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REAL TALK! with Doc and Marlon
NFL Divisions Deep Dive: The NFC West Breakdown
TJ, a 12-year-old football enthusiast, joins us to break down the NFC West division before Mike from the OC brings his Rams expertise to a wide-ranging sports discussion covering NFL predictions, baseball playoff races, and NBA all-time greats.
• TJ impresses with his football knowledge despite his young age, predicting the Rams to win the NFC West
• Mike shares his experience meeting fellow sports radio callers and hosts at Bar A
• Detailed breakdown of the Rams' roster with Matthew Stafford's back issues being a primary concern
• Analysis of all NFC West teams including the Cardinals' potential upswing with Kyler Murray
• Discussion of potential MLB trade deadline moves with focus on pitching acquisitions
• Passionate debate about NBA's all-time top 10 players with varying perspectives on legends like Jordan, Kareem, and LeBron
• Hosts share the iconic sporting events they wish they had attended including "The Catch" and Magic's junior sky hook
Join us next week as we break down the NFC South division featuring Atlanta, Tampa Bay, Carolina, and New Orleans.
And welcome. Welcome everybody to another episode of Real Talk. Doc, you doing all right today.
Speaker 2:Yes, I am man. We got a special guest. I'm really blessed to have him, and you know his name is TJ. He's 12 years old, and this is something else, man. He's very knowledgeable. Reminds me of me back in the 70s. Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how you doing today, man, you doing all right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm doing all right.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right, all right.
Speaker 3:Now, what grade are you in? I'm going to eighth, eighth grade.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right, and now for the audience. So letting the audience know this is going to be the NFC West episode. Last week we did the AFC North with jai, and before that we did the afc west with chad and s. So now we're going on the nfc west and we have our niners fans. So for one, I'll just ask you this so how are you feeling about your team and do you feel it's going to be kind of like a rebuild team, knowing you get rid of all your good pieces?
Speaker 3:yeah, I mean we lost a little bit of our pieces last season, so I feel like we have a little bit more work to do on the team overall.
Speaker 1:Okay, okay, doc.
Speaker 2:Yeah, tj, man, it's a pleasure man. Now, nsc West is going to be a competitive division. So it begs the question, man, who's a pleasure man? Now, nsc West is going to be a competitive division. So it begs the question, man, who's coming out to NSC West? Is it the Niners, the Rams, seattle or, you know, arizona? Your call right now, little cousin.
Speaker 3:I'm probably going to say the Rams, but who knows the Rams? They have a good chance, since they made it to the NFC Championship. That's my best look.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's great. That's a good prediction there as far as a lot of people at the Rams and the Super Bowl. Man, who's your favorite player on the 49ers or Rams? Maybe it's the Seattle or Arizona. Talk to me.
Speaker 3:My favorite player is probably going to have to be Pooka Nakua.
Speaker 2:Wow, that's great. That is great. Pooka Nakua man. Now I got a question for you I got a question.
Speaker 1:Now what are you expecting out of Christian McCaffrey? He was obviously great, you know, three, four-ish years ago, and now we've seen him deal with some injuries and he just hasn't really looked like himself. So what are you expecting out of Christian McCaffrey this year?
Speaker 3:I don't expect anything too like great. He's been injured. He's probably going to put up with a thousand yards, but I don't really expect anything too major from Christian this year.
Speaker 1:Okay, okay. The last question I got for you is who's making it to the Super Bowl this year?
Speaker 3:I want the Bills and the Lions.
Speaker 2:Wow, that's great. That is great man. The Bills and the Lions, all right, all right, you know I got a couple of questions for you, dj. Who's going to be your offensive rookie of the year? You follow the NFL draft. I'm a draft geek and you are too. Who's going to be your offensive rookie of the year and defensive rookie? I'm going with Ashton Gentry, the running back for the Raiders, the rookie, and on defense I'm going to go Jalen Walker, out of University of Georgia, the edge rusher. Your call TJ. Bring it what you got, baby Rookies.
Speaker 3:For offense that's a tough one. I'm going to probably have to go with Ashton Genting probably Ashton Genting, and for defense, probably probably if he has a good season Will Johnson probably.
Speaker 2:Wow, the cornerback for Michigan. Yes, yes.
Speaker 3:A lot of fix, a lot of the stuff that you need to do, he can potentially win, yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, that's great man. Now in football, what position are you to play, man? So you know you on defense or offense?
Speaker 3:I'm an offensive player.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, right on little TJ. Yeah, good position, you got your wheels, huh.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:All right, I'm going to give you my top three quarterbacks in the league and I want you to give me yours. You know, top three quarterbacks in the league and I want you to give me yours. You know I'm going to start off with Lamar Jackson, josh Allen and the guy in Kansas City, patrick Mahomes. Now it's your call. Who's your top three quarterbacks in the league?
Speaker 3:Top three. I'm going to have to go with Lamar, josh Allen and who else? Yeah, I'm going to say Patrick Mahomes, josh Allen, and yeah, I would say Patrick Mahomes yeah, patrick Mahomes, jaden Daniels is a close four Stafford's up there too.
Speaker 2:I asked you for three, brother, that's right man, how you doing in school man, did you homework.
Speaker 3:I'm out of school right now oh yeah, okay, right.
Speaker 2:Well, man, you're going to come on again. Brother, we're going to have you on again your homework. I'm out of school right now. Oh yeah, okay, right, well, man, you're going to come on again, brother, we're going to have you on again. We'll be thoroughly into the football season and I want your take on what's going on in the league. All right, all right, man, god bless you. Tell your parents to say hi, thanks a lot.
Speaker 3:Appreciate you for joining man.
Speaker 1:All right, we'll get you on next time, all right.
Speaker 2:Good job.
Speaker 1:It's summertime, doc, you know the kids ain't in school.
Speaker 2:That's cool man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that was great. That was great. He's good. This is one thing. Our next guest that's getting ready to come on. Obviously he's very well known, but you can ask him a question and he could talk for 35 minutes on one question. So I hope that he was taking notes how to answer a question and and you get stick and move, stick and move, stick and move, get in and out. So yeah, uh, so now none other than Mike in the OC joins us. Mike, you there.
Speaker 4:Gentlemen, that kid had so much poise. I wish I had as much poise as that kid, Doc, I mean that's beautiful.
Speaker 2:Yes, that's right, baby. That's how it started. We didn't have all this in the 70s. I had to do it on my own Baseball cards, stats newspaper, the Atlanta Journal of Constitution. These kids got it made man. But God bless them and he's going to go far with this. Yeah, but welcome, mike. Love you man, come on, love you guys too. How you doing Doing fine, brother. Yeah, everything's good man. A little hot out here, but we'll be all right.
Speaker 1:So really quick for those who didn't listen to the show today how was Bar A? How was it meeting Dog and Adam and Bob, stu and all of them? How was it?
Speaker 4:It was unbelievable. I wish you guys were there. That's all I kept thinking. I wish all like you guys and Champ and everybody that's called the station. It really was incredible because you know all these people you listen to all these years, like Alan White Plains, right, and you know Monica in Allentown, jan, rhode Island, just everybody, eric in Long Island, hayden, and here they are and I walk in and it's just like everybody kind of came up to me. I wear my Rams shirt, my Angels hat.
Speaker 3:Of course.
Speaker 4:It was me. They go hey, Mike, how you doing, Love your calls, Love this, and that we all had just an incredible time. And to meet Adam and Bob, that was incredible. You know. I mean, after all these years, you know for a lot of them right, ten years that's been what 20-whatever.
Speaker 4:Absolutely it's been a while right. Yep, absolutely Just to see them. They're just the nicest. The Scouts, chris, of course I met him once before when he came out for the Super Bowl to play at the Rams. He got together a few of us at dinner. I was lucky enough to Bob Stew set that up and Jimmy in Orange County a few of us. It was great to see him again and met him and his wife and Steve Torrey and his wife and all just hanging out talking, having a great time. It was tremendous. Babchick's doing his thing. I drove down with babchick. Believe it or not, that was a show, yeah that was a show in itself.
