19. Sleepaway Camp II: Unhappy Campers (1988)

🔥🥥  Welcome to Sleaze City, Baybee! This Friday the the 13th CryBaby and Bowie return to the Sleepaway Camp franchise with Sleepaway Camp 2: Unhappy Campers (1988), trading the original’s shock for  sleazier, meta-leaning chaos. 

In this episode they discuss the sequel’s (un)intentional campiness, the puritanical Reagan-era vibe, and the choices made around Angela’s trans identity, while revisiting the film’s most ridiculous kills, quotable one-liners, and chaotic summer camp energy. 

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Intro music by ERK2  (thanks a bunch, dude!) catch his Soundcloud here

Special thanks to Chel B Lockie, Michael Lamarra, Julia Maldonado, Jeff Gorcyca, Raymond Corrado Knutsen, Paige Vice, and Donnie Cianciotto! With out y'all, I would lose my damn mind. 

Transcript

Welcome and Catch Up

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You know what's interesting is that it what's interesting, it fired a lot of my brain cells about, about, uh, special interests that I have uhhuh. So it was a lot of me pausing and looking certain things up and being like, oh, that reminds me of when this thing happened and this relates to this thing and like. How hot does it have to be to cremate a body What is your book of Well, hanging out with your Smartest and Funniest Friend. You know me, I'll kill anybody, but. Hi Cuties and welcome to Horror Icon, your queer playground for all things scary, sexy, and stupid. Y'all know me. I'm crybaby the spooky slut from your wettest nightmare. And I'm joined by, uh, Bowie CAAs. Do you have a tagline? No, because I had the, just when you thought it was safe to be sis again, but I can't use that again. That's, I mean, you could, I, how many episodes have I said on the spooky stuff from Heimer? That's your thing. That's your, um, hello everybody. I'm Lyer. You know what I mean? Like, I don't, I'm a guest. I don't Yeah. But my guests can have a thing. I want my guests to have a thing. I'm still gay. There we go. Just like whatever comes up. Oh, I'm Bowie CAAs and I look like I groom kids. Shut the, I'm sorry. Everybody. Girl. Okay. Instagram reels somebody. Someone's gotta tell on her. Tell them tell the abridged version. Un, unless you don't want to. I made a video about being sad that I wasn't a stranger things, and I, uh, tagged it transactor and said something in the, caption about, a lot of trans projects are being shelved. I wonder why that is.'cause it's true. Look it up. And, immediately the 12-year-old groupers found me and someone said, I look like a groom kids. So, I guess that's appropriate for this series, for this, it is pretty appropriate for this series. Um, for Miss Thing. Mm-hmm. I, I showed, uh, sleep, uh, week Camp one. Mm-hmm. The first one to, a good buddy of mine. He straight everybody. And did he get it? Any of it? He did, yes. He very much did. And then as we spoke about it afterwards, I really saw everything kind of like start to fertilize in his mind, and he was like understanding what we were talking about. But he said, how do you feel? He, to me, he was like, how do you feel about, just like in this world, blatant pedophilia is okay. I was like, what's going on? I'm gonna hold your hand while I say this was, I was like, wait in the movie? And he was like, yeah. And I'm like, oh, it just had to be Sure. well first off, I am sorry that you had to deal with that. People online, don't be assholes. Please don't be assholes. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it's just important to talk about in the scheme of like, this is where we're at. That's very true online. Mm-hmm. And like, I don't have to prove to anybody that I'm not a bad person. I'm not on the list, girl. Like, except the place we used to work is on the list. Oh. Yeah. Yeah. So that's right. I forgot about that. It is to the point where literally like every aspect, someone, you're, everybody is six degrees. It's like six degrees from Kevin Bacon. Yeah. It's, it's, it's the worst kind. It's unfortunately true. Everyone I know is like waking up in a sweat, going, am I in there something? Woof. Well, um, I'm happy to be here. Thank you. I'm happy to have you here. I do want to,'cause you said, I think something that the people need to hear when one of the responses that people get, and I've gotten this too, There's always such an unfortunate wave of people who are just like, well, it's to be expected. Like this kind of, treatment is to be expected because you're the one posting stuff online. And I think you brought up a good point of just like. We don't have to do that. People, I don't think that's, that that's the way to move. No, it's not tolerable behavior to like, it's, I mean it's essentially victim blaming. Yeah. And you know what I'm saying? And I think, I think it's also like us having that attitude of like Hmm. Blogging out the haters to an extreme degree has kind of created the culture that we're in now. Mm-hmm. Of like, nothing bothers me. Nothing can stop me. And anyone who critiques me is a hater. Mm-hmm. Are you sure? Sometimes someone's being a bitch, someone's being a Judy. Mm-hmm. And sometimes Exactly. Yes. Exactly. And that's how I feel about that. Yes, exactly. And sometimes someone is legitimately has a concern. Yeah. And so, you know, it's okay to be hurt by things. And it's also okay to shut your fucking mouth. Yeah. It's okay to not be an asshole about things too. Anyway, I don't wanna be too preachy. No, please. What, what we're about to talk about. I have a thesis statement. I have a thesis statement too. I cannot wait. I wonder if they are in alignment. What if they're completely opposite? What are we gonna do That's even better. Better? I'm gonna get up and walk at the door. No, no, no, no, no. I love that. It's gonna be like this film is for straight people. Well, and only straight people. Uh, well anyway, we'll get to that. Well, so, we are returning to the Sleepaway Camp franchise with Sleepaway Camp two unhappy campers, made in 19 88, 5 years after the original. Mm-hmm. This film. So, uh, of course, as always party people, I have to do a call to action. Don't forget to like, and subscribe and comment and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and a Patreon. And email me if you want to. I do. Check my emails. Anything at all? Can you, at Recipe all, I just need some human contact people. If you listen to this show, please let me know. You're out there. Yeah. And also just watch the movie. Yes, please. Yeah. Just watch it. You know, please God, this, we're not gonna go through like all of the beat points. Um, this isn't, we're not trying to replace the no experience of watching the movie. It's just all about just like shooting the shit about the movie. Mm-hmm. And it's supposed to be the shit that you, you might not have even thought of. Yeah. And then you listen to us and you go, could be, that's a reach, could be, could be, could be cuts of people listening to, I always, I'll always know what you did last summer episode. Oh my God, that clip lives rent free in, in my head. Like, this movie does not deserve this. So. Yeah. Well I have a very similar moment Uhhuh in this lovely, that made me think of it so lovely. That makes me firmly believe that we probably have the same thesis. I cannot wait to find out But anyway, so we'll do some like spoiler free, just general thoughts first and then we will dive into my breakdown and all of that shit. So, Bowie, I will ask you first, yeah. What are your general thoughts of Sleep Away? Two Unhappy Campers? Um, I'm thinking about, you know, I've been watching a lot of, franchises over the past like year. It was like, boy, don't I know it. Yeah. So it was like all the saw films, all the Conjuring films, all the Friday the 13th we're stuck halfway through Halloween. I don't know what happened there. Oh God. We got, that's the worst one. I'm sorry. Okay. But we got to H2O and that was, that's fine. I enjoyed that one. but yeah, so I'm trying to think about all the sequels. You know, you watch the first one and then you're like, whew, you know that Sequel IIS is gonna hit you Sequel. And so I was like. Really no clue. How do you move on? Mm-hmm. From a, from a reveal like the first one, where are they gonna, because you can't, I mean, I, I would hope not. You can't just ignore that, like, move on into the second movie and be like, this lady, just a lady. Just a lady. You can't, like, it's not gonna work. So I was nervous. I'm sorry. And I what, when you were talking about just like, we can't ignore that. It immediately made me think of misery Have you all got amnesia? They just cheated us. That's like the same energy. It's like you can't just No. Do that. Anyway, I have more in common with her, I think. Do you all have amnesia? Anyway, back to what you were talking about, like the sequel is, and knowing that, um,, Issa Rose wasn't coming back. Mm-hmm. But what I will say is I have found that with horror movies, either that lean camp, will continue to lean in with the sequel, they'll kind of push on the gas. Mm-hmm. Or, horror movies that weren't camp, but they for some reason go full into camp. Like for instance, nightmare. Yes. The First Nightmare. Love The First Nightmare. Mm-hmm. It's much more straightforward. The second nightmare goes, okay, girl, buckle in. Yeah. Well, it's because we're gonna start, it's gonna start spiraling here in a way that I love. I know people have feelings. Of course. That's fine. I love having bad taste. Please. I love the Campiest. Versions of movies are usually my favorite. Mm-hmm. So, so you love Seed of Chucky. Yeah, of course. but also trans icon, uh, Gigi. So absolutely. I'm not a monster. Yeah. I'm not a monster to, I'm not a monster. so we love an ally in horror. Thank you, Charles. Um, so to sum it up, I hate that shit up. Mm-hmm. I did. Yeah, I did. It was, towards, towards the end it started to get a little, like we got, okay. Throw a few more kills in there and then we'll get to the end. It felt a little like that. Yes. But for the rest of it I was, I was there. I was locked in. Okay. Me too. I agree. I wasn't ever bored Uhhuh. I was very much like, Hmm. Hmm. Mm-hmm. It's like that was a choice. It was a choice. An interesting one. And I'd prefer a choice as to over no choice. Yes. I would agree with you. I think again, it, same brain cell, uh, my thought I was just like, this film might as well have been directed by Osgood Perkins because I loved the first two thirds of it, and then they lost me at the end, the last half hour. I was not with it. I, everybody, I think this movie is a really fun time. Yeah. I think it's, it does lean very into campy. We kind of start getting into that. Not kind of, we get bitch slapped with a meta self-awareness. Mm-hmm. Not quite scream level, but a little bit more specific than what we got in Jason lives. Especially for the era. Yeah. You know, we're not getting into nineties meta. No, we're just getting into IP ripoffs. That's where we're at in this movie as IP ripoffs. There were moments in here also full of one-liner. The one-liners in this film. Oh, baby. I was grateful for, because it carried over from the first one. Oh, just one liner. After one liner, and so the one-liners and the references and stuff in this one, I was like, okay, girl. Okay. All right. Let me write that down. Uhhuh. Let write that down. And then we get a little, we get a lot of sleaze in this one. It's a very sleazy movie. I didn't think the last one was that horny. And this one really uhhuh. Well because the last one there was like no nudity except for like maybe a little tasteful butt. You know what I'm talking about? Like when, uh, first five minutes this, the first Exactly. This one just tits everywhere but everybody, I will say it's worth a watch. it's very campy. It's very fun. And I think, as a continuation of the story of co there's always room to do better, but I think that this is a fun direction to take it in. You know? It was definitely, unique. I appreciate that. And that's what I'll say about older franchises that you may or may not like, whether it's Halloween Friday, they were very different. And I'll say this for Sleepaway Camp, is that summer camp? A bunch of teens in the same place. Sure, sure, sure. But it's still different Make a choice. And even if I hate the choice, it'll be a choice. Yeah. It'll be a choice. I very much feel that way too. Although I, I will say this, It's very interesting. I feel like we're COTAs right now. We are of, of a class. Welcome to class, everybody. We're gonna school you. I found it very interesting transition'cause I watched Sleep Away Camp and this one back to back. You sure did. And it was fascinating seeing. The original and then seeing this one five years later and seeing the ification of media uhhuh, and how just massaged and just forced into this film, all of that is mm-hmm. I find it absolutely fascinating. Mm-hmm. So just be aware of that. Everybody, like there's, I don't know what you're talking about. I have no idea what you're talking about. I dunno what you're talking about. You dunno what I'm talking about. Who's Reagan? Who is this? Who? Linda Blair. Yeah. Alright, so without further ado, let's get into cry. Babies breakdown. Sleep away. Camp two. Unhappy campers. 