These Holy Bones: Vol. 2-Episode 16: Camino Massages with Danny

In this episode, I interview Danny, the owner and massage therapist of Camino Massages located in Santiago a few doors down from Camino Curry. Danny walked the Camino Norte in 2014 and knows the challenges that pilgrims face when walking day in and day out for more than thirty days. He gives tips on foot care and foot wear as well as insights on how to approach the pilgrimage to Santiago. I enjoyed speaking with Danny, and I think you'll enjoy listening to him as he shares his depth of knowledge about the Camino de Santiago. 

Transcript

Robert 0:08

Welcome to another episode of These Holy Bones. I am in Camino Massages with Danny, who is the owner and the practitioner, and I just had a massage that was awesome. My calves were a little tight and my hips were a little tight, and Danny relieved the uh the pain and the uh the tightness. So, Danny, thank you very much and welcome. And could you just tell us a little bit about yourself and how you ended up here on uh in this beautiful place?

Danny 0:32

Okay, of course. Um hello, thank you for coming. That's really nice to to meet people uh that is interested in in in my city, so where where I live, where I work. Awesome. And uh yes, my story is very easy. Like everyone in Santiago um we we have something special with this city, so normally we we we do walk the the the the path, the the camino, and then we we decide to to stop here and enjoy the city and give the people that comes here like uh little little help or little uh Spanish uh hospital or hospitality.

Robert 1:21

So you have walked to Camino? Y

Danny 1:23

Yes. U That was like uh twelve years ago. So like uh 2014. Okay, 2014.

Speaker 1:32

And what route did you take?

Danny 1:34

I've done the the north path. Okay, that's a difficult path though. That's normally people say that's the the most difficult, yes, because there is a lot of up and downs. Right. Especially at the beginning in in the border with with France, so the Basque country which is really hilly.

Robert 1:52

Yes.

Danny 1:53

So it was okay. Yeah, right. That's a good time to do it.

Robert 1:57

Yeah. In your 20s is a good time to do it. And you did the entire path?

Danny 2:01

Yes, which is about yes, it's about eight hundred and fifty kilometers, which is in miles. You can help me with that.

Robert 2:08

Miles would be over 500 miles. So it'd be like 525 miles or so. Okay. So it's that's very that's awesome. Yeah. My wife and I did it for one day, and then she had problems with her heart. Oh, and she ended up in the hospital in uh San Sebastian. Oh so after that we went back to the Francis. Oh, bad memories for you then. You know, it's funny, she said actually, after she slept in the hospital, she never felt better. So she really uh she it was a good memory for her.

Speaker 2:36

She enjoyed this body's hospital. She loved it. Okay I slept in a bed, I slept in the chair. So good, that's free interest. That's all right.

Danny 2:45

Free medical stuff. Oh right, right.

Robert 2:48

So that was my experience. So tell me about when you walked it, what was the uh what was the reason why you first went out on the Camino?

Danny 2:58

Well, um first uh was trying to find my my way or my Camino. So I was struggling with with my life, like uh especially with my my career, so I didn't know what to do, didn't know what to think or what to to spend my time or my energy. So uh I decided to to to try to give it a try because it's really popular here, and it's not common that uh people from Santiago walk the Camino, which is controversial, but uh I said okay, just give it a try, have time to think about my life and my career, so it helped me a lot.

Robert 3:43

That's awesome. Now you grow up with it though, right? It's so the Camino is part of your culture. Yes. So you you must hear about it as a child.

Danny 3:50

Yes, especially not about the Camino, but about the pilgrims or about the church, about the cathedral, uh and all this stuff. But they are not telling you about the Camino, you know, it's it's it's a little bit, you know, it's a mystery. It's a mystery because now it's becoming more and more like uh business, yeah, not like experience. Right, right. So uh for Spanish or for Galicians it's not very common. Well well, maybe it's more it's it's common for the for the people from South Spain or Madrid or because of the advertising, of course. But for the Galicians it's not very common.

Robert 4:30

That's funny. The other day I was in the uh I was in the pilgrim's office and they said out of a thousand ninety people that registered, um 90% were Spanish. 90.

Danny 4:40

90. Because summertime. So it's uh July and August, that's probably 90% of Spanish. Okay. But then if you go to May or September, opposite. So that will be 90% of foreign people, okay.

