2026 writing goals, journaling, royalty statements explained, and 'what is rest?'

Tina Strachan, Madeleine Cleary, and Natasha Rai return for the 2026 edition of The Book Deal podcast. They reflect on their successful live podcast event with Hayley Scrivenor, their plans to spotlight debut authors, and Natasha’s upcoming panel discussion. The hosts share their personal writing journeys, including Tina’s plans following the launch of her third book in the Wilder Zoo series, Madeleine’s approach to writing her third book, and Natasha’s insights from working at a bookstore. They delve into the importance of rest, setting intentions for the year, and offer industry insights on royalty statements.

00:00 Introduction to the Book Deal Podcast
01:17 Reflecting on Last Year's Highlights
02:04 Exciting Plans for 2026
04:09 Tina's Upcoming Book Launch
09:10 Journaling and Creative Processes
20:17 Madeleine's New Creative Project
23:24 Removing Word Count Pressure
24:05 Shifting from Word Count to Time Goals
24:40 The Importance of Word Count for New Writers
25:44 Introducing Lauren Novak and Her Book 'Meltdown'
27:19 Understanding Royalty Statements
29:29 The Impact of Bookstore Discounts on Royalties
32:35 Supporting Independent Bookstores
35:34 Experiences Working in a Bookshop
38:10 The Concept of Rest and Self-Care
47:48 Setting Goals and Intentions for the Year
50:36 Conclusion and Farewell

Join our Patreon community for less than the cost of a coffee per month and support the pod! Your contribution will go to directly paying our sound producer, Brogan, and to help us bring you the conversations with industry professionals you love.

Follow The Book Deal podcast on Instagram The Book Deal podcast (@the_book_deal_podcast) • Instagram photos and videos

You can find out more about Tina, Madeleine and Natasha and follow their journeys here:

Tina Strachan (@td_strachan) • Instagram photos and videos
Tina Strachan children's book author
Madeleine Cleary (@madeleineclearywrites) • Instagram photos and videos
Madeleine Cleary | Author
Natasha Rai (@raiwriting) • Instagram photos and videos
Natasha Rai | Author | Mentor

If you want to stay in the know, sign up to Madeleine, Tina and Natasha's newsletters for the latest news first.
Madeleine: Subscribe here...

Transcript

Tina Strachan: 0:09

This is the Book Deal podcast where you will discover the inspiring stories behind your favorite books.

Natasha Rai: 0:15

We interview seasoned and debut authors, as well as publishing industry professionals to bring you the best tips and advice on

Madeleine Cleary: 0:22

how to get that elusive book deal. So no matter what's. Stage of writing your at. We've got you covered. I'm Tina Strachan I'm Madeleine Cleary. And I'm Natasha Rai And join us as we pull back the curtain of published authors one deal at a time. The book Deal podcast acknowledges the traditional owners, the land and waters, which it's recorded on and pays respect to their elders past, present, and emerging.

