Welcome to Spirit Gym. Today's guest has spent almost 30 years chasing one question. What happens when you stop trusting your five senses and start trusting something deeper? Eric Godsey is a writer, podcaster, and student of Carl Young, and the author of a Substack piece called Renaissance Fitness. 13 pages that started as a confession and turned into an outline for everything in today's episode. Paul and Eric talk about the beliefs that Eric has abandoned along the way: atheism, materialism, the idea that the mind ends at the skull. Then there's the year Eric spent recovering from psychedelics gone sideways, and how a book about children who remember past lives cracked something open in him that never closed back up. But before we get started, we'd like to say thank you for listening, as this podcast would not be possible without you, our subscribers and followers. We'd also like to thank our sponsors, Organa Family, My Optimizers, Paleo Valley, and Wild Punchers. You'll hear their special offers and discounts throughout this episode, and your support of our sponsors means that we can keep bringing new episodes to you. As Paul always says, don't believe a word you hear until you've tested it for yourself. So here are Paul and Eric for today's episode.
SPEAKER_03Well, as you heard from Penny's beautiful introduction, I've got a friend of mine here, Eric Godsey, who I was highly recommended by Kyle Kingsbury, somebody who I love and trust, to do a podcast with. And it's been a long time. Eric and I have been trying to get this together for how long, Eric?
SPEAKER_05Um, like almost a year. I lost my voice last year.
SPEAKER_03We were scheduled, and Eric hit a bump in the road. And so we had a little chit-chat about that, waited till he got his voice back, and here he is. And he has written an amazing article called Renaissance Fitness Part One. And I read it, it's 13 pages long, and I thought, wow, this is a perfect outline for a podcast. So I said, hey, Eric, let's just use this article as an outline for a podcast, because I think it would be just fun to dialogue and explore some of these concepts. So that's what we're going to do today. Eric, where can they find this article? And I'm sure you're going to publish part two since this is part one.
SPEAKER_05For sure. Yeah, it's on Substack. And if you just type my name, Eric Godsy, you'll be able to find it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, Eric Godsey on Substack. And uh it begins with Murphy, do you copy? I enjoy changing my mind. And then it starts off with Eric's kind of history. So, Eric, why don't you start off with how this all began uh for you and what led you to writing this article?
SPEAKER_05Well, there's a few things that have come together to get me to write about this. And the main thing is that in my current like generation, the people like I see like a bifurcation happening. There are within, you
know, I see myself as like a part of the quote unquote spiritual community. And I see something happening in the spiritual community in response to technology. Yes. Where there's the camp that's trying to get their farm turn away from everything, and they kind of just think it's fucked and they just want to take care of their kids, which there is a lot of admiration to that. And then there's the group of people who use it to help them like with their business, and but they're not looking at it as they're not looking at it with like a mythic light, which I think is important because I think there's something happening here that's something happening big. And then there's like the spiritual part of the community where they want to do something, but their relationship to like trying to build and trying to envision the future, their capacity to see the future feels like it's been broken. And that's a big part of what this article is about, is to help the people who feel that there is something deeply wrong with our culture, but who feel like they can't do anything about it. Right. And so it's it's like a playful way. Really, it's me giving myself advice. It's like that's I fall asleep all the time. Like I get re-addicted, I get re-acclimated to checking my phone 200 times a day. And so a big part of this is to help me wake up.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, that's an honest intro. Yeah. You know, um, do you know what scrying is?
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_03What color is your phone when when it's not activated? Black. What's scrying? Looking into the invisible axe aspects of yourself with a black mirror.
SPEAKER_05100%.
SPEAKER_03And that's what the phone is. What does it do? It uses AI to track your every thought, feeling, emotion, purchase, and it mirrors you back to you. And there you have the myth of narcissist.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03And that's exactly how they capture people with it. They just keep mirroring you back to you, and you keep thinking, oh my god, this is great. This is so interesting. And the next thing you know, you're forgetting to be you.
SPEAKER_05100%. And so the way I started this article is I wanted to admit the things I've changed my mind on because I feel like that's almost like a magical act to myself to get me outside of my current rigid set of beliefs. And so, like, I go through most of my life I was an atheist, you know, and then I found psychedelics. And actually, I had like a year where I was doing psychedelics way too much without enough mentorship, and I actually kind of triggered a psychosis. Oh. Um that happens. Yeah. I was able to avoid going into any type of like mental institution, but I was able to avoid it because I basically hid myself from people for like six months.
SPEAKER_03And in hindsight, I think what it would be diagnosed as was like a schizoid personality rupture episode where I helped many people through that very thing from doing too many journeys and too deep for their for their ego structure.
SPEAKER_05And so even that wasn't enough to get me to like open up to God, but it was actually Carl Jung and starting to read his works and then getting into dream work. Like as soon as I started reading Jung, about like 23, I started having dreams that I and I was and I was starting to use like the codex that he was sharing. Like the first book I read by him was Man and His Symbols. And so I was starting to use that. And then within you know, a couple of months, I had a couple of synchronicities that just like and it was like, I don't know what God is, but I know there's something. I know it's conscious, I know it has a point of view, and the big thing is it feels like it has a really delicious sense of humor.
SPEAKER_03Oh god, yeah.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_03You know what Jung said about uh atheism? No. For something to be rejected, it must first be real. Interesting. That's good. If you put an A between A and theist, yeah.
SPEAKER_05And then so the next big thing I changed my mind on, and I remember the day, you know, because like one of my like confessions as like someone in the spiritual space is it feels like I'm almost in the closet. Because like my confession is
I still really respect materialism to the point where like I'm really slow to change my mind on a lot of the things that would go against like my atheistic materialism upbringing. But the next big thing that happened that totally changed me in ways that I think are still unfolding is when I was like, I think like 28, I was on an airplane and I read a book called Life Before Life. And it was a book by about the research from the University of Virginia that they've been doing for almost, I think almost like 80 years, where they've been tracking children who claim to remember their past life. That's Ian Stevenson, isn't it? Yes. Yeah, I'm very familiar with all that. And I wasn't familiar with any of that. And I read that book on the plane, and I remember when the plane landed, I was like, oh my god, I I believe in reincarnation. And like that was a huge deal for me. And then the intro of this article that really got this all to kind of like pop up was I started reading this book um by this researcher named Annie Jacobson. I've heard of that person. She's an incredible investigative journalist, but she wrote this book called Phenomena, where she Oh, that's where I heard it in your article. And she threw a bunch of freedom of information requests to the government, she was able to get a bunch of previously classified documents that track the like 50-plus year um research and utilization of remote viewers and highly sensitive and dangerous military missions. And I just gotta be honest, for me, if I'm online and I see someone claim to be a remote viewer and they, you know, start talking about the Galactic Federation or they start talking about how Miley Cyrus is a lizard, you know, I'm instantly like, that's that's that's bullshit.
SPEAKER_03That's that that can happen, but um, you know, I am a remote viewer. I won a remote viewing contest in 2000 at the field conference in London, England. That's cool. I'd love to hear about that. Uh well look they there was a course taught by the CIA's director of remote viewing at the time. Can't remember his last name, Skip. I don't know, can't remember Skip's last name. But anyhow, he was he was the director of the CIA's remote viewing program. So they had a one-day course in remote viewing and uh without a long drawn-out conversation about it. It was uh the training, and then they put you through four exercises broken up through the day, and they had photographs of the location that they gave you the coordinates to. Yeah, and then you would use the technique and you would sketch out what you saw there. And two of my instructors were with me, and so every time we would reveal our drawings, I would go, Oh my god, Paul, how'd you do that? And I'm so you know, I don't tell you everything I can do. But um I didn't use their technique because I began having out-of-body experiences when I was 12 and due to stress largely. Um just by you know a very traumatic environment, but um, which led to my brother committing suicide, unfortunately. So the stress kind of split me open and initially it scared the hell out of me. But then I thought, wow, I wonder if I can actually leave my room. And part of the problem was is that on Vancouver Island, where where I grew up, in the summertime, it stays light sometimes till after 11 o'clock at night in the summer. My parents always made us go to bed at 7:30, so they had quiet time with no kids around, but it used to drive me crazy, you know. I was 12 and I had a lot of energy, and it was like being in prison, you know. So once I realized that I could stay in what I refer to as my spirit body, and I didn't have to come back into my body because every time I would get scared, I would come back into my body, and it was wild because when my spirit body would come back into my physical body, my body would jump like it, it got hit by a interesting bolt of lightning. It was, you know, I could really like there was something coming back in with intensity, you know. And so I thought, God, I wonder what'll happen if I just try to go through the wall and I went right through the wall like it didn't even exist.
unknownWow.
SPEAKER_03I thought, well, this is fucking cool. And so I thought, I'm I wonder if I'm just making this up in my mind. So what I did, and I did this research for a number of months, is we had a big farm, as I told you, 142 acres. So I would go look around the farm to find things. And then in the morning when I'd get out of bed, first thing I would do is run out there to wherever it was and see if what I found was there. Could be, you know, a chainsaw my dad left laying out in the woods, or could be uh uh, you know, pot plants my dad was growing out in the forest, or I would just go looking around for something that was objective. For sure. And I was able to convince myself that something was happening that I wasn't making up, but there's no way I'd be able to do that. Like 142-acre farm is big. You just walk my 14-acre property, so try 10 times that size. Um and I I did it for quite a while, but then life kind of got busier. You know, I was busy kickboxing and I was doing a lot of stock car racing when I was younger, and I was very intensely involved in kind of growing myself and my pursuing my passions. Um, but then there would come situations where I had challenges in my life or something I needed to figure out, or and sometimes I just wanted to practice because it was something that I really enjoyed doing. I thought it was always magical and mysterious.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03So then when I saw this advertisement for this remote viewing contest, I thought, well, this is cool because I think I can do that. How old were you when you went? Uh, this was the year 2000. So I was uh I'm 50, I'll be 65 in August. So what is that, 26 years ago?
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_0340. I was like 39 or 40, I think. Um and I had been doing years and years of Tai Chi and Qigong and and meditation. So I had kept my spiritual practices up and I'd I'd had many union experiences with God without plant medicines or anything. So um I I in other words,
remote viewing for me wasn't some kind of weird thing. It's just that when they had a course by a legitimate remote viewing teacher, and I had studied remote viewing enough by reading articles that I knew what that meant to them.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Uh so I thought, I'm gonna go do this and see how I fare. How like, can I do it based on their idea of it? But right away when they gave the instructions and how they suggest you do it, I'm like, that that's that's not as good as what I do. So I'm gonna just stick to my method. And sure enough, I was nailing it. And at the end, the instructor uh said, Okay, we're gonna have a contest now, and the winner gets a prize. Tell me what happened, I believe it was July 23rd, and he gave the year what happened to me at 2 o'clock p.m. that day. So what I do the way I do it, yeah, is I just say to my soul, if they give coordinates, I say, please show me what's there at that coordinates, and I just empty myself. And that's the hard part for people. You gotta learn to empty your mind and be detached from what rises. But because I learned meditation at 12 years old, spent a summer camp with the monks when I was 15, did all this work with Master Fong Ha and others, um, I had developed that ability. And so I simply said to my soul, please connect me to the instructor's soul, and ask his soul to take us to that moment in time. And then I just relaxed and I found myself floating in my spirit body outside of a large glass building. And the first as soon as I saw it, I said, This looks like a hospital. So I said to my soul, where do I go? And my soul said, Move closer. And next thing you know, I'm looking right through the window and I see him laying on a stretcher in a hospital with doctors and nurses very busy. He was hooked up to multiple monitoring machines, and I could tell by the look on their faces it was some kind of an emergency. And they had a skin pencil and they were putting a line right down his sternum. And I thought, oh, this guy's about ready to have some kind of major surgery, and it must be heart surgery. And I intuitively knew right then and there I was going to win the contest, too. I just knew it.
unknownWow.
