Leta's Tap Styles

Military Life Uncovered: Neurodiversity and Overcoming Challenges with Dr Kristen

• Leta and Amanda • Season 2

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Dr Kristen Williamson returns to the podcast for a discussion on advocating for neurodiversity within the military, focusing on the challenges and strategies for supporting neurodivergent children and their families. We discuss the stress levels experienced by parents of neurodivergent children, managing PCS moves, and the importance of understanding the specific needs and rights under the Defense Health Agency. Dr. Kristen shares her experiences and insights as a licensed professional counselor, late-diagnosed autistic and ADHD individual, and military spouse. We emphasizes the critical need for advocacy, proper diagnosis, and the right to behavioral health services. The discussion also touches on masking in neurodivergent individuals, military regulations, and the importance of support networks. (Plus, Leta’s opinion that the military attracts neurodivergent people.)

Kristen:

It's honestly being an advocate for neurodiversity, um, I think as a spouse is, is really hard whenever you're in the military and to think about it when like your military person is deployed Oh yeah. And then coming in and taking care of the household and I cannot pull up the research study to. Tell you exactly which one it is, but I remember reading it that parents of neuros spicy kins exhibit stress to that levels of combat veterans.

Leta:

This is Leta and this is me and my mommy's my mommy, and there's me and I'm just talking about this stuff. And there's me tap dancing because this is the tap Dancing Autism podcast and there's bunch animals and a wallby trying to in my hair and this bunch saying, and. Dancing. Oh, also, they're my boots. My boots are amazing. Also, dance, me trying not to have a panic attack. Also, this is a podcast that we autism and kept dancing and blah, blah, blah. I'm A DHD. This thing also. This your adorable puppy.

Amanda:

All right. Leta, do you want to do the intro for today?

Leta:

I need my Dales. This is different. Dr. Kristen and other two, Dr. Kristens in my life, and now I have to figure out who's who. And they.

Kristen:

Yeah.

Amanda:

Yeah, she does have two Dr. Kristens, 'cause one of my good friends is a, uh, professor down at New Mexico State University and her name's Kristen.

Kristen:

Oh, you know, that's a tough call. I would say I am the number one doctor because I have dragons with glitter wings. I,

Amanda:

Kristen in Q and has a whole bunch, an entire, um, storage com facility compartment full of stuffy she's bringing up because

Kristen:

That's a tough call. That's a tough call.

Amanda:

Her daughter's like, I'm too adultish for Stuffies and LE's, like, there's no such thing as adultish. For squish melow.

Kristen:

I'm 40 and I still have squish meows and like there's not, there's, I'm not too adultish.

Amanda:

My husband told me either Leta could have a Squ Melow obsession, or I could have a squish melow sub. He could put that one.

Leta:

Why he got one for stealing my squish pillows.

Amanda:

We're not getting discuss us it. Um, so Kristen, thanks for coming back on the program. You've become a friend of the program. Um, for those who have not, what Leta.

Leta:

The dog stopped the couching and barely fitting on his couch and the camera.

Amanda:

And the camera. You may have to move the camera so that Jack's not in the I did. I did. Obviously she's gotten used to having you on, so congratulations. She's talking now

Kristen:

Woo.

Amanda:

may wanna find the shut up button for those who may not have. Uh, heard or seen your prior appearance, can you just reintroduce yourself to our audience?

Kristen:

Absolutely. Hello audience. I was here exactly a month ago where we got to do a super cool Valentine's one and I still have that headband. It's so away for next year and I am like, we'll just have to do, see a Valentine's one every year, just like re-up it and wear the headbands. I am a licensed professional counselor. I am licensed in four states, maybe five states. I think I'm in the process of getting five states I am late diagnosed autistic and A DHD. I am doing everything that I can to come out and break the stigma of what that looks like specifically in females because we are an underrepresented subsection of the autism world. I can say I will come in and advocate for people of color for everything, but as the whitest person, I know I can come in and be an advocate, but I cannot come in with that personal experience of what that looks like.

Amanda:

I can understand that. Um. We hit a little bit last time on the military and we told our audience that we were gonna talk about the miLetary and possibly a little bit about masking.'cause I swear lead us topes is becoming leaders, topes and masking.

Kristen:

We can do an entire one unmasking in itself. Holy moly.

Amanda:

I think we could do an entire year podcast, just like get a whole bunch of us together and just discuss masking is bad.

