Naked Truth: Behind the Lens with Underwear Models

What really happens when the camera starts clicking at an underwear photoshoot? Our special European guests pull back the curtain on a world most people never see.

Sultan, a part-time model and trained illustrator, shares how he's merged his artistic talents with modelling, even designing his own underwear prints featuring playful beach themes. Anders reveals the nuances of mature artistic nude modelling and how lighting transforms the male form. Meanwhile, Dave offers the photographer's perspective, explaining how trust and communication create the foundation for successful shoots.

The conversation takes unexpected turns as our guests candidly discuss the physical realities of their work – yes, erections happen during photoshoots, and everyone agrees it's simply human nature. They share amusing mishaps, from Sultan's experience with a photographer's wife unexpectedly adjusting his poses to Anders nearly falling during a precarious tree stump shot. Dave recalls the time a pastor in full robes discovered their church-adjacent photoshoot, creating an awkward but humorous confrontation.

Beyond the anecdotes lies valuable insight about an often misunderstood industry. Our guests emphasize the importance of boundaries, trusting your instincts, and finding your unique niche. Whether shooting in abandoned buildings with character or capturing natural light on a beach, they reveal how the perfect image emerges from a delicate balance of technical skill, artistic vision, and genuine human connection.

For anyone curious about the realities behind those perfect underwear model shots or photographers looking to expand their repertoire, this episode offers both entertainment and wisdom from those who've turned their passion into art. Listen now and discover the naked truth about underwear modelling.

Transcript

Section A

Speaker 1 0:06

Welcome to Fully Grown Homos, a podcast about our adventures as fully grown homos, navigating today's world full of inquisitive, friends' questions about gay life and the unexplored activities of a life lived as fully grown homos.

Speaker 2 0:19

We'll discuss the gay 101s, sex sexuality and topics we don't even know yet, as we want your input into what you want to hear. Nothing is off limits, so email us on the Fully Grown Homos podcast at gmailcom or message any of our socials.

Speaker 1 0:33

Fully Grown Homos podcast. Hey Dave, hey Matt, how are you doing? Good, it's another week of the Fully Grown Homos. It is, and it's a Saturday this time. It's a Saturday night, yep, and the reason being it's because we're crossing international waters. We are, we've got some special guests on all the way from Europe, europe, so very privileged.

Speaker 2 1:15

I'm Matt this week. You are Matt this week. I know. He said he was Dave last week. So just to let you know.

Speaker 1 1:25

Didn't even know who I was last week, but who?

Speaker 3 1:26

have we got on our show? Introduce yourself, fellas. Hi. Hey guys, I'm Selton. I'm here based in Europe. I'm a part-time model. A lot of keep fit and, yeah, I'm here for a photo shoot with my buddies here.

Speaker 4 1:39

Yes, and I'm Dave. I am the photographer. I'm born and raised in the Netherlands, living in the south, but we are now in the beautiful, sunny Amsterdam to do this.

Speaker 5 1:52

Hello guys, I'm Anders. I'm also from Europe. I'm mainly doing mature modeling for artistic nude, but sometimes I also do this underwear shooting, this time together with Dave. Yeah, fantastic, and welcome to the.

Speaker 1 2:04

F going to shoot this time too. Yeah, fantastic, and welcome to the Fully Grown Homeless podcast, yep.

Speaker 2 2:09

Thanks, thanks, raghav.

Speaker 1 2:13

Thank you. We've followed Sultan for quite some time now. Back in our early inception, we had Sultan send us a message for some inspiration when we reached out and said, hey, give us some ideas of what you would like to hear and stuff like that, and he so graciously gave us quite a number of topics to discuss. So thank you for, I guess, being an early listener and someone that's actually stayed with us. So this is really when I found out I knew how to actually get all this kind of stuff working and that I thought this would be great. And then you reached out to us and asked would we be interested? And I went hell, fuck, yeah, we'd be interested, we'd love to have you on. So we got some questions because you're an underwear model. So we got lots of questions for everyone. But it's going to be a conversation more than a question and answer thing, because we like to talk about stuff and we will go off track, because that's what I do definitely Always, without doubt. But how did you get into underwear modelling or modelling in general?

Speaker 3 3:25

So I'll begin in a composite, to you the capacity. But, um, yeah, from my side I was just uh, oh, I don't know, it was uh kind of just by chance there was an advert back in uh, back in a newspaper whatever online and I just thought I'll just I'll answer it. They were looking for a model for a gallery. Um, one thing led to another. I discovered I enjoyed it. I kind of discovered I liked uh, being a bit of an exhibitionist. So I vibed with the photographer and the shots came out really beautifully. So I just thought I'll just continue and kind of have it as a as a side gig. By no means am I a professional model, just an enthusiastic amateur. I like to keep fit. You know we're not gonna be around forever, so let's take a nice shot, have some fun with me and uh see where it goes so you, you also dabble into the art world yourself yeah, I've looked some of your artwork today.

Speaker 1 4:15

It's amazing yeah, so have you always been in the creative space absolutely, I'm a.

Speaker 3 4:23

I'm actually a trained illustrator, so I love drawing. I love drawing.

Speaker 2 4:26

You can tell you can tell in your pictures. Yeah, I looked today it was like, wow, this is so cool oh, thank you.

Speaker 3 4:32

Yeah, so just you know, if you're going to put something online, make it beautiful, make it interesting. Um, people, yeah, be creative and go with it. So, yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Um, look after yourself, represent yourself. We could be sexy and create something sexy as well. So have you ever thought about creating your own underwear? Oh, I would love that, but I don't think I've got the patience to sit and sew and draw what about?

Speaker 2 4:58

what about using some of your artwork as a print idea and sending it to like a, an underwear company that would manufacture it using your print work?

Speaker 3 5:06

so I've actually got that. I've actually uh, one of the guys I modeled with, he, um, he said why don't you design a line for me? Uh, so I just send him some sketches and he'll put it on a, on a thong from you. Actually, I can show you if you like that'd be great awesome.

Speaker 1 5:21

While he's doing that, we'll move over to.

Speaker 2 5:26

Anders and ask you about your time as a model and how long you've been doing it for when did you discover?

Speaker 1 5:32

how did you?

Speaker 5 5:33

so I actually started when I was around 12 to 25 and did some modeling, mainly like this artistic nude and some other wear and some other shows, and then I didn't do it for a while, but then I started doing it now, now and then. And now when I started again for like two years ago, it was like a guy who had like an art gallery and he wanted to have some artistic nude model to do some shootings for like an he was planning to do some exhibition and I spent a day with him in his studio. It was like a yoga pass, but it was even worse because you had to stand like forever in very uncomfortable positions while he adjusted light and everything like typically photographers don't do. But it was fun. And after that I got some more requests from other photographers to do it. And now I'm here in Netherlands and we do a couple of modelling here, for mainly implied nude this time, but I don't do it for living no chance.

Speaker 1 6:37

It'd be great, wouldn't it be great, if all our hobbies could be actually something that we could make millions of dollars from, or even thousands of dollars from.

Speaker 2 6:46

Were you both nervous when you first started out?

Speaker 5 6:50

The first time, when I did it actually in Florida together with a friend I was deadly nervous, but after a while you get used to it. Now I have no problem at all with it. It mainly depends on the photographer. If you feel like he's a good guy, if he does produce good quality photos, then it's fine. But then there are some. Well, there are different types of photographers. Not everyone wants to do modeling for.