SPEAKER_03And so there was 730-something people in the class. It was a whole auditorium full of people. So he said, Okay, time's up. Who thinks you know? And I shot my hand up. And when I told him what I saw, he looked shocked. Like I knew I got him.
unknownWow.
SPEAKER_03And I had to sit and wait for everybody to say, Oh, I saw you in a dungeon with dragons chasing you and all these like LSD journeys and stuff. And finally he says, You, the guy in the back that looks like a soldier. You're the winner. At exactly that time on that day, I had a heart attack and I was going into open heart surgery. I said, There you go. What was the prize? Uh oh, it was a t-shirt. It was a t-shirt. It was the conference t-shirt. Um, did they try to recruit you? No. Um I was asked to try out for Delta Force when I was a soldier, but I had a a son and and I also had um friends that were inside of Delta Force, so I I knew that if I did go that route, there was a real chance I may not come home, and I felt too obligated to making sure my family was safe. Uh that's a funny story. I'll tell you that real quick. You know, I was a competitive triathlete and I represented the Army in triathlon. And one day I used to have a deal with the swimming, um, the head of the swimming pool. They knew who I was because I was a trainer of the Army boxing team right across the street. And I asked if I could get in the swimming pool an hour early before they opened it every day so I could do my training without a bunch of people in the lanes. And so she said, No problem, I'm here to open up early anyhow. So they didn't know I was in there, but they were doing um advanced training for Green Berets because the JFK Warfare Center is right there. I mean, I'm literally like I'd throw a rock from the Callahan boxing room and hit the JFK. You went across the street, and right behind this 50-meter Olympic pool was the JFK Warfare Center, which is the headquarters for training all the Green Berets. But one of the things they do, or they apparently they stop doing it, but they basically do a forced drowning. What they do is they take lead bricks and they keep throwing them in the water, and the guy's got to dive down, get them, bring them back, and they progressively reduce the amount of time they have to recover enough oxygen. And if they can't go until they drown, they they won't let them pass and become a green beret. That's one of the things they have to do. And I actually had a guy from the Navy who was a Navy boatman tell me that was all just a myth. I said, no, it's not a fucking myth. The reason I knew what was going on is because I heard all this screaming and yelling and, you know, them cheering each other on because those are like a big deal. It takes brass balls to drown yourself. I can't even imagine. And so I snuck to the door and stuck my head out, and I could see what was going on, and I watched for a bit, but I thought, oh my God, I didn't even know they were allowed to do stuff like this. So then I came back and I was standing in the shower naked, and I had this feeling somebody was watching me. I turned around and there was a captain in his dress uniform with ribbon after ribbon on his chest. And I looked at him like shocked that he, I mean, you know, I'm the only one in the pool. Everybody else is outside and the pool's closed. And he says, Are you specialist check? I said, Yes. He said, I understand. You have a background in racing, motocross, start car racing, drag racing. You're a mechanic. And he went through all you're a kickboxer, and I said, Correct. He said, Would you like to try out for Delta Force? He said, You have all the criteria, you meet all the, you take all the boxes we're looking for.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03I said, Thank you for the offer, but I know how real that is, and I know the responsibilities and the risks. And I have a I said, if you know all that about me, you know I have a wife and a, at that time, probably a six year old son. I said, I can't take the risk of leaving them behind. But thank you. He said, Well, if you change your mind, You you come to the JF Care Warfare Center and he told me his name. But it was the strangest thing because he mysteriously appeared in the shower. And while I'm standing in the shower, he's getting all wet. Oh, wow. He's like that. He's wearing dress uniform, polished shoes, and the water's bouncing off of me and spraying on him, and he's pretending like he's not noticing this. And I thought, well, that was one of the strangest events of my life right there.
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SPEAKER_03Do you remember his name? Uh no, Captain somebody, but I was 23 at that time. I went to I joined the Army in uh 20. I was in advanced um no, I I'd come out of AIT. So AIT's advanced um uh training for your specialty. So I I did basic training, then I did jump school, then I did almost a year of electronics school. And then I went to the 82nd Airborne Division. So uh I was uh 23 at that time. But anyhow, back to the whole remote viewing thing. So um I have remote viewed extensively. Um I've found people that were lost. One guy was a family member of a student of mine in Australia that died in a fire and they couldn't find him, and I located him. Another time, four Czech professionals who are all mountaineers got lost in the mountains and never came home in Washington state. And one of the other Czech professionals was friends of theirs, and he knew that I had these abilities, and he said, Hey, look, their families are freaking out. They sent the National Guard out there, they can't find them, so I located them. They got caught in a snowstorm, and I said, you know, when the snow melts, because they got there, it was like they had a huge snow dump and it just socked them in. But they'd climbed underneath a big like stone was out hanging, uh, hanging out, which created a kind of an alcove underneath it. So they buried themselves underneath to protect themselves from the snow, but they all ended up freezing to death. But uh, they each cut their fingers with a knife and left a message for their family in blood and said one one of them said, What they all basically said, please don't have any remorse for us. We died doing what we love to do.
SPEAKER_07Wow.
SPEAKER_03But I told them where they would find them, and they ended up finding them there. Um, so anyhow, my my remote viewing abilities have been tested. So the why I'm telling you this is because I'm not a fantasy guy. Yeah, I'm not the kind of guy you're talking about. Oh, for sure. For sure. And um, why this is relevant to our conversation is because to
remote view, you have to get rid of any idea whatsoever that could alter your conviction that it's even possible.
SPEAKER_07Okay.
SPEAKER_03To whatever you believe about God has a direct impact on your ability to remote view. Interesting. This is super helpful. Okay. So if you believe that everything is separate from you, you believe that the sun's over there, the moon's over there, uh, you're here, and that's it, that will stop you from remote viewing. Fortunately, when my parent my mother joined the self-realization fellowship, I got immersed in Yogananda's teachings as a 12-year-old and I got to ask the monks all the questions that I couldn't get asked in a Christian church. And the God that Yogananda introduced me to is really the God that I still find to be real. And ultimately, in a nutshell, there is nothing but God or there is no God.
SPEAKER_07Right.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And so what remote viewing confirmed for me is that the reason I can find people and know what's happening to that guy when he's getting an open heart surgery, like a year or two before, and I can go to the sun and meet beings there. And I've been all over the place. I mean, there was a period where my soul was taking me into Venus a lot. And I would go to meet people in Venus and have conversations like almost like the Gnostics sitting around talking about spiritual development in what looked just like a cafe here. And I realized one of the things I realized, all these people keep looking for life, can't find it anywhere, but they're they don't realize that some of these planets have evolved out of their physical manifestation, and they're what they have is very much like what we have, but it's in the astral dimension. So, like if you go to Venus, there's a lot going on there. It's like there's cities, and you know, it's just like this, except the people are at a higher vibration. They've evolved out of what we're at on the earth plane. And I've been all over. I've met alien beings of different types. I've uh remote viewed on the sun and seen stunning, stunning pyramids. I mean, pyramids miles high, pyramids that are made out of material that look like mother of pearl, that are like when the light of the sun goes through them, they they shine like a like a star, like a luminous, uh almost kind of like when we look at a light, but imagine the light of the sun coming up through what looks like a crystal. And these things are massive. I mean, they got these super fast elevators in these things, and you you can go up like 300 or 400 stories, and you're like, there's massive. And I just have had so many wild experiences that you know what I'm saying is I learned beyond a shadow of a doubt that the ego creates a firewall that gives you the illusion of a sense of self that's disconnected.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03Because without that, we wouldn't actually learn what love is, and we would not go through the evolutionary process of learning to love. If you're just merged into a non-dual reality, then there is no self.
SPEAKER_06For sure.
SPEAKER_03There is there's no love. You can't, you have to have a lover and a beloved, uh, I and a thou. And so the ego is actually how God creates the illusion that it's not God, so that it can have the absolute joy of legitimate self-realization and realizing, oh my God. You know, and like when God wakes up in any one of us, God itself has a huge celebration because God finds itself. 100%. And so the paradox is God in Eric is uniquely Eric's God, if that makes sense. I mean, yes, there's God, but God falls asleep in matter, God falls asleep in living forms, and each form is like a stage of evolution in the process of awakening and becoming. Yogananda says it takes about eight billion reincarnations through the kingdom of nature to get your first human body. So how how objective he's being, I don't know. But what he's saying is that consciousness is on an evolutionary drive of awakening to itself, and it's a process, and God's got all the time there is, so there's no rush. Time for God is just a creation of uh storyline. Um but we're you know, we're we're all in this very unique journey um to realize God within ourselves, and however long it takes doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it's like one of the things that I can really appreciate, and a part of what this article is trying to like confess and to speak to is I feel like I am um like an orphaned child in culture where I was born into the 1990s. I was raised by sitcoms and plastic and Walmart, and there was no connection to anything that had like a pulsing divinity to it. There was almost no community on any level, you know, like it was my parents' nuclear family just trying to make it work. Almost no real art. Like the only art I was exposed to was the stuff that was selected for by the gatekeepers of the record labels to put onto the radio. Like, and I just feel like I like I started super deep in Plato's cave, like really deep in there. Most people do though. Yeah. And that I'm like, it's like I'm cleaning off layers of sediment. And each of these big mind changes are like when I've like cleaned off one of the layers, and it's like the first layer to get access to the soap is like, oh yeah, there's something. It's not just random. And so the thing I've recently changed my mind on has been remote viewing. And the thing that's interesting is I really love what you said, how your conception of God deeply impacts your capacity to remote view. Like that is super clarifying for me. And the first couple of times I attempted to remote view, because there's an app you can use where it randomly generates coordinates, you then do the technique, and then you have to take a picture of what you drew, submit it to the program, and then only then will it show you the answer. So there's no way to cheat. Yeah. And the first four times I did it, two of the four times, was like startlingly accurate.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Like, and like what was interesting is that when I got into the frame of attempting to do it for the first time, because I had no idea what I was doing, it's like the pure inexperience actually allowed for there to be an openness. And then as soon as I got a couple right, I then did like 10 in a row where I got nut. It was just 100% off. You know, it's because I like believed I was starting to understand how to do it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. I mean, we're each so unique inside. You know, one of the things that I find important is the less information you have, the better.
unknownRight.
