Catch Up Chaos Episode

We’re kicking off 2025 with a bang! After a little end-of-year hiatus, we’re back with a juicy catch-up episode to react to all the wild Bravo-verse drama. From the shocking Craig and Paige breakup to the cancellation of OG Vanderpump Rules and Karen Huger’s headline-grabbing conviction, we’ve got it all covered. Plus, we dive into the latest can’t-miss episodes of Southern Charm, Real Housewives of Beverly Hills, and Real Housewives of Salt Lake City. 

Chapters

• 4:10 Paige and Craig's Breakup
• 19:38 Whitney's cupcake comment
• 23:54 JT's cane incident
• 28:39 Review of Something about Her
• 31:33 Cancellation of Vanderpump Rules
• 35:31 James' arrest
• 41:36 Erica on RHOBH
• 45:29 Dorit and PK's breakup
• 47:21 Kyle and Mo's breakup
• 51:44 Kyle and Dorit's feud
• 55:52 Karen Huger's conviction
• 1:03:09 Mary's son's addiction on RHOSLC
• 1:07:09 Bronwyn's marriage on RHOSLC
• 1:14:36 Rumors on Real Housewives of Rhode Island

Transcript

00:00:29 Unknown: Hey, guys. Hey, all. We're back now after a long, long break. I know I have left you. This is weird, because this is the first time me and Zimmer ever recording in person. We're looking for something on a small couch in a garage. Did they get the full vision of what's happening here and then scan through Netflix movies without actually picking something and try to child mine? Sam's four year olds. So apologies for the long break. We had life happen. Life has been laughing, but Bravo has been Bravo ing as well. I know. And we're so behind. So we're decided that we were going to just do a free for all catch up on the world match up when we come back in January We will deep dove into a bunch of different people that we have on our list. But with all this news, it feels like there's a lot to talk about. Yeah, we got to get into it. And this morning, we're woken by the tears of many Bravo fans with the news of Paige and Craig's breakup. Let's just take a moment of silence for that relationship. That's I mean, it's it's really sad. I feel like I, for one myself, like, really believed in their love. And I feel like when everyone was coming out on the Internet being like, they're going to break up or we're haters on them, I wanted to defend them and defend their unique circumstance and I wanted to believe that, like their untraditional love could make it. I guess I wanted to believe that. Yeah, but like, whenever it came up on Summerhouse or Southern Charm, I always was like, there's something I don't fully believe, because I just could see in Craig that he wanted something and she wanted something else. Right. I think that was always the dynamic. And that was like, I'm guessing and I know we didn't listen to the full God Squad podcast that like came out and disclosed all of this, but it does feel like a big part of this was Paige wants to be independent. She wants to do her brand, she wants to do her business. And Craig wants to settle and have like maybe a more traditional wife, which I don't know. I mean, I feel like even that's in a way like simplifying it. I think he's fine with how hard Paige works and, like, supports her. But I think, you know, you get to a point in the relationship where you got to, like, live in the same place and compromise and do the things to get yourself to the next level. And I think Craig was constantly like offering and this isn't like a blame Craig blame page moment here. But there was times where I felt like Craig would be like, let me share some of the money of the apartment in New York. And then that'll kind of be like our first step in, like doing something together. And Paige was like, No, I don't want that because I really want it to be mine. Because if something happened, like they're almost was an unconscious thing in Paige I mean, slight justice for Danielle. So slight. I've been giving justice to Danielle all day because I just write. Page gave him nothing. And I think there was always this expectation that like, if she come to Charleston, they get word that like is not fair, but it's not like then she was saying, like, yeah, we'll get this apartment in New York together. She wanted to give him nothing. She wanted to control and have things go exactly how she wanted it to go. I got to agree. Yeah. I mean, I do feel like because I think he brought this up, if Craig really wanted to be with her, why didn't he just, like, move to New York? Right. Her family's there. But, you know, and we don't know what happened And it also seemed like in the summer house trailer, we're going to get some more like back story on this. But it did kind of seem like even if Craig was like, okay, I'm all in, I'm going to move to New York. I also didn't feel that that was going to like move the needle that much for Page. I'll be curious if they have that kind of conversation in the the new season. I mean, they started dating when Page was 29. Very young. Like you're so young at 29, especially for a girl. It's expected you want to get married at 29, but nobody knows what they wanted. Oh 29 But like your brain is fully developed. Yeah. So yeah, I'm not saying like she was like I a secret lives or whether they're like their brains are not fully developed but I just felt like she thought, you know, and I think we've talked about this just as friends. Like we never wanted kids really. And then you get into your mid thirties and you're kind of like actually could do that facility with baby and then you're like, Oh, I could have kids. And then you're like, Wow, I'm a person who wants to have kids. Like, I think Page thought when I get older in my thirties, I'm going to want this. And Craig is and Craig kind of thought that too. And that's why he was changing and evolving and trying to be like this great husband for her. I don't know. People are saying like maybe they could get back together. I think it's kind of done. Yeah. Only because I think Craig is so loyal. I think he's going to just meet another girl and get in a deep, serious relationship. Yeah. And I mean, she did kind of like it does feel like she wasted a little bit of his time because it does feel like he was very open from the beginning about like or at least in the past couple of years he's been pretty open about I want to like settle down like we see them play out the conversation about getting engaged and moving in together. I feel like his intentions are pretty clear about wanting that more settled life, and I feel like she's somewhat clear, but it does feel like there's some conversation in the background that's happening where she's like, Maybe in the future I'll want those things. And I think within her she does feel like I do think I will want those things eventually and it's just not happening as quickly as he or she like maybe feels like it could for this relationship to be viable. And I don't know, it's really adult of them to just like call it, you know, right? Like just say like this isn't working. And, you know, we seen the trailer for the new season of Summer House that she's like crying, being like, I'm afraid to break up because I'm going to lose everything. And there is some like reality of that like that they are this like it. Couple of bravo. And what does it mean now that they're not does that like change the way they are portrayed on their shows and their storylines and like the interest in that? I give Paige a lot of credit because her and Craig kind of kept their relationship sacred in that way. And yeah, I know people are coming out and saying, she wasted our time. And then women are saying, if you say that about page, like, but there's truth to both of it, right? Like you did. Did she waste time? Like, in a sense, but like unconsciously? Well, they're both adult adults making decisions. He didn't have to stay with her. Yeah, pretty clear that, like, she puts her career first and that she was a city girl and that, like, her family's in New York, and she never felt like she put on airs that, like, I'm going to move to Charleston and be your housewife. Yeah. She didn't string him along. You know, they had a lot of heart. That's why I'm telling you. Like, any time I saw them online, I was like, this, they're going the distance. But then we would see these scenes on Summer House. Like, I think last season he talked to Kyle and I think I texted you after that scene and I was like, They're going to break up because like, he's being very clear about what he wants and she's being very clear about what she wants. And like, they're all they're they're both not there and they're just waiting it out for it to change, right? They're like, who's going to who's going to give up on their vision of me? Yeah. And like, I don't think she wasted his time because they were in a relationship. And let's remember, like when these. Started dating that first season of them together on with your house he was hot mess. So like he was not in a position to be like her to be marrying him. So, like, he got thrown out of court. May or may not have gotten thrown out. Kyle and Amanda's wedding for his drunkenness. I mean, I think their relationship evolved to the point where Paige really had to make that decision. I'm, like, so curious of, like, what he's going to say about it. Well, it's interesting because I guess, like the reunion of Southern Charm will play out before the reunion of Summer House. So we'll really get kind of his side of it first, potentially, even though we're like obviously getting her take on it first because she decided to do it. I imagine they made a mutual decision that it was okay for her to like announce this via the podcast. I do think he's going to jump into another serious relationship and probably marry that person pretty quick. He seems like a pretty like compulsive monogamous. He