Speaker 3 7:24

But that's important. You've got to vibe with the photographer, have a communication, uh, get them to give you direction. That's the most important thing, just feel it.

Speaker 2 7:32

Moving on to dave um, as the photographer, are you sort of like the one that's in charge of all the photo shoot itself? As you do, you choreograph.

Speaker 4 7:39

Everything can come up with the concept of the backgrounds and stuff, or in theory, both um in the process going to the shoot, I like to work together with the model or the models and then decide okay, this is what we're going to do, this is what we have in mind. Just do a yeah that you do it together, not only I decide and they have to do it, or vice versa, that you do it together, not only I decide and they have to do it, or vice versa, that you do it together. That's always my main goal and that's what we're going to do today as well.

Speaker 4 8:12

So we have some ideas and we've got to work at it.

Speaker 2 8:17

So do you have almost like a script that you come up with and then you talk about the way it's all going to happen before you start shooting, or do you just make it up as you go along?

Speaker 4 8:25

A little bit, a small one. We wanted to have underwear, we want to have a little bit more fashion-y, and then we build up the fashion and then underwear, and then the rest, naked of course, and the rest how it goes? It goes and I have to feel it. So what?

Speaker 2 8:49

was your journey into underwear modeling and modeling in general.

Speaker 1 8:55

I mean in terms of photography.

Speaker 4 8:57

First jealousy because I don't have the body like my two neighbors have, and I always liked underwear myself to wear wear, of course, but how it looks. And then, as a child, I was interested in photography on holidays etc. And it went on and on and on. And then I tried to photo shoot for underwear as well. I did a few years. I I had a Dutch underwear brand. I worked as a photographer and that's kept me, of course, motivated and I liked it a lot. So, yeah, and I was like a hobby to make connections with models and create some nice pictures.

Speaker 2 9:39

So do you three tend to get together quite often to do shoots, or is this a sort of like oh wow, okay, yeah, we've arranged it, just uh.

Speaker 3 9:48

Yeah, no, that's interesting, that's really good, because I was gonna ask how do you scout do?

Speaker 1 9:53

how does it normally work? So and I guess this is a question for all three of you how does it normally work? Have you got as models? Do you have the idea of the concept that you want to go, and then you hunt down the right photographer or Dave, do you post what you're looking for as models and then they come to you?

Speaker 4 10:13

First for this, I think I can mention the site right, there is a site, adultfolio, where a lot of models and photographers are on. I first met Anders online and we started chatting and the idea the idea came, came to us then. Now do we have something, others who can join us? And then my other neighbor came into in mind and this is how I would start it.

Speaker 2 10:43

So you, you've all met each other at some point, I suppose, or you've heard about each other, at least yeah oh yeah, we were in touch um before the camp.

Speaker 3 10:51

Yeah, okay, I've been following dave on uh on social media for a few years now, so we've been chatting. Okay, there's also yeah, online where where?

Speaker 2 11:02

you. This is such a virgin shoot for you all together, then I suppose yeah, it's exciting, no worries, exactly. I think it's great because I just assume that everybody worked together and, like, Dave would be the photographer and you two would be his models and you just do as many shoots as possible. That's what I thought would happen, you know.

Speaker 5 11:23

So I can tell you what's important for me when I select a photographer, I look at his uh work and I saw I found dave on the internet and I saw his photos and I thought, oh, they are beautiful and I like how his style. So that's why I contacted him and he started havinget and he got interested in dunya shooting. But it's just how it starts. You look at some guys, his portfolio, what he actually produced, and that's my thing. For example, I'm not really interested in porn. It should be more sensual and things like this should be beautiful, not just sympathy.

Speaker 1 12:03

Naked doesn't have to be horny all the time.

Speaker 1 12:07

Like we went to a. Dave introduced me to a four-day camp a few years ago called Naked man we have out in Sydney, and I was petrified. I was petrified to be naked. I'd come out of a 17-year relationship where I basically never got my underwear off, like I hadn't had sex in almost 17 years as well, but that was a different story. Um, but I went to this camp and after about four hours, I want to say it took me to really get comfortable, but then by the end I was okay. But then by the end of the four days I never wanted to put clothes on, ever again.

Speaker 2 12:45

But it wasn't just sex, it was just actually freeing and it was like… In fact, the sex part is just like an added bonus to the actual excursion itself. I mean, it's one of those things that is more of a social sort of gathering of people, and the people that go are from all denominations, say, age groups and backgrounds, um, and some of them are from all over the world as well. They come over here just for that camp um, and it's just a very well organized um event where they have all these activities that are set up throughout the four days and it's up to you whether you participate in any of them or not. So you can have, like massage techniques, tantric um, tire lessons and painting and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 13:26

So we get. Why being?

Speaker 2 13:26

naked is fun. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you know something that you really enjoy. If you you know, look it up, it's called Naked man Camp or Naked man.

Speaker 1 13:33

So are those undies Sultan. Where are those undies?

Speaker 3 13:38

These are the ones I designed, oh wow. They're really fun. I've got some photos of me in this, so it's like a thong.

Speaker 2 13:45

That's so cool. That's really cool.

Speaker 1 13:49

You've seen your partner with that guy, yeah.

Speaker 3 13:51

Yeah, yeah, so I partnered with him. He's a Satyaray Dutch designer, really big, great guy, so it's kind of a beach theme. So you've got the goggles you've got my team my sister's lobster.

Speaker 2 14:05

My team has this lobster.

Speaker 1 14:07

How did you feel when, uh, when it came out as a finished product, were you sort of like blown away with it? Did you order?

Speaker 3 14:10

all of them in every size. I'm cool. I was uh sorry, what was your?

Speaker 2 14:11

question. So did you feel? How did you feel when you actually saw the final product?

Speaker 3 14:16

oh no, it was. It was a good feeling, because once it takes a lot to design and everything, and I said, all right, well, if I'm going to do it, I've got model for you. So then I was able to be in a photo shoot with the undies on, so happy to model them for you now, as well, that's great.

Speaker 2 14:31

I love it. I think it's like having a piece of artwork, isn't it? You've created something and it's now yours. You know what I mean. You've made that. It's like seeing your product on a supermarket shelf, I suppose you know.

Speaker 3 14:45

So your product on a supermarket shelf. I suppose you know. So when I was modeling, he said, all right, you're gonna add like the don, the don in a thong. So I'm like that's pretty cool, so you're gonna be all macho, but in the thong. So I said all right, well, that's going to be the new idea a don in a thong, but I gotta love it, love the concept of it, that's really, really cool.

Speaker 4 15:00

That's for me the same when I, when we make the pictures and and then the creativity part for me continues, because I have to select then what's bad, what's good, and do some work on the pictures more light, less light, etc. And then you see the end result and you think, wow, we made this.

Speaker 2 15:21

So when you're taking the photographs, have you got like an instant picture in front of you so you can see what it looks like straight away?

Speaker 1 15:29

Yeah, everyone has a screen.

Speaker 2 15:31

Yeah, a screen.

Speaker 4 15:32

I just see it through my lens. Oh, okay, I scroll on the camera, but afterwards then I see the complete picture and then I say, okay, this is not that good, or this is better. And then at the end, okay, this is not that good, or this is better. And then at the end you have the end result and then it's wow, this is amazing, fantastic. I can't think about my own work.

Speaker 2 15:54

No, no, it's good. I mean, that's a nice thing when you get that perfect picture that really emanates what you were after in the first place.

Speaker 4 16:03

That's so cool. You know, when I send it to the model, the models and they have the same reaction. Yeah then I'm happy. This is the end goal.

