Protect Your Peace with Nick Ferraiolo

In this episode, leadership coach and manufacturing leader Nick Ferraiolo shares his remarkable journey, which includes navigating discrimination and transitioning in the workplace to becoming a sought-after coach known for transforming broken teams. Nick opens up about resilience, the power of empathy, and why "uncomfortable is growth."

Together, Erin, Scott, and Nick explore authentic leadership, protecting your peace, overcoming your inner critic, and the simple practices that help people feel seen, valued, and heard. This conversation is a powerful reminder that the best leaders don't just drive results, but they also honor the humans behind them.

Hosted by Erin Cox and M. Scott Knox
Edited and Produced by Stephanie Cohen

Transcript

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Erin: Welcome to the Lead and Live Well podcast. My name is Erin Cox, and I'm thrilled to be here with my co host Scott Knox. On the Lead and Live Well podcast. We sit down with leaders in the social impact world to learn about their leadership journeys. 

We talk about their strengths and passions, the transitions they have made in their career, and And how they have crafted their own paths to leadership.

Our goal is to highlight a diverse array of leaders and journeys, so that our listeners learn from relatable and compelling examples of what it means to lead and live well.

Erin: Hey, Scotty.

Scott: Hey, Erin

Erin: We are up early on a Sunday morning with a lot of caffeine and a lot of energy because we have an awesome guest today. we are so excited to be joined by Nick Ferraiolo, a leadership coach, speaker, and manufacturing leader with a passion for helping people lead with authenticity, empathy, and accountability.

Drawing from his personal journey of transitioning in the workplace and overcoming challenges with resilience, Nick brings a unique perspective on leadership, workplace culture, and the importance of work-life balance. Through his coaching practice, Elm City Coaching, he helps individuals and organizations build stronger teams, navigate change, and create environments where people can thrive.

Welcome, Nick

Nick: Thank you. Very happy to be here

Scott: Nick, it's uh, great to be in conversation and community with you today, and can't wait to dig in

Nick: Yeah

Erin: Well, I think there was, like, a second half of the bio that wasn't included and, and had we had time to read it, we would have said Nick and, Erin became coaches together, uh, went through the IPEC program, and have been, fortunate enough to be in touch since those days.

I know Nick to be a passionate leader, a brilliant operator, and just a great laugh. I don't mean to set high expectations, but if I did, I know he'll meet them because uh, he just approaches things with a direct, calm, fun open nature, and I think we're gonna have a great time in this conversation as a result of that.

So Nick, super excited that you agreed to come on the pod and share some of your journey.

Nick: Yeah, thanks for having me this morning

Erin: So let's jump in, and as you know, we like to kind of start with getting a sense of your career trajectory. And in particular, the, one of these dynamics that we like to kind of explore and play around with is whether the, the changes that you made along that journey were due to chance versus choice, and I think you have a pretty interesting mix along that way.

So tell us a little bit about your background.

Nick: So my background. How did I get here? Where, why, I'm sitting with you Sunday morning at 8:00 or a little after. I started s- 45 years ago I started in the workplace. Started as a shipping clerk. So, I, you know, I'm a trans guy, so I, I was identifying as a, a lesbian at that time, very masculine.

I, actually the the, the discrimination has been through all my career. So that builds resilience, right? So since the day I've been in the workplace until about 10 years ago, I was discriminated against and um, the opportunities were unexpected throughout my journey, but choosing was intentional, right?

So I went from a shipping clerk and I, and I, uncomfortable things, you know, w- with growth as you know as a coach, growth is um, uncomfortable. And at one point I was offered a position as a warehouse manager at a very large grocery distribution center and I took it, but I had to wear women's clothes because before I was just a w- s- you know, I was a warehouse worker wearing jeans, you know, T-shirts and stuff.

But again, uncomfortable is growth. So I did, but it wasn't good enough for them. They were like, "Well, you have to wear jewelry," and um, "Why don't you look, look at Sarah. She's wearing, you know, pearls and earrings," and I just ignored it. They fired me for it. Fired me. So I was like, "Uh-oh. Okay, that's not okay."

But my other job took me back 'cause I was so awesome and it's like it s- it's, it was sad at the time, but it builds you up. It gives you the resilience, right? I was, and time that I was transitioning in the workplace I was bullied so horrible I almost took my life. You know that, Erin. I mean it was just horrific.

And it wasn't because I wasn't doing a good job. It was just because of who I, you know. I'm, I'm the same person I've always been, but now I'm complete for myself. You know what I'm saying?

Erin: Yeah.

 I, I just wanna pause on this idea that uncomfortable is growth and it gives resilience. I, I think that also is a choice.