Speaker 2:I know it. I love babchick, yeah it was really good.
Speaker 4:Yeah, really good man that's good yeah that's good job uh
Speaker 1:okay, so we're gonna hop right into it. As I said earlier, we're doing the nf West this year, so of course, the Cardinals, the Seahawks, rams and the Niners, so I'll just hop right into it with your Rams, mike. Last year it was dealt with a couple injuries here and there, but overall I don't think anybody expected you guys to get to the point that you guys got to last year and also to a player, to a way from making it to the Super Bowl with playing as great as you guys did in Philadelphia. It was an incredible season, incredible playoff run. So what are your thoughts on the season this year? Any additions that you guys have had? How are you feeling about your Rams?
Speaker 4:Well, you know it's funny because last year going into the season it didn't look that great. Right, everybody thought we're not going to be that great. We lost Eric Donald. How's the defense going to be? Stafford, you know, elbow, this and that, and we surprised a lot of people, didn't start out well, but we really kind of, you know, got going in the middle of the season, towards the end, like I said, all the way to the you know, against the Eagles, who we got correct rhythm. We still almost beat them and here's the eventual champ. So who knows, if they won that game they probably could have took Washington and who knows how far they would have ran it. So there's a lot of expectations this year.
Speaker 4:You know, I think Adam actually at the party. Adam picked them to go to the Super Bowl, so it's all hinging again on Stafford. I know he's got the bad bat going right now. It's his training camp though, right, so I'm glad he came back. We were worried he was going to go, but that all worked out. And you know Jared Burr, fisk and all those guys on defense they were fantastic last year Kyron Williams on offense the draft picks are going to go, so I expect a lot, but you guys know the NFL. You know it's just so week to week because of the injuries. It's such a physical game, so it's just about the health. They could keep everybody upright. They've got a pretty good shot to go pretty far, I think.
Speaker 2:Well, mike, does it concern you in any way, shape or form, that Matthew Stafford's back is bottom, or you're just saving him for the regular season? Can that thing flare up? It's taken a beating through the years. Your take on that.
Speaker 4:I think it's always a concern, doc I mean. But you know he's such a tough competitor, you know he's had so many things going with him that he's the kind of guy he plays through everything. So I don't wear this bag. I've heard too much about the bag thing. I know it's kind of keeping him out now but they think he'll be ready to go.
Speaker 4:It's always a concern, but as long as he doesn't have a major hit, I think he'll be fine. You know everything should be good. You know with him, because he's a dog, as you know, and you know goes back to the days of Georgia. I mean, he's such an elite thrower.
Speaker 2:Yes, he is.
Speaker 4:He's one of the best throwers of the football I've ever seen. He can make every throw and so clutch he's put them over the top. That's why they won a Super Bowl.
Speaker 2:He came to Georgia under Mark Rigg as a five-star recruit out of Dallas Texas High school. He was a teammate of Kershaw, marlon and football and, believe it or not, kershaw was the center on that team. You know how high schools go, but Stafford, he's the real deal. He's the first Ballot Hall of Famer in my eyes because he has a ring Now. That being said, I love your D-line and Marlon, jason Fisk and Jared. First, who was the defensive rookie of the year. You know your D-line is there. Nobody can replace Aaron Donald. He's a machine, but he's been gone a year now. So what's your take on your defense brother, going into this tough division? You know you're calling back in linebackers. What Great.
Speaker 4:The D-line is really good right and they showed that. Kobe Turner right and all those guys up there I mean versus is going to be a good one. And I don't know if you saw they had that workout with Aaron Donald Doug a few weeks ago and he was tired. Aaron Donald put him through a crazy workout. He goes. I don't want to go anymore. And losing a Hall of Famer like that, it's incredible what they did. So they're good Linebackers. It's really the corners, the D-backs. That's always the concern with them. They're not really strong in that area. They're good up front but then towards the backfield not as strong, so they can get beat. But they were kind of last year bend don't break, kind of defense.
Speaker 3:You go down the field on them so now they made a big play.
Speaker 4:So they'll give up the yards, but they seem to tighten up when they need to. So I thought their defense really because the offense was a little up and down last year. That's the strength of the team last year, you know, because there were some games the offense could do a heck of a lot. They were very, very consistent all year long. So I expect the same thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I'm looking at you Go ahead.
Speaker 1:I was going to say, mike, I'm looking at your schedule right now and your win total is nine and a half. I'm thinking that it's obviously you play everybody in your division, of course, but you open out with uh home against houston, you at tennessee, at philly, so it's a tough one, and then the colts, the niners. So those five games. I see four and one schedule potentially so it's me too.
Speaker 1:I mean, even still. We've seen what you guys were able to do in the playoffs against that team in that weather too as well, in philly. So that's gonna be a great game too as well, going up against philly. But I I think you guys that you guys got a really, really cushiony schedule. I mean, you played new orleans, you played jacksonville, um, you got carolina uh, and you in the season. Sorry, doc, but you in the season with some cushion too as well with Seattle.
Speaker 3:Atlanta and Arizona.
Speaker 1:So you have a very, very, very favorable schedule going as far as for this year.
Speaker 4:I agree. I mean it doesn't look, you know, on paper it's not like, oh my God, there's some massive crazy games there. But you know the NFL, you've got to bring it week to week, you know, on any given Sunday. But I see double-digit wins. I mean I was going through two again before we got on and I thought I'm looking at it like you said, marlon, good start and the Eagles will be a tough game. The Niners will be tough. There's certain games that will be tricky. They have to go to London this year, which they. I could see 10-11 wins. I definitely could see 10-11 wins, you know, but we'll see how it goes. I could see. I think they're the favorites in the division. I mean, look the Niners, okay, they had a terrible year last year, right, but they got hurt, they had injuries. Mccaffrey was a ride, of course.
Speaker 2:DA was a ride.
Speaker 4:I just don't think that they're the team and scared teams like they used to. They're just not the same team anymore. They've lost guys. It seems like they always have some sort of thing going on at wide receivers Someone's unhappy with their deal or something or another.
Speaker 3:And.
Speaker 4:McCaffrey, is he going to be really healthy? Good to go. We've got to see about him.
Speaker 2:They say he's been working out pretty good with that. But before Marlon, before we break down those three teams in the division, I've got to ask you the addition of Devontae Adams to go with your boy Pakua. What kind of numbers are you expecting offensively from Adams, who's on the downside of the group but can still play with the quarterback Stafford? Give me some numbers. You know what?
Speaker 4:Doc, that's a great pickup for them. Devontae's such a pro's bro, you know, doc, that's a great pickup for them. Devontae's such a pro's pro, you know. And he was not in a good situation the last, you know. The Jets was terrible. The Raiders he's happy to be there. I mean, if they could get geez. I don't know number-wise, I think Pook will be the main target, but I think he has maybe 50, 60 catches out of them you know something like that, maybe?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm expecting a 70.
Speaker 3:That might be a little low, right? Yeah, yeah, absolutely for him.
Speaker 4:Him and Stafford, I think will be really good together. But you know, like I said, he's older too, but he can still. They're raving about him already, so I think it's a great addition. You know, and especially I hate to see Cooper Cup go, but Cooper just wasn't featured anymore. He was featured anymore. It was all Puka, so he didn't get him. He had injuries, so it'll be good. It'll be good. He's going to be a very, he's going to be a really good contributor for the offense. No doubt about it.
Speaker 2:The offense is going to be lit with Higby and Puka. What about your running game, man? Who's your runner, kyron?
Speaker 4:Williams right.
Speaker 2:You like him Okay.
