Recovery Unfiltered
Taking recovery discussion to a different level. Bringing comedy and the lighter side of sober living along with educating non-alcoholics and alcoholics. Hear real stories unfiltered.
Recovery Unfiltered
Escaping the Shadows: A Survivor's Journey from Addiction to Redemption
What begins as an ordinary story of teenage experimentation spirals into a harrowing journey through addiction's darkest corners. Stefani—raised in a loving, stable home with law enforcement connections—never imagined she'd become trapped in a cycle of heroin dependency and sex trafficking. Yet one casual drug experience in high school set her on a path that would ultimately cost her everything.
With remarkable candor, Stefani reveals how her "bar kept lowering" after each boundary she crossed. From a promising softball scholarship to being sexually assaulted on campus, from losing custody of her son to surviving three different trafficking situations, her story shatters misconceptions about who can fall victim to exploitation. Most chilling is her insight into how traffickers operate—not through dramatic kidnappings, but through calculated manipulation of vulnerability, particularly addiction.
The most powerful aspect of Stefani's testimony isn't the darkness she endured, but the light she eventually found. Now six months sober, she's rebuilding her relationship with her daughter and using her experiences to help others recognize the warning signs of trafficking. Her journey demonstrates that recovery is possible even from the most desperate circumstances.
This episode serves as both a stark warning and a beacon of hope. Stefani's experiences highlight how addiction creates vulnerability that predators expertly exploit, while proving that no matter how far someone falls, redemption remains possible. For parents, educators, and anyone concerned about these intertwined crises, her insights provide valuable perspective on recognizing and preventing exploitation before it begins.
Have you noticed warning signs in someone you care about? Are you struggling yourself? This conversation reminds us that reaching out for help isn't weakness—it's the first step toward reclaiming your power.
Thank You for Joining Us.. Please share with friends. If you or anyone you know is struggling with alcoholism please reach out to us. We can get you help. recoveryunfilteredpodcast@gmail.com
I don't know why I wasn't recording any of that. You're a dick. I am Heavenly Father. Thank you for bringing us together. Father, we ask that you come and you sit with us. Father, we ask that you take each one of us, Father, and you give us the peace, the peace of telling our story. Father, sit with Rob and I as we work through Stephanie's story to help support her. Father, we ask that her story reaches a soul. Not one soul can find the help that they need. Father, we ask all these things in your name. Amen, let's go to work. There you go. At least you pulled the mic away that time. You didn't want me to say a bad word right after a prayer, did you?
Speaker 3:No, because we've got to begin, we've got to do it right. This time I'm getting better. Hey, you are getting better. You are getting better.
Speaker 1:What did we say? What did Jim say? On the last one, I only had the least amount of fucks. Okay, I was setting you up for that. I was setting you up.
Speaker 3:We got to give me a couple minutes here. It was brought to our attention. This is to the listeners. I talked to Jim earlier this week and if you heard Jim's story, of which you haven't, go back and listen His sister-in-law, the young lady who prayed when they were all looking for Jim. He was getting ready to commit suicide and all she prayed for was the gun to get jammed. The gun did not work and it didn't, and so he was asking her you know how did she like the podcast and she's very a woman of faith and she said, jim, it was great, but I just couldn't get past all the. It was hard to get past. All the f were f bombs and I'm like and even when I listened to it, steph, it was I was creating like Rob, come on. And so Jim went back and listened to it and he said there was 58 F-bombs in 53 minutes. I had the most, larry, jim second yeah.
Speaker 1:I was going to say Larry.
Speaker 3:Third. So this is you know, and you know the Bible says that our language needs to be full of gratitude, seasoned with salt, so that we can give proper answers to those who need it. And it was seasoned. All right, it was seasoned. So our vow is we need to be better. We will be better. We're not perfect by any means, but what people don't know, with this young lady, jim's sister-in-law doesn't know that took place. This is my recollection. I don't even think Mary knows, because I think Mary went to the bathroom in between and Jim had pulled out two crisp $100 bills, gave one to me, so crisp Stephanie, the ink was just barely dry. Jim went back and listened to all our episodes. He goes, boys, I think we can beat that one, cause we had one that said no more F bombs, and that was the title of the show. Yeah, that was the title of the show, I remember. So he said and me and Larry never want to, uh, you know, not take a challenge or money.
Speaker 3:We did it and then we talked later and we and is money because we spent it on cocaine and booze, but it didn't go very far because booze has gotten expensive. But what we vow to do because of being we, we recognize our part. The next time we see jim for putting us up to that, we're gonna tar and feather that motherfucker in the streets okay, I'm done.
Speaker 1:We love you, jim. You know that was a great episode. You know they got some traction there, but there was a lot of there was a lot there right, yeah, there was a lot there.
Speaker 1:Uh, no, I'm talking about the story, right, I mean there was over. Jim's must got a hell of a following up there, because there was over 85, I think, in denver area itself and aurora had I don't know like 30 or 40 listens. It got some. That one was the first one and I've said this many times that mine, the very first one we had the most listens to. His blew right past mine, it blew right past it. So, and here's the other things we, with Mary, right With what Mary's been doing, everybody loves Mary. Hey, they ought to make a movie that called that Something about, oh, something about Mary. Hey, they ought to make a movie that called that Something about, oh, something about Mary.
Speaker 2:Anyways, I don't think that's quite the same.
Speaker 1:It's a little bit Mary. Anyways, the show, the podcast, everything is just really starting to grow. The Instagram, I'm so happy that she's here with us and I appreciate it, honey, appreciate you so much.
Speaker 2:It's an honor to be here.
Speaker 1:It's been fun. Yeah, it's an honor to be here. Yeah, they um. So we got. We got a guest that rob brought to me, uh brought to us, and I'm so excited. Never met you before. You hear how he corrected that, right what brought to us well, it's course, because I'm talking, because you brought it, because that then it's us. If I'd have brought her, I'd have said I brought her, that's right, it's all about me prick.
Speaker 3:You know this. Hey, that's a good word. It's better than the F word.
Speaker 1:I try not to use the F word Anyways. So, stephanie, well, hold on, let me back up.
Speaker 3:You're supposed to let her introduce herself.
Speaker 1:Introduce yourself. Hi, I'm Stephanie. A little late, isn't it?
Speaker 4:And I am an alcoholic addict.
Speaker 1:Hello Stephanie.
Speaker 4:Hello, tell us about yourself. First off, how do you know rob? I met rob in the rooms. Actually, this is a funny story. Rob doesn't even know this. I met rob at a book study in the rooms when he was doing the book study. Um, in the rooms of aa right thursday night yeah, sorry, and what rob doesn't know is I was in the process of really struggling with my sponsor. I had a sponsor that was I just wasn't making progress with her. We were doing a lot of errand running.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I was with her one day for about five hours and we didn't do a single ounce of step work. So anyways, rob, what I'm trying to get at is I went into the rooms and I had already gone in on my Saturday morning meeting and I had cried to the ladies and been like I don't know what to do, I don't know, like I just want to get my step work done. And I went into that book study and I remember I went and I asked Christy. I said, hey, can I have a guy sponsor me, because I freaking love the way you looked at that book and the way you did your book study. I was like this man knows his shit right don't blow his head up, stephanie I'm trying not to.
Speaker 4:I'm trying not to, but I and then I took it to the women's meeting the following week and I was like can a man sponsor me? And everybody's like, well, I mean, it's not like ideal. And I'm like, okay, so but yeah. And then, uh, yeah, I wanted you to be my sponsor for a little bit, but I did you got? Lucky. Well, no, I ended up getting someone that he took through the steps as my sponsor, so Christy okay, yeah, christy's awesome, she's been on the show too yeah, yeah, she's awesome.
Speaker 4:I got Christy when I totally scored, you know, and she's awesome, you know.
Speaker 1:The funny thing is is nowhere in the book does it say sponsorship right and the first 164 in the first 164, and here's the frustrating part about that is I know so many women that should not be around men as getting a sponsor, but I've met many women that should have a man sponsor or could, could, right and you're one of them right, very, very strong very type a was one of them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, christy was one. So they can. They can use it and there's some men that could probably use a woman as a sponsor yeah did.
Speaker 3:Oh, she did yes I did not know that jeanette's first sponsor was a man really yeah, did not know, 44 years ago.
Speaker 1:You know what, and it goes back to what I've said all along it's just who do you connect with right now? There's also that attraction thing that could could hurt. Hurt that a little bit, but I mean well, you know the story.
Speaker 3:The first woman I ever sponsored, uh, she had come to, she would cut my wife. She cut my wife's hair, but I, I had asked my sponsor at the time. She'd asked me she was. She wouldn't do anything, she wouldn't ask my wife is, it'd be okay if Rob sponsored me and there was kind of a to do. You know about all that and I didn't. So my wife said, listen, and you both would land. He knows why you both love my wife. She says you know, I'm not an alcoholic honey, and if I fucking was, I wouldn't have no woman as a sponsor, because women are nothing but catty fuck, catty bitches. That's what she said. That's her quote, amen. So so she goes. That woman asked you for help. She asked me for help and you're going to help her because you've been given a gift. Yeah, now I eventually had to have help this young lady learn to have healthy relationships and boundaries with women. And you, you know, now she has a woman sponsor, Right?
Speaker 4:But yeah, but in the beginning let's be honest, some of us women are pretty messed up with other women Like before we get through that step work.
Speaker 1:For sure. I mean, there's definitely some Every situation has its own. I think so, I mean, I've seen women like you. You were struggling.
Speaker 3:You were about ready to run out of it. Well, christy, christy was too at a time, so she asked, christy asked me the same question. I said well, I will sit down with you and I know christy sponsored who I love to death and you're sponsoring, and I will do the this part of it and show you how I do it. So, because chris, christy's exactly what that fellowship needs, right? Strong women strong who don't take shit from anybody but do the deal.
Speaker 1:I haven't got to see her in a little while.
Speaker 3:Of course I have, and Steph's going to be the same way. Steph will be the same way.
Speaker 1:Well, let's go. Let's go and get into your story. We'll talk a little bit more.
Speaker 4:All right, oh man, where do I even start? I guess I'll just go back to, okay, I won't take it too far back. You grow up in houston. I grew well we home of the huskies, yeah, next door to waterford. We moved um a few times. So my okay, well, I guess I didn't. Where do I begin?
Speaker 4:My dad, my biological dad, was alcoholic addict. Um, I saw him until I was I don't know how exactly how old I was. Whenever, um one day we went for visitation, he got me me like every other weekend and he wasn't there and he had gotten really heavy, really really deep into his addiction and alcoholism. So that's when, you know, I think he made the conscious decision to leave because he was afraid of putting me in harm's way. But you know, a couple of years down the road, so me and my mom moved a few times because she was a single mom, she was working as a correctional officer, graveyard shift, and you know, so my grandparents really stepped up, everybody kind of put a hand in to to help, you know, get me where I needed to be.
Speaker 4:But we moved a few times and then she met my dad the guy I call my dad.
Speaker 1:So how old were you when the last time you saw your biological dad?
Speaker 4:to be honest, ballpark probably.
Speaker 1:I want to say maybe five, wow okay, all right I want to say, and that's, that's even it's almost like a dream, like right, you know it's hard to really even remember.
Speaker 4:I have very, very few memories of that time you know, a couple of them were crappy ones. A couple of them were good ones you know, couple of them were good ones. It's kind of dreamy, but when I actually start remembering my childhood is when my dad came into my life, my stepdad, that man came in and filled any bit of a void that I could have ever possibly had he adopted me.
Speaker 1:Good for him.
Speaker 4:Yeah, he went through the process, adopted me. I took his last name.
Speaker 3:So that's, dad.
Speaker 4:That's dad. Damn right, that's dad, that's dad, um, yeah, so, but once he was around, you know, everything was great. Even before everything was great, my mom worked her ass off to make sure everything was fine, always, you know, um, but he definitely filled any bit of like void I had, um, yeah, so, growing up we were, we were, you know, normal. We finally settled into Houston. It was good, life was good. I was doing good in school.
Speaker 1:About what grade? About what grade?
Speaker 4:We settled back into Houston. I was going into eighth grade. Okay yeah, I had started there when I was young, when it was just me and my mom. Then I had actually moved away because my parents decided to go and buy a house and, you know, do what they needed to do, but they ended up moving again back to Houston. So it was like reuniting with everyone I knew when I was in kindergarten. So yeah, so everything was good. I had a little brother that was 10 and a half years younger than me.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:That was my little guy. He was like me. Okay, that was my little guy. He was like, I mean, he was my own, like he was like a live doll to me. You know, I mean, and we were at such different places in our life, there was never the competition, like it was just pure love for that kid Always, you know, no jealousy, no, nothing like that.
Speaker 1:Enough separation there.
Speaker 4:For sure. We were at completely different stages of our lives. You know, Um yeah, and things were great. I did well in school. Um, I mean, I did. I was one of those kids that, like refused to do my homework, but I tested well enough to get by.