doesn't. He he's not like all the other men on Southern charm. Yeah. You know, the Peter Pan is looking for the next fun thing. Like, I do think he is someone who intentionally is looking like if we look at his history of girlfriends, which actually isn't that long, they're all serious relationships. Yeah, I don't really see him like playing women and he is very serious about them. He puts a lot of work, a lot of effort. He's not we don't hear rumors about him being like a cheater or a player or like this kind of guy. So I do think he will try to find someone new to be with. And I think that the juxtaposition between their relationship and Amanda and Kyle's next season will be kind of interesting because like Paige is buried triggered by Amanda and Kyle's relationship because Kyle has all the control and Amanda takes a backseat, But you could see in that trailer she was like, I'm only here because Kyle wants to pretend to be that bloke. But jumping ahead a later topic, just because it plays into this, the new season of Southern Charm is a slow roll so far, But as I'm watching it play out, there are scenes from the trailer and like the clips that come out that when you watch it in context, it's so Jeff Bridges like all that you understand about it. Yeah, I assume you're talking about the dynamic between Craig Austin and Shep, where it feels like Austin and or it's Shep who's angry at Austin and Craig for kind of like abandoning him in his time of need or quote unquote time. Yeah, but then Austin's kind of mad at Craig's, so then it kind of all gets centered on Craig, right? Then it becomes Austin and Shep against Craig. And I remember watching that being like, I am 100% on Craig's side of this. And then when it played out, I was like, Wait, is it weird that I'm kind of like, I get worships coming? Yeah. Well, I guess like if what he's saying in like is in an authentic way like is true where he's like, I need your guidance now, I need your advice now. And he was willing to take that. Then like Craig should have kind of been there for him more. I just question if that's real and I could see on Craig's side, like him being like, I know you, the history here is always putting me down and always making me look small. Like, why should I come and support you when you're going to, like somehow use this against me or you've always used me? Plus, it seems like he's very focused on his business, his home, his sobriety, being with Paige. It was really funny in that I guess that hasn't aired yet when Paige was like, Oh, they're going to blame me for changing you. And she's like, You did change kind of for me, though. What pieces of that aired played out? So we don't know. Yeah, but like, it's, it's interesting now in hindsight of like, their breakup, you know. I wonder if we'll get hints of it on Southern charm and then see more of it on Summerhouse. I mean, in theory. Summer House ended in September. They broke up December. So maybe like the rumors that they've been breaking up recently might not be from nothing. You know, friends and stuff might be like this still going on, right? This could be a been a slow burn breakup where it's been like they've been talking about like do we make this work or do we just end it for a while? And we were kind of talking about to like Hannah and her husband does have like a very unconventional marriage, too. And I'm sure that like in some ways colors what page wants in a way like and yeah, I don't know. Craig is like that traditional. Like, I don't see him getting with like a blond ditz who just wants to stay home and bake cookies. I don't think so either. But I do think there's something about him that wants something more traditional than what they have, or maybe what Paige has to offer, because I don't know. She's like. To me, she's such like a bona fide city girl. And city marriages are a little less traditional than like the marriages that Craig is probably seeing in Charleston. Yeah. Paige wants to get married at all. I definitely know she does not want to get married right now. I think she's really enjoying her independence. She's enjoying her career. She is enjoying just getting to like do whatever she wants, like whenever she wants. Like it seems like that's where she's at in her life right now. Yeah. And being married requires a lot of compromise and like and that's the thing we don't talk about as feminists. We're like me, like an emotionally, you know, supportive man and do all these things. And like, even when you find, like the best husband who does all those things, you still have to frigging work at it. It's not like, Oh, then you're magically in this beautiful relationship that you never fight, never have issues, and like, nothing ever happens. And there's like a different consideration you take for, like, your partner that you're dating than you do for your partner that you've committed to marriage to. I do think like there are different unwritten expectations there that do mean like giving up some of your freedoms and mean giving up some of your independence in order to support a partnership. And it doesn't mean completely, but I think there is just it's different and some people that doesn't work for it, especially at certain times in their lives. And I think we've seen Paige kind of go through this evolution where like when she was with Perry, he was like a little older and provided that like stability and like perfect husband material. And I think she comes from that like you get married in your traditional Italian lifestyle, sort of like Teresa almost. And I think she's now realizing at 32 like that actually doesn't suit my life. And I think that's great. Like I do support her. The one thing like in her pot or whatever that she talks about was like when someone's in their thirties and they have kids, they don't have like they don't have more plans than you at 32 who like what I like. She did this like plan thing that we were talking about and the clip of the part that she some insecurity she's feeling about like maybe the idea that Craig has different plans than her and then so she it's almost felt like she was like overcompensating in some way and being like, well, you know, some people have plans and some people don't. We all have value. And it's like, I don't know if that's like I get the message she's trying to say of like being single at 32 or like whatever and child 30, like not having such a strict, you know, having a plan for family doesn't make you any less about less valuable than people who at 32 have plans for family. That's what she meant. But it came off like, I don't know. I feel like she was struggling and overcompensating. Yeah, I don't know. She's probably going through grief in her own things, But in the clips that I heard, it felt like she didn't want to fully own it and it was a girl on it. Like, what is wrong with being a single 32 year old living your best life in the city like that? Because I feel yeah, and I've seen this in scenes with her too. I feel like she thinks she should want those things. And then she has a partner who's a guy who wants all those things, is willing to go to the end of the earth, change its whole personality, stop drinking, do whatever she wants to like, give her all those things. And she's like having to confront that. She doesn't want those because there was something about her with the whole plan thing that she was talking about was like, Girl, you have plans. You know your plan, right? Your plans just don't involve the things you thought it would involve it. You don't have family plans. You don't plan to start a family and that's okay. Yeah. So to me, I'm like, I hope she just wherever she goes, like she owns it. I think Craig is owning his path, too. I'm really curious to see. I mean, it might give Southern charm a little life because Southern charm is a little lifeless right now. Also, like him accusing JT, the whole JT Kane incident played so different in the show to me. Like what he said to Patricia was rude, right? Giving Patricia a cane was was very off. Like like I wonder if there is something neurodiverse about him, because it does seem like he really struggles with social cues. But in the context of he was giving everyone canes, I was like, Oh, this isn't nearly as bright. I just got one for Patricia. And it's like, here the elderly woman needs a K, and it was like, I'm just like doing something that I think is funny and I don't, like, totally get the social dynamic. Yeah. And. So. And then he wrote that. No. Which is mom told him. Right. But then like brag saying he called her a bitch. I don't know. He pulled that out of his ass. It was a lie. I think he just heard what I think he was feeling in defense of Austin, because J.T. was bringing up this rumor about Austin still being a philanderer, still being the fact that he is. And I think Craig is a loyal person and was feeling, like, defensive, and so he wanted to hear something bad. And I think he left that feeling like, oh, J.T. is shit talking, everyone. What would be the worst thing he could have said? This is the worst thing he could have said, because this is like calling Austin a fuck boy, like that's not that bad. So, like, going and saying, like, oh, J.T. was talking about about Austin. Everyone's like, okay, like what? You know, it felt like he wanted it to be like a big deal. And so in his mind, he's like, he must have said this because it was bad. Hmm. Yeah. And, I mean, I feel like Craig wasn't lying in that traditional way. I think in his mind, he'd said that. But I don't know why that was in his mind that he had said that I think creates his own reality because he's like a feather. So. Then let's briefly touch on Whitney. Also, we did not touch on Whitney in the Fuck Away