SPEAKER_03Like, for example, when this person's uncle was missing and burned in the fire, they they wanted to tell me all about him. And I said, look, I don't need anything because I don't want to have more stuff in my head. For sure. Um I just need to know what the circumstances were, where he was at, uh, where does he live? You know, I needed that enough for my soul to lock on to it. Um you know, because I mean this is a bit deep for where we're at in the conversation, but you know, I've gone deep enough into God to tell you there's nothing there. And that when the first time that happens to you, it is such a total mindfuck.
You know, everybody loves the idea that God's unconditional love, but very few of those people actually comprehend what the word unconditional means. No conditions. Eric, God see is a condition, life is a condition, earth is a condition. Anytime there's conditions, there has to be a subject-object relationship. Consciousness is based in duality, in phenomenon. Yeah, right? So in spirit gym, as you know, I show God is zero. Unconditional love equals zero. Zero can only dream itself into existence because a mind is a duality. So in spirit gym, I show God is unconditional. That's zero. The first step is God dreams itself into being, just being. And within the dream, relationships emerge. Like how many times you've had a dream with multiple people in it, they're talking to you, or something's chasing you, or whatever. Once you have two points of sentience, sharing energy and information, now you have a mind. The best myth of all, in my opinion, for that, is Tantra. It's God dreaming Shakti into existence, and Shakti needing a lover, friend, consort, lover, and that's Shiva. So she creates Shiva, which represents the created universe. Shakti is the Holy Spirit in Christianity. She's the subject of God, the womb of God. She's the dreamscape. She's infinite energy or intelligent energy. And it's because she wants a lover that Shiva is created. And now you have two points of sentience. So now you have the basis for love. Love is the basis of all relationship. And now you have Shiva who says, I love you, Shakti, and Shakti says, I love you, Shiva. Now you have information flowing between two points of sentience. That's the beginning of mind. So paradoxically, love is the foundation of mind. And love is the foundation of sentience or consciousness, because you can't have consciousness without a subject, object, and without a positive, negative.
SPEAKER_07Right.
SPEAKER_03There has to be an is, isn't, should, shouldn't, male, female, empty, full, or you can't be conscious of anything. You can't make any meaning out, it doesn't mean anything. And so the point I'm making is when I have merged into God, first of all, it's scary as a motherfucker on the way in because you realize you're dying. Your identity is dying. And it is very hard to let go of that. And one of the times that that was most mind-blowing to me was I was doing my Tai Chi ruler practice, which I'd gotten from Fong Ho, my master at the time. And I was many years in by this time. I'd probably by that time I was probably 12 or 15 years into my daily practice. And I shared this on the podcast before, so forgive me for if you've heard it before. But I was just going out, it was sunset, and I just got home from work, and it was probably about uh it was probably about five five o'clock. The sun was maybe, you know, 45 minutes left before it went below the horizon. And the Tai Chi ruler is a very active practice. You know, you're standing on your feet and you're moving this ruler in circles, timing it with your breath. So it's kind of like doing lunges with a circular movement. Um and the next thing you know, I hear Angie screaming, Paul, your dinner's been on the table for 45 minutes. What's wrong? Come eat. And I'm like, and all of a sudden I'm like, what's going on? And it's pitch black outside. I'm wet, the ground's wet. And she walks down into my rock garden area and says, You realize how long you've been out here? And I'm high as a fucking kite, dude. I'm like, I am as high as like two hits of LSD, but clean as a freaking whistle, not like a drug high. Just I am like merged with everything. And it and it's and I said, What time is it? She says, It's like 7:40 at night. And so the point is, as I went deeper and deeper, I got to the point where there was nothing. There was no me, there was no light, there was no dark, there was nothing. And I've been there on plant medicines as well.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03But you don't realize that you can't know what God is, because to get there, you have to lose the subject-object duality created by the ego. And so you can't say anything about God. All you can talk about is on the way in and on the way out. Yeah, for sure. I love that. And that's why I keep reminding people everything that people call scripture is just somebody else's experience.
SPEAKER_07Yeah, about the God.
SPEAKER_03And remember the word about means around. It doesn't mean in or through. Yeah. And I say, why do you why do you want to keep worshiping other people's ideas? Why not invest in having your own experience with God and create your own scriptures?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03Create your own code of conduct based on what you know God to be from direct experience. And that's ultimately how I created my own spiritual philosophy. I I, you know, you could see how much I've studied. I studied scriptures from all over the world. And I and I'm like, okay, well, isn't it interesting that all these world religions have very different views of what God is and what God wants, and people will fight and kill for these beliefs. Yet none of them knows what God is, or there would be empty pages or a mirror. You want to know what God is, just hand someone a mirror and say, There you go, meet God.
SPEAKER_05So I'm tracking with God is zero, and I've had a couple of like devastating encounters with that truth. Good. The thing that comes next for me is like God is no condition. I see as like the field from the potential of all the things can, but then I feel like the next, at least in like my cosmology, is like the next most fundamental force is this thing that when I imagine it, I imagine almost like a golden thread, but it's what I would call like the inclination towards the true and the good and the beautiful. And that definitely feels like it has a preference. So it's not capital G, capital O, capital D, but it feels like it's like the fundamental, like uh demigod. And so I'm curious how you conceptualize that.
SPEAKER_03And if that's a great exploration right there. I'm glad you're bringing that up because there's a lot of people that are very confused on this. See, I studied tarot now for 15 years. Um, right behind you there, I have over 13 years of my daily tarot draws, and I followed the raw system of I need to read that.
SPEAKER_07Jung and Steiner?
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Um, I've I've I've gotten deep into tarot, but I followed the Egyptian system. And it took me a year and a half of daily work to go through the Egyptian system of actually learning tarot, like the because the tarot was developed by the Egyptians to train Egyptian priests. It was part of their initiation process, and it's you know, a minimum of 2,000 years old. Um but what you do is you actually use what Jung called active imagination. And so I ask my soul to connect me to the archetype of the fool or the magician. So in that system, they first you go through each of the major arcana one at a time and you meet them and you ask them to guide you and teach you.
SPEAKER_06That's cool, right?
SPEAKER_03And I've got all the notes to show you. I've got diagrams, and some of these meditations were three hours long. I got so damn deep into these things. Uh, I forgot that I had a body sitting in a chair in California. Um, then they give you pairings, and so you learn how these archetypes interact with each other in relationship. Then you give you triplets. Well, there's 22 major arcana, so you go through all singles, then you go through pairs, then you go through triplets. So it took me a year and a half of daily work from 90 minutes to three hours a day. Very few people will devote that kind of time. Um Why this is relevant is because
I've studied archetypes for years and and there's not really very much writing, even Jung doesn't really have any very good explanations of what an archetype actually is. Like what is it? How do they get created? What I found by meeting them is that first you have to go back to myth. And the best definition of myth comes from James Karst. Myth is a story that tells itself. So if you said, okay, what is the ultimate story of stories? What would it be? I'd say good versus evil. Life. Life life is the story that contains all stories. Beautiful. Yeah. So who could be the one telling the story of life? It can only be God because it's God that is the source of life.
SPEAKER_07Okay.
SPEAKER_03So what I found by talking to these archetypes and saying, Who are you? They said, To you, we are gods. To God, we are the characters in God's dream that make up the story of life. And we are the ones that create your ability to perceive what life is. You understand that? So in God's dream, they are the characters enacting the story. But they are imbued with God's creative ability and they channel it down into creation. And, you know, not all creatures have the same archetypes. We are interacting with the ones that create the human psyche. But beings I've met on the sun, like the insectoids, the um praying mantis beings, for example, they will not be operating on the same archetypes. Now, having met and talked to the praying mantis beings, they have full access to everything that's human. Plus, plus their own. And they know a way more than we do. And I've met lots of beings that may know so much more than we do. It's a joke. So we're like little children to them. And just like you know everything that high schoolers and junior high schoolers and elementary schoolers and kindergartners learn, yeah, but they don't know what you know, yeah. Uh that's how we are to them. We're just like little kids in a sandbox. So the archetypes are the gods of creation. And I believe that's true at all levels, because anywhere there's a mind, there has to be archetypes, or there's no possible way to differentiate father from mother.
SPEAKER_07Right.
SPEAKER_03Or there isn't perception magic from birth. And I could go on through the archetypes. And so what I found is that the archetypes are actually um they are not physical things. For sure. Um, they are beings. Um, I've got a great book written by a union analyst, I think there's two or three authors on it, but they give a quantum physics explanation for archetypes, which is a theory, but it's very interesting.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Um, and had I not had these experiences directly with the archetypes, I probably would have fallen for that theory. Because I've studied a lot on archetypes, kind of trying to compare what did I learn. But uh, and if you actually study Stanislav Groff's books, he has many explanations of people in deep LSD journeys and holotropic breath work meeting the archetypes and having similar experiences to what I just described. Um, sometimes different, but very similar.
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SPEAKER_05Would you say that there is anything outside of the Egyptian catalog of the 21 archetypes as they reflect in the tarot? Or like do you think there's
like do you think there's like a fundamental grammar for the archetypes that are represented in the I I think the tarot are the 22 major archetypes of the human psyche.
SPEAKER_03But there are universal archetypes. For example, at the cosmic level, the three key archetypes which are fundamental to consciousness are space, time, and movement.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03So anything that moves falls into the archetype of movement. Anything that requires space is in the archetype of space. And wherever there's movement and space, there's time. Wherever there's relationships, even mental relationships, there's time.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03You can't be conscious without space, time, and movement. Those are universal archetypes. Nothing can exist in a perceivable mindscape without space, time, and movement. Right. I mean, to talk to you requires movement, space, and time. The vibrations. And even in a dream, you're in a dream space.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. And that's interesting. It's like movement is such a fundamental component to dreams, too. You know, like there's always some type of action happening.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So like these are really important concepts. And, you know, like I'm a question guy, and nothing irritates me more than an unanswered question. Like an important question. Like, I don't give a shit who's fucking who and stuff like that. Those are questions that are just a waste of time. Everybody's fucking somebody. And if they're not, they're fucking themselves usually. Um, either in the head or any other any other way. But of course uh God loves that too. Um but you know, I come from a background that required a lot of discipline. I was raised by a very, very strict man that didn't believe he his his motto was an idle child as a useless child, and he meant it. And uh I learned to overcome pain. I learned to overcome my inner voice of I don't want to do this. Because either that or get the shit beat out of you. And I mean the shit beat out of you, not some belt. That would have been a treat. Um and when your stepfather's a six foot four, 225-pound professional rodeo writer, it hurts.
SPEAKER_05And I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_03Don't be sorry. It made me tough. It gave me everything I needed to make my journey. It made the 82nd Airborne Division look like child's play. I used to laugh at these guys that are whining and crying for their mommies. I'm like, you guys are fucking pussies. You wouldn't last a day on the farm with my dad, I can tell you that. I even told a drill sergeant one time, getting up in my face being all Mr. Tough guy, I said, You wouldn't last one day on the farm with my father, so you don't scare me at all. Oof. That didn't go well, but I can imagine. I've put the work in, and any of my friends that spends time in this library knows that. There's literally hundreds of notebooks of my inner work and explorations in here. And and I'm saying this to you in a podcast to inspire you.