Nick: Yeah

Erin: It's a choice around what you want, what you want to, what you are able to do with those moments, and I think that quite unfortunately, but also impressively, I have seen you time and time again really take those opportunities as opportunities to learn, grow, and strengthen yourself

Nick: Yeah. It helps me how, who the leader I am today. You know, 'cause I will never, ever under my watch, and not only with my direct team, just with my organization, and I have recently, will a- not allow anybody to treat anybody disrespectfully. I won't allow the um, discrimination at all. I mean, I'm part of this, this company I started and the company I am right now, I started in July, last July.

And I was asked within two weeks to go on their pride network board. It's a very large company. It's global. And um, this coming Wednesday we will be in the Keene, New Hampshire site saying pride for the first time ever, 'cause they never did anything. So we're gonna crawl, walk, run into that. And uh, I, I'm just excited about it.

You know, people go, "Well, how many," you know, "there's not too many trans people that work here or gay people." Yeah, maybe not, but there's parents of, you know, there's grandparents of, there's sib- you know, it's just like there's, it's connection. Everybody deserves to be treated respectfully. Everybody deserves to bring their true self into work.

That's how you get good work out. 

Erin: Hmm. 

Erin: That's, something that I've heard you tell stories over and over again and just how powerful your, your messaging and your line of questioning and challenging people can be. Before we get there, because I do want you to tell some stories about it, can you... I, I think that that moment of transition when you you decided to dig into your coaching practice, I think that was a really interesting time.

Would you, would you be willing to talk about that story? 

Nick: the time that I said I sh- I should be a coach. Is that what you're talking about? Okay. So I was working for a company, then all of a sudden all these other... Like, I was a, the assistant director of two organizations in a company, but other leaders would send their teammates that were ready to get fired to me.

Scott: Hmm. 

Nick: And I'm like, "To me?" "Yeah, the- you're just- just, just talk to them." And I brought somebody from PIP to promotion in four months, right? They're, they were ready to get out the door. So then I was like, "I really like doing this. Let me see, let me see." And my twin he he took he took IPEC like years before.

So I'm like, "Maybe I should do it." And I did. And now I'm, you know, Elm City Coaching is booming. I do that in the morning and then I go to work at night. I work a second shift job as a manufacturing supervisor. So I always tell my clients, "Just get ready to be uncomfortable, and we'll get a, we're gonna laugh too."

I mean, I mean, you know, like uncomfortable doesn't mean... It's, it's not a bad word. It's a good word .Once you know what, you know, what the outcome is. I've been so uncomfortable in my life. I mean, and I'm I'm the happiest I've ever been now. I, I get to lead a team that was broken. That's what they would do.

They would send me to when I was in a company, if a team was broken, they'd send me in to fix it.

Erin: Even before you were a coach. 

Nick: Before I was a coach. And I'll tell you right now, I didn't really do much. You know what I did? I honored them. I honor everybody here. I talk to them like humans. I work for them. Very easy.

Scott: Mm.

Nick: You know, it's, it's an easy thing. Again, empathy and kindness build stronger teams.

Erin: Mm-hmm. I thi- I've also heard you tell stories about just, like, really powerful, simple questions that you'll ask people that will just kind of, like, just open up a new level of thinking. Like, I'm thinking about a story or two where I think the core question came down to why are you so angry? Who 

hurt you? 

Nick: why do you bring the sword to work every day?

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: You know, what, what, why is it being... why do you think it's being done to you?

Erin: Hmm.

Nick: A lot of people do. You know, I have this one client that was all upset. Somebody dropped a cup of coffee. She was the m- maintenance, you know, she cleaned up the, the organization.

Dropped a cup of coffee, left coffee cup on the floor, and she was l- literally almost in tears screaming about it. And I said, "Okay, I got a quick question for you. If you called out of work um, today, would she have done the same thing, you think?" And she's like, "Oh, yeah. Mm." I said, "It's not about you."

It's those little things as, you know, as a coach that even I don- I think my higher coach brings it in. I, I mean, I... and sometimes I'm like, "Where did that come from?" Like, that question. And it makes people go, "Oh, you know what? It's not about me. It's just about she's a slob," you know? It could be. That, that's all it was.

Erin: Let's call slob a slob,

Nick: let's call a slob a slob. It has nothing to do with you. It's none of your business, well, how people treat you.

Erin: Hmm.

Nick: And it took me years, took me years to go, "What do you mean it's not about me?" And, but it's not.

Erin: But it's so hard to not feel that. None of 

your business how people treat you.

Nick: but when you get there, protect your peace, right? Your peace. And then anything you could do to protect your soul. And that's how I talk to th- this new team. It's, it's kind of funny because I went in there and I was quiet for six weeks. I bit my lip. I almost bled a couple of times. But this team had five supervisors in the last two years or something like that.

It was, you know... And then the other supervisors uh, you know, would say, "Watch out for this one." I was like, "Don't tell me. I don't know. Don't tell me that this person's a problem employee. I don't know what the, what's going on." And then six weeks after I was there, I took everybody in a room and I explained the expectations, my leadership style, and the team culture.

