The Book Deal

Literary festivals, pitching yourself for events (and podcasts!), new books and the special art of a timeline

• Tina Strachan • Season 1 • Episode 39

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Literary festivals, pitching yourself for events (and podcasts!), new books and the special art of a timeline


In this episode of the Book Deal Podcast, hosts Tina Strachan and Madeleine Cleary dive into lively discussions about their writing processes and experiences. They  reveal insights on writing timelines, the importance of mapping them out carefully, and how timelines can impact the narrative structure. The episode highlights the excitement and challenges involved in attending and speaking at literary festivals, emphasising the significance of networking and building community within the literary world. Tina promotes the upcoming Currumbin Crime Writers Festival, while Madeleine advises checking out Literary Listings for festival information. Engaging and informative, this episode is a must-listen for aspiring authors and literary enthusiasts.

Festival lists in Australia


Our Debut in the Spotlight is author Sarah Lane with Surprise Shark (Affirm Press, 2025), illustrated by Patrick Corrigan. 


00:00 Welcome to the Book Deal Podcast
00:43 19th Century Vibes and Writing Influences
03:35 Madeleine's New Book Announcement
05:18 Deep in Edits and Upcoming Releases
06:47 The Importance of Timelines in Writing
12:26 Upcoming Events and Workshops
15:05 Surprise Shark: A Delightful New Picture Book
16:33 Williamstown Literary Festival Highlights
17:01 Sex, Love, and Taboo: A Festival Experience
18:30 Meeting Literary Heroes in the Green Room
19:39 The Importance of Networking and Community Building
23:39 Pitching Yourself to Festivals
28:06 The Value of Paid Festival Appearances
30:25 Upcoming Currumbin Crime Writers Festival
32:25 Top Tips and Recommendations
33:42 Conclusion and Farewell

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Tina Strachan children's book author
Madeleine Cleary (@madeleineclearywrites) • Instagram photos and videos
Madeleine Cleary | Author

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Tina Strachan:

This is the Book Deal podcast where you will discover the inspiring stories, the authors behind your favorite books. No matter what stage of writing you are at, we've got you covered. I'm Tina Strachan. And I'm Madeleine Cleary. And join us as we pull back the curtain of published authors one deal at a time.

Madeleine Cleary:

The book Deal podcast acknowledges the traditional owners of the land and waters, which it's recorded on and pays respect to their elders past, present, and emerging. Happy Sunday, Tina. Happy Sunday, Madeleine. You're like, wait, what's your name? You're deep in edits. Oh

Tina Strachan:

no. I was, I was gonna start off with, um, good day to you, lady Madeleine. Um, because your last message to me was very 19th century and I was really hoping that you were gonna bring the 19th century talk with you.

Madeleine Cleary:

How do you do, Tina? I hope that, uh, you are fairing well. Today indeed explore and stay. But why do you have 19th century vocab at the moment? Made? I'm, oh, I'm just so deep. I can't, what was the message I sent you again? Um, I should read it out. You, you were trying to schedule, uh, our session today and I said I have rolled out of bed this morning and I've just been hitting the writing without care for my appearance. So.

Tina Strachan:

Very proper. Um, and I love that, that it's that your write your, your writing is seeping into your everyday words.

Madeleine Cleary:

Does, does middle grade writing seep into your everyday words when you're deep into in the writing?

Tina Strachan:

Um, not really because, um, yes, mine's quite. Prob, my words have seeped into it, I think quite a lot. But I do have a funny story in that, um, there is a character in book two, in book three mm-hmm. Of the Wilder Zoo Series that I'm writing. And, uh, there's a Scottish character, oh, I have to say. At the time when I was writing book two, I was binge watching Outlander. I dunno if you've seen Outlander. But it's Scottish, it's in Scotland and there's these Strachan accents and um, to the point. So I was binge watching it to the point like where in my head my thoughts were even a little bit in Scottish. Like that's all that I could hear. And so when I started writing I was like, this created this new character and he just had to be Scottish'cause I

Madeleine Cleary:

cause of Outlander. So there is a character in your book that is Scottish because of Outlander? Yes. Oh, that is the best. Yeah. I just

Tina Strachan:

wanted to write that.