episode, and he clearly sucks, especially when he tried to call Molly who was like ridiculously hot fat. That was insane. And the worst part of that was not one person at that table was like said something was like, why would you ever say that to a woman? Like, no one. And to me, the most offensive is that not even Miss Pat. Like like that's your son. You raised him, and he's behaving this. This is a reflection on you at this point, lady like. And you're not saying anything like, don't you dare speak to a woman that way. Like, disgusting. Just look at me. Frosted tips. Like, you look fucking ridiculous. And your comment on this beautiful woman eating a cupcake like, oh, oh, my gosh, someone that level of what he said if you get a facelift, you frost your tips because it distracts. I think that's got it. That's got to be true. Amazing. And I was like, I hope that's true. But yeah, I look most I look a little sideways. Patricia Now that I want to mom guilt shame here. But like what is happening that you raised is just the brother said he said it and she wasn't there to hear. Yeah she he's at it right in front of her. I he needs he needs so much more than a spanking. But at this point, yeah, we're sitting here, like devouring J.T. for giving her a cane. When I think, what Whitney said to is much worse than the cane incident. True. True. I kind of agree. I don't know why Taylor is on the show. I don't. Taylor shouldn't be on the show without guest on. I think that Taylor, like they thought she would, like, come back and she'd create, like, tension, but I think she just creates awkwardness because I think she wants everything to be rainbows and flowers, but is really just like an awkward human being. Like, I think she's another one who might be a little, like, nerd, like there's something about her that doesn't seem to fully understand social cues and like, or is just like, so desperate to be on the show that she's willing to, like, put herself in, like, socially, like, wrong situations. why are you like coming back to a show that is clearly your ex's show and then being like, I don't want to see my ex and his new girlfriend? Like, what did you think was going to happen? Oh, and I do want to touch on the JT Madison. I mean, JT was completely off base by thinking Madison was going was another like social cue thing. Like, I think, like, and I think everyone misunderstood him. I think he wasn't really saying that Madison was like had a crush on him or wanted him. I think he was saying. And he it seemed like he was right to that. Like, what's Madison's husband's name again? I don't know, but he is hot. Right, right, right. Terrible name, beautiful man. But I think what he was saying was Brett had seen him in his clothes and like seen her on the beach with him alone or something. And he was sort of questioning like, what's what's going on? Not in a way of like, are you cheating on me? But like what's like, what do you do in, like, tell me. Like, I'm not there. Like, who know? Well, and the way he heard it, it feels like maybe he heard it in a way that, like, oh, is Brett like thinking something is happening here that's not. And again, I think it's just like a social cue thing, like he's just like making a well, Madison buried the lead in that whole scene. While she admitted Brett called JT because Brett was worried her and Austin were alone together in a room. Right. Which makes Brett maybe a little jealous. Yeah. So there was, like, a nugget of truth to what JT said. Exactly. And the thing is, I like. I hate that I'm at all justifying JT because I've done it from the minute this guy, then he gives it. But I also kind of love that he wants to like call out the fuck boys. I don't know. There's those. Wow. He was kind of ah, like little fuck boy, you know, I, you know. CALLER or I liked that I liked him with the other guy too. Rod Right. And why they took him away, I don't know that maybe he. Rod seemed like he was too smart for reality. That might have been part of it. Might've been like, I'm done. Or maybe he didn't want to come back. Yeah, I don't know. Excited to see more how this all unfolds. And you know, I think there's going to be good stuff that comes. Yeah I mean it's I've I've seen online along with the frosted tips that JT is back filming his confessionals so there's a good chance so we have the reunion I think because back to the social cues thing, I think he filmed the season was like everyone's going to be against me. Let me just quit from the beginning. And then when it started airing and some people were like, wait in contact is not bad. And he maybe he even saw it that he was like, Oh, like, well, producers probably convinced him. They're like, Look, people are like, not seeing you. How you think they're seeing you. Yeah. And like, if you don't speak, there's going to be dead air, right? I mean, I do think if you come look worse on you to not be a part of this, it's making it look like you think you did something wrong as opposed to like these are just the events that played out. Yeah. And here's the thing. Don't commit to reality TV if you don't like to look bad because you're just going to. Right. But then on top of that, if you commit, you've got to just keep going with it because if you don't speak someone speaking for you but then again, like I think with Shannon Beador and you know, Johnny J, Johnny J would have been better off just not saying anything. Actually, I think going back with Alexis, which I'm jumping ahead again, but Alexis is not coming back to O.C.. Oh, it. No one's surprised. Yeah, I don't feel like I have much to say about, like, bye bye. I'll be waiting patiently for that break up. Like, we can't keep playing out, like beating a dead horse. Yeah, I think if she comes back with Johnny J and they're just, like, there to antagonize Shannon, like. Who is. Who's going to find that interesting? Yeah, there was no room for her. So Sam is visiting me in Los Angeles, and I've waited a long time to finally go do something about her. And we went yesterday a little family trip with my son and our husband. Yeah, the husband and the son were trying to get out of it, but then they ended up in there. In there. So should we give, like, our review of the sandwich or the shop? Let's start with the shop. Yeah, it's a very small but very cute. Okay. We showed up. It opened at 11. We showed up like. Like a lot of 30. Like almost 12. Yeah. And there wasn't a, like, formal line, right? All the tables were filled pretty. There's one table open that we kind of grabbed, but all the other tables were filled and there were a couple people standing inside. Yeah. And then it was clear it was starting to be like witching hour of people coming. So then the employee was like, Everybody go outside and they have like a very organized system where it's sort of like you can come in and get takeout. When it's full or you can wait and you can get a table, but it's so small. And so the line that you're seeing is really their organized system. But like, again, if this was in New York, this shit would be moving. Like they'd be like, get your sandwich. Yeah, well, I do think it's like good publicity or good like, look for them to have this line outside, even if it does mean there's like not that actual many people there. I think it like looks good that like, oh, look, there's always people like waiting outside of this place. I question how they make any money because I mean, this is really expensive. Yeah, I guess that's true. And I mean, they always have like a line. They always have people coming, but it's just such a small. Well, the question is how sustainable. And Douglas better bathroom living off of Vanderpump rules but now that and I guess jumping ahead a guess that Vanderpump rules is going to be really casted and Ariana and Katie are going to be on TV or who knows what capacity they're going to be on TV? Like how much pull do they continue to get when there's not sort of like this reminder of their fame or of their importance of or of interest in that? Yeah, it feels like another year they can probably get good business. But then after that, like where does it go from there? Which I don't know anything about the restaurant business, let's just be honest. But for me, I did work at a restaurant I did in New York City, but it should qualify me for more restaurant job But I will say, like their money is in franchising that brand because they do have a really good brand. The design is really cool. How you see it on Instagram is how it is in real life. Look, I really do that and New York would do great. Yeah. It almost reminds you of that French bakery in New York that has like ten or now like 100 different location, right? Yeah. And it's like really girly and it has like the little, like sandwiches and it's got a bar. Yeah. When you're in there, it's very cute. Like I could see my they need coffee so they don't have any coffee. That's a big negative. I'm like, why get coffee? Like because I could see myself like if it was a little bigger or spacious, like having coffee and a sandwich and my computer and just, like, staying there and working all day. Yeah, but I mean, they're never going to have that because it's just so small and it's in that space. Yeah. Yeah, the sandwiches were. Good. We only have three sandwiches. So we got the the Nancy, which was the BLT. I think if we're getting the names wrong, please correct us. And I thought that was the best. Yeah, the BLT was the best. Then we got the burrata, which I don't know the name of, and then we got the goat cheese like apple. The bread on the burrata made it really soggy and the bread on really tasty, though, like all of the flavors. And it were really cheesy, but yeah, the bread made it a little goopy. Yeah. And