Speaker 4:The fumbling is with him. He, but Doc the fumbling is with him. He had a couple fumbles. He had one or two fumbles in the Philly game. He's had a fumbling issue, but he was one of the top runners in the league numbers-wise. Yeah, and year before that when he got hurt they weren't winning, so they got him. And of course they got oh my God, what's his name? From Michigan, the other guy.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I know who you're talking about, number 23.
Speaker 2:Isn't it, corrin? Some Blake Corrin. Yes, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:Blake's good. Blake could be like maybe number one back of some other teams he's like. And then they got this guy right. They picked him up. They got Jarquez Hunter from Auburn Doc. You probably know this guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's a rugged runner. Yeah, this guy.
Speaker 4:Yeah, he's a rugged runner. Yeah, big guy. They picked him in the fourth round, so they got depth now that was a problem that running back they'd have a lot of depth sometimes.
Speaker 3:Ronnie.
Speaker 4:Rivers and different guys. So they definitely got a good running game, but Kyron has to hang on to the ball, the fumbling. You remember Wendell Tyler in the old days? Yes, I do, I do.
Speaker 2:I do Wendell Tyler.
Speaker 4:Great runner, God dang. That ball was coming out left and right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, especially in the Super Bowl against the Steelers and Lambert. Good response, good response. Brother Marlon, is you baby? The division let's do it. The division.
Speaker 1:Really quick and get to the divisions. You may know this more than I do, Mike, but I've experienced more of a very Belichickian type uh coaching with with these running backs. Sometimes with these running backs, if Kyron would fumble one time I feel like they would just mention he just wouldn't even get any more playing time. It's the other guy.
Speaker 1:So I've just noticed a lot of rotation and really just because of fantasy and all that stuff, getting one of the Rams running backs and you know you may get one of the guys last year I forget the name, but they just did goal line, that's just all they did. But he does a weird wonky rotation with these running backs.
Speaker 4:Yeah, he'll do that, you know. But it's funny with McVay, he's got a lot of respect there. He'll do it and they just have to deal with it. It's a button-up organization. You never hear a lot of squawking or anything like that. They just go out and do their jobs and get the guys they need to play the Rams when they are good to go. So yeah, if he's going to fumble, they're going to take him out. He knows he has to improve in that area, but he's the number one guy, no doubt.
Speaker 1:But Corum he's ready to go If he sees a problem.
Speaker 4:He's going to be it because he's off care. Yeah, corn's like a real physical runner yeah, you know, absolutely, they got it. They got a good situation, I think, with the run game. Nice, they're both young guys, you know, okay.
Speaker 1:So so looking at the cardinals and then looking at the seahawks, both win totals eight and a half. I I don't, I don't, I just don't know what to expect with with the, the um, the seahawks obviously they have the addition of sam darnold and then and then I believe your guy went there Cooper Cupp went there too as well. Three years, if I'm not mistaken. So I don't know I mean you know they're going to be a tough out. It's always tough to play there in that environment.
Speaker 1:The division games are always going to be ones that are a lot harder to play, but if you're looking at these two teams, what team do you think is going to come out with more wins?
Speaker 2:Doc, I'll start with you. Out of the Cardinals and the Seahawks. I like Kyler Murray man. That team is hungry. You got Marvin Harrison Jr and Marlon and Mike and I think that team is on an uptick, upswing. It's like Kyler Murray got his head on right. There were some questions about him a few years ago relative to preparation and study habits, but listen, it sounds like with the contract he's upped his game and remember he went on the road and beat a few teams shockingly so. You know Dallas on the road, I think he beat somebody else big and I just think the world of Marvin Harris and Julian. Plus they got the defense man. You know the young defense studs in Arizona.
Speaker 2:I'm not privy to Sam Donald in Seattle he has no weapons. Tyler Lockett is gone because you know TK Metcalf is gone. They still got Kenneth Walker III, mike and Marlon, but Sam Donald is not going to duplicate the 14-win season he had in Minnesota because he just doesn't have the weapons. You know they got a solid D, but not all that and I just think the acclimation to whoever he's going to throw to Sam Donald's going to have a downtick this year At some point. Mike, and you know this, you are who you are Now. He had Justin Jefferson in Minnesota. He doesn't have that in Seattle. So I'm going with Arizona as the threat to get the Rams problems. You know, as far as that's concerned and it might be shocking because I was really down on Kyle Murray but go ahead.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's a great point about you know, Sam surprised a lot of people last year. You know Minnesota had a heck of a year and then the Rams beat them in the playoffs. I mean, they went to Vegas, Remember, they moved to Arizona, they moved again to Arizona because of the fires and they beat them that with the Fires and beat them, but you know, doc, it's interesting too.
Speaker 4:You're right about Kyler. I just can't. I've always, you know. I just wonder. You know the size is always a concern to me, right, he's just not a big guy, he's a great athlete, awfully quick, you know. Sometimes he'll throw, just kind of throw out of the pocket off one leg and, you know, chucking it downfield. It's definitely not traditional and a couple years ago I would have said maybe I should go to baseball at this point. Remember the a's drafted him. Is he? Is he gonna last? And I didn't think the organization was good but he looked better last year.
Speaker 4:They seem to be on an uptick so I could see them being better than the cx. You know right, I mean sam's going there. You know they lost their receivers, you know it's just not the same team anymore. And you're right, marvin harris, they killed the Rams last year, I think the second game of the year. Marvin Harrison went nuts. I think that's the best game he had the whole year. But they got a nice thing going there, I think, in Arizona. But I can see both those teams. Yeah, they'll be kind of, you know, in that. I can see them in that 8-9 mix. I'm thinking there's not a lot of separation, I think, between the two. I think it's the Rams and the Niners and those two teams.
Speaker 2:But it begs the question. You brought this up earlier, mike and Molly, you might want to comment on this one too. Purdy signed a huge contract. Who's he going to throw the rock to? Because the one they got now he's still hurt and you know Guido's in Carolina, the running game CMC. He can't carry that offense like he did when he was 23 and 24. He's an injury risk, even though he seems healthy. Now Is Purdy going to do some things where Mark and B Calley of San Francisco might be listening. What can you expect from 49ers in your division, mike? You know what's the over and under.
Speaker 4:Yeah, last year was as bad for them and to me the jury still had them pretty. But I know they had to sign them. You know they had to sign them. It's a lot of money for a guy. That's done pretty well, but I still think there's something to prove there. You know that arm is still not obviously it's not a great arm. You know he's no scopper, he's notper, he's not in that top echelon, but he gets the job done right Somehow. He gets the job but he's got to have the right guys around him to throw to him. You said Doc if he doesn't have those guys.
Speaker 4:He's not going to create a lot of other stuff, so it's all that. And you're right. I mean, debo was to me the heart and soul of that team he was that guy. He killed us, I mean, you know the Rams. The Niners beat the Rams so much, although he would just come in and end around sweep flank whatever he's doing, going crazy. But then everything kind of went south last year and then Ayuk and that injury.
Speaker 4:So you're right, I don't know how they're going to look, their defense will be good again, and McCaffrey got to see it, so you know more. Think about it. It could be both. All those teams could be Maybe the Rams and the other three. I don't know, but I better not get too ahead of myself because you never know what's going to go on, but it'll be competitive.
Speaker 1:So Demarcus Robinson, you know him very well. Mike Yep, they have him Jennings. Who's Jennings would have weird games where he would go off for three touchdowns and then the next game he wouldn't even get a catch. It's weird.
Speaker 1:Of course Ayuk who we just talked about Ricky Pearsall. I was really high on him last year before he had the unfortunate incident, so he's going to be fresh and ready to go. And then, of course, you've got Kittle, who's always going to be around, but I just don't know if they have enough firepower. And Doc, to answer your question, the win total is 10.5 for this team and it's Damn Exactly. I don't know if Vegas knows something or we haven't even pulled their schedule up to take a look at that yet, but I don't see this.