Tina Strachan: 0:56

Welcome back to the book Deal 2026 Edition. Our next season, um, Madeleine Natasha, how, how are you? Hello. Hi. So good to see you both. Yeah. So good to see you. And we're not gonna talk about the weather. Are we, we always talk about the weather when we first start. Do we? No, let's not do that. Although we kind of did. So moving past the weather, it's been a little while, hasn't it? It's been, we finished off last year with a bang with our, um, live. Podcast recording. Yeah. With the incredible Hayley Scrivenor um, at, uh, writing New South Wales. How, how much fun was that? That was so good. That was so good. I know we're gonna have to do it again, I think this year. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. We'll have to, we've got a whole year to think about who our agony Aunt Shelby for. Yeah. For our end of season. I think we make that a, a routine Right. Our end of season live chat. I agree. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was so much fun. It was so much fun to meet our, some of our listeners, uh, some of, and the writing New South Wales crew. I hadn't met them before, so that was. Great. And of course we all got together in person, so that's just a good excuse to do it again. No, and, and we got to meet like some of the debut crew in Sydney and the debut 2026 crew, so yes. That was really cool. So exciting. What an exciting year for the debut 2026 crew. I know. And we get to spotlight them again this year, which is good. All the debut. So everyone will start to hear a little bit about the books coming out this year. So I'm very excited to hear and read and listen. And I know Tash, you've got plans, don't you, with the 2020 Sixers? Yes. Yes. Um, is that top secret? Not really. It's gonna be a little panel discussion and it's gonna be a before and after. Ooh. I dunno why I said it in that squeaky way, but Yeah. Just, it's intriguing. Exactly. I just,'cause I, I'm so fascinated by a writer's journeys like. Just to get a glimpse of what it felt like before and then after.'cause I know that I just feel like me and cool things have happened, but I just love hearing that shift or whatever, you know, that experience. So I'm really excited. We should one day listen back to our old episodes because we've really recorded our before and after on this podcast, haven't we? World. That's true. Yeah. We're anxious about, and if we're still anxious about the same things, compare that. Mm-hmm. I think that would be cool. Well, we should put that. Why don't, why don't we do a catch up? We just spend like a whole day listening to ourselves talk. Sounds, sounds great. Oh. But it will be really fun to go and, um, uh, revisit that and see what we were thinking and feeling like you said. Mm-hmm. Yeah, because it feels, I'm actually doing, I did a similar, I'm gonna be releasing my in February, a similar episode where,'cause I interviewed Mark MPO Russell and Ally Parker over a year ago now, um, about their first books. And now they've subsequently published their second book. So, talking about, so the feels about what it's like to publish your second book.'cause I think everyone assumes you know what you're doing mm-hmm. After you do your first one. Mm-hmm. Uh, but that might not always be the case, so, Nope. Mm. So interesting. And I'm sure it's different. The, the fields are different and the experience is different and yeah. You not, I guess, do kind of know what's coming, but also that can completely change. Mm. Yeah. And you are about to publish your third book, Tina. Oh my gosh. Literally. And this Wednesday. So the day, the day before this episode. Yes. When this episode airs, it will. Be out in the world. Gosh. Yeah. Very exciting. Yeah, so that's the third installment of the Wilder Zoo Series, Neeka and the great search is called, and it's been super fun, um, and super fun to play with this one as well. Um, and I have a really, um, fun launch for the book. Actually. If anybody's on the Gold Coast on the 7th of February, it will be held at Currumbin Wildlife Hospital. Because the third book, um, middle grade obviously, uh, as if anybody's read any of the others about a girl who lives in a zoo. But in this third one, there's a lot to do with the wildlife, uh, with a wildlife hospital, uh, in this book. And so it's gonna be lots of fun. Um, in the book, they are looking for a, um, a world, uh, a lost little world koala Joey. So, um, I have the. The Koala research team from bin there as well. And they will be, um, yeah, doing little chat and a little demonstration along with their detection dog as well, which is gonna show us how he, how he helps to find the koalas in the wild. So, lots of fun. Lots of fun things playing Amazing. Yes. And only a few tickets left, if anything. So have you been kind of busy with all of that, of the last few weeks? Do you know? Like I have. Yeah, that feels like, like. I'm an, as I've said before, an everyday writer, but, and it's still, you know, all this, all the author, admin as we know is quite big. Um, but all of this planning for the release as well has, so I've been doing that instead of actually getting words down. Um, but it's the, I just have to because I just don't have time to do, but, but, uh, yeah, it's been super fun and you know, as you know, in that pre-launch periods. You know, you get on the socials a little bit more and mm-hmm. You know, kind of get out there a little bit more'cause you know, people are posting things and, and you wanna share that. And that's really lovely. And I've been doing some workshops in the school holidays as well, which has been, uh, really cool at Brisbane libraries. And, um, yeah, it's just. It's a really busy time, isn't it? Mentally and and physically. So do you feel refreshed though, even though you've been so busy? Do you feel ready? Yeah, I think I feel ready. I think it's come up pretty quickly. Can't believe we were having this conversation a year ago about the first one coming out, you know? And so now here we are. So for all those, all those new authors who have signed and your release date is like two years away. Never fear the two years actually go super quickly and before you know it, it is upon you. So. So, yeah, no, it's been, it's been super fun. But luckily, uh, you know, we've just had a, a big break from the podcast, although we've been, and we got to catch up over the summer as well, which was nice. I know, you know, in person. Mm-hmm. Tash, we missed you. I know. I had serious fomo. I know. And you were not replaced by Emma Gold did also join us Tash for that lunch, um, which was really lovely. To catch up with Ima as well and have a chat, all things podcasty and, and um, books and all that sort of thing. And we were laughing because it was a, it was a warm day, I think when we caught up. Mm. Uh, down on the Mornington Peninsula. And, um, I said to Ima and Tina, come on, let's go for a swim. You know, jump in the, in the bait. Beautiful. Both of them looked like I was like an insane person. Because it was not, it was like maybe 27 or 28 degrees, but still quite warm. And so yeah, both of them just abandoned me for their, you know, whatever. And so I went in by myself, had a swim. It's gorgeous. Yes, we both, we both need it to be a little