they needed, they didn't give us silverware with it, which is like necessary, especially for feet. Yeah. And then the goat cheese apple felt like that bread would have been better with the bread. Which those two. Yeah. Because I saw like some other pod did a review that bobbleheads are all wrong and I was like, I'm not going to I don't I'm not a food critic to know. But they were right. The breads were a little. Well, I felt like a BLT bread was I was was like, yeah, that was all that was really good. But it was like a sandwich shop, you know? Yeah. I mean, it's sandwiches and like, sandwiches are good. Yeah. Yeah. But they didn't. Yeah. I mean, it's such a small space to even give any more critique. Honestly. Clearly they're getting business not because their sandwiches are great. And it's not to say that the sandwiches about their sandwiches, they're good. Yeah. And some of them are better and some of them are not as good, but none of them are, like, terrible. Like, I'm not like, there wasn't a sandwich we had that were like, take it back. Worst sandwich I ever going. But the okay, Katie and Ariana weren't there. I had already seen online that Ariana was in London. So sad. And then Katie was in Vegas with her thing with her, who may or may not be evil. We're not sure and we won't see on Vanderpump Rules because it's canceled. I will say the workers at this restaurant were young and hot and I was like, why couldn't they just keep some of the Vanderpump rollers, like wrapped up their stories? I mean, in that scenario, I see that we're playing out. SCHWARTZ And Sandy's deciding to close their bar, right? That could have been interesting. This whole thing with Lisa and Schwartz being the only people at TomTom and cutting out Sandoval like that could have been interesting, and it wouldn't have been like the whole season arc. But a few episodes like Catch Up. And then as you're introducing The New People, which is kind of like that season prior to the COVID season where they brought in like Dana and some of the newer people and had, you know, Raquel a.k.a Rachel like starting to work at Sur but and then have Katie and Ariana like introduce them at the sandwich shop and introduce their workers and like get one or two of those hottie hot on it, right? Like the OG cast, become like the Vanderpump or they're just like they're two. They just come in some scenes. Yeah. And if it doesn't work, you phase it out. The only people in that scenario who don't really fit in is Sheena and Lala. But I'm okay with them reaching out. And she, like Sheena, could do a scene with Schwartz where Schwartz complains about what's happening in Schwartz and Sandy's, and they could all go to the last night at Schwartz and Sandy's, which apparently Sandoval didn't even go to, which is another cool thing. I'm like, BPR, Nashville, what is he doing? What is that man doing? He seems like he's deeply unwell though. Like, I think this man I know well allowed him to fully emerge into his, like, villain identity. I know, like, I think that he spent a lot of time trying to hide his villain identity and, like, wear this mask of, like, the good guy. And then after this, I could. We could do a whole episode on Sandoval, I guess one day, or maybe not. But I do think, like this all happening allowed him to, like, be like, I don't need to pretend to be the good guy anymore. I get to just be like who I am, which is like kind of a villain, which is maybe going to be on traders. He's definitely going to be on House of Villains, that's for sure. But yeah, he didn't even go to the final night. But yeah, I saw a world where that could happen. I wasn't thinking that because we've done parts where we said like Vanderpump Rules just feels dead. But then being at something about her, I like kind of that idea. Again, I was like, That does terrible. But I think it came down to money. Like, everyone was just too expensive. Yeah, it's easier to just keep. Lisa Yeah. And I did say they were going to make a show under that name. I never believed this whole newbie spinoff storyline that was fake, but I think that's deeply problematic because we're seeing what's happening with New York Housewives where they like recast it and it's like we're constantly and it could be something interesting, but it's not The Real Housewives look. It's not like I hate it, I don't love it. But part of me thinks that I don't love it because I'm constantly comparing it to the OG's of New York, where if it was like, Oh, influencers of New York, like, I'd come into it with like. Different expectations. Yeah, that might allow me to, like, buy into, like, what they're trying to sell me. Yeah, that would be PR. They're going to try to give us a new cast and say, this is the same thing, and it's we're going to constantly be comparing it to the OG is and you don't strike lightning twice like that. You just you don't. And you need to have a slow transition. I don't know. Yeah. I'm going to be frank and say I gave up on New York Housewives. I'm like five episodes, so I can't even really comment on what's currently happening on the show. But yeah, I mean, I'd be interested if they would bring like I would want to see Lindsay Hubbard or Page on New York Housewives. Like, I don't know, you have this Bravo verse. Will all these people know each other from Bravo Bravocon and they do these fan fest like they do in Iraq. They do go to each other's events. because Andy Cohen has basically said, like, we're double down like New York is New York. We're we're we're sticking. They're going to need to reach us probably at least a little bit and shake it off. But he's like, no, the OG is coming back. Doesn't even even if they wanted to do that, they can't because logistically they all live in Palm Beach or whatever or the Berkshires or. No, I miss Brenda though I still want dorinda's like house show to happen. Also in sad news, Dubai was canceled. Oh, before we go to that with. Oh, we'll talk about Jamie. what's out there right now is James was arrested for domestic violence after the Kathy Hilton's Christmas party, which is another day to film Kathy Hilton's Christmas party. Right. And the police report came out, didn't say his name, but like you could put two and two together that he threw her to the ground. Right. That there was some real, like, physical violence that happened between him and unknown woman. Yeah. And Alice, very small. But yeah, I think there's a history there. I think it's probably very true that he has anger. I imagine that like losing this job, he's very on edge and like, none of it excuses it. Like you're he's an adult, he's responsible for his behavior. And yeah, I just worry about Ali. I know that like when you are in a situation like that, it's really hard to leave and it's really hard. I was happy to hear that she left the house like. Yeah, scared me a little bit at first. Yeah, but it's like whether you break up or don't like, you need to do something drastic to let that person know that like, I'm not okay with this behavior. And her first sort of initial statements kind of seem like they were enabling a little bit. Well, she like they were saying, basically, she was out about like totally fine. Also, like, okay, I do agree that the show triggered it and I think we all thought he was in a better place than he probably is in general or like in the show trigger. Yeah. I wonder if he relapsed with like drinking and I don't know exactly what his state of sobriety was at that point because with him he's never like consistent with his sobriety. And I do agree with like what Lisa said from the very beginning, that like he is someone who like needs to never have a drink. I totally agree. And he never really did the healing. I think we gave him a pass because Sandoval came out with so bad and he was getting his life together that almost like he got an unintended pass. And what did seem like he was trying because he did have these periods where he was giving up drinking. And I imagine in his career that's a really hard thing to do. I think also when we talk about domestic violence and this is just a layman's perspective, like, yeah, there is definitely a perception that it's like, Oh, woman with a black eye that's like, you know, stumbling in. And like in reality, it's probably like two people getting escalated and one person pushing the other person. And like and sometimes it doesn't even look like physical abuse. Like, what we know about James is he is like, remember those text like seasons ago that he sent to Rachel that were like she was like reading them to Ariana. They were extremely abusive texts, like the way he was speaking to her and the things he was saying, like that's abuse. And that impacts someone's self-esteem. It impacts their feeling of independence, their feeling that they can make control and choices in their lives and can be really problematic. And, you know, I think James also does some things around like control with money that we hear that it's, you know, he likes to pay for everything. That's never a good scenario. I mean, I guess people are pretty mad at Lisa Vanderpump for, quote, unquote, standing by him. Did she ever come out and say anything? Are they saying just because she didn't say? Yeah. And then Sheena and her typical Sheen fascinating about herself was like, that was the worst because she was like, I realize that people think I look bad for not saying anything. Like, Could you ever not make something completely about yourself and your image? Yeah. And then Kristen Doherty is she's getting her last laugh because she Christmas rising like an egg Hansel to like rising to the top like I over gel over. Yeah should you know Jackson saying you're not ready to be a mom and now look at Jax and then Lisa