Speaker 4:They got a pretty good one, I think like the Rams.
Speaker 1:Then that's probably what it is then. And, doc, I got a draft question for you. Who's going to have a better season? Um, is it going to be, uh, walter nolan or michael williams?
Speaker 2:well, given that I know michael williams personally because he went to georgia a former five-star recruit and parade all america and kirby smart had him playing inside and outside. So that's not a problem here. I'll go with michael williams only because he's so versatile. That's 6'5", 265 or 270, whatever the case may be. Opposite Bosa, I just think that he brings more to the table in the measurables than Walter Nolan does. Now. Walter Nolan, when he came out of high school gentlemen, was the number one recruit in the country overall as a D lineman, but he didn't have the numbers at Ole Miss and it's one of those things where at least Mikel Williams he won a natty his freshman year and they threw him in the fray because he's so talented. So, to answer your question real quick, I think Mikel Williams, I know the defensive coordinator, the ex-New York Jet coach, is going to put him to work and Bosa is Bosa, you know, and so I just think they're going to have a better year. Rookie, you know, rookie contest Nine and a half sacks, let's put it that way.
Speaker 1:Okay, and then on to your Rams, mike. You guys got a guy tied in out of Oregon, terrence Ferguson. Is he planning on starting, or what do you think the deal is with him?
Speaker 4:There's a good chance. You know depends on how Higby is in his health because you know he's had some injury problems too, kind of on and off the last couple of years, but it'll be kind of probably 1A, 1b but he's going to get a lot of play. They love this kid, they love him. I mean, they're raving about him. So you know, and he'll be a big part of the offense. He's in them. They're going to definitely run some stuff for him. You know the Rams always like to kind of feature that tight end if they can. But you know getting Higby back last year was great. Remember he was hurt from the year before the Lions game. Remember he tore his what is it? The ACL. He got that hit on from the Lions which wasn't great, and then he's out most really good. So they need some help there and that's why they got him. So watch for big things from him.
Speaker 2:Okay, talk about the coaches in the NFC West Marlon and Mike your guy is borderline Hall of Famer right now, mike in McVeigh. But what about Shanahan in San Francisco and then one in Seattle I forget his name and, of course, in Arizona, Coaches is worth one or two wins a year. Talk about your coaching staff in that division.
Speaker 4:Well, you know, I'm always amazed at.
Speaker 3:McVay.
Speaker 4:I hired him at 30 years old I mean, think about that, you know 30, and the guy went eight years in already got us hooped into two Super Bowls, won one playoffs. He's an incredible leader. He's a great coach, he just really is, and he still. He'll admit it when he screws up. But I like how he always takes the blame too if things are bad after a game. He doesn't point fingers at players. He's a great leader, just incredible at his age. What he's done, definitely a Hall of Famer. Yeah, you know most of the TV a couple of years ago, the Amazon thing. So he's still. He's still motivated to be good. And listen, shanahan, I mean he's got the Superbowl right. I mean he's done well, but he hasn't won the big one, and that's what those fans are annoyed about. Right, was Kyle Young finally win the big one? But he's a great. He's still a. They're very good friends, by the way, because they're on the same staff together and I can't remember the name of the two guys Remember the guy in.
Speaker 4:Seattle, me either.
Speaker 1:Mike McDonald for Seattle and Jonathan Gannon at the Cardinals Right.
Speaker 4:McDonald was the Ravens, was he the Ravens coordinator, something like that? Yeah yeah, he did a nice job last year. Actually I didn't like the fact they got rid of Pete. They pretty much built that whole thing up there. They got rid of Pete Carroll, like that you know kind of route, but he did a good job. And then Arizona, like you said, he's doing pretty well. So they're good young coaches, so it's a good the division has good coaches I think overall.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's too early to grade the last two. That's a good point.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Go ahead, marlon yeah yeah, okay, all right, I was trying to think of anything else. Oh, mike, all right. So Super Bowl predictions who you got so far? Well, obviously, before the season starts, we got football Thursday, by the way, guys.
Speaker 2:The Chargers and the Lions. Yeah, we do. Oh yeah, we got it.
Speaker 1:So my wife knows that when I come home, don't talk to me, don't look at me, don't ask me to do nothing.
Speaker 3:I'm locked in football.
Speaker 1:Oh man, football is back, so she knows she was like it comes back on already. I was like yes, so football in July is amazing.
Speaker 4:So yeah, who's in that?
Speaker 1:Us and the Lions. Yeah, wow, look at that. We never get it ever. So I'm actually looking forward to seeing, because with us, I want to see what this offense looks like. So, of course, herbert's not going to touch the field, but Trey Lance, most likely, is going to be playing most of the time and I'm sure Quinton. Johnston and some of the Trey Harris. Some of the Trey Harris, some of the other guys will be playing, so I'm excited for what we can do.
Speaker 1:I mean, of course, we're not going to, like I said, play all of our major guys, but these, you know, second and third stringers, they're trying to make a roster spot. We'll see what they can do. So, yeah, but yeah, Super Bowl predictions. Mike, what do?
Speaker 4:you got Prediction Boy. You know what. You're going to have the usual cast of characters, right. You're going to have the Bills and the Chiefs and the Eagles. I'll tell you what I would love to see Rams and Bills. How's that? I think the Bills are due to get in. It's been a while and, like I said, we talked about the Rams. They have everything going this year. They almost beat the Eagles last year. We'll see how, but it's a small. There's a number of teams, you know. The Lions, obviously, are still good. The Commanders of Jaden is great.
Speaker 1:Doc your.
Speaker 3:Falcons. I don't know what to say, but, Doc, I'll tell you this.
Speaker 4:I hope your now listen. I love you, but if your Falcons don't do well, that helps the Rams because we got your draft pick. Remember.
Speaker 2:That's right. Yes, it does.
Speaker 4:Yeah, absolutely, we'll make the playoffs, yeah, you guys always be competitive, and Marlon, I don't know. I don't know when they'll get the Super Bowl again. It's been a while. It's been a while since those days with Bobby Ross, so I'll do a Rams-Bills.
Speaker 2:That's a good choice, Assuming everybody stays healthy. Mainly Stafford, that's a good choice, Assuming everybody stays healthy. Mainly Stafford, that's a good pick. Enormous pressure, gentlemen, and I'm sure you'll agree on Josh Allen to deliver finally. But is he under more pressure than Lamar Jackson? I'm going Baltimore versus Philly. I think Philly's going to bounce back and go to the big dance Now, whether they win it. I think Lamar Jackson, gentlemen, is under more pressure because he hasn't performed well. And you remember he got the big horse, Derrick Henry, and he got that defense secondary with Hamilton. Now he got the rookie, Malachi Starks. You know I love Roquan Smith. So I'm going to go Baltimore. Lamar Jackson versus Jalen Hurst, let's do that.
Speaker 1:Okay, I like it. Yeah, with Baltimore, if he just played decent in the playoffs, it would be less pressure. Because of course we've seen Burrow, which you just really had that one great year, but you still Healy's got there. But Burrow and Allen plays great and Mahomes is Mahomes, so it's just you've got to play better. And of course Burrow and Allen plays great and Mahomes is Mahomes, so it's just, you know you've got to play better. And, of course, me talking about playing better in the playoffs, when we barely make it and Herbert can't win a game. So you know we have to get over that hump too as well.
Speaker 1:But, lamar, with a stacked team like that, because you only got Derek Henry for a two-year deal, so there's no guarantee that he's coming back, because there's another desperate team that may throw the books at him and say, hey, you know, here's a checkbook, whatever you want, come on over. So, um, he has a small window and his game is changing because he's he's getting a little bit older and you don't want to run like you used to the past. You know, five years you've been in the league, so it's changing a little bit. He needs to definitely work on his, his throwing, which is getting a little bit better his throwing. But yeah, but also too, as Ravens fans. I have some Ravens buddies and they're just ready to get rid of Harbaugh and they said they'll never win and get over the hump unless they get rid of Harbaugh.
