bochner,"},{"startTime":39.039,"endTime":42.375,"body":"Neumann and Shine."},{"startTime":42.976,"endTime":45.345,"body":"Her story is an incredible one."},{"startTime":45.345,"endTime":49.215,"body":"She got her job by asking her"},{"startTime":45.345,"endTime":49.215,"body":"law professor if they needed help"},{"startTime":49.516,"endTime":54.421,"body":"and then one drunken night in New York,"},{"startTime":49.516,"endTime":54.421,"body":"they decided to start their own firm."},{"startTime":54.721,"endTime":57.39,"body":"This interview is a great one."},{"startTime":57.39,"endTime":58.792,"body":"Make sure to check it out."},{"startTime":58.792,"endTime":63.763,"body":"Welcome back, everyone to another"},{"startTime":58.792,"endTime":63.763,"body":"exciting episode of the Revenue Roadmap."},{"startTime":64.064,"endTime":66.132,"body":"Today we have an incredible guests."},{"startTime":66.132,"endTime":68.134,"body":"Jaclyn,"},{"startTime":66.132,"endTime":68.134,"body":"thank you so much for your time today."},{"startTime":68.134,"endTime":71.771,"body":"Could you please introduce yourself and,"},{"startTime":68.134,"endTime":71.771,"body":"and your firm to our audience?"},{"startTime":72.038,"endTime":74.34,"body":"Sure. Well, thanks so much for having me."},{"startTime":74.34,"endTime":75.542,"body":"My name is Jaclyn Newman."},{"startTime":75.542,"endTime":78.812,"body":"I'm the managing partner of the law firm"},{"startTime":75.542,"endTime":78.812,"body":"Berkman, Baker, Neumann and Stein."},{"startTime":78.812,"endTime":83.149,"body":"We're a matrimonial law firm"},{"startTime":78.812,"endTime":83.149,"body":"in, Manhattan with offices in Long Island"},{"startTime":83.149,"endTime":86.252,"body":"and in Westchester and slowly"},{"startTime":83.149,"endTime":86.252,"body":"creeping into Florida and New Jersey."},{"startTime":86.686,"endTime":88.788,"body":"Oh. That's interesting."},{"startTime":88.788,"endTime":91.558,"body":"Why the locations spread out like that?"},{"startTime":91.558,"endTime":95.328,"body":"Well, in New York, we wanted to be able"},{"startTime":91.558,"endTime":95.328,"body":"to cover the two surrounding suburbs."},{"startTime":95.328,"endTime":97.664,"body":"So, I mean, offices in Manhattan."},{"startTime":97.664,"endTime":98.998,"body":"But then we have the two outside."},{"startTime":98.998,"endTime":102.535,"body":"And then as for new York and New York,"},{"startTime":98.998,"endTime":102.535,"body":"new Jersey and Florida,"},{"startTime":102.836,"endTime":104.504,"body":"new Jersey,"},{"startTime":102.836,"endTime":104.504,"body":"we get a lot of people that live"},{"startTime":104.504,"endTime":106.206,"body":"in new Jersey and practice in Manhattan."},{"startTime":106.206,"endTime":108.041,"body":"So you get a lot of that."},{"startTime":108.041,"endTime":110.81,"body":"And then Florida, you know,"},{"startTime":108.041,"endTime":110.81,"body":"we have a lot of New Yorkers that are,"},{"startTime":110.81,"endTime":112.712,"body":"going out to Florida avoiding state tax."},{"startTime":112.712,"endTime":116.116,"body":"So, you know, so we're looking"},{"startTime":112.712,"endTime":116.116,"body":"to kind of branch out in there"},{"startTime":116.116,"endTime":118.685,"body":"and we have, counsel people right now"},{"startTime":116.116,"endTime":118.685,"body":"in both places."},{"startTime":118.685,"endTime":121.621,"body":"But I'm looking to build"},{"startTime":118.685,"endTime":121.621,"body":"like real offices there soon."},{"startTime":121.621,"endTime":123.656,"body":"I love it. That's awesome."},{"startTime":123.656,"endTime":125.658,"body":"As a firm owner,"},{"startTime":126.693,"endTime":127.594,"body":"we built"},{"startTime":127.594,"endTime":132.632,"body":"our firm based on the idea of finding"},{"startTime":127.594,"endTime":132.632,"body":"locations that are a bit more spread out,"},{"startTime":133.399,"endTime":136.102,"body":"from a population density standpoint,"},{"startTime":133.399,"endTime":136.102,"body":"because we really believe"},{"startTime":136.102,"endTime":138.004,"body":"in the power of Google Maps."},{"startTime":138.004,"endTime":142.809,"body":"Hearing that you have a location in"},{"startTime":138.004,"endTime":142.809,"body":"Manhattan is fascinating to me."},{"startTime":142.842,"endTime":145.044,"body":"Can you give us a little history on"},{"startTime":145.044,"endTime":148.114,"body":"how the firm was built,"},{"startTime":145.044,"endTime":148.114,"body":"why you chose Manhattan?"},{"startTime":148.848,"endTime":150.55,"body":"Was it"},{"startTime":148.848,"endTime":150.55,"body":"kind of like an old school mentality?"},{"startTime":150.55,"endTime":152.819,"body":"Like we got to be"},{"startTime":150.55,"endTime":152.819,"body":"where the people are or how."},{"startTime":152.819,"endTime":153.953,"body":"How was."},{"startTime":153.953,"endTime":155.722,"body":"So there's a little bit"},{"startTime":153.953,"endTime":155.722,"body":"more history to it."},{"startTime":155.722,"endTime":158.291,"body":"So I actually joined the firm."},{"startTime":158.291,"endTime":160.66,"body":"So there were two older partners"},{"startTime":158.291,"endTime":160.66,"body":"who ordered,"},{"startTime":160.66,"endTime":163.663,"body":"Berkman and the backer of Bergman back"},{"startTime":160.66,"endTime":163.663,"body":"are doing a sign."},{"startTime":163.663,"endTime":168.067,"body":"And what happened was,"},{"startTime":163.663,"endTime":168.067,"body":"Barry Berkman was my law school professor."},{"startTime":168.368,"endTime":170.904,"body":"And I went up to him at the end of class"},{"startTime":168.368,"endTime":170.904,"body":"and asked for retiring."},{"startTime":170.904,"endTime":172.839,"body":"And the person that was working for him"},{"startTime":172.839,"endTime":175.241,"body":"at the time"},{"startTime":172.839,"endTime":175.241,"body":"was leaving to go for the Grateful Dead."},{"startTime":175.241,"endTime":177.544,"body":"So he was just like, sure, come on in."},{"startTime":177.544,"endTime":181.08,"body":"And so basically, I started working with"},{"startTime":177.544,"endTime":181.08,"body":"both of them and at the time."},{"startTime":181.681,"endTime":185.552,"body":"So Barry and Wally, the two partners"},{"startTime":181.681,"endTime":185.552,"body":"who I mean are just amazing,"},{"startTime":185.552,"endTime":187.153,"body":"amazing people, attorneys, everything."},{"startTime":187.153,"endTime":191.057,"body":"They knew each other from Harvard,"},{"startTime":187.153,"endTime":191.057,"body":"and they were basically out with friends"},{"startTime":191.057,"endTime":194.861,"body":"one night and drunk and they were like,"},{"startTime":191.057,"endTime":194.861,"body":"hey, you want to start a law firm? And"},{"startTime":196.062,"endTime":196.496,"body":"family"},{"startTime":196.496,"endTime":199.499,"body":"law while I was a corporate, litigator."},{"startTime":199.532,"endTime":201.0,"body":"And he's like, sure, I could do that."},{"startTime":201.0,"endTime":202.802,"body":"So he was like, I can let it get anywhere."},{"startTime":202.802,"endTime":204.304,"body":"So they basically joined."},{"startTime":204.304,"endTime":205.638,"body":"But when I came in,"},{"startTime":205.638,"endTime":207.84,"body":"one was on the east side"},{"startTime":205.638,"endTime":207.84,"body":"and one was on the west side,"},{"startTime":207.84,"endTime":209.876,"body":"and they are like polar opposite peoples"},{"startTime":207.84,"endTime":209.876,"body":"really."},{"startTime":209.876,"endTime":212.278,"body":"Again,"},{"startTime":209.876,"endTime":212.278,"body":"both great, smart, amazing attorneys."},{"startTime":212.278,"endTime":212.979,"body":"But you have one"},{"startTime":212.979,"endTime":215.982,"body":"who's like a Democrat Jewish guy"},{"startTime":212.979,"endTime":215.982,"body":"who's living on the Upper West Side."},{"startTime":216.115,"endTime":218.184,"body":"And then you had Wally,"},{"startTime":216.115,"endTime":218.184,"body":"who was kind of like,"},{"startTime":218.184,"endTime":221.221,"body":"you know, Catholic, very conservative,"},{"startTime":218.184,"endTime":221.221,"body":"living on the Upper East Side."},{"startTime":221.421,"endTime":222.989,"body":"They couldn't be more different."},{"startTime":222.989,"endTime":225.024,"body":"But yet they worked so well together."