Speaker 1 16:16

You know when you've got a good photo of yourself as well, because, again, I'm quite humble. I know I'm a good-looking rooster and I know when I've got a good photo of myself, I sit there and I go, oh. Or when I've had a good photo taken, I go that one's definitely a keeper. So I'd love to get in front of a lens, sometimes behind yeah, in front of a lens, because I'm always behind the lens doing the photos, doing the photos, doing the photos for everyone. So I'd love to model one day and get some decent photos, because well, we'll come over to uh, to europe, we'll come to you yeah, definitely so what's the um?

Speaker 2 16:54

what's the maximum number of of models that you'd ever have in one session?

Speaker 4 16:59

for me it's um, I had four at one time. Okay, directing it's very difficult because the other one looks to the left, the other one looks to the right, the other one looks to the front and I have to have to choreograph it. So, okay, guys look all to the left. So it's more demanding for me, but with these two it will work out.

Speaker 1 17:18

I'm sure they seem to have a chemistry already. So that's quite cool, yeah, so you guys like, yeah, yeah, so now. So well, let's, let's talk underwear models, because that's what we're dealing with underwear and naked. So in your day-to-day life, are you boxes, brief g-strings, what? What do you wear so, anders? Let's hit you first. What do you wear normally?

Speaker 5 17:38

I would definitely say briefs, and the funny thing is that in the country where I live it's sometimes hard to buy briefs. Everyone have like this, long, more or less long leggings and box.

Speaker 4 17:50

Appreciate I prefer this definitely, yep yeah how about you, dave um boxers and and breeze as well, and sometimes, when I have a naughty mood, a thong yeah, why not?

Speaker 2 18:02

yeah, do you ever? Do you ever not wear an underwear at all? Do you ever free ball, any of you?

Speaker 4 18:06

no, that's not my thing. No, of course I'm. I love underwear, so I always have on the round on. Yeah, okay, that makes sense yeah yeah how about?

Speaker 3 18:14

you, I would uh more or less wear briefs, um, tidy whiteys, you know your calvings, those. Yeah, I'll only free ball if I uh forget my underwear at the gym.

Speaker 1 18:25

And then, yeah, if you're on holiday you can wear something a little bit when you, or if you accidentally leave it at the gym because there's a hot guy and you think I know he's been checking me out.

Speaker 3 18:34

You never accidentally leave it. You get. If you leave it, you get people pinching it and you'll be surprised. Sometimes you'll just forget your underwear or your shorts outside and then they're gone. So someone's got something.

Speaker 1 18:47

I may have a couple of those types of underwear that. I picked up from the gym.

Speaker 1 18:56

I went oh they're quite nice and he was quite hot. They're mine and I brought them back to my place and Dave may have picked them up and gone. Hmm, had a sniff, brought them back to my place and dave may have picked them up and gone, had a sniff, um. But yeah, so I'm, I'm a, I'm a brief kind of guy normally as well, especially on my monday to friday, kind of all like on my work day. I'm on briefs because I need some control, like I'm. I'm not a big boy by any standard, um, but I need them, need my boys sitting where they're sitting and everything's sitting where it's supposed to sit. But on the weekend, especially if I'm wearing track pants or something like that, I do like to wear the boxer type things so that it can poke out a little bit and sort of get some attention occasionally. So yeah, they have the weekend as well, right, yeah?

Speaker 2 19:41

yeah, it's the weekend, let them breathe.

Speaker 4 19:44

Yeah, correct, correct, let them breathe.

Speaker 1 19:45

Yeah, correct, correct. Breathe, definitely, definitely. So have you where? Where's the worst place? You've been caught in your underwear where you weren't supposed to be, so have you been busted on a shoot or anything like that, or where you weren't?

Speaker 3 19:58

supposed to be.

Speaker 3 20:00

I was actually on one shoot recently and it was outdoors with a photographer and there were like joggers going past. And then there was one jogger and then he just kind of said, hey, what's going on here? And so I was like, hey, it's the photographer's really professional, we've got a shoot, this is what we're doing. And the guy was like, oh, can I watch, can I join in? So he ended up supporting the photographer and assisting. So that was, um, caught in a good way. So it was weird why are you coming over? But he was kind of into it.

Speaker 5 20:33

So, uh, that was a cool experience I have some scene when we actually had a shooting and also like a guy passed by. We were beside the lake and it was like a lot of grass and it was really nice shooting. And then was the guy started looking at us but he was a bit more creep. We actually stopped that. But the other day I had a implied no shooting by a lake and it went really well. It was beautiful, sunny beach. But then there was some staff working close by and they came up to us and said hey guys, you need to leave. You can't do things like that in our park. Ah, okay, I just rest my self in my bed.

Speaker 1 21:17

You'd have to get permits then I guess, if you were, nurturing yourself no.

Speaker 5 21:25

But you should select a place where you don't actually disturb anyone. So it's more about being considerate and not be offensive. What do you do?

Speaker 2 21:38

Talking of doing these shoots as such. What's the most awkward or embarrassing thing that's ever happened to either of you on a shoot and that? Wasn't meant to happen, all three of you, I suppose, even the photographer, I suppose I have.

Speaker 4 21:50

I have a good one a few years ago, at a shooting with a guy beautiful man, I have to say it and we went, we were at a side of a church, the back at the side of the church, the back of the church, and then what is the name, the pastor or minister? He came in in his robe, oh, blasphemy here, blasphemy there. And he said that and he went away. So we continued shooting. He's like okay now, thank you for the words, but we continued. Of course we had a laugh.

Speaker 1 22:24

I'm going to hell.

Speaker 2 22:25

That would be funny if he'd actually took his robe off and said look what I've got on. That would be great.

Speaker 4 22:32

He had a nice body, who knows? Yeah, absolutely, he was a young guy, so it could be.

Speaker 1 22:38

It's like that priest that's blowing up on the internet at the moment there's a UK priest who he's from Rotherham, rotherham.

Speaker 2 22:46

I can't say the word Um. Yeah, I remember his name's Justin.

Speaker 1 22:51

He's a sexy priest.

Speaker 2 22:52

Yeah, and he put it out on social media that you know, come and come to our church. And uh, basically the internet went crazy, absolutely crazy. They even got the women called him Daddy, so he went online. If you have a look on Google, I'll see if I can find the link.

Speaker 1 23:06

It's really funny.

Speaker 2 23:08

He was literally licking his lips and doing all the things that he shouldn't be doing as a priest would do, just to be modern and out there with it Probably something nicer than just the Catholic stuff. Absolutely Correct.

Speaker 5 23:25

How about you um anders or salt, anything really I think the most funny thing was I did like a shooting briefs, but quite loose briefs, and the photography asked if he could touch me because he wanted to have my well thing pointing in the right direction yes so every time he touched it after that it just moved to the other way. So he kicked on trying to get it in the right position and I got a little bit like excited. So it didn't help and after a while we just start laughing and we gave up.

Speaker 1 24:01

That was the most I have that question a little bit later, actually about the excitement.

Speaker 3 24:06

But, sultan, it was two, uh, two funny ones. One was uh, one shoot the photographer, male. One brought his wife along to help out. So, uh, I was kind of there posing and then his wife was kind of sitting there adjusting me. So, all right, let right, let's go with it. I was totally uncomfortable. And then another one. It was totally okay, but it was like, oh, the designer wanted me to wear a pouch with the underwear. So that was in my defense. I think it was a big underwear In his eyes, maybe it wasn't. So we've even got one on the shoes shoot as well, just in case it's needed with, uh, yeah, some moments or or something like that.