Speaker 2:So I don't. Wow, he got a ring, though that's odd because he does have a ring. And remember Marlon last year you mentioned Lamar's throwing. He threw 41 TD passes, only four picks, you know, yeah. So I don't the perception may be otherworldly that he can't do it, but he did throw 41 TD passes at career high. He only had four NITs, but in the postseason, like you referenced.
Speaker 1:So now I have an actual and this question is probably going to go a little bit deep before we go get into baseball. But we were just talking about Pete Carroll, we're talking about Harbaugh now. When does an organization say, okay, hey, it's time for us to move on With the player is one thing, because obviously we know with Kobe and other players and all that, but when does a as far as a coach Doc, I'll start with you as far as a coach, let's say, if you want to ring, if you are Harbaugh, if you are Mike McCarthy with the Packers or whoever, you want to ring Tomlin, for instance, when is it time to say you know what? We're not getting anywhere. It's time to move on. We appreciate the Super Bowl, we appreciate what you've done, but we have to move on as an organization.
Speaker 2:Well, to answer your question, brother, the voice can get stale in the locker room, it can get old and I think in both instances, tomlin and Harbaugh, this is it. You know it might not be fair with Tomlin because he does have an older quarterback on a one-year contract, but the Steelers fans are tired of him too. They're tired of feeling that. You know, okay, he's over 500, but in the playoffs you want it done for five or six straight years. As far as Harbaugh goes, you wouldn't have done for five or six straight years.
Speaker 2:As far as Harbaugh goes, you know, the expectation with the quarterback and Lamar Jackson was still only 27. He'd been in the league a year. He came in the league at 20 or something. But anyway, it goes. Noted, man, they did it to Schottenheimer after he went 14-2. You saw some other coaches get out of there after some good years because the voice gets stale. And Mike, we've been around man, it was stunning to see some of these decisions. But you have to go in another direction. You know, I think this is it for Harbaugh. If he doesn't do it, man and get Austin, he's not getting rid of the quarterback, you know, nope. And as far as Tomlin, the Steeler Nation's had it up to here. Trust me, I talk to Steeler Nation and if they don't go to at least the second round of the play, I think Tomlin's gone. You know, some really think they're going any further, but you know there's a reason why they only gave him a one-year contract. So as far as Aaron, Rodgers.
Speaker 4:But go ahead, mike. It's interesting that whole thing with the coach. Sometimes it works both ways. If you have an iconic coach, a guy that's been there for a long time talk about Tom when you talk about Harbaugh and I think back to Dr Pat Riley, that's another sport. But when he's at the Lakers, the great success they had. They finally got to that last season in 89-90, and he said you know it's time to go. They just don't listen to me anymore. So you talked about that in the locker room. That voice gets stale. He knew it was time to go. Magic was set. It's probably time to go. You just tune each other out.
Speaker 4:So it's almost like sometimes the coach makes that decision too. He might start looking around, he might start thinking this is it for me. It's almost sometimes a mutual. When they're that kind of big to the organization, there's kind of a. You know there's much more leeway there. So it's one of those things like, hey, I think this might be it for you. Okay, I'm looking for something else. Not like all of a sudden you're out.
Speaker 4:You don't see that a ton for a guy that's been there a long time, you know. But you're right, it ends for everybody you know. So you get to 10 years or whatever. 10 to 15 years, that's a heck of a run. So I think it's almost like they could call their shots too, how this is going to work. But both guys have a lot of pressure Right, especially Pittsburgh. They got a tough fan base there and they've wanted him out for a long time. But he keeps winning every year. You know, gets to the playoffs, usually does his thing. And you know gets to the playoffs, usually does his thing. And Jim's done well too. I mean John's done well too. But you know there's higher expectations. But we'll see Lamar like I was talking to Lamar real quick. You know he has to do it in the playoffs.
Speaker 3:He hasn't done it.
Speaker 4:He's got 41 touchdowns, 40, whatever it is, but, man, you've got to deliver. And he's not a great thrower, but he's improved. But can he make it when it counts? Forget about all the running and everything Can he make the big throws? So we'll have to see how it goes this year with both those teams.
Speaker 1:It'll be interesting to keep an eye on them, though.
Speaker 2:Okay, there you go Marlon.
Speaker 1:All right, now, getting to a little bit. I have a couple questions for you guys, but before we do that, ahead and start with you. Man, are you ready to give my padre some love, are we? Uh, could we possibly? Could we possibly sneak up there and win the division and catch up to the dodgers?
Speaker 4:where are you at right? I would look at late. I'm always checking. I don't know why I keep checking my angels in the wild card race. They're five, four or five back, but we're out right now the division where you guys uh, we are four and a half games back. You guys listen, the dod are struggling. I mean, they definitely haven't played well recently, right?
Speaker 4:Right right, boston again. They really. But you know, look, they're still like 14 over 500. This team seems like they could lose a ton in a row, but they put so many wins together before, so we set another leadoff homer every game. So they're going to be tough. You guys could do it. You guys can do it. It's going to be tough. You guys are definitely I hope you're wildcard bad regardless, but that division's tough because you've got the Dodgers. Giants aren't bad this year. Arizona's always playing pretty well.
Speaker 4:It's a tough division out there. So you have the pieces. I've got to tell you I'm impressed with the fan base down there. They've really developed something incredible down there. They're sending out a lot of games. People are excited. It's only game of talent, obviously.
Speaker 1:You had to throw that in there, mike. You had to throw that in there. Huh, I said you had to throw that one in there.
Speaker 4:I would love to see you guys do it. You know the fans have waited a long time and we're all tired of the Dodgers. We all know that. We're all tired of the big spending Dodgers. They already won their series. They got another one years ago, so we want to see something new in there. So I hope, so I really hope you do.
Speaker 2:Well, to answer your question, Mark, that's a good response. Mike, it starts with pitching, though the pitching and the relief pitching has let you down all year. You know, last year you was up 2-1 on the Dodgers, so you know you can compete with them. But you come into regular season. I think they swept you twice. I don't know man but Machado, and you know Tatis yeah, tatis. They're superstars, man, but it's the other cast, but it's mainly your pitching from the outside looking in man. You know Ryu, or you Darvish, and you know things of this nature. They have to show up in a big spot. Now you got a chance down the stretch only four out, but I don't think the Dodgers Marlon is going to lose seven in a row again. That's what you should have capitalized and you didn't. Good luck going forward, brother. Real talk. But it's your pitching. I hope you make a trade for a pitcher or something that can trade that line Thursday, because that's what may put you over the top man. I think you have some injuries too at the pitching staff.
Speaker 1:So good luck. Do you guys see any trades, any team that needs some trades? I mean, I'm looking at the Astros. I believe they lost five straight.
Speaker 4:They lost four straight to the A's. Fuck. You know the.
Speaker 1:A's at home, yeah.
Speaker 2:Metz.
Speaker 1:They're four homers. And then Metz are looking all right 2-1, seven straight. So looking at some teams that are out there right now, you think any teams will probably go out there and make a big move for the trade deadline.
Speaker 2:I think the Red Sox are going to do something. I really do, because the Yankees are faltering. I can't see Toronto sustaining what they're doing and I love Guerrero, Marlon and Mike, but Toronto seems to me to be like a flash in the pan. And I love the risk of Alex Cora. And I know Chad and I discussed this. He's the best manager in baseball.