},{"startTime":225.024,"endTime":227.36,"body":"And so when I came in"},{"startTime":225.024,"endTime":227.36,"body":"originally as an intern,"},{"startTime":227.36,"endTime":230.196,"body":"I was kind of bouncing"},{"startTime":227.36,"endTime":230.196,"body":"between the West side and the East side."},{"startTime":230.196,"endTime":232.966,"body":"It was a disaster. And so I was like,"},{"startTime":230.196,"endTime":232.966,"body":"all right, this is not working anymore."},{"startTime":232.966,"endTime":234.567,"body":"We need an office."},{"startTime":234.567,"endTime":236.97,"body":"So I'm looking back."},{"startTime":234.567,"endTime":236.97,"body":"I was like this young, precocious."},{"startTime":236.97,"endTime":238.137,"body":"I was like, I'll take care of it."},{"startTime":238.137,"endTime":240.206,"body":"Don't worry. I'm like,"},{"startTime":238.137,"endTime":240.206,"body":"okay guys, I got this."},{"startTime":240.206,"endTime":243.977,"body":"And so just to date myself,"},{"startTime":240.206,"endTime":243.977,"body":"I had to go into the law journal and like,"},{"startTime":243.977,"endTime":247.046,"body":"look at ads"},{"startTime":243.977,"endTime":247.046,"body":"for where there might be office space."},{"startTime":247.447,"endTime":250.917,"body":"And I go to these offices and, you know,"},{"startTime":247.447,"endTime":250.917,"body":"one, one east side, one one west side."},{"startTime":250.917,"endTime":253.553,"body":"So I picked this avenue because I"},{"startTime":250.917,"endTime":253.553,"body":"was like, all right, compromise, guys."},{"startTime":253.553,"endTime":254.787,"body":"We can both do this."},{"startTime":254.787,"endTime":258.191,"body":"And I went into different offices"},{"startTime":254.787,"endTime":258.191,"body":"and literally like just to show"},{"startTime":258.191,"endTime":261.194,"body":"I would measure the offices of my feet,"},{"startTime":258.191,"endTime":261.194,"body":"I take my shoes off"},{"startTime":261.227,"endTime":264.197,"body":"and just measure like that,"},{"startTime":261.227,"endTime":264.197,"body":"which I don't know how."},{"startTime":264.197,"endTime":266.199,"body":"And now that I'm an older person,"},{"startTime":264.197,"endTime":266.199,"body":"like how I,"},{"startTime":266.199,"endTime":267.767,"body":"someone didn't"},{"startTime":266.199,"endTime":267.767,"body":"just take me out of their office, right."},{"startTime":267.767,"endTime":270.436,"body":"And their and be like,"},{"startTime":267.767,"endTime":270.436,"body":"you have to get out of here, little girl."},{"startTime":270.436,"endTime":271.537,"body":"Anyway."},{"startTime":271.537,"endTime":272.705,"body":"So yeah."},{"startTime":272.705,"endTime":276.442,"body":"And so we kind of built from that and it"},{"startTime":272.705,"endTime":276.442,"body":"started really small with the three of us."},{"startTime":276.442,"endTime":279.812,"body":"And then as time went"},{"startTime":276.442,"endTime":279.812,"body":"on, you would add people,"},{"startTime":280.213,"endTime":283.216,"body":"and now we're 31 attorneys, I think."},{"startTime":283.95,"endTime":284.884,"body":"Yeah, we've really grown."},{"startTime":284.884,"endTime":286.619,"body":"And, you know, Wally, unfortunately,"},{"startTime":286.619,"endTime":288.721,"body":"he had a stroke a few years ago,"},{"startTime":286.619,"endTime":288.721,"body":"so he left the firm."},{"startTime":288.721,"endTime":290.256,"body":"But we're still very close to him."},{"startTime":290.256,"endTime":293.493,"body":"And Barry's like, on his way,"},{"startTime":290.256,"endTime":293.493,"body":"you know, starting to leave now."},{"startTime":293.493,"endTime":294.761,"body":"So that's it. And I."},{"startTime":294.761,"endTime":297.764,"body":"And then I brought in Evan sign"},{"startTime":294.761,"endTime":297.764,"body":"and my younger partner,"},{"startTime":297.93,"endTime":299.899,"body":"and Evan and I"},{"startTime":297.93,"endTime":299.899,"body":"are the equity partners now."},{"startTime":299.899,"endTime":301.501,"body":"That is insane."},{"startTime":301.501,"endTime":303.936,"body":"I mean, I have so many questions about it."},{"startTime":303.936,"endTime":305.805,"body":"Just ask away."},{"startTime":305.805,"endTime":310.943,"body":"Do you remember the the rent"},{"startTime":305.805,"endTime":310.943,"body":"of the first office on Fifth Avenue?"},{"startTime":311.744,"endTime":314.247,"body":"God, I don't"},{"startTime":311.744,"endTime":314.247,"body":"I can tell you my rent right now."},{"startTime":314.247,"endTime":315.114,"body":"I'm super."},{"startTime":316.883,"endTime":319.652,"body":"God, no, I you know, I don't remember,"},{"startTime":319.652,"endTime":321.721,"body":"but I know like, at me"},{"startTime":319.652,"endTime":321.721,"body":"at the time, though,"},{"startTime":321.721,"endTime":324.691,"body":"because I'm 20 something years old,"},{"startTime":321.721,"endTime":324.691,"body":"it was really expensive."},{"startTime":324.691,"endTime":327.193,"body":"And now looking back, I'm like,"},{"startTime":324.691,"endTime":327.193,"body":"what was I thinking?"},{"startTime":327.193,"endTime":331.164,"body":"But yes, I would guess if I had to guess,"},{"startTime":327.193,"endTime":331.164,"body":"it was probably maybe ten grand,"},{"startTime":331.164,"endTime":335.001,"body":"maybe five grand, 7500 like that."},{"startTime":335.001,"endTime":337.87,"body":"Oh my gosh, that's so wild."},{"startTime":337.87,"endTime":342.542,"body":"So as the greatest part, it's"},{"startTime":337.87,"endTime":342.542,"body":"like you've been there since the beginning"},{"startTime":342.542,"endTime":346.646,"body":"as it slowly and turned to to now"},{"startTime":342.542,"endTime":346.646,"body":"being an equity partner in the firm."},{"startTime":346.646,"endTime":348.548,"body":"So congratulations on your success."},{"startTime":348.548,"endTime":350.016,"body":"Yeah, I appreciate that."},{"startTime":350.016,"endTime":354.12,"body":"Talk us through some of those early"},{"startTime":350.016,"endTime":354.12,"body":"days, key learnings like did"},{"startTime":354.12,"endTime":358.324,"body":"they always love that they got drunk"},{"startTime":354.12,"endTime":358.324,"body":"in a bar one night just like, this firm,"},{"startTime":359.659,"endTime":361.961,"body":"when they"},{"startTime":359.659,"endTime":361.961,"body":"were talking to you about their vision"},{"startTime":361.961,"endTime":364.764,"body":"and you were helping them accomplish"},{"startTime":361.961,"endTime":364.764,"body":"this vision, was it always,"},{"startTime":364.764,"endTime":367.467,"body":"we want to get to 30 attorneys"},{"startTime":364.764,"endTime":367.467,"body":"and be really big or."},{"startTime":367.467,"endTime":370.47,"body":"100%? I can see that evolution."},{"startTime":370.47,"endTime":372.238,"body":"Couldn't have been more opposite of that."},{"startTime":372.238,"endTime":376.976,"body":"So the two of them, again, brilliant,"},{"startTime":372.238,"endTime":376.976,"body":"brilliant attorneys, they were not men."},{"startTime":377.076,"endTime":378.544,"body":"They were not business people."},{"startTime":378.544,"endTime":380.813,"body":"They didn't really care"},{"startTime":378.544,"endTime":380.813,"body":"so much about the business."},{"startTime":380.813,"endTime":383.282,"body":"And when I was starting"},{"startTime":380.813,"endTime":383.282,"body":"and growing up with them,"},{"startTime":383.282,"endTime":385.618,"body":"you know,"},{"startTime":383.282,"endTime":385.618,"body":"I didn't know enough to care either."},{"startTime":385.618,"endTime":387.92,"body":"And then I just I love business."},{"startTime":387.92,"endTime":389.188,"body":"I've always loved business."},{"startTime":389.188,"endTime":391.791,"body":"And I always say in the last five"},{"startTime":389.188,"endTime":391.791,"body":"what I went to business school."},{"startTime":391.791,"endTime":394.494,"body":"And so eventually one day"},{"startTime":394.494,"endTime":396.262,"body":"I decided"},{"startTime":394.494,"endTime":396.262,"body":"I was going to start running the business"},{"startTime":396.262,"endTime":398.231,"body":"because I just thought"},{"startTime":396.262,"endTime":398.231,"body":"they were doing a very bad job."