1988. Mm-hmm. Welcome back. Summertime sluts and gather around the campfire for a return to camp. Rolling Hills. With Camp AAC Camp era whacked, we find ourselves in an absurdly trashy, yet puritanical hellscape run by TJ Maxx versions of our favorite characters from the original Fre, not though Angela Baker is here and louder than ever as Camp Rolling Hills counselor of the week, and with her brand of camp counseling fueled by the spirit of Ronald Reagan himself. She takes it upon herself to weed out the bad kids by sending them home one by one. And yes, that means killing these naughty teens and this buffet of eighties archetypes find themselves on the receiving end of a series of lackluster kills covered in ketchup, But regardless of the quality of the carnage, Angela continues her chipper reign of terror until the men running this camp have had it with her sending kids home without their permission. And once Angela gets fired for her behavior, she gives up on only punishing the naughty folk and just casually kind of kills everyone else in the camp. Until we're left with Angela's favorite little camper, our adorable yet bland final girl, Molly. Molly. As Molly tries to escape, we're forced to watch a chase scene that gives us nothing before Molly knocks herself out and looks dead enough for Angela to just move on and kill some more. And we end this film with our final girl flagging down a truck only to find Angela behind the wheel. No freeze frame, no triumphant moment. No. Just Angela in a cowboy hat and damn Ricky's impact on that. Ricky's. Ricky's impact. I'm sorry. Before we talk about anything else, we gotta talk about that random Dollar General Dolly Parton at the end of Uhhuh. The Dollar General Dolly Parton going Dollar Parton. I wrote it down. I. Had to pause the film because I was laughing so hard. It was like about her, like smoking in her vice or something like that. Right? It sure was. It sure was. It sure was sounding like me. She said, she said, way I see it. I'm too dumb to drink and too fat to fuck girl. Me too. And Angela's face going, diva. What? What an iconic bitch. What? I love it. Dolly. What are you talking about? Dolly store? Dolly Parton. It feels like, it feels very like, oh, I wanna put my best friend in my movie. That's, that was the vibe it gave me. And honestly, solid decision. Why? Why? Solid decision. Why are you here? Too dumb to drink and too fat to fuck. Got the fuck. Ugh. Yep. Ain't that just the. The, the, uh, the kick in the puss. I was gonna say the, the mission statement of the film. Yeah. All, are you ready to bitch the pot on this one? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. There's some fun behind the scenes to you on this. First off, Felic Rose was asked to come back. Okay. And she did read for Angela, Okay. But she might've seemed too young, I think. Well, according to the limited research that I did before this, um, you know, my cannabis infused, let me find out some cool shit. Yeah. She just wasn't really nailing the comedic parts that they needed her to I see. As an actress. And plus I think she was like going to university after Mm. So it just wasn't a fit. So that's when they brought in Pamela Springsteen, who's Bruce Springsteen's sister. Mm-hmm. nobody knew during the production that she was Bruce Springsteen's sister. This wasn't like a, we're casting you because you're, sister Americana royalty. Right, right, right. Yeah. I mean, hearing the last name Springsteen, the fact that I didn't even cock it, would nobody on set have been like Springsteen. Huh? Springsteen, huh? But what's really funny about, Pamela Springsteen being cast in this, so there's a, a poster for this movie, this poster has this woman with a backpack and like Freddy's Glove and Jason's hockey mask. And it's very confusing. It's bold. the person photographed on the poster is not Pamela Springsteen it was just some random model. Mm-hmm. And they had to do it because Pamela wasn't available the day of the shoot. I truly, the things that fall through the cracks, uhhuh with production stuff. Even now you're like, girl, it's like, we've been doing this for how long now? It's like when you see a, like a a billion dollar film and someone's got a hard front on and you're like, how did this get through? How is, I mean, I mean this is in no way, shape, or form a a billion dollar film, but I'm just thinking about the mustache from sleepaway camp one, even all these beautiful beautifully trashy effects. Yeah. And then the mustache was like a fucking, like you, you, you cut it off of your dog and you glued it to your upper lip. It was wild. Yeah. Let's see. Uh, so this was shot in Georgia. It was shot in Waco, Georgia. Georgia. It was shot in six weeks. Mm-hmm. Filmed, back to back with Sleepaway Camp three Teenage Wasteland. Sure. So I'm gonna reference that'cause I have some points to make about theories that I have about that, but it was basically, it was shot in tandem or like, you know, right. One right after the other. So we didn't have as many underage actors in this film. Like, it wasn't, it wasn't like the first one where there was earnestly a bunch of children. Mm-hmm. But there were a couple of children. So, in this script, there was a line that was supposed to say, and these are the, the two kids, the perverts that were taking the Polaroids, there was a line where they were supposed to say, Hey, Amelia, check out those nips. But Georgia reps said that they couldn't have any underage kid say that, so they changed the line to, Hey, Amelia, party hats at two o'clock. Which is arguably a better line. Anyway, I'm sorry, I, of all the notes that I took, how did I miss that line? It's when, um,, she's getting outta the pool. Right. And I think i's a white t-shirt moment. I think I was just so I, my eyes were up here. There was that moment where I, the director had me where he wanted me. Mm-hmm. And so everything else was somewhere else. Yeah. Yeah. Nope. Yep. That's when it happened. Mm-hmm. That's so funny. Wow. Party hats at two o'clock. I'm gonna say that nips is pretty bad. Nips nips. Nips. I would've rather than say titties or milk. Duds. OUAs milk Duds. Milk duds. Mosquito bites. Yabos. Yabos reference is crazy from fucking yabos. What's, oh my God. Why am I, I'm gay. I'm supposed to remember this hocus pocus. I'm gay. I'm gay. Course I couldn't wear anything like that because I don't have any, what do you call'em, max Yabos. Max likes her yabos. In fact, he loves'em. Let's see, yabos, uh, Valerie Hartman, who is the actress that played Ally, who is the one that is always showing her tits, is overage. Please? Yes. Okay. For a minute. Yes. She's of age. I dunno, I had a, I, as my research came me is Yeah, fear came over me after our discussion of, of the first one. And that's true. A whole thing was like, we gotta find a naked man. Yeah. That whole thing. I last minute. I can't do that again. So from what I, from what I read, she really enjoyed doing all of the nudity scenes.'cause she very much loved, you know, showing off her body. I'm like, good for you. And you can tell in her performance, yeah, you sound fun. She, she's so comfortable in a lot of those moments. the scene where she's having sex with the dude in the woods Uhhuh, complex, which is a media site, uh, ranked it number five out of the 15 best topless moments in mainstream horror movies. And flashback ranked it number 16 in the top 20 gratuitous nude scenes of the 1980s. Can I just say the bar's really low? Of course not. Because No shame to this woman and her, her BGAs Uhhuh. Um, they're great. They're lovely. Yeah. That, that scene in the woods went on a while, very a while. It could, I, I don't know, could have been more visually stimulating. Oh, of course. So the bar's pretty low. Mm-hmm. I'd say what were, what was number one on those lists? I didn't check. Now I'm incredibly curious. Goddammit. But it's funny because it's like, okay, are we talking about like only American films? That's true. Because the minute we leave the American border, we, I mean, we get into uns simulated sex scenes. Fucking literally, literally someone who's watched like, quite a bit now of like French extremists, like fucking Jello films. I'm like, girl, we gotta, what, what is the bar at here? Because I don't think, I think we're at the state championships and not at the Olympics. That's fair. Yeah. We're competing at regionals right now. So that's, that's funny though. That's true. That's very, very true's funny. If I were her and I saw that on the number, I'd be like, you can't put me higher. I'm like, uh, these, I, I mean my eyes, oh no, my tits are down here. My tits are down here. It's okay. You can look at them. Yeah. All. Are you ready for the Rotten tomato score? Yeah, we did. I didn't look it up and I only c curs orally saw the sleepaway on, uh, letterbox, so Yeah, Mm-hmm. Rotten Tomatoes. Tomatoes. Our score di has gone down from sleepaway camp one, not surprising, uh, tomato meat, 58%. Mm-hmm. Our happy review mm-hmm. From Anthony Arrigo, from Dread Central. It's absurd, trashy, violent, nasty, disgusting, and entirely entertaining. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I don't disagree. I don't dis Well, I wouldn't say entirely entertaining. Again, the first two thirds, I, I mean, it, it, I mean. Yeah, but you're not going into this thinking. It's gonna be, I dunno. That's a very good point. Schindler's List. Like, I'm not go, I, my, my expectations are did you just managed, did you just reference Schindler's List in our episode about Sleepaway camps too unhappy? Yes. I, it was my first thought of like, cinema. Cinema, you know what I mean? Like when you think of cinema, cinema, it was either that or like the Irishman or like Citizen Can or something like that I have not seen. Yeah. It's like I'm not expecting this to be a Norson Wells joint. Yeah. So I'm always curious when people are like, this is trash. That's fair. I'm like, what's your bar though? Mm-hmm. What's your comparison? That's a very good point. I also think, and we've had this conversation before, and like it's, it's when I go into movies. I'm not rooting against it. I wanna have a good time. Yeah. Even if there's things that I don't like about it, which there's a lot of things I don't like about this movie, I still enjoyed it. Mm-hmm. There's only one movie that I've watched for this podcast so far that I absolutely hated and was, that was third. I always know What you did last summer. Yeah, I was gonna say, and I'm just gonna leave it at that. This is a fun movie, Scott Weinberg from e film critic.com. Come on Scott. on a normal movie scale, I'd rate sleepaway Camp two pretty damn low. But the healthy body count and copious Gore rates this a must-see for any self-respecting horror freak. And that was a bad review. What is, it was like low ranking. What is a normal movie scale? That's what I wanted to talk about. What's a normal movie? That's what I wanted to talk about. I don't. Oh, see now sound off in the comments people. What the fuck is a normal movie? Okay. This, yeah, this is really, we're digging in deep here. You know what I think when I think normal film, you know what I just watched the first time the other day because Michael was like, we should watch it. You haven't seen it. It's a foundational text. F1. Uh, absolutely not. Brad Pitt Honey. I'm so sorry, girl. No. Um, fucking both 21 and 22 Jump Street. I don't know if I've seen either of those. The, yeah. The fucking Jonah Hill with fucking and Channing Atu. Channing Tatum joints. Wow. Those feel like normal movies. it's not offensive to anybody. Uhhuh. There are moments that anybody will find enjoyable. Mm-hmm. Whether you loved the filmer. Didn't. Okay. There will be moments that you go, that was enjoyable. Mm-hmm. Funny, interesting. Mm-hmm. Is, that's what I think about a normal film, it's just like, it has to appeal to the most common denominator, I guess. Yeah. To people with, uh. The most, I, I don't know if basic taste is the, the way of putting it. A palette that is very sensitive. Maybe a date