bit warmer than that before we go diving. Diving in the water, but it would've come with refreshing. Surely would you have come with me? I might have gone half deep squealed and won back out. You're all weak. The only way to do it, I know we're we're not as. Tough as those Melbourne is, but, uh, but I did manage to get into the bay, so it was lovely. But yes, we did have a catch up. Uh, but apart from that, we've, we haven't recorded for a couple of months, which is pretty crazy. But this, you know, we did replay some of our past most popular episodes, um, from the book deal as well, which was really great and that. Like, everyone seemed to really enjoy them as well, and even for us to have a little listen back and, um, that was really fun as well. So I'm keen to see what our summer season will be at the end of this year. What our, we, because we have some amazing, uh, authors and interviews coming up, don't we? It's very exciting. We do. It's gonna be a big year. I'm very excited about this year. Yes. Mm-hmm. Lots of fun guests, but we'll keep it at top secret for now. Yeah. Except for little hints we've given. Mm-hmm. That's right. No, it's, it starts off huge too, so that will be, that's fun and I can't wait to share that with everybody, but, but I wanna know what you ladies have done, uh, over the break. It's been a lot. It has been Christmas and, um, and a lot of break, just writing as well, so it's, so, so let me know. Tash, can I start with you? What have you been up. Um, so I have been really doing things a little bit differently start of this year. So I'm on a deadline for book two. So I've been working on structurals, which is very different this time around to onslaught. Um, it feels harder because. I dunno. It's just a different book and I'm struggling with parts of it that I know I'm quite right and I don't really know how to fix it. So I'm waiting for my editor to step in at some point and. Once the deadline, once we get to the deadline and we can have a chat about that also. It's a different editor for me'cause um, last for Onslaught, um, the editor that I was working with, um, had to leave after the Pantera acquisition. So I have a different editor who's lovely. Um, but it's also our first time working together. So there's all these firsts, even though it's a second book. Um. A couple of things that I'm doing is I'm, I brought a notebook and I've started writing in it. Um, initially I, I, I was thinking about writing in it every day, but that felt like a chore. So I decided just to write when I feel like it. And it's been amazing because I've been making these connections around random things that I. Maybe if I wasn't paying attention, I would've missed, and, and these ideas are percolating for like a book idea that I can't quite grasp, but they're there and I can feel it. And it's really cool. And I, and my intention is that maybe at the end of the year I'll go back and read over. Look back at some of the entries and see what still speaks to me. Um, and the other thing that I've been doing is I've been reading The Luminous Solution by Charlotte Wood. Mm-hmm. That's a great book. Yeah. Oh my God. So I just read this, the essay she's written about how writers write basically, and this idea about writers create a problem. First that they need to solve, that they're not just answering a question or solving a problem that already exists. They're creating. And for some reason that has just fired me up because for so long I'm like, what do, what do I do? Like, what is my process? And that just spoke so deeply to what I do because she's right. I've been calling it a question, so it doesn't matter. It is a question. But I've been coming up with questions that. Exist in different ways, but don't exist in the way that I think about it. And then I find the answer, which of course makes it hugely interesting and creative, but also really difficult. Mm-hmm. Um, so these questions are for your, the book that you're writing now. Yeah. So, yeah. So she was saying that they did this study a while ago and they, it was about artists and artists. Were given something to look at and then paint it or interpret it. And she said the artists that just interpreted it directly from what they were, they could see were great. They were fine. Um, and then there were artists who looked at it and looked at it and considered it and thought about it and then went and did something with it. And she was saying that apparently when they looked at these artists again a few years later, the ones who were really thinking about it and doing problem solving exercise first had longer or had. Like longevity in their creative careers or flow. And again, she's not saying one is better than the other. It's just interesting. So. Dunno, problem solving. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. As a problem solvers. And I think that ly really resonates with me. Like, you know, writing sort of crime. That is problem solving, isn't it, literally. Exactly, exactly. You run into an object and you've gotta go through. But the thing is thing, and also though Mads, like you are the one creating the problem, the crime, right? Yes, yes. Like, it's not something you already know about that you're trying to work out. You're like, what would happen if this person and this, yeah. Yeah. That's, yeah. It's funny mindset. But the writing,'cause you, when you said you got a notebook, so you're writing the hand. Pen. Yes. Paper. It. I, yeah, a hundred percent. And we've spoken about it before on the podcast. It absolutely, um, and I can attest to this myself, just helps with that problem solving. Like I've, I do it, sometimes I do it if I'm just like trying to get an idea down. But if I have a problem as well or I can't, or I think this is just. Kind of isn't working. Even if I just get a pen and a notebook and I just start writing and it's, and it's rubbish. A lot of it's rubbish and it's unreadable and you know, I'll probably never go back and read it again. But the fact that I just, the process of writing it down, just writing all the words in, but what if this happens and then this, but then how come about this? Like, it just seems to work. It's like untangles on, on the page, even not just. Like writing down and trying to problem solve. Even just writing down like what Tasha was saying, observations of things. Yeah. And and it's sometimes that you don't know what purpose or direction they have, but Exactly. They there at least it's really cool. That is cool. It's really cool. And Tasha, it's interesting because, um, maybe, maybe it's like a New Year's thing. Maybe it's like this New Year's resolution.'cause I, um, Ali Parker got for Christmas for me, a journal, um, like a, like a real. Live journal book, which I've, and I've never really journaled before. Mm-hmm. Um, and I thought, oh, well I'm gonna write down something that interests me. Um, and my day-to-day life doesn't really interest me, even though I think it, I should be writing it down, but it just doesn't interest me in the same way. So I was like, oh, well what interests me is at the moment is, um, trying to document all my memories from when I lived in China.'cause I really regret not. Journaling while living in China.'cause that I was living a very