And I know I'm doing okay there when the, one of the employees that were p- problem employees came up to me just a couple of weeks ago and said, "I don't know how you did it, dude. You changed the culture here, and you treat everybody the same, and you show up every day." I said, "I do show up every day 'cause you deserve me to show up every day." You know? That's what it is. It's like I have fun. I can't wait to go into work. 

Well, most of the time. And some of the time, but some of the time it's very hard to sh- to show up, you know? And you have to, you know, and being kind and empat- empathetic, sometimes it- it, I wait to have conversations because I'm like, "Oh, they're having a bad night. I'll have that conversation tomorrow." You know, you know, that kind of thing.

But my conversations are all the same, whether I'm giving you feedback, promoting you, or pretty much firing you. It's the same tone, 'cause it is what it is, and I don't make a big thing about it.

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: I had to let somebody go the other day, and they smiled on the way out.

I said, "You know, it's just not a good fit. I've tried, you've tried." And I th- I think when people are at that level of, you know, that final warning, it's almost a relief, you know, to, to, to let them go. And, and again, it's not e- it's never gonna be easy for me to do it, and I've done it for, like, 40 years, and it's not gonna be, and it shouldn't be easy.

Erin: So Nick, I know there was a key moment in your career where something that some people might see as kind of devastating happened to you, and you totally turned it around and made it into something amazing for yourself, your wellbeing, and your practice.

And frankly, the impact that all of that had on so many other people's lives. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Nick: Yeah, sure. Um, I was working for a company for 13 years, and I'll be honest with you, for 13 years I thought I was gonna be fired even though I was promoted six times. And that's my gremlin and my inner critic, and we'll, we'll talk about that maybe another episode. So, I was... It was during COVID. I was on the computer working from home, and I got a call on Teams.

I answered it, and it was the director of HR and the uh, plant manager. And she was already crying, so I was like, "Uh-oh." But here's the good news. I was mostly way through my, the coaching certification, and that taught you that you are exactly where you're supposed to be. And so they said, you know, she said, "Nick I'm sorry to say that we've eliminated your role here."

And I said, "Okay." I said, "We're gonna all be okay." She's, she was crying so hard she had to get off the phone 

Erin: she she being the director of HR?

Nick: No, she being the plant manager.

Yeah, she goes, "I didn't wanna do it, but we tried." I mean, I, you know, I said, "I know how hard this is for you, and it's okay. I'll be okay." And she gets off. The HR director goes, "Oh my God."

He goes, "I've, I've done like 2,000 of these." He was, worked for Pratt & Whitney once, and he had to always, like, let people go. He goes, "I've never had a response like that, ever." I said, "You know, it, it, everybody is gonna be okay. I'm, I'm okay." And plus they gave me a year severance. I mean, you know, how okay is that?

So with insurance. So I, that made it a little easier, but I was still... And I'm saying to myself, "13 years you worried about this constantly, and now it's happening and you're okay with it." It, it's like, 

what? So I c- I've really focused on Elm City Coaching. so I flipped that switch to something c- devastating to how do we look at it differently? And I think through, you know, I had a coach at that time that helped me through it

Erin: Hmm. I have to say, so listeners, Nick and I get together with our colleague um, and fellow coach, Rebecca, for the last seven years on about a monthly basis, and I remember you signed on to that Zoom and your energy was just, it was palpable. Like, I could still remember that conversation because you were excited.

You were, you had been... I think the way you described it at the time, it was, it was, it was a gift. You were given the gift of time and space financially to build out something that you really knew you loved and would have impact in ways that really meant something to you

Nick: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it, it- a lot of time when I look back on my life, I'm like, "How the heck did you do it?" You know, I, I mean, when you're in it, like the courage to, to go to work day after day with an environment that was horrific. I mean, I remember when, you know, I started at the company that, that I worked for for 13 years.

I started f- that was the first company I started as Nick. I didn't have any surgeries, I didn't start any hormone therapy at all, and it was me. And I remember walking by a VP's office, and them li- like, "You know, you hear about Nick Firriolo. You know his story." And I'm like, "Are you kidding me?" And I look, and I looked in the office, and somebody that was in the office looked at me, was like, "Oh, shit," and then shut the door.

And I'm like, are you kidding me? That level? I've got it from every level. But here's the good news. I've worked every level. So I, I connect with everybody, right? So I, I connect with the ... and, like, even the people are not on my team, I'll walk through the plant and everybody goes, "Nick!" I'm like, "Yo, what's going on?"

You know, I'm a tatted guy, and you know, just like me. And I want people to feel, you know, we're at work so long. They do 10, they do four 10s.

Let's not, let's not be b- miserable, you know what I'm saying?

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: So I don't know how I ... see, I got, I w- I went somewhere, and I don't even know if I stayed in the conversation, but

Erin: You're here. You're here. I see you. We're good.