Speaker 1:Yeah, fuck you people yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah, didn't have to. I could put in really minimal effort and I still did well. Like I look back and I'm like man, if only I just applied myself. You know the possibilities, but but, um, yeah, so I did fine, um, but I grew up very, um, insecure. I don't know if it stemmed from my dad, I really can't tell you where it stemmed from. I just remember my entire life being incredibly insecure and incredibly uncomfortable in my own skin. Um, just never really feeling like I fit in. You know, um, and so like when I would get attention from a guy, I would be so uncomfortable with it because I didn't feel like I deserved it. You know that I would get like weird about it. I don't know. I just had a weird, a hard time like starting the dating process when my friends were like starting it, like I just got really weird about it and I just was like I don't know, it just wasn't natural to me, it was odd, it was like I, it was just a weird thing, thing. I don't even know how to explain it.
Speaker 3:What did you get into athletics oh, my whole life.
Speaker 4:Okay, yeah, I played travel softball my entire life, um that that could be part of the reason too, cause that takes up your whole life. You know you don't really have time to anything travel takes you.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean, we were practicing three to four nights a week you know, and then tournaments every weekend and we were traveling, so I mean, it was, it was. My whole life was was consumed with sports, um, which also makes it hard to make like friends outside of your sports crew, you know. So at school I felt kind of like weird, like I didn't really have like my core group. All these people were like hanging out outside of school and that those weren't my people, you know. So, yeah, so, uh, my sophomore year, I remember. I remember having this huge crush on this kid that was at my school and eventually he was expelled, right. He was expelled for something to do with pills, right, so, which automatically just made him so much more attractive to me, right, fucking awful, um, but yeah, so he was expelled, um, but somehow he got my number and he had texted me one day and was like hey, want to hang out. And I'm like, yes, like absolutely.
Speaker 1:So you had no insecurity about that one.
Speaker 4:I think I was too excited. Okay, I think I was, just so I was. I again didn't feel like I like I thought that dude would have never even talked to me, you know what I mean. Like that just wasn't in my, in my scope, you know. And so he came and he had reached out and I was just like in awe of the whole thing, you know.
Speaker 3:And up to this point, no drinking, no drug. You're just a regular high school girl.
Speaker 4:Regular high school girl. This is my sophomore year. Yeah, didn't drink, didn't hide anything from my parents. It helps that my parents. So a little background on my family. My grandpa is retired deputy sheriff, also lives in Houston, very connected within the community. My mom worked for houston school district and she was in corrections right and she was in corrections, so you can't get shit past her, and my dad worked for the city of houston, so like I couldn't get away with anything, even if I wanted to right and so you know, I just didn't really
Speaker 4:push the limits on it. It was like I don't really feel the need to. And, plus, my mom and I had a pretty open relationship with each other. You know, if I was going to go do something like go to a party or something, I would have told my mom, because she was like she would have rather known that me be shady about it.
Speaker 4:So, yeah, so I started seeing this guy and my mom was excited for me because she saw how excited I was and everything you know, and um, so we kind of just ignored the fact that he had just been expelled for, like, selling pills, right, everyone just kind of got over that and um, yeah, we were dating. Um, we went steady for my sophomore, junior and and senior year my first relationship ever and we were together like nonstop, you know, and in that time he was definitely living more on the edge than I was, you know. He would go to his friend's house for beer pong and he would go, and so he would take me with him. So I was starting to get exposed to more like partying, having fun, you know, just doing I don't know what high school kids do you know?
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was just stuff that high school kids did and it, but it was new to me and it was exciting and I don't know, it was just being a kid I guess. And so once he, I helped him get through he ended up going to like a charter school. I helped him graduate, cause he would would have given up, like he was over it, you know, and so I kind of helped him really stick, stay on course. So once he graduated, he kind of I don't know, I guess he kind of just started partying more and more and more and I didn't notice that, you know, things were getting really like he was getting way deeper into things than I was even recognizing, cause I have no experience recognizing any of it. Um, he was acting kind of weird and I come to find out, long story short, he was on pills again, right, Again.
Speaker 1:Do you know, did he stop at one point?
Speaker 4:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:Yeah, he did, he had for sure. Well, I mean yeah. I think so.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 4:I think so. Um, I got really close with his family and his sister and his parents and they were both. They were all just so happy I was, you know, there and everything, and they were like we see such a huge difference in him, like he's amazing. So I think so I think he did stop for some some time, but I think once all of his responsibilities were done and he had done, he had graduated, it just kind of was like well, I can be me again, you know.
Speaker 4:So, um, yeah, so he started to kind of really withdraw from me and I didn't understand why and I was kind of just like what are you doing?
Speaker 3:why are you was this? No, were you, was he. Is he older than you? Were you out of? Was he? He was out of school I was still in school.
Speaker 4:Yeah, okay, he was two years.
Speaker 4:No, he was a year ahead of me so you're a senior and he's out of school yeah, I was a senior, he was out of school, um, and he was like really withdrawing from me like just and just, even when we were together, not the same person, and I was like what is going is going on, you know, and um, yeah, so one day I went I started to try to like incorporate myself with his group more, cause I'm thinking like maybe his friends don't like me, you know, I'm trying to think of what's wrong with me. It was the base of everything, right Right.
Speaker 4:Something has to be wrong with me because he doesn't want to be around me anymore. What can I change? You know was kind of where I went with it and so I started trying to incorporate myself with, like his crew more and hang out with them and you know, um just started being in situations where I was like I'm not totally comfortable here. But you know, like I I love this guy and obviously if this is who he wants to hang out with, then I'm here for you know, and I remember one day we went over to one of his friend's house and we were sitting in the living room and the guy so my boyfriend at the time had gone into the bathroom to use the restroom. He was in there for a little while right, I'm pretty sure he wasn't just using the restroom and the guy that I'm sitting with pulls out a piece of foil with a pill on it and hits it right in front of me Like it was no big deal, like did you know what he was doing?
Speaker 4:I mean, I could see it. I could see, I saw what he was. You know he was. It was like it was just did you know what it was. Yeah, I could tell what it was. I could tell what it was. Yeah, it was a little blue pill. I could tell what it was. It was just very odd.
Speaker 1:I was like what is he?
Speaker 3:doing no no, hold on. Does that work? I don't know. Does that work? How the fuck would I know? We got to try that.
Speaker 1:God damn it.
Speaker 3:Rob, we got to take it aside. If I try that do I lose my sobriety?
Speaker 1:Yes, if it's Viagra, I'm going to tell you yes.
Speaker 3:Motherfucker, let's go back. Okay, never mind, sorry.
Speaker 4:So he pulls it out and he starts smoking a pill right in front of me Like it was just a normal thing to do, and I remember in that moment getting very uncomfortable. And then I had that moment where I was like, well, I have one of two options here I can leave and push the guy that I love further away because now I've made him feel uncomfortable with, like his friend, you know, or I can cause he went to hand it to me right after he did it, for you to take a hit, for me to take a hit, and I was like you know, and I was just like, well, I got one of two options and unfortunately, I took the latter of the two and I took it and I hit it, you know.
Speaker 3:Um and so okay what I mean. So you are absolutely spotless at this point. What did it feel like? That's your first high? No, but she'd had alcohol.
Speaker 4:I had had alcohol.
Speaker 3:This is an alcohol.
Speaker 4:Okay, but this is different. This is opioids.
Speaker 3:I've never done that because I've done a few drugs, but I've never done any of that. What does that feel like? What is the attraction to that?
Speaker 4:Because for me I always thought it just makes people, you know, kind of sit there and count their heartbeats, which I like to go. It was you know? Yeah, have you ever? I'm sure you guys have seen the movies where you see like the heroin addicts shoot it and they're immediately just like yeah, in ecstasy just your euphoria immediate right um, and that was it okay that was it.
Speaker 4:It was a good feeling, wow right, I'm not gonna sit here. And that was it. It was a good feeling. Wow Right, I'm not going to sit here and say it wasn't, it was a good.
Speaker 3:If it wasn't good, people wouldn't do it.
Speaker 4:Right or be addictive. It was a good feeling.
Speaker 3:Don't try it at home, gentlemen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, don't try this at home.
Speaker 3:Don't ever try it at home.
Speaker 4:Even if it is Viag. So I uh, yeah, it felt really. It was like tingles all over. It started in like my, my you know hands and feet, and it was just I don't know. It was just this lifted feeling. It was crazy, um. But then it was immediately followed by what the hell did I just do?
Speaker 4:it was guilt, immediate guilt. I was like what the fuck? Like I? I just was just so disappointed in myself the minute I had done it, um, and so my boyfriend had walked out of the bathroom. At that point he had seen what had happened, he could tell what was going on, um, and he basically was like, hey, let's go. And I was like okay. So we got in the car and we drove all the way home. We didn't speak a word to one another, not a word. He dropped me off. I went inside and then I think that our goal was to just pretend that it hadn't ever happened. Right, like that was my goal. I think that was his goal. We're just going to forget it ever happened. But the thing was we had already right. At that exact moment, we crossed a line that you can't go back on you know I suddenly was less judgmental of other people's choices.
Speaker 4:Right, I was like I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 3:I know exactly what you mean you lowered your bar I lowered my bar completely.
Speaker 1:Everything was okay after that absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 4:And so I um, and the other thing that came from it is I woke up the next day and I was fine. I wasn't like needing another pill, like I woke up and I was totally fine, I was living my normal life. I wasn't like, oh God, I got to do that again. You know, it was like just another day which, looking back, I wish that it would have been consequences consequences for it.
Speaker 4:You know, because it was like well that you know I mean shit. I thought addiction was like you just had a problem right away and well the next day you're under the bridge and right right immediately.
Speaker 4:Yeah, no, I mean yeah, or I thought, at the very least I would wake up with serious cravings and I had none like I, I just like take it or leave it, you know. So we I mean to make a long story short we basically started once. He knew I had done it and I knew I had done it. He became more willing to, like, take me around different people right, because it was like I wasn't going to sit there.
Speaker 3:Relationship got better.
Speaker 4:Right, and so we were finally improving, we were hanging out more, we were you know, all these things that I was hoping for All the while I am socially or occasionally right, using drugs right.
Speaker 3:So these any drugs, or you're back to pills Oxys, oxys, heroin.
Speaker 4:Oxys, basically heroin right, yeah. So Oxys, um, so oxys, um, and so I end up I'm still noticing him in the same patterns again. Right, we were good for a little bit, and then I started noticing the same patterns where he's drifting and I'm like what the fuck is going?
Speaker 2:on. You know like what what is going on.
Speaker 4:And I was devastated again, devastated um. So I had, at this point, I had graduated- Scholarship to softball.
Speaker 3:Yeah, softball To Sac State.
Speaker 4:To Sac State. I went out there, I was living in the dorms, everything was going great.
Speaker 3:What position did you play?
Speaker 4:First, primarily first, and I wasn't that great at offense, but I was a damn good defensive player Okay.
Speaker 3:So what did you bat in the lineup?
Speaker 4:Usually about six or seven. Okay, I wasn't like there. I definitely wasn't the fourth hitter, I definitely wasn't the runner up because I wasn't the lead off, because I wasn't fast, you know. I mean I got the ball in play but I was like average. But my defense kicked ass and I was a leader so that got me you know far.
Speaker 3:I can imagine.
Speaker 4:For sure yeah, so I um had gone off to school and did he stay in houston?
Speaker 4:he was in turlock. Okay, yeah, he was in turlock the whole time. So he had stayed in turlock. He was living with his grandparents, um. His parents had moved to idaho, right, and he decided he wanted to stay because we were dating and everything. So he moved in with his grandparents, um, so whenever I went off to school, he was very upset about it because, oh, I stayed here for you, right, he got mad at me rather than being happy for me and I was like, hmm, this is weird.
Speaker 4:You know, that was kind of like my first sign of like this guy doesn't really want what's best for me. You like, why are you mad at me for going to school, you know? So I um, yeah, I basically just went off to school and we were drifting apart, but I was meeting new people and I was gaining new friendships and I was kind of getting to know myself better well, you're growing, getting older, maturing a little bit yeah, and so I wasn't as devastated, um, about the distancing, and I think it made it easier having, like, a geographical move like you know it didn't.
Speaker 1:For that instance I could see how it would be. She wasn't completely addicted like where my daughter's at emily.
Speaker 3:She got, you got school work, you've got it was very busy.
Speaker 4:You're busy.
Speaker 1:It was very a lot of time very busy the separation from him was probably a good thing and it was.
Speaker 4:It was because it when we were living in next door towns and we still felt so separate, I was just living in, like just so depressed, because I'm like why doesn't he want to be around me anymore, you know.
Speaker 4:So once I moved it was like okay, well, if he doesn't want to be around me, it's because I live too far right it's kind of my new excuse, right, and so I was like yeah, so I'm making new friends, we're partying, we're, you know, going out, we're doing what college girl dorm people do, right, which is pillow fights.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, right, and, but not searching for, not searching for drugs no, absolutely not.
Speaker 4:So. You were even remotely addicted. No, not even close.
Speaker 1:No, I had um not addicted, but you were drinking.
Speaker 4:So I was, was I mean? It was to be honest with you, though I was most often no, but I was most often Get it out of your head, rob.