Kristen:

Oh my gosh. And how I'm asking leads to burnout and what burnout looks like.

Amanda:

Oh yeah,

Kristen:

But that's a thing for another

Amanda:

that is the thing for another day. Uh, we will possibly discuss a little bit about it though, 'cause it does lead into the military and autism. Um, the diagnosis rates are really high in the military compared to the civilian world.

Kristen:

Which is really interesting because for a while the diagnosis rates were much lower as opposed to the civilian world.

Amanda:

Yeah. And now,

Kristen:

the, the lost generation of where kids would fall through the cracks.

Amanda:

yeah. And now we're three out of every five Tricare uh, recipients under 18 are diagnosed, not receiving services, but fully diagnosed autistic.

Kristen:

Wow. See, that's new data for me, I was coming in with being raised military, being married to the military, and just seeing, at least for my generation, how military kids were absolutely just, they were not seen.

Amanda:

Yeah, I mean Leta was shocking'cause I know we've been at some duty stations where she's, the fir was the first autistic kid that the doctors had seen and I was telling them what we needed, um, which. Parents should not be the one telling the doctors what you need.

Kristen:

No, but if you look at it, doctors have primary care doctors. They have what, one or two semesters on psych and that's it. And so they don't have the best descriptors of what autism would look like. Think about autism and females and how we present different. And if we don't have like the masculine phenotype, then.

Amanda:

Well, they weren't even sure what services she needed and I'm like, there should just be like a send you directly to the neurologist Behavioral shrink or developmental ped, get you outta the office.

Kristen:

I mean, if we're gonna live in the shoulds, we're just gonna be perpetually mad at tricare.

Amanda:

It actually works great if people know how to do it.'cause if you have tried Prime, we just treat it like an acquisitions project. Okay.

Kristen:

You, you know, actually, I think that hits on an entirely different thing. It's learning what you need to do because so many people, they have no idea, and especially for the military spouses, they might have just absolutely no idea.

Amanda:

Well, and I've learned because I had, you know, before she was born, almost a decade of advocacy, so I knew what we needed, but we turn around and I'm telling. Because Tricare, all the referrals, you know, go through the nurse

Kristen:

Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

and the nurse is like, I don't know what to do. And I'm like, you fill out this form, this form, this form, this form.

Kristen:

See, maybe you could just be the face of the government for how to get people through with autism awareness and all of the things. Because funny enough, with my clients, I, and now my clients that I work with are later in life diagnosed, and they're the ones that I, we lived in Germany, or we lived in North Carolina, we've lived in Guam. We, you know, hopped bases every 18 months. And so I, by the time my masks started to slip. And started to have those cracks. Ba we're in a new place and I get to have the new chameleon mask of Guam, me,

Amanda:

Well, and it's not just for the kids, it's also for the spouses to have that mask.

Kristen:

because with the military life, there is an expectation that you act a certain way, you perform a certain way as a spouse because you were still representing the military.

Amanda:

I was lucky because my career was adjacent, but enough, a far part that I re when my husband's commanding officers would say something about, you're not being the perfect spouse, I could. Go. Hi, your executive branch. I'm legislative branch. You wanna have this discussion,

Kristen:

Oh my gosh. See, it's. It's so incredibly cool that for both of us to come in, ed, you had this really beautiful positioning that you could come in and be like middle finger to you. Ha ha. I was the stay at home mom. I was a stay at home mom with kiddo and, and then second kiddo on the way. And like, I have no idea what I'm doing. Early twenties, I don't know how to advocate for myself or for my kid. Definitely didn't know about any of this within me.

Amanda:

And the key spouse program is not well-trained, even though they're supposed to be the ones you're going to.

Kristen:

It is. Oh my gosh, it's so interesting. Have you ever heard of the phrase third culture kids?

Amanda:

Yep.

Kristen:

I just learned about this recently and I, I love it so much and just learning how military kids are connected to that third culture because, and, and neuros spicy kids are connected to like, they are not from. Like if we're in the US but then we're in Germany, we're in other countries, other countries are then here, and then it's just how everything is not connecting and showing that neuro spiciness or how it's like we may, we might be American kids over in Germany and like we, we are neuro divergent, but we are not, like the language barrier is not there, so they aren't seeing it. They just see it as a language barrier.

