ALGORITHM SHAKE-UP: TikTok Update, Jimmy Kimmel, Branding Ethics (Ep. 013)

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What happens when TikTok’s magic algorithm gets rewritten in the U.S.—and Jimmy Kimmel gets yanked off air for poking fun at politicians? This week, we unpack how censorship, content, and creator strategy collide.

What You’ll Learn:

• What TikTok’s U.S. algorithm split could mean for your reach, engagement, and sales
• How the Jimmy Kimmel vs. Disney fallout reveals bigger branding and censorship lessons
• A practical framework for choosing when (and how) to engage with cultural conversations in your content

Update: After filming this episode, ABC announced that Jimmy Kimmel would be back on air starting September 23rd. This goes to show that we can vote with our wallets to effect the change we want to see in the world. 

Timestamps:

00:00 - Introduction
 04:00 – TikTok’s U.S. takeover: what the algorithm shake-up means
 08:30 – Jimmy Kimmel pulled: censorship, Disney backlash & brand trust
 13:00 – Ethics in marketing: propaganda, press, and personal branding
 19:00 – Diversifying platforms: protecting your business beyond TikTok
 27:00 – Core values + content pillars: deciding when to join the conversation
 34:00 – Playing to your strengths: finding the right content medium for growth

References & Resources:

• TikTok
• Disney / Hulu / Disney+
• Jimmy Kimmel
• Ted Cruz
• Saturday Night Live (SNL)

EOS model / Traction (book)

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Transcript

013 Click Tease

[00:00:00]

Joanna Newton: Welcome back to another episode of Click Tease. This week we are giving you an update on what is happening with TikTok and how the algorithm will be changing sometime soon. We're also gonna talk about Jimmy Kimmel and what happened with him this week, and how it affects how we show up online and in our content.

And finally, we end the conversation with a discussion about how to get really creative and work in your strengths to grow your business. Hi, my name is Joanna. I'm the co-founder of Millennial Marketer and Agency that helps creators build their own digital products.

Michelle Pualani: And I'm Michelle, founder of To Be Honest Beverage Company. We're a non-alcoholic functional spirit brand as well as business mentor and consultant to where personal branding meets personal development. Let's dive in. 

Joanna Newton: So today I got, I've got to get myself in the mood to film because we're filming on a Monday. We normally film on Tuesday. It's throwing me off, but I have a trusty beverage. This is actually a La Columbe bottled [00:01:00] pumpkin spice latte.

Michelle Pualani (2): Ooh.

Joanna Newton: So we're back on the I pumpkin spice today 'cause it's still as fall.

We've got a long way to go, but it's delicious. And it's one of those like canned like coffee beverages, but it doesn't like have like a weird taste. Sometimes those like canned coffee beverages have weird taste, but this is really good.

Michelle Pualani (2): Oh, delicious. Yes. Back on the pumpkin spice bandwagon heading into fall. We get hints of it here in California. It is weird to be filming on a Monday, 'cause I actually don't even do much on Mondays in terms of like meetings or calls or anything. Mondays and Fridays are reserved for like. Work. Work, but here we are.

Needless to say, I'm drinking yerba mate. I have been going to, so I don't drink coffee as some of us may know. No coffee for me. But I do love teas and Yerba mate is one of those great, like natural caffeine. You know, stimulants and I love matcha, but I have been drinking a lot of matcha and so I'm, I'm trying to drink not as much matcha and drink your mate.

So [00:02:00] that's what I have with a little bit of honey and a splash of soy milk, easy pizza.

Joanna Newton: Oh, that sounds, that sounds really tasty. I've been, I've been on a green tea kick lately. I've been trying to drink less like soda because it's like bad for me, like diet coke.

Michelle Pualani (2): Oh

Joanna Newton: and so I've

Michelle Pualani (2): gosh. You should stop drinking that. It's bad.

Joanna Newton: I know, I know it's bad, but you gotta like, sometimes you just gotta keep yourself going. But I've been like a green tea when I've wanted a Diet Coke instead, and I've been really enjoying it.

So I think that's a good switch.

Michelle Pualani (2): a little green, a little. I'm proud of you. Green tea is a good option. It's got antioxidants. It's like not as high of caffeine. I grew up in Hawaii on the big island, and so a. I had a very fam, a family that was like very close to me that I kind of grew up alongside. And the mom of that family, Mickey, she does green tea and she'll do like two bags of green tea, but then she'll just like keep adding water to it throughout the [00:03:00] day, you know?

So it's kind of like her hydration, but also a little caffeine boost. So it's a good practice. I think it's positive also, you know, honestly our like overarching Asian cultures have so much good. Food drink choices when it comes to like longevity and health and wellness. If you think of like Blue Zones, so I'm game to do what they're doing.