Speaker 2:When, given the pieces, I can't explain why they traded the boy to San Francisco. You know he didn't want to perform with them, but it's one of those things where Bregman is playing, he's playing out of his mind. I think they just need another pitcher man. So look for the Boston to do their thing and get it In the National League man. I think it's the Phillies and the Mets and the Dodgers, and I don't think the Mets are going to go out of their way to make changes because they're doing so well right now. In Philly, they got Wheeler and Nola as their aces, you know, and the other cat that should have made the All-Star game His name escapes me, Mike, but is it Eduardo Suarez?
Speaker 2:Something like that? Yeah, so I don't think the Phillies are going to, not unless they have a big injury to Harper or something like that. So internationally they're more set. I know the Yankees don't go that route anymore. They used to when Steinbrenner and George were living. Judge is out. I don't know if they'll make another bat, but Boston for me to answer your question real quick is going to make some major trades to push this thing over. You know, Go ahead, Mike.
Speaker 4:Yeah, let's go to the trade. You know, because you talk about the Yankees. But boy, now would judge out for a bit. You know he's got the injury. Whatever he's got going on there and they're kind of like dipping a bit, so they might you never know, they might kind of might try to do something. The Tigers have been slipping right.
Speaker 4:You know they've really kind of hit along. They've been great all year. So these teams that are kind of right there but going through some losing streaks, you can see them making a move. The Astros, like we talked about, you can see them maybe. Hey, this is just not enough. We're winning the division because here comes the Rangers and Seattle's right there, that's another team. So all these teams kind of in the mix, obviously still Wild card race, individual race, where it's kind of close, you can see them doing something. Then you got the brewers and you got the cubs and the national league and you know. So there's a number of teams. You know the teams, the teams that are out of it, those are going to be the sellers, right, obviously yeah yeah, they're like listen, you know we'll take, we'll have a star player, we'll give you this now, like my angels.
Speaker 4:You know we got kenley jansen who can still pitch. We're like, you know, under 500 now I'm not going anywhere. So they, they might move them, they might move, you know, they might move different guys. So we'll have to see how it goes with some of these teams that are kind of right there. But these teams are going to make some moves, you know, that want to solidify their rotation. It's always pitching though, doc, right, you've got to get the pitch.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you've got to.
Speaker 4:You're not going to win anything you got to I could have won anything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it seems like Marlon, that baseball is in a better place when the Cubbies are relevant. Chicago is the second major market in the country and I'm glad to see the Cubbies doing their thing in that division with Milwaukee and I don't know what happened with the Cardinals. But, yeah, let's see the Cubbies do some things to champion the Mexico's Cubbies and take it from there. Yeah, Go ahead, Mark.
Speaker 1:All right, and then last two questions I have for you guys. So, of course, whenever Mike's on, doc loves talking history already, but whenever Mike is on, he really loves talking some history. So we'll talk a little history for you guys. There's been a lot of talk that's been on some shows about just top 10 players of all time for the NBA, who makes your top 10, and all that. So, Mike, I'll go ahead and start with you on this one. So just your top 10 players, doesn't matter the position. Who do you have? Top 10 players of all time?
Speaker 4:This top 10 basketball list. It is definitely the most talked about thing, I think, of any sports fan. It seems like it's always fun to kind of think about the 10. And Doc, I had a 10., I had a 5. But now it's like I looked at it because, you know, marlon told me about your time. So I looked at it again today, like wait a minute, it is hard to put 10 guys in there, because there's probably about 15 that are worthy of 10. And you're leaving out some incredible guys. But here's what I came up. You want to go in order One to ten there, marlon.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah Go for it.
Speaker 4:All right, here's what I got and I you know, this is my current list and this could obviously change. We've got some guys playing. All right, I've always had Kareem one, I don't care. There you go. You know Big cap, he was the best player for about 15 years. Marlon in the league All through the 70s, in the 80s a little bit right To me. I mean the scoring, the All-Star games, the MVP, six MVPs, six titles, whatever you want to do this whole career from you.
Speaker 4:It's just unbelievable. So I'm going Kareem one, I'm going Michael two. Okay, obvious reasons, right, I got lebron three and that seems like those three are kind of talked about as a top three. But you know, like I said, you can move any of these guys around. Now this is interesting. The next four and five, I go back and forth. Kobe and magic now to me I usually match, is my favorite player of all time in any sport. I love maddie johnson that's right, it's just my guy.
Speaker 4:But, doc, he said kobe's the greatest laker. Who am I to argue with magic, calling kobe the greatest laker of all time, when magic, when kobe was still here with us, and so I always go like it's almost four, it's almost 1a and 1b with those two. So I'll go, I'll, I'll respect magical kobe for magic five. So we got five go. I'd say this next guy to me a lot of people don't see it Larry Bird. Larry Bird was a killer.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 4:Unbelievable player, marlon I mean clutch, just competitive. Would stomp on you, would step over you, would curse, you would do whatever and what he you know Magic and Larry and everything about it.
Speaker 4:I always love Larry right there. Then I got Will. It's hard not to put Will right, will, what's that? One, two, three, four, five, that's seven. Right, yeah, seven, yeah, I mean, how could you not have Will in this group? You know you're talking about the most dominant force that we've seen. Probably that came in the league. You know, martin, he averaged 50 a year. One year, yes, he did 50.
Speaker 2:50 and 25.
Speaker 4:You know the stats.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:It's absolutely crazy what he did coming out, and then it's hard not to have Bill Russell in there, right that's right.
Speaker 4:I'm not going to say Bill's the most talented player, but he was such an incredible force for the Celtics and everything he did was just so precise and he beat Will right in most of the series. So I got Russell, then I got Hakeem right. I just think with Hakeem, you know it was such incredible footwork, that footwork that still Kobe went to. You know, see him all those years, you know, worked on the footwork. Just Hakeem, the dream it's so close there.
Speaker 2:And the last spot.
Speaker 4:I was trying to figure out do I put Steph, Do I put Tim Duncan? I know you still have Shaq and I'm going to tell you the reason why I took Steph and this is incredible to me, because I would never, put him a couple years ago.
Speaker 4:But what he still does at his age and how he's changed the game, the his age and how he's changed the game yeah, the fact that he changed margaret, the fact that he changed the game to what it is now, I gotta give him a ton of credit. And I've watched this guy four years and I'm like, how does he do it? He's not a big guy, but the way he controls that body, where he throws that shot, what he does, that it's unbelievable. So that's my 10. You could, you could. There's probably some names I looked at. You definitely could put it in there. I just want to say there wasn't a difference between Shaq and there, because Shaq to me it was so great. You know, those years at the Lakers, those three years.
Speaker 4:But, doc, there were so many years, it just kind of faded quickly for me. But I know there's some great years before too. But coming to camp out of shape, getting in shape kind of annoyed me sometimes. Yeah, but I'm not gonna. I'm gonna go with the other guys. They kind of were just more overall consistent for the course of their career. That's my time and that's him and doc one, sec doc one second, before you go, just on your shack thing.
Speaker 1:I know that shack as he's sitting there talking and analyzing everybody on a nightly basis. He was very dominant for a short stint of the time and I feel like after that, miami, it was just he's shack, but he's not right. The shack of the, the lakers and and all that. So I know he's probably looking back at his career saying, man, I wish I would have been as as focused and as determined as and and motivated as kobe was throughout my whole career, because there would be no question that everybody would put me in their top 10, or even top five, for that matter.
Speaker 2:Go ahead, doc yeah, man, that's a very good point. Remember he was dominant in orlando too. He just ran into hakeem in the finals that one year when he was 19 years old or 20, whatever it was. But I'm going with jordan mj number one, big cap. Kareem number two. Both of them have six rings. That matters to me. I'm going LeBron number three. Some people have LeBron too, but I got him three. And then after that I'm going to put Wilt, number four.