Scott: Ni- Nick, there, there's, you know, there is just in the short time together, you know, there's this such a theme of resilience. And thinking about, you know, especially as someone who's trans and how difficult it is in, you know, whether it was 40 years ago, 30 years ago, 20, and especially like right, right now.

And, you know, no, and, and you, you know, you've shared, you shared some of the, the hardship that's come along with your journey, even considering suicide at one point. And, you know, I'm, I'm wondering, knowing that it can be so hard in our country right now to be someone who's trans, you know, what are, what are some of the things that like you've leaned on or you f- you feel like have been part of that resilience, that personal resi- resilience that you've, you've held and have?

Nick: I know the support around me. You know what I'm saying? The people that ... You know, I only surround myself with people that honor me now. And I've, I've lived this life so long like that I know how to get out of a sketchy situation. Just happened a month ago, a worker that works for me came, he goes, "Do you have a minute?"

Came in my office. He goes, " "I just found out you were trans." You know, people still talk. And I said, "Okay." He goes, "Well, I'm the opposite." And I said, "Okay." He goes, "Why didn't you just stay a girl?" I said, "'Cause I'm not." He goes, "Well, I don't, I don't understand it." I said, "Okay. Well, I don't understand how it is to be you.

I, I don't understand how it is to be a cisgender man or a woman." I said, "I don't know, understand how it is just to go to work and not have to worry about somebody outing you. I don't know how it is to just to go out and date somebody without having to tell a story." But I'll tell you right now, I'm who I am, and if, you know, that's it.

And he go, 'cause he says, "Dude," he goes, "I really admire you." Like, that was like, he went from like wanting to be a girl to, "Hey, I really admire you." I said, "Listen, that has nothing to do with who I am as a person." Do you know what I mean? That's my gender identity. You know, I'm not n- a nice guy and a funny guy because I'm trans, I'm just, that's who I was all my life.

You know what I'm saying? So it's like that's not, it's like people ... I just don't understand the whole thing. Even like when I was a lesbian, it was just like, you know, back in the day that wasn't acceptable either, and I was like, "Who cares?" Like, I just, I'm a boring guy. I come home, I let my dog out, and then I watch TV all night.

I mean, I m- I don't do anything exciting, or I'm not like, I, I don't know. But yeah, so it's um, it's still tough sometimes.

Like, I know Wednesday's gonna be a little bit uh, sketchy,

Erin: The event? 

Nick: And Wednesday is when I have to go tell everybody about the Pride network in the huddle-ups.

And one woman already kinda heard about it. She goes, "What do we have to do?" I said, "Nothing." I'm like, "Don't worry. You don't have to wear rainbow." I was just like, you know?

Scott: Hmm.

Nick: I'm a little nervous about that, but I'll ask Chat to help me come up with something to say. 'Cause I do a huddle-up, ev- everybody does a huddle-up throughout the plant every Wednesday, and they just everybody else just stands there and says stuff.

I have a, you know, Erin, I have a presentation. I sh- show everybody the numbers and, you know, I talk about our rework and why it caused it. I want people engaged because they weren't engaged, and why, you know, they're just not numbers and assembly workers. They're people that need to understand. And we have produced more than ever.

And when you're engaged, you really care about your work. So you know what I'm saying? And then I'll f- I'll, of course I end it with a cartoon. Funny cartoons actually, but they don't laugh. Eh, that's okay. I pay people to laugh. I say, "I'll give you an extra 20 minutes for lunch tonight if you laugh at my cartoon."

But you know, it's like it, it, that I don't wanna be known as Nick the trans guy.

Scott: Hmm. Mm-hmm

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: I wanna be known as, "Oh, there's that cool supervisor everybody's talking about."

 You know? 

Scott: in, in your, you know, i- the reference to you know, I, I go home, I watch my shows, you know, like I, you know, things like I walk my dog. You know, just the, the things, the experiences that we all share in common. There's this, for some people, there's this like immediate othering of, oh, you know, is Nick casting spells, and, you know,

Nick: Yeah, 

Scott: you know, trying to doing something deviant after hours.

Like, no, I'm just doing the same thing you are. I go grocery shopping.

Nick: Yeah, I'm boring. I'm, I'm b- b- boring. I don't do anything except coach and work. That's what I do. But, you know, like, um, the culture where I was is horrible there. Well, it was. And I'm now asked to, um... What I do is anybody that's joining uh, the assembly or an organization, I do that whole, you know, the presentation that I did for my team, they had me do for the new hires.

Now they're thinking of me doing it for orientation. I said, "Well, you gotta clean up your culture first. You can't tell people, you know, like, there's no bullying, no isolating behavior, no gossiping, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and then they go out onto the floor and somebody's, you know, gossiping right next to them."