Joanna Newton: Yeah. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense. Um, today for our episode, I wanna start with a pretty UpToDate update about. TikTok, I dunno if you've been following the recent saga, but I'm sure like the TikTok drama has been going on for a while. There was a period of time where the app was completely shut down. Um, it was like 12 hours.

This was late last year and there's been a lot of drama around what the US government's gonna do about the TikTok app in the United States. Um, [00:04:00] very recently. Now nothing is official. There's no final deal. But it looks like US and um, by dance have figured out some sort of deal where TikTok in America will be majority owned by Americans and it's a group of American companies will be buying the app and the app will become sometime soon completely separate from the Chinese version. what they're saying is that the. The US version will still have access to the global community and global videos and all of that, but all of the American data will be owned by the American company, and this is the clincher that really has me going is the algorithm itself will no longer be the TikTok algorithm.

The algorithm will be something that is monitor, monitored, and trained separately in the [00:05:00] us.

Michelle Pualani (2): That'll be really interesting. I think my biggest question is, so if it's gonna be a completely separate app, does that mean that we're downloading a new app and are all of our US-based accounts gonna be sustained as the same accounts?

Joanna Newton: So I think that it, my understanding of the information that we have is that it won't be a separate app that will still be in the same app. It's just that the data and the algorithm of people with a US IP address, that's probably how it'll be, will be separate. So the, the actual. Hosting of that data and the hosting of, um, the algorithm and all of those preferences will be owned by the American of the company.

Now, could it be a completely different app? I think that's possible, but because we're still gonna have access to content [00:06:00] globally. I would imagine it's the same app, but we'll have to see. We don't know like when the deal, there's no like date yet of any change. But the things that I'm really interesting to watch too, so let's, let's assume we keep our usernames, we keep our accounts, we're on the same app, and it's just the data that's all moved and the algorithms that's changed. One will be interesting to see if people leave. I think that a lot of people are on. TikTok because they don't feel like it has the same control that the government has over places like Meta, like Facebook, Instagram, X. And so I think a lot of people are on TikTok for the idea that the what's being shown to us isn't controlled by the American government. And so that will be really interesting to see if people leave and if people still use the app given the change. The other thing is. The thing that makes TikTok so great as, as a consumer and as a creator, is its algorithm. There is no [00:07:00] platform that does an algorithm like TikTok. It adapts. It adjusts. So for me, as a consumer, it really adapts to what I wanna see in that moment and gives it to me.

And if I like switch topics, I'm interested in it like. Switches like that. As a creator, it's also just very good at showing your stuff to the people that would wanna see it. So it helps you get your, your content out faster into the right people because the algorithm is so good and there's nothing like it.

Like the shorts feed, the reels feed does not compare. So I'm really curious to see if. If it'll be any good, like when the algorithm changes, will it be good? And then I'll say, will, the ideals the government doesn't want out there, will those things be repressed in the algorithm? Because they theoretically could do that, right?

Like, I'm not saying they will, I'm not saying they [00:08:00] won't, but given what's what we've seen happen, I dunno if you followed this story, Michelle, but have you followed what's going on with Jimmy Kimmel?

Michelle Pualani (2): I have seen some highlights about it. I'm kind of in like a stop general consumption mode, so I'm only reading things like specific sources right now, but I have seen bits and. Pieces. So if you wanna fill in the story, I think.

Joanna Newton: Yeah, I can, I can fill in the blanks, but essentially, um, Jimmy Kimmel made some. of jokes about the Charlie Kirk situation and, and what happened with him, and not specifically about jokes about, uh, Charlie Kirk or about his death or anything tasteless, but actually kind of jokes about the Republicans in this situation and. Basically, the US government kind of essentially really told Disney they needed to take him off the air Disney [00:09:00] listened and took away his show immediately. that's kind of scary, right? Like when you think about that, that control, because I don't think the things that Jimmy Kimmel said were like, they were kind of making fun of the president, but like our, like. Entertainment news, media, media, night shows. Think of SNL, like do that. They poke fun at our government, both sides, right? And so that's something that's been pretty standard for a lot of American history. But there was some pressure put on

Michelle Pualani (2): Yes.

Joanna Newton: to. Take him off the air. They took Jimmy Kimmel off the air and actually di the Disney company has lost something.

Like, last time I looked something like it was over a billion dollars of people canceling subscriptions, canceling trips, um, and doing all of that in response to this. So when you look at. The US government owning the TikTok algorithm, and then you put that together. And I'm not trying to be a conspiracy theorist here, and I'm not trying to say like, oh my gosh, the government's controlling everything.

We think, like, I'm not going [00:10:00] that far to say, but if they're going to encourage the Disney Company to get Jimmy Kimmel off the air, why would they not also decrease the pre prevalence of leftist content? Right. Like I just like see that pattern there that makes me think people will jump ship. And I think a lot of creators could jump ship, um, when, when this sale happens because they don't wanna support or be part of that.