},{"startTime":398.231,"endTime":401.367,"body":"And so and they, to their credit,"},{"startTime":398.231,"endTime":401.367,"body":"like their attitude"},{"startTime":401.367,"endTime":404.57,"body":"always was like, you be you just as long"},{"startTime":401.367,"endTime":404.57,"body":"as you take care of everything."},{"startTime":404.57,"endTime":405.371,"body":"We don't care."},{"startTime":405.371,"endTime":406.439,"body":"Like the big joke about it."},{"startTime":406.439,"endTime":407.974,"body":"When I became a partner"},{"startTime":406.439,"endTime":407.974,"body":"one day, I walked in."},{"startTime":407.974,"endTime":409.742,"body":"I was like,"},{"startTime":407.974,"endTime":409.742,"body":"it's time for me to be a partner."},{"startTime":409.742,"endTime":411.21,"body":"Like, okay."},{"startTime":411.21,"endTime":411.844,"body":"And then, like,"},{"startTime":411.844,"endTime":414.981,"body":"I think about when people become a partner"},{"startTime":411.844,"endTime":414.981,"body":"now in my firm, it's a whole to do"},{"startTime":414.981,"endTime":416.949,"body":"like we do. Like we said, champagne."},{"startTime":416.949,"endTime":418.217,"body":"We do like it's a whole thing."},{"startTime":418.217,"endTime":419.986,"body":"For me, it was literally okay."},{"startTime":419.986,"endTime":421.888,"body":"And when I decided"},{"startTime":419.986,"endTime":421.888,"body":"I want my name to be in the firm,"},{"startTime":421.888,"endTime":424.157,"body":"I went in and I said,"},{"startTime":421.888,"endTime":424.157,"body":"I think it says my name to be in the firm."},{"startTime":424.157,"endTime":425.992,"body":"They're like going to take care of it."},{"startTime":424.157,"endTime":425.992,"body":"That's fine."},{"startTime":425.992,"endTime":427.56,"body":"I was like, okay."},{"startTime":427.56,"endTime":430.797,"body":"And then when I decided"},{"startTime":427.56,"endTime":430.797,"body":"I started taking over the books"},{"startTime":430.797,"endTime":432.765,"body":"and started getting in"},{"startTime":430.797,"endTime":432.765,"body":"with our accountants and everything,"},{"startTime":432.765,"endTime":435.535,"body":"and one day I just said I was like,"},{"startTime":432.765,"endTime":435.535,"body":"I'm declaring myself managing partner."},{"startTime":435.535,"endTime":436.702,"body":"Like, okay."},{"startTime":436.702,"endTime":438.571,"body":"And that was really how the whole thing"},{"startTime":436.702,"endTime":438.571,"body":"happened."},{"startTime":438.571,"endTime":441.541,"body":"Like there was no. Business partners ever."},{"startTime":442.108,"endTime":443.176,"body":"They kind of are."},{"startTime":443.176,"endTime":444.677,"body":"But they didn't want to,"},{"startTime":443.176,"endTime":444.677,"body":"you know, their attitude."},{"startTime":444.677,"endTime":445.344,"body":"But like,"},{"startTime":445.344,"endTime":446.512,"body":"as long as you take care of it"},{"startTime":446.512,"endTime":448.981,"body":"and I can just keep doing what"},{"startTime":446.512,"endTime":448.981,"body":"I want to do, that's fine."},{"startTime":448.981,"endTime":452.151,"body":"And so I decided like and again,"},{"startTime":448.981,"endTime":452.151,"body":"they are such good guys."},{"startTime":452.151,"endTime":454.086,"body":"But like it was one of those things"},{"startTime":452.151,"endTime":454.086,"body":"I looked at."},{"startTime":454.086,"endTime":457.089,"body":"I was very precocious and I was like,"},{"startTime":454.086,"endTime":457.089,"body":"we're on Fifth Avenue now, you guys."},{"startTime":457.089,"endTime":458.324,"body":"I didn't like the ties they'd wear."},{"startTime":458.324,"endTime":460.56,"body":"So I was like,"},{"startTime":458.324,"endTime":460.56,"body":"you need to start wearing Ferragamo tie."},{"startTime":460.56,"endTime":463.629,"body":"And so I would buy them Ferragamo"},{"startTime":460.56,"endTime":463.629,"body":"ties, like, you know, as holiday"},{"startTime":463.629,"endTime":465.798,"body":"gifts and like, I didn't like the shirts"},{"startTime":463.629,"endTime":465.798,"body":"they were wearing."},{"startTime":465.798,"endTime":467.967,"body":"So I was like,"},{"startTime":465.798,"endTime":467.967,"body":"one of them have. So I would get them,"},{"startTime":469.202,"endTime":471.037,"body":"my, my,"},{"startTime":469.202,"endTime":471.037,"body":"like little state, what do they call them?"},{"startTime":471.037,"endTime":471.871,"body":"Totally blanking."},{"startTime":471.871,"endTime":473.239,"body":"Cufflinks. Cufflinks."},{"startTime":473.239,"endTime":475.107,"body":"Thank you. I don't know,"},{"startTime":473.239,"endTime":475.107,"body":"I totally ran off my head."},{"startTime":475.107,"endTime":476.042,"body":"So I get them cufflinks."},{"startTime":476.042,"endTime":479.011,"body":"I was like, that means you need shirts"},{"startTime":476.042,"endTime":479.011,"body":"that use cufflinks and like,"},{"startTime":479.011,"endTime":481.514,"body":"so like I just started, like,"},{"startTime":479.011,"endTime":481.514,"body":"that type of thing."},{"startTime":481.514,"endTime":483.516,"body":"And they were just,"},{"startTime":481.514,"endTime":483.516,"body":"you know, they were like, okay."},{"startTime":483.516,"endTime":485.618,"body":"Like, they really just kind of"},{"startTime":483.516,"endTime":485.618,"body":"went along with everything."},{"startTime":485.618,"endTime":487.353,"body":"And they are amazing people."},{"startTime":487.353,"endTime":490.59,"body":"They couldn't have been more supportive"},{"startTime":487.353,"endTime":490.59,"body":"in my career and everything."},{"startTime":490.59,"endTime":494.26,"body":"And so when we grew, yeah, that wasn't"},{"startTime":490.59,"endTime":494.26,"body":"that was me."},{"startTime":494.26,"endTime":495.595,"body":"They were not as into it."},{"startTime":495.595,"endTime":498.598,"body":"They were perfectly happy"},{"startTime":495.595,"endTime":498.598,"body":"being like a really small little thing."},{"startTime":498.598,"endTime":500.867,"body":"I was less happy with that."},{"startTime":500.867,"endTime":502.602,"body":"I kind of had much more,"},{"startTime":502.602,"endTime":505.538,"body":"delusions of grandeur"},{"startTime":502.602,"endTime":505.538,"body":"and really wanted to build this thing up."},{"startTime":505.538,"endTime":507.94,"body":"And again,"},{"startTime":505.538,"endTime":507.94,"body":"they were just sort of like, okay."},{"startTime":507.94,"endTime":510.977,"body":"And now it's sort of funny"},{"startTime":507.94,"endTime":510.977,"body":"when we have these holiday parties"},{"startTime":510.977,"endTime":513.412,"body":"and there's,"},{"startTime":510.977,"endTime":513.412,"body":"you know, 40 or 50 people in the room."},{"startTime":513.412,"endTime":515.915,"body":"And while he comes, I have to like,"},{"startTime":513.412,"endTime":515.915,"body":"whisper who people are."},{"startTime":515.915,"endTime":518.551,"body":"And even with Gary,"},{"startTime":515.915,"endTime":518.551,"body":"sometimes they're on a zoom"},{"startTime":518.551,"endTime":521.554,"body":"I like I see him looking at someone"},{"startTime":518.551,"endTime":521.554,"body":"a little puzzled who they are, like,"},{"startTime":521.821,"endTime":522.321,"body":"here's something."},{"startTime":522.321,"endTime":523.923,"body":"So I detect from all I've been like,"},{"startTime":523.923,"endTime":525.925,"body":"that's our new intern in the Westchester"},{"startTime":523.923,"endTime":525.925,"body":"office."},{"startTime":525.925,"endTime":528.127,"body":"He's like,"},{"startTime":525.925,"endTime":528.127,"body":"and I see him like that. I was like, yeah."},{"startTime":529.595,"endTime":531.931,"body":"That is so amazing."},{"startTime":531.931,"endTime":536.269,"body":"The lesson I'm hearing,"},{"startTime":531.931,"endTime":536.269,"body":"you know, if I am, young law student"},{"startTime":536.269,"endTime":539.739,"body":"or I'm a young lawyer, sometimes you gotta"},{"startTime":536.269,"endTime":539.739,"body":"ask for what you want, right?"},{"startTime":540.306,"endTime":541.374,"body":"Make some should happen."},{"startTime":541.374,"endTime":543.776,"body":"You know,"},{"startTime":541.374,"endTime":543.776,"body":"sometimes you just do it. All the time."},{"startTime":543.776,"endTime":545.211,"body":"I love all the time."},{"startTime":545.211,"endTime":546.679,"body":"You know, the answer to answer."