Amanda:

Yeah, and I mean, that language thing is a whole. Nother kitten caboodle itself. I like, you can say it in your microphone,

Leta:

I'm afraid the dog's gonna steal my microphone because, because he stole the cat so much. I have been kicked off the cow time. Stay on the floor. You can also, I went to speech therapy for nothing because nobody uses English. Right. And apparently I went to speech therapy to use English. Right? And yeah, no, don't use English, right? I went to speech therapy for nothing. The government to go speech for speech, even use English, right?

Amanda:

So she's gotten past any, uh, nervousness having you as a guest, Kristen,

Kristen:

I don't even think she was nervous last time. She had some wildly big opinions last time too.

Amanda:

that's 'cause you and a few of our other guests are willing to let her have those wildly big opinions.

Kristen:

It's everyone's a lot of opinions and screw people who say otherwise. It's honestly being an advocate for neurodiversity, um, I think as a spouse is, is really hard whenever you're in the military and to think about it when like your military person is deployed and then coming in and taking care of the household, and I cannot pull up the research study to tell you exactly which one it is, but I remember reading it that parents of neuros spicy kids exhibit stress to that levels of combat veterans.

Amanda:

They do and they don't. I've got the, you know, contact list. So like when Tri West went to Nat Health and now that it's gone back, I know exactly who to call to go, Hey, there's a problem. We were in New Mexico and I literally told his commander, like in October when it went. I think we all, if you were in the Western Dale, you remember when Tri West went to Nat Health?'cause like for a year they hadn't gotten anyone taking Nat Health. They were, they had sent out letters going, hi, could you please ask your provider to call us to take the health insurance?

Kristen:

See, we're in the Tri East that just went to Tri West, and so now it's a huge hodgepodge of a thing of getting everything flipped over and then services are interrupted.

Amanda:

They, they were and like where we were, I was like letting people know in advance and I'd even told her therapy clinic that she was at and they're like, no way that's happening. We are one of their biggest providers. They would have told us. But as soon as she did one, and I'm like, can you check that she has services and their billing went, uh, she doesn't have services. I'm, I'm in the parking lot calling the SES at the med clinic going, hi Bill, but Jacob's commander, I had it like. Up to the SES at the hospital and Jacob's Commander Moseys on in is an oh five going, I can handle this since a spouse was dealing with it. And I'm like, yeah, here's Bill's phone number. And he and Jacob are calling Bill and they get off the phone and I'm like, should I have warned you? That's the SES at the clinic. Both of them look at me like I am the worst spouse ever. They're like, see, you're supposed to spouse. Because they were just using his first name and acting like, you know, he was just some worker at the clinic.

Kristen:

You know, I'd still, yes, there's a hierarchy to be given and utilized, but sometimes when it comes to advocacy, like, Nope, we completely miss all of that. It's like, I am doing for my kid

Amanda:

Well,

Kristen:

I'm going to,

Amanda:

Uh, if you can get into that level at the, your clinic or the hospital, all those guys, the hierarchy goes out the window. And so they hadn't realized, 'cause he wasn't like pooling, right? Going, oh yeah, I'm the SAS here. He's just like, no, I need you to tell me exactly in detail so I can go to my higher ups, which are, you know, DHA.

Kristen:

it's I, so I put out questions onto my social media to say, Hey. All of my people out there, all of my, my, my ones. What would you wanna know for talking about the military? And I actually had a therapist friend who worked with a lot of military families. Military kids. She says, how do you prep that family with neuro spicy kids for a pc S move?

Amanda:

Oh, there's a way you can get out of a pc. S move for your neuros spicy kids.

Kristen:

What?

Amanda:

Yeah. And Jacob's current commander was his old commander when he failed to do the paperwork for us and when we moved, 'cause he thought the services were going to follow. And he's like, how mad are you at me now? And I'm like, you should go back to command school 'cause you had a whole week in command school on this piece of paper. Um, but uh, I think they sleep through it. What do you wanna say, Leta?

Leta:

Noise. Oh, you're, you're wanting to show

Amanda:

wanting to show the puppy snores.

Leta:

Um, no.

Amanda:

no. Your command can stop it.

Leta:

Dog Sno.

Kristen:

That is new information for me.

Amanda:

It is and it annoys me when I find out it's new information.'cause this information has been there for like 35 years. The only way they can force you to proceed is if there is zero interruption in services and that is zero days interruption.

Kristen:

See, this is why getting together like this is so, it's so incredibly important because it's sharing information that at at some point in time we're like, why would you not know this? Why does the world not know this? It's just

Amanda:

I hate to say it 'cause I never like saying anything good about the army, but they're better at it than the rest of us.

