These Holy Bones: Vol. 2 Episode 10: Gabriel's Quest

I met Gabriel outside of the cathedral in Santiago de Compostela. He was sitting on the steps that lead down to the back entrance to the church. Although I felt self-conscious tapping him on the shoulder and asking him if he would like to be interviewed about his journey, I am so glad I did because Gabriel had a lot to share. He spoke candidly about his faith and his relationship with the Blessed Mother and his guardian angel. I think you will enjoy this one--have a listen.

Transcript

Vol. 2 Ep. 10 Gabriel's Quest

 Host: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to another episode of These Holy Bones. A podcast about the ancient pilgrimage to the Cathedral of Santiago, where the bones of St. James are Interred beneath the high altar. I'm your host, Robert Nerney. This episode is being sponsored by Ocean Magic Surf and Skateboard Superstore in Jupiter, Florida.

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Host: Hello, this is Robert Nerney. Your host of These Holy Bones. I am outside the Cathedral of Santiago, speaking with Gabriel from Texas. And I kind of snuck up on him and asked him if he would be part of this podcast.

 Host: So Gabe, welcome. Thank you for saying yes. Can you just introduce yourself a little bit for the second time? I'm sorry we had some mechanical, uh, some technical issues. 

Speaker 2: Yeah, no problem Rob. 

 Host: Alright, thank you. 

Speaker 2: Um, my name is Gabriel. I am a graduate of the University of Dallas a couple years ago and I'm here just having completed the Camino with some friends from college, uh, we decided to, uh, do a trip together every couple years to not lose touch with each other. [00:02:00] So here we are. We just finished yesterday and we're able to go to Mass today also. 

 Host: Did they swing the incensor?

Speaker 2: I wish they had, 

 Host: Well, it was funny because I got in a few days ago and there were two Irish women that I met and I interviewed and they said, make sure you go to Mass. This was yesterday because an American, uh, paid the 400 Euro to have it swung. Wow. So that's, that's part of it. So people can pay to have it swung. So it did swing yesterday. Okay.  

Speaker 2: Wow. 

 Host: Yeah. So I'll show you the film after. Um, let me ask you this. So you started where? 

Speaker 2: We started in a town about a little bit over a hundred kilometers south called Vigo. On the Via Portuguese, 

 Host: Was it a popular route? Were there a lot of pilgrims? 

Speaker 2: Actually, no. 

 Host: Okay. 

Speaker 2: There weren't very many pilgrims. 

 Host: Okay. Because there are some obscure roots. One time I did the Madrid Camino, and I was like, I met two guys. It was just, there was, there were no pilgrims. So there are some obscure routes. That's cool. At least you had each other?

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. 

 Host: And what was the biggest challenge? 

Speaker 2: The biggest challenge of our Camino was I would say it was two things actually. I would say that it was maintaining the presence of God while we walked, and also trusting in him to provide us with a safe and restful way. We had a couple really significant challenges along the way. Beginning from the very start, we had a train ticket. That was canceled because the wildfires. Oh. So we drove through the wildfires and that was crazy, but we ended up starting a half a day late. So every day we were getting into town five to seven hours after everyone had already gotten there.

 Host: That's crazy. Yeah. So, when you said you drove through the wildfires, do you mean in a bus?

Speaker 2: Well, so we rented a car. 

 Host: Okay. 

Speaker 2: And then the route [00:04:00] from Madrid to Vigo--we looked on the Google maps and there were about six large regional wildfires that intersected the highway. So it looked kind of like Mordor. 

 Host: Mordor. It all looks like Mordo. No, that's really interesting. I was just talking to a gentleman last night from Germany. And, uh, he's like, Spain is burning. I was like, well that's ominous, dude. I was like, okay, Dante. But, uh, no, that's cool. Alright, so, um, how many miles did you average a day?

Speaker 2: We, let me think. Our first day was about 30 kilometers and then we did 40 or 45 the second day. So we did a lot the second day. 

 Host: That is quite a distance to walk.

Speaker 2: And then our third day, uh, we did another 30k. So we were finishing about three, three and a quarter days of walking. 

 Host: Right, right, right. 

Speaker 2: Or so. 

 Host: Well, you did a lot of miles.

 Host: Because 30 is about 18 miles, right? 

Speaker 2: I suppose. 

 Host:  So, I know The University of Dallas is a hotbed for Catholic theology. And you said you encountered Thomas Aquinas there? 

Speaker 2: Yes. 

 Host: Okay. Was that really what helped your conversion, Thomas? 

Speaker 2: You know, it was a combination of Thomas and GK Chesterton. 