Like, like massive amounts of people have canceled their Hulu subscriptions, their Disney Plus subscriptions, their Disney vacations.

Michelle Pualani (2): Which is powerful. I mean, people vote with their dollar and it's actually relieving to hear that people are taking that type of action because there shouldn't be censorship to that degree, like. If someone does something that is tactless and tasteless in light of, you know, independent of the [00:11:00] political climate and what's happening, then yes, they should face scrutiny for their actions.

But when it is one sided, and again, not I, I was like, I saw the things and I almost went down that rabbit hole of being like, oh my gosh, what did he say? And watching the stuff and then watching all the responses. And I have just been trying to like, keep myself away from that recently from my own.

Joanna Newton: As

Michelle Pualani (2): Mental.

Joanna Newton: a lot. And I, I turned on, like I was, I, I was like going to kind of make sure I was up to date of the TikTok conversation before hopping on this podcast and there happened to actually be a. A White House briefing and the topic they were talking about is not relevant to us at all.

But I was watching it and I was like, oh, I don't wanna be watching this at all. Like, not to bury my head in the sand, but there's this level of like, what? I was just like, what is happening? How is this a White House press briefing? Like, what is happening? And it was just really hard to watch. And then I like [00:12:00] skipped it and I found some other content to update me about TikTok because it is a lot, um, it's a lot to take in.

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah, and it's a scary time like it is. Legitimately a scary time for us to think about censorship and control and manipulation. We talk on this podcast about press and propaganda, and ultimately marketing is the way to accomplish anything, whether that's a sale. To convince someone of something to create belief systems.

And you know, if you're listening, go ahead and hit that subscribe button. ' cause every single week we talk about these very culturally relevant things that come up in marketing, personal branding and content creation that can affect you as a business and hopefully guide you in that path of figuring out what it is for you from an ethical perspective to be able to align your values, your sense of self in your brand.

And of course, we want you and. Those who are well intentioned to have successful businesses [00:13:00] to create that freedom for themselves. But I think that we often come back to this larger conversation of the ethics of marketing and sales, because you can use it for good and you can use it for not so great.

You know, I'm not gonna say necessarily bad, but you can use it for things that promote ideologies of hate. Of bigotry, of racism, of sexism, of classism, of, you know, what we would consider those negative things in our lives that oppress people, that hold people down, that harm them, that keep them in the same place that create, you know, times of unrest and issue.

And so. Marketing propaganda press the media is something that we should be able to look to and believe because there is some honesty or truth behind it. Now, when it comes to news and broadcasting [00:14:00] and social media and all of these things, there's always going to be a lens in which it's created and the lens in which it's distributed, right?

So your perception and consumption of those things is going to have. Somebody's life experience behind it, it's gonna have somebody else's beliefs behind it. And we have to take those things into consideration and think critically. But at the same time, we wanna be able to at least trust that our media outlets and news sources are providing real factual information, even with entertaining.

Entertainment sources of our late night shows, SNL, those platforms, yes, they're making fun of things, but oftentimes they're sharing the truth and the heart of the matter. And so that is something that needs to be sustained. And when we have people who are in places of power with influence like Jimmy Kimmel talking about these topics and then being thwarted by the government in this way, that's scary When we hear about.

Censorship online [00:15:00] and websites and information being taken down or removed, that's scary. And so we are in a time that does cause this type of feedback, and I'm so grateful that people are making that choice to take action with their dollar and saying that what you did is not okay. We will not stand for that censorship.

And I really hope that that will continue to be the case and we're not gonna be in a place of. Like monarchy or like just taking over, you know, because that's scary. It's really scary what that could mean.

Joanna Newton: it is scary and I think, I think some of these more extreme actions that I think have happened over the past couple of months are, I think making some people see like the problem, I forget who it was, I think it was Ted Cruz who's a, like a Republican politician, I think it was Ted Cruz, he said about this situation, like you, [00:16:00] like, kind of like you do realize that if. If Jimmy Ki Kimmel is bullied off the air, that means that that sets precedent for right-wing commenters to be bullied off the air. And like ev like, like we talked about Charlie, Charlie Kirk, um, last week, a little bit like there's a lot he says that I don't, I didn't agree with. Do I think that means he shouldn't have a platform or right to speak? No. Like I, I personally don't agree with him. I wouldn't go watch him speak. I wouldn't give him money. But that doesn't mean I, I think he should not have a right to speak his ideals. And that's like part of the point. And I'm, that's like the part of the point of America. Although I write with free speech and, and all of that, and I am not a political expert. Anything like that. But you know, for us from like a communications marketing standpoint, we have to just be aware of what is going on and what is going on in that cultural conversation. Because it does [00:17:00] affect us, I think it affects us, like mentally, right? Like it affects us personally mentally being what's going on in the world. It affects our customers, you know what I mean? Like, like. We talked last week about when there's these like big cultural conversations, people might be upset, people might be grieving, people might be angry. People have all kinds of emotions that's gonna play in their ability to pay attention to you, but then it also affects us practically, right? If you are on TikTok and you are making money on TikTok and the change happens next week and half a million users leave because they don't wanna be on the US algorithm. you've lost a ton of followers. So, so there's all of these factors happening that can be really hard as a business owner because there's, there's practical re repercussions.