},{"startTime":546.679,"endTime":547.48,"body":"Question is now."},{"startTime":547.48,"endTime":550.483,"body":"So I ask question 100%."},{"startTime":550.516,"endTime":552.351,"body":"And what's the worst that could happen?"},{"startTime":552.351,"endTime":554.62,"body":"Look, I know you're okay."},{"startTime":554.62,"endTime":556.989,"body":"Good for let's say yes,"},{"startTime":554.62,"endTime":556.989,"body":"but you also could be the worst thing"},{"startTime":556.989,"endTime":559.992,"body":"that could happen,"},{"startTime":556.989,"endTime":559.992,"body":"but not in this situation."},{"startTime":560.026,"endTime":564.263,"body":"So you are taking over"},{"startTime":560.026,"endTime":564.263,"body":"more responsibilities of the firm."},{"startTime":564.263,"endTime":566.365,"body":"You guys are starting to grow."},{"startTime":566.365,"endTime":569.101,"body":"You know, 30"},{"startTime":566.365,"endTime":569.101,"body":"attorneys is an incredible milestone,"},{"startTime":569.101,"endTime":572.071,"body":"especially for for family law offices."},{"startTime":572.104,"endTime":575.975,"body":"You know, we always talk about"},{"startTime":572.104,"endTime":575.975,"body":"how when we got to 30 attorneys, that was"},{"startTime":576.842,"endTime":579.812,"body":"we were kind of like,"},{"startTime":576.842,"endTime":579.812,"body":"okay, we've there's something here."},{"startTime":580.246,"endTime":580.479,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":581.547,"endTime":584.183,"body":"I'm getting there."},{"startTime":584.183,"endTime":588.654,"body":"How have you been able to build, process"},{"startTime":584.183,"endTime":588.654,"body":"and create opportunities"},{"startTime":588.654,"endTime":592.525,"body":"and open locations"},{"startTime":588.654,"endTime":592.525,"body":"like what's your mindset going into"},{"startTime":592.525,"endTime":595.728,"body":"to building the firm, and how have you"},{"startTime":592.525,"endTime":595.728,"body":"been able to do that so successfully?"},{"startTime":596.629,"endTime":599.799,"body":"So it's a fantastic question"},{"startTime":596.629,"endTime":599.799,"body":"because I think a lot of"},{"startTime":599.799,"endTime":602.702,"body":"it was somewhat organic, like a lot of it"},{"startTime":599.799,"endTime":602.702,"body":"wasn't like I woke up one morning."},{"startTime":602.702,"endTime":604.971,"body":"I was like, I want 30 attorneys."},{"startTime":604.971,"endTime":607.273,"body":"But I think what ended up happening,"},{"startTime":604.971,"endTime":607.273,"body":"I'm a big believer in"},{"startTime":607.273,"endTime":608.708,"body":"you don't walk away from opportunities."},{"startTime":608.708,"endTime":610.91,"body":"We had a lot of people"},{"startTime":608.708,"endTime":610.91,"body":"that have fallen into our lap."},{"startTime":610.91,"endTime":612.111,"body":"We've been amazing."},{"startTime":612.111,"endTime":615.247,"body":"I've had a lot of people that have been"},{"startTime":612.111,"endTime":615.247,"body":"with me since the very beginning."},{"startTime":615.247,"endTime":617.55,"body":"We don't have a ton of turnover."},{"startTime":617.55,"endTime":619.051,"body":"You know, for me, culture is king."},{"startTime":619.051,"endTime":622.054,"body":"Like, I am super, super into culture."},{"startTime":622.121,"endTime":623.823,"body":"I've been like at almost"},{"startTime":623.823,"endTime":627.526,"body":"the majority of the weddings at my office,"},{"startTime":623.823,"endTime":627.526,"body":"and we had one last weekend."},{"startTime":627.526,"endTime":628.761,"body":"There was like 20 of us there."},{"startTime":629.795,"endTime":631.631,"body":"We, you know, and the baby name is I'm"},{"startTime":631.631,"endTime":633.799,"body":"one of those people that,"},{"startTime":631.631,"endTime":633.799,"body":"you know, I'm like, I'm on the list."},{"startTime":633.799,"endTime":636.402,"body":"Like the second you give birth,"},{"startTime":633.799,"endTime":636.402,"body":"I want that part two in the morning."},{"startTime":636.402,"endTime":637.37,"body":"I want to know what's going on."},{"startTime":637.37,"endTime":639.472,"body":"Like, there's a very, very tight knit."},{"startTime":639.472,"endTime":641.974,"body":"My associates are super tight knit."},{"startTime":641.974,"endTime":644.977,"body":"We just sort of grew somewhat organically,"},{"startTime":641.974,"endTime":644.977,"body":"at least in the city."},{"startTime":645.211,"endTime":646.278,"body":"The outside offices"},{"startTime":646.278,"endTime":649.482,"body":"were much more of a decision"},{"startTime":646.278,"endTime":649.482,"body":"like I really wanted because, again,"},{"startTime":650.282,"endTime":652.218,"body":"at least in New York City"},{"startTime":650.282,"endTime":652.218,"body":"and on Fifth Avenue,"},{"startTime":652.218,"endTime":654.153,"body":"when I would go to the outside boroughs,"},{"startTime":654.153,"endTime":656.689,"body":"they'd be like a Fifth Avenue"},{"startTime":654.153,"endTime":656.689,"body":"attorney can't be here kind of thing."},{"startTime":656.689,"endTime":659.492,"body":"It's a very, you know, if you didn't"},{"startTime":656.689,"endTime":659.492,"body":"go to high school with these people"},{"startTime":659.492,"endTime":661.861,"body":"and you weren't out there,"},{"startTime":659.492,"endTime":661.861,"body":"probably want nothing to do with you."},{"startTime":661.861,"endTime":665.665,"body":"And so I realized that being shot down"},{"startTime":661.861,"endTime":665.665,"body":"many times I had someone"},{"startTime":665.665,"endTime":668.868,"body":"was argue to me saying, well, maybe"},{"startTime":665.665,"endTime":668.868,"body":"that's how they do it on Fifth Avenue."},{"startTime":668.868,"endTime":670.503,"body":"And I was like, well, actually people are."},{"startTime":670.503,"endTime":671.937,"body":"And that's sort of how they do it"},{"startTime":670.503,"endTime":671.937,"body":"everywhere."},{"startTime":671.937,"endTime":674.94,"body":"And they were just like,"},{"startTime":671.937,"endTime":674.94,"body":"you wanted nothing to do with me."},{"startTime":675.074,"endTime":678.778,"body":"I realized we needed insiders,"},{"startTime":675.074,"endTime":678.778,"body":"and so we started hiring people"},{"startTime":678.778,"endTime":681.013,"body":"that were on the inside, like,"},{"startTime":678.778,"endTime":681.013,"body":"and even though it's drop"},{"startTime":681.013,"endTime":684.116,"body":"ins often shouldn't be that way,"},{"startTime":681.013,"endTime":684.116,"body":"sometimes you just got to play the game."},{"startTime":684.116,"endTime":685.584,"body":"It is what it is world."},{"startTime":685.584,"endTime":686.619,"body":"It is the way of the world."},{"startTime":686.619,"endTime":690.289,"body":"So we would, like I was like, just,"},{"startTime":686.619,"endTime":690.289,"body":"you know, if your phone number,"},{"startTime":690.289,"endTime":691.49,"body":"the judge's phone number on your phone,"},{"startTime":691.49,"endTime":694.493,"body":"like that was kind of my interview"},{"startTime":691.49,"endTime":694.493,"body":"question, like, let's start there"},{"startTime":694.56,"endTime":696.228,"body":"just to know how close everybody is."},{"startTime":696.228,"endTime":698.964,"body":"And unfortunately or fortunately,"},{"startTime":696.228,"endTime":698.964,"body":"some of them were."},{"startTime":698.964,"endTime":701.4,"body":"And so that's how we started building."},{"startTime":701.4,"endTime":705.538,"body":"And I have to say, I mean, I find it"},{"startTime":701.4,"endTime":705.538,"body":"harder to build in the outside world."},{"startTime":705.538,"endTime":707.239,"body":"We have a lot of people"},{"startTime":705.538,"endTime":707.239,"body":"that really want to come"},{"startTime":707.239,"endTime":709.508,"body":"to the New York City life,"},{"startTime":707.239,"endTime":709.508,"body":"as a lot of young students"},{"startTime":709.508,"endTime":712.478,"body":"always want to be in the New York City"},{"startTime":709.508,"endTime":712.478,"body":"office and New York City offices."},{"startTime":712.478,"endTime":713.145,"body":"Tons of fun."},{"startTime":713.145,"endTime":715.181,"body":"You know, and it's in the outside"},{"startTime":713.145,"endTime":715.181,"body":"boroughs."