Kristen:

really.

Amanda:

So years ago, years, years, years ago. And I'm trying to, 'cause I know we have younger audience members, uh, be a little careful in selecting my words. We had a very bad summer, a very bad summer, where federal charges were coming on a real regular basis. And the Army, uh. Uh, Congress got involved. It was Pentagon got involved. These are kids we're talking about. And the problem was it was the younger enlisted and the younger officers, they didn't know what they were doing. They were stressing out and charges were being levied. Um, and the statement was, this is a command failing. That the commanders are failing in their job of taking care of their personnel. Um, so if you are an EFMP family, your commander is supposed to have a written document on file with EFMP stating exactly how your commander is going to support your family. They're supposed to have quarterly check-ins with the spouse.

Kristen:

Wow.

Amanda:

do not.

Kristen:

No,

Amanda:

What the commanders don't seem to understand is we, it's snowing again here, Kristen. It was like 60 yesterday. Fires all over the place and I just looked out the window and we have snow.

Kristen:

I'm so jealous. It's like 85 here today.

Amanda:

We were so bad yesterday. Jacob got sent home early 'cause the post or base was on fire.

Kristen:

This is the epitome of like literally the world is burning.

Amanda:

Yeah. And then we were at the dance studio and there were three more fires around us, including where we were looking for a new studio space. And I'm like, well, we should.

Kristen:

Oh my gosh.

Amanda:

So snow is an important thing right now here.

Kristen:

really, we're gonna put out some fires with snow,

Amanda:

And I know Texas, uh, my family's a little further north than you are, but brain could be used right about now down there.

Kristen:

We are. We are under fire watch as well because Texas,

Amanda:

We're under Fire Watch and a possible blizzard warning at the same time.

Kristen:

that's impressive. I don't know that Texas has ever had that.

Amanda:

We're we're. Colorado is a unique

Kristen:

It really, it is a very unique state, which I loved living in Colorado. That was all the quirky weirdness that I did well with.

Amanda:

It is. Um, but yeah, your commanders are supposed to be involved in your EFMP, and if something happens, which God forbid it happens, they are on the hook

Kristen:

Ooh,

Amanda:

and it's more than just. Proceeding without services. It is if you are facing federal charges, they're facing federal charges.

Kristen:

that's, see, that's information that most don't know and it's, this is why I like learning

Amanda:

Your therapist friend can write a letter to the EFMP and go. I do not think this person should be, I'm saying they as a, the doctor, as a medical provider, no. They cannot proceed. We're at this lo part in a service providing to proceed. Would to interrupt?

Kristen:

The continuity of care.

Amanda:

Yeah. God help me. It is not just autism, it's across the board. I've had oncologists call up going, how do I keep them from in the middle of chemo?

Kristen:

That's, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

hi, it's this little, because I've had parents call up and go, we're in the middle of chemo and they wanna move me across the pond.

Kristen:

Have you ever felt the pressure as a mom, as a neuros spicy mom with a neuros spicy kid? Because neuros, spicy mom with a spicy kid, a couple of neuro spicy kids, and the pressure of. How do I say this in the right way? How do I say it? To make sure that they are understanding like what I'm trying to get across. Sometimes I feel like my words get muddled because I get stuck in the semantics of it, or my brain buffers.

Leta:

You should make my mother off of this. She makes no of 11 cents off of around people who want me and my father. She has no such.

Kristen:

I mean, to get roasted by your teenager, that's, that's mom code right there.

Amanda:

How does Mom code, um, Jacobs and my deal when it comes to her is it's his career on the line, so he gets to deal with her. The problem his commanders have had is they've made me mad with her, and then I have to deal with them on a professional level somewhere else. And since I'm already miffed with what they did to my child, now I'm coming in with puff barrels, plays into what they're doing with another child.'cause I'm like, I had to sit back'cause I can't, it would be a conflict of interest for me to deal with her. Um, but I can go after you for what you did to this kid.

Kristen:

oh. Okay.

Amanda:

Which I kind of think he should warn his commanders a few times going, hi. She knows more than you do and you're gonna mess up again.

Kristen:

That's, um, prior to y'all, do y'all do homeschooling

Amanda:

Yeah, we do homeschooling.

Kristen:

Prior to homeschooling when she was in public school and like the multitude of times if you were ever in public school, did

Amanda:

She was in private school,

Kristen:

Okay.