Speaker 1:God damn it. I see where your perverted mind is going over there. Stop it. I ignored you the first time, jesus, sorry.
Speaker 4:So I was most often the DD, because I wasn't even really a fan of, I mean, drinking was okay, but I was like I have as much fun sober, right, Like I'm one of those people that'll have fun either way. So I um, yeah, I kind of just, you know, was doing my own thing with my own people, but he would come out and he would visit me, you know, occasionally and at this point I'm hiding it from my parents because my parents had recognized he was doing something not right, you know, and so my mom was very much so like you need to kind of like back off from this dude, Like something, something's not right here. Steph, you know, tried to warn me.
Speaker 1:Well, he had to be 21 at this time. 21, somewhere around there, yeah.
Speaker 4:I think he was. Well, I was only 17 when I graduated.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:So I was 17 through my entire, which is another reason why I was often dd, because I didn't have like the fake idea I couldn't get into the same clubs as everybody else.
Speaker 4:So, like I was just, you know, I was so young my whole year, you know. And so I um, yeah, I just was, I don't know. My mom had warned me I was hiding it from them. And then I would remember one day I was at my dorm and I got a call from a jail and I was was like like completely just not expecting that. Right, it was a collect call. Someone was trying to get a hold of me. So I hang up, I call my mom. I think it's my biological dad.
Speaker 1:Oh, right OK.
Speaker 4:Because I'm like who the hell else in my life is going to go to jail? Right, it wasn't, it was. It was was my boyfriend at the time. So my mom then finds out that he's in jail.
Speaker 1:So now she is like cut that tie like get away from that dude.
Speaker 4:Yeah, she's like get away from that dude right now, right, and so I kind of just let it drift apart, you know, I kind of just let it take its own course, because I felt him pulling away. I kind of was getting to be okay with that, you know. So I just kind of let it be. But all the while I'm making these new friends and these new friends are experimental and crazy I tried, you know. I remember I went to a party one time they had cocaine. Tried it Wasn't really a fan Drinking occasionally.
Speaker 1:You missed that opportunity right.
Speaker 3:No way, I'm not a fan of cocaine either. Fuck that shit. Sorry about the F-bomb, mary, but I made. Methamphetamines is my and Jack Daniels Two of my favorite things we're getting there.
Speaker 4:Okay, so, yeah, so tried coke wasn't, I mean, it was whatever. But again, woke up, no consequences. I woke up, went to class the next day, everything was fine.
Speaker 4:No sort of like cravings, no, nothing, no-transcript tear to my acl your freshman year, yeah, your first season yeah, my first semester, I didn't even get through two semesters, um, so, yeah, so I blew out my knee. I had already applied for housing, but it was off campus and I was just going to, like, walk because I had a truck but it was expensive, I don't know. It was just. It just wasn't working out the way that I needed it to. So I was like you know what? I'm just going to go back, I'm going to go to JC for a couple of years. We're going to do that route. I'll come back, you know, once I have my aa or whatever.
Speaker 3:Um, so that's what I did. I went back to my parents house, went to mjc.
Speaker 1:That's associate's degree, not alcohol, synonymous.
Speaker 4:Thank you for clarifying that, rob yes, I went back to my parents house did you lose your scholarship because of your knee? Yeah, son of a bitch, yeah yeah, once you're no use, they just kind of sign you off. You know which is crazy how'd that make you feel? Just, I knew it was coming. Okay, I knew it was coming, I tried to play through it.
Speaker 4:I tried to play through it for a long time, but I mean, I just, it just is what it is, you know it's weak you know, going into it, that what you're signing up for, though I knew the minute I hurt my knee I felt something really bad happen and I tried to pretend like it wasn't as bad as it was because I knew what was coming. You know which sucks that. That's how it is, but that's just how it is. You know my academics. Like I said, they were OK. I got by on academics but I certainly wasn't getting any sort of help academically, you know.
Speaker 4:Yes, I went back to MJC, got signed up at MJC, started playing ball again after I had my surgery and everything started playing ball again, went to, was going to school for criminal justice and I one night was leaving campus and I was raped on campus. It was late, it was a. We did a late night study hall, basically with the softball team. I had parked out on the fields, like there's a little teeny parking lot by the baseball fields out there, I know where you're at.
Speaker 4:What are you saying? And I was parked in the back of it because I got there it was full, you know, in the back, and it's pretty dark over there at night. You know, especially. You know, however many years ago.
Speaker 1:not a great part of the neighborhood, it's not it's not Um, and they didn't have.
Speaker 4:I mean, they may now, but they didn't have cameras, they didn't have. You know, all the stuff that I'm sure that they've probably upgraded, you know, since. But yeah, it was, uh was I was going to get in my car and yeah, so I was sexually assaulted by two people One basically held me down and the other sexually assaulted me and I was really scared. I would say, like fear was the first feeling, but then it was embarrassed was the very next feeling that I felt from that. Fear was the first feeling, but then it was embarrassed was the very next feeling that I felt from that, and I was not in a position to want to go to law enforcement with it. I was very uncomfortable with it and I knew, if I brought it to my family, that that would be their immediate. We need to go make a report. You know, I didn't know who these people were. I didn't know if they'd been watching me, I didn't know how much they knew about me.
Speaker 3:I was just scared and I wasn't.
Speaker 4:You didn't tell anybody I didn't tell a soul just carried it I carried it so, but then what happened was my parents were still expecting me to be gone at school this many hours a day. So what am I doing? Going and finding people that have nothing to do for yay you know x amount of hours throughout the day and I ended up in waterford, nice. I ended up in waterford and I met a little crew over here that didn't have jobs, didn't have school, didn't have anything going, and they were free to hang out all day long. But unfortunately they were doing a lot of pills, a lot of you know drugs a lot of Welcome to Waterford baby.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and so I was, you know, and I felt like every time, kind of like I said how I had crossed that line. You know that first time, every time I was exposed to something new, it was like you couldn't go back. You can't unring the bell, no, you can't.
Speaker 1:And that bar just kept going down, yeah, real quick, before you go on. After you were, because you were going to school. After you were assaulted, you didn't go back to school.
Speaker 4:I didn't go back to school. You, you said I said I'm done yeah, okay yeah, I did not go back to that school. I didn't go back to for nothing yeah absolutely nothing.
Speaker 2:I was done, yeah um, yeah, so after your assault, because I come from law enforcement similar to your background family-wise, how was it more embarrassed? You said embarrassment. Is that what you said? Yeah, was it because you came from like an Ellie family and you're like I should have known better? Or was it like, fuck this, I'm not telling my family because I don't, I don't want to make the report, I don't want to deal with this right now?
Speaker 4:I, I think it was, you know, I think part of it was I knew my life. At that point I knew I didn't want to ever have to go back to that same school again.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 4:Um, and I know that my family always wants what's best for me and like the thought of me now not just dropping out of a four year but dropping out of a JC would have been very hard pill for them to swallow.
Speaker 1:Cause they?
Speaker 4:they watched you lower that bar right twice right and so and I'm not saying that they would have pushed me to go, by no means would they have like, expected me to go back, necessarily.
Speaker 1:But do you think you missed the support if you would have opened up?
Speaker 2:oh, absolutely they would have looking back for sure yeah, but in that moment it's weird, you know, you kind of just um well, and you're still fighting with your insecurities at that age too, and not to not to put it on like you should have known better, but I feel like there's a different degree when you come from law enforcement like you're held a higher standard because a little bit.
Speaker 3:So yeah, to be hyper to be aware you don't put your back to the doors and you don't yeah and a lot of these times and thank you for going to that, mary did you feel that at a certain level this was kind of your fault a lot of way? I got you know the people I've worked with and I don't know why, but you know they should have known better. They shouldn't put themselves in that position. No way is it your fault.
Speaker 4:But you know, I didn't really feel at fault good I, I didn't, I didn't feel at fault and I didn't feel like I could have done anything differently. Necessarily, you know, I didn't really do the self-blame but you didn't feel safe in that space anymore.
Speaker 4:I was very scared in that space at that point. Yeah, I was just really, really scared and yeah, I, looking back, like I said, you know, I would have been nothing but love and support for my family. But in that like moment, for whatever reason, I think I was more or less in fear of having to go make a report on it because I didn't know who these people were and I didn't know how much they knew about me. I didn't know, you know, and I and you immediately go to the worst, like these people have probably been watching me and God knows what they know about me. They don't you know and and, and I was just scared, yeah.
Speaker 4:So you end up in Waterford and up in Waterford um with a crew that was, you know, winners.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I probably knew them all.
Speaker 4:Yeah, real winners. Um, I'll tell you names off air, you can see if you recognize any of them. But yeah, so they were partying more regularly, you know, and I was just meeting more people again, but not people with ambition, like I was meeting when I went to college. It was people with opposite, you know. They were just not living a life there.
Speaker 3:When did you get introduced to methamphetamines? Is that Waterford?
Speaker 4:No, what I know surprisingly.
Speaker 1:Don't be bashing on my town bitch.
Speaker 3:I'm just working questions, buddy.
Speaker 1:You're wanting to throw Waterford under the bus.
Speaker 4:No, waterford was still pills. Waterford was still a lot of pills.
Speaker 1:I think people were doing a little bit more but I think I put blinders on a lot of pills. Um, I think people were doing a little bit more, but I think I put blinders on a lot of times. It was heavy and like, like I said, I was coaching high school football during that period of time that she's talking about Pills were.
Speaker 4:heavy Pills were heavy we were.
Speaker 1:We were dealing with a lot of it, yeah.
Speaker 4:But expensive, expensive, um, yeah so, yeah. So, anyways, I was with these people, you know, know, and kind of just meeting new people, and every time I met these new people, I felt like they were like more and more shady, like they were always disappearing to the bathroom or you know, like just doing weird shit, that I'm like what are you? What's going on right now, you know? Um, but I just kind of, I think, chose to like put blinders on when I needed to, just to kind of keep myself comfortable where I was, you, you know, cause I I didn't know where else to go or what else to do at that point.
Speaker 4:You know, um, yeah.
Speaker 1:How? Where's your alcohol level at this point?
Speaker 4:So I I'll be honest with you Alcohol has never to this day has never been my kryptonite by any means, um, I have made a conscious decision in sobriety to not go on that slippery slope anymore. Okay, um, I'm I'm active in AA because of that exact reason I like the accountability of AA, you know. I don't feel. I just I've learned enough getting sober and to know that our, our brains are wired different. You know so I just wouldn't even like risk it. Okay, you know so, I just wouldn't even like risk it, okay, but alcohol wasn't really my thing.
Speaker 4:Kristen love, joy my grandpa's. Marvin Harper, if you're law enforcement you might know that, do you know, marvin Harper?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:You do. Were you arrested by him? Did he arrest you? No, oh.
Speaker 1:That name does sound familiar. He was a coach. He coached me.
Speaker 4:Oh, yeah, he me in football. Yeah, he's amazing.
Speaker 1:yeah, he is a great man, he is an amazing man. Yeah, yeah, he's an inspiration for sure. Um, you played football. Yeah, were you the football.
Speaker 3:No, I was the safety and the running back maybe they just tossed you around, yeah, so, um, yeah, so these people.
Speaker 4:I went to a party in turlock with them and I got introduced to a different group that was from Escalon and not Escalon, sorry, riverbank, riverbank and Escalon, it was kind of a mix and we were talking and hanging out and everything, and I don't know I just I had lowered, like I said, lowered my standards at that point so low that like I wasn't really noticing all the red flags. I probably should have noticed from the start, you know. But yeah, I basically just started seeing this guy and, yeah, him and that other guy that I was talking to you about One day we were at a party and they were like, hey, can you drive us over here? We want to get some weed. And I'm like, yeah, it's fine, right, I have the car, which is convenient for everyone, right? So I'm like, yeah, no problem. So we drive over here and we come over here. Uh, I think we came to Watford actually to buy weed. I thought, right, and so we drive back and we get back to turlock and I'm like I didn't smoke weed, so I wasn't even interested I don't blame you shit, not a fan I never was not a fan I
Speaker 1:was a but I'm going off the rails here. But I never could understand the, the oxy and that kind of stuff either, because we like to go up. But everybody you know I was a cocaine head. I was an 80s child, right. I loved my cocaine. Back in high school I used to play a mean game of football while wired out of my brain. I never could understand the guys that a would get do a bunch of cocaine and smoke weed used to piss me off quite honestly but I never understood the oxy stuff.
Speaker 1:Whenever I whenever I found out the kids were doing it during football games and shit, and I'm like, how the fuck do you do? I take one and I'm ready to sleep for three days so you know what it was with me is I?
Speaker 4:I've, to this day, have been asked a lot of times if I might have adhd um okay, because for me. I got like really like social and really I, I didn't, I wasn't I've heard that to go to sleep or to nod off or anything like that. I just got really like like you were, drinking confidence like you were that was the best thing for me is I gained that confidence that I did not have like I was drinking it was her alcohol, it was my alcohol right for sure.
Speaker 3:Um so what'd you pick up from Waterford?