Robert 4:55

Which is and of a lot of Italians in August. Yeah, yes, very I met a lot of Italians.

Danny 5:00

I would say yeah, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, and French, they they take holidays or the the vacation there is July and August. Okay.

Robert 5:09

Especially August. Right, right, right. That's interesting. So um when you walked it, did you encounter a lot of challenges or was it smooth?

Danny 5:19

Uh for me it was really smooth. Oh, that's good. Really smooth. Yeah. Well, I'm really calm. Yeah, yeah. So I speak very calm and I walk very calm. I do everything very calm. Oh, that's good. So it was really smooth. So uh maybe the first week I was a little bit uh tough, but because of your your body's not not used to walk like this long distances. Right, right. But after that, it's everything by yourself. Piece of cake.

Robert 5:49

By yourself or with a friend? Only me, only me. Okay, you recommend that? Of course. Of course, no really, why is that why is that?

Danny 5:57

Um yeah, because uh the experience is is really different. I understand when you w walk with your I don't know, your partner or your friends or your family, that's fun and it's interesting to share everything with them. But when you walk alone, you you have to be with yourself, which is really tough uh sometimes. And people don't like to, you know, to to fight with with themselves. So you know it's funny.

Robert 6:27

So I walked this summer with two gentlemen and uh now they're both gone, and I'm struggling a little bit. I'm here to podcast, and I and I took the extra days to to podcast, but I am struggling a little bit um with myself, you know, with whatever that means. So I understand what you're saying. Yeah, yeah.

Danny 6:44

So it happens to you even in a normal day, or like you you do if you try to do your day on your own and just focus on what you feel and what you think in, you just struggle. But if you spend a week walking or ten days or a month or every single day just fighting with yourself, that that's that's hard. It is hard. But it's I mean it's hard, but it's good.

Robert 7:12

Yes, I think it's a healthy thing. Yeah, because we don't really have those experiences back home, you know? Yeah. Where you have that time to think and and uh a lot of times uh commune with nature too. I mean you're walking I love the Mesita, and so you're walking and there are sunflowers and wheat, it's just beautiful.

Danny 7:29

That's that's the point. We forget how important it's to be in contact with with nature. Right. And with people. We we're losing that.

Robert 7:47

Well, it's true. We losing everyone's looking down. That's crazy. I know, it's crazy, and it's so it's brand new. It's it's so you know what I mean? It's this is a just a brand new phenomenon.

Danny 7:57

Does it make sense? Uh I see that every single day here when when I'm trying to to one when I'm waiting for people to come, right? Uh I just see people just walking by just with the phone. Like like they don't look, like they just focus just you know, like with the phone like that. And then when you're when they get to the cathedral, I think they they realize and they say, okay, we finish with phone, we try to to to to see the city or enjoy it, and then when they come up, they they stop by because they you know they like okay, we made it. Yeah.

Robert 8:39

Right. Well, it's funny. In twenty I our fur my my wife and I did the uh Camino in 2015 and the phone wasn't prominent. It really wasn't. And since then it's really become dominant. And uh even this Camino, um, the two gentlemen I I was walking with, they were like, okay, we got uh we got 11 more miles. I'm like, who cares? Who cares how many like I don't care. Well, we gotta get there at 345. I'm like, what? 345? Ah, we we're late. Late? You can't be late on the Camino, it's impossible. But I can understand what it was their first Camino, I understand, but my point is it it uh the can the computer really dominates the GPS. Yeah, follow the arrows. Yeah, exactly. Go go west go west. You don't need nothing.

Danny 9:24

You don't need anything at all. No, well, I remember when I walk on on the north, um, it was not very common like 12 years ago. No, not at all. Um it was sh not many people like walking. Uh and I've I had that that sensation, like uh, I was using my phone sometimes, but the sensation it was like, come on, just stop. You got you see the arrows, just forget the phone. And and I did it. Like I just put it down and I say, okay, just keep keep walking.

Robert 9:57

Is the Norte well marked?

Danny 9:59

Uh at that time I think it was not too bad. Okay. I think uh people told me that improved a lot. So now it's better. It's better compared to like yeah, 12 years ago.

Robert 10:12

Right, because the Francis is so well marked.