Vanderpump was like, oh, she's having a baby with Hiro. I think the Internet made a bigger deal about, oh, great. You know, she was just saying, like, I don't know who are like, I don't know these people. I'm not close with them, but she does have her. And then, of course, she's a producer on the show is like that doesn't mean she watches it. I felt like people were saying she's like saying something really terrible about Kristen, and I feel like she was just trying to probably overcompensate in some way and be like, I don't know anything about this person because she, like, feels very above. Kristen I agree with that. And also I feel like Lisa's producer credit on the Valley from the knowledge I know from people who worked on the show is very legacy from Vanderpump Rules. But she doesn't do anything like I don't even think she watches cuts. I could be totally wrong, but it does. I was kind of surprised when people were even saying that she had that. So, yeah, R.I.P. Vanderpump, you we will never have anything like you. You will live in our hearts forever. Well, we try the new one. Yes. Well, we complain about it, of course, like basically. No. And we'll definitely compare it to the old one. Yeah. And Dubai getting canceled. We fall for that. And just maybe that's why we need it. Our brain. Let's do a petition. It's expensive. And the problem is, there's no money. We all broke. We need a go. Fund me for Dubai to come back. Can't Carolyn's Danbury's friend just pay for it? What's his name? I think. Mike, Mike, Mike. All we need to do is pay for it. Like I'll support Caroline. Joe, pay for it. You'll have to pay less for her if you pay for her to show up. I don't know. Maybe they do like a spinoff where it's like about her and Sergio in their hotel in Bali. Yeah, but I really like Tully Justice for to leave, you know, to lean Broadway and I really like Chanel. I like she's a good character and I wanted to see what was going to happen. I mean, her and Lisa, like after the fallout at the end, like now we're just stuck on a cliffhanger. They need to figure out a way to make it cheaper. That's all I can say. Yeah. Michael, please fund this. Michael, fund this. Okay. Beverly Hills is back. There's a lot going on. Dori became an entirely new person. So this season I am making a three. Is it one? 81. 80 under. And Erica? Yeah. I heard her the MVP this season. Like, I was ready for Erica to be canceled. To be fired. I was like, don't bring her back. She's bottom of the barrel at this point. And she is like a Phenix rising in the sun. And I want to give her a pizza party. Yeah. When she came out about the pizza party, I was kind of felt sad. I was like, you know what? She did kind of deserve a pizza party. No, she definitely didn't deserve a pizza party. No, I feel like she deserves one now. She does, but I wish. Okay. My frustration, because I've watched all the like a housewife and hustlers two was like, can we ever get the truth? Well, I think the thing with Erica that that made me the most upset about the whole thing with Tom was she came on to the show being like, I'm a smart, savvy. Like, this is who I am. I'm intelligent, I'm savvy. I can move through the world in these ways. And then as soon as everything happened with Tom, she tried to convince us she was dumb. And you can't convince us how smart you are. And then be like, I will open a credit card. It's like, you know how to open up like you do. You're not a dumb woman, but you know you're not a dumb one. So don't play a dumb woman like and I don't know what that looks like when your husband's going through something like that, because clearly it means that you knew more than you're willing to say you know? But you need to figure out a way how to sell that without say. Oh, you know, I just got chills because this is Braunwyn storyline. Yes, yes, this is Braunwyn. Erika is Braunwyn because Braunwyn is that. I'm so smart. I'm so smart. But in my relationship I've done a lot and very similar dynamic, right? Like a rich older man who's taking care of you, who you feel like you have to like live under their rule and their law. But as soon as you're away from them, you're like a different person. Yeah. There's some there's some parallels there there. Interesting thing about India right now would be really interesting. So Dori and P.K. getting divorced. I really like how much Dari is showing and showing. I feel like we're getting the we should be getting from high quality. Yeah. Vulnerability of her just being like, I still love him, I still want a marriage. But there's all these. And just like the authentic feeling of this is someone who is unhappy in their marriage and who's, like, not ready to give up this idea of family and this image and this, like, life that she's created. Okay. So do you have some insider knowledge? I have someone I work with recently who were next door neighbors to Tory MP Chi and like good friends and basically was saying so did the robbery happen? This was they moved before the robbery because I asked that question. I said, what about the robbery? And she, oh, this person's wife. It's also like involved in law enforcement. So they called her after the robbery. And so from there, like, it was all real, obviously, and because they had spoken to that, but they weren't living there, they had moved away at that point. Okay. So but they said like early days before, they weren't housewives, like they were the most in-love couple, all this stuff. And then they were saying like P basically wanted to write to be famous. Like he had this dream of dripping famous. He wanted to have her on the show. He put her on this pedestal like all this stuff. But do you think it's because he's like a little bit of a scammer? I get like scammer vibes from him, like he's constantly trying to scam. Like he almost kind of reminds me a little Randall Emmett because even when they were saying that, I was like, Well, then he got all that and then she eclipsed him and he couldn't handle it, right? Like now she's like, doesn't actually need him. And he's like, Well, I don't know what to do. Like, I don't have control anymore. at that dinner they had where it was just that where he's like, you're you need to stop calling me. He was saying like, I didn't like it, that you made me feel like less of a man with your, like, money and power and not needing me. And it was like, Oh, you're a little male ego. And somebody did a breakdown on Instagram that was basically like outlining the story of their relationship, but like, you know, obviously skewed towards the right side. But it was like Dirie was a successful designer and then he wanted her to give all that up to like raise children. So she did. And then she he and him came up with the idea of doing her own swimwear line. And she had a name and a branding and a whole thing. And then she went on a trip, came back. He had rebranded the whole thing without her, like, and then she even said, I guess at that dinner like or no, it was with bars or whatever later that she was like, you know, the boss. Sorry. All the new people's names. I'm not doing well with. I'm just learning braunwyn. I'm still call her brown wine. But like with that conversation, she was like, but I know things about business. Like, I know things about contracts. Like, I have lawyers. So, like, you're asking me to trust you with this stuff, even though I have my own knowledge. Like, it just seemed like he needed to take up space and be the center and, like, be the smartest one in the relationship. But I kind of wonder, it does feel like they did have like an agreement that he was going to play one role and she was going to play another role. And I think this is something we see in Housewives a lot where like when they do get the power and the money and the fame of being a housewife, that that dynamic shifts. But there isn't like a conversation of like what's going to happen because our roles are going to change. And that's like my advice for like future people who want to join these shows is like, have those conversations with your spouses before you go on the show, because if you have one set up this show is going to change it. You being on the show is going to change that and that's going to change the dynamic and that's going to create resentment that's going to create so many issues in the relationship. Definitely. And but at least with T.K. and Dory, I can follow and I feel like we're getting the story. The frustrating part with like Mo and Kyle, I'm like, they're having the nicest divorce ever. And it's just like, what the fuck are you both, like, flaunting his philandering in her face? He's like, he's a he's a kemosabe with a bunch of, like, you going with it. But I'm just that's what it's like. I feel like She is trying to for one image of like what this separation is. That is like a bow and it's nice. And we love each other and like with so, so much love there respect. And if there is all of that that why is he bringing those? Like, why is he bringing the young bartender to Kemosabe? That's Kyle's place. Like, to me, the math isn't math. Think of like what Kyle is trying to show us and like, what we're just seeing based on, like, you can't hide things anymore. And this is something interesting that I think also connects to like braunwyn like in this age of reality and social media and everything. Like, you can try to produce something and make us think it's one way, but there's too much you know, there's too much out there for us to, like, be able to see behind the curtains that, like, you can't create a pretty image. And it's better to be vulnerable, like P.K. and Jerry are being of like, what's really going on and how difficult it is and like how it is tricky. Well, and that's why I don't feel like