},{"startTime":715.181,"endTime":716.582,"body":"You don't have that many younger people"},{"startTime":716.582,"endTime":718.484,"body":"that are usually living in the outside"},{"startTime":716.582,"endTime":718.484,"body":"boroughs."},{"startTime":718.484,"endTime":720.82,"body":"They may live there eventually,"},{"startTime":718.484,"endTime":720.82,"body":"but not in the beginning."},{"startTime":720.82,"endTime":723.789,"body":"And so it's harder"},{"startTime":720.82,"endTime":723.789,"body":"to build out there very much."},{"startTime":724.957,"endTime":727.727,"body":"But the advice I give to people,"},{"startTime":724.957,"endTime":727.727,"body":"I mean, the problem that, you know,"},{"startTime":727.727,"endTime":728.994,"body":"especially in that money law,"},{"startTime":728.994,"endTime":732.131,"body":"is that you don't want to hire people"},{"startTime":728.994,"endTime":732.131,"body":"unless you have experience."},{"startTime":732.131,"endTime":734.4,"body":"But again, they can't get experience"},{"startTime":732.131,"endTime":734.4,"body":"once they get hired."},{"startTime":734.4,"endTime":737.036,"body":"So this is kind of,"},{"startTime":734.4,"endTime":737.036,"body":"you know, it's very small,"},{"startTime":737.036,"endTime":738.938,"body":"as you said, like,"},{"startTime":737.036,"endTime":738.938,"body":"I know we're one of the largest."},{"startTime":738.938,"endTime":740.072,"body":"Sounds like you're one of the largest."},{"startTime":740.072,"endTime":742.241,"body":"There's a few in Chicago,"},{"startTime":740.072,"endTime":742.241,"body":"but for the most part"},{"startTime":742.241,"endTime":745.244,"body":"it's solo practitioners and young,"},{"startTime":742.241,"endTime":745.244,"body":"you know, small, firm."},{"startTime":745.578,"endTime":748.614,"body":"And so what I always advise"},{"startTime":745.578,"endTime":748.614,"body":"people is like, you know, work"},{"startTime":748.614,"endTime":751.717,"body":"for free, like, just get your experience,"},{"startTime":748.614,"endTime":751.717,"body":"like, it doesn't matter."},{"startTime":751.851,"endTime":755.387,"body":"I mean, it does matter where you work, but"},{"startTime":751.851,"endTime":755.387,"body":"it is just about getting the experience"},{"startTime":755.387,"endTime":756.555,"body":"that people don't want to take risks."},{"startTime":757.69,"endTime":760.392,"body":"But I'm"},{"startTime":757.69,"endTime":760.392,"body":"also a huge proponent of as I said,"},{"startTime":760.392,"endTime":761.761,"body":"you don't want to walk away"},{"startTime":760.392,"endTime":761.761,"body":"from opportunities."},{"startTime":761.761,"endTime":764.964,"body":"If you get a good person,"},{"startTime":761.761,"endTime":764.964,"body":"you train them like matrimonial law."},{"startTime":765.264,"endTime":767.6,"body":"It's it can be complex,"},{"startTime":765.264,"endTime":767.6,"body":"but it's not rocket science."},{"startTime":767.6,"endTime":768.701,"body":"It's all about people."},{"startTime":768.701,"endTime":771.504,"body":"And, you know, and I used to say,"},{"startTime":768.701,"endTime":771.504,"body":"my interview skills,"},{"startTime":771.504,"endTime":773.205,"body":"I used to just not even look at a resume."},{"startTime":773.205,"endTime":775.307,"body":"I'd be like, I'd have, you know,"},{"startTime":773.205,"endTime":775.307,"body":"can I go out for lunch with you?"},{"startTime":775.307,"endTime":778.11,"body":"That was usually my like,"},{"startTime":775.307,"endTime":778.11,"body":"when that when I would interview people."},{"startTime":778.11,"endTime":779.845,"body":"I look at the resume after"},{"startTime":778.11,"endTime":779.845,"body":"because I'm like,"},{"startTime":779.845,"endTime":782.281,"body":"if you're annoying to me,"},{"startTime":779.845,"endTime":782.281,"body":"you're going to be annoying to my clients."},{"startTime":782.281,"endTime":784.75,"body":"And so it's so much about personality."},{"startTime":784.75,"endTime":786.285,"body":"At least in this field,"},{"startTime":786.285,"endTime":788.988,"body":"you can pretty much learn everything else"},{"startTime":786.285,"endTime":788.988,"body":"you need to know."},{"startTime":788.988,"endTime":790.623,"body":"And we also deal"},{"startTime":788.988,"endTime":790.623,"body":"on the high net worth space."},{"startTime":790.623,"endTime":792.958,"body":"So the high net worth space,"},{"startTime":790.623,"endTime":792.958,"body":"there's not a lot of space"},{"startTime":792.958,"endTime":796.162,"body":"where you just need to know the judges,"},{"startTime":792.958,"endTime":796.162,"body":"you need to know what's going on."},{"startTime":796.162,"endTime":798.631,"body":"And so to me, even more to the point,"},{"startTime":798.631,"endTime":800.065,"body":"you need to know how to work"},{"startTime":798.631,"endTime":800.065,"body":"with the people"},{"startTime":800.065,"endTime":801.901,"body":"because these cases settle"},{"startTime":800.065,"endTime":801.901,"body":"for the most part."},{"startTime":801.901,"endTime":803.636,"body":"You don't see"},{"startTime":801.901,"endTime":803.636,"body":"a lot of litigation about them"},{"startTime":803.636,"endTime":805.871,"body":"because people want to be private"},{"startTime":803.636,"endTime":805.871,"body":"and things like that."},{"startTime":805.871,"endTime":808.274,"body":"And so it's all about"},{"startTime":805.871,"endTime":808.274,"body":"just knowing your people"},{"startTime":808.274,"endTime":810.209,"body":"and putting the good culture together."},{"startTime":810.209,"endTime":812.611,"body":"So I think that's like the key"},{"startTime":810.209,"endTime":812.611,"body":"to the whole thing."},{"startTime":812.611,"endTime":813.813,"body":"That's incredible."},{"startTime":813.813,"endTime":817.216,"body":"So for our listeners,"},{"startTime":813.813,"endTime":817.216,"body":"there are 68,000 family"},{"startTime":817.216,"endTime":819.752,"body":"law firms across the country,"},{"startTime":817.216,"endTime":819.752,"body":"which is pretty."},{"startTime":819.752,"endTime":821.053,"body":"Yeah. Very true."},{"startTime":821.053,"endTime":823.455,"body":"Most of that majority of them"},{"startTime":821.053,"endTime":823.455,"body":"are still practitioners, right?"},{"startTime":823.455,"endTime":824.623,"body":"They're very small shops."},{"startTime":824.623,"endTime":828.561,"body":"And it's being able to"},{"startTime":824.623,"endTime":828.561,"body":"to come in and create"},{"startTime":828.561,"endTime":832.832,"body":"value initially as high if they're open to"},{"startTime":833.966,"endTime":835.201,"body":"letting go."},{"startTime":835.201,"endTime":835.601,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":835.601,"endTime":840.639,"body":"There's so many, single sole proprietors"},{"startTime":835.601,"endTime":840.639,"body":"who are that way because they like"},{"startTime":840.639,"endTime":843.742,"body":"to be in control of all of the things"},{"startTime":840.639,"endTime":843.742,"body":"they have their hands on, all the things."},{"startTime":843.742,"endTime":847.947,"body":"So being able to find a firm"},{"startTime":843.742,"endTime":847.947,"body":"that will allow you"},{"startTime":847.947,"endTime":851.317,"body":"to take things off their plate and create"},{"startTime":847.947,"endTime":851.317,"body":"that value is really important."},{"startTime":852.117,"endTime":852.985,"body":"You said something that"},{"startTime":852.985,"endTime":856.088,"body":"that really struck a nerve,"},{"startTime":852.985,"endTime":856.088,"body":"which was building a great culture."},{"startTime":857.189,"endTime":860.693,"body":"Talk to me about what"},{"startTime":857.189,"endTime":860.693,"body":"you've done to create that culture."},{"startTime":860.693,"endTime":861.694,"body":"I think what we know"},{"startTime":861.694,"endTime":864.864,"body":"and from what we've seen in our firm"},{"startTime":861.694,"endTime":864.864,"body":"is that culture is so important."},{"startTime":864.897,"endTime":865.831,"body":"Having values,"},{"startTime":865.831,"endTime":869.668,"body":"having a vision and being able to share"},{"startTime":865.831,"endTime":869.668,"body":"that vision is is an incredibly important."