There's personal like and re like, not repercussions, but mindset stuff for you with all of this going on in the world. And then it's also affects [00:18:00] your customers and like how they're feeling and thinking and where they're at in their heads.

Michelle Pualani (2): And you know, from a very technical perspective is if you are on TikTok and using that. In your distribution platforms, and that is one of the ways that you drive conversions, drive traffic, and gain sales and clients and customers. You have to be prepared for the fact that the algorithm might also change the distribution of your content and material.

Yeah, I mean, we wanna hope that, of course, the type of content and the skillset that you're building is one that you are. Cleverly capturing people's attention, being able to hold their attention and then convert them. But with the distribution and the algorithm changing, that means that your reach, your engagement might shift as well.

So it's important to think thoughtfully, think thoughtfully. It's important to be thoughtful about, okay, if TikTok is my only platform, which it shouldn't be, but if TikTok is my only platform. Where else then am I growing? How can I start shifting that attention? How can I start getting people on my email list?

How can I start [00:19:00] building more collaborative referral type options? How can I be in other places? Like what does that look like from a marketing sphere so that you aren't negatively impacted by one platform having a shift or change or anything else, which is important. And then just keep in mind when we go back to your personal brand thinking through.

What you wanna stand behind, and we've had this conversation on the podcast before about how you can effectively like, speak up about things without, you know, putting yourself maybe at risk or being vulnerable while also protecting, like, you don't have to share everything, right? Like, you can take a stand and use your voice without being completely explicit about like, here's everything, here's all of my, like, everything.

Like, you know, you don't have to air out all of your, all of your stuff. But in this type of context, just look at what happened with Disney from a financial perspective, is that now you have clients, audience members, customers who are moving [00:20:00] away because of a choice that was made. Now as a business and brand, they had to make a choice.

The way that that choice went demonstrated. Their ethics, their values, and the integrity of the business and brand. Same thing for you. When you are creating content and putting yourself out in the world, you are establishing your set of values. You're establishing your voice, you're establishing your positioning on things, and you can use that to your advantage by polarizing.

Because there's a billion people who feel strongly that Jimmy Kimmel should not have been removed. Just imagine if you voice that, you don't think that Jimmy Kimmel should have been removed. You have, uh, a lot of that audience who's, who's gonna come behind you. You might have people who disagree with your sentiment.

But that's okay because you are allowing those people to self-select and to choose and know that the people who are meant to be in your community, the people who are meant to be your clients, are gonna be drawn to those choices and how you're taking that stance.[00:21:00]

Joanna Newton: Yeah,

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah.

Joanna Newton: and you have as, as a business owner, whether you have 500 followers or a million followers, whether you have like clients or a hundred clients, you come in contact. With people like your ethics, your morals, your vision, like what you think is important, you have the power to impact the people around you.

And you can, you can use that, um, and you can use that to champion the things that like you feel. Are right for you. If the Disney, Jimmy Kimmel situation is not the thing that like you wanna spearhead, that's okay. Right? But like I think if you wanna be an ethical business owner, you. Live that out in your daily life, on your content with your clients, and be that person with how you spend your money, how you act, what you care about. Do you have to be a political activist? No, I don't think we're all, that's not the path for everybody. [00:22:00] But we can still make change. We can still vote, we can still encourage our friends to vote. Like there's a lot we can do. Um. In the process because I think sometimes like, what do we even do? Like when this stuff is happening?

Like what? Like, what do I have to offer filming this podcast in, in my basement? Right? Like, what do I have, what do I have to offer the world? Well, I can still influence the people around me. I can still, you know, I'm raising my daughter to think critically, right? Like, I always talk to her about different possible opinions, right?

Some people believe this. She's eight. Obviously it's, it's a different conversation, but we're, I'm always letting her know, talking about media bias. Talking about people having different opinions, letting her know it's okay to think differently than mom and dad, Like, I think those, those are ways I can contribute and can keep me sane, right?

Like, this is what I've done to [00:23:00] contribute to the world and trying to make it a better place, um, and not be so caught up in trying to fix everything myself. 'cause that's just not possible.

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah, and those of us who are a little bit more sensitive and empathetic, as you're listening, a lot of times we kind of wanna get drawn into it. We go down that rabbit hole of consumption, right? You wanna watch all the videos, you wanna stay up to date, you wanna get the information. But at some point it's.