So you gotta clean it up first. But trying to change culture because, again, nobody should feel like I had to feel, because it's not okay. And you hold people hostage, right? You, that, that replay all weekend. I can't believe that it, that they said that to me. I can't... You, so where's joy? Where's peace of mind?

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: Peace of mind, you can't, you don't have room for peace of mind when you're replaying stuff.

Erin: I'd love to explore this, this idea of changing culture, 'cause I've, I think through our time together, you, you have done it in so many different settings whether you stayed there for a long time or not.

So can you tell us a little bit more about the approach you take and how... You mentioned that you, how you know it was working earlier, but like just tell us a little bit more, because it's not ju- you're not the only manager there, right? There's... You're uh, usually on a team of leaders, and so you can set the tone but I think there are also...

there's other people who have to get on board, both in leadership and in your, in your role on the floor. So tell us a little bit more about

Nick: Yeah, sure. In the assembly organization, there's m- I, I'm the supervisor at night. Second shift, I have the whole entire assembly o- you know, clean room. And then there's two l- two supervisors during the day that split that room. And when I, when I said, "You know, we need to change the culture," and I invited them to my presentation, along with all the leads in the organization, whether they worked in the shift that I work for or not, and of course my boss, who's very supportive.

Uh, For the first time in a long time, I respect and like my boss. But the culture I'm... They, they, they, they, when they saw me present, you know, I present a lot, Erin, so I know how to present. It doesn't, I don't get nervous. They're like, "Oh my God, you're good at that." I said, "Well, I do that." They're like, "You know, the messaging." I said, "But we need to uphold to this too," right?

So my expectations for my team are here, my leads are here. For myself, it's here, right? I don't hold myself to the same expectations. Stronger expectations. So they're, they were kinda on board with that. But they're changing the c- just total culture change. When you see how changing just the culture makes the whole energy of the room, I mean, it's just so d- it's not as heavy as when I first got there.

It's light. That m- makes it contagious. It's like vulnerability. When you start being vulnerable, it's like, "Oh, I, that felt, that's good, so I wanna do it again," right? So having that culture of not gossiping. I have written people up for disrespecting to other people

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: Because it's not okay. It's just not. It's not okay to walk away from somebody when they're talking to you.

It's ju- you know, and it's... So I hold them to high expectations, and hopefully other leaders see the benefit. I mean, it's a big company. I m- I, I... very big company,

but I know that my team is gonna feel honored every day, feel valued. Oh, they're just putting parts together, and that's not true. And that's, you know, just like w- at, at the other company when I took over manufacturing. I was a supply chain uh, j- assistant director of supply chain. The whole supply chain, from the sea to the consumer.

We, we did supplements, so it was from the raw material to the consumer. And then the, the manufacturing team wasn't doing well because their leaders, I'll keep it at that bad. And they asked me, "Hey, I can't take supply away. Would you take manufacturing?" I said, "Yeah, sure, I'll do it," 'cause I knew about the team.

All's I did was I went in, I watched, I got rid of the dead wood. And I hate to say it, but they're troublemakers, and 'cause they were not nice people. And I said, "I honor everybody here. Anything you need, you, you have from me." They doubled their output with half the people, with hardly any quality challenges.

And it was all because I, I brought in a really cool supervisor that was kinda like my style. And it, you know, when you listen to people and they feel heard, they don't feel overlooked. I know as a shipping clerk starting there how you're v- you don't think your voice is gonna be heard. It feels like it's thousands of miles away to the top, right?

My team, their voices are heard. Whether it's from me or I'll grab the expert that they're... Like, if they're telling something about maybe safety, I'll grab the safety guy, bring him in the room. "Hey, I'll, for..." Like, "John has something he wants to talk about." They feel heard. Instead of not feeling heard, they feel like they're w- they're valued, their voice matters.

Scott: Hmm.

Nick, you, you brought up something that I think so many of our listeners, certainly myself included, can identify with, and it's this idea of our inner critic. And whether that shows up, you know, through imposter syndrome or just self-doubt or unrealistic expectations, can you share a little bit about, like, your own journey with, with that and how you work through it and are working through it?

Nick: Oh, absolutely. You know, again, IPEC, I have to plug them because my life changed when I took that course. They talk about the inner critic. Mine was horrible. Mine started before I even got out of bed in the morning. It would ... Anything that I wanted to do for self-care, it would say, "Don't." Um, So what they, what, what they say is name it.

So my, my, my gremlin, my inner critic's name is Stanley. And um, Stanley would say, you know, I would wanna go to the gym and take care of myself, and it would say, "You don't have to go to the gym tonight. Just go tomorrow." Or, you know, "Why don't you go get that whoopie pie?" And, you know, it's, "Nobody's gonna love you.