},{"startTime":869.668,"endTime":872.037,"body":"But when we're dealing with attorneys,"},{"startTime":872.037,"endTime":874.94,"body":"getting them involved"},{"startTime":872.037,"endTime":874.94,"body":"is is sort of a different game, right?"},{"startTime":874.94,"endTime":879.111,"body":"We have our agency and"},{"startTime":874.94,"endTime":879.111,"body":"and young hungry workforce at the agency."},{"startTime":879.511,"endTime":881.28,"body":"Leading"},{"startTime":879.511,"endTime":881.28,"body":"and building a culture at the agency"},{"startTime":881.28,"endTime":882.481,"body":"is much different than the culture"},{"startTime":882.481,"endTime":885.284,"body":"we're building at the law firm"},{"startTime":882.481,"endTime":885.284,"body":"because of who we're dealing with."},{"startTime":885.284,"endTime":887.286,"body":"Yeah, we found that to be true."},{"startTime":887.286,"endTime":889.255,"body":"So I think I get it. Who you pick."},{"startTime":890.322,"endTime":892.057,"body":"We are really, you know,"},{"startTime":892.057,"endTime":894.46,"body":"I mean, I heard you cursing,"},{"startTime":892.057,"endTime":894.46,"body":"so I'm going to say we have a no alcohol"},{"startTime":894.46,"endTime":897.096,"body":"policy, like, very much."},{"startTime":894.46,"endTime":897.096,"body":"I don't care what your book is."},{"startTime":897.096,"endTime":899.531,"body":"None of that matters to me"},{"startTime":897.096,"endTime":899.531,"body":"in any way whatsoever."},{"startTime":899.531,"endTime":903.402,"body":"So that's like number one,"},{"startTime":899.531,"endTime":903.402,"body":"the other thing that we do and I"},{"startTime":903.569,"endTime":903.936,"body":"you know what"},{"startTime":903.936,"endTime":906.038,"body":"I tell this to,"},{"startTime":903.936,"endTime":906.038,"body":"I run a lot of managing partner groups"},{"startTime":906.038,"endTime":907.873,"body":"and a lot of women"},{"startTime":906.038,"endTime":907.873,"body":"managing partner groups, which are,"},{"startTime":907.873,"endTime":911.911,"body":"you can imagine or barbecue between,"},{"startTime":907.873,"endTime":911.911,"body":"as I'm sure you've seen. But,"},{"startTime":913.012,"endTime":915.648,"body":"I have my associates hire associates."},{"startTime":915.648,"endTime":919.885,"body":"And the reason being is that I don't"},{"startTime":915.648,"endTime":919.885,"body":"personally know really what we need."},{"startTime":920.152,"endTime":922.755,"body":"And so again, beer slushie"},{"startTime":920.152,"endTime":922.755,"body":"and people call me all the time,"},{"startTime":922.755,"endTime":923.989,"body":"how do I break in the field,"},{"startTime":922.755,"endTime":923.989,"body":"blah, blah, blah."},{"startTime":923.989,"endTime":925.624,"body":"And I was like,"},{"startTime":923.989,"endTime":925.624,"body":"don't call the managing partner."},{"startTime":925.624,"endTime":929.395,"body":"Like, I try to take like 2 or 3"},{"startTime":925.624,"endTime":929.395,"body":"calls a month just to get back."},{"startTime":929.395,"endTime":931.33,"body":"But generally, don't call me."},{"startTime":931.33,"endTime":934.9,"body":"You should be calling the junior partners"},{"startTime":931.33,"endTime":934.9,"body":"or the senior associate"},{"startTime":934.9,"endTime":937.036,"body":"because they're the ones"},{"startTime":934.9,"endTime":937.036,"body":"who have the hands on the pulse."},{"startTime":937.036,"endTime":938.771,"body":"They're the ones who know"},{"startTime":937.036,"endTime":938.771,"body":"if we need someone."},{"startTime":938.771,"endTime":939.872,"body":"I don't really know."},{"startTime":939.872,"endTime":942.174,"body":"I know that I,"},{"startTime":939.872,"endTime":942.174,"body":"you know, I have work to do."},{"startTime":942.174,"endTime":944.944,"body":"I give it to my workflow attorney"},{"startTime":942.174,"endTime":944.944,"body":"and then it gets done."},{"startTime":944.944,"endTime":946.812,"body":"I don't know how the toilet paper goes in"},{"startTime":944.944,"endTime":946.812,"body":"the role."},{"startTime":946.812,"endTime":948.18,"body":"I'm not involved in that anymore."},{"startTime":948.18,"endTime":950.783,"body":"And so I'm the worst person"},{"startTime":948.18,"endTime":950.783,"body":"to be calling for this."},{"startTime":950.783,"endTime":954.153,"body":"And so for me, my associates come to me"},{"startTime":950.783,"endTime":954.153,"body":"say we need to hire."},{"startTime":954.42,"endTime":956.355,"body":"I say okay, and I say go hire."},{"startTime":956.355,"endTime":958.657,"body":"And the way I look at it"},{"startTime":956.355,"endTime":958.657,"body":"is they do the interviews."},{"startTime":958.657,"endTime":961.76,"body":"I'm usually one of the last interviews"},{"startTime":958.657,"endTime":961.76,"body":"because they're the ones"},{"startTime":961.76,"endTime":963.128,"body":"we're gonna have to work"},{"startTime":961.76,"endTime":963.128,"body":"with these people."},{"startTime":963.128,"endTime":965.631,"body":"And so why am I going to choose"},{"startTime":963.128,"endTime":965.631,"body":"who you're going to sit with at lunch?"},{"startTime":965.631,"endTime":969.134,"body":"You know, and also you"},{"startTime":965.631,"endTime":969.134,"body":"I want you to have interest in it."},{"startTime":969.134,"endTime":972.137,"body":"I want you to feel vested"},{"startTime":969.134,"endTime":972.137,"body":"because your name's going on this person."},{"startTime":972.271,"endTime":974.239,"body":"And at the end of the day, like,"},{"startTime":972.271,"endTime":974.239,"body":"I'm still giving my work"},{"startTime":974.239,"endTime":976.642,"body":"with senior associate"},{"startTime":974.239,"endTime":976.642,"body":"or junior partner, whoever."},{"startTime":976.642,"endTime":979.111,"body":"They have to do it"},{"startTime":976.642,"endTime":979.111,"body":"like they're still responsible,"},{"startTime":979.111,"endTime":981.013,"body":"just like I'm still responsible"},{"startTime":979.111,"endTime":981.013,"body":"if they screw up."},{"startTime":981.013,"endTime":983.649,"body":"So hire somebody that's going to be good."},{"startTime":983.649,"endTime":986.552,"body":"And it's I mean, I will tell you, like,"},{"startTime":983.649,"endTime":986.552,"body":"my associates are tough."},{"startTime":986.552,"endTime":987.486,"body":"I call them mean girls."},{"startTime":987.486,"endTime":991.29,"body":"Like, and it's not just girls, but like"},{"startTime":987.486,"endTime":991.29,"body":"they are, it's hard to get in our door."},{"startTime":991.29,"endTime":993.525,"body":"I would hire"},{"startTime":991.29,"endTime":993.525,"body":"so many more people than they would."},{"startTime":993.525,"endTime":995.361,"body":"But you know what guys look like."},{"startTime":995.361,"endTime":996.362,"body":"I think that's great."},{"startTime":996.362,"endTime":998.364,"body":"And they care and they are invested."},{"startTime":998.364,"endTime":1000.065,"body":"And the person that they choose"},{"startTime":998.364,"endTime":1000.065,"body":"is somebody"},{"startTime":1000.065,"endTime":1001.9,"body":"that they're all ready"},{"startTime":1000.065,"endTime":1001.9,"body":"to put their names on."},{"startTime":1001.9,"endTime":1004.903,"body":"And I've been told that what they do"},{"startTime":1001.9,"endTime":1004.903,"body":"is they interview"},{"startTime":1004.97,"endTime":1006.772,"body":"this is I to kind of find this funny."},{"startTime":1006.772,"endTime":1009.575,"body":"And as soon as like the person clicks off,"},{"startTime":1006.772,"endTime":1009.575,"body":"they have this little system"},{"startTime":1009.575,"endTime":1011.777,"body":"where they have the thumbs"},{"startTime":1009.575,"endTime":1011.777,"body":"and they either go up or down"},{"startTime":1011.777,"endTime":1013.045,"body":"like everyone knows to do it."},{"startTime":1013.045,"endTime":1013.612,"body":"And it's like,"},{"startTime":1013.612,"endTime":1016.081,"body":"and I go, you know, I feel like that's"},{"startTime":1013.612,"endTime":1016.081,"body":"how they basically decide"},{"startTime":1016.081,"endTime":1017.85,"body":"who they're going"},{"startTime":1016.081,"endTime":1017.85,"body":"to get to the next round."},{"startTime":1017.85,"endTime":1019.852,"body":"And I, you know, thumbs up."},{"startTime":1019.852,"endTime":1020.853,"body":"In order to move forward."