interesting life there. Yeah. And so I've been every day and doing this every day and it hasn't felt like a chore. Tash. Like it's, I'm excited to sit down and just do like my one to two pages. Um, and that's been a joy. And it, and you're right Tina, the writing feels different as well because you can't go back and edit. It exactly. You know, computer and I loved it. Yeah. It unlocked something. And you know what else is really cool as well? Like, I've been experimenting more with, when I go for a walk, when I'm out, not to listen to music or a podcast.'cause that's my go-to uhhuh. Mm-hmm. The scraps of conversation that I've overheard are fascinating. Fascinating. Yeah. Yeah. And it just, that's what like, it's just as soon as you start paying attention, there's just stuff everywhere in a way that. I don't know. It's not even about a book idea. It's just speaking to some curious part of me, or inspirational part of me or whatever, and it's just, I'm really enjoying it. Yes. Do you, do you find, like, this is for me when I've, I've learned when I go walking, yeah. And I try and avoid like listening or music or whatever, I have to walk for an hour before my brain finally starts to think and problem solve, like through plot stuff.'cause sometimes I'll go out with the purpose of. Thinking through my book. Mm-hmm. And, but my brain's like thinking about birds and trees and like random boring stuff. And then after an hour it's like, ooh, bang. And here we go. Here's the, here's the problem solving happening. Maybe the novelty of the walk, the birds and the trees and stuff we ha has to wear off a little bit before your brain can then get, can sink into, into, and there'd be some biological reason for that neuroscientist. Purely nervous system perspective. If you're feeling a bit wound up or you're feeling like you need to get out and walk, uh, the walking and the, the movement of the blood and all of that, it's, um, sending signals about activation. So once the activation comes down, it's like a braking system, like in a car where you go out, you're bit revved up, and the walking in itself is like a break and you start to notice your environment and that's another type of break. And then once you're starting to really. Leave things behind. It taps into a different part of your system, which enables creative flow. It's really Tash. She always has the insights. Madeleine, doesn't she? I love it. I love the insights. That's amazing. Wish be bloody paying you for this, this wonderful, you know what's hilarious? Um, we have not spoken about us all journaling or anything. Have we before, but I too also have just bought a journal. Oh my God, that's so good. With the intent, with the intent, um, to journal. I actually, I actually looked online and I was like, I, I want some kind of enviro one that I can keep re like refilling something. I want it to be like, you know, environmentally conscious. I don't know. I, you know, why not? And I ended up ordering it and it came from, it ended up coming from the uk, which probably, I didn't know. I, I thought it was coming from Australia anyway, so that probably, um, wipes out the enviro part of it. But, but, um, it's really cool because it's, it's not just a diary, but it obviously, but it's, it's got all these. It kind of prompts and things in there as well. It's got some, I just wanted something that had a little bit of a space for putting goals in as well. Mm-hmm. I, I think that was kind of what I mostly wanted it for. I wanted to, I still wanted to plan my week'cause my week's hectic and is time boxed to the tea mostly. And um, but I wanted some space to also track, um, yeah, goals and almost every day kind of go, what are you doing today to meet your goal? Or what have you done today? Maybe I even put a word count in there. Maybe just something to, to really get into, um, the writing and, you know, and, and all the other. Parts of being an author, like I'd really like to do more, uh, workshops or speaking or festivals and things like that. And so, so what have I done to progress that? Have I entered a competition? Um, have I pitched to a festival? Just something like that because the days do just get away from me when they're so busy. And I just wanted someone to document all that because yeah, like, so it's, it's probably, it, it sounds like we're all doing different, a different way of doing it, doing journaling and um, but it's still sort of. Um, I guess inspiring ideas and, and our writing and, and I think you, who knows what's gonna happen once we start it? Maybe I will start writing a little bit more. I'm very much more of a dot pointer. But anyway, I'll, um, I'll see how it goes, but. That's so funny that we've all just started to think about journaling. And I have read, you know, I've been listening to lots of podcasts recently, and so many people have been talking about journaling as well. So maybe it's a little bit of a something in the, in the, um, in the air at the moment and beginning of the year. Right. That's probably when lots of people. Start getting a journal, but, and it's not scrolling. I think that's the most important thing. It's a time to just get off the tech, even just to get off your laptop.'cause sometimes I find it really difficult to jump from like day job work, which is purely on a laptop and computer, and then just jump into writing, which is also on a laptop. Mm-hmm. And I don't know, it's just nice to just pick up and do some writing that's different. And that's. Very tactile and Yes. Yes. And it helps your brain focus a little bit. It's a nice sort of dip. So yeah, I think it's lovely. Mm-hmm. And it could almost, it's creativity as well, isn't it? Like it's sparking that. Oh yeah. Creative side.'cause I am, I'm just about to go out and buy some brand new pens today for, for it. I'm kind of just, I'm really getting in the, in the vibe of it. Um, and making it like a little bit of a ritual. You know, this is, I'm gonna take this time and sit down. Start, you know, right when I've got no interruptions and, and all those, you're manifesting Tina by ing by putting your goals into the world. That's right. That's right. Yes. Yes. Madeleine, can we have a little bit of update of what you've been working on? I've had a pretty glorious summer. Um, it's been really lovely. It's just been quiet and, you know, lots of gardening and. Relaxing. And, um, I might've mentioned that I've started a new creative project. So this will be, I think, book three. Um, I hope. Um, and a year ago I had started writing this novel and had written about 45,000 words and then put it down and then. In sort of Easter, I started again, wrote 10,000 words and then put it down. Um, uh, and I scrapped all those previous words as well. And then, so I felt a bit anxious about starting this project, but I'd saved it up for summer'cause I knew I'd be, it was a quiet time and gimme some time to think. And so, um, and do you know, interestingly, with this, so I'm up to about 10,000 words again. I'm just going, for me, this is slow. So it's been a couple of months, um, but I've done away with word. Targets, like word counts. Normally I'm a, you know, if I'm writing new words, I want minimum a thousand words per day. Like, that's what I wanna do every single