Amanda:

she was only in private school. She was a Montessori for preschool. Then they moved us. Because I wanted outta Florida so badly. That was the first time a therapist was like, we can stop you. And I'm like, no, we're going home to New Mexico. I will be close enough to El Paso. I can go smell Texas. So I'm happy. Uh, the Texan in me needs the Texas Air every now and then. Um, and I will be around family, I'll be around friends. I need back with my support group.'cause we had. Someone who's like, I will stop you. And I'm like, I need to be at Beaumont. Like, and she's like, but we're the Air Force. And I'm like, I need the army now. Um, but then we moved her to a private school and New Mexico has, and I think all the states are doing this now, where they give vouchers for private schools, for kindergarten, and because Tricare. I hate this about Tricare. I do not think enough people understand this. If you are on Tri Prime and you receive services in the school, you are not allowed to receive private services.

Kristen:

Really?

Amanda:

And if you do, we can come after you up to and including after retirement when we find out.

Kristen:

Holy moly. That's wild

Amanda:

And I have dealt with so much of that that I'm like, no, no, she's in private services. She has to be in private school because if she's in public school, well, her private kindergarten class had 35 children in it.

Kristen:

ha.

Amanda:

And I was, go ahead, Leta

Leta:

Got stolen or her shit.

Amanda:

her, her shoes got stolen 'cause a couple of the kids were picking on her. Um.

Kristen:

It's,

Amanda:

Would you like to talk about the, uh, few times? I got phone calls from the Donna Ana County Sheriff's real quickly because Dr. Kristen will love those.

Leta:

we went on a field trip, I got lost in the museum and also on ground and also in a place where there was nobody else around and we in the middle of nowhere and there was bunch of messiness everywhere, and I got up on the multiple times.

Kristen:

mm-hmm.

Amanda:

And because it was Las Cruces small town, I was getting phone calls from deputies going, hi, we have Leta.

Kristen:

And as a mom, that just makes your stomach drop at least the first time. The second, third, fourth, fifth, six. You're like, all right, this is more my norm.

Amanda:

I, I was like, how did they lose my autistic kid at the state Fair grounds

Leta:

I also felt like my teacher's mother was being really creepy towards my father because she was talking about my father with, so my father likes his child and his wife.

Amanda:

There is definitely a difference between guys and girls, and my husband does not mask, he does not understand the idea of masking, but

Kristen:

that? Yeah.

Amanda:

very autistic and for some reason people just see it as quirky. Uh, I wanted to be a paleontologist, but got upset 'cause SMU wouldn't let me in. Nothing like being that. I mean, he is still mad at that. And that was like in 2 0 0 2, that SMU United entrance.

Kristen:

You know what they've, they've officially rule the day since then.

Amanda:

I mean, he's will sit there and check their scores for sports just so he can rub it in when they lose. And I'm like, dear, it's been two decades. We can get over this now. But autistic people don't get over stuff.

Kristen:

No, no, that level of mono tropism where we just hyper fixate on one to two things and we are laser level focused, that does not,

Amanda:

No,

Kristen:

that does not go away so easily.

Amanda:

it, it does not. But he's a guy, so it's okay for him to be hyper-focused on the fact that SMU didn't let him in, but volunteered to let him come teach classes. He just wasn't good enough to be a Master's student.

Kristen:

Oh my gosh. Bringing the gender differences between how we are appropriately allowed to act,

Amanda:

but she's had a couple, she's had teachers both in school and with dance and stuff, go, don't you wanna try for a normal kid like you? And he's like, I don't think you know what normal is.

Leta:

I also don't

Kristen:

A normal kid like you,

Amanda:

Yeah. Like my husband, who is I. I guess during the like two or three hours, they see him here. He looks normal. I don't know.

Kristen:

how offensive is that though? Don't you wanna try For a normal kid, it's like, well, don't you wanna try to go eat sand? Like I don't, I don't know what's a, that just seems so rude.

Amanda:

You may take that one.

Leta:

sorry, but I know it's weird, but I got more offended when I talked about my father creepily because I don't care what gender, it's still wrong to creep on men. It's like wrong, wrong as hell, especially when it's, my father's wrong as hell.

Amanda:

I mean, I, I'm also sitting there going, you don't know what. He's like, TMO looks at us funny because we have to move his rocks, and they're like, oh, these are just plain rocks. And I'm like, my husband's a geologist by training. Do not mess with the rocks. Do not hurt the rocks. They need to be properly packed in crates.