Speaker 4:so come to find out um it was heroin oh it was heroin that we had came to get and uh, so we got back over to Turlock to the party we were at. We were hanging out at this guy's house and I um, the guy I was dating kind of disappeared into the back room with the other guy that we were talking about and I was like where'd they go, like what? Because I was thinking they were just smoking weed. Like I'm like why are you guys disappearing to smoke weed? So I go walking back there and they're smoking foil and I'm thinking, oh my god, these dudes really like this. Because the guy's house we were at was a total square, like he was stressed out about beer pong in the backyard, right, and I'm like what are you?
Speaker 4:guys doing right, like you guys are not smoking pills in his in, I but the smell wasn't pills the smell was not pills. I was like what is that? Black tar heroin yeah, I was like what?
Speaker 4:little different smell right and so I was like oh, and I walked in and they were like kind of, they didn't really you know jump, but they weren't, like, they were just doing their thing. And then the guy I was dating was like oh, hey, and walked out and kind of like, you know, just rushed by me and walked out. And then the other guy was like hey, come here and I was like what are you smoking?
Speaker 4:and he's like, oh it's, it's heroin. And I'm, like you know, floored. Floored because, again, never exposed to it, never thought I would be exposed to it, that just wasn't in my that's the lowest of the lowest for to me in my wheelhouse that's what we always thought too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, in my wheelhouse that's the lowest of low, for sure, right, I mean there you can't you can't get it first you?
Speaker 3:smoke it, then you shoot it. That's the lowest of the. Yeah, absolutely so, you did yeah, so what was the difference feeling this than the pill?
Speaker 4:it was exactly the same exactly exactly the same it was exactly the cheaper though but a hell of a lot cheaper. Yeah, that's what most people go to heroin it was exactly the same and that's how he sold me on it is. He's like oh shit, if you've smoked oxys, he's all try this. He's all same shit. And I was like okay, he seems trustworthy it's alley.
Speaker 1:Oxy is all it is, yeah I was like, yeah, why not?
Speaker 4:and so I, I did a big mistake, obviously. But um, yeah, tried it and yeah, you know, just. But then so come to find out the guy I was hanging out with, that I was, you know, seeing. He was like, hey, do you want to come back to my house with me? You know, we've been hanging out for at least a couple of weeks at this point, but we'd never been to his place or my place, because I don't really take anyone to my place because my parents would have lost their shit, you know. So I end up going with him to his house, we'll come to find out, you know. So I end up going with him to his house. We'll come to find out. His dad is a method that lives like in and out of the house, but mostly in a shed in the backyard at like all hours of the night.
Speaker 4:Um, like you do right with a headlight on working on cars yeah, and his mom struggled heavy with alcohol and he had no like parental no supervision whatsoever none. His house was the house that everyone would go to when they wanted to use drugs. His dad would sit there, hit the pipe and hand it to him. His dad put a needle on his arm?
Speaker 1:no, that was in a riverbank okay.
Speaker 4:His dad put a needle in his arm the first time he ever tried it so that he could teach him how to. The dad is alive. The son is dead. Fuck cockroaches, live forever.
Speaker 3:Yeah, amen to that, the son the son is dead.
Speaker 2:Um, how old are you at this point?
Speaker 3:I was, I think, 19, but and your parents still think you're going to school and you're not.
Speaker 4:Yeah, Okay, yeah, living this whole double life and you're not, yeah, ok, yeah, living this whole double life, right. I mean, so at this point I'm noticing that, like I can't really continue to like live this Right. So I just start drifting from my parents because I still wasn't ready, I still wasn really shameful and guilty and you know, I just wasn't ready to and I just kind of just started just drifting away. Um, I basically did to my parents what that guy had done to me, but at the time I didn't realize I was doing that.
Speaker 4:I thought I was protecting their feelings you know, um, and so I started staying over there with him and I remember, you know it's so crazy how drug addicts have this like hierarchy, right of like, how low you are depending on what type of drug you do right so like his dad the same guy we were just discussing that put a needle in his arm to shoot him up with dope to teach him how to steal. God forbid. He caught him smoking heroin right Then.
Speaker 3:It was like If he caught his son smoking?
Speaker 4:he's disappointed, uh-huh.
Speaker 1:How was he supposed? Oh, shoot it.
Speaker 4:But no, no, his dad only did meth.
Speaker 3:His dad shot him up with meth. His dad did meth and meth was okay.
Speaker 4:Meth, bring all your friends.
Speaker 3:You know we could all do much together. But like god forbid, you touch heroin right, because with booze you lose, with dope you got hope.
Speaker 4:You're a sick individual, you need to go back and read that, that's. That was a saying from a breath.
Speaker 3:One of the guys that we that was one of his sayings. I believe it. Either you do it or it does you. Eventually it does you right, you know right, but but that's the shit you tell yourself.
Speaker 4:His dad was so twisted up in his head. It's funny how intelligent he really was. He was a smooth talker, could get his way in anywhere, very, very smooth, charismatic type of guy, but just used it for all the wrong reasons. The wrong reasons, you know. Um used it to get over on people and everything, and so I don't know. He just had this way of making you feel so low for doing you know, anything other than dope or meth I guess I should clarify here anything other than meth, right? So, um, I remember the guy I was dating and his dad getting into multiple like knock down, drag out fights in the house, the mom's screaming drunk, you know, just just a mess, chaos in that house, right, um?
Speaker 3:you're in the middle of it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and I'm in the middle of it, and at this point I'm so withdrawn from my own family and are Let me live Like it is what it is, you know, and so I just kind of was just getting to be more and more used to it.
Speaker 3:But you hadn't done meth at this time.
Speaker 4:No, actually. So we started out, we were just doing heroin, um, and I remember the first time I walked out into the shed and his dad was sitting there and I'd never seen meth before, right, I'd never seen a meth pipe, I'd only on like tv and stuff. Right, and his dad pulls out a meth pipe and there's a group of like probably six or eight people in there, right, and his dad pulls out a meth pipe, hits it and he hands it to the guy I was dating, my, his son, and, um, I started crying and I walked out. I was so, so devastated by that, you know, because I was like here goes another thing, like you know, just like what? What am I doing? You know, I just the the sheer, just like, is this really where my life is right now? You know?
Speaker 4:you had enough stability in your life to realize where you were at oh, for sure that you were just for sure, like I knew, normal, right right, this wasn't my upbringing Like I knew, normal, right, right. This wasn't my upbringing.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 4:I knew normal and I knew not normal and I knew I was not in the normal at that point in time?
Speaker 3:What changed after you walked out crying?
Speaker 4:I walked out crying. He followed me out with the pipe. And then we had a jacuzzi and he's like get in. And I'm like, okay, fine, so I get in the jacuzzi. And he's like, get in. And I'm like, okay, fine. So I get in the jacuzzi and I'm crying and he's sitting there. I didn't know, he had the pipe on him at the time and he I thought he just came out to make me feel better and I was like man, what do you do?
Speaker 3:he did in a sense, right, right.
Speaker 4:And so I'm like what are you doing, why? What are you like why? Why are we? What are you doing, you know, and he's like just, he's like just, try it.
Speaker 3:And if I had a penny for every time, somebody said I'll just try it, you know, and then all of a sudden, you've already done xyz, why not?
Speaker 4:I mean, and that was my rationalization, that's how we do it.
Speaker 1:That's how we sell it absolutely.
Speaker 4:at that point I'm like well, shit, I've done heroin. Like the fuck is this, you know? Like? So I tried it and I don't really know that I got the same type of high that some people get. I remember feeling different, but I was also on heroin, so I think it was more of just a balancing, like I felt a little bit of something, but it was more of just kind of like a balance.
Speaker 4:Right, I didn't really feel anything great. It wasn't a big old aha moment, but what it did is it crossed that line and now I was willing to do it.
Speaker 4:You know if I was around it because I had done it and so, yeah, so we, I ended up getting pregnant when I was with him, and let me back up a little bit, so this is ironic. And oh, let me back up a little bit, so this is ironic. Um, him and I started dating and one of the times that we went into modesto to our drug dealer's house to get heroin, we ran into the guy that I was dating in high school and he was there trapping out of the trap house, right, and I'm like, oh, that makes sense. Now I know why you pulled away. You were on freaking heroin, right.
Speaker 3:And so he you, piece of shit.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so he was pissed at the guy I was with, right, because I will say I will give credit where credit's due. As far as this guy goes, yeah, even in his worst of days he did not want to drag me to those places. You know, he saw that I had potential to do so much better than that, which is why he would start to just pull away.
Speaker 3:The same reason you pulled away. You said you pulled away from your parents.
Speaker 4:I pulled away from my parents.
Speaker 3:To protect them. Maybe that's what he was doing.
Speaker 4:That's what he was doing with me. So when he saw this guy walk in proudly holding my hand, beat the living hell out of the guy I was dating. I mean beat the living hell out of that dude.
Speaker 4:And I was like, well, what now? Like how the fuck? Like, thanks, you know what the fuck you know. And so, um, yeah, so anyways, I got pregnant. Um, and right around when I found out, my parents showed up to the house I was at banging on the door. The guy I was dating in high school had Facebook, messaged my mom and said you need to go get your daughter right now. She's on heroin, she is not doing well. He had Facebook, messaged my mom and my mom's talking to her now, looking back, she didn't believe him. She was like you're fucking out of your mind.
Speaker 1:She's a good girl.
Speaker 4:She goes to school every day, yeah, she was just completely, just like, just didn't even believe him. She thought he was on drugs and he was like making shit up at that point, you know and so, but nonetheless, my parents showed up after his mom had made a drunk phone call to my mom to tell her about the choices we were making. So that confirmed what she had already heard from.
Speaker 3:So now she believes. Now she's heard it twice. Mom was on her way.
Speaker 4:Mom was on her way, so they came. They basically intervention by us, which was great.
Speaker 1:At the drug dealer's house.
Speaker 4:No at the guy I was dating.
Speaker 3:Gotcha.
Speaker 4:Him and his dad's.
Speaker 3:Well, that's the meth house. I mean, it wasn't a good house, right, right.
Speaker 4:It was a meth house, my mom. But I just found out I was pregnant and I was like you know what? This is perfect, like I should go, you know. So my parents put me into Maynard's.
Speaker 1:Go figure.
Speaker 4:Yeah, went to Maynard's beautiful, loved it, um, but the whole time you know what? Wait, I was not pregnant yet. I just thought about that.
Speaker 4:I was not pregnant yet so you got the intervention to me and took me to Maynard's and I was not pregnant. I broke out after about two weeks at Maynard's. He came and picked me up in the middle of the night, right, and I broke out, went back to his house, was doing the same shit again for about another not very long. Then I found out I was pregnant. Then I contacted my parents and was like I'm pregnant. That's how it went. I'm pregnant, I need help, you know. And so then I got put into frickin nirvana Right, which is no meaner.
Speaker 1:No no no.
Speaker 4:I was expecting to go live luxuriously again and it was not that, you know it was, it was not that. But I actually graduated from there and I stayed clean and sober and I stayed sober through my pregnancy. But none, you know, he was still trying to contact me because obviously I was pregnant with his kid, you know, and my parents were like absolutely not, you're not going to contact, we are not, I don't care who his dad, like his dad is, we're not doing it, you know um. So I had my son. His name was Brecken um and man, I loved that boy, um how old were you when you had?
Speaker 4:20?. I was pregnant when I was 20 and I had him when I was 21.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:Um, and that was a love that I'd never felt before. I went back from home, from the hospital, to my parents' house. They opened their doors you know they were having me back, um, and but my mom had set a what is it? An ultimatum, basically, where? She said, you can be here. You and your son are absolutely welcome here. You will have no contact with with his father.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 4:But I was getting the constant nagging, not just from him, but from his drunk mom, from his you know, you know and it just got really exhausting having to continually disappoint people and be like I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't, you know. And so I caved and I said you know, ok, fine. So I went to go, I told him, I said I'm not going to go live in that house with you. If you want to see your son, you need to get us in a safer environment, because I am not taking him to that house. And so he said OK, we can move in with my stepdad. So the mom had been married to his dad, divorced and remarried to a different guy and then divorced that guy and gone back to dad again.
Speaker 3:Sweet.
Speaker 4:Yeah. So he had his stepdad, but they weren't still, you know, together and so he said he, um, we can go to my stepdad's house. Also did meth, but was much more responsible about it. Right, what I know, don't look, I know. So you know, I was like okay, and so we what did mom and dad think of that? My mom and dad yeah. They cut me out.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah.
Speaker 4:They cut me out. You know they, when my parents set a ultimatum, they mean it.
Speaker 3:That's good.
Speaker 4:You know they don't, they don't mess around. If they say something, that's what it is and they are not the type of parents that ever or any of that, like like love, right. They were very much so firm in their shit and I knew what I was doing when I left and I took that chance, you know, and it was an awful decision, awful decision, but you know you're not making the best decisions whenever you're, you know, fresh postpartum and no, no, I was, I was still sober, um. But going back to that environment.