SPEAKER_06Oh, for sure.
SPEAKER_03And I'm what I'm saying to be clear is you have to be careful about reading books because the danger is that you believe it. If there's something worth reading, that's the first thing. Who is the author? Are they credible? And do they walk or talk? Paramahansy Ogananda, read. Ibn Al Arabi, read. Carl Jung, read. Rudolf Steiner, read. Itzak Bentov, read. Arthur M. Young, read. Houston Smith, read. Um Gene Gebser, read. Ken Wilbur, read. And I could go on and on, right? Um I've spent my life reading people that have achieved a legitimate level of mastery in some way. Um and that was my criteria to say if I'm going to spend time reading their book, I need to know if the author is credible. But look at who wrote writes most of these books today that people believe in. It's people that have monkey mind and can't stay off their fucking phone.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03Um but my point is like I go into dialogue with Carl Jung regularly. I say, okay, I don't understand what you're saying here, and that's not matching my experience. Um and I find out directly from them. And, you know, I had some big disagreements with Osho. I've got the entire Osho library, I've got 800 pages of handwritten notes from my studies of Osho, and there's things Osho said that I just flat out disagree with. So I went to Osho in the afterlife and said, Look, you know, I love you, but telling people they can't become enlightened if they're gay or homosexual doesn't fly with me. And how can a man of God say that? And telling people they got to be a vegetarian, it didn't even work for you.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And he told me, he said, I made a mistake. I wouldn't do that again. And he acknowledged it, you know. That's how I study. Yeah. And it takes a lot of discipline to study. You got to really do a lot of work. This is why um Jung and Bohm said almost the same thing. Real thinking is hard work. That's why most people just rearrange their prejudices and call it thinking. That's painfully true. But anyhow, I'm sharing that as an answer to your question about archetypes. And um, that's the best answer I can give. But I I know that to be true from my own direct experience.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, and when you share what you shared in response to my question about like the threat of the good and the true and the beautiful, and that that being like the fundamental myth or story of God, you know, life. It's like the will to more life. The metaphor that came to mind is like, you know, how with like TV screens, there's three fundamental colors, and they're so small, and there's thousands and thousands and thousands, and then they can create all these images. It's like the fundamental pixels of human perception and life are these 22 archetypes, and then it just fills up.
SPEAKER_03The good, beautiful, and true, I believe, from my own investigations, are there to show us the authentic nature of God. Yeah. Everything else is to you have to have to be conscious of something, you have to know what not good is evil. For sure. What not beautiful is is a value judgment. To God, everything's beautiful, even the darkest stuff. And true is is um true is uh a measure of fidelity with God consciousness.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03If something's true, it's true even to God as a metaphor. You know, if you're lying, you're lying.
unknownRight.
SPEAKER_03Um, if you're faking, you're faking. You can't trick God.
unknownRight.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_03You know, there's another concept that we want to introduce here, and that's great spirit. God is unconditional love. So God is the transcendent. There is nothing to know in as or about that God. That's pure potential. That's the Tao that can't be spoken. But great spirit is the sum total of the flow of all spirit within God. That is the great mind of God. That's the great dream and the great mind. So that is the sum total of all knowledge, all wisdom, all intelligence, all thought, all feeling, and all experience simultaneously at any given moment. And since God is infinite, when you're connecting to great spirit, there's no beginning or end to God. So you're connecting to something that was never born and never died. God's been dreaming forever, living in some way forever, evolving in some way forever.
I'll give you an example of exactly that. You know, my concerns over artificial intelligence led me to saying to my soul, actually to my unconscious, because the unconscious, and this is Shakti. It's that's what the unconscious is, it's Shakti. That would be a long explanation, but it's Shakti. I hear you. And so I said to Shakti, I said, Look, I'm I'm, you know, is artificial intelligence new or is it new to us? Uh Shakti said, it's billions of years old. And I had another experience where I was shown the truth of that. But Shakti said to me, Paul, there are civilizations five billion years more advanced than you, that have not only gone through all the trials and errors that you're going through, she said there's many civilizations that completely destroyed themselves with artificial intelligence, especially using it with weaponry. Um, but she said, many of these spacecraft that your people view that appear and disappear and seem to be living craft are artificial intelligence. But it they've they've gone beyond artificial intelligence. It's actually, um, I'm trying to think of the right words for it, conscious machines. They've gone past artificial and they can project their own consciousness into the machine, and the machine carries out their thoughts. That's why these things can turn at 90 degree angles at Mach 6, because they're not in a dimension that's controlled by the same physical laws that ours are. And this is why not everybody sees them, because you have to be able to penetrate into the astral dimension or into these higher vibrational dimensions. And sometimes they let themselves be seen because they're inviting you to look deeper. They're, you know, luring you to show you there's a lot more to you than you realize. The more advanced the civilization, the more they realize what we are, where we're at in our evolution. So they're kind of like big brothers and big sisters saying, you know, one day you can have a car. I'll take you for a ride in my car. You know, um, one day you look look in my wallet. There's a thousand dollars. You can do that too. Well, they're doing it at every level. They're showing this is what you can do with matter. You can actually make it conscious. This is what you can do with life, this is what you can do with your mind, this is what you can do with love. They're showing us all the time for people that aren't too boxed into ideas and beliefs. Um, so the whole thing of artificial intelligence is just one example of, and and you know, Shakti said to me, You guys are in a very precarious position right now because the people that are behind the development of artificial intelligence are very spiritually underdeveloped.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And in the past, when spiritually underdeveloped people have created advanced technologies, it's it's created massive catastrophes.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, it kills people.
SPEAKER_03It kills, it can completely destroy a whole planet. I mean, just vaporize it.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Uh you know, sometimes it's not the artificial intelligence, what the artificial intelligence is doing and using like nuclear weapons. We have enough nuclear weapons on the planet to destroy the planet 179 times over right now. So all you need is artificial intelligence to trigger a nuclear Armageddon and it's done, and the world will be like dust. But you know, that's part of our evolution. Steiner goes deep into human evolution, and I won't go too far off the beaten track, but anyhow, I just wanted to make some of these points. And the point was good, beauty, and true. Or we would never recognize God when we truly encounter God. Beautiful. Love is also an archetype. Yeah, unconditional love is the archetype metaphor that gives birth to all archetypes. So it is looking into itself. There is the characters being dreamed into existence that make consciousness possible. Because God cannot know itself otherwise.
SPEAKER_07Right.
SPEAKER_03That's the that's the fundamental paradox of God. God can't know itself unless it dreams itself into existence because God is that for which there is no other. There's nothing for God to relate to.
SPEAKER_05Nothing behind.
SPEAKER_03There's nothing behind God. Everything's inside of God. And so the paradox is God has to dream these polarities into existence.
SPEAKER_06For sure.
SPEAKER_03And, you know, if you want to see the polarities, just ask how many people's mothers and fathers fought a lot. Well, but how many of them also made love and made you made the chance for you to be here? So you see all these archetypes, they're neutral in polarity. They're the story carriers. You can be the loving mother, or you can be the addicted, distracted mother. You can be the loving father, or you can be the tyrant and the pedophile. All of that is an experience for God. It's all the stuff that makes the story of life so real. But the archetypes themselves never say, oh, you know, that's that's a little too much violence. You're you know, that's a little too kissy kissy. Um or what would happen is we would not have free will.
unknownRight.
SPEAKER_03We would not be able to become conscious on our own accord because you'd now just be a character in a video game.
SPEAKER_05For sure. So it feels like the next step for me, you know, there's capital G, capital O, capital D, God has no condition. Then there's like the threat of the good and the true and the beautiful. And then what I've noticed in my personal life is that there's almost this like interior somatic musical quality to the fork and the choices I have in any given moment, where, at least in my conception, when I choose to say the True thing instead of obfuscate or lie. It's like I'm hitting a note in key that has like a type of resonance with it. When I take a moment to appreciate something beautiful and just like allow it to really meet me, or if I create something that just feels like it hit the intention, there's this musical quality to it. Sure. Huh?
SPEAKER_03Oh yes. That's the sound of God singing itself into existence. Everything is music, everything is art, everything is poetry, everything is math. God meets you any way you want to go.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And you understand my point?
But there feels like there's there feels like there is the felt sense of missed notes and there's dissonance. And that there's like a really good example is if you are withholding something because of shame. It feels like you're almost like accumulating the momentum of building and building on top of further and further dissonance from like that home court.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. That that right there, by the way, is what stops you from actually really seeing God. You see the illusions you have to generate to make your story work within what you're trying to create. So if you're trying to convince your wife that you're not having sex with another woman, you have to generate an illusion and hope that the illusion works, which is the domain of Lucifer.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And the problem is you have to carry that illusion in yourself, right? So whenever you're trying to see God, you have to look through the illusions you're carrying. That's why all the mystical traditions through antiquity have a long process of purification. And if you study tarot, it's a lot about purification. You can't get through the womb of Shakti, which is tarot 21, the world. That's the naked dancer with the two healing wands, and the Vesica Pisces is the vagina. That's the return back to Shakti. That's the return back to unconditional love. You can't get through that gate unless you've purified yourself of all illusion. Because illusions cannot exist in God. They simply cannot exist in God at that level. Think of a layer cake of vibration. We're down here at a very low vibration where matter forms and crystallizes. So this is the crystallization of the dream. But everything's moving very, very slow here. It has to. Because if you were in the astral dimension and you were a Hitler, you could destroy as fast as you could think. So you would be wiping souls out. If you get into the astral dimension, you'll be in a dimension that matches your spiritual development. But when you get, like if you want to go meet Rumi, you're going to go to a dimension that is very, very high vibration and very, very loving and very, very free of all these um illusions and withholds. Because that's the dimension Rumi exists in. So you can only have ideas about someone like that. You can't really meet them until you can frequency match them, unless they want to come help you by their own choice. If you look at Tarot, the process of purification begins in tarot seven with the chariot. The armor that he's wearing is not battle armor, or he'd have a shield on his face. That's the armor that he has to develop to learn to manage the tendency of his mind to go to the negative and to self-denigration and fear and insecurity and self-judgment and judgment of others, creating more illusions. The two sphinxes represent the forces of consciousness, and there's no rigging on that chariot, which means the chariot goes wherever your mind goes. And mythologically speaking, there's something even deeper in tarot number seven, very few people realize. Mythologically speaking, if you ever encounter a sphinx, it will give you a riddle. And if you do not solve it, it will kill you. So what tarot seven is saying to you, if you do not solve the riddle of your own mind, you're likely to crash this chariot. Yeah, that's so true. And if it doesn't kill you or somebody else, it'll hurt you.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And the pain teacher will come to show you where you're creating illusions. And so tarot seven is the beginning of the purification process. Tarot eight means you're in enough pain, you got to look deep enough into yourself to find your own soul or God within you. What's tarot nine? It's Jesus going off into the desert to meet Beeslebub, the devil. It's Mara meeting, it's Buddha meeting Mara, the great tempter. And this is a mythological reality that every mystic goes through. And so tarot nine is actually the hermit isolating him or herself from the distractions of relationships and people so that they can do the deeper work in themselves to heal and to purify and to come face to face with the mirror of themselves. Then you have tarot 10, which is the divine mirror that says whatever is happening in your life is what you're creating. So you better pay close attention because you're the one creating the illusions that you keep running into. That's why Jung said, if you don't meet your unconscious on the inside, it'll meet you on the outside in the vents of your life and you'll call it fate. That's tarot 10 straight up. So without going through each of them, you get to tarot 17, the star. The star is the next deeper stage of purification, where you have to master not only your mind, but the ability to use your heart. And so she's got those two urns, water represents consciousness, and she's having to consciously control the flow of consciousness. So Tarot 17 is actually the evolved hermit who is in the world sharing their love and their wisdom with others. Osho said, if you want to be a star, you better learn to play with fire. Because what happens to most mystics to tell the truth about God? They get killed. What happened to Jesus? He got nailed to a tree. So the challenge of Tarot 17 is that you not only have to work on perfecting your relationship with God and your soul and your spirit and the unconscious, all of which are the self. You have to be very, very conscious about how much you share with unconscious people, which is why Jesus said don't throw pearls to swine. It's exactly what he meant. He means don't say things to people they can't understand, because if they misunderstand it, it might end up causing more trouble than good. And it can cause you more trouble than good. I just happen to be at an age that I don't really need anybody else's approval.
