Recovery Unfiltered
Taking recovery discussion to a different level. Bringing comedy and the lighter side of sober living along with educating non-alcoholics and alcoholics. Hear real stories unfiltered.
Recovery Unfiltered
Healing the Open Wound: The Power of Sponsorship
Sometimes God moves in unmistakable ways. For Larry, it happened during a Saturday morning meeting when a newcomer named Blake shared his story. A warm feeling washed over him—what he calls "God's spiritual two-by-four"—and he knew instantly he needed to sponsor this man despite his previous reluctance to take on sponsees.
This powerful moment opens a deeply authentic conversation about what makes sponsorship work, fail, or transform lives. Rob and Larry explore the critical timing of recovery, using the striking metaphor of a newcomer as "an open wound"—one that will either be properly healed through working the steps with a sponsor or merely scabbed over by time, destined to crack open again.
Drawing from their years in recovery, they outline the essential elements of effective sponsorship: radical honesty, confidentiality, respect for each other's time, and allowing someone the freedom to seek guidance elsewhere if needed. They don't shy away from discussing sponsorship failures, including Larry's early missteps when his motives centered more around ego than service.
Throughout the episode, the spiritual foundation of recovery shines through. "God hits a moving target," they emphasize, explaining how prayer must be paired with action. "If you're going to worry, don't pray. If you're going to pray, don't worry." These aren't just platitudes but hard-earned wisdom from men who've experienced both sides of the sponsorship relationship.
Whether you're considering becoming a sponsor, looking for one, or simply want to understand this vital recovery relationship better, this conversation offers raw, unfiltered insights that cut through recovery clichés to the heart of what really works.
Thank You for Joining Us.. Please share with friends. If you or anyone you know is struggling with alcoholism please reach out to us. We can get you help. recoveryunfilteredpodcast@gmail.com
How about now? We feel a man is unthinking when he says sobriety is enough.
Speaker 2:You sit on the toilet, don't you? No, use that as your meditation.
Speaker 1:Not my wife, not your wife, nor anybody listening to this podcast has eaten a shit sandwich.
Speaker 2:We didn't have a hand in that. Welcome to.
Speaker 1:Recovery Unfiltered. I'm Larry, I'm an alcoholic. I'm Rob, I'm also an alcoholic. We are not professionals. There are no letters after our names. We know very little, however. Next to nothing you will hear the word god in a four-letter word. Next to nothing. I'm about ready to prove that offended. So if you are easily offended, just pass us by this podcast is not for you.
Speaker 2:Our opinions are just that. If you don't agree with what we're saying, that's okay. We're gonna love you anyways.
Speaker 1:We are not in any way affiliated with aa so sit back, grab a beverage of your choice and get ready let's go, mr rob.
Speaker 2:What's up? Brother? Happy day, we are back. I got a little bit of announcement we were supposed to be recording. I'm going to pull back the curtains just for a minute. So rob and I we record every other sunday, right and the last typically, sometimes typically right. Sometimes we grab another day in there because we have to, because, like I said, I want to drop every week, no matter what right. Sometimes rob and I just come in, we put something in. We don't throw it together. We try not to throw anything together. Everything we do we have a purpose right. So every once in a while rob will rob and I will grab something on the weekends or on during the week and but for the most part we stay on a pretty good schedule. About every other sunday we record and then we drop wednesday. Wednesday, then record again. Well, we had Mike and Jason on on that last episode, the last 41 and 42, right 40 and 41, right 41, 42. 41, 42.
Speaker 1:Right, we're getting ready to record. Right, right, right, we were 40.
Speaker 2:Yep, yep. And so we towards the end of 42, we got to talking about Mike's wife, kim, and and that well, living in men's actually let's.
Speaker 2:We were going to bring those two back in to finish up because we didn't get finished, and then somewhere in the week mike says hey, well, no, that was me, I, when I went to edit that, right, I edited that and as I was listening to it, I'm like because we I said something to Mike about the living amends with with his wife and you know, just the livings amends of how to forgive yourself, and he really started to get into that, educate or get into that conversation and as I was listening to that, I was like, you know, the only way to finish this story with with mike is to bring kim back in. So we set that up and and kim agreed, well, we were going to record to their.
Speaker 1:They were intent on trying to find, trying to find the text. As you told me, I was in the middle of the week, right, because our plan was to have these guys were going to come back for right for a third they were.
Speaker 2:They were in the middle of the week.
Speaker 1:You texted me.
Speaker 2:You said, hey, kim wants to come in right and do one because, like I said, I reached out to Mike and I said hey, I just got done, Because when we left here that Sunday that wasn't a plan. But I'm telling you, which was awesome. God just hit me and said Kim's got to be, kim's got to be in here to finish it, same way we did with Jason when we brought Jenny in right, it was perfect.
Speaker 2:It was perfect. And I, to finish this story yeah, she did. Well, I got a phone call at 8.55 this morning for Mike, and you know, sometimes I wonder about people when they try to back out at the last minute, but that's not what this was.
Speaker 1:Shingles are no joke, baby.
Speaker 2:He told me that he felt like you know, kim was pretty convinced that she was coming down with the shingles, that you know all the signs looked at it and I said you know what, take care of her. You know, rob, and I, rob and I love sitting and chit-chatting. Anyways, I had a couple of things. I want to get caught up on a couple topics that I've been working through myself. So, just going to give us some time, so we're going to record a couple episodes and, um, um, hopefully, hopefully, something sinks in, you know something, something you can work on.
Speaker 2:But what I want to talk about today is, uh, so Jason A's wife, jenny, she decides she wanted to start her own podcast and it's called sober sister shit show. And they came into my studio, or come into our studio, and, um, and they recorded and the first one was with a girl by the name of Christie, right, and I'm giving a little backdrop on this because it's going to get to where I want to go and they recorded, and the first one was with a girl by the name of Christy, right, and I'm giving a little backdrop on this because it's going to get to where I want to go. So just be patient with me or don't.