Speaker 1 24:49

So, uh, well, we've had this conversation, um, over text and we, we don't think you're no, not tall, small at all. We think your pouch is totally unnecessary and yeah, and and I hope hello, um, and we don't, and I you don't mind, but we did show a friend or two and said we'd be happy with that and I said, yeah, fucking hell, I'd be happy to have it inside me in my mouth, in my everything.

Speaker 3 25:15

What a compliment. You know when you're mourning for underwear. They've got different sizes, they've got different looks. It comes with the territory right. So first you kind of take it to heart, then you kind of don't. But yeah, whatever you do.

Speaker 2 25:30

So when you take the photographs, obviously, Dave, you own those photographs because you're the photographer. Yeah, but with the two models, do they get choices of what pictures they like to keep themselves and use themselves, or is it all?

Speaker 4 25:44

negotiatable. Normally it it's I'm shooting and then I select them, and sometimes I have 100, sometimes 50. They can have them all, right, okay. I always say, keep what you like, that's very nice, that's nice yeah, and when you use them on the internet or Instagram, just tag me. So we are both yeah, and I don't select. Okay, you just get to 20 or or 10. Now, why, why?

Speaker 2 26:16

use them. Yeah, absolutely, yeah, definitely. So have you ever had any sort of like um photographs that have turned up in obscure places that you didn't think they'd ever turn up in?

Speaker 4 26:26

oh, yes, I did, and a few times yeah and then I would go how to say this uh, uh, illegal, yeah, because that's hard, isn't it?

Speaker 2 26:39

and most, of the times they were, they were taken off, so that's, that's fine that's good, but it's though, if you don't know they're out there, isn't it really True yeah?

Speaker 1 26:50

So erections on photo shoots, how often do they happen?

Speaker 4 26:58

For me quite a lot, but that's fine, yeah. Yeah, I'm gay so I love to see it. I'm a human, so why not yeah?

Speaker 1 27:06

absolutely so. Okay, how about for you when you're photographing? Do you get aroused when you're photographing these men?

Speaker 4 27:19

I'm human. So, yeah, sure, I had two guys who were onto it. So, okay, guys, wait a minute, Just give me a break. Why? He said, hey, I'm human, went to the bathroom, I didn't do anything, but just to relax and calm down, and then we continued. So, yeah, yeah, why not? Absolutely Another robot.

Speaker 2 27:42

No, but have you had this shoot escalate really quickly into going from modeling to being, like you know, a full-on, sort of like make-an-out session without it?

Speaker 4 27:53

No, no, the two guys behaved after that Right. Okay, it was a nice moment for the shoot.

Speaker 1 27:59

And I guess that's the parameters that you actually said at the beginning of the shoot, isn't it really? You sit there and say, all right, this is the possibilities, that this is what could happen during the shoot. Um, then you've set those parameters um.

Speaker 2 28:11

So with with you, with with both andrews and um sultan, have you both sort of like, had shoots with people that you've never met before, and then there's chemistry there, and then you go on afterwards to hook up with that person later on in the evening or later on in the week, or uh, from my side, yeah, like, sometimes you never met the model before.

Speaker 3 28:30

So, yeah, yeah, there is chemistry. I mean it's had it never, never been in a situation where, uh, we hooked up, afterwards it was kind of professional or you get a good vibe. But, um, yeah, you, there are some cases where you, you meet, you like the model. Yeah, you get a bit hard. As long as the photographer and the model are good with that, it's fine. You know, and you could say some photographers have set up getting a bit excited. Let's just calm down and that's okay. But most of them, uh, I, I think I think are cool with it, I think are good with with erections and I think are cool with it, I think they're good with erections or they incorporate them in the show. It's happening now. So I'm trying and have you ever had?

Speaker 2 29:15

this is more for you, dave. Have you ever had any models that you just couldn't work with and you've had to stop the shoot and say look, I can't do this, it's not working for me, you're not working with me.

Speaker 4 29:26

No, never had that. Okay, that's cool. Always worked out good in a good way, that's good.

Speaker 1 29:33

But if you're doing your pre-chats and all that kind of stuff, you know you've got a bit of a vibe with them.

Speaker 2 29:38

That's important to have a good chat in front, that you have the boundaries for the two or the three of us, what he likes or doesn't like, that you have the idea and then it worked out fine and what's the sort of like the demographics in terms of age, wise, um, in terms of like the models that you've actually photographed over the years you've done it, are they all ages and all different backgrounds?

Speaker 4 30:00

yeah, exactly I. Straight guys, yeah, it's a bisexual guy, okay, gay guys, and from from just regular clothing, just regular pants, a shirt, to nothing it's fine, do you find? Very often?

Speaker 2 30:16

I'm used to it. So when you've got a straight guy and a gay guy together and they're working together, do the straight guys ever get an erection as well?

Speaker 4 30:25

Yeah, Okay, that's cool. Yeah, and then in the beginning it was a bit awkward for for him and uh say I don't mind if the other model doesn't mind, do your thing. Uh be yourself, feel what you feel and it worked out perfectly.

Speaker 2 30:40

Yeah, I think that's perfectly cool. I think that's great. If that can happen, that means that they're relaxed and they're actually enjoying the actual session themselves.

Speaker 4 30:47

I can see that on the picture, not literally, but in the face, in the relaxation, the body.

Speaker 3 30:52

Yeah, that's important You've got to be comfortable when these things happen.

Speaker 1 30:57

right, absolutely, it's going to have a fun shoot at the end. It's nature, yeah.

Speaker 3 31:04

Thank God, and I love mine. You're not going to have good photos.

Speaker 1 31:06

It's that simple, right yeah so, Anders, with your life, with your nude modeling and that do you do life drawing in that as well, or is it just photography and stuff like that?

Speaker 5 31:24

Yeah, it's mainly photography and it's usually guys who like the male form and male shape. So it's not really about sex. It can be also like social things. So, for example, I sometimes do shootings with other guys and those can be both straight and gay or whatever, and it's similar. As my friend Uriah said, sometimes you get like a good vibe, a good connection with other guy and depend on what type of poses you do. Of course I can get excited and the other guy also. If you feel that the other guy is excited, you start like a spiral. If you also get excited, but it's like typically I don't hook up with the guys after. But well, we can be friends, we can talk and so on. But it's really it should be professional. But of course you get excited.

Speaker 2 32:19

You will if you click without the model how do you go about choosing the underwear you're going to actually photo shoot? Do you get like brands coming to you and asking them to do shoots with you, or do you actually go around and choose what you like yourselves?

Speaker 3 32:34

We choose. I'll show you. We've got heaps here. So basically, we've got all this stuff. We've got, we choose whatever we want. So we've got this black one. You've got a jock strap in blue.

Speaker 2 32:50

You've got print, so I'll take it. You you don't have any branded stuff because you obviously you couldn't do that.

Speaker 3 32:56

I suppose could you if the brand wants us to model it, we want to. Sometimes we check hey, I've got your stuff, would you like it? And we can also send you the photos. Some of them, most of them, say yeah, let's have a look.

Speaker 1 33:06

No one's going to say no, right, it's basically no, that's right absolutely if they haven't paid for the, for the photographs, well then they're gonna say, yeah, we'll use, so do you?

Speaker 2 33:16

do you actually? Do you actually keep the underwear yourselves, or do you actually? You know what happens to the underwears when you finish with them?