},{"startTime":1020.853,"endTime":1023.422,"body":"Yeah, you have to have a thumbs. Up"},{"startTime":1020.853,"endTime":1023.422,"body":"I love that."},{"startTime":1023.422,"endTime":1026.392,"body":"So I just I just learned that I was like,"},{"startTime":1023.422,"endTime":1026.392,"body":"oh it's a system, right?"},{"startTime":1026.392,"endTime":1028.227,"body":"It's like work."},{"startTime":1028.227,"endTime":1029.328,"body":"But I that that's the thing."},{"startTime":1029.328,"endTime":1030.963,"body":"And also I don't have to interview"},{"startTime":1029.328,"endTime":1030.963,"body":"a million people."},{"startTime":1030.963,"endTime":1033.966,"body":"That also helps, you know,"},{"startTime":1030.963,"endTime":1033.966,"body":"and by the time someone gets to me,"},{"startTime":1033.999,"endTime":1035.501,"body":"I say like, tell me why?"},{"startTime":1035.501,"endTime":1037.87,"body":"Like how are they going"},{"startTime":1035.501,"endTime":1037.87,"body":"to integrate in our culture?"},{"startTime":1037.87,"endTime":1039.004,"body":"What are they going to do?"},{"startTime":1039.004,"endTime":1042.007,"body":"Where are or"},{"startTime":1039.004,"endTime":1042.007,"body":"what do you see them being strong at?"},{"startTime":1042.107,"endTime":1044.543,"body":"And you know, and we also like"},{"startTime":1042.107,"endTime":1044.543,"body":"and they all rally"},{"startTime":1044.543,"endTime":1047.78,"body":"and our associates are super, super close"},{"startTime":1044.543,"endTime":1047.78,"body":"which partially because they picked"},{"startTime":1047.78,"endTime":1050.516,"body":"who they wanted to sit with. And I think"},{"startTime":1047.78,"endTime":1050.516,"body":"there's something to be said for that."},{"startTime":1051.784,"endTime":1054.253,"body":"We at our"},{"startTime":1054.253,"endTime":1056.822,"body":"business, we call that shared faith."},{"startTime":1056.822,"endTime":1059.691,"body":"Yes. No, I am responsible for the person"},{"startTime":1059.691,"endTime":1063.262,"body":"that I hire, and I'm going to be held"},{"startTime":1059.691,"endTime":1063.262,"body":"accountable for their success."},{"startTime":1063.262,"endTime":1066.465,"body":"And so we have this shared fate"},{"startTime":1063.262,"endTime":1066.465,"body":"where we're moving in the same direction,"},{"startTime":1066.799,"endTime":1069.368,"body":"and it's my ass on the line"},{"startTime":1066.799,"endTime":1069.368,"body":"if you don't work out."},{"startTime":1069.368,"endTime":1069.968,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":1069.968,"endTime":1073.472,"body":"I better interview in a way that's"},{"startTime":1069.968,"endTime":1073.472,"body":"going to allow us to both be successful."},{"startTime":1073.806,"endTime":1074.84,"body":"Yeah, 100%."},{"startTime":1074.84,"endTime":1078.31,"body":"And the only interview question"},{"startTime":1074.84,"endTime":1078.31,"body":"I usually ask is what's your pet peeve?"},{"startTime":1078.377,"endTime":1080.813,"body":"What's your work pet"},{"startTime":1078.377,"endTime":1080.813,"body":"peeve and your own pet peeve?"},{"startTime":1080.813,"endTime":1082.681,"body":"I think that tells so much about a person."},{"startTime":1082.681,"endTime":1085.284,"body":"Like everyone's expecting us all"},{"startTime":1082.681,"endTime":1085.284,"body":"these crazy hard questions,"},{"startTime":1085.284,"endTime":1086.952,"body":"and I let everyone do their thing."},{"startTime":1086.952,"endTime":1089.121,"body":"And then as an AG"},{"startTime":1086.952,"endTime":1089.121,"body":"part of that's my question,"},{"startTime":1089.121,"endTime":1091.123,"body":"I feel like it throws people off."},{"startTime":1091.123,"endTime":1092.291,"body":"But like, I'm always like, you know what?"},{"startTime":1092.291,"endTime":1094.46,"body":"That's what I want to know"},{"startTime":1092.291,"endTime":1094.46,"body":"because you're going to tell me a lot."},{"startTime":1094.46,"endTime":1096.595,"body":"Like if you're someone who's like,"},{"startTime":1094.46,"endTime":1096.595,"body":"I hate when people like,"},{"startTime":1096.595,"endTime":1098.697,"body":"you know, micromanage me, which, you know,"},{"startTime":1096.595,"endTime":1098.697,"body":"that's fair,"},{"startTime":1098.697,"endTime":1100.432,"body":"but that's telling me something"},{"startTime":1098.697,"endTime":1100.432,"body":"right there"},{"startTime":1100.432,"endTime":1103.402,"body":"or someone just like, you know,"},{"startTime":1100.432,"endTime":1103.402,"body":"I don't like anyone touching my desk."},{"startTime":1103.402,"endTime":1105.337,"body":"Okay. Again."},{"startTime":1105.337,"endTime":1106.805,"body":"Okay. That's something I want to know."},{"startTime":1106.805,"endTime":1110.542,"body":"You know, like, whatever it may be,"},{"startTime":1106.805,"endTime":1110.542,"body":"I'm very, you know, like, I have, like,"},{"startTime":1110.809,"endTime":1111.91,"body":"whatever I was gonna say."},{"startTime":1111.91,"endTime":1113.912,"body":"So totally inappropriate,"},{"startTime":1111.91,"endTime":1113.912,"body":"but I want. So anyway, go ahead."},{"startTime":1115.314,"endTime":1117.716,"body":"I'm sitting here racking my brain"},{"startTime":1115.314,"endTime":1117.716,"body":"with, like, well, what's my pet peeve?"},{"startTime":1117.716,"endTime":1118.917,"body":"How would I answer that question?"},{"startTime":1118.917,"endTime":1120.152,"body":"That's right. It's not. It's not."},{"startTime":1120.152,"endTime":1121.553,"body":"Easy. Questions."},{"startTime":1121.553,"endTime":1123.856,"body":"And I also like people"},{"startTime":1121.553,"endTime":1123.856,"body":"to answer quick. Right."},{"startTime":1123.856,"endTime":1125.891,"body":"Because we also can"},{"startTime":1123.856,"endTime":1125.891,"body":"you think on your feet like that's"},{"startTime":1125.891,"endTime":1128.36,"body":"not a question you're expecting"},{"startTime":1125.891,"endTime":1128.36,"body":"especially coming from me."},{"startTime":1128.36,"endTime":1131.263,"body":"And you know, I want to know"},{"startTime":1128.36,"endTime":1131.263,"body":"like what's your reaction time."},{"startTime":1131.263,"endTime":1133.966,"body":"Because I think in our field,"},{"startTime":1131.263,"endTime":1133.966,"body":"you know, we have we're litigators."},{"startTime":1133.966,"endTime":1135.334,"body":"We need to be able to react."},{"startTime":1135.334,"endTime":1136.902,"body":"You guys need some confidence to."},{"startTime":1136.902,"endTime":1139.671,"body":"Yeah, 100%."},{"startTime":1139.671,"endTime":1140.072,"body":"Chocolate."},{"startTime":1140.072,"endTime":1142.241,"body":"I wish we could spend like,"},{"startTime":1140.072,"endTime":1142.241,"body":"like nine days together."},{"startTime":1142.241,"endTime":1144.977,"body":"I really enjoyed this time."},{"startTime":1144.977,"endTime":1147.279,"body":"I really appreciate your story."},{"startTime":1147.279,"endTime":1149.414,"body":"Incredible origin story."},{"startTime":1149.414,"endTime":1152.05,"body":"We love great origin stories here."},{"startTime":1152.05,"endTime":1154.319,"body":"I told you a little bit"},{"startTime":1152.05,"endTime":1154.319,"body":"about our listenership, and"},{"startTime":1154.319,"endTime":1156.555,"body":"and you gave us"},{"startTime":1154.319,"endTime":1156.555,"body":"some really great tips throughout,"},{"startTime":1156.555,"endTime":1159.424,"body":"but is there anything that you'd"},{"startTime":1156.555,"endTime":1159.424,"body":"want to leave,"},{"startTime":1159.424,"endTime":1162.728,"body":"our listeners with as they're thinking"},{"startTime":1159.424,"endTime":1162.728,"body":"about getting into the field,"},{"startTime":1162.728,"endTime":1166.498,"body":"or do I start my own firm,"},{"startTime":1162.728,"endTime":1166.498,"body":"or do I go join a big firm?"},{"startTime":1167.266,"endTime":1169.668,"body":"What what piece of advice"},{"startTime":1167.266,"endTime":1169.668,"body":"could you leave the listeners with?"},{"startTime":1169.668,"endTime":1173.138,"body":"So the piece of advice"},{"startTime":1169.668,"endTime":1173.138,"body":"I give anyone who does this, you should"},{"startTime":1173.639,"endTime":1177.442,"body":"go and intern or work for judges"},{"startTime":1173.639,"endTime":1177.442,"body":"or do something in matrimonial law"},{"startTime":1177.476,"endTime":1178.51,"body":"before going out."