Speaker 1:We don't care.
Speaker 2:Everybody says I talk too much, but this is my story and I'm telling it. So, when Jenny came in, she came in with a girl by the name of Christy, right in. She came in with a girl by the name of christy right, and they, they did it and they recorded and everything went great and they were going to come back record again because that was going to be her co-host. Well, the very next time, um, they were coming back to record, she couldn't make it because a good, very close friend of hers was very, very sick and, uh, in a in a hospital room down in la san diego area. So, okay, she recorded with another girl, and so on and so forth. Well, about two months ago there was a guy that came in to our Saturday was it Saturday morning or your Thursday night meeting. When I went Saturday morning, well, it was Saturday morning and he was just fresh. He'd only had a couple of days sober, fresh.
Speaker 1:And you want a little backstory on Christy. Yeah, she had asked me to help her with the steps, so I sat down at my Thursday meeting. We'd show up early for three weeks me, her Susan, her sponsor and we went through Okay, so you co-sponsored her Basically. Yeah, we went through the steps. I told her. This is how it's laid out when you do your fifth step, you say it to her. When you do your meds, you talk to her.
Speaker 2:Okay, and then you go and I actually got some. I got a co-sponsor thing in here that I want to go through, so she's on fire right now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she is, and I saw her yesterday.
Speaker 2:So he so yesterday, and actually after that meeting a couple months back, I sat there and talked with him for a long time. I mean, he was fresh green and I was just trying to encourage you.
Speaker 1:He just showed up to our Monday meeting for the first time You're telling my damn story. You want to finish telling it motherfucker, shut the fuck up. Sorry, speak when you're spoken to. No, hey, I talk too much. I apologize. You know I speak out of turn. I overspeak. I'm just on the loud. I'm sorry, larry, I apologize. Take, if you can. Can you pick back up where you were? Fuck?
Speaker 2:Don't lose your spot. I gotta go back and remember where my story was Fuck, Go, go from.
Speaker 1:he came short.
Speaker 2:Monday night. So when he showed up Monday night I thought all right, you know, I mean, it's not that our Monday night some um some miraculous event. Well, let me, I'm going to, I'm going to explain that. But our Monday night is not an AA meeting. It's not. We're not associated. No, we are not. That Monday night group is just a group of brothers that hold each other accountable and we love and we go through the book and then, well, we started with three or four or five and we're at 26, 27 in our meetings.
Speaker 2:It's grown, it's a God thing, it really is a God thing, same as this podcast. So he sat there and he shared right and and, and I've said this so many times when I see that pain of somebody, right, it just just intrigues me. I don't know about intrigue, is the right word?
Speaker 1:I it, it, it attracts me I don't know why pain of somebody. You want me to tell you why it attracts you yes same reason. Okay, remember when old boy was sharing and you were looking at me like the guy was new at the saturday morning meeting and you were looking at me like I was chomping at the bit, because when they're in pain, there's that small window. They're ready. They're ready, their willingness is right there. The most it's ever going to be to get to God and do this work.
Speaker 2:So Saturday morning he showed back up and in that period of time from Monday night to Saturday I don't know how you and I got in this conversation, but you said, well, I spawned Saturday. I don't know how you and I got in this conversation, but you said, well, I spawned. He, that's Christie's, that's Christie's boyfriend, and I'm like, huh, okay, brings it home a little bit. And then on a Saturday morning I saw them close. They were both. You know, the women's group was leaving and the men's group was coming in and I we chit chatted a little bit together, which Christie says she wants to come on and tell her story, which we need to get that on, you know. And then we got into the meeting and then Blake shared.
Speaker 2:Now you guys have all heard me say when I don't like to sponsor, right, it's just not, I've tried it. It's not me, I'm a selfish prick, I don't like to give up my time and I and I've saw and you've already said you will sponsor, right. People said that, doug said that, everybody said that and I've said it. You know, if God slaps me over the head, I will present the opportunity, right? Well, when I say that God slapped me over the head.
Speaker 1:I'm sitting there listening to him share and I had a warm feeling just come over my body and just literally, I just froze and I'm like I got to sponsor this guy, yeah, like I gotta sponsor this guy, yeah, I gotta sponsor this guy that is, the, that's equivalent of god's spiritual two by four, by the way. Wow, I'm like. So, I was like. Well, there's no doubt, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:There's oh no, there was zero doubt. There was zero doubt, I knew for a fact right because of the back I my interactions with him up to that point.
Speaker 2:the night I spent with him after the meeting and I, we sat there and shared and we talked back and forth for so long and then and then so I just waited and I even texted you. I was like I even told you. I said I think God just hit me over the head with a two by four. I think I'm going to need to sponsor this kid or offer so, and I and as we've spoke many times, I am not going to say can I sponsor you? That's just not how we do that. Nope. But after the meeting I told him I and I literally pulled him to the side. I said, blake, I just got to tell you something. You I have always said I would never sponsor, but God has hit me over the head pretty hard to sponsor you. But I'm going to tell you something that doesn't mean I should be your sponsor. What I am going to tell you is that your willingness right now is wide fucking open. I've seen it in you a couple of times now, that's the attraction.
Speaker 2:That's what a track. And I'm like you are wide open, you're an open wound right now. And I said I'm going to warn you, if you don't, if you don't get a sponsor and get this happening quickly, that window is going to slam shut and you're going to think everything's hunky-dory. And I said I don't really care if you go to Rob, pat Doug, I don't care who you go to get a sponsor, but you need to do it quickly, before that willingness stops. And he started to say something else I go, do not ask me right now. I want you to go home, I want you to pray about it and then I want you to contact that whoever you want to be your sponsor. Well, he called me about four o'clock last night and asked me if I, if I, would sponsor him. So yes, I am going to take another run at this. What are you writing down over there? Go and keep talking. Well, I'm done now.