Madeleine Cleary:

That's when your everyday life seeps into your writing, which is common, isn't it? Yes. Anyway. That's fantastic. Even in middle grade. I love that. But yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm deep in, um, 19th century Melbourne at the moment, which is a fun place to be really. It's a nice escapism. I think that's why I enjoy historical fiction.'cause it is, it is a bit of an escape. Mm-hmm. Um, not sure of times were simpler back then, but certainly very interesting for some, maybe. For others, not so much. No, that's right. That's right. So it's been good. Um, um, progress tracker, oh gosh. Should I say it then? I'll have to be kept to account. Yeah, do

Tina Strachan:

it. But I was gonna say this is, um, this might be some exciting news for fans of Madeleine Clery and the Butterfly Women.

Madeleine Cleary:

Are you

Tina Strachan:

talking, are you sort of, are we hearing it here first? Madeleine? Is this. Is this a new book that you're writing?

Madeleine Cleary:

It it perhaps this is the first, well I have spoken about it in a couple of other record things, but this might be the first one that goes to Eric about it. Yes. So I am writing a new book. Uh, it's set 15 years after the Butterfly Women. It is set in Melbourne again. Um, it definitely expands out of Little Lawn. So for those who've read The Butterfly Women, it's. There's lots of very familiar locations in Melbourne that my, I'm taking my characters on to. So it's expanding that love letter to the city that people have described it as. And it's a lot of fun. So I am up to, as of today, 25,000 words a down. Wow. Which that's a good place to be, isn't it? It is, it is. It's a really good place to be. Um, 30,000 I think is the point where generally for me. I'll either stop or keep going. Mm-hmm. So I'm almost at that point, and I thi but this one, this story's feeling really good and, and just like I get, I'm getting the same feelings, it's feeling special and important to me. Mm-hmm. And I've got a lot of momentum behind it. Mm-hmm. So I'm hoping that continues. Mm-hmm. And you're excited to sit down and keep going. So excited. I love that feeling. I love it. My brain, I'm just completely absorbed right now. Um, so good. I've also, it's coincided with a bit of a quieter period for me in terms of events. So for the last couple of weeks I've just been, and it's also really cold in Melbourne, so I literally have just been huddling down and writing and that's been really fun. So that's nice. What about you? You are deep in edits.

Tina Strachan:

I'm deep in edits. Yes. Speaking of writing, I'm deep in edits for book three. Which doesn't come out until next year.

Madeleine Cleary:

Um, but it's, you've got a bit of a break then after you've got, uh, book two coming out in July and then, uh, next week, Madeleine? I don't, is it next week? Next week, is it? Oh, no, it's the

Tina Strachan:

week after next. Sorry. Okay. Oh my gosh. Week after next. I, I don't feel very prepared for it. It's just, it's, it is very, I can say it's very different. July is literally, yeah, I know. In 10 days,

Madeleine Cleary:

so I know it's scary. What date does it come out on the, the 1st of July. July 2nd. July 2nd. We'll mark that date in your calendars, everybody. Yes. July 2nd. Sneak from the storm. We'll hit the

Tina Strachan:

shells July 2nd. And yes, I, everything is so busy. Like I've got so many workshops, uh, coming up and it's, yeah, there's just a lot to do and edits. Edits always just seem to come in at the. They're really busy times, doesn't it? Is it a structural edit or is it a copy edit? Oh, well it's the type set edit. Oh, so you know what it looks, looks when they send you what it looks like. Printed on a page. So it hasn't got the illustrations in there yet, so they're still gonna have to do some fiddling around and moving things around, um, to fit the illustrations in. Which is good because I've, um, ma made quite a few additional sort of edits and changes.'cause it's been a while since I've seen it.