 Host: Ah, that's so awesome. 

Speaker 2: It was his Orthodoxy. 

 Host: Really? I've started that book like 400 times but have never finished it.  

Speaker 2: Chesterton has a beautiful way of expressing, I think, the deepest truths of the faith, which at the same time are simple and also paradoxes.

 Host: That's true. Maybe I should try reading more Chesterton. Um, no, that's cool. That's a beautiful way to come to the faith. No one has ever mentioned Thomas and Chesterton in the same sentence. 

Speaker 2: Well the University of Dallas, I'll give a plug for them. They will get you there. Chesterton plus Aquinas--it's just the way things roll.

 Host: Let me ask you this: Does this Camino plant seeds for future Caminos or was it like more about your friendship, less about the pilgrimage, or was it a combination? 

Speaker 2: I don't know. I quit my job on Monday to go in search of my own heart.

 Host: That's what life's about. I've been quitting jobs my whole life. 

Speaker 2: So I quit my job the Monday before I came here. 

 Host: What were you doing? 

Speaker 2: I was working at a tech company--which is doing really good work, but it just wasn't where my heart was. The parable of the pearl of great price has been on my mind a lot. And so I began thinking, asking Our Lady, what is the pearl of great price? And I had this experience where I realized it was love. I mean this is what the kingdom of God is compared to. It's not like I had a private revelation or anything like that, but, and I realized that my heart was so maybe numbed by the environment I was working in. So I had planned this trip forever and it providentially worked out that I was sort of, you know, asking Our Lady for marching orders basically. And it just happened that I quit. Then that Camino happened and I tried it. I tried not to have any expectations. Um, and I still don't, so [00:09:00] I'm not sure if there will be future Caminos. This one happened really providentially. 

 Host: That's awesome. On the way into the square, I was asking Our Lady for her help with the podcast, and we ended up talking. 

Speaker 2: She has been, uh, wow. It's hard knowing how much detail to go into. I won't go into too much detail, but 

 Host: the more, the better. 

Speaker 2: Well, I've had this sort of, um, 

 Host: My SD card is empty. 

Speaker 2: I tend to think that the map of a masculine soul over the journey of his life looks a lot like a kind of predictable pattern. Not necessarily in the events, but in the sort of questions he's asking. And the first sort of three stages, I think have to do with, you know, first you're like the beloved son, and then you're sort of a roaming cowboy asking, you know, do I have what it takes? And then you settle into a kind of warrior stage. Um, and I think that the past few months, an image that I've been meditating on a lot recently has been, I see in my mind, like myself kneeling before the Blessed Mother sort of asking her like, what is the, what is this quest that you want to send me on?

Speaker 2: What is it? And in this image, I'm sort of dressed in rags and like, I'm not a very good knight. Um. But then about a week before I left for the pilgrimage, the image changed and I was wearing the breastplate of justice and shot with peace and had the shield of faith and the helmet [00:11:00] of salvation. And Our Lady sort of gave me from her crown that she was wearing and she plucked out like a pearl and a ruby.

Speaker 2: And a diamond sort of, I think as symbols of love, wisdom, and fortitude. And all of a sudden I realized that I had, I had sort of in my relationship with her, been asking the wrong question. Like Our Lady was there for me not to send me on the quest so much as to prepare me for it. And she said, so I was asking her like, Our Lady, like, you've given me these things as preparation for a quest.

Speaker 2: Now what do I do? She was like, you need to get your marching orders from the king. And so that's what brought me to Santiago. That's the question: What are my marching orders? 

 Host: That's pretty deep. What was your major at Dallas? 

Speaker 2: I was a philosophy major.

 Host: Okay. And, uh, well you sound Yeah, very interesting. The images are, uh, very, uh. They're very concrete, you know? And so, um, yeah, that's beautiful. 

Speaker 2: But I've never, I've never experienced that before. I've never been able to pray successfully with images in my mind like that before. So it was sort of out of the ordinary in my, in my experience, you know, 

 Host: Well look at where we are. This is kind of out of the ordinary. You know what I mean? No, I mean, I think that when you go on the quest with Our Lady, you know, um, and she sends you to her son, the King, that your life will always be an adventure. Now there'll be reprieves, you know, because it gets exhausting.

 Host: But, um, do you know Michael O'Brien, the author, the Catholic author? 

 Host: Father Elijah. 

Speaker 2: Yes. Father Elijah. 

 Host: Yeah. Okay. So I met him years ago. I interviewed him. I had a Catholic newspaper. [00:13:00] And uh, this man was like, his life was out of control. Out of control. He lived poverty. Six kids. Wow. Struggled, you know?