Speaker 1:Keep talking, keep talking, god you don't shut up, can't you spend? Look at the signs where I'm starting to finish no, okay, because you had a good listen, you had a great metaphor and I want, I wanted to capture it because that's something you said I actually agreed with. I shouldn't agree. I actually liked and might fucking use.
Speaker 2:Sorry, whatever I might use. Okay, what did I? What did I say by accident?
Speaker 1:right now you're an open wound. So if, if, because then when that wound closes you get to be scabbed over. If you just let time go, or if you want god to heal it, you work these steps and it'll be healed, right not scabbed over a thousand percent you might not drink if it's scabbed over, right, but eventually that scab is going to crack yep and then break open. Yeah, absolutely, you want god to do it, because right now that open wound is exactly what it is.
Speaker 1:Right, it's open. How is it going to get? You're going to scab over right? You ain't going to heal it. No, I'm not going to heal it. God can heal it, right. Or you can just take time and right. Try to live off the first power, which is the fell, the power of the fellowship, and so. So that was good. So that's what I was writing down Appreciate that.
Speaker 2:So I mean, he called me and we talked and he goes. You know, I listened to your guys's first two or three episodes of of your podcast while I was cleaning the house. Today. I go, I go, really he goes, yeah, he goes. I really appreciated your guys' stories. I love the podcast, he goes. But you know, I really want you to be my sponsor and I said okay, well, I said let's, let's get to know each other a little bit. And you know, we'll, we'll start working through this and uh, and I told him, I told him the four rules, man, well, I think I only did three, but you know, I told him you, you, you don't lie to me and I won't lie to you.
Speaker 2:That's one, right, that's one. Uh, the other one is whatever I tell you stays between you and me, and it's not your girlfriend's fault, not your girlfriend's business, not my wife's business.
Speaker 1:It stays between us.
Speaker 2:And third is don't waste my fucking time. I work extremely hard and I go about. I'm a very busy person, so I'm going to set aside time for you. Don't waste my fucking time. Your time is as important as my time. So just let's respect each.
Speaker 1:Let's respect the only other rule I add to that is at any given point you want to go a different direction? Right, go, grow, you ain't gonna hurt my feelings, right. You want to go work with that cat?
Speaker 2:go, I'm good and you know, rob, I appreciate that I forgot this, I forgot that one, but the three, the three important ones, and I think the number one, the number one is don't waste my fucking time yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:And I think and a guy who's ready a guy whose wound is open, like you, like Brandon, like the men I've worked with that, are just flourishing. They were ready that wound was and they wanted God to do it. We're just facilitators. And right now he's striking when the iron's hot Don't mean we're going to be successful. We don't get anybody sober going to be successful.
Speaker 2:We don't get anybody sober. Nope, we don't get anybody drunk, we are a conduit, that's it. You know, and I I really so a couple of things that he said when we were talking yesterday and I actually told you and, uh, I asked him if he had a big book and he said, well, him and Christie share the plain language big book. And I'm like, Hmm, so I had to throw my prejudice aside and go. If this man needs to go through that plain language text to get sober, I need to learn that, learn that tech. So I ordered two yesterday, one for me, one for him, because I, to me, a good sponsor buys a man his first, first AA book. So I ordered one for him, one for me.
Speaker 1:Okay, Now, as long as because the third step, prayer, doesn't change.
Speaker 2:No, no, it's right there, baby, this fourth step is a three-part inventory. It doesn't change. Let me get a copy of that for you.
Speaker 1:I got them for you, I don't give a shit. I don't care for the plain language. I probably won't, I don't know.
Speaker 2:But I don't know, rob, have you read it? Yeah, I've read three quarters of the, so I can't form an opinion on it. I may get through and go fuck. This opened my eyes up a little bit Great.
Speaker 1:However, all I'm saying is I don't care what you go through, what book you use, god's the same. Third step prayer is the same. The four step inventory is the same, absolutely the prayer.
Speaker 2:Step five the confession.
Speaker 1:That's all the same. As long as that work happens, I don't care what book you're opening. Okay, let me take the back, I do care, however, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2:It doesn't matter because god's involved, right and he's, and he's the answer, all right. So so we're, so I've been, you know. Here's the other thing.
Speaker 1:And one more thing yeah, why are you done? I know I got and why?
Speaker 2:why are you turning those fucking pages right on the mic will?
Speaker 1:you want to swallow or?
Speaker 2:take a drink and swallow, shut up up hey, by the way, my wife told me I can't do my sounds anymore.
Speaker 1:I don't blame her because, hey, out of respect for katie, no more the reason rule number four, or your rule number three don't waste my fucking time is the most important right. The reason it is because if a man won't honor us right and respect a sponsor right and submit his time and will to a sponsor during this process, he's not going to submit his will to god. So there, that's what you know, right, once they start wasting your time.
Speaker 2:That's why, okay, I'm gonna go, because you're not ready so there's no other thing him and I talked about I, you know, I to me I thought it was a little bit important to understand this and we're going to get together, go have some coffee tomorrow or meet up to kind of kind of learn each other a little bit more, um, but I asked him if he believes you know does he have a higher? Power. He.
Speaker 1:He's struggling with that does, is he willing to believe that there could be a high power?
Speaker 2:yes, the book says that's all you need to make a beginning and we talked about that yesterday because, like I said, I want to be prepared right for every offense. For every offense, you need a defense right and I need, I needed to know a little bit of what I'm, what I'm, you know what I need to prepare myself for before we start walking down if you need to go to the week gnostics is that's what it says over there?
Speaker 1:and what about alcoholism? Um, I'll know more about needs. Is he, if he's willing? To believe, yeah, that there could be right, something greater than you you can go.
Speaker 2:One of his things that he said to me is he's like I know that something happens because I have already seen things change in my life.