Madeleine Cleary:

Mm-hmm. Um,

Tina Strachan:

I think it's probably been like six months. So that's a good break. That's Yeah. To then look at it and go with a fresh pair of eyes. Um, the biggest thing that I found. Actually, and I, I had this issue when I was writing it, it as a bit of a timeline situation. I dunno if you've like Yeah. I think'cause the timelines are quite tight in this book and it's, you know, one of the main issues is that something's due at a particular date, you know? Mm. So I sort of have to almost work back from that. And there's a few things that happened in that time that has to happen on particular days. And I think at one point. It kind of happens over about the space of a week, and at one point, you know, I had to change the timeline, change the days, and so I, I can see a little bit of that sung over and, you know, in this, um, type set copy that I've got now, which I'm glad to have caught. Oh,

Madeleine Cleary:

that's good. That's also frightening, isn't it, when you Also

Tina Strachan:

frightening.

Madeleine Cleary:

But I, how do you map out your timeline? I'm so

Tina Strachan:

glad you asked. If you have time, and this is why, once you've done, once you've done it and it is really important okay. To map your timeline. I didn't know this, so I read my, my first manuscript that I wrote, I just completely wrote the whole thing and it was fine and, and timewise, timeline wise. There was no other major issues except so I just naturally just had it.

Sarah Lane:

Mm-hmm.

Tina Strachan:

Fine. Like it was just working fine. But I don't think the particular days mattered. It probably didn't matter if it was in, you know, a couple of days here or there, but when I started mapping it out and using story grid, the story grid, we go, okay, story grid, as we know, everyone knows how we, how I love this. Um, at the end. So it had like even when I first saw story good, I was like, this is outta control. This is so full on. I'm like, I'm not gonna map each the time of each scene and how long it starts and when it finished, it ended. But I can tell you now when you do that, you do realize that silly, some kind of like silly mistakes get through. Like at one point I realize that they had been driving in a car nonstop for 26 hours, which can ever happen. You do have to stop. No one's got 26 hours worth of fuel in the tank. You know, just one of those, just one of those things that you just sort of don't really think about and they, yeah, so I just, so it was really handy to pick that up and admittedly I didn't, um, I did, I had to actually do just the, I had to sort of map out the time for each. Chapter again now, not as, not like start and fish, but at least the days and if it was the morning or the afternoon, because it really does make a difference when you're looking at such a tight timeframe. So,

Madeleine Cleary:

yeah, and also like external things, like where the sun's positioned in the sky and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. Oh. Morning, afternoon, or what season it is. Maybe it's not as necessary. In Queensland seasons don't mean this much. There's storm season and there's storm season. That's right. Wild season. Well, there you could be. Yeah, that's true. So I guess that, that, that's

Tina Strachan:

interesting.

Madeleine Cleary:

Mm-hmm. So you would recommend it,

Tina Strachan:

um, I think if you have time after you've written a manuscript, even just a, your zero draft to position yourself.'cause sometimes you can get yourself like in a really tight or a really. You can create a really big issue, I think with your timelines

Madeleine Cleary:

you can. And um, so when I submitted the Butterfly Women and it was accepted, Ruby then asked me for my timeline. Oh, oh really? They asked me to send through. The timeline for her, her next structural way to read. And I was like, eek, I don't, I, I'm a chaos writer. I don't have any timeline. And she says, it's, and I sort of went, oh, I'll have to put one together for you. And she said it's really helpful, particularly in historical fiction, to have timelines.

Tina Strachan:

Mm-hmm. Um,

Madeleine Cleary:

I think any, any anything partic and crime and all sorts. And so I yeah. Had to retrospectively go back and create a timeline. Mm-hmm. The other useful thing that Ruby did was put together, um, kind of a map of the chapters for me and the parts to see, you know, a summary of which of each chapter, where the clues come in, and the points that she did up this amazing wow shape. Um, which, you know, because she just obviously knew that I didn't have anything. She's like, oh, I'm gonna have to do this. Yeah. So I guess for emerging writers, it, it, I think it's now I do timelines ahead. Like I've actually done timeline now, or every time I come across something where I go, oh, this happened on this date, or This person was born in this year, so that would make them this, this age. Mm-hmm. Because that's a thing. They would've had this person at this age. And I now just, I have a table. Randomly in some random Word document that I just add to. And so that way Ruby, I can just give it to Ruby in the future.

Tina Strachan:

She's gonna be

Madeleine Cleary:

so

Tina Strachan:

happy with that.