},{"startTime":1178.51,"endTime":1181.413,"body":"You're going to make no money in the"},{"startTime":1178.51,"endTime":1181.413,"body":"beginning because it's just not a field."},{"startTime":1181.413,"endTime":1182.781,"body":"You make money, wait until later"},{"startTime":1182.781,"endTime":1185.751,"body":"unless you're part of a big firm,"},{"startTime":1182.781,"endTime":1185.751,"body":"has a small matrimonial practice,"},{"startTime":1185.918,"endTime":1187.719,"body":"so you need to make sure"},{"startTime":1185.918,"endTime":1187.719,"body":"you really want to do this."},{"startTime":1187.719,"endTime":1191.99,"body":"It is emotionally draining work,"},{"startTime":1187.719,"endTime":1191.99,"body":"I love it, I find it so rewarding."},{"startTime":1191.99,"endTime":1192.658,"body":"I wanted to do it"},{"startTime":1192.658,"endTime":1195.661,"body":"since I was like in middle school,"},{"startTime":1192.658,"endTime":1195.661,"body":"which is really weird, but whatever."},{"startTime":1195.661,"endTime":1198.03,"body":"And and yet there's no divorce"},{"startTime":1195.661,"endTime":1198.03,"body":"in my family."},{"startTime":1198.03,"endTime":1200.132,"body":"Like, so like four generations out."},{"startTime":1200.132,"endTime":1201.6,"body":"My parents are both psychotherapists."},{"startTime":1201.6,"endTime":1204.102,"body":"The big family joke because I was too"},{"startTime":1201.6,"endTime":1204.102,"body":"aggressive to be a therapist. But I"},{"startTime":1205.671,"endTime":1209.041,"body":"but, I really think you need to practice"},{"startTime":1205.671,"endTime":1209.041,"body":"like you need to."},{"startTime":1209.074,"endTime":1211.91,"body":"You need to be in it because"},{"startTime":1209.074,"endTime":1211.91,"body":"everybody thinks it's sexy and it's fine."},{"startTime":1211.91,"endTime":1214.446,"body":"No, it's fun to hear about people's"},{"startTime":1211.91,"endTime":1214.446,"body":"sex lives and money and blah, blah, blah,"},{"startTime":1214.446,"endTime":1216.148,"body":"but you need to make sure"},{"startTime":1214.446,"endTime":1216.148,"body":"you can really do this."},{"startTime":1216.148,"endTime":1217.182,"body":"And like hearing people"},{"startTime":1217.182,"endTime":1220.252,"body":"whine all day long and being neutral"},{"startTime":1217.182,"endTime":1220.252,"body":"and really kind of validating."},{"startTime":1220.252,"endTime":1222.588,"body":"And, you know,"},{"startTime":1220.252,"endTime":1222.588,"body":"I always say I'm that's a strength."},{"startTime":1222.588,"endTime":1224.489,"body":"Like you need to make sure you can do it."},{"startTime":1224.489,"endTime":1226.959,"body":"And you don't want to learn"},{"startTime":1224.489,"endTime":1226.959,"body":"that after the fact."},{"startTime":1226.959,"endTime":1228.627,"body":"Like, you want to learn"},{"startTime":1226.959,"endTime":1228.627,"body":"that while you're in law school"},{"startTime":1228.627,"endTime":1231.096,"body":"because you are"},{"startTime":1228.627,"endTime":1231.096,"body":"it is a hard skill to break into."},{"startTime":1231.096,"endTime":1234.433,"body":"So you want to basically be in a situation"},{"startTime":1231.096,"endTime":1234.433,"body":"this is 100% what I want."},{"startTime":1234.833,"endTime":1238.07,"body":"So I think get the experience now"},{"startTime":1234.833,"endTime":1238.07,"body":"while you know"},{"startTime":1238.17,"endTime":1241.807,"body":"you're still under the dime"},{"startTime":1238.17,"endTime":1241.807,"body":"of whoever's paying for you and,"},{"startTime":1242.774,"endTime":1243.275,"body":"find out if"},{"startTime":1243.275,"endTime":1246.278,"body":"this is really where your passion lies"},{"startTime":1243.275,"endTime":1246.278,"body":"because you're going to burn out."},{"startTime":1246.278,"endTime":1248.547,"body":"If it's not, you got a lot of it."},{"startTime":1248.547,"endTime":1248.78,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":1248.78,"endTime":1251.85,"body":"You're dealing with people at some of"},{"startTime":1248.78,"endTime":1251.85,"body":"the worst time of their entire life."},{"startTime":1251.85,"endTime":1255.32,"body":"And if you can add value during that time,"},{"startTime":1255.687,"endTime":1260.726,"body":"you actually are going to be"},{"startTime":1255.687,"endTime":1260.726,"body":"a huge benefit to the rest of their life."},{"startTime":1261.293,"endTime":1264.463,"body":"You got to be"},{"startTime":1261.293,"endTime":1264.463,"body":"you got to have the callous and the muscle"},{"startTime":1264.496,"endTime":1267.499,"body":"built up to be able"},{"startTime":1264.496,"endTime":1267.499,"body":"to do both of those things."},{"startTime":1267.633,"endTime":1269.134,"body":"But I do think it's a wonderful field."},{"startTime":1269.134,"endTime":1269.401,"body":"Can I?"},{"startTime":1269.401,"endTime":1272.271,"body":"I just want to offer"},{"startTime":1269.401,"endTime":1272.271,"body":"a little plug to the field."},{"startTime":1272.271,"endTime":1274.072,"body":"I love it more than anything."},{"startTime":1274.072,"endTime":1277.042,"body":"And like, I mean, I would have"},{"startTime":1274.072,"endTime":1277.042,"body":"thought myself if I was doing taxes,"},{"startTime":1277.309,"endTime":1281.213,"body":"but like I have to say, it's"},{"startTime":1277.309,"endTime":1281.213,"body":"you learn something new every single day."},{"startTime":1281.213,"endTime":1283.615,"body":"I always say I've got like five minutes"},{"startTime":1281.213,"endTime":1283.615,"body":"cocktail conversation."},{"startTime":1283.615,"endTime":1286.618,"body":"I'm pretty much any topic"},{"startTime":1283.615,"endTime":1286.618,"body":"there is because you learn,"},{"startTime":1286.752,"endTime":1289.955,"body":"I learn businesses, I learn,"},{"startTime":1286.752,"endTime":1289.955,"body":"I mean a million different things."},{"startTime":1289.955,"endTime":1292.424,"body":"It is something you"},{"startTime":1289.955,"endTime":1292.424,"body":"every single day is different."},{"startTime":1292.424,"endTime":1293.325,"body":"People are different."},{"startTime":1293.325,"endTime":1296.028,"body":"I can't say enough"},{"startTime":1293.325,"endTime":1296.028,"body":"good things about this type of field."},{"startTime":1296.028,"endTime":1298.43,"body":"Like, I absolutely, absolutely love it."},{"startTime":1298.43,"endTime":1300.399,"body":"So I do think people to dabble in it"},{"startTime":1298.43,"endTime":1300.399,"body":"if you,"},{"startTime":1300.399,"endTime":1301.867,"body":"if that's something you're interested in."},{"startTime":1301.867,"endTime":1304.603,"body":"But again"},{"startTime":1301.867,"endTime":1304.603,"body":"just make sure it's real interest."},{"startTime":1304.603,"endTime":1305.437,"body":"So great."},{"startTime":1305.437,"endTime":1308.44,"body":"Will you please come back as I."},{"startTime":1308.607,"endTime":1309.074,"body":"Would love to."},{"startTime":1310.075,"endTime":1311.81,"body":"Thank you so much for your time today"},{"startTime":1310.075,"endTime":1311.81,"body":"everyone."},{"startTime":1311.81,"endTime":1315.08,"body":"I hope you enjoyed this awesome episode"},{"startTime":1311.81,"endTime":1315.08,"body":"and we will see you next time"},{"startTime":1315.08,"endTime":1316.415,"body":"on the revenue roadmap."},{"startTime":1316.415,"endTime":1320.752,"body":"If you enjoyed this interview"},{"startTime":1316.415,"endTime":1320.752,"body":"with Jacqueline, make sure to check out"},{"startTime":1320.752,"endTime":1323.822,"body":"the other interviews"},{"startTime":1320.752,"endTime":1323.822,"body":"we have during this series."},{"startTime":1323.822,"endTime":1327.592,"body":"At Revenue Roadmap,"},{"startTime":1323.822,"endTime":1327.592,"body":"we have had some amazing conversations"},{"startTime":1327.592,"endTime":1331.33,"body":"and heard some awesome stories"},{"startTime":1327.592,"endTime":1331.33,"body":"telling their,"},{"startTime":1331.863,"endTime":1334.866,"body":"perspective on what it takes"},{"startTime":1331.863,"endTime":1334.866,"body":"to build a successful law firm."},{"startTime":1335.033,"endTime":1336.168,"body":"You will love it!"},{"startTime":1336.168,"endTime":1338.17,"body":"Make sure to check"},{"startTime":1336.168,"endTime":1338.17,"body":"out a few of them right here."}]}