Speaker 2:I had Magic before, but Wilt's number is so staggering, shocking. You know the numbers that he had man Scoring 78 points and 100 points here and 50 points and average 28. And he led the league in assists. You know just the stats alone. And people tell me Marlon, that he had nobody to go against him and I don't know about that because Nate Thurman was a big guy back then and Bill Russell. So I got Jordan, kareem, lebron, wilt, magic at five, okay. And then we're going to go Russell at six. The rings and the things that they did in Boston 11 rings in 13 years that's sick. I got to put Russell in the top six, kobe's seven and Kobe's nine-time first-team all-defense that nobody talks about. You know you'd have Kobe higher and I wouldn't even argue with it. Nine-time first-team all-defense he took on the best offensive player of the opposing team. He's number seven, larry Bird. Three straight MVPs in the 80s, arguably one of the best teams ever in the 86 Celtics. It was the 86.
Speaker 3:Celtics.
Speaker 2:I got Bird number eight. I hated Bird at the time, mike being in the East, because he killed Milwaukee and my Atlanta Hawks repeatedly. He scored 60 at the Army Marlon. It was so dominating that the Hawks bench was laughing. We couldn't stop him.
Speaker 4:That was hysterical yeah.
Speaker 2:I remember that 60. And this is before the three-point shot became prevalent. So Bird is eight. And you know what I got to put Shaq nine brothers. He was so dominant and forceful in those four rings with the five rings with the Lakers, and not only that, he was dominant on Lando Coming in the lead, marlon Dominator Ewing his first time at Madison scored guard. He owned Ewing and Ewing really wasn't a big guy and that was a big market at the time in 92. Big game. You know Shaq went into Madison Square and dominated. You never thought so. Shaq is number nine to me.
Speaker 2:And then Duncan, the fundamental, big, fundamental one. I got to put him in there, mike. He five rings Never said much but he was always there at the right time. He could play the four or the five. You could say, well, curry has re-revolutionized the game. I think he has. But you got non-shooters trying to beat Curry and destroy some of the movement and, in my opinion, destroying the NBA as far as three-point. But Curry, he's a 10A if you will. So Jordan, kareem, lebron, wilt, magic, russell, kobe, bird, shaq and Duncan. You know I got four big men, maybe even five my math is big men in there. You know Duncan is underrated. If you will, yeah so. And then Curry is 10-8. Now, in the years to come, maybe Durant and Oscar and Jerry West, you know, maybe we'll put them in there, but not right now.
Speaker 1:I don't even know that Durant could make it. He'd have to win another ring or two to make it, but I don't know that he could Because at this point he's injury prone. Now he's going to a Houston team where you're not going to be the guy anymore. You're essentially a role player and you can take over whenever you need to, but you're not going to be the guy anymore. You're essentially a role player and you can take over whenever you need to, but you're not going to be the guy. So, unless they win a ring or two, I don't think he's. Because if we look at Mike, the main thing that you said with Steph is longevity. Kd, he's getting up there to an age, but we've noticed he has all these injuries consistently. Now Steph gets hurt too as well, but he's still efficient. He's still out there playing and dropping 30 and 40 multiple, night after night after night, whereas, KD, you're bouncing around all these different teams. You need all this help, and so I don't know it's got a little funny.
Speaker 1:Yeah, KD would need to win two for me to put him at least in like top 15.
Speaker 2:That's fair. That's fair. But remember now the Phoenix thing and the Brooklyn thing kind of ruined his legacy, devastating injuries at both stops, you know, and one in Phoenix was during a pregame warm-up and he blew his ankle out or something, and the Brooklyn thing was a disaster. So it goes noted. Man, you're right, and it's a shame, not unless he has an NBD caliber year with Houston this year, which I don't see happening. You mentioned his age and the legs are gone. You know he would just have to shoot, like percentage-wise to even make it in the top 11, 10 or whatever. So I got to carry a 10A. But when you look back on Durant's career, mike, you see what could have been, what should have been.
Speaker 4:Yeah and you know that the shoot like he did, I mean that that height, we never see anything like that. I mean really that kind of guy. We saw jerks who sprints all in different guys and I was, yeah, joker, but durant was that guy. Like this guy, you know, just that tall thing guy just launched him up. I always liked kevin durant a lot, but you're right, he's just made so many moves. You know the whole Brooklyn thing, right, he had his foot on the line, right. Yeah, that's right, it's just Phoenix, it just didn't work out. But yeah, I mean, no doubt he's better, he's still very good, but his better days you know are definitely his great days are behind him.
Speaker 4:Like you say, top 50. You can't say five after you can talk about that. Jerry West, oscar, dr J.
Speaker 2:Moses Malone.
Speaker 4:Oh Moses.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:These are great players. Moses killed Kareem in the 83 finals.
Speaker 2:Sure did. I got him at number 12. I got him at 12, but then I'm disrespecting Oscar and Jerry West. I had to put Moses in there somewhere.
Speaker 4:I had to. Gary averaged 40 in the finals.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're talking about Jerry West and Oscar. Now, next time you come on, we'll do the next 10. And now you really have to think on that one, mark. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:Go ahead. Mark, that's what's more interesting, because that first 10, we always kind of most people agree. Yeah a lot of them, but that second 10. Yeah, you know, they have that 75th anniversary of the NBA All-Star game. They've had the anniversary a couple years ago that everybody come out. That's right, cool Right. So you saw Oscar come out and Jerry, you know, when he was alive, and all these guys like, oh my God, look at this. Yeah, he's like, oh my God, look at this guy, you know, and they're all together, goodness.
Speaker 1:And then really with that 75,. You know you talk about Carmelo Anthony D Wade. Yeah, I believe Allen Iverson was in there, you know, so there's a lot of Russell Westbrook was in there, so there's a lot of great players.
Speaker 4:I never like to devalue guys Like a lot of people like ah, he's trying.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 4:When you're great, you're great. It's just a matter of like how great.
Speaker 1:And how long?
Speaker 4:You're 15, 20, 25. You're still one of the that small percentage of all the people that play basketball.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:In that group. Yeah, it's like it's unbelievable Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah right, yeah, man, it's just tremendous, some of these guys, that the legacy that they have and we, the number yeah, that next can is going to be a bit, why don't we do something like that before the nfl season come on and we got a few weeks but that that that'll be because I had to put moses in there and I didn't bring up george gervin. Oh, you know, so yeah go ahead, go ahead, marlon.
Speaker 4:where were you back then?
Speaker 1:Wasn't even thought of Little pup. Where does somebody like Kevin Durant fall and Karl Malone Do?
Speaker 2:they at least make top 20? Yeah, you gotta do that. You gotta do that, man. In fact, as much as I love Dr J Mike, I gotta put Durant ahead of Dr J right now to speak today. I think he's had over 30,000 points. The stats do mean a lot, man. So Dr J, you can argue, had his best years in the ABA when he was really young.
Speaker 4:I love Doc.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I can say Doc in the ABA was sick. He'd be the greatest basketball we've ever seen, Marlon. And they didn't tell us all those games, and I didn't. But those years he was in there it was unbelievable what he was doing on the court. Some of those dunks, some of those moves, and he's the guy that started really the dunk contest that started with Doc at the ABA and all those great athletes and just those guys over there. But I've always loved Dr J and I remember when the.
Speaker 4:Lakers played him in that first final in 80, you know just a classy guy. And we beat him at 80 in 82, then he took us in 83. But it was that's right. He's just a tremendous. There's so many gears, man.
Speaker 3:So you're right.
Speaker 4:Back in 10,. Yeah, malone's a great looking. You're talking about the great rebounders all the time. Yeah, but they just just didn't win Him and Stockton.
Speaker 2:You know, I'm talking about Moses. Well, carl Malone too, but I'm talking about Moses Malone, you know.
Speaker 4:so yeah, I'll take Moses Malone for Carl, yeah, and Marlon yeah.
Speaker 2:George McKeown, david Thompson.
Speaker 4:Artis Gilmore.