Mo is like, I guess philandering doesn't feel right to me because I'm like, well, she wanted the divorce and she asked for it. And yeah, he's doing all those things, but they're, they're socially well paid legal papers. It seems like they're freakin divorce, right? Like he's living in a different. Yeah, like that's what's weird to me with Kyle is like, you wanted this and weren't you running off doing music videos with Morgan, right? So like to me, I'm like, What is he doing? I love to do a deeper dove into Kyle and her family and all of that, because I think that she is like this person who puts on such a mask and like you see it break and she like doesn't know what to do with it. Yeah. And I mean, like, it's weird this season that she's almost playing it. Like, she thinks they might get back together, like Dory, as at saying we're in couples therapy and I would like to make it work. And P.K. is saying, I don't basically. And that seems clear. But with Mo and Kyle, Mo isn't really thinking anything. Conversation. Yeah, every conversation we see with them is so surface like that conversation. That one conversation we saw between Dory and P.K. was so deep and they both talked about their emotions. They both talked about how complicated this is and how difficult it is and laid out clear what it is they feel and they want. Even though they were on the same page about it, it was like there it was raw. Kyle and Mo, like they're sitting there talking about like, can you remind me how to turn on the pool lights? So they're so, like, so fierce. And I think that's their entire role. I don't think you've ever had like a deep, emotional, vulnerable conversation. And I question whether Kyle is capable of it. I don't think she's done it with anyone, even with Cathy when she tried to. Right. Like at those reunions, you see the the moment that she's most pissed at Dory for for like trying to interpret for her, like, this is what Cathy means. Kyle shuts her down because she's like, I don't want to go that deep. I don't want to, like, go to the deeper emotion. Yeah, this is so true. So true. And I mean, even the stuff about her sexuality, she's like the big sport. It's like, Oh, what are you having sex with? Morgan are not right. You don't just say you're lesbian or bi or whatever, but, like, are you having a relationship with this woman? Yeah. You made a music video of you guys like Making Out and then said it was a joke. And also like to me Kyle's whole thing of like, I just want my privacy or I just want like, people shouldn't be so invasive. It's like you are on a reality TV show. You made a choice to make your life public and you don't have to, like, pick and choose. And if you compare her to, like, Vicki Gunvalson, that woman, given her life, you know, you can love or hate her, but she's given like multiple deep relationships on these shows that like, yes, it's been bad, but like you've been on the show as long as she has. But really, what did what has Kyle really given on that level? I guess it's almost like she just sacrifices people, right? Like that's what she gives a sacrifice. She brings her sister, Kim, and like, right. Like she sacrificed. She brought Kathy sacrifice, like even her friendship with Lisa Vanderpump, like she was willing to, like, throw it under in order to, like, avoid real, real stuff. Yeah. And that's why I'm like, I mean, I don't even know in the finer details of Kyle verse story who I could side with, but like I'm on the jury doesn't listen. Oh, yeah, exactly. It's with the getting in the finer details. I think it's difficult. But at the same time, I'm kind of like I'm teen Dorit because we've seen this pattern with Kyle so many times, right? It's like, I can't even care who she's fighting anymore. I'm just like, This is the same thing you did to Lisa Vanderpump, to so and so to Kathy, to look to everyone, everyone. So but I'm really excited about the season. I think it's really good. I am, too. And we love Jennifer Tilly. What a great person to add to this. She's so interesting and fun to watch and just watching her like ping pong, her head as the other women are fighting and be like, what is going on is like how I feel like I would be if I was in that like sprinter van or December taxi. And I think she's willing to be honest. Like, I like that she was like, yeah, you know, even just yeah, you're, you're mercurial. Mercurial. summer house trailer we kind of touched on. Oh but to the Lindsey and Karl of it all in that yeah. So there's one clip because you know we're deep in the Lindsay Karl relationship we've been that's how we started our pod. There's a brief moment where Lindsay well Karl is responding to something Lindsay said and basically saying and they get into this back and forth, basically of Lindsay being like, you cheated on me while we were together. Right? And he's like, I will pray for you, like get a life, basically. And she was like, I don't need it. And everyone was like praising Lindsay for like whatever she like whatever her retort was. But to me, what I felt in that moment was like, why is she like, she's having another man's baby? You're pregnant with another man's baby and you're still trying to make this guy look bad? Like, oh, like. And also when Carlos openly said, I haven't kissed a woman since Lindsay, Lindsay's already pregnant with another guy's. Maybe. And then you want to make him now seem like he was cheating, right? Right, right. Oh, she needed to win. She, like, needed to win that breakup to a level that, like, she wanted to destroy him. It's and I think she's pissed that he's back and that he didn't get, like, fired or completely canceled or the whole world doesn't, like, totally hate him. Yeah. And it was interesting the one moment where she was like, yeah, we have names. And then Sierra was like, Who is we? I thought that was funny. I'm interested to see how much we're going to actually hear about this relationship. Right. Well, and I think this is going to be the problem with Lindsay is like you can't be a reality star and decide to hide a big part of your life. If you have this partner having a baby with who you're having a relationship with and you want to be on a TV show, like, that's boring. I want to see the relationship. I want to see what's really going on there. And what we know about Lindsey is she is really good about painting a pretty picture of how things are. Is it very inaccurate to how they actually are? Yeah. And so we're going to hear how great and wonderful this guy is and how great and wonderful their relationship is. But what we know is Lindsey is a PR pro. She's openly said it doesn't make sense for her to go back to Summer House, which I am shocked they filmed their whole season with her pregnant, but it seems like she brought stuff so I'm you know I support you know her coming back for this season being pregnant because she did bring some story and like life to it. I mean, we'll see. Yeah. And I mean, it couldn't have been easy being pregnant doing that. That's actually sounds like my nightmare to be pregnant at our house with people partying. So, yeah, I mean, but is she going to be on house? Like, they got to do something without anyone. As much as I have said my $0.02 on Lindsey, I don't want her to not be a family star. Yeah, she's a professional. Okay, this is a big one. Karen Puga Potomac. This is a good fall from grace. So you are. We have the verdict. Do you. Do you remember the verdict was I mean, guilty on you? Negligent driving. It was like driving without a license. There was like six counts, I think. Or eight was like when she was like, wait till you see the truth was like, well, and I think that's what's so deeply problematic about all this. And like, I know we were talking about this the other day, but I think that she should be fired because she spent this whole season trying to be like, I did nothing wrong. I'm like, I'm innocent. I like you guys will see how innocent I am. And everyone's trying to, like, hold her accountable or get her to, like, see that, like, okay, you don't have to be a bad person for this to happen, but you need to recognize that like you made a mistake. And I think her doubling down on like, I'm innocent, I didn't do anything wrong. Like, to me is like she put people's lives in danger while she was in a very bad position to have filmed this season, I think because some of the counts like driving without a license or whatever, suspended license, whatever it was, like your license either is suspended or it's just fact or fiction. Yeah, there's no I don't know. It's all fact. It's all like, well, well, I think and I could be totally wrong on this. Someone who's a lawyer actually, like studied all of this. Please do. I say I am, but like it, they're in certain states. They don't have to force you to take a breathalyzer so you can deny it and then you can fight it in court. But like, from what my knowledge on that is, is like it never works, right? Because if you denied it, then clearly you're kind of inadvertently saying you're guilty. And I would imagine and discovery, her lawyer saw all those horrible videos, you know, how could you have seen those videos and go out of show and pretend you're innocent knowing that like I maybe she thought those videos would never come out. Well, no, she must have known that. That's why I'm saying, like, what? Don't you shoot her? She looked more than drunk. Like she looked at. I was under the belief that her. Okay, this is just my theory. But my belief was that she was going to come out and say she was on some kind of prescription meds that she didn't know would affect her the way it did. And that's what happened. And that was her defense. I have not seen anything to indicate that she asserted that I