Speaker 3 33:23

it depends on the, on the uh designer, so sometimes they give it to you as a gift, thanks. Sometimes they want it back, depends what it is. Yeah, many of them, um, they, they give it to you, which is uh awesome.

Speaker 2 33:36

It's cool, you know as long as you wear it as well. Yeah, it doesn't cost them anything to you know, to give that to you, because, at the end of day, I mean you know it's promoting their brand as well at the end of the day, isn't it you? Know so so do you do just underwear, do you do to do um like like speedos or beachwear and stuff like that as well?

Speaker 3 33:54

I I've done everything underwear um jocks news clothes.

Speaker 2 33:58

So, um, yeah, I do, I I do a bit of everything, yeah for me as well and is it just male, male with male, or do you have any females taking part in the me as well? Okay, and is it just male with male, or do you have any females taking part in the shoots as well?

Speaker 4 34:10

A few times I'm more like a male photographer.

Speaker 2 34:14

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Speaker 3 34:16

And you know I'm getting uncomfortable with myself. For you guys I'm going to take it off, oh my God, make a man alert.

Speaker 1 34:25

Now, we're talking, now, we're talking, now, we're talking. Now it's a photo shoot.

Speaker 2 34:31

So, in terms of time-wise, how long does this photo shoot normally take you on average?

Speaker 4 34:39

Two hours approximately.

Speaker 2 34:41

Is that two hours constant or two hours breaking and stopping and starting?

Speaker 4 34:46

Also with breaks. It's a small break, five minutes to drain something. Yeah, and clean my lens or my glasses, because I didn't you don't see it in the podcast, but I'm wearing glasses, so sometimes I have to clean my my glasses because it's glued on the lens.

Speaker 2 35:02

Yeah, yeah, three, or just a model yeah so where's the best location you've ever taken any photo shoots? In terms of travelling wise, overseas.

Speaker 4 35:17

I was somewhere in Belgium, in Fort, half graffiti, half broken down. It gives you a little bit of uh the storyline, I suppose. Exactly, yeah, and there were arches, there were, there were stairs and old windows broken. That's like a like, a like, more like a war scene idea. Now that's uh. Until now that's the way I get the most likes when I post pictures of that shoot. I love that.

Speaker 3 35:53

For me it would be outdoors the beach, the forest, nature, I think, is always beautiful because it's kind of more sexy. Studios are great, but then when the photographer is tinkering with the lights and fix this, fix that, it gets too much. So sometimes outdoors, yeah, natural, fresh, it's even better.

Speaker 1 36:08

Yeah yeah, well, natural light's amazing. Natural, that's it. And how about you? And where's your favorite place to be photographed? Where have you been? Travel wise?

Speaker 5 36:18

uh, I like outdoor and also like these abandoned buildings, um, and, of course, studios, because then you can play with light and darkness and you can basically make part of the body to light up and then part of the body to move shadows. That works very well with this implied nude and you can also add colors to the picture. So it's quite advanced maybe, but I really like that. I did a similar shooting this Thursday, spent like four hours with a really good photographer doing all kinds of poses and situations and they used all colors and I love them because the pictures are really beautiful.

Speaker 1 37:06

Nice, yeah, do you and this is for all of you do you have a favourite photograph of yourself that you just think nothing's ever going to top that yet and describe it to us? Is it black?

Speaker 2 37:20

and white.

Speaker 1 37:20

Is it monochrome? Is it underwear? Is it clothed? Is it nude? What makes it your favourite photograph? Is it the memory of the day you had it underwear? Is it clothed? Is it nude? What makes it your favorite photograph? Is it the memory of the day you had it taken? What makes it so.

Speaker 5 37:33

I guess if we start with you, anders, I actually have to think, but I think that the one that I find most cool was actually one I did myself, for a couple of weeks ago I woke up in a hotel room. They had like yellow curtains and it was morning sun coming in, so I just put up the camera, put myself in profile nude and of course my VNs was hanging out and the picture was really, really beautiful light. That was the one that makes sense I really like. And then we also have other photos with some implied noob with some red silk fabric, which is well, that was also like a professional guy and but typically like some photographers, they just they have to make the perfect shot that you really love it. So obviously I have more and I'm really looking forward to dave's the one that dave's so don't feel pressure.

Speaker 1 38:34

I can't wait to actually, um, to finish the podcast so I can go and hunt down some of your stuff and check it out, dave, because, like I'm really excited to see what you actually what you do with these guys? But to see what you've actually done before as well. So so I definitely need that.

Speaker 3 38:47

Beautiful and they're brilliant, and they're with these tiny little. They're all hunky. So he has got some fantastic.

Speaker 2 38:53

It'll be hard for you to have a perfect picture then, Dave, because you do so many. There'll be so many for you to choose from, but surely you've got a favourite though.

Speaker 4 39:00

Surely you've got For me personally, or from another model. No for you. I was a few years ago at my work. We had to make more corporate profile pictures, so we had a photographer there and he was chatting, he was laughing and playing with me. Automatically I had the greatest smile. It looks very natural and when I see this picture, okay, I love it. It's one of the only ones I love for myself and, yeah, I use it a lot that one.

Speaker 2 39:36

That's good, that's nice. What about you, sultan?

Speaker 3 39:39

For me it was always, I remember, with the photographer because they could direct, and it was always one. One was outdoors just kind of posing by the waves on the rocks. It's kind of a nice sexy one. The other one was kind of a topic, kind of on a bed and in a hotel room kind of like. So that was a. It was kind of an innocently taken at the time but it was actually just kind of cool with a baseball hat on, really cheesy but and innocently taken at the time, but it was actually just kind of cool with a baseball hat on really cheesy but kind of good fun.

Speaker 1 40:09

So I wish I'd re-played it and I never could For our listeners, Salton's quite flexible. He just basically is like right the way out there, that's good.

Speaker 4 40:17

And um.

Speaker 1 40:19

We've got the boys naked on set now, so, and yeah, quite a good view from here. Sorry, listeners, suck it up. You're not getting to see this, but we do.

Speaker 2 40:31

Have you ever done any sort of catwalk modelling?

Speaker 3 40:35

I was asked to do it twice but I couldn't choose the dates. But that would be a cool one. Catwalks are kind of a semi-professional we're getting into it. Uh, I'd love to, but I'd say, oh, that's also competitive.

Speaker 2 40:48

But it didn't. What about your, your normal work? Do they know what you do as well?

Speaker 3 40:53

um, yeah, some some do, some don't. Um that, uh, that I model and yeah it's fine.

Speaker 2 41:00

yeah, that's cool. Have they ever asked to see any photographs at all?

Speaker 3 41:06

Some colleagues yeah, okay, mostly friends, though you know you've got to be friends with them, right yeah?

Speaker 2 41:14

Obviously you're very comfortable with your body and everything else, so nothing's going to sort of like embarrass you anyway.

Speaker 1 41:21

So how many pairs of underwears do you own? Because we've just seen a bit of a touch of your collection hey, there's underwear and there's like fun underwear, so I don't know.

Speaker 3 41:31

I think I've got about 20 briefs that I would wear during the week and then, yeah, I would say another, maybe 20 thongs, jock straps, stuff like this, that's not, that's, not that's nothing I own more than that.

Speaker 2 41:48

I was gonna say most game may have like five drawers of their own.

Speaker 4 41:52

One big drawer made it 100, so 150.

Speaker 2 41:55

You go through there, you think I gotta, I gotta condense this down. I don't need them all.