Speaker 1:Wow, don't know where it's coming from doesn't matter what's coming, don't matter, go get it, go find it.
Speaker 2:well, blake, you're starting to see a little bit of the promises and I promise you you get through these steps and you're going to see the promises come wide open for you, and it's just and that relationship with that power right.
Speaker 1:Whatever that is, whatever that is, whatever that is, he'll develop that on his own and watch it, and then watch. As we know, god will work. Yep, if he works it, it's be amazing. That's the most you're getting ready to embark If it plays out like the way that, going to find one of the most, even all the heartbreaks that we have. Right and I've had a lot of God has given me a lot of great successes. Let's be honest.
Speaker 2:He has.
Speaker 1:However, the most beautiful ones are where you're going to go, the one you're embarking on right now, someone who doesn't have a preconceived weren't raised with nothing, just okay, there could be, and then to watch God work in's all I can do, you know I think this could come at a better time for me, because I think I needed this.
Speaker 2:I had to back away from H&I a lot. I'm not getting to go into the gels as much, so I haven't been able to work with another alcoholic like I was. I mean, I still go and speak at Maynard's. I go speak a little bit here and there.
Speaker 1:Which is great, which is great, but it doesn't solve that one-on-one Nothing so much ensures immunity to drinking as intensive work with other alcohol. Oh, I'm sorry I might quote in the book. I apologize, I don't give a shit. Big book thumper Brad.
Speaker 2:Right. So the other I mean, I want to just go over real. I got my sponsor, which is Rob, who is now what I call brother more than sponsor. But I just wanted to. So when I came out of Maynards and if I've told this story, if you've heard it, then I apologize, but I think we're on the topic, just say it Fuck off.
Speaker 2:We're on the topic of sponsorship and I just want trying to trying to get some of our listeners to understand how important this is. When I came, some of our listeners to understand how important this is. When I came out of maynards I was so wide open and so ready to fly down that a step.
Speaker 1:You okay with it? No, I'm looking at your texture because you had, uh, you know, b day, sober day, right, belly birthday of sober birthday. You know? Advice to new sponsors work with us.
Speaker 2:These are kind of right, this is the topics we're going after today. Um, so, when I came out of Maynards you know my, my counselor up there, which who's been on the shows Chris, he got me in touch with primary purpose and Jay that I mean Chris and I formed a bond, I think, when I was in Maynards and that bond is still extremely tight, one of my favorite men in this planet, yeah. And when I got down here and I met jay for the first time, I had no idea he, loving open arms, dawson, michael, norm, I just an amazing group of men that I I was, you know, so blessed to be a part of. When I got out of maynards and I, I got with jay and we and we, we met two or three times and jeanette met with katie and you know was it's all warm and fuzzy and cozy but, my God, I needed the throttle hit Right. I needed it Right.
Speaker 1:I was just drowning and I'm like in my opinion, everybody in your position, because when we all, most of it not I shouldn't say, let's say 90%, I can't even give a damn percentage. Anyway, most of us hit that moment Right, and the book says the throttle needs to be hit and the reason we do not, I think, through my experience, the throttle doesn't get hit and then the scab crosses over. They don't heal, god doesn't heal them, because they start to feel better, they don't get through the steps. Hey, maybe you know the throttle doesn't get hit, but you know yes, so let me just finish.
Speaker 2:I want to come back to that, okay. So the throttle doesn't get hit. But you know yes, and so let me. Let me just finish. I want to come back to that, okay because that's the throttle didn't get hit.
Speaker 1:But so then, what did you do?
Speaker 2:I just kind of I floated for about till about a month. I just kind of floated. I met with jay like two or three times and sitting at a primary purpose meeting, I was staring at the the door coming in and just not really having it. Primary is just an open book, it's a, it's a book study. So there's a lot going on. And you know, in comes rob walking and fucking bouncing across and I, it was instant, instantly. When I saw I was like I gotta fuck. Then you sat behind me and you're you. When you shared, it was like I want what this fucker's got. I, I gotta know where he's what, what is this and where can I get more of it. And as we were walking out, that's when jay introduced us. Right, and jay, you know, I, I think you say it, I don't remember it this way, but I'm pretty sure jay knew what he was doing when he introduced us because jay can't run, I make the joke, and I make the joke for his benefit because I love him more than anything.
Speaker 1:You know, the closest thing I've had to a father, you know, since my dad died in 2000. Yeah, but once he introduced us he said Larry, have you met Rob? You turned to shake my hand and he, you know, with his cane at the time, didn't take off running and give you the bird and say rob, he's your fucking problem now, right, but he just turned and left.
Speaker 2:He did, and it was just because he knew it right, I had to I. I was god, love jay, and he's walked a thousand men. But that whole situation right me coming in right the way I wait, because I just with energy, because I just come in, because god's energy and you just came off your battle with cancer.
Speaker 1:You were, you were right, I mean you were about a year and a half.
Speaker 2:You were starting to you were just starting to get yeah healthy and you were just starting to come back into it. But, yeah, you had a fire that I wanted you know and I and this is where I go back things.
Speaker 1:That, god thing, is the spirit of god. For sure, for sure to god and me, jay's same spirit. For sure, because you need it, because, if not, you were. That's your scab.
Speaker 2:I was struggling, I was right I was struggling and that's where I go back to when I was talking to Blake yesterday and I said listen, dude, if you don't squash right now, I have a fear inside of me that you aren't going to make it and make it you. We need to get going, whoever you're doing it with, but it needs to be now, on the other side of that, what I want to say. I believe there are certain people with different personalities that couldn't do the steps that you and I, the way you and I needed them. They go to different sponsors, Right.
Speaker 1:That's what I'm saying Absolutely. I'm great with that.