Kristen:

I wore this in thinking of your husband.

Amanda:

I love

Kristen:

we all need to be dinosaurs.

Amanda:

Oh yeah. Dinosaur, dinosaur, dinosaur. He's got dinosaur. Dinosaur, dinosaur, dinosaur. She's all excited over there with the dinosaurs.

Kristen:

I love dinosaurs. See, she gets me.

Amanda:

Yes. Dinosaurs. No. And I'm like, dinosaur, because they're like, well, she's all into dinosaurs. And I'm like the dude. We've been together forever and um, we were really young when we got together. He called me on my 21st birthday. He was out in the field with his, uh, college class or, um, internship, had not in any way said happy birthday to me. And he is like, hi. I stumbled on a dinosaur today

Kristen:

That's amazing.

Amanda:

and I'm like, hi, do you know what's 11:58 PM and you have yet to say happy birthday? And he's like, oh, happy birthday, by the way. So we were out and Horner and I were talking and we were walking and I just stumbled on a dinosaur and I'm like. Only you dear could just because he tripped over a femur.

Kristen:

Okay. That is really cool though.

Amanda:

Uh, but you know, most women don't appreciate, I will give him a hard time that he never did say happy birthday that year.

Kristen:

Well, and see that's where you come in with the, I'm not most women. I'm spicy.

Amanda:

Yeah. I'm like, okay, fine. And I'm like, most women are not gonna be okay that he was off in the field old.'cause he was still going for paleontology at that time, not the military. And he was like, I'm looking for dinosaurs. They were like somewhere totally else. And that dinosaur, we can actually go visit it at the New Mexico Museum in Albuquerque, but. Most women aren't like, and I give him a hard time. I'm like, let's go visit, because he's got like four dinosaurs around the country we have to go visit when we're in town because they're his dinosaurs. He either, you know, found the quarry or he prepared the bones,

Kristen:

I would go visit them too. Like that's a need of like, here's my dinosaur. I call him Franklin.

Amanda:

I don't believe that my father found dinosaurs. She's like, I don't believe he found dinosaurs. He's not that cool. But if he found a dinosaur, he would be dead. You have to be a little different to be okay with. We're going to drive out of our Yes. Cuckoo as eLeta saying, because I gotta go and you have to be okay with. This is just who he is. And they're all seeing like that one hour where he's not masking, but they're like, oh, he's so cool. And I'm like, yeah, I don't mind, uh, packing up all these rocks and taking them TMO might I do not. Um, he went to Colorado School of Mines. When you graduate, you get a rock from the mountain.

Kristen:

Oh, that's cool.

Amanda:

Um, the military and he will be very clear on. He, we did not, oh, the kitty is here. Um, Lee's like the cat disappeared. He will be very cool on or clear on, not cool on. He's like, you don't understand. I had to walk up there as a freshman, put the rock up, then had to bust up as a senior to grab my rock.

Kristen:

Yep. Those rocks come with.

Amanda:

And he has his rock and he has his, uh, and they're, it's just a plain white painted rock. Yeah. You try explaining to TMO that that needs to show up at the next location in one place.

Kristen:

That's, see, I, I love autism brains. I think they're so much fun. I know for this next generation of moms, they're able to get more resources because it's being seen more, being noticed a lot sooner. Not always for girls, but a lot more for girls.

Amanda:

A lot more for girls. Um, and still in the military we're starting to teach people how to notice.

Kristen:

One of the things that I find is still a struggle, and I wonder if you have seen this across the, just, you know, having your access to all the military, the struggle of maintaining a job while being primary caregiver for kids, but also then for neuros spicy kids, which might need they, they might need higher levels of care.

Amanda:

And it's even worse because most military spouses, you're not going to be a professional.'cause moving with all those licenses is a pain in the butt.

Kristen:

Yes.

Amanda:

Um, and I don't think people understand that you can't, you cannot move to a different state and just set up practice.

Kristen:

No, I, so hypothetically, because I'm licensed in Texas, I could move to Colorado, but I couldn't see clients in Colorado. I could see clients in Texas because I'm licensed in Texas, and I set myself up specifically for kind of a military lifestyle. If I needed to move, I could still see clients. It just wouldn't be in person, which I don't know how you do it. I have a hard time with eye contact anyway, which is why virtual is always good. Even even virtual, I still find myself looking away because eye contact's hard.