Speaker 4:I didn't stay that way, you know, um, it would. It took a little bit, it took a little time, but I eventually ended up doing heroin again, um, doing meth again, you know, um, and just not not doing the things that I should have been doing as a mom. So one day I had. So he got arrested. We were in Escalon and he got arrested for my son's death, sorry, my son's dad got arrested for stealing from the freaking dollar store, stupid move and got taken to jail San Joaquin County Jail but he was already on probation. He'd been arrested like 100 times, you know. So they kept him. It wasn't just like a you know site and release type thing. They kept him. He was in there and he was going to be serving, you know, not a long time, but a little bit of time.
Speaker 4:And I got home one day and I had my son with me and I don't remember where we went. But we got home and somebody knocked on the door and I'm like is here, you know, because nobody ever came to the house, I opened the door and it's a CPS worker and a sheriff or a police officer, one of the two and they said, hey, I'm you, know-and-so, and this is someone from CPS and we're going to have to take your son, and I just lost it. Um, just fucking lost it. And I was like what do you mean you can take my son. I haven't been given any type of like you know warning or any. And they said said it's called an emergency ex parte petition. Your parents filed for it. We are taking your son.
Speaker 4:He was about six months old. Six months old and, man, I was just fucking devastated because, even though I wasn't making great choices, you know, that little boy came before anything else in my life. You know, um, which is a weird thing to say, because I was making awful decisions, but, like I loved, I would have given up anything If someone had came to me and said hey, this is what you're, you're, you're risking. I would have done left, given up anything at that exact moment, but I didn't get that luxury. Instead, I got them coming and saying, hey, this is already a done deal, we're taking him.
Speaker 1:So when your parents hold on, I'm going to back up. Mom played devil's advocate just for a moment. So when your parents they they sent you, you went to live with your boyfriend and they basically said that's it, we're done with you we're done right, that wasn't any kind of indication to you at that point. Well fuck, maybe I'm going down a bad road oh, for sure okay I, and, like I said, I knew.
Speaker 4:I knew what I was getting in.
Speaker 1:I did not think you had a risk of losing your son?
Speaker 4:no, I didn't think that they would do it without at least can like saying something, for I did not expect them to just flat go to the courts and it'd be a done deal. You know, that was not what I was expecting. I didn't even know an emergency export, a petition existed. I thought, if anything, they could start a CPS case on me and then I could get my shit together, you know, but I would still have my son. Were they seeing your son?
Speaker 2:while you were living with your boyfriend no, my son. Were they seeing your?
Speaker 4:son, while you were living with your boyfriend. No, no, no, um, no, cause they had cut ties with me. You know we cut contacts. Yeah, um, they cut contact, and so I immediately, um, I'm on the phone with my mom and I'm so, did they?
Speaker 3:but did they take Brecken? Right then, they took him, and then you got on the phone.
Speaker 4:I was loading him in his car seat and I'm already calling my mom to load him up to get ready to leave with them.
Speaker 3:And were they taking your son to your grandparents, to my parents, to your parents' house?
Speaker 4:To my parents' house and I called my mom and I'm hysterical and I said please let me come home. I will never speak to this man again. You could take my phone, you could take everything I need to be with my son. I promise you I will not have contact with these people anymore. Please let me come home. And my mom was crying on the other end of the line and she said honey, I can't. And it was part of the court. Court ordered. You know, if I am a threat, an immediate threat to my son, they cannot house me. If that's what they're saying in court you know right so that moment was absolutely devastating.
Speaker 4:But that was the moment I was like, all right, this is it, I'm gonna get my shit together, I don't give a shit what I have to do. Um, but then so the stepdad that I was staying with, now it's just him and I, because my, the guy I was dating, had gone to jail, right, so it was just him and I. He came home that day and he said, hey, this looks really weird, I can't have you here. And I was like, what do you mean? And he's all, you don't have the baby anymore. Like I'm a single guy, like I can't have you here.
Speaker 4:And I was like where, no, I may have had I don't remember if I had my car or not. Somehow I got to. No, I did have my car. Um, he gave me about 60 bucks and was like good luck, you know. And I couldn't go home and I didn't know where to go, and so I found the cheapest hotel I could in Modesto to go put myself up for the night. You know, I just I wasn't ready for homelessness yet, and so I ended up at the Tiki Motel on McHenry.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah.
Speaker 4:You know, with enough to pay for the room for one night and no clue how I was going to make it after that. At that point, you know, and no clue how I was going to make it after that. At that point, you know, and that was the start of a real downward spiral for me. So I got the room, I stayed there, was scared shitless, scared shitless because I again was not raised in this shit. You know, I was not cut out for the streets, I was not cut out for any of this. I wasn't street smart. I had people that were pacing my room.
Speaker 3:Oh, I bet Just pacing.
Speaker 4:I could see them outside of the window just pacing, pacing, and I was just scared. I was so scared but I was still using cause. At that point, um, it hadn't really developed into um, a physical need, but I think at that point, that was when I started numbing. That was the shift for me was when I started um, using to numb the pain, because I just was like I, I felt like I had no purpose anymore. You know, there was nothing holding me to like, want to be better, um so, but I did look forward to my court dates and I did look forward to everything to try to fight it.
Speaker 4:But I was, I was really struggling. I was on the streets, you know, like I, and then I. So I went to a couple of court dates and I kept, you know, putting myself out there and trying, and then I came to the realization one day that, um, I'm fighting to bring a child into a life that he doesn't deserve. You know I'm I'm fighting to pull him out of a stable environment where there's nothing but love, to bring him to live on the streets with me and to struggle to survive. Like what kind of mother would I be if I did that you know, um, and that was a really, really, really hard thing to accept and to um come to terms with. And then it just went really bad because I stopped going to court, I stopped fighting, I in every sense of the word.
Speaker 3:You stopped fighting.
Speaker 4:I stopped fighting, I just gave up. So at this point my addiction is heavy just heroin, meth whatever anything. I could get my fucking hands on I tried fucking lots of things. You know um. Heroin was a was a dead given.
Speaker 4:I had to have it because I was physically very dependent on it um, but other than that, I would get anything that came my way, you know, whatever, whatever they'd throw my way. Meanwhile, I'm not a good criminal. I don't know how to make money on the streets, I'm not good at stealing, I'm not good at anything. You know that that has anything to do with, like survival, and so I'm just kind of bouncing from place to place. It was a good thing. I was cute and I was young, you know, and I just kind of would just fall in where I, you know, but there would be someone to be like, hey, like come in my room, let's hang out. You know, not not in any type of like weird way, it was just like people enjoyed having me around.
Speaker 4:I had a kind of a bubbly personality still, I hadn't completely fallen apart and I think people enjoyed just um having something different around, you know um, and so I was just kind of bouncing around place to place, you know, and I but still scared. Scared because I had people.
Speaker 4:You know when, whenever you're not raised in that lifestyle and you're suddenly exposed to the fullest degree to it, um, you are targeted hard a lot, but you are targeted hard by, um, some really really, really vicious people, um, and so I had, I just felt like I was so tired because I never slept, I could, never, I would lay down, but when I say sleeping with one eye open, like you know, I really really just I couldn't even relax at any point in time enough to be able to just like regroup. I was just always on edge and always, you know, cautious and aware of my surroundings and, you know, just very, very on edge all the time. So, after you know, months of that, I was getting worn down, like just fucking worn down, exhausted and desperate.
Speaker 1:desperate at this point to get out of this cycle of like waking up, have you tried anything at this point to get out of it cycle of like waking up? Have you tried?
Speaker 4:anything at this point to get out of it? Or were you just so buried? Oh, I was buried.
Speaker 1:You weren't trying to reach out.
Speaker 4:Just surviving Hell. No, I was just in survival mode.
Speaker 1:Well, I think this goes back to like what we talk about. God, please take this bottle from me, right?
Speaker 3:I didn't do, but yeah.
Speaker 1:Because we didn't do any actions. Right, you're in the same boat.
Speaker 3:You wanted out, I wanted I wanted out, but it just seemed um unreachable right. What did I know that feeling? What did it take?
Speaker 4:it took something, because here you are. So I, yeah, I well, I ended up finding a sense of security in all the wrong places. Um, I met a guy that really glamorized the idea of, um, basically that I'm sitting on something that can make me a lot of money, right.
Speaker 3:Oh, I got it Okay.
Speaker 4:I got you. Um, he's like why would you ever struggle like this? Why, why would you struggle like that? You, you are so dumb for even going through this struggle right now. Why are you stealing? Why are you doing this? Why are you doing that? You are sitting on a friggin moneymaker and I was like desperate. I was desperate at this point to just have a secure place to sleep. I was hungry, I was tired. I was just desperate and the idea of, you know, performing one act and being set up in a hotel room for two weeks was very appealing at that moment.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can see that.
Speaker 4:It was very appealing at that moment because I was so tired. So he really glamorized. It made it seem like it's like like I was crazy for not doing it.
Speaker 1:What's wrong with you?
Speaker 4:Right, like, like, I was so dumb for not like utilizing my assets and so I remember I allowed him to post me online. There was a lot of online platforms and there we go again. Cross that line. You don't go back.
Speaker 1:Bar lowered again.
Speaker 3:Bar lowered again. But how many times have we said that? Well, we've already done X, Y, Z, what might as well? The fuck-its? Your bucket full of fuck-its. Sorry about the F word, but that's what we call them.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Here's all my fuck-its. Thank you, jim. So yeah, here's all my buckets.
Speaker 4:Thank you, jim. So that bar was lowered and I remember, you know, the first time I met somebody was I was very high. That was probably the most drugs I've ever consumed in one period of time Just to get through that.
Speaker 4:Just to get through the experience, you know, and after I had that same disgusted feeling, I had the first time I ever tried that pill. You know just that. Like what the fuck you know. But instead of you know that sticking the instant gratification of oh my God, I can, I can now sleep. I have a place to sleep for for two weeks. I don't have to move all of my shit and walk miles to the net. You know like I, I can live here for two weeks. I don't have to move all of my shit and walk miles to the night. You know like I, I can live here for two weeks right now and sleep and shower and sleep and shower and just fucking be okay and safe.
Speaker 4:Just be safe. Um, and so it was. It was a range of emotions. It was disappointment and then it was wow, that was actually not as bad as I thought it was. It was a range of emotions. It was disappointment and then it was wow, that was actually not as bad as I thought it was.
Speaker 1:You know, there it is.
Speaker 4:You know, I just immediately was just like wow, that, you know, in comparison to having to run around all day and steal and lie, and you know, like, like it just was, it was a weird thing that I went through emotionally. So that guy kind of just tagged along, stuck around. It was also a place for him, he, he, you know, put it as like hey, well, you know, I'll keep you safe and you don't know who these people are and I'll kind of keep an eye out on you. But really he just wanted a free place to like, tote along and free drugs.
Speaker 4:He got he got a place, he was benefiting. You know, he wasn't, he wasn't violent and he wasn't aggressive and he wasn't anything.
Speaker 2:He was just kind of like the one that just planted the seed. I guess you can say um, so he he was like a john.
Speaker 4:No, no, he was a pimp, but he wasn't. He wasn't taking my money, he was more like a freeloader he was a freeloader. He was the one that planted the idea in my head and kind of planted the seed and was like hey, did the computer work?
Speaker 4:yeah, he did my, my site for me and he kind of did all the stuff you know, and so he and he protected me. And I'm doing that in air quotes because it's like really I mean you know, but but he was a freeloader, um, it was easy money for him too you know, like other women too, or were you just just?
Speaker 2:it was just me, you were special, yeah yeah, hand selected.
Speaker 4:No, um, it was just me, um, and then so that lasted for a little bit, um, and eventually I became so numb to the, to the act itself that in kind of just like drugs and anything else, you know, it's just, that's just part of my. That is how I was surviving at that point that was that was how I was surviving. Um, so I and I, I'm going to try to remember some of this stuff. Some of this stuff, like I said, it's very, very almost like a dreamlike state.
Speaker 1:Um, I don't, I said it was very, very almost like a dreamlike state.
Speaker 4:How long have you been sober? Right now? Six months Okay.
Speaker 3:Today, six months today. That's funny, I have six months today. Congratulations, thank you, and steps done.
Speaker 4:Yeah, okay, sorry, I forgot that was today until just now, yeah, so I don't remember exactly how I, how I transitioned from this guy into a different guy. Now this one was was a much different approach. He was terrifying, he was violent, he was taking the money Right Scary, scary guy, scary guy. And at that point I was like, well, now I'm trapped. This is no longer me controlling where I go. You know who I'm seeing, what I'm doing. Like cause, at first I felt like, in a sense, I was in control of it. Um, though I wasn't really safe, I was. I was able to kind of pick and choose and I was, it was, and I got to choose where I stayed and everything and no options with this guy. Um, I went where he put me. I saw who he saw fit. Um, he set his, his, his quota for the day. Whatever he was feeling like was needed to be met, and if I didn't meet it, I got my ass beat.
Speaker 1:Beat, so that was a true pimp.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah yeah. He was a very dangerous man and he just took me to a place that was the beginning of true manipulation and isolation at the hands of another person in my life. He saw that I was not in contact with my family and I was not, you know. I didn't really have, oh, which is.