day. Um, that's how I write. Um, but for this book, I can't do that because, uh, I think I'm just spending more time with the characters and I've got an ensemble cast, so I, I just feel like I need to first. Learn who they all are and how they're interacting with each other and they, and their relationships and how they affect one another. Before I just start writing a thousand words per day, which is what I had done for the first time, few times I've started. So it's, it's a different book. This is a really different book to what I've written previously, and so it's almost like I'm trying to learn and teach myself how to write this before I. Go forth again, and it's much better and I'm enjoying it and I'm really, really liking it. And yeah, it's been really fun. So yeah, different process to what I normally do. I don't know if, yeah, if you guys have ever done that. It's really hard to write ensemble cast though, and I'm, I've been struggling, but it's been a good problem. Solving exercise. I think that makes sense. If it's taking a little bit longer and ensemble cast, there's a lot of characters to, to flesh out and think about. Yes. And yeah, that's a really interesting process I think. I agree. I think every book I writes different ends up. I mean, I think I start the same process, but they just all end up maybe a little bit different for whatever reason. But that's an interesting process. You are, I mean, I guess some people do. They take the time at the beginning to do like character, full character sketches almost where they questions. I can't do that. I haven't done that before either. But you know, I guess that's, this is maybe your sort of version of it. You're kind of sitting there and thinking about them, but you're not doing like a full question and answer thing for your characters, but, but you're getting into their world in, in that way. Yes. And I think for me, doing away with the word count just puts the'cause I think I always do that as my measure of. Success. That's always like my measure of progress and success and because I'm like. Doing words, but then I'm actually removing them and then having side conversations that might probably not end up in the book. And that's my sort of process I thought just to remove that and that will put less pressure on me and stress, and I don't even check now the words I'm doing. Like I don't check I every day, like back in the other manuscripts. Check my total word count and then measure my success by what the word count ends at the end of the day. And now I don't do that. And that's been, I don't, yeah. So I, I think it's at 10,000, it might be more, might be less. I don't even actually really think about it. And Wow, that's been amazing. Yeah. So that's nice. So maybe it's more of a time thing. So instead of checking off 10,000 words every day, it's, I've spent an hour or two hours on this because the thinking and the writing and then deleting is all part of. Progressing, which sounds strange, sometimes deleted. No, but it's true. Without the word is progressing, but yeah. But it is because I was just thinking about that and yeah, I definitely have time goals, like the word count. Just hearing you as described that I was feeling a little stressed. I was like, I was just imagining myself set like I imagining setting a word. Count goal for myself. And I was like, actually, no. In the old, not old days, in the early days of writing like a first novel, I think that was really important to me. But now I think I've definitely shifted into time, like if I can devote this much time today onto that, that feels good. Mm-hmm. And I just feel relaxed. You're saying that, and maybe it's because. We can do this because we know we have done it before. Exactly. We can actually write a novel. Whereas I think when you're first writing your first novel, you actually don't know if you can do it. Mm-hmm. And so having a word count goal is useful because you can then see that progress and it helps keep you accountable and all that kind of stuff. Mm-hmm. And I suppose word count also might be useful if you're feeling a little blocked or you're not sure how to progress things and you think, well, if I can write the 500 words today, then that feels better. Yeah. You feel like you've hit the goal, but I guess the, as long as you don't beat yourself up and feel terrible if you don't hit that goal Exactly as well. Yeah. Yeah, because that, I mean, we do this for, for the joy of it and yeah, it's been really lovely. Hi, I'm Lauren Novak, author of Meltdown, why Motherhood Makes us Angry and What to do about it. Mum Rage, as you may have heard it called, came as a surprise to me when I had my first child. But it turns out that feeling furious with our partners, our kids, even ourselves, is an almost universal experience in motherhood, is just that no one warns us. So after 20 years working as a journalist and at least six, working as a mom, I've drawn on my experiences and those of hundreds of other moms to break down the taboo around anger in motherhood. In Meltdown, you'll find real stories from other families and insights from a survey of more than 200 women. My Angry Mom's Club, I've interviewed top psychologists, gps and experts in nutrition, sleep parenting, and more to glean their best advice. The result is part memoir, part journalism, part self-help offering practical advice on coping with everything from the hormonal rollercoaster and sleep deprivation of early motherhood to juggling paid work and the infuriating inequality of the household mental load with a mix of humor, understanding, and insight. I hope Meltdown gives, expecting parents the warning I never had. And reassures those of you already in the trenches, that getting mad doesn't make you a bad mom. If you are not the only one losing the plot, and it's time we started talking about it, published by Harper Collins on the 28th of January. Meltdown is available now in stores and online. Thanks so much for listening. Now back to the fabulous book deal podcast. And then the other interesting thing that's happened was, was I got my first royalty statement at the end of December. Um, and for this, so this was for the butterfly women. Um, and it's, it, it's, it was so interesting. I learned so much. Like, I thought I knew a lot about this because I've done like a lot of, you know, these podcasts and we've talked about it. But yeah, it was so interesting. So. What I discovered from that, so basically for, and this is different for every publisher, but for a firm, you get paid your royalties based on the months of, between March and September, and then you get paid in December, and then from the months September to March, you then get paid in June. So there's like a three month delay and it's over six month lease. Um, and. Interestingly, it broke down the, so the sales and the sales are sales that a affirm have sold into bookstores, not people buying books from the bookshops. And that's. Um, very much the same for every publisher. So what you see on your royalty statement is actually the books sold into bookshops, not books that have been bought. Um, and, and they, and Affirm and all publishers will withhold a proportion. It's generally like 25 or 30% of your first royalty statement to cover any