Speaker 2:Bill Walton, my guy Bill Walton, absolutely. But Marlon, that's interesting, man Durant's no longer than 15, in my opinion. Yeah, but go ahead. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right. So last question for you guys If you guys were to go obviously we're talking sports, we're talking basketball, football, baseball, we're talking all that stuff and there's so many we just great players. Uh, and when you think of all the memories that we've had in all the sports where that's like an iconic um, you know, a hail mary pass or a game seven or or hitting a walk off home run, if, if you could go to any game to witness any sporting event, what? So that you could be in attendance for any sport any year, it doesn't matter where it is the biggest moment in sports. Doc, I'll start with you. Any top three iconic games that you wish you would have attended at any point in life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just one right.
Speaker 1:No three. I would have loved. Yeah, I was just out of high school.
Speaker 2:I was just out of high school. You know that 81-49er Dallas game, the catch with Dwight Clark Montana Late over Ed Tutar Jones. I always think about that. I was in my mother's living room at the time I was just a teenager looking at that game. I thought Ed Jones was going to bet the thing down. But that's an iconic image. That's an iconic game that really put the 49ers in the Super Bowl realm, if you will, to do their thing with Montana. You know, everybody knew he was good. That was really his first year where he really brought it in a big spot Because Dorsett and them, Dallas was going to go in and San Francisco was going to win that game, you know. But Montana to Clark, you know. So yeah, I will go right there, yeah.
Speaker 4:You know who announced that game Doc for CBS at that time, which a lot of people don't know Vince Scully. Vince Scully. Wow, he did football and golf for CBS also.
Speaker 2:Yes, he did the Dodger. Announcer. Wow, Mike Vince Scully.
Speaker 1:Well, go ahead, brother, yeah yeah, vince, scully, go ahead brother. Yeah, two more, two more, doc oh.
Speaker 2:Doc, two more. Okay, I would say the Raider Patriots game with the tuck rule. I would have loved to have been there in the snow football weather. I would have been bitching and complaining, even being a neutral fan, because that was a fumble and that in and of itself put Brady on his echelon uptake level, if you will. You know we heard of Tom Brady but that game right there really did it for him on that tuck thing and it propelled him for the next 20 years Because Raiders they had Gannon. Gannon was coming off an MVP-type year and Raiders, even though they made a Super Bowl a year later, I think it was. But that game right there, that was the Raiders to win, charles Woodson blitzed and I would have loved to be at that game. These are iconic games, man, you know.
Speaker 2:And then I would say number three I would go in basketball, even though I was really young. That's Phoenix Sun, boston Celtic. Garfield Hurd game, mike, three overtimes in the NBA Western Conference Finals. You know, uh, that that was. I heard that was good. Garfield Hurd, you know, you had Dave Cowens for the Celtics. I would have three overtimes. Marlon 76, I was 14. I was going to be 14.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was the finals, doc, against the Celtics. That was the finals. Okay, yeah, that was the finals. Yeah, yeah, man. And that, rick Robey, you know, for the Suns and Alvin Adams, you know I looked at that, I said, and Alvin Adams, you know I looked it down. So three overtimes in the finals, marlon, think about that Celtics-Phoenix. So I gave you three iconic games that old Doc would have loved. Yeah, go back and look at it, marlon 76.
Speaker 3:I saw it. Yeah, I saw it.
Speaker 4:So you saw it. I saw it, marlon, are you kidding me? That's stuff we saw. Yes, you know we saw from that day, that's a crazy one. Those are all great ones, man. Thank you Fantastic. All right, three games, marlon.
Speaker 4:Three games, mike there's so many, but here's the three I'm thinking of. And one of them hits close to home and I wasn't there, but I was at the next game. So when the Angels game six against the Giants in 2002, I'll bring you guys back to this one when the Giants were up 5-0, right and the Angels came all the way back, scored their five runs in the eighth and Scott Spiesel hit a big home run. Dusty took out I forget who was pitching at the time, russ Ortiz handing the ball, and he thought I got the game won 5-0. I forget who was pitching at the time Russ Ortiz handing the ball, and he thought I got the game won five-nought.
Speaker 2:The Angels came back, won the game. Scott Spezio Troy.
Speaker 4:Gloss did a big double off the ball. Troy Gloss, it was literally nuts. He said I mean the Thunder sticks. That year I went to game seven the next day yeah, next day when the Angels won the World Series, which was unbelievable. That the Angels won, but that, that the Angels won. But that game six is one I would have loved to go at. I got another one, and this one unfortunately there weren't many fans, but it's one of the great college games of all time. Ucla-gonzaga, the semifinal game. You remember that one, doc, the 21.
Speaker 4:I think so yes, tiger, hawkins and Tiger.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 4:Tiger Campbell. That's right, right. And they beat and they lost in a Jalen Suggs half-court shot at the buzzer. But UCLA, and you know we had John Juzang, oh my God.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was a really good college game, but there was nobody in the. It was during the COVID era, right, so they had very little fans in the stand. But that is one of the best college games I've ever seen and I would love to be at that one. But I think the one I would love to go to, Doc, was the 87, game four, Boston Garden. Irvin Magic Johnson took the ball out on the left side and he went all the way down across the court Wow. Threw it over. The junior skyhook over.
Speaker 2:Pierce Dale and Bird. Junior skyhook. Yes, he did.
Speaker 4:And then the end of the game they passed the ball, burned the corner. That ball went in and out. They would have won the game. The Lakers were 3-1. Riley said the Irish eyes were smiling on the Lakers tonight and then Bird was so pissed. But that magic Skyhook, Junior's hook. I've probably seen it a hundred times and it's still one of the greatest. I would love to be at the Garden for one of those kind of games.
Speaker 3:The.
Speaker 4:Garden fans be all mad and everything. All the chatter ahead. So those are three, but there's so many.
Speaker 2:Oh, there's so many. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 4:There's so many.
Speaker 2:You can mention the classic Jordan game, what he did in the air, reverse hands against the Lakers, yeah, you could go back to 88, 89, two feet with Riley. It's so many games, Marlon, but we gave you three iconic ones and you know that's good stuff. Good stuff, Mike. Yeah, Love it up, mike.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thanks, so good, love you guys. I love it. Okay. Well, mike, we appreciate you for joining me, that's all I got you guys got anything else for us?
Speaker 2:well, this is my best show. Oh, go ahead, mike go ahead.
Speaker 4:Man, it was fantastic. I was gonna say a real guy. I told my daughter it's coming on tonight. She goes. Wait, how many times been on the podcast? Like I think it's my third she goes. Is it like saturday night live if you host five times, you get a jacket you know, I hope I go I don't know if doc's got a jacket for me, you may have a cigar yeah, I got a cigar for you yeah, it's always a pleasure to be on with you guys, man, you guys, you know I love you guys.
Speaker 4:You guys are the greatest yeah, incredible guys, incredible sports fans, I just love it. So anytime, anytime you need me, you know, marlin, there I am.
Speaker 1:we were doing divisions. We were doing divisions so I said we got to go If we're doing NFC. West, we got to get Mike on and talk his Rams. So, Doc, what next division are we doing?
Speaker 2:Well, we'll go to the NFC South.
Speaker 1:NFC South baby.
Speaker 2:We'll do the NFC South.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:All right, yeah, we'll do. Atlanta, tampa, carolina and the Saints, let's do that All right.
Speaker 4:All right, Doc. I wish it was the old NFC West with the Falcons.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh, man Bartowski. Yeah, oh, my goodness, William Andrews, I wish we used to be in the NFC West back in the 70s and 80s. Marlon, that's old school. Yeah, crazy yeah.
Speaker 1:Love, crazy yeah.
Speaker 2:Love it. So yeah, nsc style, mike, we love you baby. Thank you, god bless.
Speaker 4:Appreciate you guys, thanks so much no problem.
Speaker 1:All right, we appreciate you guys for listening. We'll catch you guys next week. Peace, peace.