Madeleine Cleary:

I know, I know. I think

Tina Strachan:

I feel really good doing that. Yeah. You're such a star pupil. Um, now that is a really good, that is a top tip too. Go through and check your timelines. Yeah. Uh. Maybe after you've finished, perhaps, or at the same time if you like. But yeah, it is really helpful, especially if you do have an actual ticking clock kind of thing. Yes. As your storyline. Yes. Um, you can't, yeah. You need to know when to apply the kind of the pressure and everything, and you can't do that too far out and you can't. Build it up and then, you know, drop it back down. You've gotta keep that pressure on and the momentum going. Exactly. So

Madeleine Cleary:

really

Tina Strachan:

important. So, uh, timelines

Madeleine Cleary:

and your publisher might ask if for emerging writers who are Yes, they may ask you for your timeline. So be prepared based our people,

Tina Strachan:

we both said the same thing.

Madeleine Cleary:

Oh, hilarious. But you, yeah. So I'm deep in edit, so that's kind of, yes. Okay. Tell us about your events though. Like what, what, what have you got upcoming for book two? I think I did last time actually. Did you? I think,

Tina Strachan:

yeah. How about, do you wanna just remind everybody? I did. And then, and I said I'm gonna put it all up on, um, on Inster and I, you know what? I have been so busy that I haven't totally got round to it, but I've started and um, so I have a couple of library events mm-hmm. Up here. Gold Coast Libraries. Uh, in the school holidays I have an event at Quip Brown Fox, which is a, um. Writing workshop. Mm-hmm. Um, which is all about writing wild characters. Mm-hmm. And settings. Um, and I also have an event at where the Wild Things are in West End, in Brisbane, and that is a, uh, Wilder Zoo Crew workshop. So kids come along and test your skills and see if you can make it as a Wilder Zoo Crew member. I'm gonna, we've got some little. You know, wildlife trivia and we're gonna do a little mock vet exam on, on a rescued, I'm doing bunny ears. It's a stuffed animal, um, rescued animal. And, um, yeah, I've got a few more things and I'm just getting the final details on, um, for August. So, yeah. And

Madeleine Cleary:

so where can people find all these events and booking links?

Tina Strachan:

Yeah, on uh, my Instagram at the moment. So yes, just at, um, Tina, just search Tina Strachan. And, um, you shall find me in your link. You link in

Madeleine Cleary:

your bio or is that where

Tina Strachan:

Oh, yes, the, so the link is on in the bio there. That's probably the best place and. Very soon. I should have them on the website as well.

Madeleine Cleary:

Brilliant. Keep an eye out for that. That's exciting. And all in Queensland. And then you'll be down in Melbourne as well.

Tina Strachan:

Yeah, end of August. Uh, book launch for Nika in the store. Book two at Melbourne Zoo. So, okay. Tickets will be so it's gonna be super fun, but tickets will be quite limited, um, for that. Unless you've got a pass to the zoo, which I know lots of people do who have kids. And then you could just come in and

Madeleine Cleary:

wait. Am I. Yeah, absolutely. You're on VIP list, so I get, I'm one of the VIPs. Yes. Yeah.

Tina Strachan:

You got an automatic ticket. Fantastic. Uh, no, but that's gonna be super fun.

Madeleine Cleary:

Who's, who's, who's in your in convo partner in Melbourne, Catherine Collette. Oh, you should have asked me. Tina. Jealous Bloody clack, Catherine. Always getting the good, the good gigs.

Tina Strachan:

Well when you write your middle grade, um, hey, I've been a

Madeleine Cleary:

middle grade reader before I've read.

Sarah Lane:

Hi, my name's Sarah Lane and I'm here to tell you all about my debut picture book Surprise Shark Illustrated by the super talented Patrick Corrigan and published by the beautiful team at Affirm Press. It's hard to make friends when you're a shark, but this shark has a foolproof plan for winning people over if only they'd stop running away. A surprising story about finding friendship in the most unlikely places. Surprise Shark came about after my son had to rewrite the ending to Whitney and Britney Chicken Divas during COVID Home Learning. And he put a shark in. And I thought, how wonderful that in his mind, a shark could just show up anywhere. Kids' brains are the best. And that got me thinking about the most awkward, unlikely scenarios in which a shark could arrive and surprise shark was born. Surprise shark has been described as delightfully, energetic, and a joy to read aloud with fun, rhyme and cheeky dialogue. Shark defies stereotypes and is full of humor and heart. Thank you to Tina and the book Deal podcast for the opportunity to share Surprise Shark with you today. Surprise Shark is out now and I can't wait to share it with you. Bye for now.