Speaker 2:And this is what I was telling Blake yesterday. If you want to do it this way, which is what I believe you need, I can kind of read your personality. Let's go. Whether it's me, whether it's Doug, whether it's Rob, whether it's Pat, whoever it is that you do make sure you talk to me and I will help you get to that person. If you're not comfortable with me, and that's perfectly fine, I don't care. But, dude, we need to do it, you need to do it. You know and I know it probably sounds bad to a lot of people saying you can't tell him what to do. You need to suggest. You can't. Man, I'm gonna tell you. I had to use my gut on that one. I truly believe that man needs to squeeze well he could listen.
Speaker 1:They can shut the fuck up. Do you have any musts in the big book?
Speaker 1:oh yeah, there's 71 yeah, there's no musts in the big book. There's, yeah, there are. Must you must? He had to do it or we would die. Right, had or must. So we qualify the alcoholic. Page 93 tells us that once you were convinced your man is an alcoholic, this man already came in and says I am an alcoholic of this type. Okay then, if you are, you need this right. Right, or that's just or don't. You don't have to do it, but this is what you need. It's like a doctor and here's a medication you need right to fix ailment. You don't have to take it, motherfucker but here it is.
Speaker 2:You can sit there and look at it, but you need it.
Speaker 1:All right, you know what it's done for me.
Speaker 2:just since yesterday is I, you know, I've actually opened up my 12 by 12. I've been studying, I've been going back.
Speaker 2:Like I said, it's just done so much for me to reignite a little bit of sun. I mean, it wasn't like I was stagnant, you know, I had a balance in my life that I was happy with. But guess what? God had another story for me, right? God literally said trust me. When I sat down in that meeting yesterday, Tom and I were just sitting there bullshitting and laughing and joking. He was giving us a hard time about us talking about him on our last podcast, and so we were bullshitting back and forth and I said jason was I was just glad mike had something other than what he had, oh yeah, and I was happy he had tom and uh anyway.
Speaker 2:So we were bullshitting and then it came around to blake, for him to uh, for him to share and uh, like I said, I don't want to go down, beat that road up. But good, god, it's just. I'm excited, a little nervous, but you know. So I started reading some stuff only for two, a couple reasons. One when I do anything, I want to know that you know what I'm. I don't like this to do stuff without a good knowledge of what I'm doing. So so I believe when I sponsored the first time, I was only about seven, eight months sober. I shouldn't say only I was seven to eight months sober.
Speaker 1:Same time I got my first one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I didn't. I don't heroin addict. Oh boy, Still sober Doing great. And I, my first two aren't. It's not us, it's still. They weren't ready. And you know, yeah, they weren't ready.
Speaker 1:And you know they didn't turn out right.
Speaker 2:But I truly believe I wasn't ready right.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:And I truly believe I wasn't ready. That's why Did you?
Speaker 1:had you at that time had a spiritual awakening as a?
Speaker 2:result of the steps. Oh, yeah, no.
Speaker 1:Did you have access to me? Oh yeah, and other men who've had that, absolutely, so you were ready enough. I don't. Knowledge, wise Knowledge wise.
Speaker 2:Emotionally maybe not Right I don't think that I was emotionally but you had all the tools necessary to take that I did.
Speaker 1:Were they ready is the better question. Well, and I look at it, I don't believe they were.
Speaker 2:Well, whether they weren't or not, I don't think had so much selfish um selfishness in me to where I want to do this, I want to do that. I fuck, I gotta have that stupid meeting tonight. You know that I am. I feel like I'm in a better place. I got to instead of I get to right. That's where you were right now I'm like fuck I, I get.
Speaker 2:I get to meet with him tomorrow night and I'm excited. I get to start working these steps with some, with another man, and I'm excited. I wasn't that way before before. I was just excited to say I had a sponsee.
Speaker 2:Oh, I got you, you know, that's what it was, everything, baby before I was just, I was strutting around with my chest out saying I got a sponsee. Look at me, look at me and it's just like no, that wasn't the right motives. Right now I got you. Now I think I want to help. As much as I speak about it on this podcast, as much as I talk about it, I think God has now said you're going to walk this man through his steps, whether he's successful or not, you're going to do it. You're going to stay sober, right for sure. So I looked up. I wanted to just go in. You know, look on, look on google and say what is an, a sponsor and alcohol remember, we are not sponsored by, we are not affiliated with a and the word sponsorship get over it the word sponsorship.
Speaker 1:Over it I am what the word sponsorship is not in the first one. No, it's not for one reason huh, for a great reason, that wasn't. It wasn't intended to be sponsored right then, right Until you know. That's why.
Speaker 2:Go ahead. So in Alcoholics Anonymous, a sponsor is a more experienced member who provides guidance and support to a new member, also known as a sponsee, as they navigate a program and work through 12 Steps Essential. A sponsor acts as a mentor, a confidantant and a source of encouragement, helping the sponsor stay on track with their recovery.
Speaker 2:I love it that's actually aspects of being a sponsor sharing their own recovery story. Yep guiding through at the 12 steps. Yep providing emotional support when needed. So I I had to read that one because I I'm not. This is where I'm gonna have. Emotional support takes different. It takes different'm not. This is where I'm going to have emotional support.
Speaker 1:It takes different, it takes different. This is the this is what they mean by that.
Speaker 2:Sponsors. Sponsors offer a listening ear, encouragement and safe space to discuss the challenge and triumphs in recovery.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Promoting accountability, and you know that's that's huge. Offering resources big healthy boundaries.
Speaker 1:healthy boundaries depends on resources. It doesn't mean you got to go get them a job If you have an opportunity and they're ready for that not a bank don't bring them into your house.
Speaker 1:You're not a bank, you're not their doctor, you're not their lawyer. You are their sponsor through the AA program of the steps. Not a fucking marriage counselor either. No, and that's the like I said your opinion. If they ask it, you're free to share your opinion, but when it comes to authority, your authority is in the big book, right into the steps, and that's it that's the problem I had with my number one.