possible returns.'cause bookstores can return, have up to 12 months to return the books. So it's, yeah, which is quite significant actually. Like that's a quite a significant proportion of your statement. And they can, I checked the contract, I didn't actually realize this. They can withhold that for up to, and including two royalty statements, which actually means you might not see anything until the third. So that could be another year from now, which, um, is, I mean, and that's probably fair enough because yeah, if retailers can. Return them within the 12 month period. It could happen at any time. And then, you know, they have to, publisher has to cover themselves. And then the other interesting thing was the, so the statement broke down the sales into bookstores. And I'm just talking about print books here, um, by discount level. And so your. What you receive is going to be different, um, depending on what, uh, terms they have with the individual bookstores. So, for example, if they sold to bookstores, um, at full price, so 34 point 99 RRP, with like a 50% discount, which is pretty standard then. We get 10% of that. So that's pretty standard. So you're getting about like for a average book, like$3 50 or something per book. Um, but, and this is for me, my, the largest proportion of my bookstore, uh, book retailer sales was in the high discount. So this is 55% or more. And that's mace basically your big. You know, big doubles and possibly airports and things like that. Um, and that's where the majority of my sales went to, which is interesting. I mean, it's probably around 55% of the sales. Um, and you get, I calculated it, it's like maybe a dollar 50 per book. Mm. For each of those books because you're getting the, um, 10% of the net receipts. So 10% of whatever. You know, you publish your, and that's based on your price. So if you, for your, your RRP for your book. So all, all books have, you know, different prices? Uh, no, not based on the RRP. It's actually based on what the publisher gets from their network. Sorry. I mean, every, every book has a different RRP, so, so I'm just saying, so when you said a dollar 50, that was based on your RRP, so anybody else? No, no. So it's actually based on the 10% of the net receipts the publisher receives. So, um, this is the bit that I learned. So for example, if your book, um, is, you know, discounted at like, so it's, okay, so say it's 34.99 and the publisher gives a 55% discount to Big W or whatever. So then they, so the publisher will receive, um, I've just done the 55%. Um, so the publisher will receive about$16. Prop for that. Mm-hmm. So big W's paying them$16 and then you get 10% off that. Yes. Sorry. So what I was saying, so my RRP is like 16 9 9, so they're not getting$16 for that. No. So it will be different for that book, correct. Because it will be, yeah. Adult book. Yeah. So depending on your RRP. Like, I'm not getting a dollar 50 for my Big W book. No, no. Correct. That's right. Yeah. So it's so it's a bit, yeah. It depends on your different for kids, but yeah, for like the standard adult book you're getting, so, so there's actually like a$2 difference between a. So this is really interesting. Mm. If someone's buying your book from Big W, someone's buying your book from an indie bookstore, you're getting about$2 less per book. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Which is actually quite significant if you add it up. Yeah. So do encourage everyone to shop at independent book shops. Yeah. Yeah. And even your dimers and others who are not possibly getting that high discount. Um, I mean, of course it's great. Big W is amazing for getting books out there. Shifts a lot of numbers. It does shift. Lot of numbers shifts. It does, yeah. So anyway, I thought that's interesting. It is interesting. Yeah. I learn a lot. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.'cause it is, when you do get your royalty statement, there's a lot of lines on it and sometimes it's a little bit hard to understand. So, so yeah, that's really helpful. And remembering that I think if you are confused, definitely ask questions of your publisher as well. They're really happy to answer anything and affirm like I had a couple of questions and they were immediately responded and were fantastic. Yeah. Um, yeah, so do, do ask questions if you are confused, but just get prepped in your mind as well for that. If you are kind of a commercial fiction book. It's likely you're gonna see that kind of similar proportions as well. Like that's, it's just interesting. Thank you for explaining that Mads.'cause it is really confusing, isn't it? It is, it is. And I think maybe, I hope I didn't get anything wrong, but I think it's just good that, you know, authors share and talk about this stuff too because, um, you know, it is confusing and, it's really interesting. I just find it interesting. And I was in a bookstore the other day, uh, chatting to the lovely ladies there and they were just boxing up all their books for return. And I found a little bit sad seeing them all go back, but I mean, they will all hopefully find homes elsewhere. Um, but, and I mean, a lot of them were Christmas stock as well. Mm. Obviously the stores, they, they're so small, they only have minimal shelf space, so, you know, those, those books just. Hopefully just go back and sing in the Warehouse till the next Christmas. Um, but yeah, it was a little bit sad to see them all go all, all go back. But yeah, just it's limited space on the shelf and yeah, I'm talking boxes and boxes and boxes of them were going back. Um, and you know, they were saying that some publishers don't pay for. Those returns either. So, you know, that's another thing that could be working against books being stopped in the stores. Um, because it's a gamble for this. What do you mean not being paid for? Like shipping costs? Some, some publishers will assist with the shipping costs back to the store, uh, back to the warehouse. Um, but some don't. And so that's just another thing that, you know, small bookstores have to think about when they are, you know, ordering in boxes, you know? Their, um, budgets are so tight and can they then afford to send these books back if they don't sell? Mm-hmm. Um, it's almost costing them money for, for books that don't sell. So, yeah, it's a lot. Um, there's a lot that our indie bookstores have to, um, work against. So yes, definitely support them where you can, I think is a, is a good message here. And Tasha, you've been working at the book shop too? Oh yes. It's been, I've only done a few shifts, but um, hopefully there'll be more coming. It's been. Just even in the, those few shifts, eye opening, like for me personally. Firstly, getting to know different writer names, like seeing what's what on like,'cause shelving, I never knew, I'd say this shelving has proving to be one of the greatest delights of my life because not only is it meditative, like I'm just seeing all these names that I'm unfamiliar with, especially kid Lit Ya and things like fantasy. I'm like, oh, okay. These are'cause especially the bookshop that I'm working in, roaring Stories in Balme, which is an amazing little independent bookshop. Their shelf space is tiny like, so, um, the owner, Dan has to really think about the stock that he is ordering in and just him explaining to me his thinking is, is just fascinating, like in terms of what he's ordering. So that's been amazing. And also just seeing what people buy and, um, all my nerd fantasies have come true because when I went in to work there, I was hoping. And hoping that people would come in to say things like, help me choose a book. I don't know what to read. And that has happened quite a few times. And I reckon I'm more excited than my customers because of like one time this woman was like, oh, so what if I don't like it? I'm like, yes, come back. Talk to me. We'll chat about why you don't like it. And she was like, oh, okay. But I'm just having the best time. I'm having the best time. And it's just a side of the industry or side of the process that. I haven't got to experience till now. You know that book selling, it's really fun the way you're talking about it. You've just lit up Tash. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I can see this is, this is like your Ikigai your joy there. Yes. It's So hold onto that. Yeah. Oh, that's incredible. And some incredible insights too, isn't it? You're like a full circle author. You understanding it from all the, do you miss it? Madeleine? Oh, so much. When you're talking and when you've sent a few messages through, I've just so, so jealous. Like I really want to go back and dive in and jump in and do that. Oh, alas, the public service though. Oh well. Um, so that was an extra thing that you did over the break. Yes. I thought you said you didn't do all that much, but I do wanna ask, I do wanna ask something, um, about, because it does sound otherwise, like you ladies had some time to relax and rest during that time and. That sounds amazing and it's something that I would like to know more about because, um, I have a little bit of extra time now, um, uh, up my, up my sleeve. And one thing, and another thing with the journal is I thought I'd even try and put something in every day. Like, what have I done? Um, maybe like self-care, like some, and Tash have really inspired me about, you know, trying to know when to rest and when to relax. When you need to rest. And I thought maybe I can even just hold myself accountable by sort of writing something every day or at least every other day that I've done to switch off for a second.'cause I, I don't have much switch off time. Um, and as I think I think about that, I actually think, I don't even know. What it is to rest or to rest. Like I, I'm not sure I, I even know what to do. And so I was really keen to, uh, to chat to you both about what you do for rest and, um, and if you have any tips or suggestions for me would be great. I mean, I think rest just looks different for everyone. Mm. Um, what works for one person, what work for another at the most? For me, the most basic, fundamental level is. What can I do or what will now, for this moment, even if it's 10 minutes or an hour or a whole day, take demand off me. Mm-hmm. That's, that's my question when I go into rest. So if I'm feeling depleted and I need to just feel inspired or fed in some way, I will read. Mm-hmm. Um, if I need to just be on my own, I'll go for a walk. Um, the thing with like, I know a lot of people use social media or watching a show. They're all great. That's fine if that's what you need, but I guess I like to just check in with myself after. If I've watched a show that I've watched a billion times and it's my comfort show, after an episode, after a couple of episodes, I'll just check in with myself. Like, has this just taken me away from something that's uncomfortable and distracted me or has it actually helped me calm down? Or feel, feel relaxed. And if it feels like I'm still a bit agitated, then what I've done is just, just distracted myself. Mm-hmm. And then I will, um, figure out what it is I need. So I know for me, rest usually looks like a lot of reading, a lot of reflection, and a, and writing. Like, I can spend hours, like if I have a Sunday to myself the entire day, I'll spend. Some of it reading in bed, some of it reading on the couch. And at the end of the day, I feel so full in a good way. And I feel like, ah, now I can go back out in the world and do whatever I need to. Mm-hmm. And rest can also mean walking. Rest can mean running. Rest can mean exercise for some people. Mm-hmm. And for others it can mean going and having a nap or Yeah. Cooking or cleaning. As long as it's not distracting. I think that's the, that's the thing that I think is, can be confusing because people. Might use it as a distraction and feel like it's doing something for them. And that's the checking in afterwards. Mm-hmm. I like that. I think that's a great advice and, and that sort of, um, questioning and checking in with yourself, it sounds really important as well. Like, why am I feeling this need for rest? What factors are around me that's sort of stressing me or giving me stress and what can I get do to help bolster myself? Yeah. To be able to manage that because it's oftentimes you can't get rid of those stresses. It might be like family or work. S like other things, but what can I do to build myself up and give me that resilience and strength to, to persevere? Yeah. And was it you that's talked about time and how it's not about. Trying to keep away from something or spending less time doing something, it's, what are you devoting your time to? It was you that said that, right? Yes. Yes. What, what are you giving your time to? And this was because I did some training on time management as part of like a course I did at work. And, um, they were talking about this. CEO. She's incredibly busy. She's got a family and she runs a business. And um, and someone called her and she was actually hiking upper a mountain. It was like midweek, you know, during the week and she was spending a couple of hours hiking and um, and she spoke about that as an example instead of. Like, yes, the time that she took to hike took away from her business and her family and all that kind of stuff, but she actually sees time as something you give to, and in that moment, she wanted to give time to, to going outdoors and in nature and, and enjoy that rather than feeling stressed about what it took away from, she's thinking more positively about what it. Ever since you told me that, that has really shifted a lot of things for me. So now, for example, because I know rest can be really hard for people in terms of what am I not doing now? I'm like, you know what, this is what I'm choosing to do. It's what I'm devoting my, I'm giving my time to this. So that's helped me a lot value. I'm not thinking about what's taking it away from Yeah, yeah, yeah. And value it as importantly as all those other things that you have on your list. Yeah. It's like that saying, um. Uh, you should, you should meditate for one hour every day. But if you are really busy, you should meditate for two. Yes. It's like, yes, because what you know, and meditate slash rest, you know, it doesn't have to be one hour or two hours, but if, if you are super busy and you are super stressed, you actually need it more. Maybe Yes, it is kind of what it's saying.'cause then it helps. Yes, it takes away from that time, your productivity time we shall