Tina Strachan:

Yeah, so I've had lots of friends. I haven't attended too many events myself, but you've had a busy weekend.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yes. At a festival. Fun. Yeah. So yesterday was, um, well it's over this whole weekend actually, the Williamstown Literary Festival in Victoria, Willy Lit. Um, and yeah, it was super fun. Um, I did an event yesterday afternoon. It actually was a so solid out event as well, which is very, very cool. Um, that's very cool. So it was a packed room. Um, yeah, it was in conversation with. An author called Rochelle Siemienowicz, and she wrote a book called Double Happiness. Um, and the, the topic was Sex, love and Taboo, which is, oh, that sounds so exciting, isn't her? Yeah. Topic. Our books are entirely different, but Charlotte, so Charlotte Guest, she's, um, an incredible book seller. She's the store manager at Book Bird in Geelong, and she, we, we had met at STR to Writers Festival. She's brilliant and she's a brilliant moderator. I've heard this. Yeah, she's incredible. And so she facilitated the conversation and, um, her questions just really, she found all these amazing synergies mm-hmm. Between the books. And I love that, that, you know, when your book is deeply read in that way. Um. So it's a privilege, I think. So we had a fantastic event and then afterwards, um, so as signing books, um, had a fan of the podcast come up, which is so lovely. Um, Georgie Foster, who's an emerging writer herself. Um, so we had a good chat about that. And, um, yeah, had some like, just nice chats with readers, which was really, really lovely. Uh, so. Uh, is there something very energetic and heartwarming about writers festivals? I'm not sure. And it's, it's just, yeah, a little bit different, I think, because. It just attracts a whole different type of audience and people can just float between events and it's really cool. And as a writer attending, it's, it's fun. You get to go into the green room, which is really cool. That sounds very exciting. I was in there and I, I was too nervous, of course, um, to approach them, but. The first person I saw was Claire Wright. Mm-hmm. Who wrote The Forgotten Rebels of Eureka. And I'm a massive fan and I just like Star at her from the corner for a while. Really awkwardly. Go and talk to her though. No, I was too embarrassed. I was like, oh, what am I? And she's so smart and intelligent as well. I don't even know how I would engage with someone like Claire Wright. And then the next person that came into the Green room was, um, Kate Granville. Again, and she was like, she's so cute looking. And I was like, I can't, I just don't know what I could say to someone as amazing and, and smart as Kate Granville. So I just, um, I hung out with my crew. So,

Tina Strachan:

yeah. Experience though. Sure

Madeleine Cleary:

there was people like,

Tina Strachan:

oh, that's Madeleine Cleary. No, no. May. Okay, well maybe next year. But that's an incredible experience. All of it, like the green room and especially, you know, having, um, people come up and chat fans off the podcast, fans off your book. So you can see why festivals are highly sought after for. Authors.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yes, it's a great opportunity. Emerging authors are very

Tina Strachan:

interested.

Madeleine Cleary:

It's, it is a good opportunity. And if, and yeah, probably I should have gone up, but I was hanging out, I was having great chats with, um, Ali Parker, so we got to hang out. She's another fan of the podcast. And of course, um, I saw, um, Marion Taf was there, so she was in conversation with Gail Holmes. Um, so it was nice to see some of our debut crew there. I was gonna say,

Tina Strachan:

I saw lots of debut crew photos coming up all over the socials. I was feeling very jealous.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry. But she could have you here, Tina. But no, it was good. It was so I was having lots of engaged conversations with lots of different people and, um, yeah, it, it is, it is fun. They're diff it's difficult to get festivals and I think as a debut writer, you can't really expect to get any, like, if you get one or two, like that's pretty amazing. Um, because, you know, there's, there's so many amazing writers out there and festivals. Need to be able to draw a crowd and as an unknown quantity, you are taking a risk on, on people like us, I suppose. So it's great that festivals are taking the chances on debut writers. Um, but yeah, often it is, um, you know, the people who I've met, I suppose in. The two years that I've been part of this community and networking and build, it's not really networking, it's just like community building, isn't it? Mm-hmm. Um, that's helped. Yeah. Networking