Who's gonna love you? You're gonna lose your job, you know?" You know, I bought a house, and within 20 minutes after everybody left when they helped me move in, I thought I was gonna lose my house I'm like, "You're gonna lose your job. You're gonna lose your house." I'll never forget, I was like in my kitchen looking at all these boxes going, "Why do I even un- un- unpack?

I mean, I'm gonna lose my house." And my best friend pulled up and, 'cause she got me a, a, a present, a Buddha, and um, she goes, "What's the matter?" I was like, "I think I'm gonna lose my house." She goes, "Are you kidding me?" She goes, "You just got it." I'm like, "I know, but I think I'm gonna lose my house. I'm gonna lose my job."

And then that... I'm, when I'm saying that he was so powerful at one... Now he's not. He was so powerful at one point that it wa- I didn't have peace of mind at all, like not even a minute a week, not, not even anything. I didn't. But your gremlin, 'cause I coach a lot on this, is your in- interpretations of limiting beliefs and assumptions create that.

So your assumption of it, it, well, it's gonna, I'm gonna lose my job 'cause, you know, well, I mean, I'm gonna get written up 'cause the last time I was at a job. Or my other supervisor used to say, I had just a worker just last week, I had a talk to them about his excessive um, talking. And he goes, "What?

You know, n- nobody's gonna be able, n- I heard nobody could talk to me." And I was like "Um, I, nobody ever said that." Well, two years ago, two years ago, a supervisor said, "Don't talk to bloop." And I was like, "Oh, boy," I said, "Well, we're not there," I said, "and please don't put my face to another supervisor."

Whatever. But the assumption that it's gonna happen again. Interpretation is that quick little story you make up about something, and I'll tell ya here's a good story. I'm dating somebody as a trans guy. Probably the first woman I'm dating as me coming out trans. I've always dated straight women actually, but...

So I'm on a date with this woman. We're at an Italian restaurant. We just got finished eating dinner. I have a Sambuca. She has a chocolate martini, and she says, "I don't know what I'm gonna say to my family. They're gonna be shocked. My friends are gonna be shocked that I'm dating somebody like you." And I'm like, "Oh, really?"

I said, "Well, you know what?" I said, "I can't change who I am." I said... And then I'm, I'm, I'm, my, I'm like, "Okay. Of course. You know, I, I can't, I can't change who I am. I'm trans, and that's it." She goes, "No," she goes, "it's because you're Italian." True story. See, when you know what I'm saying? The, that inner cri- that because a lot of people, and I'm not saying a lot of women came in my life, and I know they fell in love with me, but they couldn't stay because I was trans, so that made that inner, that made that conversation, the lens that it created I see everything as 'cause I'm trans, 'cause I'm trans, 'cause I'm trans.

And it wasn't. It was because I was Italian

Scott: Hmm

Nick: Relationship lasted about three years. So that in, interpret- and your limiting beliefs, that stuff that you absorb as a child. couple of examples, you have to work hard for your money. You know, stuff like that always creates that inner critic. But Stanley just lied to, to me all the time.

That's all they do. You know, at one point of your, in your life when you were a kid, you know, it would say, "Don't touch that, it's hot." You know, it was, it was useful. But as you get older, it started getting a little cocky, and it starts, it starts talking about, you know, stuff that's just not true. So I, I do a lot of work with that with my clients, and I say name it.

Why do we name it? Because it takes it from inside, out. It's like, okay, hey Stanley, you can, don't have to go to the gym. I'm gonna go. You can, you're welcome, but I'm gonna stay for the 45 minutes. So you start talking back. And then it starts getting quieter, and it's like, "Oh, where's Stanley?" And you, I was like, oh wow.

So Stanley come, still comes. I'm human. But I don't listen to it.

Erin: Yeah. That act of separating yourself from your gremlin is a really, it's a challenging one, and I think it does start with the naming. I know that might sound a little woo-woo to folks on the, who are listening, but it's super powerful. Uh, It It allows you to have a conversation with yourself that starts to parse things apart, and allows you to, your, the voice that you want to come forward to take some of that energy that your gremlin's absorbing away.

But you've really transformed the way you interact with Stanley. Part of what we do with gremlins is explore why they exist. Do you have a, do, do you have a s- a, a... What's, what's your answer for that? Why does yours exist?

Nick: It's obvious. Like, what I always ask, "Whose voice is it?" 'Cause it's not my voice. It was my father's voice.

Scott: Mm-hmm.

Nick: It was horrible.

 You know, it was just, it was, it's just like that's who it was. And then, and then you start, you start believing it. Like, who's gonna love me? You know, I did you know Byron Katie, The Work?

Anybody, do you know of her? Okay, she does this...

Oh, oh, it's wo- Okay. It's wonderful. And I had the opportunity at a company that one of the founders was a practitioner of it, and this is all it does. And when you say, "Nobody's gonna love me," is that true? Right? And h- here's a really cool... This is good, this is a good story.