Speaker 2:But very first sponsor I had I, I, mean the accountability part is the biggest one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure, when you're shit, young man, oh, and I'm I will trust me A foundation of fellowship. No pressure to well. So, anyways, here's some more stuff. What doesn't a big book say about sponsorship? Here's more detail Sharing expensive, strength and hope. The big book stresses the importance of sharing personal experience, strength and hope with others to help them in their recovery. The sharing in a core. So, anyway, some more of this is BS or not BS, but so I wanted to come back to this because I I believe this is something very important. You hit on it with christy, right? So our listeners must think we're just an all-in-bred, because we I mean, if you, if you go back and listen to our podcast we just kind of mingle around with. There's just there's so much intermingled with this person's involved with this person involved, not not relationship wise, but no, yeah, you know, it's just weird, because's so much intermingled with this person's involved with this person involved, not not relationship wise, but no, yeah, you know, it's just weird because you co-sponsored um.
Speaker 2:You co-sponsored um Christie Christie, which I'm going to go back to that. I want to hit on that. Can you have two sponsors? This is it's funny.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Right One sponsor is a norm. Se One sponsor is the norm. Seeking multiple opinions can be problematic.
Speaker 1:Go ahead, because this is why.
Speaker 2:If a newcomer seeks advice from several sponsors based on what they want to hear, it can lead to inconsistent guidance and lack of focused support.
Speaker 1:Exactly Because, typically, what a human being will do and I've got a good friend, you know him, we just talked about him He'll do this. He'll call us oh ten, oh yeah, he's called me after he's talked to you till someone co-signs their bullshit and then hey, well, you know this guy. The first five guys said motherfucker, right. But number six said you know, I wouldn't do that, okay, and that's what they wanted to hear.
Speaker 1:So that's the direction they go that's why one sponsor picked the right one and again. If that's not working, go grab another one, but don't begin, like you said, motive, motive the reason.
Speaker 2:You're the reason.
Speaker 1:Motive but your motive was wrong because you were just with your chest.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my first one was just their motive is wrong for getting a new sponsor.
Speaker 1:It's gonna, it's gonna, it's gonna show up in them not getting sober.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, and that's that's on them, yeah I think my maturity, and my maturity in my recovery, is at a point to where I want to give it away to somebody else.
Speaker 1:Someone who's ready and wants to have it.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Right, and I, you know I see guys in fresh freshies a good way to call it which new hope has been bringing a lot into. We've had a lot of guys coming into New Hope. I think it's because of Pat, the chairperson, who works with the New Hope quite a bit. He's been bringing a lot of guys in. There were three fresh guys in there yesterday. One guy looked scared to death. I mean he didn't even share.
Speaker 1:yesterday, me and Aaron got together, said a prayer, gave the power over to God. We showed up the next week and guess who was there? Jason Ryan. Then guess who was there. Yeah, jason Ryan. Then guess who was there. The fourth week Doug. Wow, and we built it and we just kept, we just stayed consistent, stayed obedient basically.
Speaker 1:And God did the heavy lifting, wow. But we must stay obedient. It's not that you know. Again, don't lean on a fucking shovel Right and pray to God for a hole, start digging. He provided the tool. God will you help us get a group together? But we're not going to do anything else. We're just going to sit here with our thumb up our ass and wait for you to do everything.
Speaker 1:That's not how he works. God hits a moving target. He prefers to hit the moving target. He's a great shot. Stay moving and work towards that goal, because your prayer should not be hopeful, your prayer should be expectant. That's faith. If you're going to worry, don't fucking pray.
Speaker 2:If you're going to pray don't fucking worry.
Speaker 1:Learn to let it go, because he's going to work and you have to trust in that prayer.
Speaker 2:And that's very difficult. It's easy for me to say that from here.
Speaker 1:You'd have told me that, since month seven of sobriety, I just slapped you upside the head. You know, brother, I'm just treading water. You know what, though?
Speaker 2:and I still go through it though because I get, I just went through some stuff at work and I'm actually kind of still going through it. That and it's just I and I and I don't stop right, you know, show me, guide me through what you want me to do next you don't.
Speaker 1:This is. This is what you're great about.
Speaker 2:Right, you don't stop.
Speaker 1:No, God, no, no, no no, god hits a moving target Right.
Speaker 2:I literally I've been working through something for the last two weeks and, uh, and it's, I had to really. I mean, I've been praying every morning. God, show me the path. Don't, don't take this from me, right? I don't pray that way anymore. Show me the path to relieve this. Yeah don't lighten my load. Give me broader shoulders. Right, show me how I need to navigate this to where I can relieve this pain. And he has right. He showed me and I had to go through some stuff that I was scared to death to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, I was scared to fucking death to do yeah Right, I had to.
Speaker 2:I was scared to fucking death to do some stuff I had to do these last two days. I had to discuss some stuff with some people that I didn't know how it was going to turn out.
Speaker 1:Well, there's growth, only to be found on the other side of those moments.
Speaker 2:Right. So here's another one. You're how to know if you got a bad sponsor right, how to know that I'm going to go to this one, your sponsor talks more about him or herself than about you.
Speaker 1:It depends on the moment, it depends on what the topic, it depends on where you're at.
Speaker 2:I kind of get that, because one of the things that I kind of honestly see I just listen. I don't speak a lot, I do a lot of listening and that's where I'm going to have a rough time. I read the book.
Speaker 1:I explain what the book says. I make them. Do you know exactly? I have them do examples from. I show examples from my life, you know, being molested or whatever. Whatever the hard ones are, I show them and have them write out examples of theirs. Do you understand this?
Speaker 2:right and then I just listen right, your sponsor has a cynical or pessimistic attitude.
Speaker 1:Yeah, fuck that guy if he's got no hope and strength. I mean right if he's, but if that his attitude, why the fuck did you pick him?