SPEAKER_07You don't give a fuck.
SPEAKER_03I don't care what people think. I just say, look, I'm going to put a buffet of my own experiences out. And my dream is not that you believe anything I say.
My dream is that you do the work to go figure it out for yourself. Like there's a lot of people that say, oh, Paul Czech's fucking crazy. He's a cult leader.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Good. Well, I say this to you: do the meditations, do the time in yourself, test the things I tell you.
SPEAKER_06For sure.
SPEAKER_03And come to your own conclusion because you've done the honest work to get past just swapping prejudices and really come face to face. And if you've got a better idea, I'm going to be the first guy that wants to hear it. I'm always interested.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I wish there was like a way for there to be some type of artificial intelligence gatekeeper that keeps a person from sharing a hateful judgmental comment without them first having to confess how much time have they researched the topic? How many hours have they focused on the craft? How many things have they, you know, like where there was some type of resume of proof? Because the thing is there. It's there. Well, no, what I'm saying is like the people who critique I understand. They don't have it. You know, like they have an Instagram account with no user, like with no picture of themselves on their profile picture. I understand that.
SPEAKER_03That's fine. I'm gonna give you some words you've heard many times before. Jesus said, by their fruits ye shall know them. Without okay, good. What does it mean when someone doesn't even tell you who they are? No fruit. What does it mean when someone just criticizes everybody? No fruit. Rotten fruit. Yeah. I'm telling you, you know, mystics like Jesus, if Jesus really lived, that's another story. Oh but it doesn't matter. I mean, nobody knows if Lao Tzu lived. I've investigated Muhammad, Jesus, and Lao Tzu spiritually through books, through studies. Let's just say there's plenty of mystery around those three. Interesting. Uh but it doesn't matter because timeless truths are timeless truths, they echo endlessly for our own salvation. And I don't mean salvation in a negative sense, for our own self-realization. Yeah. Um but it back to what I was saying, like just pay attention to what you know. Look at what Ticknaut Han left as the fruits of his existence.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03Beautiful man. It's good food. Yeah. Look at what Eckhart told. If Eckhart told dies tomorrow and you eat up everything he left, you won't become anything but something more beautiful. 100%. If you really study the words of Jesus that we have access to, it's hard to say because it's all been so contorted and manipulated. But there's enough really good stuff in there. It doesn't matter whether Jesus was real or not, because it's all God just acting this out. The fruit is there.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03Um 100%. If you if you understand even the basics of Lao Tzu, it'll change your life forever. The fruit is there. You know, people accuse me of being a cult leader. I say, okay, yeah, let's look at that. I teach people to think for themselves, have a clear dream for their life, use their heart to feel what they know, pray and move their feet, quit acting like a fucking baby, wake up, clean up, grow up, show up and go do something in the world. Does that sound like a cult leader? No. But people project their own biases and insecurities onto anybody that, you know, doesn't fall into their own gestalt, but misery loves company, and that's just a reality.
SPEAKER_00Imagine
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SPEAKER_05And for what it's worth, I've been accused of being a cult leader too, and I use it on my resume. Like cult leader, great. It's it's a badge of pride. It's a badge of pride from the sense of everyone that I've ever met, and everyone listening can look around and you can feel that there is something incredibly sick with our culture. And so if there's anyone who's doing anything that has a type of gravity communally, it's going to elicit an immune response from the people who think that the way to live this life is to ignore the fact that we're going to die.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05To work for companies that they know they don't trust, that aren't trying to help the world, but it's because they want a paycheck and they're going to spend their weekdays in front of a TV with a computer on their lap, with a phone in their hand. And then on the weekends they're going to drink, and then they're going to have a midlife crisis. And if they see people over here hugging each other too long or making eye contact too long, or having success. Right. That it is two wives deeply triggering. And so I hope that like because a part of what I'm trying to do with the things I'm writing about is I'm trying to stir up people so they can start to become leaders. So they can act like in order step one. Can you feel that there is something so wrong and sick with our culture that it needs help?
SPEAKER_03Well, let's look at that. You want to look at that? Sure. Um, on one level, I agree because it's obvious. But now I'm gonna ask you a question. If you read the Bible, let's say it's 2026 year olds old, just to put some context to it. If I transported you back into the old testament days, would it be any different than right now?
SPEAKER_05In my opinion, I feel like it would be different because of the scale that technology allows for that we have now, where a single terrible Roman emperor is able to do more damage to the planet because of the tech that we have.
SPEAKER_03Okay, good. Were the intentions, the motives, and the way of living any different?
SPEAKER_07No.
SPEAKER_03No, it's the same fucking story. Women were treated like shit. I say to women all the time, if you study Christianity and you join that religion, I know you've got some serious daddy trauma to work through. Because that is one of the most ruthless religions. Islam, uh, I could go on and on. I studied these things very carefully. I tell people all the time, if you want to read a really revealing book, read the book When God Was a Woman by Merlin Stone. It'll wake you right up. Now, the point I'm making is look at all these scriptures. I don't care which ones, you can go to the most ancient tablets. It's wars. It's even wars amongst the gods. There's wars above and wars below. Okay. Now, here's my different perspective. What if the world, planet Earth, what if Mother Gaia devotes herself as a garden for souls that are actually in about kindergarten through third grade, and that the only souls that reincarnate here are two kinds teachers for the school, or also teach learning and learn teaching to use Ra's term, yeah, and the young souls that are just trying to figure themselves out. Um, I've
got two books written by a guy named, well, that is written as Dwal Kool, but it says he's the reincarnation of Confucius, and they're called the Rainbow Bridge. They're very good. Interesting. And he gives a structure. He says, for the average person to reach union with God, or what he calls enlightenment, is about 735 lifetimes. Now, this is just a structure. I'm not saying I buy into this, I'm just saying it gives a model. Long time. And he says the first 500 lifetimes that a human being lives is usually just spent drinking, partying, blowing shit up, getting lost, getting confused, uh, you know, learning morality, learning the very, very basics of a human life. He says the religious urge usually comes around the fifth, 500th lifetime. Then we spend the next 200 lifetimes reincarnating through each of the world religions so that we have the ability to experience different perspectives on God. So by the time we've gone through all the major world religions, now we're like someone who's lived through all the tarot archetypes. Now we know what it means to be a Muslim and really worship and love Allah. We know the Jewish approach, we know the Taoist approach, we know the Christian approach, and we can see the commonalities and the differences, we can see these paths to self-realization. Then around the 700th lifetime, you go through a process of progressive mortification. Yogananda says there's three things that are very, very hard for even the most advanced monks to drop. Now, I don't remember the exact specifics of how Dwalkool goes, but the last 35, 700 to 735, we got to drop the urge to eat. It's very hard to do. We got to drop the urge for sex, and it's very deeply ingrained into our DNA and into our instincts. So typically, food is the first. Sometimes it's sex, different pathways, different spiritual, different monks, different systems go at them at a different angle. Some go for sex first, some go for food first. A lot of monks have to and nuns take a vow of celibacy. We know a lot of them can't do that, just go to the Catholic Church. And then the final one is the body, the urge for a body. Wow. Yogananda says when you die, if you so much as crave a milkshake, you'll reincarnate to get one.
SPEAKER_07Wow.
SPEAKER_03So it is the urge to have anything in the context that we know of as life on earth, from food to body to sex to things, that draws us back into the process of experiencing, and we finally have to reach a point where we're ready to let go of elementary school and graduate to higher dimensions of reality, but you have to purify yourself of those desires. So the context I'm trying to share with you, if it's not obvious, if you look at the earth as a third-grade school where people are throwing spitballs at each other, putting glue on toilet seats, pulling hair out, scratching, fighting over the hopscotch box. Now, if you go to a third grade classroom and go to recess on third grade and you see people doing stuff like that, you say, well, what do you expect? You know, these are only six, seven, eight-year-old kids, and that's just, they're just emulating their parents, and that's you know what we do. We're just little monkeys. Now, if you come back to third grade 10 years later and you go, what the fuck's going on here? These idiots are still doing the same spitballs, hopscotch, and and stupid shit. And I I I have to remind you, um, you came back to a third grade classroom. The souls in this classroom are third grade souls. The point of Making is that the souls that come to Earth are somewhere between kindergarten and third grade development. So if you study all the scriptures throughout the history of man, you see what happens in kindergarten through third grade. But like I said, you go to Venus. If I could take you with me on an astral journey to Venus and show you, or some of the other places I've been, like the sun, you would go, oh my God, there's where everybody is that came out of third grade and then high school. You go to the sun and you meet people that have graduated, well, say university. That's what the sun is. The sun's like the central locus of intelligence in the logos of our solar system. Think of the sun as a living being and everything in its heliosphere as its children. It is the guiding intelligence of its own being. Like the earth is the guiding intelligence of her own being, but she's intimate with the sun and the moon. And they're all working together. Steiner explains all this beautifully. But like if you go to these different planetary spheres and look into these different dimensions, you can actually see there's a process of souls evolving from very low levels. And the more materialized they are, usually the less conscious they are, because spirit falls asleep when it's wound as tightly as matter has to be wound. So when you've got a physical body, it takes a lot to raise the vibration enough to do things like astral travel remote because you've got to actually get out of your physical body. And that's exactly what alchemy is all about. That's what that's why alchemy is so beautiful. It's free of all the religious baggage and it doesn't give you a bunch of religious crap about God. In fact, some alchemy books refer to God as the dragon. I got books right there. The dragon is everything. It is the bark on the trees, it's the mountains, it's the volcanoes, it's the rivers, it's the oceans. They're just saying God is everything. But in alchemy, they teach you that God falls asleep in its dream and it crystallizes in the material form, and that the goal of alchemy led confusion, delusion, misunderstanding, material sleepiness to gold, consciousness, being awake, gold is also the symbol for gold, is the symbol for the sun, it's the symbol for the self, it's the symbol for the spirit and the soul. So lead to gold is the alchemical transformation of unconscious to fully conscious. And and so, you know, without a long alchemy lesson, the whole sphere of the planets and the sun is all involved. So do you see my perspective? I'm saying, yes, what you're talking about there, I get it. But I'm saying part of what I see your frustration is is why do people keep acting like third graders and doing this kind of shit and getting lost in video games and AI? Because if you give a bunch of third graders an iPhone, they'll get lost in it.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. So to step into your metaphor, what what I feel like I'm trying to do is you said that there's two types of souls that incarnate on Earth, and like one are the teachers, teachers, and then the other ones are the ones that just need help. Yeah. I'm trying to put out a I feel
like I see a lot of sleeping teachers. Yeah, well, a lot of sleeping potential leaders, and I'm not trying to talk down on the leaders. I'm trying to poke the sleeping leaders to start to respond.