Not going to positively impact you anymore and to a certain degree, you've still gotta focus on what's gonna move your life forward. For a long time, especially in my business, I felt like I had to meet the demands. This was kind of actually more during like BLM and COVID and what was happening in the world.

Um, there was a lot of Asian hate happening at the time and I was compelled to not. Talk about my business as much and not sell in my business as much because I felt like I needed to be sensitive to what was happening around the world. And that's not necessarily what we're saying because at the end of [00:24:00] the day, you still have a responsibility to yourself, to your family, to the people that you support in whatever context that looks like to your clients, customers, audience members, and to the world.

If you are, again, an ethically driven, purpose driven brand, who's. Creating and doing things in the world that are powerful and beautiful and help move toward positive change. So don't let yourself get sucked into these conversations and allow yourself to get so swept up with it that you forget the importance of your business and your sales.

All that to be said is figuring out how you wanna contribute in the conversation, right? Are you creating content around it? What are you talking about? What does your marketing look like? What does your business structure look like? What do your offers look like and how can you support people through this process as opposed to thinking of it?

In a selfish way that's like, oh, well, it's because this, this was my perspective, so I'm sharing from personal insight on this one. During COVID, it was like, oh, well, people [00:25:00] aren't working right now and people are having a hard time with money, and so I can't sell my stuff. I just have like self-care things, so it's better that I give it away for free or like gyms aren't accessible, so I should just do fitness for people, but I don't want like to charge a lot because again, everyone's impacted by this.

And it tanked my business during that time, and I didn't realize until too late that I was like, actually, if I'd go, gone all in on my business and said to myself, it is actually so important how self-care healthy habits and fitness integrates into people's lives right now. And there are so many people through the pandemic who were totally and completely fine.

Like yes, there were people who were impacted, but there were still a ton of people who were working full-time from home remote positions, people whose businesses were thriving or growing because of the result of the pandemic. Like things just shifted. And if I had seen it differently to say like, okay, how can I best support [00:26:00] people during this time and still.

Run it as a business and sell my products and focus on those things in the ways in which I'm actually helping people. That would've changed the game at the time for myself, but that also in service to other people. The hundreds of lives, thousands of lives that I could have impacted because I. I know now in retrospect that like my stuff is positive, that it does help people, that it moves people and inspires people towards a change in lifestyle.

And so if you are kind of in that circumstance or feeling of. Well, I can't sell right now because of this, or I shouldn't launch my program because of this thing, or so much is happening and it just doesn't feel right. Just remember, like what you're bringing to the world and how you can be of service to others in that way and protect that and stand behind it and believe in it.

Joanna Newton: Yeah, and I think. I just think as a creator, like we can't [00:27:00] get away with, there's things happening in the world. There just always will be. And we got a really good question, um, on YouTube. Um, someone left a question on our episode last week talking about like how to decide when you're going to talk about topics.

Like how are you gonna bring that up? Should you just talk about everything? And I think there's like two things. To think about, I think when deciding like, should I talk about this? Right? The first is always go back to your core mission and core values. If you do not have a core mission as a business, if you do not have core values as a business, should create them.

Check out the book Traction. The EOS model is a great way to think about core values, your core mission. You should have those as a company because that's gonna really inform how you should interact with these topics. So for you with COVID, Michelle, like your core mission is about helping people feel healthy.

They need help feeling healthy. In COVID, of course, you should still [00:28:00] be offering services, right? Like if you. Come back to that. Now, that can be hard to assess on your own. So talk to a friend, get advice, leave a comment on our YouTube podcast. We will help you figure this out. But if you go back to your core mission core values, that'll help give you direction of like, should I talk about this?

So like for us, for this podcast. Our opinions. We have like briefly talked about our personal opinions about Charlie Kirk, but our personal opinions about Charlie Kirk don't matter so much in relation to this podcast. We talk about branding, we don't talk about like politics except in the relationship of like communications, branding and marketing. Um, that's not so much like our. Our like cross to bear. Right? But in kind of a similar vein, we talked a lot about the American Eagle and Sidney Sweeney campaign. So that had really strong political like reproductions. Maybe it did. [00:29:00] repercussions.

Michelle Pualani (2): a lot of reproductions of the ad I saw in content, so.

Joanna Newton: Yes. Lots of people reproduce that, but like it had like political significance and political repercussions, but it's about branding and marketing, so it makes sense for us to talk about that. So for like us, as we're talking about things we have to think about, does it make sense for us to comment, for us to talk about?

And I think that's one thing. If you go back to your core mission, core values, that's really important. other thing that I think is good to help you decide, like, how do I handle these issues, is I saw someone, I, I gotta go find this video so we can credit this creator, but I saw someone talk about content pillars, and we've talked about content pillars on this.