Speaker 4 41:59

But then you go through and say, no, I'm not getting rid of any of it, yeah, do you have a favorite pair that you wear constantly, to the point where you're gonna, you know, make them threadbare and give them that way that's what you personally, but anderson was wearing a gold one and I've seen that a few, a few minutes ago, and that one is my favorite and I take it always with me, so they have to wear it, of course.

Speaker 2 42:21

Here it is they have to wear it for the shoot.

Speaker 4 42:25

That's mandatory for me and the rest is all good, but this one is my favorite it's a damn sexy underwear quite honestly good one fits fits all.

Speaker 5 42:37

Yeah, always fits me so it's very sexy, but it's not that much fabric in front of it. So if you're too excited.

Speaker 2 42:49

It's like a posing pouch, isn't it really?

Speaker 5 42:53

it's very cool I like it.

Speaker 4 42:54

Yeah, that's from a, from a dutch designer. Unfortunately, the the brand is not there anymore, but it's, it's my child, it's much.

Speaker 2 43:05

Have you ever had anything sent to you in the post that was sort of like a bit risky, that you didn't sort of like order or didn't know was coming your way?

Speaker 4 43:15

um, yeah, of course myself I'm ordering enough what I have with me.

Speaker 3 43:21

There's a lot of new stuff that I take with me for for today, yeah sometimes when you model the uh, the design may give you some of, yeah, the underwear or whatever you want in the shoe, those ones I will take because I think, well, it's a shame to take them and waste them and not wear them. So I say, look, I love it. It's not something I would wear myself, so I didn't like to. But I'll take these ones that you've given me, because why take what they produced and why have it sitting there? You know so exactly that's right yeah, it's not for you.

Speaker 2 43:52

Just say so and no one's gonna be offended someone else, and there's always going to be some products that aren't going to be as comfortable as what you think they would be, yeah. So you know, the natural thing is to say, okay, I'll wear them for the shoot, but I'll never wear them personally myself, you know well, it depends what you wear, then maybe if it's your naked, then you could wear a couple of those. Well, absolutely you know, you're not wrong there at all you have to come over and check it out get everything out there.

Speaker 1 44:13

It's it's, it's, it's free. I'd highly recommend hunting it down, or they'll come to australia, and it's only november sold out this year, so I'll have to get on board for next year.

Speaker 4 44:33

If you had to swap places with an underwear model for a day, would you, dave, when I'm 40 kilograms lighter? Yes, maybe, no, I'm comfortable behind the camera.

Speaker 1 44:44

It's 2025, body positivity. Trust me, but not in my head.

Speaker 4 44:45

I'm still in the camera. It's 2025 body positivity, but not in my head. I'm still in the 80s.

Speaker 2 44:49

I know what you're saying.

Speaker 1 44:50

I get it. I do get it. I sort of like I said I was 40 plus kilos heavier, but then I also I'm going to do it. I thought I was the sexiest man on the planet then as well, though. Nothing's changed, nothing's changed, nothing's changed. But yeah, I'll have to send you some of my news. Wait a minute, are you OnlyFans? No, I'm not giving my link out to my OnlyFans on here.

Speaker 2 45:16

He's actually got a very good one with him.

Speaker 1 45:19

I got a pump when I was experimenting one day and I pumped it up and I went fuck, my dick looks huge there.

Speaker 2 45:27

It's a great picture. Honestly, it's a really really good picture.

Speaker 1 45:30

I get it out at every single chance I can actually get.

Speaker 2 45:34

Well, he actually gave it to. He gave his phone to somebody and it came up. They were scrolling through his photograph and it actually came up. It came up.

Speaker 3 45:42

You've got to share the link with us afterwards.

Speaker 1 45:45

Yeah, because I don't think you're going to be able to see it here. Yeah, no.

Speaker 3 45:51

I don't know, you might not be able to Go to the camera.

Speaker 1 45:53

Yeah.

Speaker 4 45:55

Oh yeah, oh my goodness, yeah, it looks all right there, it looks all right.

Speaker 2 46:00

Is that the whole?

Speaker 4 46:01

pump.

Speaker 2 46:01

Yeah the whole pump, yeah, the whole pump yeah absolutely.

Speaker 1 46:05

If you can do it right. That's what George Michael said, right.

Speaker 4 46:09

I have time next week in my schedule. Yeah, done.

Speaker 1 46:13

I don't know if you can photograph via Zoom or anything like that. I wonder, but yeah.

Speaker 2 46:20

So obviously both of you two. So you've obviously got full-time jobs. So dave in terms of your side of things do you have other sort of like photography jobs that you have lined up, apart from more underboat modeling, but you have other like normal, like photo shoots to do and stuff like that as well um, what I have next week on saturday?

Speaker 4 46:42

there are, of course, bodybuilding competitions Okay cool, All sorts of models, and for a few years now, I'm the official for the PCA Netherlands. I am the official photographer and, yeah, that's what I'm going to do next week. That's awesome. On the side of the stage, the crowd that would be very cool.

Speaker 2 47:05

So what's the furthest that you travel in terms of, like your jurisdiction, where you travel to and from to do photo shoots For?

Speaker 4 47:13

me it's now, Because I have no car, so I do everything by train. Right, okay, the Netherlands, belgium, germany, okay so you travel quite extensively.

Speaker 2 47:23

Then, yeah, the last few years after the Netherlands, belgium, germany. Okay, so you traveled quite extensively, then, yeah, the last few years after the COVID.

Speaker 4 47:27

I traveled a little bit more yeah.

Speaker 2 47:29

I was going to say what happened during COVID. Did that affect you quite seriously? Because you wouldn't have had any contact with anybody would you Not personally.

Speaker 4 47:39

Yeah, it was less shoots, of course, yeah, he obviously got three survives.

Speaker 2 47:48

That's what.

Speaker 1 47:50

I mean so what's the cheekiest direction you've ever given to a model? Has there ever been anything where you've sat there and told a model to do something and you thought I'm not going to get away with this, but you did.

Speaker 4 48:06

The first thing that pops in my mind is yeah, there was a guy who liked the view from the backside. He wanted to have his ass full frontal. And so, yeah, he sat on the bed on his knees and his arms. The ass comes up almost in my face. Yeah, he sat on the bed on his knees and his arms. The ass comes up almost in my face. And okay, let's go a little bit more to the back Because you're too close. A and B I have to make a nice picture, so it has to be nice and in frame. So, yeah, it was laughing but a little bit awkward, but it was nice.

Speaker 1 48:44

That would be nice, but whole picture and it gave some inspiration to my neighbor. Yeah, here's what good looks like.

Speaker 2 48:51

Yes, correct, correct and have you got a um a preference to the style that you shoot in, like monochrome, sepia or color or any other sort of like preferences that you you like shooting normally?

Speaker 4 49:06

um, yeah, just just normal, normal colors. Okay, I uh, I make them black and white with extra contrast and then it looks great, but normally, um, like now, just just just regular colors?

Speaker 2 49:24

okay, cool. And how do you find the getting the lighting right, can you do? You struggle sometimes getting the lighting right in a room because it's too small or too big or yeah.

Speaker 4 49:34

That's why, in theory, I like the most to be outside to work with natural light, to have to have the, the sunlight in in the face of the model or on the on the body.

Speaker 2 49:45

Sometimes it's the light is playing with the body, and that's what I like have you ever done a show any of you have you ever done a shoot in like a shower scene or something like that?