Do we have time for another story? This is a really good one. So sh- Byron Katie does workshops. And this is, a, a therapist told me this once and it just changed my life. And she asked everybody just to write down the worst thing that ever happened to them, and this one dude brings 10 pages back and forth of his divorce.

And then she says, "Okay, bring it to one page." Brought it to one page. Then they have to bring it to a paragraph, and then before they leave, they have to bring it to one sentence. And this 10-page, double-sided divorce, blah, came up to one sentence. Two people met, one person left. The rest is all noise. The rest already happened.

It doesn't matter anymore. So when you go, hoof, you know what I'm say- Like, that just changed... Like, when he told me that story, I was like, oh my God. But when you're in it, it's hard. That's why you need sometimes coaching or therapy to get to keep reminding you. It just w- that's what it is. So yeah. So I was able to start kind of before IPEC with a gremlin on, is it true?

Is it true that I'm gonna lose my job? it, it's not true. And sometimes, you know, it happens to be true, but again, we're all, everybody's exactly where they're supposed to be. And, you know, they say, you say, "Good or bad, who's to say?" I always say that too. I mean, you know, you can't...

You don't know. You go, "Woo-hoo!" And then all of a sudden it's like, "Oh, shoot," you know? Or you could go, "I can't believe..." Like, change, how scary is change to people? It's scary in the beginning, messy in the middle, but usually beautiful at the end,

You know, when you talk to people like I talk to people, like, "You're a rock star at this," people aren't used to being spoken to that way. Like, I'll, I'll say to even somebody on my team, "I honor you.

I, I value you. You give me peace of mind when you show up every day, and I wanna thank you for that." I said that to one woman at her first one-on-one, 'cause she goes, "We're..." Everybody's like, "We're having one-on-ones?" They're like, "Yeah." She, she started crying. Crying. She goes, "No- nobody's ever talked to me that way."

And I was like, "But you, I do value you. And I... You know, you're safe here. You could be who you you are here." She goes, "I'm sorry I'm crying." I'm like, "I'd rather you cry than be an asshole." You know what I'm saying? It's like, yeah, cry all you want. Cry all you want. Because somebody said, "She cries over everything."

I said, "Let her be who she is. I don't care. I don't care." But yeah, so, so Stanley is kind of still there sometimes, but I have to really check... It's e- it's easy for me to say, "Okay, thank you. Go." You know what I'm saying? But to get there, it's hard work. you have to be very vulnerable. Again, whose voice is it?

Scott: Yes

Nick: the same voi- It's kind of funny 'cause it's the same voice as when you're driving in the car and you kind of go, "Should I go to, should I go get groceries first or go to the bank? Well, I don't know. What time does the bank close? Maybe I should go to the bank first or..." But then it starts getting negative.

That's, that's when you're inner critic, you know. Your inner critic is gonna hold you back, and you gotta push through, and it feels really good when you do.

Scott: Hmm. Well, and Nick, I, you know, I'm thinking about one of the gifts of age. It, you know, just speaking from personal experience, like, you know, the, the, the more years we have under our belt, the more kind of cycles of, you know, the inner critic and, you know, working through the inner critic, and, you know, what a gift age is.

And then I, you know, I, I can't help but think of, you know, again, thinking about your experience as a trans man and thinking about our young people in the LGBTQ community, and especially young trans people who, you know, let's just bracket the inner voice for a second. And then you hear about, like, all the external noise of just telling you, like, you're not worthy, you're less than, you know, you don't deserve healthcare.

You know, you don't deserve to, you know, play on your on your sports team. And, you know, thinking about, A, what a gift again it is to have that that survival mechanism and that coping mechanism. And I'm wondering, you know, from kind of your vantage point, you know, what, what advice might you give to, like, someone young, trans, and in the workplace, you know, as they're, they're, they're, they're balancing that inner critic and all the external noise

Nick: Yeah. I w- where I am now, we do. We have, we have some uh, young trans people. Just to know that, that you're, y- y- you have ... They, they need to understand, and I hope they have the support. Like, we need to be more vocal. Instead of people c- trans people coming, kids coming to us, we need to go to them, and we need to say, "Listen, I got your back.

You ever need anything, you see me. If you ever need to talk, anything." Because we can't change what's ha- well, it's hard to change what's happening in this country, okay? For especially with trans kids. And um, it's just to, to, to say, you know, again, I always say I honor who you are. Come, come see me, no matter if they're trans, lesbian, gay, LGBTQ+ or not.

People need to ... We need to go get and bring them to us instead of asking them to come to us. You know what I'm saying?