 Host: And then finally the books helped him a little bit and eventually because he was a visual artist, you know, he began to sell his paintings too, and he's in his seventies now. But that's, I think that's, uh, it's a warning that if you do take up the quest that your life will not look like other lives. You know? And people won't understand what you're doing. Um, but I think that you do it, you know, anyway. And, uh, at the end, you'll live this beautiful adventure. That is, uh, you know, written by our Lord and, uh, condoned by Our Lady. So that's cool. 

Speaker 2: It's, it's funny thinking about like asking God questions honestly, because he might answer them. You gotta be careful. It reminds me of, was it St. James who said, you know, can I sit at your right hand? 

 Host: Oh, absolutely. John and James. [00:14:00] 

Speaker 2: And he said can you drink the cup that I'm going to drink? 

 Host: Right. Sons of thunder, your out of your mind. No. Right. Yes. No, that's cool. 

 Host: Do you have anything in your pack that is unusual that you really value? Don't tell me Water or sandals, something that you took that might've been of value to you that you wouldn't have left home without. 

Speaker 2: No. Did you I took one change of clothes and the sandals, and that's it. 

 Host: You didn't walk in those, did you?

Speaker 2: I did. 

 Host: Oh my gosh. That's crazy. All right, so how many, what, what, uh, how much did your pack weigh? 

Speaker 2: Oh, probably five to eight pounds. 

 Host: Oh, that's beautiful. Last year I took 24 pounds and it just crushed me. At the end, it was just, oh, man. Yeah, I had a computer, I had this stuff.

 Host: That's awesome. Now when you get back to Texas, you're going back to Texas? 

Speaker 2: Yes. 

 Host: Okay. Yeah. And, uh, you're out and you see a friend and, uh, he asks you about the [00:15:00] Camino. What, what would you, what would you say? 

Speaker 2: I think I would tell him about my guardian angel and how my guardian angel provided for us. My guardian angel provide, our guardian angels provided for us the entire time.

Speaker 2: They gave us what we needed, when we needed it. And it's funny in the ways that we asked for them. And that meant we should have been more specific sometimes. Um, can I tell a quick story about, 

 Host: Of course. 

Speaker 2: So it's closing in on eight o'clock. And we had heard about an albergue. They had four extra spots. And so we're like, oh yes, let's take that. 

 Host: You weren't using booking.com or anything, right? 

Speaker 2: No. We had nothing booked before we left. So we arrived at this albergue. We got set up with beds. We, [00:16:00] we had asked our guardian angels to please let us attend a Mass later. And this Mass just happened to be later than all the other pilgrim Masses. So at eight o'clock instead of seven thirty, so we went to Mass and then we went to dinner and it was late about midnight and we had not really slept well the night before.

Speaker 2: And so earlier that day we had prayed to our Guardian angels, please get us to Mass and to an albergue where we can just set our stuff down. So we get back to the albergue after dinner and I'm lying in bed and I look up and I see bedbugs. And I say to my friend, Harry, we gotta talk. So I meet my buddies outside and we, after a brief sort of counsel, we decide to pray to our guardian angels.

Speaker 2: Uh, please help us find a place to sleep tonight. Like that's all we want is a place to sleep tonight. So we leave [00:17:00] the albergue. We walk about 10 minutes down the road. And then we decided we're gonna sleep in a field. 

 Host: Oh, wow. 

Speaker 2: Uh, so we go up and we find a vineyard with a little patch of grass that we can set our stuff down and we basically shiver our butts off until seven o'clock in the morning.

 Host: because you had no bag, right? 

Speaker 2: No sleeping bag? Uh, no sleeping bag. I only brought shorts. Uh. No socks. So, we realized in that moment we should have asked our guardian angels to find us maybe some beds to sleep in or somewhere warm at least. 

Host: That's so funny. That's awesome, dude. Uh, no, you're definitely a pilgrim in, you know, in, uh, more than in spirit.

 Host: I mean, you brought the right amount of stuff--as far as weight goes, that's awesome. My wife has gone four times and has had three, three  encounters with bedbugs. Three times she got bedbugs.

Speaker 2: Did she bring them back with her? And you had to fumigate the house? 

 Host: No, I mean, we took care of 'em on the trail, but you know, she had blisters and it wasn't pretty.

Speaker 2: Yeah. 

 Host: Yeah. That's crazy. Well, that's, that's awesome. Um, well thank you so much for this interview. You're a very interesting person and, uh, I think the Lord's hand is on you. And, um, yeah, you, uh, I'm so happy that you said yes. So Gabe Buen Camino [00:20:00].