Speaker 2:Right, right, get rid of that. Yeah, definitely your sponsor has trouble finding time for you. Get rid of them. Yeah, that's okay, it goes back to our rule.
Speaker 1:This doesn't mean they're bad or evil people, no, they're just not right for you. They're not right for you Because a lot of people have a problem. We've talked about it. Yep, how do I change sponsors? And they'll stick out of gear. Guilt, fear, all right, and that's a detriment to their sobriety.
Speaker 2:Right when I left, jay, I still remember asking you, do I need to tell Jay? And you said he'll figure it out.
Speaker 1:I'm like okay, well, and I knew because the way he turned after he introduced us, I saw that he knew.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he knew He'd been doing this long enough. Because, yeah, your sponsor doesn't return your messages promptly. I don't know, well, I don't know about promptly, right? What if he's busy? Your sponsor is rigid in his or her approach, bullshit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't have a-. If you want a guy who's doing hey, here's what the step four step looks like, but do it how you want to, Right.
Speaker 2:Good luck and take your time. Don't call me whenever you're ready. Yeah, I'm going to tell you if you would. Yeah, well, I was different. I had my four step done in a day and a half and I was ready.
Speaker 1:I had mine done in three and a half hours. I was ready to get that shit.
Speaker 2:The fuck out.
Speaker 1:But again are ready to go the way the big book says it. You know, the way the old time boom, boom, boom. And I'm not if you, if you go and do a different way and have success, great, that's not the way I'm going to do it, because god's had great success through this right. The way the old time, you know, just it's right here right, your sponsor tries to psychoanalyze you.
Speaker 2:We don't have, but here's a.
Speaker 1:We're not doctors in the hair but had, remember I shared in the big book study two weeks ago, had bill wilson, not because he remember when roland hazard went to, went overseas, uh, he tried to go to sigmund, freud, freud was too busy. He tried to go to adler because adler and carl jung were both, uh uh, apprentice or not apprentices, but a freud, right, adler wasn't available. Freud uh, I mean adler, freud weren't available, only Carl Jung was. And Carl Jung out of the three is the only one who believes in something spiritual, anything metaphysical. Had he not, that's all we'd be doing was psychoanalyzing people, because there's no, there'll be no higher power in this program and we wouldn't have a program either, because that's the power. But anyway, that's just.
Speaker 2:Your sponsor isn't a good listener.
Speaker 1:You've got to be a good listener, because it's not about talking.
Speaker 2:Listen. Yeah, your sponsor asks you to run his or her personal errands. If you do that, for them, mow their.
Speaker 1:I've heard hey, listen older sponsors have guys come.
Speaker 1:Okay, now, hold on, I'm going to play devil's advocate. I knew an older guy. I mean they were working the steps. This guy was working, I mean they were doing step work and he would have this young man come over and mow his lawn. This, this young. Okay, hold on. Okay again, here's, here's, here's where circumstances are different. Most times now I would say, dude, don't. But the young man, this young man had never been employed. He had just been, you know that kind, you know just right, homeless, robbing, stealing, thieving. He had no, no responsibility. So this guy was trying to teach him. Before you go out of the workforce, he'll have some response for the next month and a half as we do this work. You're going to be at my house on saturdays. You're going, this is your responsibility edge, you know right, and he paid him a little bit, but just to learn some work ethic, right, okay? Before he said that's not.
Speaker 2:That's not that's different. But just to learn some work ethic before he said that's not, that's different, right.
Speaker 1:But just to do it, just to get some free labor is bullshit, and if that's what's going on, get a different sponsor and then, introduce me to your sponsor. Me and Larry are slapping upside the head.
Speaker 2:That's what cracked me up last week when Mike said, yeah, I switched to Tom as my sponsor. He had me wash his truck. Your instincts tell you that he or she isn't the right sponsor for you. That's what. That's what switched me to you.
Speaker 1:Right, I just, I just knew Again, that's a double-edged sword too.
Speaker 2:This guy's too rigid, this guy's, you know he's too, you know he's a, he's a, he's a disciplinarian.
Speaker 1:Well, maybe that's what you need.
Speaker 2:Get your ass through that fucking step and if it's coming out of this book.
Speaker 1:If he's not telling you, in my opinion, fuck him, then don't listen. But if he says well, right here, on page 65, it says, and that's something you don't want to do, it's right here. Do it or go get drunk, yeah.
Speaker 2:So there's always qualifiers Get working or get dead, one or the other Right.
Speaker 1:Anyways, I think we beat the shit out of that one. What do?
Speaker 2:you think I love it.
Speaker 1:I mean but sponsorship and choosing the right sponsor or an appropriate sponsor, right or wrong, I should say that's. You know semantics, but you know I mean. But don't be afraid to change right and go and if and if need to go eyeball, eyeball to the man hey, listen, this isn't working for me I want to work with jim over here Go.
Speaker 2:But get the work done, get it done. If that guy's got a problem, that's his problem. And I told Blake that yesterday. I don't give a shit who you do, I don't give a shit who you ask to be your sponsor, just make sure you get it done.
Speaker 1:But remember, when you come in to AA you have an open wound.
Speaker 2:Right, there was another man that walked up.
Speaker 1:He's going to get closed by a scab if you don't do the work and eventually open back up, or you can have God heal you through these steps Right, which is going to be.
Speaker 2:There was another gentleman. As I pulled Blake over to the side and we were chit-chatting, there was another gentleman come up and was talking to him about asking him would you like me to be your sponsor? Blah, blah, blah. And in my mind I'm like, oh blake, please know who is that?
Speaker 1:I ain't talking about as soon as we get off this podcast.
Speaker 1:You better fucking tell me and uh, whatever, man, if he would have done it, I would have just left it I would have left it the way it was hold on, remember I told you, I told you a story about when I was a year or two sober, about the guy who was not right not an. He was a certain type of hard drinker that never worked the steps. The young man asked me. He goes, you know, in the back room of primary. Oh, you don't have to do the steps. I didn't. Two weeks later that kid was drunk and killed a mother and daughter. Now he's in prison, you know, for vehicle homicide.