Scott: Yes, I love that

Erin: Hmm. Nick, I'd love to to, I think this is a nice segue into, to have you talk a little bit about your coaching practice and, and what you focus on. You've referenced it a little bit in this conversation, but if you could just give folks a flavor of, like, what, what kinds of topics you tend to cover, what kinds of clients you tend to work with, and uh, and, and how folks can get in touch with you

Nick: Okay. I, personal coaching, one-on-one personal coaching, I work a lot with the inner critic. For some reason lately it's people breaking up with people. Like, like bad breakups or, you know, they're, they're sad. The, you know, the, the heart is broken, and my heart has been crushed. You know that with um, when I was started transitioning, it was just horrible.

 So I, I, I feel that. I know how it feels, but I also know how to get out of it. So for my one-on-one coaching, really anybody that feels stuck anywhere, right? My corporate coaching, I do a lot of with leadership. Leadership management training, how to, how to, how to, how, how to lead with kindness, and it builds, you know, a stronger team.

So I do a coup- couple of workshops on that. I work um, bridging the gap between, like, two organizations. I've done it before. It's a really cool workshop. It's a three-hour workshop. And I also help companies retain people, which is now ne- a, a need, right? So anybody at one company, anybody that gets a written, a, a warning, a start in the warning, they see me for four, four visits. Most of them I turn around because most of them are saying this company, but what I do immediately is bring them outside the company and s- you know, outside and go, "Do you ever... When... Do they push your buttons?" I don't know, I don't know if you remember this, Erin, but I forgot her name. She was one of the coaches that helped our, that was in front of our uh, class, and we were coaching her and she said, she kept saying, "The, the guy, he pushes my buttons, he pushes my buttons."

And then at the end she said, "Nobody asks me about the button."

And she goes, "It's 'cause it's my button." So I always use that. I'm like, "I bet you they push your buttons." "They push my buttons, they push my buttons." I said, "Okay, well it's your button. We gotta figure out what that button is." And then we start there.

How does that... How do you... Do you ever feel that way outside of work? Yes. So now it's not about the company. Now they're not going, "This place." They're going, "Oh, it's m- you know, I'm bringing it." You bring yourself everywhere you go, 

right? So you bring yourself to work, you bring yourself home. So I do a lot with helping companies retain employees.

And I do believe it or not, I had one train- one training for Priceline.com and we talked about being a transgender leader, and that was my only one this year. I'm usually, June is usually slam-packed with workshops on supporting your LGBTQ+ workforce or understanding gender identity 101, and that went boop, done.

But I refocused on leading with kindness 'cause I think that's more important now than ever.

Erin: It sure is

Nick: You could get in touch with me, elmcitycoaching.com, and you could have a 30-minute free chat, and we laugh and we get to know each other.

Erin: And he can do a lot in those 30 minutes to unlock you. Of course, you should always sign up for more. My favorite buttons question after you say make, build the awareness that the button is, is yours, 'cause then people get kind of a little shocked sometimes and maybe a little defensive. Like, "No, it's not."

Nick: Yeah, 

Erin: It is. But then you say, "But you get to decide how big it is and whether or not it gets pressed." And then it's, "Oh,

let's, let's explore that." Yes,

Nick: I always say that when, when I'm, like, giving somebody a, a verbal warning. I'm like, "Here's the good news about it." They're like, "Good news?" I said, "You have control of the whole thing." I said, "You could... It's you. It's just whatever you wanna do." ' Or I'll say, "This might sting a little bit," like, before I say something to my client. This might sting a little bit, your ego. Check your ego.

Scott: Yeah

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Nick: And ego's not a... I just told a coworker that. I said, "Dude," I said, "Leave your ego in your car." 

Erin: Bring, your whole self, but 

not your ego. 

Nick: said, "Listen, bring bring your, bring, leave your ego in your car, your sword in your car,

okay? Bring in your sense of humor, your empathy, your kindness, and your lunch." Leave all that other stuff. It, I mean, you know, it, it... And he goes, "My ego?" I said, "It's not a bad thing." He goes, "It's not?" I'm like, "No, it's just, you know, check it." I, I say, still I'll say, "Dude, that was your ego." Like, "What do you mean?" E- anytime I s- I say to myself, "What do you mean, like, that that's not okay?"

I'm like, "Okay, that's your ego." It's, it doesn't have to be your, your way. You know what I'm saying?

Scott: Yes

Erin: Well, Nick, I know we're at our time and I'm sorry this conversation has to come to an end. Uh, But there's always parts two, three, and four we can look

forward to. Uh, but we really appreciate you taking the time to share a bit about your story and, and all of those messages that have come from a place of resilience.

I think I can, I can see and feel our listeners writing a bunch of things down that they will carry forward like, uncomfortable is growth, and protect your peace, as we always like to say to each other all the time. 

Nick: Yes, we do. Well, Scott, it was very nice meeting you

Scott: Nick, so great to meet you. Happy Pride. Thank you for the voice and leadership and cheerleading you do in many, many spaces

Nick: Thank you. All right, guys. Have a great Sunday.

Scott: You too.

Nick: All right.

Scott: Bye, Nick

Erin: Bye。