Speaker 3 49:54

in water, oh yeah, um yeah, a couple of middle is easy because water's, you know, it says movement. Um, baths as well, but bubble baths is a. I love bubble, so, uh, it takes effort. When it's done beautifully, it's done beautifully. But nothing beats the sea as well. It always comes out beautiful, at least for me, on the beach or anything to see. Yeah, water's an interesting medium. Um, true, I think indoors showers, baths are tough, but when you get it right, you get it right, yeah.

Speaker 5 50:26

I agree, Like if you have a shower with a glass wall and you make it foggy and you just see like the contour of a guy pressing himself with a glass, for example. That's really, really hot. You need to have it cooled in the bathroom and very hot inside the shower. Then the water starts to condense.

Speaker 2 50:50

Otherwise, I'm not going to fog up. Have you ever had any accidents doing any modelling at all?

Speaker 3 51:00

I've fallen downstairs off tons of bloopers. I've fallen off logs. I've fallen downstairs off tons of bloopers. I've fallen off logs, I've fallen off chairs and there was like a filming behind the scenes. So I've got so many, so many bloopers uh that's one of my questions.

Speaker 2 51:14

You have bloopers do you get embarrassed or do you sort of like just get up and walk away and think, shit, that hurt, but I'm not gonna say I think no, I mean everyone's just kind of laughing.

Speaker 3 51:23

I've had one where one kind of uniform had buttons just underneath the buttocks area and then, as I'm putting, they just snap off.

Speaker 1 51:34

I mean it's funny, right, it's meant to be fun, but everyone, just kind of the photographer in the eye, and you said you've taken away my liking, have you?

Speaker 3 51:43

ever done anything with like food, as in like modelled with food on your stomachs or something like that I've done cake, but food's hard, it's messy, oh okay, yeah, so you kind of avoid it, like some things you've got to avoid, like honey, for example, or stick. That's one I've done, but not not again.

Speaker 2 52:04

Uh, it's too much hassle. What about you? And if you had any accidents at all?

Speaker 5 52:10

yeah, I think the most severe one was, uh, I was standing on that piece of wood, a piece of a tree that was cut, and standing there like a statue and then the guy wanted me to drop my jeans a little bit and then the jeans was like close to my feet and then I almost fall over and I couldn't actually jump. So it was like a crash. But it went well, but it was like it could have gone really bad. Trousers down at my feet anymore, standing on some items no, as long as they got the shot, that's important, I guess.

Speaker 2 52:48

And what about you, david? Have you ever had any mishaps yourself? No, not really. You haven't walked back and fallen over your own props, or anything like that.

Speaker 4 52:56

Or that I couldn't get up, that my knees hurt or whatever. Yeah, that's true, but not very big things. No, have you ever dropped any of your equipment at all? Oh yes, oh yes. Camera fall down on the tripod. Oh wow, like war scars on my camera.

Speaker 1 53:14

Yeah, that's true, yeah, and it's expensive equipment.

Speaker 4 53:18

Oh, absolutely, yeah, yes, indeed absolutely.

Speaker 2 53:22

How do you find that carrying all your stuff on public transport, then? Because that would be quite difficult for you, wouldn't it?

Speaker 4 53:28

Not today. I had a good friend of mine who was assisting me today and he's out of the picture, out of the screen at the moment and he's helping me out and he has a car, so we live in the same area, so it was a nice ride to come to Amsterdam so I could take extra stuff with me, which is not possible, true so, in terms of your shoot today, have you what sort of like what's?

Speaker 2 53:59

the plan for you to do today maybe one of you can elaborate.

Speaker 3 54:05

I think, think, outdoors, beautiful day, sunny day, and then, uh, yeah, some kind of urban shots, I think that's what kind of day's got in mind, so that'd be interesting. And then, um, yeah, just some, uh, some in uh, the studio, in the room. Um, yeah, see what we can do with all our fun clothes, exactly.

Speaker 4 54:25

You have tons.

Speaker 2 54:27

So when the photo shoot's finished, do you go and have a drink together or do you just sort of go your own ways and go home and sort your own lifestyle?

Speaker 4 54:35

Yeah we'll do that. We'll drink something, we chat about how everything was going, just to relax a bit.

Speaker 2 54:43

You've bonded right, so exactly no, that's, that's very true, that's very true. And do you ever sort of like, um like, arrange to do follow-up shoots? If you, if you gel, like you are today, obviously you can say, like the atmosphere is very, very good there between you all, would you sort of like, ever sort of like, contemplate doing a further shoot if the one happens today, it's good usually, yeah, if you vibe with the photographer, you're like, hey, let's, let's arrange.

Speaker 3 55:08

You know each other by now.

Speaker 2 55:09

You know the styles I mean honestly, looking at all three of you, you seem so relaxed, all three of you. It's almost like you know each other. That's why I'm for me. It's hard for me to not realize that you don't know each other, correct?

Speaker 1 55:21

it's so weird because you just look so like you know each other from forever so dave had some questions around photographers, right, and I told him they were off limits, right, because what he read in the media, right, was that photographers were basically not great people, right, and that they basically all insisted on casting couches and things like that and that they weren't very nice to models. But what we're seeing is different. So is there that element that you've had? Is there horrible photographers out there that I guess that you know of?

Speaker 3 56:00

From my experience because it's like I'm not a professional model so I can afford to walk away if I wouldn't appreciate photography and, like some moments, I'm like this isn't working for me and you're the best. Um, I think it's different in the industry. Um, I can't speak for everyone, but for myself. I have had some interesting experiences and I've left, not because just more like an attitude rather than an appropriate behavior, but I always stay in my boundaries.

Speaker 5 56:26

You don't respect the money, and that's my experience for me, for example, I I chat a bit with them. Then I always want to meet the photographer on WhatsApp with your call to have a good feeling. Is this a person I trust? Is this a person I will be comfortable with? Sometimes the photographer says no, I don't want to be on a video, I don't want to talk over the phone. Then it's like a warning sign for me. Then if I would do an exception, he need to be really, really good and be publicly produced. Uh, published on the internet and well known, maybe then, but uh, no, if I don't have a good feeling for him, I would not meet him. And I've been probably quite well, I've been selected, so I haven't really had any bad experience meeting photographers. I have done some paid shootings and they can be very demanding. The photographs there they have. They have a lot of ideas what they're going to do and that can be quite demanding, but it's also fun because they have really thought it through what they want to achieve.

Speaker 1 57:42

Very clear direction, I guess.

Speaker 2 57:44

Because what Matt's making reference to is the story I, or the information I read, was this it was a young guy from Canada, basically, and he got into the male modeling industry and he went really far.

Speaker 2 57:55

He went to Rome, he went to Paris, he went to all those big high-end places doing catwalk models and stuff like that. But he had to get out of it because he found that the photographers, more so, were asking him to do things that weren't appropriate, if that makes sense. It was like he would be cast only with the photographer, or the photographer would ask him to do stuff that wasn't consensual to him, you know, I mean, and he said it got very toxic and he said the pay wasn't that good either. He said for a male model compared to female models, it's just not good at all, you know. And he was going from one job to another and he lost track of all these agencies that he was under and basically he just had to quit, but he just found it very toxic in that regards. So he wasn't a veteran skin in the game.

Speaker 3 58:39

Sorry, he had skin getting the game. It was his profession and it's different. So you know exactly. And yeah, this it's it's kind of different rules.