Speaker 1:Now, it's not my fault that that kid went and drank. It's not that guy's fault, right? It's the kid's fault, right? However, I should have said something, right? Okay, yeah, I should have said something Right?
Speaker 1:No, not right. Then. And the moment, hey, motherfucker, I know you didn't work the steps, but before that man left my presence, the young man, I should have said something. Yeah, should have said because you got guilt on that, no, not anymore. But I did right. I mean, me and jay had to work through that because jay was rob. That guy is not a right. He told me a lot of that guy's story because jay tried to sponsor you got you.
Speaker 1:That's why I found out the guy never worked his steps. He was a certain type of guy was new, right, you're sober certain type of hard drinker. He had a second dui. He liked what he got from aa. He wasn't in trouble, no more. So he just stayed here. Everybody loved him because he was a really educated man, spoke well. Everybody loved to hear him share because he knew the book and he would sit, all the right things. But he never worked a step. I didn't have to work a step, you don't have to work him that kid's in prison.
Speaker 2:Still, this dude actually in the middle of an aa program, a meeting after the meeting, in the back room.
Speaker 1:The guy asked and I and I heard it and I didn't say nothing, and then all that happened and I and I went to Jay hey, jay, this is what I heard, right, man, I feel like an ass. He said well, he goes. Yes, I would have said something, but I understand he goes. It's not your fault Any of that. Let me tell you the backstory about that man.
Speaker 1:Now whether Jay should have, because he told me that, so I wouldn't feel guilty, I could put everything in perspective. But now I would have said and since when I've had not exact scenarios like that, but other scenarios, I don't care if 20, 30, 40 years sober people, I've pulled them off to the side when they've said stupid shit in front of newcomers?
Speaker 2:No, for sure, and I've listened.
Speaker 1:If you say that again, you and I are go to different fellowship.
Speaker 2:Fuck this place right, don't do that. That's the difference between because you're killing. You can kill people, yeah, but then that's and that's what I said in the very beginning. There's certain things that I won't get involved in a conversation because it goes a little deeper than my knowledge, right, because I'm still a little bit not a little bit I'm still a lot ignorant to a lot of in-depth stuff in this and there's times I might overstep and I well, and it doesn't but I'll apologize.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna tell you right now I would take you, I would take your advice over people 30 and 40 years sober, because how deep you go into this book, right? So I mean I don't know where I'm going going with that. It's just that I'm very cautious about how deep when I hear stuff that's not right. I and I know for a fact it's not right. I will say something, but but the way we do it.
Speaker 1:We don't say it right there. No, no, no, no people, I pull people aside and I do it you do it.
Speaker 2:But if that way, you try to correct what was possibly said.
Speaker 2:Same way, the guy, the guy that when you and I was getting ready to do my four-step right and some guy pulled and I talked about it at primary purpose and some guy had pulled me to the side and started telling me how he did his four-step. And I'm listening to this guy and I don't even remember his name, nothing. I don't think I've ever seen him again. I remember that guy confused me so bad that when I left there, because I still wasn't a thousand percent understanding the four-step, I was a little bit more confused. Maybe you hadn't even introduced it to me, I just knew it was getting ready to come. A little bit more confused. Maybe you hadn't even introduced it to me, I just knew it was getting ready to come. And I was so confused about what he said and then what I had read in the book, or then you explained it and in my mind I'm like that motherfucker shouldn't have said a goddamn word, because he confused the shit out of me.
Speaker 2:More harm than good he did, for I mean I for like two or three days, I'm sure he meant I'm sure he did great things, but he does more harm than good and that goes back again if it's not in, if you can't be substantiated, what you're about to say to someone, new right is not found in this fucking book.
Speaker 1:That's why I quote it that way. It's not me paraphrasing, it's a fucking quote. It's a quote not just to show. Hey look, how smart rob is. No, because I'm not smart, but I can memorize, memorize. But that way they don't have. Hey, rob, would you? I don't have to go, I don't have to ask rob, I can go to page 64, because that's what he said. Oh, there it is, it's in the book. There's your authority, right?
Speaker 2:and that's where I'm hoping I I mean, I I'm gonna have to do some more studying and get get caught up on some of that stuff. Anyways, rob, let's get the hell out of here. Let's go. Recovery unfiltered podcast at gmailcom. Reach out to us if you got any questions on that, if you got, somebody needs some help that's right.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry. There's like six f-bombs and that's. I'm please forgive me for that I'll clean it up next time.
Speaker 2:Tammy, it was all him, not me. Yeah, recovery, unfiltered podcast, that g what?
Speaker 1:my sister asked because I want to talk. I want to clarify one thing as far as the mike and the jason, because we had talked about, um, uh, mike's first son, joseph joseph, and we kind of left it on the cliffhanger.
Speaker 2:She goes robbie, that's something I was going to clear up is joseph still alive.
Speaker 1:Yes, joseph is alive.
Speaker 2:Uh, physically he is still impaired, mentally he's pretty good, you know, but he is still alive and well, you know, I'm sorry to leave that was one of the things I was going to bring up, and we will, we will, and it's probably good that Tammy yeah, I mean Joseph is. I mean, he's around Oakdale. Oh yeah, people know him. Yeah, all right, let's get out of here. Bye-bye. Thank you for joining us today. We hope you learned something today that will help you If you did not come back next week, and we'll try again If you like what we heard.
Speaker 1:Give us a five-star review. If you don't like what you heard, kiss my. You can't say that, can you? Anyway, if you don't like what you heard, go ahead and tell us that too. We'll see what we can improve. We probably won't change nothing, but do it anyway.
Speaker 2:Hey, thanks Rob. Go back next week and hopefully something will be different and something will sink in unfiltered.