movie. Ugh. You barely know this person. Oh, a date movie? Okay. Yeah. No, not date movie. You barely know this person. No idea. Maybe even what their middle name is. So you pick said movie and are like, yeah, okay. Yeah. I see. Probably won't offend their sensibilities. You know what, that's uh, you know what's so funny? We were debating this now, but I'm now currently having a flashback to a conversation that we had And I remember making a comment about us not really seeing normal movies. Yeah, I really don't watch normal movies. I guess that's why we're friends. Yeah. Pop meter. I'm sorry. I will do. I am nothing, I'm not reliable about getting us on track. Don't you ever apologize for that. That's what I want. Uh, popcorn Meter. Mm-hmm. Uh, 51%. Eighties tits. Ooh. Bad acting and gruesome murder. Mm. These are the ingredients for a fun Saturday morning flick. Okay. That's so true though. That seems so real for that because like I work Saturday nights, so sometimes in the morning I'll just throw something on. That's so real. It's so real. Saturday morning. Yeah. It's like, it's like the cartoons. And you know what though? Actually not far off, because there are some elements of this movie that are Looney Tunes as fuck. Mm-hmm. It's a very Looney Tunes ass movie. True. Consider your pot bitch to everybody. Did, did you not stumble upon, or maybe you just didn't see anyone, you were looking like transphobic stuff because we had talked about this in the first one. No, there was no, because, well, because, okay. And actually let's talk about it now that we're getting into the movie. Let's talk about the transation of Angela Baker because fascinating. I do feel like it's in, I feel like it's kind of thrown away. Mm-hmm. It's, and I, part of me is grateful for that. Mm-hmm. And part of me is just like, well, I don't think they knew what to do with this plot twist from the first movie. What are your thoughts? Well, I think maybe we should return to our mission statement. Mm-hmm. Our thesis statements. Mm-hmm. Because I think it has to do with that. Mm-hmm. Because I had thoughts from. Like minute two based on a line that was said. I said, I might know exactly where this film is going. Uh, and I kind of did. Mm-hmm. And you referenced it. Um, and so to me, the line that happens right away and tells you right away what the vibe of this is, is fucking, what's his name? it was Sean. Oh, Sean's right. Telling the story about Angela Uhhuh. And he goes, but she wasn't a she, she was a he. And then. Years later, she went to a psych ward and they gave her a sex change on our tax dollars. Yes. That's exactly what made me, I was like, and I sat up straight and I said, oh, this is a rich text. I fear Uhhuh. And it's like, okay. And his father is a cop. His father is a cop. His father's a cop. One of the cops away. His mom left when he was young. How could you leave a cop? How could you leave a cop? America's greatest, could leave a cop and marry a foot doctor. A foot doctor. That's right. I was locked in for that scene. I actually really like the acting between the two of them. You know what's so funny? Yeah. The acting is better, but I also think that this movie suffers for having better acting. Yeah, yeah. In some regards I believe it. You know, because then there are moments of camp that, because there's just like maybe are not fully camped. Yeah. It's just kind of like a white bread for some of the performances. Mm-hmm. I think, Allie did a great job and I think, you know, Pamela did a great job. Mm-hmm. But yeah, back to your point. Yeah. That, that, that stood out to me too and I was like, okay, we are very much in like the conservative era of media. Mm-hmm. We were very much like, you know, full blown like video nasties is going Satanic panic, it's 10:00 PM Do you know where your children are? Hopefully not getting trans out there in the psych ward. Yeah. Yeah, it's music bands and the parental advisory mm-hmm. Situation. Yeah. Like I, that's very rampant throughout the film and they set that tone super, super easy. And I think that's the part, that's why I'm kind of so grateful that like, it, they don't linger on her trans identity mm-hmm. That long. But it is weird because at the end of the first one,'cause we talked about this a lot, from the first one, they have to make a choice. Mm-hmm. Over whether, you know, we have been told in no uncertain terms. Mm-hmm. Aunt Martha Trans, his gender. That was not his choice. Not his choice. Forcibly. Danielle, we get a scene where she decides and she goes, Angela's a good name. Angela's a good name. Yeah. Okay. Um, so they have to decide at the end, they have revealed this twist. They have to decide which way she, now, now are we going where he, he she is going to be the lead again? What are they identifying as? Mm-hmm. And, and it's interesting. I would love to know how or why they made the choice. Mm-hmm. Because it is not the same thing as what a lot of plenty of movies did before then and after then, which is. Man in drag. Mm-hmm. Man, in a dress. It was not that. Yes, it was Angela is, Angela now has not, they, they call her Angela mm-hmm. Throughout the whole film. Mm-hmm. It's mostly she pronouns, they, they have to throw in a moment or two. It's like literally he, yeah, she a, he, whatever. But for the most part, I was kind of surprised by that because like, I don't know, it would've been way easier for them to do a fucking Norman Bates type shit. Mm-hmm. Um, exactly. And that's what I'm happy about. Yeah. Because I feel like it could have gone that way where it's like they had Angela transitioned back to Peter. Mm-hmm. And then the same setting and scenario except Norma Bates it when it's just like you have Peter being mask presenting during the day, and then Angela comes out at night and kills all these people when he gets triggered. And I. I was afraid that that's where they could have gone, and I'm glad that they didn't go. Yeah. Yeah. I'm glad that it was just acknowledged of like, oh, okay. Like she, she had a, uh, an operation, she transitioned and she's now living her life as a woman. Mm-hmm. That's that. Now let's focus on her puritanical obsession with morality mm-hmm. That apparently Aunt Martha instilled in her. This was my thought. Okay. So the whole thesis statement that I have that is probably shared between the two of us, one, uh, Angela is now being someone who was deprived of a childhood mm-hmm. Has not grown out of being a child. Mm-hmm. In the way that she behaves and speaks to other people mm-hmm. And is very petulant when she doesn't get her way. Mm-hmm. Very like young girl sort of behavior. Yes. And two, she is exhibiting behavior that very much shows us who she was parented by, because I think by the end in the final cabin and her mothering Molly. Yeah, that's true. I see a lot of parallels between the little bit that we saw Aunt Martha of like, she is like play acting, playing house of what she thinks being a woman is. Yeah. Um, which then leaves that question of like, what's been going on between movies, like way we know that. A very good question. Apparently she went to a psych ward and, and whatever. Electro shock therapy and like all like meds and all this shit. Yeah. It's kind of like the jump from Oh yeah, Michael was in the psych ward. He's out again now though. Mm-hmm. It's like, okay, well what, what happened between all this time? And then three, this movie. You could either, depending on which way you fall, use this movie to say it is conservative and puritanical, or trying to make fun of conservative puritanical mm-hmm. Values. But I, I don't think it fully lands on one side of the other. Me either. And it baffles me. Mm-hmm. Because there are so many lines that you're like, oh, this, it's not taking itself seriously. It's like a caricature kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. It's like when we talked about like, nobody's on mar, nobody's doing that. Yeah. This one felt a little bit less sure of it, weirdly enough, more meta, and yet less sure of its mm-hmm. Statement. That makes a lot of sense. And I think that's a side effect of just like. Like the, the degradation of the eighties slasher. Mm-hmm. And just becoming significantly more like commercialized and, and of course like attacked by, uh, people who are morally outraged by it and everything. And I think it's, it's one of those things where I would very much like to say that they were intentionally making fun of those conservative values, Yeah. But like, yeah. I was wondering if you felt the same way while watching it, because I am led to by what I watch and who I am as a person. Mm-hmm. I'm always led to like, this is camp. Mm-hmm. This is like whatever. And then you put yourself into like, well this is 18, 18 88 girl sleepaway Camp 2 18 88, 18 8 electric boo old before summer camp. Old summer camp. Which is basically just a coal mine. Yeah. The children yearn for the mines. Mm-hmm. Um, 1988 mm-hmm. Is very specific time period. And Yeah. You have all the, like US history flood into your brain and you go, oh yeah. Mm-hmm. I don't know because it, if that came out now, depending on the studio mm-hmm. If that came out like on Shutter tomorrow, I think it would be a much different story. A hundred percent. Like I see what you're, I see what you're doing here. Well, at this point I think media literacy is like, uh, both like at its worst in the public, but I think creatively a lot of people now know it's like, There's, uh, an opportunity to add value to my work by being intentional with, I think we all understand that, movies and horror movies and this type of media can be excellent vehicles for, making a point or showing a perspective or making a political commentary or a social commentary, things like that. Mm-hmm. I don't necessarily know if that was kind of a thought pattern back then. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Um, as much as we may be crediting it. Yeah. You know? Yeah. It's always that thing too, where it's like sometimes there's a random one-off person who thinks completely differently mm-hmm. From other people at the time, or, you know, films are such a big undertaking. The director's feelings could be different from the screenwriter's feelings could be different from the actor's feelings like. They often are such big productions that the, they're a bit disparate mm-hmm. In their ideas and thoughts, and so sometimes they don't necessarily all come together. Mm-hmm. So it is hard to come down unless the director or whatever has made like a straightforward statement, which a lot of directors don't like to do. Yeah. Either. It's giving, um, you said a eraser head was your most spiritual film. Can you elaborate on that? No, no. Like, it's giving that, it's like no. Okay. Next question. Um, next question. Yeah. So you're kind of just left of like that back and forth of like, your hindsight is 2020 versus your modern day lens. Yeah. It's, yeah. Et cetera. And it's all valid when you're like looking at media. It doesn't, you know. but all that to be said, I think Angela as a character, I do think it was a very interesting and successful choice. It's weird for her to be a quote unquote transsexual leading the, campaign of purity in this film. So funny. We start right away by being like, she's a trans, and then into like, oh, but it's okay.'cause she's Yeah. But, but she's on our side. She's uphold traditional values. Yeah. The ation of Angela Baker. This is so, like my brain. I was so confused. Well, yeah.'cause immediately we get into her just being like, good girls don't show it off. So it is fascinating that, in an era like the, the eighties, that you do have this trans character mm-hmm. Who is in fact upholding the same oppressive ideals that are. Damaging to her, which is less about her gender and more about Aunt Martha. It all comes back to that. It comes back to fucking Aunt Martha. You cannot, aunt Martha, Andrea is not in this movie and I missed her. So bro, imagine getting like a scene of them at like tea or something. Like her visiting her in the psych ward. Yeah, I was gonna say visiting. Like visiting in the psych ward and just being like, we're gonna get you out of here, babe. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it would've added just that little extra bit of like, yeah. How Angela's behaving is on purpose. Mm-hmm. Because that's a big change too, in this one. Mm-hmm. Total change. Yeah. She's in total control it's less reactive and more judgmental. Mm-hmm. You know, more, more planned. Like, I think about all the times that she's spying on people. Like the shit twins. The shit sisters. Which can we talk about them? Yeah. I love the shit sisters. The shit sisters are great fucking much. It's great. Ugh. I,'cause I love the, the, the bickering in this and the, and the, I think similar to the first one, it feels very accurate for the way with the bully the kids behave. Yeah. their worst thing they could say about the shit sisters is that they smoke weed. Like, and that's not wrong. No, it's true. Like, it's literally like fine. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? Like they're being catty towards each other, but it's nothing that really matters. Yes. I do have to read from the shit sisters. Oh my god. They're little songs. Yes. They're little. Yes. Okay. Because to preface it, they have a little song. Um, Angela Baker, we find out that she's the camper of the week, and she sings her favorite song, which is, I'm a Happy Camper, camper, whatever. Well, the shit sisters, they end up having their own version of, of it. She sings, I'm a happy camper. I love to drink and fuck. And if you pay me money on my titties, you can suck I fucking love that. So funny. And she's singing it while smoking weed, while her sister is like making out with some random guy or drinking. And it's like, she can't quite even get the words all the way up. She's like, too far gone. Yeah. And then Angela, they're the quintessential, like I think about the stoner episode that I did with Chris Veo from, queer Horror High, their mm-hmm. Former podcast. gosh, I wish I had seen this movie before the episode because mm-hmm. The show sisters definitely would've made it on, uh, some sort of list. I think they're, they're exactly what you would expect from a movie stoner. Yeah. And they get exactly the kind of death that you would expect for a movie stoner Yeah. Barbecuing them is so funny. It's so funny, and I love the, I guess this says something about me that I'm watching that scene and I'm going, Uhhuh, and then the other part of my brain is going. That's definitely not hot enough to burn a body. How long has she been laying there that, that, that, that her sister is now a crispy fried onion. Exactly. It must have been quite a while. Like quite a while. Brain was like spitting and I was like, maybe this is not what we're meant to focus on. Yeah. I this moment. Yeah. And that, that actually leads me to, I, I miss the special effects from the first one. Mm. I miss them so much, although Aunt Martha and the special effects. They, yeah. Although they do hit us, uh, real quick with like, don't worry, this'll be a lot more full frontal violence with the fucking whacking that girl with a tree limb. It's so bad. It's so aggressive. And her donk, the gooey is blood. And the actress grabs the other side of her head. Yes, she did. And you just see it like, if her brain down flew to the other side of it and she's like, oh. But it was like, oh, so this is what we're doing. It's like, this is where we're at. Yeah. Okay. No more of the like a shot of the knife, a shot of her screaming. We're not doing that anymore. We're, it's, you're gonna, you're see it's very, it's Looney Tunes. Yeah. It's very Looney Tunes. For better or for worse. Yeah. Um, but yeah, I love the barbecuing of the shit sisters. Um, the shit. And I honestly, I love the style of them too. I love their like, cut up little camp shirts and their high frizzed out crimped ass ponies. And if, if you didn't have a fucking shirt with all the holes ripped in the side to show off your sports bra, then, I mean you didn't live the girl experience. No, not at all. I have a whole section in my notes for the kills. I will say, I think honestly for the most part they're the best part. The kills are the kills mostly because of the one-liners. Yeah. Okay. Well then like, I love her being like, Angela, where are you? Right here, thunk. That's funny. That's true. Yes. Like the log, like again, it sets up like how the rest of the film is gonna be. every kill in this is like. It's wild. Yeah. Well that's, he, he, he, let's talk about kills. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so there was Phoebe, the one that we're talking about, the first kill of the movie Phoebe. We covered the shit, sisters. Mm-hmm. Um, mare. You love Ma. I love Mary. Let's talk about Mary. And I love her kill. they have that whole conversation that like, this movie keeps doing that to you. There'll just be these big swabs of like, whatever. And then you'll get like this, like chunk of dialogue and you're like, there's something there. Like what? Mm-hmm. I want, give me more of that. And they have this, they start to have this conversation and Mary's like pissed off and emotional and Angela's driving her and she's like, um, why, why do you feel like you have to perform so much? And like you only showed your tits off because you're trying to impress Ali. Mm-hmm. And why don't you just be yourself? And I was like, Angela Point taken Angela. And then when she calls her Mary and she's like, I hate that name. My name is mayor. I was like, so now we're getting into a discussion about identity and names. And preferred names. Mm-hmm. And like what is expected of you. And so it's weird that Angela, Angela is such a like dichotomy still between like, you gotta be yourself. Mm-hmm. You gotta live free. But then she has very specific ideas of what's Okay. Exactly. To be as far as yourself. Yeah. So she's kind of, John cramming it a little bit. Yeah. Literally you're like girly pop. I think you're, mm. I feel like getting your mixed signals here. If Angela Baker existed in the early two thousands, she would've been jigsaw's apprentice a hundred percent. 100% her, she, before Amanda, like the Amanda, she would've killed Amanda. She would've taken Amanda out. And I love Amanda Young. She would've been like, I love Amanda Young. Amanda's out here killing people in these slutty tank tops and Yeah. Cargo pants, I can't have that. Yeah, absolutely. She'd be killing people. Yeah, but you're right, I do, I do love that about ma. Um, and with the drill, it's kind of funny. I love the drill. You love the drill moment? Yeah. Be I just,'cause I love her casually. Re because she's say basically saying like, we don't have to go home. Like, I'm giving you a shot, Uhhuh. And Mary's just like, no, she this dramatic her reaching between the two of them. Uhhuh, what are you reaching for? A gun? No, a drill. A drill. It's ketchup. Ketchup, ketchup's. Yeah. And it's like, I eat that up. You know what, what I mean, like, that's what I want. Or like even the, the one liner with the, the shit sisters, the say no to drugs, say No to drugs, and then she is smiling, puts on her little army cap. I need a dare t-shirt. Oh her. But it's her face through the flames say no to drugs. Drugs. And another thing about the kills. Okay. So I listened. I was like, I can't wait to geek out about this. Mm-hmm. With them. I recently listened to the audiobook of, men, women in Chainsaws. I'm about to read that for, I'm doing a Final Girl episode for Women's History Month. Girl. Yeah, girl. It was one of the most riveting things I have read slash listened to mm-hmm. In a long time. It was like everything I love, it was like fucking academic. Mm-hmm. Essays about horror and gender and sexuality. You and I are one in the saying, ah, like Carol J Clover wrote this. Yes. It's an academic look at horror films. Carol j Clover is the first person to coin the term Final Girl. Mm-hmm. Like, she, she defined what the Final Girl is. Mm-hmm. It's, it's a quintessential text, essential text, very academic required reading. Yeah. Um, but I never, I didn't think that it gets to a point that's, um, too dry. But also I eat that up. So I was gonna say, if you love horror, then yeah, it's fun. Um, but I, the best part of the book for me. Is the part where she talks about The difference between slasher, well occult films. Mm-hmm. It is usually the narrative about a, a man or a masculine figure having to open up and accept in the spirit the ghost. Mm-hmm. The emotions. It's like very much that it's like a man having to disconnect from masculinity a bit, let in femininity, whatever. Yeah. Because you know, occult stuff is always about like, let it in, like being vulnerable and being penetrated. There's a lot of that. Interesting. And then with slasher films, it is the opposite with the idea of the final girl. It is usually. A girl who then has to become masculine to a certain degree mm-hmm. And inherit that masculine energy from the killer, killer, from the killer, hence all of the very phallic murder weapons, what have you. And I was noticing that about, uh, this, especially as that, I mean, as with most slashers, but it was interesting because, you know, Angela then takes on the very like masculine slasher role mm-hmm. With a lot of phallic weapons, like a drill especially. Mm-hmm. It feels very, it feels very curling iron, There's, there's, you know, there's a chain, a bat, a but like a log and like a drill mm-hmm. Feels very specifically, but, and yet her one-liners are not, in my opinion, very masculine. No. Because they're camp and it's like, it's very chipper. It's very like, what I love about her performance in it is like she's very like. Pamela Springsteen has such a friendly face. Mm-hmm. And she uses that so well in this part because she's so warm and so like super and happy and very open. Yeah. And approachable. But she's actively killing people while smiling like this. It's great. And you know what, I think, you know what I, you know what I think, what do you think? Think this one she, Angela, has learned to perform is what I think. Yes. She is performing femininity. She's performing socialization. This is, we're we're getting into, I, I know you did last summer type. It does not deserve this, but as someone who was raised as a girl who's definitely on the autism spectrum, but had to learn to be all those things, because I was just like, I'm clearly very different from all of these other girls and people. I need to figure it out. So like I taught myself how to be friendly and how to have a sense of humor and make eye contact and. Be like bubbly and chipper because it, that's what you had to do. Mm-hmm. Otherwise you would be an outcast. Um, yeah. Well, and you also have to think about too, going back to kind of your point about like what happened between these two movies. Mm-hmm. It's like she learned how to perform, and she learned it in an institutionalized setting mm-hmm. Where it's like there was a correct way to behave as a girl, and that was rewarded with like, freedom and whatever. Mm-hmm. And now she's out in this world and it's like, well, I had to go through all of this shit. Mm-hmm. To learn how to perform this femininity And I see so many other people not doing that, and that's just not fair. That's not right. I just had a horrible thought. What's a horrible thought? Do you know who Blair White is? Blair White. Blair White. I hope you don't. I don't think so. Blair White, I don't even know if she still does it now. I don't know what she's doing, but she's that fucking white conservative trans woman that was like making a lot of content on YouTube over the past like 10 years. Yeah. And it slowly became like, I'm one of the good ones type shit. And she was one of the first like big pushes of like, yes, I'm trans, but I'm, I'm serving perfect godly, wearing makeup in a god honoring way type shit. Um, and it makes me think of that. That's very trues. It's okay to be different as long as it still fits. Performs inside of our rigid beliefs as it doesn't threaten anything. Exactly. Exactly. If it doesn't make people uncomfortable, it's fine. Yeah, exactly. And so it does feel very like that. It's very much like, it's okay honey, that I weirdly groomed you into not actually being trans, but now. Basically your only recourse mm-hmm. Is to be trans because you're less threatening as a woman mm-hmm. Than a man. Like I very point so much going on there. also kind of the throwaway, sort of idea that that's still continues to now. That is just. You go into a big building and you come out a different gender. Like you get all the surgeries in one day. Yeah. You go in, it's like a conveyor belt with robotic arms, like ripping hits off and putting shit like, it's like a Mr. Potato head. We kind of, I mean, we don't have to get into it because, I mean, it's such a thing, but I think about this a lot is that to this day that's still people's, understanding of being trans is it's still very much a binary thing. Mm-hmm. And it's very people in positions of power, who have wealth, who have influence, who can literally leave the public eye mm-hmm. For a while and then come back for all intents and purposes, a different person. Mm-hmm. Which allows mm-hmm. Everyone, the grace to like. For instance, Elliot Page. Mm-hmm. Oh, well, you would never confuse Elliot with who they used to be. Mm-hmm. Because we don't see Elliot for a while, and then it's a totally different person. It's like fully, yeah. You know, surgery hormones, like all these, same thing with Caitlyn Jenner. Same. I was about to say. Yeah. Like you go away and you come back a different person. Mm-hmm. Which I think makes it easier for cis people. So it's so funny, the idea of going into a psych ward. First of all, you go into a psych ward as a trans person, and you think they're gonna try and help you be trans. Are you serious? Girl? They're gonna try and help girl. They're gonna medicate. They're gonna give you a lobotomy girl. They said, well try on some Valium. And, uh, we'll see how that goes. And here's a little, here's a little electricity to help you out. Yeah. Shock. Some good sense India. And if that doesn't work. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Like, uh, will begrudgingly give you gender affirming surgery? Begrudgingly girl. What? Only because the taxpayers are paying for it. All right. Let's go back to the kills. Let's go to the fun stuff. Yeah. Yeah. ooh, Anthony and Judd. Oh my God. Anthony and Judd have the meta kill of this movie. Holy. It's tasty. It's, so we borrow ip, these two kids are like, what? They're trying to scare Angela by wearing a very bad Freddy Krueger, makeup and a very bad knockoff Jason mask. Mm-hmm. And as they're trying to scare Angela, she gets the jump on them as a very confusing leather face, but potentially made with a Michael Myers mask. I wasn't sure. The references are just like, it's like stone soup, baby. They just throw it in there and hope you like it like crazy. It was a little baffling it. Yeah. And I look, they're like, this is, this is the big plan. I've been cooking up a big plan. I know they're gonna love this. They're gonna fucking love this. It was very disorienting though. Like of course we love it as horror fans. We love seeing references to, to other films, but it's, it's just confusing in this world. It's like, I'm sorry that you are seeing this instead of the new. Franchise film. So here, yeah. You can have a little taste of Freddy. Well, that's true. Just like, yeah, Jason, let's give them some of their favorite slop. Well, it's like, you know what, if we put this on the poster, we have to put it in the movie, but we wanna put it on the poster so people will come and see the movie. So it makes sense. And again, the, the woman becoming the man mm-hmm. Again, of the killer. Mm-hmm. You don't expect, literally expect it to be a woman. Literally. Yeah. Yeah. But that's how they die. They get, they get, sliced and chainsawed from Angela Baker, cute Angela. But the blood looks like ketchup. The blood looks like ketchup. I do kind of love the, constant references to like red things appearing like blood. Oh, okay. Let's, yes. The syrup and the ketchup. They used that gag so many times. Yeah. Where it's like somebody will get killed and it'll cut immediately to like red paint on the floor and then it pans up and there's a little girl like, I hate it here, I wanna go home. That part was so funny because I was like, in what context? Does this make sense? Yeah. And they pan up. It's just who spills an entire bucket of red paint. I'm too autistic for this. I need to know why Someone spilled whole thing of paint and it's not being addressed. And this one girl is overstimulated and wants to go home. Either that or she's got, she's force sensitive. She knows something's going on. Something's going on and she's gotta get outta dodge. Yeah, she's credited as the girl that gets sent home. Which is funny because the euphemism throughout the movie is that everybody that dies gets sent home. So I'm like, wait. Does she actually get sent home or sent home? Not in a body bag. Not in a body bag, yeah. Let's see what else, what else, what else did Ali? yes. Yeah. So Ali, I think probably one of the more brutal ones. Yes. Because there's no camping music to this one. It's also. Allie definitely is the most interesting story. I agree. In the movie, I agree a hundred percent. That fucking sex scene in the bathroom, I was crying, laughing because it felt so realistic in the way that it was such a mess. It was a sloppy mess. No one knew what they were doing. She's getting thrashed around in there and being like, can you, can you? And it's just like, I love like the lingering shot on their legs Yeah. It was actually, I think that was very funnily shot a little too long, but also that helped with the awkwardness of it. Yeah. It was so funny to me. Mm-hmm. And because she has so many like funny moments and irreverent moments. Yeah. Her kill, she, I actually wrote that down as I think it might be my favorite kill in the way that it really upset me. It really upset me too.'cause I put myself in that place and I was like, oh my, because it's the what actually happens to her and her whole monologue. That Angela is giving. It's brutal. Scary. It's brutal. So what's in there? What do you see in there? What do you see in there? Shit. Oh yeah. Shit. One of your favorite words. I'm gonna borrow it. You are a shit person. What else in there? Piss. You're pissing away Your good like girl. Okay, so this, uh, this for me is the death of the movie. It's the shower scene. It's the curling iron. It's the curling iron. Yeah. And it is very disturbing'cause she's reading her for filth while shoving her in filth. And there's like leeches in there. It's juicy baby. I love the camera shot from inside the toilet. Oh, love it. Love it. We call it a butthole shot in my collective. Sure. Mm-hmm. And then shoving her in there, being like, get in there and just manhandling.'cause Angela is not that big of a person. She's tiny. She's not that big. She's not that tall. Mm-hmm. She's not that beefy. Mm-hmm. And she just picks up that girl, shoves her in there. hear me out. It felt like an airy aki. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I see that. Yeah. Where I was like, like I took a breath and I was like, oh, we're not having fun anymore. We're not having fun anymore. Yeah. Not anymore. Yeah. I feel like,'cause there's a world and then she know we should have been the first to go woof G. Okay. Maybe. And I was like, tell us what you really think Angela. Geez. Literally it was rough, but I liked it. I hate that. I liked it, but I liked it. It was Brody. Yeah. Yeah. And then after that, for me, it all kind of goes downhill.'cause we do have Demi. hers was weak. It didn't have like a power to it. All it was was week. You talk a lot. You talk a lot. Yeah. I was like, oh, that's not very fun. Yeah. And it's like, you know, she, I think the humor from that one comes from like, we know the reason Angela's killing her is because she's onto something.'cause she called MA's mom and like the whole thing rambling. I called her and then she didn't pick up and she said, actually she's still camp up. Yeah. And all the wild, like, I think the, rather than the one-liner, we get the nice physical comedy of her, like trying to find something to kill Demi with While Demi that was funny was Yeah. I was gonna say just that moment where she picks up the coat hanger I'm sorry. You can't have a woman picking up a coat hanger and examining it and examining it. Someone we already know also who is up to no good. It is such a cultural touch point that I see that and I go. Okay. Mm-hmm. Your brain goes one of two places. Mm-hmm. No wire hangers. Mm-hmm. Ms. Young Crawford. Mm-hmm. Or the other one. Yes. And so I was like, just the moment that she picked it up, I was like, okay, can, let's, I don't know about this one.'cause I was like, are they gonna do a new curling iron? But it's different. But then she put it down. I said she put it down. Yeah. This is the beginning of the fall for me though. Mm-hmm. Because we get from there and then we get the other bitch that just gets stabbed four times. Yeah. Because she's gonna tell. And it also leaves the realm of, not that this is full believability we're going for in this film, but it gets to the point where you're like, uh, okay. You could probably get out of this. Yeah. If you stop now and get outta Dodge. Mm-hmm. But now we're a little'cause we're losing the ethos. Yeah. Well, and also we're leaving the, like, I'm killing you because you deserve it. Mm-hmm. To the, I'm killing you. Just because now I don't want to get caught. Which is Yeah. Like a, obviously like in life that would happen probably. Mm-hmm. But it's like, that's not as fun to watch Uhhuh as like just these, all of these campers committing carnal sins. Yeah. And just getting punished.'cause they're naughty, naughty, naughty. Well,'cause you know, when I felt that for the first time is when she killed the first boy because she killed, killed like three girls. It was the, the pretending to be Freddie and Jason. That's right. Yes. And when she killed whichever one first, the Freddie, I was like, we've made a change. Because so far it's been girls. Mm-hmm. And it's been about like purity culture. Mm-hmm. Now it's like, you're coming for me. Yeah. You're just like. Out to get me. Mm-hmm. But not in a actually threatening way, you know? Yeah. Maybe she just has no patience for games like that. Those are real. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. But the whole thing about like, I don't like kids like you. She says that too with, Allie, I think before she kills her. Mm-hmm. I hate kids like you. Mm-hmm. Girls like you and kids like you. Mm-hmm. I'm like, okay. Yeah. There's a difference, girl. And we remember that there's a difference between, I don't know, boys like Paul and boys like Gino. Like Exactly. Yeah. We've got the difference here. Exactly. Yeah. Now it's just like, it's, it's just unfortunate.'cause at this point it's like wrong place, wrong time for everybody. Mm-hmm. You know?'Cause what happens? Yeah. Leah gets stabbed four times after that. Tc. Yeah. Tc. Yeah. Melted with battery acid. Yeah.'cause he discovers Angela weird relationship happening there between TC and Angela. Yeah. Mm-hmm. In the beginning, him clearly trying to ask her out. Angela clearly knows that he is. I liked the sort of reference to, oh, go for a swim Uhhuh. And we know from the, we know that she doesn't swim. We're not doing that. Yeah. Um, there's many reasons we're not doing that. But I do think that she knows that he's trying to hang out with her or whatever, and then when she kind of gives him the pushback, he starts nagging her. Do you think he's trying to hang out with her or do you think he'cause from me, from the jump, uh, he's just always wanted to talk to her about her strictness because he's like, I wanna talk about. What happened with Phoebe, right. So I always took it as like, he's just more, I see him as a very like, mansplaining. He's the kind of husband that would invalidate his wife, trying to be like, let's put the kids to bed. He's like, no, I'm the cool dad. I'll handle it. You know? Right. He's, he's that brand of like, unsupportive man. Well, that's the thing is I thought he was trying to like, get with her in a way of like, I can change her. You know what I mean? That's kind of the vibe I was getting getting because then when she pushes back, instead of him elaborating about like, well, I just thought, you know, it'd be good to relax with the kids and blah, blah, he turns it into a neg. Yeah. And he's like, well, I didn't, I didn't even really. Want to hang out with you. You know what I mean? That's true. Yeah. And that feels very like Besmirched. I can definitely see that man. You know? Yeah. So that was the vibe I got with that. But then, yeah, it is a very interesting relationship that they have the whole film. Mm-hmm. Because he keeps really trying to give her the benefit of the doubt. Mm-hmm. Either because he doesn't care or some other reason, I don't know, he's kind of weird. Think he's just over it. Yeah. I think he's very much just like, he's just there. Let me handle it. Yeah. He's just like, I'll take care of this. I think something that's very telling about how their relationship is being depicted is when the cabins are kind of messing with each other. When we get into the co-ed chaos of it all and the boys invade the girls bunk and then the girls invade the boys bunk. Mm-hmm. They made a very clear point to show us how Angela reacts when she walks in and she's like, you guys are all in trouble. Get out, da da da. Mm-hmm. Versus how TC reacts when he's just. Ugh, whatever. Tell me when it's over. Tell me when it's over. Yeah. Like they're very much painting him as like the more laid back, like mm-hmm. Cool. It's like cool Dad. Casual. Yeah. Cool. Dad, while it's like Angela is like this very manic, um, hard ass. Mm-hmm. And it is giving very much like it is giving mommy and daddy of like, well go ask dad. Mm-hmm. Because we, because mom's scary. Mm-hmm. Like, I feel like that's kind of the, their relationship on the campgrounds. Mm-hmm. Because Uncle John, if Mel wasn't doing shit, uncle John might as well be a cardboard cutout. Mm-hmm. What is he doing there? He's just there. What is he doing? where he is like, where did so and so go? And she's like, oh, she had to be sent home. I caught her fucking one of the boys. And he goes, oh, next time just let me know. She's, she goes, you mean like I'm doing now? It was like, yes, that was good. And that's it. And he's like, you're right. I'm sorry. Yeah. I'm like, girl, you own this camp. Mm-hmm. It very, who's running the ship? Yeah. It was very funny. I almost missed Mel. I very much Miss Mel. It's just crazy. I would've loved to have seen Mel in this situation. Children. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sean, our love interest mm-hmm. Gets decapitated. That was another one that kind of took me off guard. Yeah. Yeah. Because I mean, it, it didn't, right, because this is another thing. I do think the movie, the movie got right. Whether or not they did it on purpose or not, I think it, it was too blatant to not be on purpose. Mm-hmm. But I think the whole point is that it's kind of juxtaposing. Paul and Angela from the first movie. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. With now the like, good version, quote unquote, of like Sean and Molly, who do, for all intents and purposes, seem to both like each other. And instead of, you know, especially the scene where she's in her fucking nightgown singing Kumbaya and outside, they're having a chased little kiss and like, he doesn't ask her to go inside or like grab her, grope her or anything like that. He just kisses her and then leaves. Mm-hmm. Um, so I was like, okay, I am definitely getting. Like a parallel here. Mm-hmm. And then at the end, you know, you think back to, and she references it about Oh yeah, there was a boy like that for me once and then I handled him. So it is, it does make sense.'cause it's like, okay, Sean is the, the Paul and the fo for Paul. Yeah. The Paul insert. And so him getting beheaded makes sense in that way. Mm-hmm. But I don't know, like it was like, I had gotten used to the stabbing and the blunt force. Yeah. And then all of a sudden the machete has Yeah. Well, uh, I loved that she put his head in the TV screen though. I just thought that was fun. Look who's on tv. Look who's on tv. Well, I'm telling you that is I think where the movie came back for a moment for me and I was like, locked in was the final cabin. Mm-hmm. With the, the bodies and like playing house. Her being like, honey, you haven't eaten anything all day. Mm-hmm. I was like, yeah, I want more of this. Yeah. Because this is feels, that felt interesting to me. But the unnecessary dream sequence that was basically, um, silent night. Deadly night toing us where it's like just showing us what we just watched literally. And then they give us nothing chasing that happens after it sucks that, that is in between those two.'cause you're right, it is a lot better, but I forget about it because I just don't like the things around it. Mm-hmm. I find them, here's what, here's what I think. Because they filmed two and three back to back. Mm-hmm. I think there may have been an issue with like. Running out of time or running out of coverage.'cause it feels very much, the movie's only an hour and 20 minutes. People very short. It's very short. It feels longer than it is. Yeah. And I think it's because they realized as they were putting it together that they only had maybe an hour's worth of a movie. And then so they patted it with that unnecessary dream sequence and then they give us nothing. Girl Chase scene, I, it very much feels like, kills with a movie, tried to be built around it. Mm-hmm. Which you could argue a lot of slashers are like that. Oh yeah. But not, not to this degree. I would, I would say say more successfully than this one. Yeah. I just, especially towards the end where it's like, and now we gotta kill everybody. Yeah, exactly. It's like, oh, but you're, you're right. This moment, you know, when Sean gets killed, like there is, it's joyful. And then it feels, it also felt very, um, which one is the one? God, is it two or three? Are you talking about Nightmare on Elm Street? No, I was welcome to Primetime Bitch. No, actually, because that's what I was thinking of. Well, sure. But I was thinking the end of this movie after that feels very, I, is it two or three where the girl is the final girl and she's being chased and she has to like pretend that she's his mom? Yeah. Yeah. And she's like, Jason, yeah, Jason, it's your mother. Mm-hmm. Um, it felt very, that where she was like the pure whatever, and she had to like run away from her and she keeps almost getting away and then not quite, I think when it comes to Molly, Angela, I don't think ever was going to really kill her unless she absolutely had to because Molly was the purest thing. Mm-hmm. And she had film, she had, she had formed this weird, uh, codependent relationship and emotional attachment with her. Yeah. So I think that she wanted to protect and cherish Molly as much as she could. Mm-hmm. I would have loved if I wrote this movie. I would've loved if Sean ended up being an absolute sleaze bag. Just a piece of shit. And then gets And then Angela kills him. Yeah. And then Molly's like, wait, yeah. I think you're onto something. Oh yeah. Okay. And then Teenage Wasteland is just two bad bitches killing people, mother and daughter. Yes. Yeah. Shit, I would've, if I wrote this movie, that's what it would have been. People. Yeah.'cause it would've been a good, like then moving into the third. Exactly. Because now I'm like, well, where are we gonna go? Now I'm very curious What a third camp. Yeah. And I'm wondering, the third summer camp, I'm wondering if they're gonna Friday the 13th, us, where, you know, how um, uh, the first four movies take place in like the same fucking weekend? Mm-hmm. I wonder if they're gonna do that with Sleepaway Camp two and three.'cause I wonder if she's just gonna go from one camp to the other. Maybe a a Across America tour. Angela takes Manhattan is the next one Issa? No, it's Pamela again. I think, oh, is it Pamela again? Yeah. I don't think Issa comes back. Maybe not until like, maybe in the aughts, but Yeah. Well after Sean's death, it's all a bunch of like, nothings like, yeah, nothing murder. Matt is killed off screen. Oh. But you know, Charlie and Emilio, the two fucking pervy bro, they do get, it's a very seven esque presentation of their bodies.'cause they're peeping Toms they've been like looking at all the girls getting undressed and stuff and Angela fucking cuts out their eyes and like ties them to the windows. And I would say it's very biblical. It is weird too, because again, it's doing that like you're mixing your metaphors here because you kind of, you kind of set yourself up a little bit when you decide that your main killer has an ethos of some degree. Yeah. Because it means you have to follow it. Yeah. And or else the audience is gonna get annoyed, Uhhuh. Um, and so they don't really do that here because. They, they have already depicted her freaking out about smaller, incidental things so that when she catches them with the pictures and she's like, TC and Uncle John are gonna hear about this. It makes it feel like just any other incident where you're like, yeah, Angela again ruining the fun. And it's like, no, no, no, no. This one, this one is bad. This one is absolutely, it's assaults. So that is something that needs to be addressed. But because it's in this mass of other, it's, yeah, Angela overreacting. Mm-hmm. That it makes it all run together. And then it makes the boys kill, even though it's s symbolic, it takes it away a little bit. Mm-hmm. Because oh, she's just killing everybody now. That's true. Yeah. At that point, when we find the bodies, it is very diluted. I think that we should have found their bodies, or they should have been killed much earlier in the movie. Mm-hmm. But late eighties, they're not gonna kill actual children on screen. I was impressed by that. I was like, Ooh, dead kids. I know. Thank God. I think that about me. But like that is also a thing when you start not watching non-American horror movies. Yeah. You very quickly, well, it's also are like introduced to like other, types of horror and things like that. Who. Nobody is safe. Exactly. Nobody. I think the American formula is quite boring I think one thing can be said is that like in most mainstream horror movies. You're never really gonna see the children die. Right. And if they do, it is the instigating factor of the movie. Mm-hmm. It's not like a casualty of the horror itself. Right. So it's really nice to see films break that mold.'cause it's more exciting, it's more true of life. Mm-hmm. Um, it's, uh, I, I I think it's, you know, reverently, irreverent, to the, just the nature of the, the horror genre as it should be. Mm-hmm. You know? Um, so I'm with you there and it's been long enough. I think I can talk about it. It's not spoiler anymore, but the end of weapons, I appreciated that even though the kids don't die mm-hmm. It is a depiction of like trauma Yeah. That we don't address when kids are in horror films and like experience all the shit that the adults are experiencing. For instance, I don't know The Exorcist, which like, I personally really like the Exorcist two and three. Mm-hmm. Because they explore other aspects. Like, I love the idea of like, okay, so how does Reagan feel now after being possessed? And saying, and doing all these things, the end of weapons them basically being like, yeah, the kids got released. Yeah, but they're not. Well, yeah. I mean, some of them started talking again. That one line was enough to be like Oof. Yeah. in a world where we have to deal with new CSA files being dumped onto us every day with. The victim's names Unredacted and the predator's names redacted. It's just, it feels so fucking, like, we're living in two worlds when you watch, you know, any kind of media versus just existing in the world. Mm-hmm. You're like, these are not, art is not reflecting life right now. I feel like, and this, the art that is reflecting life right now is getting, attacked. Mm-hmm. Canceled show. Canceled. Yeah. It's like the select outage is insane. Mm-hmm. It's absolutely insane. Mm-hmm. Um, so that's why I support killing children in movies. Yeah. I agree. I hundred percent agree. Let's see, John, uncle John gets killed off screen, like half of this movie. I mean, was he ever there? Uncle John was killed in his natural habitat. Offscreen. Offscreen. Offscreen. And perhaps in that boating accident, John, John, And let's be honest, I'm sorry to anybody named John, this is not specifically to attack you. This is just, I'm just going off of vibes here. Uncle John as a moniker has extreme incest vibes. Oh, John boy. Oh, you wanna know why?'cause John is award for Dick. That makes sense, right? Yeah. Maybe sound off John's. Yeah. Sound off John. Yeah. John's out there in the world. Let me know what you think. let's see. We have Rob, who was the one that I think was trying to fuck what's her face. Mm-hmm. Oh, and who did? Mm-hmm. Um, he ended up stabbed, hanging gagged with the jockstrap, which was a throwback to the jockstraps that went missing earlier. He, again, another, nothing Diane. Okay. This, mm-hmm. This batty. I'm just gonna throw it out there. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Diane Hot. She's the one with the short buzz cut again, going back to the eighties, being obsessed with the iconography and imagery of like, you know. Oh yes. Gender play. Oh yes. Maybe that's why they cut her outta this movie.'cause we see her twice. But she is so hot. She's serving. Yeah. She is a, what'd you call Smoke show? She is a smoke show. Smoke show. and then after that, the last person to get killed is our all American dollar Parton trucker. Um, yeah, Molly. Molly dying but not dying and then getting picked up by Angela and then probably dying. And I know, I wonder if she's gonna be in the next one actually, if it's any, if it's any consolation. You almost made it. You almost made it. Which is so funny. She didn't even, that's a fucked up thing to say. She didn't even care enough to check if she was dead. Yeah. Just walked away assuming. Yeah. And it's so funny too,'cause it's such like a, again, like going back to when I used to play dead as a child to see if anybody cared about me, I would fall off of a one foot thing like that and just lie there and be like, face down in the pool. Anyone? Yeah. Face down in the dirt. Yeah. It was also giving me, for some reason, piggy from Lord of the Flies. Oh, that's right. That, oh Rock. He was like, I know this because I played him in a, um, film that we made as a book report and we edited this bit. That looks like I get whiffed in the head with a rock and I'm, I love that fleeting from my head. Yeah. Pretty good piggy. So I peaked. You peeked, I beaked playing Biggie. Yes. Well, I mean, those are the kills. Mm-hmm. The kills ended up being, being us going through the kills just turned into us talking about the movie, actually, which is great. But that's what we do here. Speaking of the Kills, Uhhuh, before we even get into the film, they say that in the first film she kills 30. People at that camp. I think that that's just like, I think that's them being cheeky urban legends always get like blown outta proportion. Right? It's funny that they got every other fact. Right. And then they're just like, and she killed 30 people. I love that. That was the outlandish thing about that.,I was gonna ask you about how you felt about, because we both really enjoyed Judy in the first film. Mm-hmm. And how you felt about Ally, because I feel like Ally was the new Judy. Ally was definitely the new Judy because Tits, it felt very, they both do have tits. Yes. But, um, more so the, like, is she threatened by Angela? Why is she so aggressive toward Angela? Mm-hmm. More than the other girls are who are just like, yeah, she's annoying, but she has this specifically sexuality related, which we had talked a lot about this with Judy about like performing femininity mm-hmm. And what she believes to be appropriate. It's more of the same. It's like she keeps calling her a dyke. Mm-hmm. And then there is also that one talking about the era and stuff like that. I felt like it was very. Kind of out of left field, but when she fucks that guy, Rob, and then she's like, you don't have AIDS or anything, do you? Yep, yep, yep, yep. I was like, whoa. And because of all the characters to say that it would be her, but it was just in the context of all these other things that we've had of her, like I always sleep in the nude and like everybody being like, okay. And then her like being so aggressive with like, I'm the hot girl and everybody loves me and I'm gonna show it off and blah, blah, blah. And Angela's such a dike, not annoying or strict or mm-hmm. Like specifically about her sexuality and then like seeming to constantly try and bait her. Mm-hmm. With her boobs. Like I noticed another thing is that Angela never looks at her chest. Mm-hmm. When she's like topless, she's always very much locked in, like eye contact wise. Mm-hmm. And I'm like, what is going on here? That's a good question.'cause also she's like hypersexual and trying to get with the boys. Mm-hmm. She's pissy That scene with Molly, it's so funny, where she just starts shit with Molly. She's like, I know you hate me just as much as I hate you. And then after she starts shit, she's like, leave me alone diva. That is so funny. I'm doing that for now on. I'm, yes. I'm I gonna start shit and be like, leave me alone. Why are you, why are, why are you talking? I'm feeling so attacked right now. Literally. And, and Molly so fucking funny. Immediately having a breakdown and being like, Allie said that she hates me. Poor Molly. It's giving. A a, what was it? Carpenter's dream. Yeah. Flat is flat as the board needs a screw. Needs, needs a screw. Yeah. You know that I, I, I definitely, she's very clearly the Judy Standin, like mm-hmm. You can't have a character as iconic as Judy in the first movie and not have some sort of iteration of that. Mm-hmm. In the next movie. She needed a shirt with her name on it. I, she needed it, but she just had a shirt with her tits on it, and that's, I mean, one and the same, really her tits on it. I think most of her beef is with Molly in the same way that most of Judy's beef, beef was with Angela. Mm-hmm. And that Molly was pulling the, the male attention that she wanted from Sean. Mm-hmm. And like, we even got the same kind of cadence, uh, from Allie that we got from Judy of like these two lovebirds hanging out and she just like enters the scene. Mm-hmm. And then. Departs from the scene or like they depart from the scene, you know? Yeah, yeah. Um, just kind of like these intrusive moments that are just unsuccessful in her attempts to like try to win the male gaze that she wants. Mm-hmm. So I think in that sense, she does remind me a lot of Judy and with Angela, I'm not sure. I think, um, I kind of took it as just like a mean girl trait. I took it not necessarily of her being threatened by Angela, but because Angela is kind of an extension of Molly who was her threat. Mm-hmm. It's just kind of like agro in that direction too. Also as an authority figure, telling her that she can't do what she wants with her body. Mm. I can just see a lot of aggression coming out that way. Mm-hmm. Very, uh, horror Madonna dichotomy in this film. Mm-hmm. You're either a slut or a prude. Mm-hmm. There's this, that's all you get. That is all you get. And a little bit of gay panic thrown in there. The first one a little bit. Okay. A little bit of gay panic. They, they drop full on the friend and gay guy over their word. Mm-hmm. And friend and gay guy over there. Oh my god. F-A-G-G-O-T for those who didn't catch a pile of stitch, just loud and proud baby, very randomly in a moment that behind a Jason mask. Jason wouldn't use that word. Jason doesn't talk. If Jason could talk, he wouldn't use that word. I mean, if you're gonna, it's kind of like when you get one F word in a movie, it was like, if you're gonna get the one slur, why was that when you chose to use it? Yeah, exactly. Well, since this is your playground for all things scary, sexy, and stupid, we're jumping into our final three segments, our wrap up segments, baby. I feel so I'm highly caffeinated today, everybody. I've had six shots of espresso locked in. Um, how scary would you say the big bat of this movie is? Depends on what the big bat is. Well, it's, it's basically, it's, I feel like we're gonna have the same split skis that we did with the last one. We sure. We sure are. Is Angela scary? No, she's funny. No, she's funny and she's, she has a friendly face. She's funny and silly. Yes. Mm-hmm. But what is scary about this movie? Ronald Reagan. Ronald Reagan. Uh, what is the scariest slash most uncomfortable moment of this movie? The poopy. Thank you. The poopy. That the poopy, the poop. The poopy poop. Well, it's poopy, poopoo to paint the picture again. Party people cop on wee whiz. This sequence is brutal. It's totally different than the other kills from this movie. It's. Fun, but in a very uncomfortable way. And it's also as scary as it is because of the context of the movie. Mm-hmm. If you looked it up on YouTube and watch it on its own, you'd be like, eh, but because it's in a movie where all the other kills are so different. Yes. You're like, this feels, it's like she hated this one. Yeah. She, this kill is charged. She really want, I mean, and then she says, you know, you should have been the first to go. Yeah. You're like, oh my God. It's like Jesus. Do you think you could handle being in this movie? Do you think I could handle being in the Reaganite eighties? No, I think I would've been fucking gunned down. That's true. Um, the Camp Angela would've hated me. Yeah. Angela would've hated me. Oh yeah. I would. I would've been fucking dead. This is the bummer though, isn't it? Right? Is that this Angela would me in the first movie? Yeah. That Angela, we would be friends with that. Angela. Absolutely. This movie, Angela. I mean, she probably perceived me as Okay if I was serving fem enough, I guess because I'm pretty, like, I generally have the sexuality of like an avocado. But you, I don't know. She might not, she might not let that happen. No, I would absolutely die.'cause I'm too, like, um, I'm too sassy. Mm-hmm. I have a mouth on me. Mm-hmm. And it's just like, she, I, she would not like me. And it makes me sad. It makes me sad to grow apart from my childhood friends like this. Well, it depends though. If you're serving, if you're serving boy drag should probably leave you alone. Yeah. Yeah. But even in serving boy drag, I'm a troll. I suffer from Little Brother Syndrome. Would would you dress up like, like jetty for Jason Rag? Yes. Jason Krueger. Yes, I would. Vor vor Krueger. Yes, I would, would would put Saran wrap outside of her cabin door and smear honey all over it. You know, I'm a prankster and it's only made worse at Summer Camp Angela would've killed, I would've been, I would've been the first to go. I probably would've been at Fat Camp. Wait, is there a horror movie set at Fat Camp? There has to be. Oh my God. If there isn't, I'm making it tomorrow. Honestly, like that needs to exist. Put a pin in that actually.. On that note, let's go to the Horny Hall of Fame, the Horn of Fame. Oh, I'm so horny. It it weird doing that with these movies where they're supposed to be children. Yeah. It feels less weird with this one than the other one. Yeah. More adults. But this movie, I will say in general, like how, how horny would you say this movie is? Oh my God. I mean, the last one we thought was pretty horny, but that one was like a fucking in like precent way. Yeah. That one was like a fumbling, like, oh, have you ever thought about boobs? Yeah. Like, I'm gonna put my wiener in a watermelon just to see what it feels like. This one time at Bandcamp. Yes. Yeah. This one was like sleazy. This was sleazy. Horny. Sleazy. Yeah. Yeah. And also like, I don't believe these children. Children are getting down and dirty quite like this. Yeah. it's very, see we've moved into the CW casting on this These are adults. Mm-hmm. Who do you think is the sexiest character? It, I mean, it has to be Allie of course, because not just like, looks wise. Well, her whole embodiment, the whole, her whole character. She is very comfortable in her body. Yeah. She knows who she is and she knows what she wants. Yes. So I agree with you, but I'm also going to say just because she's a smoke show, Diane. True. Who give Di Exactly. Give Diane her flowers. Give Diane her flowers. Who Baby? You weren't in the movie, but you're on my horny hall of fame list. Oh, where is she now? Dead. Um, wait, were you talking about the actress? Yes. Oh, I thought you were talking about the character. I don't know about the actress. She might be dead too. I don't know. Dead, dead. Moving on. Jesus Christ. Uh, what would you say is the hottest rga Morris? Uh, what, sorry? The hottest, the hot death because the deaths weren't really hot. No. In this one. In the way, like in the last one, getting killed in the shower. Always kind of like, mm. And then the curling eye and the intimacy of like, Paul, yes. We don't have that same kind of like, no issues to these. No, I'm trying to think like hottest. I mean, maybe, maybe in a weird, esoteric, masculine, phallic way. The drill? Yeah. Just because of the like. I don't know. The freaking me loves like car. Yeah. Loves just like a, a fucking, and it takes a long time. Like it's very deliberate. It's very, yeah. Um, do you have a hottest death that you thought Yeah, I'm thinking too'cause like, I, I was gonna say the toilet one just because it's so exciting in a weird way. Um, and it is thing going in whole, but you could also argue too the strangulation that I was gonna say there. Very intimate about that. Yeah. But, um, I think what I'll do just for like the small little, crumb of homoeroticism that we got, even though he was killed off screen, the guy that we see like hanged with a jocks strap in his mouth. Yeah. That's pretty fetishy it, I think it is. That's pretty queer. Yeah. Um, I'm not particularly into that, but there's lots of people out there who are, and I just love seeing a straight man with a jockstrap shoved in his throat. I think it's kind of, funny. Yeah. And I guess sexy. Yeah. Yeah. So that's my answer. What was his name? Rob. Yeah, Rob. Uh, Time for our Dumb Bitch Juice. This is my favorite section. I love talking about all the stupid shit. Is this movie Camper Cringe? Here's the thing. Yes. This is what I'll say if you look at it from an eighties lens from like, if you're watching it in 1988 mm-hmm. Sat in the theater mm-hmm. Cringe. Yeah. If I'm watching it now, Uhhuh and really giving it the entire benefit of the doubt turning off my brain mm-hmm. To the actual very real reality of what was going on camp. Yes. I frequently turned my brain off during watching it. It was like, this is just so funny. Mm-hmm. And then there would be a line that'd be like, you don't have aids or anything, do you? And then you're like, zapped back to it. You're like, oh yeah. It was like, you're trying to be a trauma film right now. Mm-hmm. And you're not quite doing it. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, I would agree. I would say my, my thoughts are very, aligned with also just how I feel about how much of the movie I enjoyed. Mm-hmm. I think the first two thirds are camp The Osgood cut. The Osgood cut. Mm-hmm. I feel like the two third good. It's okay. The first two thirds uhhuh are camp and delightful. Yes. And then it gets cringe to me around the dream sequence. Yes. And, uh, it doesn't fully redeem itself for me after that, so, yeah. Valid. What's your favorite, best dumb decision or best line of dialogue? This is where I want your list. Throw them at me. They, I can't, I can't pick just one. It starts right away with one of the weirdo kids. Mm-hmm. Before we know him as a weirdo. Mm-hmm. I know him as the kid who says, There's a fried chicken place down the road from my house. And my sister's best friend got served a fried rat. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I love that one too. and so right after that, them being like, what happened to Angela after that? And then him being that same kid, being like, I heard that he's playing the dark-haired girl in the facts of life. Mm-hmm. Yep. Ben and I wrote down Damn the Trans of In Invaded Hollywood. They were in there. Yep. And then of course, too dumb to drink. Too fat to fuck what? That one has to win. That's so good. My favorite, dumb line of dialogue. Nay. My favorite dumb song of dialogue. I love, fuck. And if you pay me money on my ties, you can stop. Final dumb bitch juice question. How stupid is this movie? You know what's interesting is that it what's interesting, it fired a lot of my brain cells about, about, uh, special interests that I have uhhuh. So it was a lot of me pausing and looking certain things up and being like, oh, that reminds me of when this thing happened and this relates to this thing and like. How hot does it have to be to cremate a body and like, you know, all these things. So the, the, for every brain cell I lost sort of like reaganite nonsense. Mm-hmm. I like gained a few more'cause I looked some things up on the internet. All I want was multiple sources. All I want now I'm gonna make this happen. I need to figure out a way to just like get that soundbite of you saying, how hot does it have to be to cremate a body and just find something fun to do with it. I just need that. I'm, that might just might, I might turn that into your text tone. Oh my God. Whenever you bring me up, bring text tone back. Actually I know whenever my phone has been on silent since 2019 though, so I, there's no point in me having. A text tone. My mom has hers on and she has the haptic noises on. Oh God. So when she's typing, it's like, yeah. I'm like, oh, I had to turn that off.'cause my roommate practically threatened to kill me. The overstimulation is crazy. Yeah. Um, yeah, this movie to me is a very dumb movie, but not in a, uh, a bad way. At least not until the end. There are much worse. Sequels Yes. That are not fun. Nothing's worse than a, a dumb movie that's not fun, like a dumb movie that's trying to be dumb. That's not fun. And it has like, it removes the earnest quality of it all, and then it's just like mm-hmm. All I see is somebody trying to be, be dumb and trying to be funny and it's like stupid. Yeah. I hate when I feel that you didn't know what you wanted to do. Yeah. Then I'm like, ugh. Yeah, Excellent. That's, that's sleepaway camp too. Unhappy campers, everybody. Oh my God. Yeah. Would you say that you were an unhappy camper? Or you were a camper? I was a camper. I was a camper. Uh, my happy camper too kind of went down. I got homesick around the. The last 30 minutes I got homesick. You were that girl who was like, I wanna go home right now. I wanna go home now. Yeah. Like, okay. Like, okay. A prime example today, I was rewatching it before we recorded just like three times. People listen three times. I didn't take my note. Okay. The first time I watched, it was months ago. The second time I watched it was yesterday. But I was with a friend so I couldn't take notes because that's was rude. And the third time was today because I just wanted to take some notes. Mm-hmm. All that to be said, when I re-watched it today, um, I literally got up to take a shit during the dream sequence and I just never came back. I just started doing nothing. I'm not missing anything. Yeah. I'm not missing anything. And this is after. That is really something though. The phenomenon of movies or TV shows that you don't pause Uhhuh when you get up to go to the bathroom Uhhuh or do something uhhuh. That really tells me, uh, how you're feeling about it. Yeah. It's like, do you want me to pause it? No, no, it's fine. No, and it's like, it's, for me, it's like there's very clear points of investment. Mm-hmm. If it was the first half of this movie, I would pause it, take my shit, come back, and then line up another shit for the second half of the movie or something. Line up anything I have to do for the last quarter Exactly. Schedule my therapy appointment, whatever it is that I have to do. Literally. Um. So, yeah, I think I was, uh, I started off a happy camper and then I wanted to get sent home. How are you? It went downhill. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was, um, yeah, I was, it was about the same, it was the Osgood experience. Yeah. Which, you know, there's nothing bad. It's just like, I'm never going to watch this movie again. No. Yeah. You know, that's the thing is like, did I, did I enjoy my experience watching it three times, the first two? Sure. Um, did I put it on my Campy Crystal Lake, uh, playlist on letterbox? Yes, I did. Mm-hmm. For like, if people were to ask me what are campy movies that I might not have heard of or watched before? Yeah. I would say, sleepaway Camp one. And then if you're really enjoying that and you just want to continue with our good friend, Angela. Maybe watch the second one. The third one will really be, it's gonna be a great litmus test. I think I'm very curious. Yeah. Especially since they were filmed so closely together. Yeah. I find that actually kind of promising, but concerning at the same time, because I'm sure there's lots of directors who would love to film. Pearl and X and look at how great that was. I still haven't seen them. Oh, you haven't? No. Maybe none of the three, because my partner keeps Oh boy. Bringing it up. This is the thing. When you have a partner, what's that like? Listen, when you have a partner and you're both neurodivergent, it's kind of a nightmare. Especially when you're trying to watch things together. It's, I, it's just two dumb bitches being like, I don't know. What do you wanna watch? No. Literally, what do you wanna watch? Literally, the problem is I get hyper fixated on things. Mm-hmm. And also my brain is broken because the, the world is so, so awful. Mm-hmm. That I can't. It is, it is hard for me and overstimulating for me to start new things. So that's, I haven't watched them yet. I feel you either. Another hard thing though is like a lot of movies recently, I just have not been interested in No. I'm in this phase of my life where if it's not horror or anything queer, I don't really wanna watch it. No. Because why, if I, I am not of, and this is no shade to people who have the mental capacity to do this and enjoy this, I cannot understand, I do not have the energy to be one of those people who just consumes all the new media that come out. It's exhausting. Um, because some people love to be connected. They, in that way, they love for, they love new things that does not produce the serotonin in my brain. Mm-hmm. Because then it, it's me. Spending that time going, I don't care about this enough. Well, and also I don't care about this. Well, also, it just feels like homework. And I think that's, that's one of the things that I'm grappling with, uh, with this podcast. If I may break the fourth wall here. I like,'cause I think a lot about, like, I don't really, I have never been the kind of person to have my finger on the pulse of what's going on mm-hmm. In pop culture at the time. Mm-hmm. I'm always just kind of doing my own thing and doing what I like. Mm-hmm. And that's kind of what's been happening with this podcast. I'm like, well, should I go, should I watch these new movies and cover them on the podcast? And I, maybe I'll get to that point, like once I have more time and resources and stuff, but. You know, for now it's just like, I just, it's, it, it feels like homework to try to stay on top of all of the stuff that's coming out. I'm the same way on my TikTok. I read books and I watch movies, but I'm not on book talk. Yeah.'cause I have. That's also not where a lot of my interests lie. Yeah. Um, so I'm just like, I'm just kind of doing what I wanna do because life is too fucking short. Yeah. Like, I'm doing this podcast because I, I wanna do what I enjoy. I enjoy horror. Hence, yeah. Sleepaway camp anyway. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. All that bitching aside. Mm-hmm. Bowie. Yeah. Where can our listeners find you? Oh boy. So technically I am on Instagram, but uh, me and her have a strained relationship currently. Um, because I try, you know, I thought I cheekily, uh, my hubris allowed me to cross post a video from TikTok to Instagram. But now, oh no. It's just everybody on my ass. You, they lost too close to the sun. You know what's funny too though? What is, I got like an influx of who knows how many, it does not matter, but anytime you have anything go, even semi viral, you get a fuck ton of followers where you're like, I hope you're not expecting this level of content. Yeah, all the time. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was, yeah. Me recording a chicken on the street of New York City is not my whole gig. Um, but yeah, it's like, check my page before you follow me. We'll check everybody please. Yeah. Literally the weirdest menagerie of shit. But I got a, a bunch of followers and you can just look at the, the names and stuff and all the fucking gay flag stars. Oh, like sock and nail eye. And I'm like, okay, I see why you followed me. Yes. You're not the ones leaving the comments. I see you sweat back and nail sweatpants. Baggings got it. Literally. I'm like, okay, you're safe here. Sock and nail. I don't know. Reminds know what my content is gonna do for you Graham cracker. But I love you and I'm glad you're here. But yeah, anyway, I'm on Instagram technically. Oh, yeah, yeah. Theoretical. We're in an episode and I definitely am, for real, for sure. On, on TikTok. Or I do a bunch of different things because weirdly people are less crazy over there. That's very odd. That's true. So, So what's your handle? It's, um, I think it's the same on both. It's um, at knife stab, stab, underscore presenting. Well give Bowie a follow. Show them some love. They deserve it. They need it. They're fun. And then of course you could follow me crybaby at crying in under public. That's crying without the GRE in under public. Do it. I am only on Instagram. I, um, deleted my TikTok. I might go back. I don't know. It's all bad. I just, I just don't, I feel like part of me is like, okay, I deleted my fucking TikTok because I'm like, this is gonna become a propaganda machine. And then I'm like, but I'm on Instagram and I wish I had an answer. You know, it's, I do. It's not much better than the other. I just panic deleted my account. I don't know. I understandable. If you want me to go back to TikTok, uh, to my. 12 listeners right now out there, say something, just let me know. Say something. But I am on, I am on the Instagram. Um, and then of course Horror icon is on Instagram as well. Mm-hmm. Horror Icon Pod, W-H-O-R-R-O-R. Icon Pod. Mm-hmm. And if you have anything to say or if you have anything you want to share with us mm-hmm. Or if you have any recommendations mm-hmm. Shoot me an email at horror icon@gmail.com. W-H-O-R-R-O-R icon@gmail.com. I would love to hear from you. And with that said. We're gonna drive in our little trucking cowboy hat, straight from Sleepaway Camp to unhappy Campers into Sleepaway Camp three. Teenage Wasteland. Teenage Wasteland, which is such a lovely title. It is, it is, it is. Well, again, I, we are firmly in the MTV slasher era right now in that pocket, and I'm excited to see what happens. So until then, cutie patootie, don't be scared unless you're into that sort of thing. Bye bye.