Speaker 3:He's taking advantage of that. That's exactly what they want. Yeah, he saw that. That was a weak point in my.
Speaker 4:You know I didn't really have, oh, which is, which is that's exactly what they want. Yeah, he saw that, that that was a weak point in my you know life and he just put the sunk, those claws in and just, you know, didn't let go. And he knew that I was too uncomfortable and too scared to reach out to my family. He knew I wouldn't do it and he also played on the fact like he was this really scary person and he used to threaten my family.
Speaker 3:Threaten your family to you, to me, if you ever do X, y, z, yeah, if you ever do this.
Speaker 4:I'll fucking hunt all of you down Right. And that man I saw that man do some really really terrible things to undeserving people. He made sure to keep that.
Speaker 3:Fear.
Speaker 4:Fear in me. He made it very clear that he had absolutely no limits. He was fresh out of prison, he lost his dad while he was in there and he kind of went off the deep end. You know, um, and he just he really made it clear that I, that he was terrifying Um, and so that was a different experience that went from being um, like I said, kind of feeling like I was at least somewhat in control to how long did that last?
Speaker 4:with this guy. This entire period of of life only lasted about maybe I think it was about a two or three years it feels like a lifetime.
Speaker 1:No shit, it feels like a lifetime.
Speaker 4:I was looking for two or three months wow, two to three years of my life um wow from the time that I went to the tiki until the time that I you know.
Speaker 3:So what?
Speaker 4:21, 24 oh, no, no, no, this is. This is a long time ago. This is like eight years ago. This isn't recent okay um, this is so I've been out of. Oh, I mean, I'll get to that, but this would have been in 2000 and like 16, 15 or 16, until like 18 or 19. Okay, okay, um, and so how old are you now?
Speaker 3:no late in that time early 20s.
Speaker 4:Okay, I mean the progression of having my son.
Speaker 3:No, no, I mean, I didn't mean. I didn't mean 20, 21, I mean I'm at you, oh 21 to 24.
Speaker 4:yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, um, so, yeah, so they. Yeah, this guy was just, it was scary, it was How'd you get away from him.
Speaker 4:This is crazy. I think that one day he just decided he was done with me. And what he did is he beat me up because he would avoid my face intentionally Right A lot of the times because I still had to look good online, but this day all bets were off. He was beating the shit out of me and I remember laying on the floor. He had taken me to his mother's house and was doing it there and his mom was so scared of the way he had became. She ended up moving out of her fucking house because he had gone so far off the rails. Um, but he had taken me there. I don't even remember what he was mad about. He beat me up so bad. Um, I remember laying there thinking like, hmm, this might be it.
Speaker 1:That's how I'm going.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I remember laying there thinking like this really might be it, um, and unfortunately I didn't really have um much of a relationship with God at that point in my life. You know, I hadn't really been. I'd been raised, I had gone to Catholic, I'd been gone through like the Catholic ceremonies, I'd gone through baptism, catechism, confirmation, you know all that stuff and but I'd never formed a relationship with God. I feel like those are two very different things.
Speaker 3:Very different.
Speaker 4:Very. I didn't trust in God. I didn't even necessarily believe in God, I was just going just to, you know, check the box, like, yeah, I did it, you know. And so I remember thinking in that moment, I this really might be it. And I didn't say, god, help me, you know. But I remember thinking to myself, please do not let me die. And I didn't know who I was talking to or what I was talking to. I was just begging something or someone to please make this stop, um, and he ended up taking me outside and putting me in his car. Um, he went over to another guy that we knew his house, um, it was. He was mad about something that had to do with this other guy. He broke that guy's arm, right in front of me, in the front of the car, and I was just beat to shit in the backseat. And then he drove into a parking lot, looked at me and said don't ever, ever, get involved with somebody like me again, kicked me out of the car and left. Never saw him again.
Speaker 1:God damn, he had a little bit of guilt. Come in, no shit.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so I. It was the weirdest thing, it was the most unexpected thing, and it was almost immediately after I was begging to please make this stop, like don't let me die right now. It was almost immediately after he went and put me in the car, and so that was my first like moment of okay, there might really be someone or something listening to me, because there's absolutely no reason that that should have stopped at that exact moment. Given his history, given everything you know, I have no idea what happened right then it's giving me chills wow yeah, so um got away from him.
Speaker 4:Um, and women that fall into any type of trafficking just random little fact um, they average seven times before they finally get out of it before they get out of it or they die or they die seven times.
Speaker 4:Um, now, whether that be with different people or seven times going back to the same abuser, whatever it is, the average is seven times. Um, I only did three. So that was one and two. But here I was again no money, I had nothing. I had nothing. I had the clothes on my back that were bloody. I had nothing and I was on the street again. I had no friends. I was completely isolated at this point because he had kept me away from even talking to anyone, you know, and I just walked my way over to I don't remember where I went, but I went to a hotel. I think I went to one of the hotels in Modesto, and I saw people that I had been into and known from before and, you know, I was like, hey, you know, talking to them, and it's amazing how normal it is out there to see someone just beat to shit, because nobody even asked me what was what happened normal streets yeah, nobody was like hey, are you all right?
Speaker 4:you know, like I I need help.
Speaker 4:Yeah, they knew what happened pretty much, pretty much um, and so one of the girls that um I I had met before was like hey, you want to come in my room? She's all, you can shower and stuff. I'm like all right, cool. So I went in and showered, um, and but by the time I got out of the shower she had called some of her friends in um, and this isn't confirmed, but I do believe that she basically sold me to my third person right, um, because I got out of the shower and sorry you're fine, hon take your time Take your time.
Speaker 4:I got out of the shower and I was, I remember, um walking in there and they were being kind of weird and shady. They were kind of talking like under the table, you know, just very, um, very, uh, just weird, kind of secretive, and I was like what is going on, you know? And I was like what's going on, you know, and I was just um uncomfortable and uh, the guy was like hey, you know, and he's like I can go get you a room, like I can help you out. I'm so sorry you went through this, you know. And I was like all right, like thank you.
Speaker 4:Good cop, bad cop, good cop yeah, I was thinking like man, that's really really nice of this person like I was like that's incredibly nice of you because I had nothing and I was like my God, you know, and so I just was hoping. And you know, that's the problem with me is I never I, even in my my worst of days I never lost trust in people. You know, even today, I still trust people at their word, you know, and I still, um, I still trust people at their word, you know, and I still, um, I don't, I didn't let my experiences shift my view on humanity. So when someone tried to do something that was kind, I took it as something kind, you know, um, but it wasn't.
Speaker 1:That's a bad attitude to have on the streets.
Speaker 4:Yeah, terrible, terrible fucking attitude to have on the streets. Yeah, terrible, terrible fucking attitude. Um, and it wasn't just being kind, you know, but it but she had introduced us and she'd been like this is my buddy, you know, this is my friend, and they were being really nice. We're sorry, you know that you're like going through this, you look like you're struggling and whatever. And um, I remember we were leaving and he gave her money right in front of me, gave her money and I was thinking like, wow, this guy's really nice, like he's giving her money, he's about to go get me a room, like this guy must be rich, right well, no, I was just thinking like, wow, this might be like you know how you get like those robin hoods right, like the, the people that try to like kind of save, save the hood, right.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was just something that I was like, okay, well, here we go, you know. And so he went and he did get me a room and he was incredibly nice to me and he put me up in a room and he was, you know, we spent probably two months together of just hanging out and him helping me, and you know.
Speaker 1:Were you using during that period of time? Yeah, oh yeah, I was using. He was getting you drugs too.
Speaker 4:He didn't do heroin, he did meth. He didn't do heroin and he wasn't a huge fan of it, but he continued to get it for me.
Speaker 1:Of course.
Speaker 4:He wasn't by no means trying to get me off of it, but he was, you know, not a fan, but he was by no means trying to get me off of it. So the ironic thing about this guy is him and I got to talking and he had gone to Houston High School a year before I started in Houston. He had been in a foster home. So we're making all these connections and one thing I did do is I didn't trust people with my real story. I did learn that much to not confide in people like anything about me that was real other than my name. I gave him my name. I didn't have like a street name, but I didn't tell him where I was from. I didn't tell him any of that.
Speaker 4:But this guy got my trust after two months of being with someone all the time, you know, and he's being so kind, I started to trust him and I was like you know, this is where I'm from and this is you know. You know, like just telling him kind of my story, you know like what I had gone through and shit. And we connected on a different level and then one day it was very nonchalant but he was like, hey, I, I don't have any more more money, like I'm out of money and I don't know what to do. And he brought it to me, almost like he was um brainstorming with me, like okay, how are we gonna? You know, what are we gonna?
Speaker 4:do your idea right, what are we gonna do?
Speaker 3:I'm kind of like the first guy I told you you're sitting on a gold mine and what are you? You're kind of like I can't believe. You don't even know this yeah.
Speaker 4:So he was. He came and he was kind of just, you know, shooting ideas back and forth. He's like, well, I could go, you know, sell this or do that or whatever. And he's like I don't want you to, and he even made it. I don't want you to have to do that again, right. And I'm like yeah, I was like okay, thank you, you know what. And he's like I don't want you to ever feel like that again. I'm like all right. And so then he really made me feel like it was my own offer, right, like my own, like, oh, it's okay, like I don't want to be on the streets, like you've been doing a lot for me and let me, I will do this one time just to get us on our feet. And then, you know, we will figure it out from there, right? And so I did it at the one time and, um, yeah, he, uh. He was a weird transition. I don't know how it went from being that to being very dangerous again.
Speaker 1:That same person Wow.
Speaker 4:Yeah. He was a different kind, because I had actually started to like, love and care about this person Right and he had convinced me that he was in love with me.
Speaker 1:Manipulator.
Speaker 4:He was in love with me. Manipulator, he was in love with me and so a lot of times in the beginning it was like we're just doing this just to get that leg up so we can get out of this life, like we need to get out of this life, like that was always the hope that I was like.
Speaker 4:The hook. I'm just doing this just to get out of this life. And then we're going to live this beautiful life and I'm like, okay, okay, okay, um, but he, uh, he was a master manipulator. Um, he got me vulnerable, he got me to trust him, he got me to fall in love with him what I thought was love with him and then he, um, switched on me, um, and he was a different type of isolator. He took me all over, like all over. We were never close to home, right, we were in Vegas, we were in LA, we were in San Francisco, we were, you know, sacramento, wherever we could be. That was nowhere near anybody. That I knew is where we went. And just to give you an idea, this is so crazy, we were in Las Vegas. This just kind of goes to show how isolated I felt and how isolated you can feel in that position. We were there. I had a room at the Luxor during the mass shooting.
Speaker 1:Oh, oh oh at the Mandalay Bay, the.
Speaker 4:Jason Aldean concert Mandalay Bay. I didn't even know it had happened and I was at a hotel within like a couple of blocks of it, um, and I was so focused in on trying not to get beat to death right Trying to appease this person. That is absolutely just terrifying. Even conversations I would have with people were so superficial at this point that they'd never gotten to any sort of depth, because I was so scared to say the wrong thing or do the wrong thing, or, you know, because he always had this like way of making me feel like he was watching me. No matter where he was, he did enough just to make me feel like I always had eyes on me. So I was too scared to ever even try to do anything or anything, you know. And that night I remember hearing a lot of sirens and he would get mass paranoia.
Speaker 3:Methamphetamines.
Speaker 4:He thought I had called the cops on him. So I almost died that night because he thought the cops were coming for him because of me, yeah, and was there. I was there for a few more days, never knew, never knew that it even happened until like months later, you know, after I finally, you know, kind of broke free. That just kind of goes to show you how could you be right there and not know that is so isolated right there, that is so detached from reality, you know, which is why it just felt so unreachable to get out of that situation, you know so how did you get out of that?
Speaker 4:so he and I uh, landed in modesto one day. He had to come back. He had a sister out here he was trying to get something from his sister, um, and we landed back in modesto and we, um, he had left, i't remember, we didn't have a room. We were kind of struggling, um, and he basically left to go somewhere. So him and I were split up and I, um didn't have a phone, cause I, of course. How, why would I have? You know, he would never let me have a phone, right, of course, um. So we got split up and I ended up going over to a hotel and getting a room and he, apparently in another one of his paranoias, thought that I had a room at a different hotel.
Speaker 4:He had brandished a firearm at the hotel, thinking I was in the room, and he got arrested, tell uh, thinking I was in the room um and he got arrested and I didn't immediately run because I was like, where do where I'm terrified, I mean and where do you go?
Speaker 4:and where do I go? You know, um, I was scared, I was really scared, and but then I um, and I was also in drug court. At this time in my life I had caught a charge for false impersonation. I had spent 12 days in jail under someone else's name. Random fact, I caught a false impersonation charge and so I got drug court for it. Because it was like, obviously, drugs kind of made me make that terrible decision and I was attending drug court. So one of the days when I went into drug court, make that terrible decision and I was attending drug court, so one of the days when I went into drug court, he had real court, and this is when drug court used to still be right across the street from the courthouse, and so I went straight from drug court and.