Speaker 2 58:47

Yeah, you know so this is you can tell that because I mean you are all like I said, you're so very chilled. It's almost like I'm I'm, I'm sitting here looking at you, all three of you, and you just seem so relaxed with each other and it's so cool. I love it, you know, I mean it is, it's very cool and and. I can only imagine what the photoshoot will be like going forward. You know what I mean in terms of like You're welcome to stay online and have a documentary version as well.

Speaker 5 59:14

I think when you mentioned, like when I was younger 20, 25 years I did some modelling but I have quite a strong own will, so I got suggestions to do a thing that wasn't appropriate and I just said no thanks, because I didn't need. I didn't need the money so I could select what I did myself. But I can easily see that younger guys can probably kind of easily be like they think oh wow, if I do this and this service to the photographer, then he will make me really famous and things like that. They might be more desperate. I think it's more risky to be younger. If you're older than then, they know that you're more experienced and you can say no to things.

Speaker 1 59:57

So yeah, older is wiser sometimes, yeah, yeah, well, that's what I keep telling myself, but I know that's not true for me.

Speaker 2 1:00:07

I've got, I've got there's been an hour, um, but another question. I'd just like to ask if you could turn back time. Knowing what you know now in terms of where you are, in terms of your modeling and your photography and stuff like that, would have you got into it earlier if you knew now.

Speaker 3 1:00:24

Yes, and I would have probably taken better care of my body and I would have been, I think, more, just a bit crazier and more assertive. But I think that's what comes with age, right? Yeah, I think everyone says that.

Speaker 1 1:00:41

Yeah.

Speaker 2 1:00:41

Yeah.

Speaker 1 1:00:42

So your body's great, by the way.

Speaker 2 1:00:45

Great Not just good, but great, it is good, honestly always great have you got any advice to anybody else that might be listening on the podcast to maybe getting into?

Speaker 1 1:00:57

thinking about starting out modeling and where?

Speaker 2 1:01:00

and where do you start what? What's the first thing you actually do?

Speaker 3 1:01:02

uh, you know, good question. I would um just don't don't take it too seriously. See where it goes. Have your boundaries, communicate them, because different people, different boundaries um always agree. What you own, what you don't own, um, trust your gut as well. It's, it's there for a reason, um and and just also treat your body with respect and create a moment of beauty. If you're going to be there, be present, listen to the photographer, listen to yourself, see what you want to do, because don't waste people's time either. It's not fair. So that would be my advice.

Speaker 1 1:01:39

Right Anders.

Speaker 5 1:01:42

I would say it's a lot about competition. So you need to find your own niche where you actually have your own advantages. Sorry, this sounds like a marketing thing, but anyway, you need to find your niche where you actually have your strongest personal appeal and things like that. There you will have a much better chance to succeed. If you just try to compete with anyone, then it's harder. So find your niche and then also, like my friend says here, be yourself and have your boundaries and don't move your boundaries just because someone promises you something. And if you're not comfortable with a shooting, just say no something. And if you're not comfortable with, like, a shooting, just say no. And because it's very hard to pretend being into a shooting if you don't feel comfortable. It's like you can see it on the picture.

Speaker 1 1:02:39

yeah, yeah and how about you dave anyone starting out in photography or even working with models? How, how, any?

Speaker 4 1:02:46

advice to have a good, good equipment. Yes, of course that's important to have a good camera, etc. And if you have some lighting would be great. Um, for me, when someone asked me, what was important for you is, uh, it's what the two gentlemen already said be polite, be, be nice, don't be a bitch, just be you, but in a good way, and I have a good connection with the model, or the models, that's, that's the most important thing. I just don't see it as just a job, click a, click ready and leave, but make it, make it a whole experience and, uh, preparing in front and then and at the end, when, when everything is finished, when the photos are there, um, to share everything, or not everything, and depends on the platform, uh, but to share the with the models, what you have made. So, yeah, that's yes.

Speaker 2 1:03:39

Is it important to have any sort of industry qualifications in photography to do this, or do you? Is it part of the actual requirement to have them anyway? Not for me. It's okay. So you've learned over the over the years just by your own development.

Speaker 4 1:03:54

Yeah, exactly, I have some training. I had a course a few years ago for fiat bikes and, yeah, and, try to use the experience and look at the camera, try to to do to learn a lot. I'm hungry. Just work with your camera and and and try to to learn your camera and, and then that's the technical stuff and what I just said about uh, me personally. Be kind, try to do a good good uh me personally.

Speaker 5 1:04:34

Be kind, try to to a good, good, uh always evolving, really, aren't you to the models?

Speaker 4 1:04:37

yeah, yeah, not too much drama.

Speaker 2 1:04:38

No, no, no drama please I just had x today because you want to stay in shape as much as possible, so but have you ever saw like being asked to do something where you've had to slim down to the point where you weren't happy, or is that?

Speaker 3 1:04:52

no one's ever asked me that but I did one shoot and I was. It was recently and I was something like eight kilos overweight. And you know what? I did not look good, I was. I didn't feel good. It didn't seem like you've got to get back into shape because people aren't going to book you or want to work with you. So, um, and that's okay, you can be whatever you want to be, but for me it wasn't what I wanted.

Speaker 2 1:05:18

To represent myself, just just look after yourself a bit. And in terms of another question, do you, um, do you prefer to be shaved or natural?

Speaker 3 1:05:30

yeah, no me, uh me shave stuff. I'm totally shaved everywhere. Uh, I got it done before the shoot. So that that's that's my style for me and and what I would do even if it was a personal.

Speaker 2 1:05:42

So is that not? Is that a sort of like a common thing within that sort of industry that more people are shaved, or is it just as people are?

Speaker 3 1:05:50

I think now we've got more variety. You've got okay cool. Yeah, it's totally different. It's not like 1980s, where everyone's like smooth and blonde. You get everything now, which is good yeah, great which is great cool.

Speaker 5 1:06:04

I'm actually quite hairy, but I usually drill my chest hair and stomach and so on, and then around cock and balls I shave because I prefer it. Yeah, for some shootings I'm more or less forced to trim all of my body hair really short and then I just don't like it. I just I like to be a bit hairy, but thrilled I like hairy.

Speaker 2 1:06:27

I like people that hairy. This is one of my choices. But again, I mean great guys look great normally anyway, but um, but yeah, as long as they don't look like a silverback, that's right I.

Speaker 1 1:06:37

I turn out to be too fussy. I like men full stop. Um, I've got a pulse. I mean, I'm there. Um, it's been fantastic having you guys on. Um. Is there any websites or any instagrams you want to plug while you're on here? Or do you just want me to tag you?

Speaker 2 1:06:52

We can put your photography thing up there.

Speaker 4 1:06:57

We can send them to them, right yeah?

Speaker 3 1:06:59

we'll send them to you.

Speaker 1 1:07:02

And we'll pop it into the tag when we actually release the episode and stuff like that as well. So it's been an absolute pleasure having you gentlemen on and thank you so much Thank you for having us.

Speaker 2 1:07:14

Yeah, we'll look forward to doing another one in another time as well. It'll be great.

Speaker 1 1:07:17

All right. So I'm Matt this time. He's Matt. Yeah, I'm Dave this time and we're your Fully Grown Homos and we'll chat to you again next week. That's a wrap from us. We've been your Fully Grown Homos and we look forward to opening your mind, your ears and your curiosities. Don't forget to like, comment and subscribe and share our podcast with your curious friends. You can contact us on fullygrownhomospodcast at gmailcom or any of our socials. Fullyully Grown Homos Podcast.