Danny 10:14

Yeah, but anyway, for me it was fine, you know. Like, okay, I want to get lost sometime. Right, right. Lost, and then you know, talk to people and then just get to the pla to back to to the to the path again, right?

Robert 10:28

Well, the other day I was with the two gentlemen we got into town, and then they were going somewhere. I said, I gotta go back, my legs are killing me. And so I got turned around instead of going down this path, I was on the other, I was walking the opposite end, you know, and my phone died, and so I was lost. And I've been here. I I know, and so I had to ask probably 14 people. I even went into a bar, sat down, and then three gentlemen came and they sat and I said, excuse me, I was using English, I don't speak Spanish, and they were very helpful. And they they said, Where's your where's your data? I said, I don't have any data right now. And so they gave they showed me uh the the path to go, and uh, but I still had to ask a number of people, so I had to encounter the other person instead of just this.

Danny 11:16

That's the thing, that's the the spirit of the Camino. It is. Um uh I'm every time I'm thinking about that, right? Because uh that's that's our uh heritage, right? Our culture. So if I think about it, we've been doing that for centuries. People is coming here, I don't know, for centuries. 814. Exactly, you know it's better than me. And uh so in our blood, is uh you know, we we we used to to help people like even even we we struggle with English or with with some things. We we always try to help. Right, right, right.

Robert 11:56

I asked one gentleman, I and he you know he spoke no English, I speak very little Spanish, not really, but he was very, very um he communicated with me, like you know, he understood what I needed, and uh that was a beautiful encounter. Yeah, you know, he's an older man. I'm an older man too, I forget. But uh yeah, I think uh I think that was providential that I was supposed to kind of get lost and and rely on others, you know, as opposed to thing, yeah. Yeah, I was a little I got a little like shaken, you know, because I was like, Where am I? I can't believe I don't know where I'm going, you know.

Danny 12:30

So you're learning, like, okay, I'm I'm having this sensation and why? So you you just keep thinking about that, why why I'm so lost without the phone.

Robert 12:41

Right.

Danny 12:42

I d uh do I need it?

Robert 12:44

That's a good meditation though. Yeah, really, it's very relevant. Yeah. So tell me a little bit about um being a masseuse on the Camino. What is some of the the um well let's go back. Yeah, we had that conversation conversation about um about feet. I think that's an important one. Yes. So maybe can you tell us how you you would approach the the whole foot issue?

Danny 13:08

Yeah, that's the if you go online, that's the main question all the time. What should I do with my blisters?

Robert 13:16

Right, no, it's true.

Danny 13:17

So uh first of all, um don't use like brand new shoes, never. So you need to when you buy them, you need to use them for for a few days or a few weeks even. Okay. And then you can use those shoes to to do the walk. So never brand new. So break them in. Exactly.

Robert 13:40

Yeah, that's good.

Danny 13:41

That's the main one. Uh and then probably the second one. Uh they need to be the the shoes, they need to be breathable and light. Okay. So it doesn't matter. Because people normally they they tell me, oh, I bought like uh the most expensive shoes and I have blisters. Why? No. You need to to to be careful with that because okay, uh first of all, you are not climbing the the Everest. Right. That's true, right? You don't need like hiking boots or or very high boots. You just need the trainers or just you know, they need to be breathable and light. That's right, right. Especially on the summertime.

Robert 14:24

Right. This year is the first time I've done that. Yeah. So before I used like a hiking shoe and it wasn't breathable and it wasn't light. But this year I use a like a trainer. Yeah. Mizuno.

Danny 14:37

And then the the last trick, uh, that's the Vaseline, right? Like it helps a lot. Right. It helps a lot. Yeah, yeah. But if you're using hiking boots and putting the the the the the Vaseline doesn't matter, right, right, right, right.

Robert 14:53

So you need to go step by step, right? Right, that's awesome. Yeah, this is the first year I really um was conscious about using Vaseline, like at least twice, if not three times a day. It does get it, it's a little messy, but I just wipe it, wipe it on my sock, you know what I mean? So it's worth it. All right, very good. Now, what do you see here? What people come in with all types of ailments, right? Yeah, and what's like one thing that's common with uh with pilgrims?

Danny 15:19

Uh the last years, like two or three years, um I'm getting a little bit disappointed because everyone is coming with the with the how you call it the poles.

Robert 15:32

Yes.