Speaker 4:I went in there to see where he stood in his trial because I wanted to know exactly, like if he was going to be in there long enough for me to run. I was going to gonna run. I didn't give a shit about drug court. I didn't give a shit about what I was leaving behind. I could not care less. I was getting the fuck away. Um, and I went in there and he was getting held. He got brought in and on the looking crazy, the chair with the the thing and the face mask and all that crap, you know spit mask.
Speaker 4:Yeah, he was looking insane, um, and they brought him in and they continued the, the, the um to push it, because he needed to see a psychiatrist to see if he was mentally competent to stand trial, and I knew that that process took a minute, and so I went back to the hotel room that I had, I grabbed my stuff and I left and I can't I'm not going to go into much detail about where I went or anything, um, just left.
Speaker 4:I left, perfect, I left and I never looked back and, um, I was very lucky to have found a place where I was able to finally catch a break and get my life on straight, you know. And so I got off of the heroin. At this point, the meth continued and this was in, I think, 2018, 17 or 18. The meth continued for lots of reasons, partially because I was telling myself that I kind of needed it to continue to push on, but in reality, now looking back, I think it was my only way of coping.
Speaker 4:I was happy to be off the heroin, but that was the only way that I could feel safe yeah to continue to run from this person at the time, Cause it kind of made me forget about all of that. But as soon as I would start to sober up, the fear of like this man getting out and finding me would start to sink back in. Um, so I stayed high, I stayed high and I continued to do everything that I continue to do. I got a job.
Speaker 1:I um were in Modesto.
Speaker 4:No, I was in Escalon at this point, okay, doing you know normal people things, paying my taxes. I was like back to living kind of normal again, you know, and safe, and saving some money up and doing things that I needed to do. And as time went on, this person that used to be so scary and so big was no longer big and scary. He just kept getting a little bit smaller, you know, um, and I started to be like wow, like I'm going to be okay, you know he's not going to come after me. Even if he does, I'm not. I'm not scared of him the way that I was, you know, um, but I was still dealing with a lot of PTSD type things. So, but that didn't really start happening until quite a while down the road.
Speaker 4:I think the fear of him, the immediate fear of danger, kept me out of that PTSD for some time when I started to notice the PTSD sort of kick in was after I, so I met, I met.
Speaker 3:A guy.
Speaker 4:I met a guy right and we got involved and I got pregnant again. I didn't know I was pregnant until I was in labor. Random fact, yeah how does that?
Speaker 1:happen.
Speaker 4:That whole show. I didn't know I was pregnant. Yeah, I always thought it was bullshit, it's not. I had had.
Speaker 4:So I had something called endometriosis growing up, very erect, not to get like too in depth, but I was my, my like, monthly stuff was super irregular. I would go nine months without having anything and then it was not irregular for me to like not have a whole lot of, have a whole lot of normalcy with my body, right, um, and so I hadn't had a period I lost a ton of weight. Um, I didn't gain weight. I had started working at a gym. I was cleaning a gym, so I got a free gym membership, so I started working out, right, and I lost weight and, um, yeah, she didn't move, or if she did, I, you know, thought it was like gas or something. She didn't move, or, if she did, I thought it was like gas or something. I didn't get swollen feet.
Speaker 4:None of the telltale signs that I had when I had my son, not a single one came with my daughter, and so I went to the hospital and I went into the emergency room because I thought my endometriosis was coming back, because it was kind of a similar type of pain, and I got in there and they were like, ok, well, let's take you back to ultra, see what we can see. See if you have a cyst. If it's, you know what we can see on the ultrasound? And I went back there with the doctor. The doctor looked at me and she I never seen the color drain out of the ultrasound technician's face and I was like what's going on, you know?
Speaker 4:And she's like, well, you're going to have to wait for the doctor. I can't tell you anything. Like you're gonna have to wait for that. And I'm like, no, what's going on? And she wouldn't tell me. And I got back in the room and the doctor came in and she said you're pregnant. And I said, oh. I said how far along am I? She said you're in labor Shit. I was like okay.
Speaker 1:How big was the baby?
Speaker 4:Little.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Five pounds. I mean teeny, teeny, little girl Teeny, and she came what they approximated to be about three weeks early I had been smoking.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I had been on drugs.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 4:I had not taken prenatal vitamins, I had not seen a doctor, I had not done.
Speaker 3:Why would you? You didn't know.
Speaker 4:So then I had her and then just this overwhelming sense of like, oh my god, like what the fuck did I just do to this kid? You know? Like just guilt, guilt, guilt, love. I was like like just immediately in love, but so guilty. I didn't have a car seat to take her home in, I didn't have anything at home for her, we didn't have clothes, we didn't have anything. And I was like, okay, so just very, very, very um, shocked, shocked, um. So we, I ended up getting her home and, um, after having her is when PTSD started to kick in. Um, I was, I think I was hypersensitive to her safety, um, and I just was noticing, I was what did the father of this child think?
Speaker 4:This is funny cause you know, yes, I do his immediate reaction. I called him and I said hey, I'm in labor, he's all. Oh well, she, they're going up for adoption period. And I was like I'm sorry, what? And he's all, what do you mean? He's all, that's absolutely. You're not bringing a child home, like that's not happening. And I'm well, I guess I'm not bringing it home to you, but I'm not giving my kid up for adoption.
Speaker 4:So, um, and his daughter, his oldest daughter, is the one that was like kind of reeled him back into reality. You know, I think it was just his, his instinct was just like what the fuck? You know, um? And she, she was like what are you talking about? So she ended up bringing him down there. It was during covid, so he, it was like he was the only one allowed in the room, um, and then when he, when he left, he couldn't come back, like once they left and he had to go get a car seat and shit, and so, like I was there by myself with her for you know, the first day, um, yeah, his reaction was not not the greatest right and Right, and so I was like well, it is what it is. You know, um, I got her home and that little girl became.
Speaker 4:I was just so um.
Speaker 4:I think I had seen so much in my life at that point and, knowing she was a little girl, it was different, like I just became so aware of all of these traumas I hadn't worked through, I had just pushed aside.
Speaker 4:You know, I was super, super hypersensitive to our surroundings all the time. I was finding myself in certain situations, like things would just trigger me and I would just get stuck back in a memory of you know, whatever memory it was and I noticed I think it was the worst one I noticed was when she was she's probably about two, maybe three, and I was standing inside and I don't even remember what it was that triggered me to kind of go into this, like detached from reality. But I remember her being like mom, mommy, mommy, and I don't even know how many times she had called my name and I was just completely, just not there, you know, um, and then I would like snap back in and I would pick her up and you know, but it's just just, she was dealing with the aftermath of my traumas at that point, um, and so sorry go ahead.
Speaker 1:No, no, no go ahead, no, so how old is she? Sorry?
Speaker 2:go ahead. No, no, no, go ahead, no, not so how?
Speaker 1:old is she? So how does she now? Five, five, five, she's five.
Speaker 4:Okay, beautiful so you went back in, you went back out again then yeah, no, I never stopped she never got sober oh okay, six months ago.
Speaker 1:So the holding the baby and all that stuff didn't bring you back into any kind of reality no, with her when she came no, she's amazing she yeah, she was.
Speaker 4:She is intelligent little girl. I mean, just yeah she's. She's beautiful and perfect in every way, no complications, um thank god, say that again, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So what got you sober? Yeah, what got you sober? Let's talk about that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because the baby didn't. No, I got deathly ill for no apparent reason, so I had been staying At this point. I was justifying it because I was running back and forth from hospital trip to hospital trip and I was like I got to keep up. I was just exhausted all the time Got to have the myth.
Speaker 4:Just justifying, rationalizing, telling myself everything was fine, you know, and like it just was not. But I got really really, really sick one day at work, throwing up bad. No idea what happened and I went to my parents' house. By the time I got to my parents' house I had passed out in the front seat of my car with the door open. It was raining.
Speaker 1:So you mended relationship with your parents at this point?
Speaker 4:Yeah, okay, yeah, we skipped over that, yeah you're right, no, after I had kind of turned my life around and I was kind of up and coming again. My mom's mom passed away, Okay around and I was kind of up and coming again. Um, my mom's mom passed away and I found out about it and I so you got to have a relationship with your son again.
Speaker 4:No, my parents don't have my son anymore. That's a uh, one of those things that I haven't. I have the information to where my son is he's within the family but I haven't had the guts to have that conversation with my mom as to why she doesn't still have him. I've made this up in my own head to, I think, cope with it. I do believe that she probably got him because he was probably in danger because of his dad's family. They were crazy and they were relentless and they would not have given up. And if my parents were holding him from them, I could only imagine the threats, the bullshit they were dealing with. So they probably gave him to. It's a very close family friend of ours. They live in escalon and my parents are still very much involved in his life, but they don't have him anymore, okay, um so you're sick, you're really sick I'm really sick.
Speaker 4:I'd gone over to my parents house, um, and I ended up getting hospitalized and they were testing me for meningitis, um, just all kinds of shit.
Speaker 4:I was super sick, um, and my mom works for sutter and so she was just on the shit on top of it, she created a whole online page for me before I even like I was sleeping and she had gone and she was trying to get all my lab work and everything and, um, this is not funny, but this is kind of funny.
Speaker 4:Looking back, when I went in, I had my shit on me right, because I always had my shit on me. I had my pipe, I had my dope, I had my stuff because I was never going to leave it at home, right, so I had it on me and so I put it inside of this, um, like patient belongings bag. But my mom was coming in and she kept going through my stuff to try to get me my phone or get me my whatever, and I'm like my mom's going to find that shit. So I took it out of there and I put it in my pillowcase and I woke up one night to the nurse coming in my room and she went to fluff my pillow and all over the floor. And at that point, what am I going to say? I well of course even still, even still.
Speaker 4:I was like who the hell are you letting in my room? You guys need better staff. Still trying to keep up this lie, right, just insanity. Um, and finally I was like and so then they were requiring a toxicology report, like they needed me to pee in a cup. So I started flipping out. I called, uh, my daughter's dad was like come, get me the hell out of here. My, I cannot have reality's coming right, I can't have my parents because in my mind.
Speaker 4:The way I was thinking is I cannot lose my daughter too. That was immediately where my mind went. And if my parents found out, and they knew that I had been lying, I was so scared. I was so scared, and so I just was yeah, I was hiding and lying and everything Shit just hit the fan, you know, and shit came to a point and it just was what it was. And so I um ended up. My mom came in the room and I don't know how she found out because I still hadn't. I held my pee for like almost, almost 24 hours. I refused to go pee, um. So I don't know how she found out, but she found out and she came in and she just started crying and she just gave me a hug and she said it's gonna to be okay. And I was like mom, I can't lose her too. I cannot lose her to my daughter. And she said I would never. She said you're not the same person you are. You are not the same place you are.
Speaker 1:She said you just need help it sounded like maybe she wasn't the same person at that absolutely both yeah so is that when you came in the rooms, Cause I, that's when I had met you first.
Speaker 3:You had just. You're brand new. Yeah, I, brand new. She came to my Thursday.
Speaker 2:Yeah, big book study.
Speaker 3:Brand new.
Speaker 1:Yeah, See, hey yeah, are you done? I'm done.
Speaker 3:Go ahead, Fucking guy yeah.
Speaker 4:I went straight to the. I went from the hospital. I stayed in the hospital about a week and went straight out to First Steps in Clovis.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:And I did a 30-day inpatient because I knew I needed the inpatient, because I had a lot of stress factors at home that I needed to just be able to forget about and go and take care of me for a little bit, because I wouldn't have done it at home. So I went over there and I did my 30 day, got out and immediately went hit. The ground running was shopping for a home fellowship and I found oakdale and man, I just thursday night welcome home.
Speaker 1:Welcome home I felt right at home when I found so never, at any point, did you think about going into an na you know I had gone into any after my excuse me, my Nirvana trip and it was a bad experience.
Speaker 4:I had a couple of guys try to like, 13, step me and then.
Speaker 4:I had someone try to sell me drugs after the meeting and I was like and, to be honest, the people I feel like say it, say it, preach it. This is no offense to NA in any way, shape or form form, and if it works for people, I'm, more than you know, happy for them. But I was trying to find a room where people were living lives that I wanted to live like, if that makes sense, and NA to me capped out at like it just capped out at a different level than AA. I feel like AA really lives in the solution and it really like. It's just more about like hey we're really bettering ourselves as people.
Speaker 1:It's not like like sitting in the bullshit that we were in. You know, no, and I, I can appreciate that because I, I've I mean, I've had, we've spoken to na people, we've had to have them, you know, I, we offered them to come on here and to share their side of the na and it's. And they, the two people that we offered them to come on here and to share their side of the DNA and it's, and they, the two people that we've invited to come on here they backed out the last minute because they didn't want to get they didn't want to.
Speaker 1:They thought it was going to get into a debate and it's like listen, it's never a debate. We're all sober, right. Tell me why you're, why you're sober through NA. That's what what I wanted to hear.