didn't see anything like. But I guess what's more, I understand her going on the show and being like, I cannot talk about anything. I am innocent because she was planning on fighting or not saying you're innocent, you don't have to say. You can just be like, I can't talk about Yeah, Erica style. Yeah, I can't talk about it. I can understand that. But I think there were aspects of even when she went to watch her habits, like, she was like, y'all see the truth. And it's like. We're still waiting for the truth. Karen. What the hell was that? They haven't filled the reunion, have they? No. That's why I'm saying I don't usually be fired until after you get to freakin. But she is in a lot of shit. Me I. Right. She's going to really need to like. Make amends? Well, I mean. I mean, she's going to go to jail. She's going to go to jail. How did she not just plead guilty? Like now the judge is going to throw the book at her because. Right. You should have thought like, well, not only that, but now there's like all this footage of her trying to, like, double down on being like, I'm so innocent. That's what I'm saying. How is she going to go into court and cry? I don't think she'll get two years, but I don't think she'll get nothing. Yeah, I bet she gets at least a year. Yeah, or six months. Well, it would be like a year that she'll serve, like. Yeah. So I think that Bravo won't need to make that decision, because I think the court will make that decision for them. And if she's off for a season. You know. Yeah, everybody likes a redemption arc. The problem with Karen, though, is she so she has no humility. I am so I'm just still like, what the hell is going on with you and Ray? Because every season she's been like, It's because of my marriage with Ray. It's like but every season she's also like, our marriage is an institution. Karen's in a place where she's going to have to come to that reunion with her tail between her legs or whatever. It takes some, like, real accountability because, like, again, like, she could have killed people. Like she put her life in danger, but more importantly, she put, like, other people's lives in danger. And like, there has to be responsibility taking and like clearly you have a problem. And whether that problems with alcohol, with your mental health, with like, you know, something else like you need to like be able to acknowledge that you did something wrong. And she just feels like someone who cannot do that. Definitely. And to pivot to Salt Lake City, Mary Sons drug addiction. It was probably some of the best reality TV I've seen in like five years. Yeah. I mean, I think it's like a beautiful example of like what enabling looks like and how hard it is to be a parent of some of a child in addiction. And I think Mary is needs to deeply work on like what her boundaries with her kid are going to be because letting you know your addict child live in your house rent free is enabling, right? Like you're allowing him to continue his addiction by giving him comfort and giving him money and giving him right. This is giving him access to drugs and allowing that to continue. And like how hard it must be to say that, like. To your child. Like, I can't support you, and I need you to hit rock bottom so that you'll, like, get better with the potential. Like, they could die. And I think on a reality TV perspective, like the producing of that scene, you really see, like you take a person like Mary and say, this is something that's really happening in your life and really important. And I think she talked about on Watch What Happens like that. Her and her son were like, let's just go into this conversation and just be as real as we both can be. And I actually think I don't think they would have had such a real conversation unless the cameras were there, in a way. Yeah, it seemed like it it allowed them to have some kind of accountability because Mary's obviously been living with him this whole time and seeing what's been going on. And we saw that for a while. Yeah, we saw in the couple of scenes that they even aired before that. So I almost think maybe that gave her a little bit of power. And I think as producers, you know, obviously there's an element always of like meddling or how much do we meddle or how much did we did it. But like really the key to really good reality TV producing is making a real safe. Please. We're two people can sit on the couch and just have a really real conversation. And that's what you show. Like you can make all the, like, big parties. You can make all the things. But but you can't, like, fake that level of vulnerability and authenticity. And the way he described, like, depression and what, you know, substances do for him in his depression. Must have like that's so real for so many people, this feeling that, like, everything is bland. And as soon as I use like it's like spices and I just felt like that was a really powerful thing and people need to hear that and understand that like, it is not it's it's just not so simple, right? Like, I think people, if you haven't, like, dealt with this personally in your family, with your friends or with anyone in your life. Like I think it's very easy to judge Mary and to judge him and judge what they're going on. And he did a beautiful job describing I think Mary did a beautiful job, just like beings trying to be supportive and trying to hear him and give him a space to talk and but also holding herself and him accountable. Definitely. And I think also, yeah, her relationship with Angie is really great to watch. I am curious about her husband. She mentioned on Watch What Happens Live. Her husband also struggled with some kind of drug addiction, has really been there for her son because he can relate to it. I'm like, it's so weird that we saw him first season and we've never seen him again. I think probably after all, like the scandals that came out about their church, he doesn't want to be like on the show, which, I mean, I really was hesitant seeing her come back and full, full house. And she's another one who's been like a 180 MVP this season. Like she's given more story that Heather Gay has. Definitely and Braunwyn. Yeah. We haven't even discussed. I did see the episode, the last episode where she reveals all the stuff about Todd. And then I saw the clip that she went on, watch what happens live and tried to like backpedal. Was that what she was doing? She was kind of like, Oh, no, they made this a bigger deal than it was. Okay. Yeah. And I know I tried to give Todd, like, a moment of. I just want to go back to our first episode that we talked about, Brownwood, where I was like, This guy is abusive. You were like, Superman. No, I'm getting that. I'm getting into this. Okay. Okay. I am backpedaling, obviously. But also, I'm going to say that I guess my point to point by point is these newbies and these new people, they come on their their first season is always rough so like be a little patient to see. I still feel like that point is valid, although Todd did not do any his him any favors. My other point is like sometimes I think people think in editing we make these choices and it's big choices. Sometimes it's like not it's just like that's what's there. And I still stand by that in the fact that if that's what's there, that's that's what I'm saying. I think my interpretation was he made an offhanded comment and that happened to be a good ending for the scene. And like, let's give him a second, because I did like I think there was something in that scene where Bronwen was texting him the play by play of the Mafia party and was like, oh two, have a good marriage. Like they had a good rapport. But then obviously that was like totally off base. I, but I think what I thought was, oh, just ignore it. Half, you know, it was maybe a throwaway line was actually is his entire personality because as a as a progression he's like controlling he is Todd has become absolutely horrible but but I think it was like another one who like wants to present things one way and is totally not ready for what it means to be like. Apparently, she was like an influencer before she was Oh, I don't even know that I heard it on Jamie Side's podcast. So yesterday is about Brian, but it was really good. But she was a she was an influencer, so she would like make all these posts about her life and she made like a lot of money and followers. And then you can like present yourself however you want as an influencer because there's no like. There's no one else who controls the narrative but you. But on reality TV, you don't control your narrative. You can't. And if you do try to, you people know and they find it inauthentic. And I think she's having a hard time now because she can't, like, control her narrative about herself and her interactions. And I think she's going to have a big like I think she's someone who's going to have a lot to face at the reunion when it's like, Oh, but look at like, look at this, look at this. You can't say that. And then we show this clip. Well, and Heather Gay. Justice for Heather Gay in that fight like she was too face. She's just so good at being two faced. So she says what you want to hear in that moment, in a certain tone, and then repeats the same exact words to somebody else in a different tone. Right? Giving it a completely different context and meaning, but then acting like it was the same thing. And she's done that a couple different times. And now even when she came out about the whole Todd thing in the context, again, it was like spinning again. It was like, I feel that the narrative's gotten away from me because the episode before that she was mad about the rooms and that was insane. Like she was like, okay, I got to throw something on this too. Like, sacrifice to, like, make