Danny 15:33

So as I told you, that you're not climbing like a high mountain. This is like you're walking. So you don't need, in my opinion, as a professional, uh, it gives you more trouble and unbalanced your body. So I don't know about the companies that they're right, right, right. You know, I I think they're doing a lot of advertising.

Robert 15:58

Okay.

Danny 15:58

And it's wrong.

Robert 16:00

A lot of people we I mean I use polls. My doctor said that the operators I will help you, of course.

Danny 16:06

Oh, okay. Yeah if you if you have an injury, it helps.

Robert 16:12

Okay.

Danny 16:12

But at the end it's giving you more issues like, for example, your shoulders, your elbows, your hands. Right. So if you of course if you if you are injured and you need them, go for it. Right, right, right. But you know, it's I see that uh everyone is is is using them. And they and they don't know how to use them. Right, right. So it's okay, they're helpful sometimes, but uh for me as a professional it's doesn't make sense. Okay, that's it. So your hips are gonna be you know, they're they hurt anyway. Right. So it gives you like uh wrong information to your brain, okay, they're helping me, but then you're hurting your shoulders or your back. So my advice is never use them, never. Right.

Robert 17:02

That's cool. My opinion. Right, that's fine. And what about packing? You should pack light or no?

Danny 17:08

Um same with in the last two, three years, most of the people they're sending their their bags on post. So it's getting really trendy. That's they pay, I don't know, maybe five euros a day, which is five euros, not much. Right. And they pick it up and they they send it to you to the next point, right? Okay, yeah, yeah. So, but for me, uh uh the full experience, you need to carry a pack. Carry your backpack like every day, you know. Right, right. You carry your backpack, you're carrying your shit.

Robert 17:42

Oh yeah, no, so carry your shit. So yeah, no, it's true. Yeah, I think that's uh I I feel the same way. If you can carry it, you should carry it. If not, if you have something wrong, that's fine.

Danny 17:53

Yeah, don't don't get too crazy because some people, you know, they they put a lot of stuff on on their backpack, like they come in here with twelve kilos, which is or fifteen, uh what? No. This is of course it's your first time and you don't know, but common sense sometimes.

Robert 18:12

Yeah. I met a young gentleman from uh Texas yesterday and uh Gabriel, and he packed so light, like uh four pounds, I don't know how many kilos that is, and he had nothing. I said that's very smart. Yeah. He's 24 in great shape, you know. I mean he only came for a few days, yeah, but um but that's smart.

Danny 18:33

Yeah, to me, even when I travel and I do backpack, I can say I'm a backpacker, I'm going all all the time with my backpack. I I hate the the the the other the suitcase.

Robert 18:46

I never bring a suit I never bring a suitcase.

Danny 18:48

I really hate that. Never so I'm trying all the time to challenge myself, like you don't need that. Yeah, you don't need that. So every time it's getting lighter. That's good. Even in the camino, well, I was lucky because I was walking home. So when I when I arrived to the border, well to to Galicia, to the when I was getting closer, uh I told my my girlfriend, please can you help me? And I want to leave some stuff and walk lighter. So I was quite lucky, but it it was it wasn't that heavy.

Robert 19:22

Oh, that's beautiful. Yeah, yeah. It's funny because they say, well, this is like a metaphor for life, and it's true. Like, what do we need in life? And uh, and uh as an American, you need a lot. You need a you know, three or four houses, you need multiple cars, you need a lot of, you know.

Danny 19:38

Yeah, fortunately it's happening everywhere, not only in the US. It's but you don't need it. You don't need it.

Robert 19:45

It's it's actually a hindrance, right?

Danny 19:47

Exactly. It's come on. Uh you walk in, you just need water or or uh some nuts or or a banana, I don't know.

Robert 19:56

But no, you can really yeah, I know, you don't need a lot.

Danny 19:59

That's it.

Robert 20:00

Yeah, yeah.

Danny 20:00

You can just uh yeah, a pair of shoes and maybe uh some um underwear and that's it.

Speaker 20:09

So right everywhere.

Danny 20:10

So that's that's my opinion, is lighter, better.

Speaker 20:15

Right.