Speaker 4:Yeah, no, for sure, I, um, yeah, I just I didn't really the couple of ones that I went to I had that experience and then. I just didn't feel like anybody in there was like living, as I was looking for people that were living happily and I didn't get that vibe and it could have just been the one I went to you know it doesn't matter.
Speaker 1:The thing is, is you got, you're in a, you're in recovery and you're in a good place and you're happy there, right, whether that's in a, a fucking goat farm, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 3:She came in because I was there the first day she came in. Was it my thursday night, big book study, one of those anyway? But she was, she was ready to do it. I mean, yeah, she's willing. She had the willingness, the desire we talked about that, but you can't do anything without it, no matter where you go.
Speaker 1:Before we started recording, your willingness was just wide open. You know, that's why you were saying your first sponsor just you needed to go. Yeah, I mean, I was the same way when I first met Rob. I needed to go and my sponsor just wasn't doing it Right and I had to do something different.
Speaker 4:And that different was getting a different sponsor and you had to do the same thing yeah, I had that window of willingness was closing right and it happens quickly, yeah it was closing for me and I felt it happening, and that's when I really got scared because I was like, wow, I'm gonna run out of these rooms if I don't fucking get someone that's gonna help me right now all right thank you, christy.
Speaker 3:I know that, but christy had the same thing right, she took action yeah, we did it, yeah, and so she sees that yeah she, she man christy and she's out of life. She's amazing. Absolutely she's out of life, absolutely. I never told christy anything that you know when we guys have a lot of similarities. We do.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's funny how god works and puts we do well, and I loved christy from the very first meeting I went to, but I didn't think she was sponsoring and I I was. I don't know I don't know why I didn't think she was sponsoring and I was. I don't know I don't know why I didn't ask. But I, like, was just kind of like more like Christy was my buddy, like Christy was my friend immediately, but I just didn't like think to ask her to sponsor me. And then whenever I got jealous cause I heard she was sponsoring another lady, another girl, and I'm like, oh, you're sponsor. And I'm like, hey, and so I kind of like jumped in.
Speaker 1:I was her second line, you know, and it's funny that you guys look a lot alike too. That's the funny thing about it.
Speaker 3:And um, anyways, they have this certain they have the same light, the same light to them for sure and you're gonna help her.
Speaker 1:You probably get him because she loves to get involved with the dances and she loves.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah, I'm there, for I told her next year prom committee I'm on it. Period Nice.
Speaker 1:Nice, nice. So anything else you want to bring up in there, anything else you want to bring up, there's something I want to know.
Speaker 4:Yeah, how did I get this?
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 4:Nothing to do with any of the stories.
Speaker 3:I just told you no, nothing to do with any of the stories I just told you, no, uh well, it did have to do with drugs, for sure I was, I would fall down.
Speaker 4:Yeah, um, do you know, jacob myers? Oh yeah, you know the giant rope swing.
Speaker 4:That's just up the rope just up the river, yeah well, it used to be until my dad cut it down. Yeah, we were at the. We used to go on it all the time we would like go. It was like a regular thing to do. And one day I had a weird feeling about it and the guy that I was dating that, um, the first guy that his dad was a meth head or whatever, um, kicked a rock and he's all go. He was standing up at the top on high street and he kicked a rock and the rock came straight for me, you know, face first, down that whole cliff. That was nasty. This hand was touching this elbow oh they have a case study on me.
Speaker 4:I have all metal. I don't have bones from like here to here. It's all metal, otherwise I would have been an amputee. It was crazy, crazy story.
Speaker 1:Can I ask you a personal question, and this may get too deep, and if it is tell me. Well, it's a little different filling the love of a man. Is that something that you've been able to get past? Okay?
Speaker 4:So I went for someone that um and I haven't said his name, so I can say this I went for someone that is completely emotionally unavailable. Okay, I have never been able to um, now maybe, but I, I'm, I, you know, I've. I had to get to a point where I was okay with if it did happen or if it didn't happen. I was okay right.
Speaker 4:I wasn't gonna try to force anything to come about and I certainly wasn't gonna um if it. I feel like if something falls in my lap, fantastic, if not, I'm happy okay like I am okay good for you, you know good for you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're not chasing it no, no, no.
Speaker 4:I you know, and I don't. Your sobriety is good enough right now absolutely my sobriety and my relationship that's building with my daughter right is is huge right now, and that's really my main focal point. I don't feel like I need to complicate it with anyone.
Speaker 3:You're going to school, aren't you?
Speaker 4:Am I? No, no, I'm not going to school right now, but I did just have. I just had an interview at the Lakes Treatment Center and I got a job offer, so I might take it.
Speaker 1:Doing the.
Speaker 3:Lakes, buddy.
Speaker 1:I know Just resident assistant. It's an entry-level position.
Speaker 4:But her and I had a conversation and I told her I said, look, I can start out at entry-level, but I have to be able to support me and my daughter. You know I have to. I can't stay at entry-level. That's not what I'm looking for. So I mean I, I would love to do that.
Speaker 3:I drive by there every day.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's beautiful.
Speaker 3:Going from table mountain to go from plant to plant.
Speaker 4:That's my back. Beautiful out there.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they get this spoiled rotten.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they get spoiled rotten, all right Well what Nothing, dad, I'm good you started to say something. No, I didn't. Oh my God, stephanie, that was a joy. I appreciate it. Thank you for doing that for us, right the listeners. If you want to reach out to Stephanie, you can always reach out.
Speaker 3:I have a daughter right now in college.
Speaker 1:It's brutal for me to listen to. It's brutal for me to listen to the fact that that and you know what you guys said something before and I wanted to bring this up too. You said something before we started recording that vintage fair is a real hot spot for can you can? You explain that? Can you explain that a little bit more?
Speaker 4:me, yeah, so then it, you know I, I don't want to scare you guys, because you guys are both fathers of of girls.
Speaker 3:This is, this is knowledge, this is learning my wife's into this.
Speaker 4:I wouldn't pinpoint any one location when I say that this is everywhere. It is everywhere. It's in Waterford, it's in Riverbank, it is anywhere you look. And it's unfortunate because it's hard to get a handle on it from a law enforcement perspective, because if you would have seen any one of my online postings, I would have 100% looked like a willing participant, right, and you would have came to my door and you would have never known that I was scared shitless because I couldn't do that, because then I wouldn't get your money, I couldn't give it to him and I would have got my ass beat, right. So all these men are paying into an industry that they think is completely by choice and innocent and you know, whatever like. They think it's just like a good time, but the reality is there are so few that are on there by choice you know, and there's so many that are under age and there's so many that are.
Speaker 4:You know it's. It is a very, very dark industry, a dark industry that's sad. And it's happening everywhere.
Speaker 1:You know what?
Speaker 3:makes me it's right by the freeway. They grab them freeway, they're gone.
Speaker 4:Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 1:What scares me is your story about your background and your family that you really had. You really had.
Speaker 3:You're my daughter. Yeah, you raised like my daughter?
Speaker 1:Yeah, by all rights you. You had a great upbringing. You didn't have any brokenness, you didn't? Oh, you know. The other question what about your real dad?
Speaker 4:so he's passed um from cirrhosis of the liver. Okay, uh, fairly recently. I just found that out actually, my mom and I were having a conversation one day. She said that he had reached out and he had wanted to get back in contact with me, and my mom was really not sure how to handle it because she said I didn't know where you were mentally, I didn't know if you could handle that.
Speaker 1:Gotcha.
Speaker 4:So that was just a little couple of years ago but he passed. But yeah, no, upbringing was fan, fan, I mean yeah, I think that's the part that's right. This drug, this drug, everything, anybody absolutely the drugs and specifically the the industry. I was the perfect target yeah they don't go after girls that were raised in the streets that wouldn't pull their call, their bullshit on them. You know it's it's sad, but they had leverage with you.
Speaker 4:One hundred percent and I had. I was so naive that you don't find for people that are straight, smart. You know that's the unfortunate part about it is the women that are being targeted are are girls like me, you know, are women like your ex's daughters, like um, and a lot of online. Online is the really scary part right now.
Speaker 3:Um, I mean, is this not okay? Again, I'm not on any social media. Is this like the dark web stuff that you hear about? I don't know. No, no, no, no, no. This is happening right on. This is right out in the open, bro, yeah, this is happening right on.
Speaker 4:This is happening on. What's that? Oh gosh, it's like a gaming chat room platform. I don't do gaming, but it's Discord, I don't know. It's just a chat room platform, right, but they are grooming young women. I just met and I'm not going to go into detail again, of course, but I met with a young girl last week that was absolutely getting groomed to be sex trafficked and had no clue wow, she's 16 do you help her? Yeah, well, yeah, I'm, I mean I'm as best I can. I got you what?
Speaker 2:and I mean I don't understand, but like what's the difference between prostitution and sex trafficking?
Speaker 4:Sex trafficking is absolutely you are being forced and it's weird because I went through it. So I actually went through the program without permission. I knew I had a bunch of trauma that I needed to work on and they specifically work with. It's the CSED program, so commercial sexual exploitation diversion program. I learned a lot in there. So they would even consider they call it the game, right. So the game is anyone that is selling sex, right, right, and so I the traffickers they had.
Speaker 4:They categorized them in a lot of different forms. So there is, um, the different types of pimp. There's the boyfriend pimp, which would have been like my third one. There is the gorilla pimp, which would have been like my second one. There is the um. I don't remember all of the names, but there's a lot of different ways that people go about manipulating women into doing this. But they also have different streams of influence. They have the media, like, let's be honest, you listen to, like Cardi B's songs or anyone you know. You listen to this stuff and it's like encouraging women to like do these things and making and normalizing it, you know, and so I don't know that there's, I guess, prostitution versus sex trafficking. I don't know would it be?
Speaker 3:I mean because during the number two you had no power you were getting none of the cut.
Speaker 2:You were, you were just, you were, you were just the yeah, I was just the moneymaker.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I was I was literally gonna use the first one. You were doing it for yourself the.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I was just the moneymaker. Yeah, I was. I was literally going to use the first one you were doing it for yourself the first one was
Speaker 3:would be more would be more prostitution. This second two would be more sex traffic. Yeah, you would.
Speaker 4:That's what I would have said until I went into that class and they said even the first one by from a, from a, like a justice standpoint would have been considered trafficking Cause that gentleman had planted that seed. That would still get him in trouble in the face of the law.
Speaker 3:But the other two you were kind of just a commodity.
Speaker 4:The other two I was just, yeah, like a, like an object, essentially yeah.
Speaker 2:My last question was do you think and there's a lot of like studies around it with like sexual assault and stuff like that and what kicks it off, and there's a lot of like studies around it with like sexual assault and stuff like that and what kicks it off but do you feel like that was the baseline of what was to come At MJC, at MJC, just because, like I mean, there's statistics where it's like if your mom was assaulted, you're at a higher chance If you get assaulted, you're at a higher chance to happen two to three more times during your lifetime.
Speaker 4:So I, you know, I don't, I don't know that that was necessarily a connection. I mean, at least not one that I had made Like consciously maybe. Maybe not consciously, yeah, you know, but I do. My life certainly wouldn't have spiraled the direction it did had that not happened, right. You know I wouldn't have been in that situation in the first place, where I was at that desperate point, you know.
Speaker 4:So I mean, yeah, in a sense I haven't really made like the connection directly, you know, but it very well may have been because there was that extra sense of like self-consciousness and and self loss of self-worth yes, no value was I had no value and that's what they pray upon and that is what they saw and they, you know, and I just was so low and that was the stem point, like the, the starting point for all of that for me, yeah, yeah. So I mean in a sense, yeah, I think they are connected.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's that, you know, it's we went from and I appreciate it. You know the recovery unfiltered went to a little different way with this one Right and I'm I'm happy we did, I'm not disappointed. No, we never have. And you know what, anytime we can bring light to something like that, I'm, I'm completely you got daughters?
Speaker 1:I have daughters, yeah I mean, but it also the recovery of you coming out of it right that that you're gonna have a great path of helping other people. You know what heather that was in here once before with john, I told her the same thing please, please, get involved. Please get involved, because your story is going to help people. You know, I love to do what we do, what Rob and I do, because this came as a calling for me. This is what I want to do, this is how whether it brings out what you did or just you know alcoholic or whatever it is we're bringing some of this stuff to life. And you know what? If you want to reach out to Stephanie, you can reach out to us recoveryunfilteredpodcast at gmailcom. That's recoveryunfilteredpodcast at gmailcom. So don't be afraid to reach out. If you want to get in touch with her, we will get in touch with her for you. All right, guess what? We're going to come back to do another episode with Stephanie, and the next one is going to be a little bit lighter, though.
Speaker 4:Yeah, this one was heavy.
Speaker 1:Thank you for joining us today. We hope you learned something today that will help you If you did not come back next week and we'll try again If you like what we heard.
Speaker 3:Give us a five-star review. If you don't like what you heard, kiss my ass. I can't say that, can you? Anyway, if you don't like what you heard, go ahead and tell us that too. We'll see what we can improve. We probably won't change nothing, but do it anyway.
Speaker 1:Hey, thanks, rob. Come back next week and hopefully something will be different and something will sink in. Take care, this has been Recovery, unfiltered you.