them like me again. So she throws the whole Todd thing in it. Then she finds a way to make this Lisa's problem again. And to me, it didn't play as authentic in the episode as I saw in the clips online because again, context, right? Like the whole context was like all of a sudden she was like, now I'm going to reveal my vulnerable not. What this is social cues. I know. And then in the watch, what happens live. When Todd was actually sitting there like monitoring her, she was like, now I have a new story. Right. Like, no, they all they all misinterpreted. It wasn't like that. It was different. Well, she was basically saying that it was exactly the way she described it, but that they had nothing physical happen. We even more because he travels three days out of the week. Right. Right. He got another life in Chicago. Yeah, I know. I mean, that's why I'm like, these guys are going reality T.V.. Don't you know you're going to be caught? But I give I mean, I, I will give them one more season, but they will get divorced. I don't see a future for these two people. I don't know. Yeah, I, I, it's hard to imagine there's no pre-nup, though, so. I don't know. I think she'll leave him. Potentially, I don't know, but seem a little like Stockholm syndrome. Oh, and Britney and Jared Osmond are official on Facebook. Me? I have an announcement. What? That's a Britney. I thought you were going to say, I'm David. You do? And I was like, You are. I would not want to lose all the oh, my God, I've seen at least three or four there together. Announcements. Well, I think what's really interesting about Salt Lake City in general is I think that because a lot of them come from these like more traditional, like Mormon homes and upbringings, that they are sort of used to like having to present themselves one way and that sort of have these like it almost seems like they all had these, like secret lives inside of Mormon wives, secret lives of Mormon wives. Well, these secret selves, these like bad girl selves inside of them, like you see it with a Britney, you see it with Heather, you see it now with even Bronwen, like where they were like surviving in these good girl communities. But they all kind of had this like, devil on their shoulder. And so they've like, always kind of known how to navigate, like, having two selves. And like, that's kind of what you do on reality too. It's like you're kind of like creating these, like, two self. Oh, yeah. Like, you know, Braunwyn being insulted that Britney said she was wearing a costume, but then openly wears the costume to the airport once a week to pick up her husband. What is happening once again must remind the audience that the air in Salt Lake City is actually buoys in the water. The water. So the way the lake is, is it's got gases. And because the drought, the water is drying out. And the more that water dries out, the more the gases are released in Utah. Before I came to L.A. to visit Jenny and I didn't drink any of the water because I was, like, afraid of the gases in the water. And I was like, I can't drink the water or the water. So it's not like eggs don't drink the water. Well, get the bottled water. That is insane. But from what my knowledge of science, which is exactly zero, is that the water is good in it. But the more it dries up, the more the gases are released. And the air is don't breathe the air, don't drink the water. It's really beautiful, though. Did you want to become a mormon wife? I'm like, I'm not a Lisa Barlow, a Jew turned morbid. Like, I still I am still baffled by how any Jew turns morbid. Oh. I loved Meredith. Yeah, I loved it. I loved that she was showing us, like, different culture, different religion. I loved her. And, like, it gave us the most classic line of high body. Count her. Oh, my God. High body count here. That was the best. The best. And the bump it. And we should bring the buffet back. Would high body count hare be like an insult? Because I feel like in New York, like, those housewives would be like, yeah, we've got a high body count. Oh, my God, I should find that video we made. So Sam's bachelorette we did in the Jersey Shore, and we all went out to the club wearing leopard print and matching leopard red lipstick and bump bit hair. And then, remember, we filmed in the back of the club. Like, everyone giving, like Housewives tagline was, Oh my God, if you have it, we have to find it. We have to find it and post it and humiliate everyone who was there. Yeah, no anonymity here. And you know, everyone is coming for, well, mostly just Meredith for how mean she was in the body in that slut shaming, in that Meredith was crying and throwing up because of the slut shaming. But I'm sorry if someone slut shaming me by calling me high body count here, that's an that's a compliment. I wish I had high body cam hair. I'm proud of my body count. Body count right now. You know, high body count means like that. You fucked a lot of people. You lived your life. Yeah. You fucking had fun. Yeah. Like, stays the armpit, don't like, dry a lot of penises, but because they're all religious, it's, like, offensive. Yeah, but I don't know. Meredith is amazing. I think she is like, humor. Like, everything she does is, like. It's very unserious to me. It is very unserious. I think that show is perfect. So and digging this up, there's rumors. Rumors, there's a little room of nastiness. The rules are that this is going to be a Real Housewives of Toronto, because I guess that's the cheaper version of Dubai. Do we want that? I mean, if Caroline Stanbury moves there. Yeah. That will be Caroline Stanbury. I mean, she did just, like, build the house that took forever, but, like, she should just move somewhere. They were around that Beverly Hills, maybe. Yeah. Miami Hills. Miami. Because she's friends with Larsa Pippen. Weirdly, I don't know why that friendship made my face do something weird. So I don't know. I've heard nothing about Real Housewives of Toronto that can be totally fake, a fake and direct the crazier thing. Shout out to Bravo's and Cocktails. Again, we are waiting for our, you know, special invitation to the subscriber's club, the cocktail hour, where we will take a donated cocktails subscription. We do try to look at all the links and we are blocked. But they are saying there's going to be a Real Housewives of Rhode Island. My family is all technically from Rhode Island and live in Rhode Island. My dad lives in Rhode Island. They say it's going to be Cranston, which is hilarious. I, when I was a little kid, had a very thick Rhode Island accent. I wish I would have heard, but it was so embarrassing. Also, Rhode Island accent is the worst parts of a Boston accent and the worst parts of a New York accent mixed together. When I moved to Florida, all the kids made me say water, and I was like, water, water until it was beaten out of me. And I said, Water, this is. This is my trauma. So the fact that there would be a Real Housewives of Rhode Island is triggering, but like, I don't know, in a good or bad way yet. I can't imagine that there are people rich enough to be, like, qualified. I mean, do you have to be rich? I guess, like, maybe that's the experiment. I don't know how much I believe in Real Housewives of Rhode Island. I feel like someone's trolling us. I always bring out like they're going to do a Nashville one. They're going to do this one, and then they haven't done any of those. Well, here's the thing that I don't think is like always described as like any company, right? Like any production company can say, I want to do a Real Housewives of Bushwick, Brooklyn or Real Housewives of Tanzania. Like any place, get the money together, make a pitch tape, find these people, cast it, go around and say, we are doing Real Housewives of Rhode Island. Cast it, film it, and then send it to Bravo and Pitch. But that doesn't mean Bravo is commissioning. This doesn't mean Bravo is going to buy this. I mean, Heather Gay does a good job like describing this in her book, like the process of it. And also, Bravo could see it and be like, we like it, just not as housewives, let's call it, you know, blood, sweat and heels or whatever. So sometimes Bravo goes to a production company, says, we're kind of interested in Real Housewives of Dallas. Can you, like, work on this? Here's, like, a chunk of money to do that. So. That could be happening, right? They could be like filming and testing, but it doesn't mean it well. But it also like today. Yeah. Me and Sam tomorrow can make a production company and make our own Real Housewives and take it to Bravo. And they could say no. And we told all these people that was going to be Real Housewives stuff, you know what I mean? So it's it is a little bit and here's the thing. There's really only three or four big companies that make housewives. Right. Which is like evolution, truly original. So, yeah, Bravo's not going to trust like I think that honestly haymaker that started with Southern Charm, they were one of the first companies that started on a Bravo show But there is an aspect where the networks need to trust the company making it and their real company. They have a real infrastructure. They have like real money. Right. Especially something like Bravo, who, as we've said, doesn't always take risks. Yeah. So I would take it all with a grain of salt, but I would die if there was a Real Housewives in Rhode Island. For sure. So, yeah, we have a lot of requests. We're kind of thinking of doing Mia from Potomac. Yeah. Let us know if you guys think that would be interesting. Anyway, we're going to try to drop some bombs and. so, yeah, keep us in the DMS. Our Instagram is at unhinged on camera. Follow us. Like us, scribe, we will respond to your DMS. Happy New Year, y'all. Happy New Year.