SPEAKER_03Well, yes, just remember that everybody that's less conscious than you is your student. Everyone that's more conscious than you is your teacher. So there's actually nothing here but teachers and students, and even Eckhart Toll is evolving, even Buddha was evolving. There is no end to enlightenment, it's it's infinite. So this is where Ra's concept of teach, learn, learn, teach is ubiquitous. Like there's people that are way more enlightened than I am, and that's why I love looking for them. Because they inspire me to grow. Um, and there's people that are a lot less awake than I am, and and that's what I came to what did Lao Tzu say? He said, What is a bad man but a good man's job? What is a good man but a bad man's teacher? He said it right in the Tao De Jing. It's bang on. That's why I say if you understand Lao Tzu, you can get rid of all this other stuff. It's just a distraction. That's how you know how deep someone is. Okay, I'll give you an example. By their fruit you shall know them. Okay, what kind of mind, heart, spirit, and level of consciousness? If I said to you, create one symbol that's as simple as possible, that explains everything in the created universe, how long would it take you to do that? A whole life. Lao Tzu did it. He gave us the one symbol that is as simple as it can get, that explains all of it. Even unconditional love, because if you put a point dead center in the Tai Chi symbol, no matter how fast it spins, the axle is not moving. That's unconditional love. That's called the pivot of the Tao. And that's God pouring itself into its dream. Shakti is the black fish, Shiva is the white fish in Tantra. So, you know, what you see is when you study like someone like Lao Tzu, you're getting to universal truths that are true no matter what context you can put any religion into the Tai Chi symbol, you can put any experience in life in there. There's nothing that doesn't fit in that symbol. The point is by your fruit show shall know them. Lao Tzu, whoever he is, wherever he, whatever that is, whoever figured that out had to have been that deep to come to that realization. And look what that offering is to the rest of us. I spent years studying that symbol. I spent years studying Taoism and um the Tao Dijing, and there's another great author that would be a great mind fuck for you. His name's Wei Wu Wei. Whoa. And he wrote a series of like six or eight books. That's an incredible name. That's such a good name. Yeah, I know, and his books are deep and powerful. I mean, I've got a whole library over there of like I've I've got all the world religions. You can see all my studies of them. I got like 25 different Bibles, I don't know how many of them. But like when you get into what Lao Tzu was really saying, and you study the other books attributed to Lao Tzu, they're stunning. Stunning. I I I remember as I was really getting deeper and deeper into this, I'm like, who would even want to bother with all this other stuff when they realize what's being said right here? 81 verses of poetry, anybody could read it in an afternoon or a day, and if that becomes your manual for life, you can take all the Bibles and all the scriptures, you don't need them. He's telling you not only how life works, how nature works, how mind works, how love works. It's all there. Yeah. And I say, you know, by their fruit you shall know them. Go to the real masters. But you know, reading it's one thing, living, it's another thing.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And Edgar Casey has a quote that's so painfully true. Did you remember that quote from my podcast? It is so good. I recorded it.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_03It's shocking. Your spiritual evolution is not determined by your highest understanding, but by your worst behavior.
SPEAKER_08I love that.
SPEAKER_03That's lightning. That that is lightning that that illuminates anyone's shit that's honest with themselves. 100%. And and there it is. And that's why purification is so important. And it's something I have to work on all the time. I have got so much fire in me. It's you know, it's hard to purge yourself of the pain and the trauma and the um anger and the disrespect the dis the disappointment of and you know, those are the formative forces that can really m give us the courage and the strength and the drive to face the darkness and do something.
SPEAKER_05Right.
SPEAKER_03But but you know, in and this is why the sword is the symbol of mine in tarot, the thing that saves you can kill you. It's things that saves others can kill others. And um you know, I I'm just so grateful for Jung's teaching on the shadow because it's really given me tools to watch myself and really find the parts of myself that I don't want to find. 100% that I don't want to admit are there.
SPEAKER_00And um if
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SPEAKER_05Like my version of the Christian going into the confessional. My version of that is
I actually record my dreams and I look for my dreamer to call out my bullshit.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05And it's it has been one of the greatest relationships that's so hard to, and it's one of the reasons why I get so excited to try to help people who don't have a connection with their dream life to start to have one. It's like, yo, there is someone, there is an intelligence that's waiting to like be your corner, like if you were a fighter, like the ultimate corner of all corners that's millions of years old, that loves you so much that it creates entire worlds for you to show you your own blind spots. That's the self. And it's and it's it's right there and it's alive. And man, it's you much of what I do and why I'm able to do what I do with the type of like conviction and audacity that I do bring to it is because I just do what I feel like my dreams tell me.
SPEAKER_03That's how Jung largely ran his life. Um, we were talking or earlier before we were on the podcast, and you asked me how often I dream. And I I noticed that as I grew deeper into connection with my soul, my highest self, my unconscious, um, and because I work with them constantly, first thing I did when we started the CODS was connect with that part of myself and ask it to connect us to everybody listening at that level, um, then the less the soul needs dreams to get past the ego's firewall. And so now when I dream, it's very important to me because the first thing that it makes me want to say when I come out of the dream is to did I miss something. Were you trying to get a message to me that I wasn't that I was too distracted to get or uh and and oftentimes um my soul doesn't say no, you were you didn't miss something, but I wanted you to have an experience of an aspect of yourself that you need to be more conscious of. And if I was simply to tell you this, it wouldn't have the same impact as you experiencing yourself, right? Um I'll give you an example. One night I had a really crazy dream, maybe a year ago. And in the dream, I was in my bed sleeping, which is exactly what I was doing, but I heard people running up and down the hallways and going up and down the stairs, talking to each other, say things, things like hurry up, hurry up before they wake up. And I'm like, what the fuck is going on? But this dream was so intense, I didn't know I was dreaming. I was like, it was lucid. And so then in the dream, I got up, ran out my bedroom door, and there was like a dozen people carrying furniture down the stairs and just stealing everything they could get their fucking hands on. And they saw me come out the door, and I said, What in the fuck are you guys doing? And they say, We're taking stuff. You have too much stuff. It's not fair. You should give this to us. I said, This is I worked my ass off for this. Quit you're being disrespectful. I don't care what your story is. And if you did believe that, you should knock on my door and share that with me and give me the opportunity to share it with you. And I was getting pissed off. And they were just keeping carrying stuff out like they were kind of half listening to me and ignoring me. And one of them would stop and say something. And I finally said, Look, I'm gonna give you a choice. You either put that stuff down and get out of my house, or I'm gonna start kicking ass. And then I woke up. Interesting. Oh, actually, before I woke up in the dream, I yelled out my window to my buddy Steve, who used to live right there where Tucker is down the hill on my property, because Steve's a jiu-jitsu, very experienced with jujitsu. And I yelled, Steve, get up here really quick. People are up here ripping us off. I need your help. And then I woke up. So I said to my soul, when I woke up from that dream in the middle of the night, like all jacked up, heart racing, and pissed off. Wow, I said, Why did you give me that dream? And my soul said, Because you need to feel and remember what it's like to be like most people in the world, and you need to go deeper into your capacity to share everything with those that need it. So all the furniture and all the stuff was symbolically representing wisdom. And the wisdom for me was try to give as much as you can away. Try to someone asks you a question on the street, try not to blow them off. Um to have some empathy and compassion for the rest of God that's caught in their dream or their nightmare. And so, really, what it what the dream did was it allowed me to come face to face with that level of consciousness. If I can get a hold of it, it's mine, kind of like a pirate mentality, like is really rich in the world today. But my soul was saying you shouldn't have told them you were going to kick their ass. What you should have said is go ahead and take it because you know you can create more, you you have the resources to refurniture your house. And then I said to my soul, What doesn't that just give them license to keep doing that to me and everybody else? And they don't really learn anything. And my soul said, That's not your job. Your job is to buy more furniture. And instead of yelling at them, sit at the front door and wait for them and talk to them about what's really going on and teach them how to do what you've done. And that's you know, Abraham Lincoln said the best way to help the poor is not to become one of them. People got really mad at him for saying that. But what he said was don't keep giving them money, teach them how to make money for themselves, teach them how to create the life they want, or you're just pacifying their it's like giving a drug addict money, it never works.
So when you say, and I'm just curious, and you've talked about this before, but like when you're in communication with your soul, what is the subjective experience? Do you speak out loud? Do you speak to speaking words in your head, or is it more of like a your soul is your position? Well, yeah, but what I'm asking is like for someone who doesn't have this type of relationship with their soul, yeah, to help them locate what it would feel like to ask their soul and then to hear it, it's what's it like subjectively for you?
SPEAKER_03Uh look, it's the same for everybody. Uh what does it sound like when you're talking to yourself inside? Go inside your head right now and go three plus three equals and then go three plus three plus three equals, and you'll hear yourself doing it, won't you? Yep. Okay, good. Now empty yourself. Let your mind go. Just say, dear soul, please say something to me, but listen and don't talk. Did anything happen? Yeah, I said hey. Say what is your name? What should I call you, my dear soul, when I want to reach you? Ask the question and dump your mind and listen with your whole being. You can't hear, say, dear soul, I'm having a hard time hearing you. Speak louder, please. Perfect.
SPEAKER_06Thank you.
SPEAKER_03And I'll tell you another trick. Bring your consciousness to your heart and open your heart and say, Dear soul, please come to our heart so I can feel that it's you. And then if you need it to speak louder, say speak louder. It's important for me to hear you. And open your heart like you're hugging someone you love.
SPEAKER_05All right, so I have a couple of interesting things to share. One is I I notice that there's this part in me that as soon as I attempt to do something like this, there is this jumping childlike part that wants to like almost knock everything over and like shout a word.