Think of content pillars as buckets of topics that you talk about as a brand. What they talked about is having like content pillars, like [00:30:00] your, like main dishes, like your main dishes and sides on a plate, and then other topics as like seasoning. So you might talk about. Branding and social growth and marketing funnels, and that might be the stuff you talk about, but the seasonings are the things you care about. This maybe you care about technology and sustainable business practices as an example. So you talk about your core things with your seasonings that like make up your whole brand. So if you also think about that, like what are my seasonings, what are the things we care about? You and I, Michelle, we care about ethical business ownership, right?

We care about being honest and authentic in your marketing. So these topics make sense for us to talk about 'cause we care about those things and they're not our main thing, but they're like the seasoning on top of what we do. So when you're as a, when you're thinking, do I talk about this? Do I engage with this?

If you go to your core values and you go to your [00:31:00] content pillars and like your seasonings that you've cooked up, that can help you decide how to interact with something.

Michelle Pualani (2): Absolutely, and those are super helpful. I think deciding what to take part in is just as important as like your normal content strategy, right? Because you are probably gonna receive flack for participating for now. Not participating, so you should decide whatever those terms look like for you. And like I mentioned in the last episode is there are tons of businesses and digital content creators who take absolutely no part in these conversations.

And that's okay. That is their choice as a business and brand, and I respect that. I know that there are a lot of people out there who give flack to larger celebrities and influencers and say that they have a responsibility. When I, I, I don't think that they do. I don't agree with that at all. They created that brand, they created that sense of fame.

I think that they get to decide what to do with it. There is pressure, and yes, there is a responsibility that comes with the fact that you have influence over that many people, but I still think [00:32:00] that those people get to decide. Now, if people wanna pressure and then the person responds and they're okay with that.

That's part of the process, right? Like we pressure politicians to make different decisions. So I respect that that's like an ecosystem and is gonna continue to be the case, but I still believe that each brand, each business, each presence gets to decide ultimately what they talk about and what they don't talk about.

And if you aren't sure about how to engage in these things, go to the show notes of this episode and subscribe to our substack, because not only do we talk about these things and then give you tips and tricks throughout. More specifically, you'll get right to your email inbox. A better breakdown in actionable takeaways of how to apply these things.

So if you're still like, wait, how do I approach this? Then just go hit subscribe to the substack and you'll get our weekly update email that has those tax. Tactical, tangible takeaways that then you can [00:33:00] implement. So one of the things I'm thinking about, which is what I'm pursuing from a marketing perspective right now with my non-alcoholic functional spirit brand is public relations.

So part of that is being like is is pitching to be on like larger outlets, whether that's in like a roundup. Or an article or something that backlinks to our product or talk about our product or my story. And so that can be written in an article, blog capacity, or it can be some type of audio or video option.

And so I've done this and pursued this in the past for businesses and I think it's highly valuable because as we're talking about TikTok and the potentiality of that algorithm changing your reach and distribution changing, you wanna think about where else can I put myself in front of people? When you think about influence, one of the ways that I feel like I shine the best is in these environments where I'm on video, I'm talking to someone.

I use my voice when it comes to short form content, [00:34:00] like I have not nailed that yet. I'm still working on it. I am not giving up. I will someday. It has been about 63 days of every single day posting. So we are on a track. We are gonna make this happen quantity over quality. Right now we are focused on just making it happen.

Yeah. 365 days, no big deal. So anyway, the point being is I have a medium. That I really like. And that is typically long form content, which is why I wanna pursue more of like my YouTube channel coming up here soon. And then podcasting, which Joanna and I do weekly for Click Tees. And then I love getting on other people's podcasts and having an interview conversation.

And that's one of the places where I feel like I, I shine most, get phenomenal feedback and that people really enjoy as well in terms of consumption. So recently I just got on Pod Match. It's. Platform that connects guests with [00:35:00] hosts for podcasting. And already I've been featured on, I already did one podcast, and this is literally like in the past, like five days, and I've already been on one podcast already that does have a great distribution and channel.

And, and the guy who runs the brand, John Brink, has a huge audience, which is fantastic. But I'm starting to have these other conversations and so. Deciding where you shine and where you love to be when it comes to your content and your marketing is something that is a great reminder because I have been like, you know, for our, our brand, our functional brand, we've been working on Pinterest, SEO blog strategy, paid ad strategy, organic content across platforms and, and some other things.

But I had done some podcast interviews like. I dunno, seven or so on kind of like the, in, kind of like the early stages and we got traction in sales from those. But for a while then I had neglected promoting [00:36:00] that and doing that and reaching out to people. And it was brought up to me recently when I had like a consultation call with someone and I.

Was like, oh, well why am I not doing this more? It's a medium that I love. It gains traction, it grows the brand, it gets to share my story. I get to practice the medium of exchange that I really love when it comes to content and marketing. And the more that I talk about what I do, the business and the brand, the more clarity I receive through that.