Tina Strachan:

sounds like you're trying to sell something, doesn't it? I know, but it sounds it's not like that at all, is it? It's just, uh. Yeah, it is building community, I think is a much better word for it. That's

Madeleine Cleary:

right, that's right. And like for example, um, I, I don't mind saying this. Um, I met, um, Emily Westmoreland, who's the director of Willie Lip Festival at an event that I attended with, um, so Barbara Minton, who's the historian, she was in conversation at. Um, a, a, an event. That book and paper in Williamstown where the festivals had organized like over a year ago, we got chatting at that event. Um, she asked about my book. So I talked to her about that and then, you know, that's how I think I. Having that connection with the director, she then remembers you and your face and then, you know, the invitation came along. Um, and I've since found out too, like she's sort of, you know, recommended to another festival, a few of bus day booths and said, you know, take a chance on these ones. So it's amazing how. When you put yourself out there, go to these events to meet these people and hey, I should have listened to my own vice and probably gone up to Claire Wright and Kate Bel and introduce myself. But what it shows is that it is part of this, you know, putting you out there, out yourself out there is important. You get these kinds of opportunities.

Tina Strachan:

Mm-hmm. Yeah, a hundred percent. Um, which, which. Is true for lots of other things. Mm-hmm. Not just festival invites. Mm-hmm. You don't have to go and seek out all the festival directors, but there's lots of different things, appearances, um, you know, school visits, lots of things.'cause there's, you know, a lot of authors and there's only so many spaces. Mm-hmm. And like you said, for debuts, you are an unknown quantity.

Sarah Lane:

Yes.

Tina Strachan:

Um, you, so I can imagine as, as a festival director, I wanna fill the room, you know, and I That's right. Also want the people who I invite to talk. To feel like they can fill a room as well. Um, so, and there would be so many authors that put their hand up to do it, who, um, have uh, really Strachan backgrounds and can absolutely fill a room and sell out. Mm-hmm. And so it is so that is the people that you're, that you're up against. That's right. But there's probably a few different, um, maybe angles that you can take in that some, a lot of festivals do like to do debut panels. Mm. Or do like, you know, new books or new faces in the military community, which is nice. Mm-hmm. Or if you have some kind of angle so you could, you know, you could definitely go, uh, for, you know, historical. Panels. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like, you'd still be very relevant for that and people would still definitely be very interested. So just about finding your niche, I guess, that you could Yeah, that's right. That you could play on that. Have you ever pitched yourself to festivals? I haven't

Madeleine Cleary:

neither.

Tina Strachan:

No. Um, I will though. It's my plan. Um, it is my plan on my list, and I know that you have to do it very early for those people who do wanna pitch themselves. Um, you have to get in really early, I think. Literally, by the time the festival's over, they're thinking about the next one.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yes.

Tina Strachan:

And it's, I'd say maybe at least nine months outright. They're, they're trying to start putting out feelers for names. They are of, um, yeah. People for the next festival. So don't leave it too late either. If you, uh, do you wanna get to a festival soon? Um, it's not always, you don't always have to pitch yourself though. Publishers do pitch for you. Mm-hmm.