SPEAKER_03And that's the ego, because it knows every step you go into your soul, it's beginning to die.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03So it's gonna resist spiritual development every step of the way because there's the artificial intelligence that you really should be worried about. Beautiful. Did you get a name from your soul?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I got Ibis. Oh, good. Because what as I felt that voice come in again and again. And the thing about the Ibis is that there's a very distinct dream character that has evolved with me for the last few years that feels like that bird, but much grander. And I could I instantly felt that's that's my soul. Okay.
SPEAKER_03Then work with it.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_03That's the code word that means your intention is to speak to that part of yourself which is the grand total of all your life experience. It's the experience of being Eric Godsey in this lifetime, but it's all your lifetimes concentrated in one. So the soul is that which is having the experience. Spirit, spirit is what it is experiencing. Thoughts are spirit themselves.
SPEAKER_07Okay.
SPEAKER_03Thought is the flow of spirit. What can you create out of thought? Anything, because God says yes. Okay. But there is no such thing as a soul without spirit, or what would it experience? It would be like a drum that nobody plays. So spirit is the flow of energy and information, and soul is what is having the experience of living and being and being conscious. So it's the consciousness within you. Spirit is what it's conscious of. Yeah, that makes sense. The whole of creation is spirit, it's crystallized spirit at different vibrational levels. Um, the the chakra system is telling you that all these dimensions are enfolded into you like a Russian doll. From an alchemical perspective, the root chakra is the lowest vibration, it's linked to your bones. So it's the most concentrated form of consciousness, it's the most sleepy part of you. And then your crown chakra is your connection to God or unconditional love. So just like you have octaves on a keyboard or Dilrahemi Faso Lati, those are the octaves that are nested in each other. So spirits in a step-down relationship to create your physical body, and it's on a step-up relationship. So you have involution, big to little, God, soul, spirit coming into form, and evolution, which is little becoming big. So the chakra system is the rainbow bridge of the psyche and a two-way communication with the big self or God. The little self is you. The big self is everything in the dreamscape of God's mind, all of which is nested inside of us. So when we're in relationship with the self of us, we're in relationship with the unconscious, we're in relationship with the soul, we're in relationship with the personal unconscious, which is where the healing needs to take place, we're in relationship with our spirit or our highest self. The highest self is the source of the spirit in and as you. And we're in touch with the superconscious or the mind of God, and you have an ego. So if you take all those and imagine a sphere, and just like we have longitude and latitude, you could say that the highest self is the North Pole, Shakti, the unconscious is the South Pole, the soul is the flow of spirit, giving that being its experience, the superconscious would be the dotted circle around the Tai Chi symbol or the potential to create anything. My point is it's all one self, but we give aspects of it names to try to understand those functions. For sure. It's like coordinates. Like what?
SPEAKER_05Coordinates. Like it helps.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. But the point I'm making that may not be so obvious, the self is one thing. The soul and the spirit and the unconscious and the personal unconscious and the the they're all one thing, but we can relate to different aspects of it for different functions. Like there's things I talk to my unconscious about that I find are better questions than they are for my soul. There's things I talk to my highest self, like if I want to know what I'm here to do and what I should be focusing on for the future, my highest self is the better place to go. If I want to know uh how to heal a relationship with somebody, then my soul is a great place to go. Because it's the feeling nature of my being. Um but through time and inner work, and this is why in a lot of my classes, like tarot for soul guidance, I have exercises to take you in to meet these things, and I give you key questions to ask them, such as what is your name? How do I access you? My highest self is Ama. My unconscious is Ananda, my soul is Kidra. My self, the totality is ohano zero one zero. And I say, What does owano mean? It means the unconditional pretending to be you, which will ultimately become unconditional again. It's so it's the story of life zero, becoming one, becoming zero again. So my self is called awano. So when I want to talk to awano, which is the combined intelligence of all of those things, then I say Iwano. This is cool. So you know, but the this takes practice. Otherwise, you're just throwing labels on a wall. You don't know who you're talking to. You can be talking to a complex inside of yourself or a fragment. Like this has taken me a lot of years of deep inner work. And you find out things like, uh, you know, some of my students say the funniest things to me, like, my soul said I could eat a box of Oreo cookies every day and I'll still be healthy. I'm like, yeah, one of my students said, My soul said I can do uh DMT every day and that'll be fine. I'm like, no, you're not talking to your soul, you're talking to a complex, and you need to be very careful about that. So it takes a lot of practice to pick up what I call the signature of the soul, the vibration of the soul. There's a unique vibration when you're really talking to your soul that nothing can impersonate. But it takes a lot of, you have to be brave to talk to your soul. For sure. You've got to be brave to talk to your highest self. You even got to be brave to talk to your unconscious. Because until you're ready to hear the truth, you're gonna block it.
SPEAKER_06For sure.
SPEAKER_03You know, there I could give you a thousand examples of that. And and I have to be brave, you know, and your soul will take you on a hell of a journey. And and even with the most mundane of things. I've been out lifting rocks, and I say I always say to my soul, I let my soul guide it. You know, that's one of the things you got to practice letting your soul guide you in things that don't have an outcome objective, or you're the child in you gets too worried about the report card.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03So you you project onto the soul what your idea of deity is, which is usually the mother-father archetype projecting itself into your mind, or what Freud called the superego. Um, but for example, my soul will say, uh, I want you to put that rock up there. I'm like, that rock weighs 400 fucking pounds. I'm like, are you telling me to like do something that's gonna hurt me? And my soul said, You're more creative than that. What do you mean? I didn't say you had to lift it, but I did suggest that you put it up there. And so I sit and think, oh, so maybe like make a stairway out of stones and roll it up, my soul says, now you're catching on. So the point is, my soul has taken me up against myself and put me in situations that if I didn't ask more questions, would get me hurt. But when I do ask questions, my soul's always saying, slow down, think outside of the box, and be more creative. When I paint, I let my soul paint. Because I if I don't like the painting, who gives a shit? I can light it on fire.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03So I just let, because there's no outcome objective, right? I don't have to worry about a teacher giving me a bad grade or, you know, but the point is, you see, if you're gonna be your own judge and act like your mommy, your daddy, or your school teacher, well, then you're not gonna want to connect to your soul because you're not gonna want to paint, because you're too afraid of the judge inside of you, which is part of the reason the purification process is inherent to spiritual development, because it takes tremendous spiritual courage to hear the voice of God in you, which is spirit and soul inside of you. You've got to be absolutely brave. Like a good example is your soul will tell you to be honest with people in the public, even if it gets you killed. There's no better way to die. Yeah, you know, and how many people are ready to do that? Um, that's ultimately what all my teachings are about. And and I can say it doesn't matter whether you believe, I tell my students, don't fucking believe anything I say, but be smart enough to go test it. Because even if I'm wrong, it's still a good exercise. What am I doing? I'm asking you to explore yourself. What a tough call. Yeah, if I asked you to take 36 pills of this and that supplement every day, you'd do it, no problem. That's a good point. You know, but if I ask you to sit still and have a conversation with yourself, 85% of them come back and say, I don't have time or I don't believe in it, or you know, you're a cult leader. I'm like, oh yeah, I'm asking you to talk to yourself. Imagine that, yeah.
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SPEAKER_05Yeah,
the thing that I always find that is tough for me, but your prompt to hey, if you're not sure, ask it again and ask it to be louder. That solved like a two-year lock I've had when it could like the way I currently will attempt to be guided by my soul is just kind of two ways. One is if I'm awake and conscious, it's like a strong artistic urge where the more surprising the inclination, the more I trust it as like something in my own conscious was able to pierce through. And if the spontaneous thought is something that scares my ego, I'm like, got it, do it. And then the other way is um through working with my dreams.
SPEAKER_04Yes.
SPEAKER_05So like if I have a dream, I'll sit with it, I'll watch for the spontaneous associations that arise and really like wait for the like quest that kind of organically arises from it, like the change in behavior. Those are the two methods that I currently have cultivated over the last 15 years to like attempt to be led by my soul because I've had enough experiences now where the more I'm afraid of doing something that feels like it's coming from my soul, the more bountiful the response from reality is. But the conscious attempt to drop in and ask has always been locked for me.
SPEAKER_03I'm gonna help you with that. My soul just told me to make sure I tell you this. You probably have heard me do this with people before, but maybe need to practice it more, and everybody should. I'm gonna take you through a clearing request. Now, this can take hours to finish. Once you say these words, pay close attention to what's happening in you. I don't want to say it. I want you to experience it. Okay? Dear soul. Say it. Dear soul. Please clear me. Please clear me. Of all disembodied souls?
SPEAKER_05Of all disembodied souls. Entities, entities, spirits, spirits, or complexes. Or complexes. That can block our clear communication. That can block our clear communication.
SPEAKER_03Please let me know when we are clear. Please let me know when we are clear. No, just feel what starts happening right now. What are you feeling inside?
SPEAKER_05It feels almost like a um big snake is like extending its insides to like see how much it can open, and that as it's trying to open, it can feel a bunch of like uh resistance, rock, things like that. And the felt sense that came through is that this process is going to, it's basically like it's going to be a purification process that will take months.
SPEAKER_03It takes a long time in the beginning because when you first ask that question, you got an entire lifetime of baggage hanging out in your unconscious, your wounds, your complexes. That's why people can't hear their soul because all those voices are talking at what that's what family systems therapy is all about, is meeting all those beings inside of you. So what people generally feel is energy moving all over the place. And it feels like someone's like throwing the garbage out. Stuff's just being thrown out here and there, and people will describe all sorts of very interesting stuff. But for me, it feels like someone's running around with a vacuum cleaner inside of me, and I can feel it going through all the different parts of my body, and I can feel areas where I've been holding emotion. And when by the time it's done, I feel open. Uh my fear is gone, insecurities gone. I'm calm. I'm um I'm like a beautiful sounding board that's willing to listen and trust. Because I know once that's done, I can trust that I'm hearing my soul, not some part of me impersonating my soul to give me the illusion that I want to live to meet my insecurities, fears, dogmas, or fantasies. Um, but I've found in my own work with myself that in the beginning, sometimes it would take my soul a day or two, and I would still feel the cleaning going on. And I realized I couldn't begin a dialogue until that work was done because I would not be confident of who I was talking to. And I found that the more I do it, the faster it goes. Like right now, if I wanted to do a tarot draw, for example, which I don't need to do, I can just my card, my soul will show me the images and I can just tell you what they're yeah, that's the goal is to use tarot as training wheels to get past it. Um that's cool. That's how Jung did it too. Uh I don't know. Yeah, Jung used tarot until he got to the point where it just worked inside of him, and and and I reached that level a few years ago.