And it's just a really good reminder to think through. What are the channels that I'm leveraging? Where do I really enjoy spending my time? And how can I adjust my strategy to match that instead of feeling like I'm forcing or having to do something that I don't necessarily wanna be doing all the time in order to grow my brand and business?

Joanna Newton: I think it's so tough 'cause it's so easy to get caught up in all of the things. Like, right. Like

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah.

Joanna Newton: of the platforms, doing all of the things and you see someone [00:37:00] else being successful at something and you want that too, instead of just like embracing what you're best at and what you're doing. Like I. I like TikTok and I like TikTok creators, and there's a big part of me that like wants to be a TikTok creator, which is funny because I like you.

I think I do better in long form, like I have a lot of success from long form and I make money from my LinkedIn, like I get inbound requests from LinkedIn, but then I ignore LinkedIn to focus on TikTok, even though it doesn't do. Anything for me. Like why, why

Michelle Pualani (2): why are.

Joanna Newton: and, and this podcast, like I share it on LinkedIn to this podcast, like plays into my LinkedIn strategy really well. Why do we do this? Why? I don't know,

Michelle Pualani (2): I dunno, we're

Joanna Newton: it's,

Michelle Pualani (2): maybe, I don't know. I,

Joanna Newton: I think.

Michelle Pualani (2): I'll [00:38:00] say there's something about like the entrepreneurial energy and personality, which you and I both have, even though I feel like distinct. Like we talked about this before, right? Like way back in the day when we were actually her first, if you haven't been around since those days, since we transitioned to click tees.

But we did have some conversations about that EOS strategy and you know. We both have the same entrepreneurial spirit, but Joanna is definitely more in the integrator type personality, and I am the visionary type personality. But I think honestly, we both struggle and I think entrepreneurs and business owners often struggle with this in that we have a hard time focusing on the one thing that we know works.

Like, we don't like to repeat the same thing over and over again. And I gotta say like, and I, again, I've been in masterminds and business groups and conversations and conferences and I've worked and spoken with people all the way from like zero. I like [00:39:00] just idea to multi multimillion dollars annually, right?

In sales. And every single one along that journey struggles with this idea of focus. Now, obviously, the ones making more money. They're typically better at it. They've typically figured out, okay, this is my system. These are my channels, this is my messaging, this is my offer. Run it on repeat and they do it over and over and over again and they usually bring in people to help run it over and over and over again.

Right. But for some reason, like you and I are still in those stages of really figuring that out. And we wanna do things like the reason we are entrepreneurs and business owners 'cause we wanna do things that we enjoy. And that excite us and that we're passionate about and that we're like inspired to do.

And sometimes the most menial work in systems is what drives the most results. And I think that's where, at least I know I struggle.

Joanna Newton: Yeah, because it's not like the [00:40:00] big, you want it, I dunno. It sounds like fun to be like a content creator, influencer, just like. Chill it, but you know, that's not how it's gonna really be anyway, first of all. But then, right, like I have, have like profiles that I have to keep up to where I get like inbound leads.

Um, the Kajabi expert marketplace we've talked about on this podcast before, they're actually my migrating to a new platform. So I've been working on that portfolio and it's like. If I go and I write a case study and make the images on that portfolio, that's actually probably the most valuable action I could take for my marketing a day.

So if I'm like, I can only do one thing for my marketing today, should I post a cute TikTok or should I go that case? I should write the fucking case study,

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah, top priority for sure. What do you wanna do? You wanna make the TikTok.

Joanna Newton: But I wanna make the TikTok, but because I thi because I think that that will make me money, but it, which is [00:41:00] really bizarre too, because I've been on, I've seen the other side of the data of the people with the millions of followers and they struggle to make money. struggle to make sales so. And I think it's just like a social perception because I think head, I think people will think I'm more successful if I have a big following, but I make more people. I, sorry. I don't make more people. I've made one person and I will only make one

Michelle Pualani (2): It's more than me.

Joanna Newton: I make, I make more money than that I know have way more followers than me.

Michelle Pualani (2): Oh, totally. And I, yeah.

Joanna Newton: It just.

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah, it really does, and I have been stuck in this trap for so long, and it is honestly hard to get out of because it is a belief and it is a perception, but I know so many business owners. Who make bank with like [00:42:00] no digital traction in terms of social media. And we know a ton of creators, influencers, people who have millions of followers across platforms or hundreds of thousands of followers across platforms who struggle to make ends meet.

And it is one of those things, like you can have both sides of the coin, right? You can have tons of following and lots of money and you can have, uh, no following and no money, and you can have anything in between, right? So it's not to say, but. It's just that one thing does not beget the other, and you do have to figure out like where your sales are coming from.