Madeleine Cleary:

That's what

Tina Strachan:

I've,

Madeleine Cleary:

yeah. At least I think some publishers do there. I think there are perhaps some of the smaller presses that might not have that capacity to do. Mm-hmm. To do so and so they rely on an external freelancer or perhaps the author to represent themselves. That can also be better sometimes because. The author approaching a pub, like a Fed Festival director can be, you know, more, perhaps more tailored, um, and more likely to receive a response. You know, you're making that connection. Yeah, and we're not suggesting that, obviously people just go start hounding um, festival directors over Instagram and saying, why can I be on your festival? Think about your pitch. And there's

Tina Strachan:

usually a formal method for this, isn't there? I think it's, um. I think you can find it on their website. If there's a festival that you really want and you, and with pictures, I think it's the same for everything, right? For PO people who wanna pitch podcasts, we get a lot of them as well, don't we, Madeleine? Mm-hmm. Um, most certainly. I. Um, pictures where people can tell you what they're going to talk about or what they can talk about or what the difference is for them. Um, certainly can make a difference when you, when you're pitching anything, festivals, school visits, all those sorts of things. Give an example of what you're gonna talk about. Yes. Um, example of times. When you've done it before, even, um, is handy or all of that help is extremely helpful.

Madeleine Cleary:

I agree. I agree. And, um, I guess we've kind of been surprised at, um, the amount of pictures that we get from authors who want to come onto the podcast and it's, it's. Very, uh, flattering to, to receive those pictures. Mm-hmm. It's also quite difficult for us, isn't it though, Tina? Because we wanna have as many people as we can on the show, but we only conduct, you know, limited number of interviews. Um, and so we've got a bit of a backlog, I think, at the moment. Um, and I agree it's the ones that, um, also I think take, and this is the same for when you're pitching to anybody, any like a library or a festival. Um. Show that you are engaged with that individual entity. So the best pictures that I've seen to the podcast said, oh, I really love this episode where you talked about this like this. I took away this. I've noticed there's a gap. You haven't actually spoken about this. I can feel that gap for you. Mm-hmm. Yeah,

Tina Strachan:

definitely. Because everyone's looking for something a little bit different, or they're looking for an angle that they can. Push and promote.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yes. Yes. And um, and I think that's the same with libraries as well. Like you can look at, well, who some of the authors that they have taken and done events with in the past or bookshops and then said, well, you know, I, I'm similar. I can do this, I can talk about this. I think your, your community would really appreciate this. Like, I think there's ways that you can kind of. Make it different rather than just a stock standard. This is my book, this is who I am, please have me on.

Tina Strachan:

Yes.'cause you have to think there's a lot of, they're getting a lot of these pictures. Yes. So you really need to make yourself stand out.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yes. And I guess, because this is just interesting as well, we do get pictures from publicists as well. Mm-hmm. Um, from publishing houses and sometimes the pitches that we get, um, you know, there's 10 authors in one pitch. And so I guess that's useful for us to know that.'cause I didn't know that mm-hmm. When, before we started the podcast that publicists are very busy

Tina Strachan:

Yeah.

Madeleine Cleary:

People and they might not be able to do an individual, you know, everything's tailored, everything's beautiful. It's all lovely. Yeah. Um, but often, sometimes one of many bundle

Tina Strachan:

Yeah.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yeah.

Tina Strachan:

You're bundled up. Yeah. Yeah. Which is, which is fine. Yeah. Um. Now with festivals back to festival. Are we expecting to get paid

Madeleine Cleary:

for festivals? Madeleine? I think yes. Yes. Mm-hmm. Um, all the festivals I've done so far have been paid for that time. And I think actually authors on a panel get an easier ride than the moderators do. There's a lot of work that goes into moderator. I agree. I agree. Yeah. Because you have to read the books at least. Yes. At least the books that they've been published and yeah. Not the back list of those authors as well. Mm-hmm. And then you. Um, yeah, prepare so much. I know Charlotte has had done so much preparation, so, um, but we do for love as well. Um, but yes, authors should absolutely be paid for festivals, don't you think? Yeah, I

Tina Strachan:

agree. I agree and I think they, I. Uh, a lot of festivals, the good festivals are, are go to a lot of, um, effort to make sure that the guests, all the guests are fairly paid. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Um, and you know what that means? That they'll get big. Um, reputable names coming to their festivals again as well, because they, uh, know how much time it takes. It takes time. It's not just turning up for that, you know, 45 minute, half an hour panel for you. It's, you do have to think about what you might say. You've gotta probably take the time off. You gotta travel there. It is work. It's probably on your, on your weekend if it's a weekday. Mm-hmm. A sometimes take time off of work to do it. Like it's, um, and it's taking away from writing time. That's right. That's right. But yeah, it, it is important. Um, and of course, uh, a SA Australian Society of Authors would have all those, um, rates of pace, which would include festivals, I believe they have like mm-hmm. Different, um, appearances. Yeah. Yeah. Rates of pays Yep. For panels and all those sorts of things.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yeah, for sure. It's, it's, it, it's, yeah. I think we've just got discussed this on the, um, the podcast before. Even if there's no indication of pay, it's still important for authors to ask the question. And even if you're happy to do it for free, it's also still important to say, well, I'm waiving my fee for this case for you. Yeah, yeah,