SPEAKER_05But uh Wow, I didn't know that. That's so cool.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Exactly how it works. And tarot is training wheels to learn to work with your psyche at a deeper level. Um But the point is now I can do it, and it's uh, you know, anywhere between five and thirty seconds, maybe a minute, depending on how wound up I am about something or what's going on or whatever. But I also practice heart breathing every day. So that is a very powerful resonant, harmonizing, and purifying practice. And that's what my soul has led me to for the last couple of years, because I find heart breathing is even more powerful than any of the other exercises I've done, such as tai chi, qigong, yoga, all that, because those things can help with this or that. Like tai chi can bring your brain, your heart, and your gut into resonance, it can calm your mind, but it's not teaching you how to really bring your vibration up to that of unconditional love, to love fully without fear and insecurity. And because the heart chakra integrates the upper and the lower three, it's the masterplace. If you're gonna do spiritual work, do it here because any progress made in the heart is automatically transferred to the upper and lower three chakras. And so I've just learned it turns out that for my all the things I've done in my life, the most beautiful practice is one of the simplest ones. And the more I bring myself into the resonance of love, the easier it is to hear my soul, the easier it is to trust. That's why I said come to your heart and open your heart, because the negative aspects of ourselves have a hard time projecting themselves through the heart because that vibration is too high. So as long as we can open our heart with the intention to genuinely love, then I bring my consciousness to my heart and communicate to my soul from there. I try to do all my work from my heart because I find that I get far less interruption from either internal or environmental or external negative entities because a lot of people I work with are carrying all sorts of stuff in them. So um anyhow, those those are some things that have helped me and we could go on forever, but when I read your article, I just thought, you know, this is a great reason to sit down together and explore some of these concepts and just have a dialogue and see where it takes us. Yeah, we got to soul, so it's pretty good. Yeah, yeah, we got to soul, and we got to love and we got to third grade. Yeah. Anything you you want to share before we close the podcast? Anything you want to tell people about?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, so my soul felt like it was coming through. Um I would love to invite you to feel into like based off of what you can read in me and just like feel and know. If you could assign me a gong, like a 100-day protocol to do X, I would love to invite you to share it on the podcast for anyone else who's listening who feels the same, like, okay, I'm I'm I resonate with this, I'd like to try to do something.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
Put your feminine hand, your non-dominant hand, over your heart. Put the other hand on top of it. Close your eyes. As you breathe in, let your belly expand. So put one hand over your belly button for a second, the other on your chest. Breathe in through your nose, that activates the parasympathetic nervous system. Let your belly expand for the first two-thirds of the breath. Only in the last third, let your chest come up. Take as deep a breath as you can without any neck tension or struggle. Stay at the top of the breath until your body naturally wants to breathe out, and then just let it come out naturally and slowly and steadily. In through the nose, first two-thirds through the belly, last third through the chest. Just stay there until your body wants to breathe out, and then just let it go out at about the same pace you brought it in. And there's a pause at the bottom, just let your body breathe in when it wants to. Two-thirds, one third, as deep as you can with no struggle. Whenever possible, keep your tongue on the roof of the mouth behind your front teeth where it naturally goes when you swallow. Okay, that's called a full diaphragmatic breath that will oxygenate your body. If you do it at a nice slow, steady space, you'll get enough CO2 retention to activate your parasympathetic system, open your right brain, and give you the right frequency and brain activity to connect you to the wholeness of everything. Now, what we want to do is as we inhale, imagine we're standing in the center of the sun, and as we inhale, the sun's shining in reverse towards its center. See that center in your heart. So as you breathe in, visualize yourself that you're breathing the unconditional love of God. And just like the light of the sun shines out, let it shine into your heart and see it as God's unconditional love, filling your heart, filling, filling your body, filling your water. Just let yourself feel the bliss of God's love, unconditional or unconditional love, or even just love if that works. For somebody. If those other words are too lofty, just feel love. Let love be poured into you by intention. And now as you exhale, open your heart like you are going to hug someone you trust to really love and open your heart to. And on the exhale, hold the thought I give God's love to all beings in all places, in all times, in all dimensions. And on the inhale, I breathe God's love into my heart, into my being, into my water. I am healthy, I am whole. On the exhale, open your heart, I breathe God's love to all beings in all places, in all times, in all dimensions, and just wait till your body wants to breathe in. See yourself in the middle of the imaginary sun. As you're breathing in, see all the light of God coming from every direction at once, filling your heart with God's love. Filling your body, let it swell like a sponge, so swollen it's saturated, it's pouring out into your body. By the top of your breath, your body's full, your water's resonating with love, unconditional love, your heart's full. On the exhale, just I pour God's love out to all beings in all places, in all times, in all dimensions.
SPEAKER_08I breathe God's love into my being.
SPEAKER_03I am happy, I'm healthy, I am vital, I am whole, I open my heart and pour God's love out to all beings, in all places, in all times, in all dimensions. And once you get good enough, keep your heart open on the inhale and the exhale. And that trains you to keep your heart open in any circumstance. And now I'm holding my heart open as I breathe in. And I keep my heart open as I breathe love out to all beings in all places and all times and all dimensions. And I keep my heart open. As I fill myself with God's love, God's light, and God's presence. I see myself as vital, happy, healthy, and whole, living my dream, sharing my love, sharing God's love. I keep my heart open as I pour God's love out with my breath to all beings in all places in all times in all dimensions. I find somewhere between seven and twenty minutes of that. Do as much as you can while staying fully present. If I told you to do 20 minutes every day, but the f after five minutes your mind was saying, I'm in a hurry, I gotta get out of here, then the practice isn't really helpful. Five minutes of genuine heart breathing is better than twenty minutes of struggle or an hour of struggle. So for me, I'm just honest each day and say, look, right now I have the time to really immerse myself for the next 20 minutes or whatever. Some days it's like I just say to my soul, God, I'm feeling time pressure today. Is it's five minutes, okay? My soul always says, Yes, five minutes is beautiful. But you get to the point through practice where you actually begin to carry that into relationships and into work and into nature and into conversations, and you start having room inside of yourself for other people. You start having room to be empathetic and room for compassion. And you realize that you know, even if someone doesn't like you or whatever, it's okay because you know how to make love and you're not dependent upon their approval for a sense of validation, being wanted, needed, or loved, because you you have a love affair with God, and you realize that the more challenging people are, the more the asleep they are, and and the more love they need. And so those are the people that we're giving this gift to. Because think of every outbreath of unconditional love you give is like adding water to the ocean and it lifts all the boats.
unknownFor sure.
SPEAKER_03And it's free. Like we're not asking them to change anything. I'm not saying I want you to stop being an atheist or stop being a satanic worshiper or uh uh, you know, a Christian or a monk. I'm just saying, hey, I'm doing my best to raise the vibration, and I know that if we make the soil better, then all the flowers and plants are better.
unknownFor sure.
SPEAKER_03All the trees are, all the birds are better. So I'm I'm doing a total giveaway. And I know that um That's your dream. That's that's the fulfillment of your dream. If I can put clean water in the fish tank, then all the fish win. If I can put fresh air in the atmosphere, everything that breathes wins. It's the one practice that teaches me how to love and gives it away at the same time. And there's the dream of all the people robbing my house, right? Instead of being angry about the furniture, the metaphor is just give them as much as you can. But the better thing would be not to give them all my furniture, it would be to say, hey, let's sit down in my living room. Let me teach you something that'll feed you for a lifetime, right? Um and and that's you know been my goal with all my teachings is to give people principles and practices that um aren't gonna go out of date. You know, so anyhow, but what a good ride, man. Thank you. It was a great share. I I I loved just exploring these things with you. It's an honor.
SPEAKER_05Really? Thank you. You've been such a positive, helpful mentoring influence in my life since like 2009. So just thank you for everything.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, thank you. And glad to know that you're I love, I love your article. I I'm glad to know you're doing what you're doing, and I'm grateful that you've been in Spirit Jim. And you've been to some of my other workshops as well. Um, I think you know, all of us realize it's learn, teach, and teach, learn. And we're in third grade for souls, you know, or kindergarten or somewhere in there. And um I believe everybody that's less conscious and less capable than we are is our child or our student. And everybody more conscious and capable of us than us is our teacher.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03And there are some teachers that are very conscious and capable in art or music or teaching a given subject, but they're terrible with interpersonal relationships with their spouse or their children or managing money. So enlightenment uh grows in, as Ken Wilbur says, in levels and lines. So somebody can be very enlightened in one area of their life but completely lost in another. For sure.
SPEAKER_05And I think um Shout out to Ken Wilbur. Incredible.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, no, Ken Wilbur's taught me a lot. And so I think it's important not to project the parts of ourselves onto other people that we need to meet and embrace within ourselves, right?
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Like I've had students from India want to kiss my feet. And I say, I'm sorry, but I I want you to kiss your feet. 100%. I understand the cultural intention. I know you're sharing gratitude with me, but I don't want you to see me in a way that creates the illusion that I'm somehow smarter than you, or more involved than you, or better than you. I want you to kiss your own feet. Yeah, for sure. Because what you're doing by kissing my feet metaphorically is you're seeing something in me that you don't think exists in you. 100%. The golden shadow. You know, so you want to kiss some feet? Kiss your own. Kiss your own. Because that's your temple. That's the one you need to love and keep clean. Um, I can kiss my own feet. So, anyhow, thanks to all of you guys. Hope you enjoyed the journey. I knew this would be a fun one with Eric. We we really didn't know where we were gonna go. We we knew the article was sort of the inspiration. Um, I'd say read the article though, because it's got a lot of great stuff in it that's real fun. And uh thanks for being on the journey with us. Hope you enjoyed the heart breathing practice and some of the soul connection stuff we went through. I hope you enjoyed it all. And I think Eric would agree, don't believe a damn thing we said, go test it for yourself.
SPEAKER_05100%.
SPEAKER_03You know, make it your own or not your own, but just remember anything you don't agree with any of us on is really beautiful because it's showing you exactly where the edges of your myth are. You know, that's I tell people all the time, you can agree with me or disagree. You're really just identifying where your myth is different than mine, but just know you've got to live that one, I've got to live mine. So make sure you're clear on what your myth is, or you're gonna be mythed by it.
SPEAKER_05100%. I couldn't agree more.
SPEAKER_03I always say just remember the story you're telling is telling you first. Most people need to think about that.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. Are you living a or is the story that's coming through you is it a tragedy or is it a comedy, or is it a hero's journey?
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05A lot of people are living tragedies, and it can change.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. You've got the pen that's called Free Will. So thank you to my sponsors for all your love and support. Beautiful products. Thanks for all of you for anything you buy from the sponsors that supports the podcast, supports you, supports the farmers that make biodynamic organic and free range products, and your money goes to support companies that are taking care of us on the planet. As you know, that's the circle of love. Love is a boomerang. Whatever you put out gets back to you. And so, uh Eric, thanks for the trip. Thank you, Paul. Enjoy the rest of your stay at the rainbow. So good. See you guys soon. Lots of love.
SPEAKER_00Thank you for listening to Spirit Gym with Paul Tech and today's guest, Eric Godsley. You can find Eric online at ericgodsey.com on school at school.com forward slash lucid university, and on SnapStack and Instagram at EricGodsley. That's EricGodsley, smells me on C M D my Formal interaction with Paul. You can find his virtual monster class that's happening this week. Go to my virtual.com for full detailed and released. And finally, if you enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe to the channel on the podcast platform of your choice. This podcast is available on Spotify Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, Audible and YouTube.