Danny 20:15

So just tell me, how did you end up here though? Uh in in this uh local right here in this very small place that's very familiar to I want to, you know, um when I I get to to Santiago to work as a masseuse or a massage therapist, um I used to run a big business like with with employers and well employees. Uh and we were like ten of us, so it was quite too much. So I decide to to do my my small uh business here. So now me and my wife we we we're running it, so I think that's enough. Um we're trying to give a very good quality attention and um and you do, it's excellent, excellent Masseuse.

Robert 21:09

Thank you. No, thank you, thank you. That's wonderful. That's wonderful. I think a beautiful profession. You know, it's so human. Yeah, yeah.

Danny 21:19

Yeah, it's it's really rewarding. I always use this this word like a reward, yeah, because um you're helping people and you you you are in contact with people all the time. Yeah, so you're giving them like the good vibes or the massage, so you're trying to release the pain, yeah, um, release the muscles. Right. And then they give you um like the good vibes back. So that's really, really nice.

Robert 21:49

Yeah, that's cool. That's really cool. How long have you been here in this office or in this space?

Danny 21:53

Uh in this space is uh four months, only four months. Oh wow, which is quite short.

Robert 22:00

Time and Kamal has been there for 54 days 54 days or something. It's been open.

Danny 22:06

When he arrived here, like um tell me please speak English here.

Robert 22:14

So he was like really we're speaking about Kamal, the owner of uh Camino Curry, which is three doors down, right? Three or four doors down.

Danny 22:22

Yeah, I'm always telling him uh you you came here, you saw the name, and then you put Camino Curry. So we were Camino Massage, Camino Curry. What is gonna be next? That's funny, but yeah, yeah, he was quite lost, especially because he was struggling with the language. And right and I I try to help him. Like I'm trying to help everyone.

Robert 22:43

Right, right. That's awesome, Dan. Yeah, that's cool. Well, thank you so much for your time. And of course, what what one recommendation? So someone comes to you, they're your friend, yeah, and they say, Daniel, I really want to do the Camino. Uh, should I do it? Like I'm thinking about it. How do I know it's for me?

Danny 23:00

Um always say yes. Uh as we talk, um do it by yourself. It's something for you. So um uh hundred percent yes. Yes, even if you have short time, because normally people they want to use their holiday or their vacation, um, doing different things, or uh even if you have two weeks, yeah, just let's go do it. Yeah, awesome.

Robert 23:27

Yeah, yeah, it's like the movie The Way when um Tom is talking to uh I forget his name, the oh Sebastian, the um the police officer, and he says, you do it for yourself, only for yourself. And um, yeah, I think alone is is a good is a good approach, you know, I think from my perspective, because I'm a journeying person, so I tend to stop a lot, talk to people, and uh if you're a goal-oriented person, then you don't stop.

Danny 23:57

Exactly. Your pace is different, yeah. Very different. You always, you know, like uh waiting for the other one, like okay, if you're going in this in this in this space, I'm going with you. So I can run or I can blow down. Right. So I think it happens to you with with this year, right? With these two gentlemen. Yeah. So it gives you, yeah, like uh good uh uh anxiety, right? Anxiety I wanted to scream, stop but I did I didn't, you know, you know it because you're full experienced, so you did it many times, so you know what's going on. Right. Well, that's right.

Robert 24:43

Right, right. I wanted to dip my toe in every river and I wanted to drink every beer I could, you know, get my hands on, but that didn't happen. Probably that's probably healthy though, that I didn't that that didn't happen.

Danny 24:53

Yeah, especially the rivers. Uh there was a woman here last week and she was like an experienced Camino walker, so she did it like many times. And she said this year she discovered the river. So she w every one every day she she finished walking and she was she she went to the river to to to get a little swim, and she was like, oh, that was the best choice. Well, that's what I mean.

Robert 25:19

Those little pleasures that you miss, you know what I mean? There were a couple, there were two spots that I was like, oh, I want to stop and just put my feet in the water, and I didn't, but that's fine. I mean, I think like Kamal said, I might have been on a different type of journey this year, you know. Well, Danny Daniel, Daniel.

Danny 25:36

Daniel Diaries they say always Danny boy, Danny Dad, the Americans, Danny California, whatever it's called. Every time it's Danny Danny.

Robert 25:49

Well, thank you so much for your time, and of course, Buen Camino.

Danny 25:51

Thank you, Robert, and Buen Camino.