Tina Strachan:

yeah. That's fair. And I think always send a link to the ASSA rates of pay so people know where it's coming from. Yes, exactly. That's what I think. Exactly.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yeah.

Tina Strachan:

Hey, speaking of festivals, can I plug the MB and Crime Writers Festival? Yes. So the Rom Crime Crime Writers Festival is, it's the first one this year and it's being held. That's a tongue

Madeleine Cleary:

tied is, is it? Oh no it wasn't Little bit for me. Rum, the

Tina Strachan:

Crime Writers Currumbin and Crime Writers, Currumbin Crime Writers Festival the 15th to 16th of August. So two days in August, and the beautiful bin, um, up here on the Gold Coast, or an incredible venue. Uh, the guest of honor this year is Fiona Macintosh, and she is, I, I think maybe there might only be a couple of tickets left if that, for her workshop. So she's holding a workshop, which is gonna be incredible. Um, yeah, get to spend, um, some time with her and work on your crime writing. Um, also Hailey Scrivener, January Gilchrist and Ali Lowe. So some really big names. Uh, so if you're a crime writer, I'm sure everybody would know who they are and, uh, very. But also Alex ett will be there, the literary agent, Alex ett giving, uh, people advice on their manuscripts. Mm-hmm. And Rebecca Saunders from her, she will also be there giving some feedback. Um, so yeah, workshops, panels, uh, networking sessions as well. We're just talking about how important networking sessions are. Um, and, uh, it's gonna be an incredible event in such a beautiful spot. So. Know, maybe, uh, pitch them for next year. Everybody, if you wanna go and pitch them. But yeah, I go along, uh, rum, K Brothers Festival, check them out on their website. You can buy tickets on the website. Um, and it's a good excuse, excuse to spend two beautiful days, um, up here on the Gold Coast.

Madeleine Cleary:

Yeah, look, August in Melbourne is not great, so I think Sounds wonderful.

Tina Strachan:

It's, it's gorgeous

Madeleine Cleary:

that that could be a tax write off as well, right?

Tina Strachan:

Absolutely, absolutely could. So that's actually gonna be my top tip and recommendation for this episode, Madeleine, is to go and check out the Currumbin Crime Writers Festival books on tickets and um, yeah, spend winter

Madeleine Cleary:

up here on the Gold Coast. What about you, Madeleine? Beautiful. Well, I'm gonna go back on an old top tip and reiterate it, which I remember Natasha, our catch up chat saying that she, during a festival has solved. Some terrible complex problem in her plot. In her book during a festival, just sitting in the audience, listening, talking about writing. And sometimes it's nice. So if you are feeling stuck in your, in your manuscript, go up to Rumba in August or go to, there are so many incredible festivals in Australia and there's more and more every day you can actually go to literary listings. Um, so Jill runs that amazing website and her Instagram, and she has. All the incredible writers festivals on there, so check out literary listings. That's my top tip. That's great. That's awesome. Well, hopefully I get to see you at a festival soon, Madeleine. Yes, I know. One day we'll be, uh, invited together doing the book deal podcast episode. Why? How fun would that be? Did you hear that festival directors

Tina Strachan:

we're available

Madeleine Cleary:

for gigs? That's right. We should pitch that. Oh, that's something we could do. Let's, let's put that on our vision board, Tina. Mm-hmm. Okay, let's do it. I love it. Alright, talk soon. See you. Bye.

Tina Strachan:

Thank you for listening to the Book Deal podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to the pod so you can receive updates as soon as our new EPS drop and to keep up to date with what the pod is doing. You can also find us on Instagram.