say. But it will increase your productivity during the time that you do have. So it, so it works out better. Yes. It's just gonna look different for you, Tina. Yeah, I mean for me, and this is something that I've done and practiced for the last four weeks probably.'cause the weather's also really nice, is, um, like staying in bed and reading actually. Doesn't sound restful to me, which is so interesting. Um, because I would get agitated that I haven't gotten up, made the bed, done stuff, like I have this product. Like, I'm like, I've gotta, you know, get up. And that's just, I've just learned that that's actually part of me. Like, I tried doing that recently, just, oh, you know what? Spend time in your pajamas, don't shower. Just stay in bed and read. And I was like, no, actually it doesn't work for me. So instead, I. Well, my rest looks like getting up in the morning and going into the garden for just a couple of hours and I potter around. I pull up some weeds, I do some watering, I imagine like what I wanna do, and I just sort of, you know, do that. I have my cup of tea, then I shower and then I can sit on the couch and read. For the rest of the day, like that's my dream day. And that's what I was doing over Christmas, new Year. I was probably doing like two to three hours in the morning in the garden and then reading in the afternoon and napping, and that's like my ideal life. Sounds like a perfect day. That sounds like a perfect day. I think gardening is very meditative and um, um, yes. See, and, and that's the other thing. I hate gardening and. Because every time I get around plants, they die. So, uh, that's like, as you said, ma staying in bed readings doesn't sound good for you. Yeah. Going out in the garden, I'm like, oh god, no. Uh, so, so interesting. Okay. Alright, well I'm gonna report back and I'm gonna take notes in my journal of what I do in a day to just, yeah. Uh, what did you call it again? Um, take the demand off. Yes. I love that. Thank you. So Tina, why do you have so much time now? Oh, well, I don't. Time. Um, do I have so much time? Do you, because, you know, I fill it with stuff. Uh, it's very full-time still, but yes, I've just, uh, decided to, um, take a little bit more time, uh, from off of work to, I just, you know, life's just very busy and I'm very fortunate to be able to have that opportunity to do that. Um, so it's gonna be, you know, for a little while. I'm just gonna spend my time. Riding more and, um, spending time with the family because it's very busy and the kids are growing up so fast and I can see that flashing before my eyes. And I want to take a moment to, um, actually just sit. With that and appreciate them while they're, while they're so young and still, um, and still wanna hang out with me. I love that. That's really lovely. Yeah. That's beautiful. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, and I just, um, it's a little bit scary, uh, to take that step back from something that you've worked at for 20 years. Um, but, but I realize it's. It's still part, very much a part of me, whether I'm working in a day to day or not has influenced so much in my life. And, um, it that it's a bit scary, but I am, uh, I have full belief and faith in, um, whatever comes off this, uh, extra time that I have off, which I will be productive, but also resting. Which will increase my productivity, I'm sure. So yes, it's a very courageous thing to do. I think actually it's mm-hmm. It's the harder path because suddenly then you're, I don't know, there's, it's just, it's just, it's just different, isn't it? Your life looks different. Mm-hmm. Yes. How you, because I think you are a person too. You like structure and mm-hmm. And you like routine frameworks and processes and everything, and it's a lot of change. Yeah. A lot of change. Mm-hmm. That's right. Yeah. So it's gonna be exciting 2026 for all of us, I think. And, um, yeah, I look forward to checking in at the end of the year and seeing how, how we all went with our goals and our dreams and our writing for the year. Do you have writing goals? Um, yeah. I, I do. And they look very different for the last few years because obviously the Wild Zoo Series has. Just been deadlines for like the last three years. Um, and so it's a very exciting time to be able to just sit back and go, okay, what, like where are we going next? And what are we working on next? So, um, and I'm sure that the, the deadlines will come, but in that, in the time between now and then, I'm just gonna really enjoy playing with writing a little bit more.'cause it's a space we've not really been in for a little while, you know? Mm-hmm. Um. So I, I do, I have, I have some goals of, yeah, getting words down, uh, finishing things I've been working on, but also just, um, enjoying the other parts of, of Rider life, you know, the, um, doing presentations and, and talking to kids at the schools and, and things like that. But sort of connecting with, uh, community and readers is, is a big thing that I wanna. Focus on as well. What about you ladies? Should we set some goals and some intentions? I think, um, you know how lots of people do like a one word to describe one word as an intention for the year or something like that. And yes, I think I'm gonna go with, um, uh, uh, I should have thought about this a bit better. Maybe rest might be my word actually. For the year. And, um, yes, I've kind of, uh, explained what my, what my goals, I guess, for this year are. But what about you, um, Tash, what have you, what are your thoughts for the year, your intentions, if it comes down to one word, curiosity. Ooh, I love that. Curiosity. Okay, so we've got rest and curiosity. Mm-hmm. Did you, did you prep us for this, Tina? Not really. Come on, let's be on the spot. Oh my goodness. Um, maybe. I think maybe like something like, maybe a word like joy, because I think, um, for, I think with this book that I've been writing, it hasn't felt joyful, like the writing. Mm-hmm. And I think that was always the problem. And I'm, I'm just trying to reclaim that. Mm-hmm. Reclaim the joy. That's a little, yeah. That is a great, that's a great word. What great words I know. Rest, curiosity and joy. C and joy. Alright, so we encourage our listeners who haven't set their an intention for the year or a word for the year. Have a little think about that. And I guess just keep checking in with it and, and are we aligning with it? We can keep checking in through the year. That sounds wonderful. Oh, well we're gonna have a great 2026 ladies, I think. Woo. Yeah, it's gonna be a big year. I'm very much looking forward to it. Well, it was so lovely to catch up with you again, ladies. You too. And so looking forward to this next, next few weeks of our interviews with our incredible authors that we have on, and, um, then we get to catch up again and, and see how our first month back on went. Can't wait. Thank you. Chat. Bye bye. Thank you for listening to the book Deal podcast. We're able to bring you these weekly writerly chats because of our amazing patrons. Join the TPD family by becoming a member of our Patreon community@patreon.com slash the book deal podcast. And if you love the pod, please give us a rating or review. And don't forget to follow us on Instagram and Facebook.