I'm in a place right now, so marketing aside. Well actually, I mean it's a part of it too, right? In terms of focus and energy is we know that we get consistent sales from our B2B partners. And I know that actually getting those partners is super fricking simple because it's a simple sales process. You go into the spot, you say, Hey, we're this product.

You sample them, you follow up, you get them to buy. And then once they're buying, they just keep buying. And I have lists of [00:43:00] people that I'm meant to be reaching out to right now. I have dropped samples off places and I cannot explain to you how hard it has been for me to follow up on that very simple, mundane task of sales.

But I am like spending so much time on the digital strategy and paid ads and organic marketing, which brings in comparatively a very small percentage of what we do in business, and I know that it has the potential to do more. So same thing like, okay. If I get this TikTok platform off the ground and I'm reaching millions of people that can translate into digital product sales and more people inbound in my sales funnels and like things like that.

So I get the intention and the vision behind it, but you can't ignore like what's bringing you money right now and how you can continue to grow and leverage that. So, uh, we're in the throes of it. We're learning.

Joanna Newton: Yeah, and it's, and it's hard, something I've been thinking a lot about because for, for millennial, we're in this area of trying to like diversify our [00:44:00] income so we're not just, um, you know, only bringing in income from our one-on-one clients at the same time. Of all of that being said, it's hard to. turn a, what's that analogy?

It's hard to turn like a moving ship, right?

Michelle Pualani (2): Oh yeah.

Joanna Newton: like, you need to be bringing in for, for, in your case, you want the big distribution, digital sales, like all of that coming in when you spend effort on, um. You're one-on-one. You're one-to-one. Bringing in business clients that takes away from the other effort, which is the future idea, right?

But you have to make the money and you have to do the thing. And this is why I think feels like a pivot, but this is why I think time blocking is so important for a business owner. It's all clicked with me on this call, is like, Michelle, you should think about your time for TBH as like, okay. I want this future state of [00:45:00] of followers, digital sales, e-commerce, website through the roof, but these business to business partnerships, they're gonna help fund all of that.

So I'm gonna spend, I. Monday, Wednesday, Friday morning on that, and Monday, Wednesday, Friday afternoon on social growth. And then you have your buckets of time, so you're not fully, you're, you're, you're able to keep one toe in. And if you can stick to that and say, okay, what are my business goals? block your. around those business goals where maybe you're spending 60% of your time on like the things that you know are driving revenue and the, and 40% of your time on future growth. Right? And that can help you accomplish both goals. Keep the lights on, keep the money coming in. Wow. Trying to pivot to that next state.

Now some people have the luxury of lots of funding. Some people have the luxury of. [00:46:00] Being like somewhat independently wealthy, right? Where they don't, they're not self-funding their business. Right? That it's a very different state. If you're in that state, you probably can just go for the long-term goal and not worry about your short-term financial needs. You're bootstrapped. I'm bootstrapped. That's not a luxury we have, right? Like we have to make money Wow. To fund the future goal ourselves.

Michelle Pualani (2): Yeah, lots to think about today. So as you're reflecting, just kind of considering the channels in which you are currently marketing and sharing your business on one, what lights you up? Where do you wanna be spending your time? How can you focus more on those things and actually turn them into leverage, you know, for conversion and for growing your audience and being able to successfully connect with people.

So keeping in mind the TikTok and knowing where that's going, but just kind of considering what that change might look like for you. You know, and I know that I have a lot to think about right [00:47:00] now, and the best thing that I'm trying to do for myself during this time is we navigate unknown. Political climate, unknown future like with what's happening is staying at least somewhat aware to take the actions perhaps at a local level in two days.

I have our annual luncheon for a committee that I set on Women's Legacy Fund. It's a local endowment fund that supports women and girls in the area we are privately held and an equity fund that receives. Investment gains every single year that we are able to grant make from that is not dependent on federal funding, state funding, or anything else.

And so we are able to ensure that programs happen in our community because of that privately held fund and the work that we do. So as things on a national scale are becoming more unknown, as funding is being cut from the programs that you care about. Try [00:48:00] not to fixate and focus on the problem and the largeness at hand and get caught in the emotional drama of what that looks like and turn around and say, how can I effectively make change at a local level?

In a way that I can be a part of and essentially take charge of and then focus on those things. Still invest in your business and believe that what your business holds is important and of service to the community so you can continue to grow and flourish individually as well as, you know, as a group with whoever you're speaking to.

Joanna Newton: Thank you so much for listening in today. I hope that it gave you some new perspective about how to think about talking about these topics, where you should be spending your energy and all of that. If you like this episode, please subscribe. We share our weekly hot takes every single week on Thursdays, and we will definitely be keeping you up to date with what's going on on TikTok and how the algorithm [00:49:00] changes. As that all comes to play, so subscribe, share it with a friend, and we will see you next week.