Amanda:

I, that is one of the whole reasons we started Dance Studio, Kristen, is because teachers were coming out to me going, she's not maintaining eye contact with me. She's being disrespectful. And I'm sitting there going, I'm sorry. Would you like to repeat that?'cause I don't give a.

Kristen:

And it's, you know what though? But still with the idea of eye contact, there's this misconception of like, that it, it physically hurts us and not for me. It doesn't physically hurt, but I have to spend more time saying, okay, I need to look in the eye. It's polite to look in the eye. Did I hear what they're saying? No, because I'm focused on that one eyebrow hair that I saw that I cannot let

Amanda:

on that. There are studies on that.

Kristen:

Of course there are studies on

Amanda:

And the studies are, it's not hurting us, it's that we're not paying attention when we're looking in the eye. You want to take that Lita'cause you look happy,

Leta:

I just do this.

Amanda:

you're just doing that. Uh, but no, you on a regular basis have told teachers that your eyes are not your ears.

Kristen:

That's, yes.

Amanda:

But we have studies now showing. That autistic people, um, I like India, are more likely, she's like, why did I do my hair this way? I don't know.'cause you're just over there doing your hair, autistic people looking you in the eyes or doing what you said. They're thinking, how long have I looked in the eye? Is this getting creepy? Is this getting strange? Did I miss, oh no, I just missed what they're saying. If they're not looking you in the eye.

Kristen:

Well, and it's funny because in a couple of Dr. Temple Grandin's books, she talks about how in studies of the brain, sometimes neuros spicy brains, they actually feel some like visceral reactions

Amanda:

Uh.

Kristen:

when they're looking people in the eye, as opposed to when neurotypicals look people away. Like how they have that of like, oh, that's a rude, that's a thing. And so like they feel it, but it's just flipped.

Amanda:

My microphone just changed. I'm gonna have to get out and get back in'cause I don't want bad audio for this. Lila, you can talk about your hair for two seconds.

Leta:

My

Kristen:

I like that you have one side. Done.

Leta:

I don't

Kristen:

You know what we need to do with your hair?

Leta:

I don't even know why I did this. Why would I talk

Kristen:

you need to put your hair in like a mohawk.

Leta:

anything. Did you not turn on your, um, um, how, um, speaker,

Kristen:

Can you hear me now?

Leta:

um, oh. Oh, now I can hear the stuff. Now she can hear the stuff.

Kristen:

I was saying you should put your hair in like a mohawk where it just goes straight up. I feel like you would touch the ceiling because your hair's so long.

Amanda:

You might be. Yeah, we can look into that at some point in jelling it there. There's nothing saying you can't do a mohawk.

Kristen:

like, what?

Amanda:

No, it's as long as it's one, you can either have it down altogether or in three strands. There's nothing saying you can't

Kristen:

would be

Amanda:

it. Um. No, but the I I thing just drives me bonkers. And that's another one that spouses get told by commands that their kids need to do X, y, stupid Z. And it's like, no, your kid does not need to look your husband's commander in the eyes.

Leta:

Snowflake got snowflake. Snowflake got. Stick into the.

Amanda:

It is massive. We need moisture. And the dog just annoyed her. I know what he did.

Kristen:

That's so funny. Well, so think about it. The idea of they have to look their commander. There's the parents commanders in the eye, and then you move to a new base and that commander has no idea of what your kiddo has been through, has not been through, and you have to go through that whole rigmarole of advocacy all over again.

Amanda:

I am gonna say something that probably is going to shock a lot of our parents. Uh, fun fact, your incoming command or receiving command is supposed to know your EFMP. That is supposed to be something that they are made aware of. They are supposed to have a plan. By time you actually get there, they're supposed to meet you and your, uh, sponsor, the active duty member within a month of you showing up because their job is to support you. It is in the regulations people.

Kristen:

So what I'm hearing from you is these incoming. Spouses who are 18 because we get married when we're 18 in military. Like that's just it. It's so incredible moment, 18, 19, but ones who don't know that they can do this, like these new, new parents at 19 years old, 20 years old.

Amanda:

that might be why the regulations crystal were written the way it was.'cause we thought the problem was more for those young kids.'cause I mean, it's across the, I mean, I don't just work with autism, I work with the cancer kids. I work with the kids who are having issues with eating. We were at one of Jacob's commands and they didn't even know because their kid had to be on prescription formula. Try Prime paid for the prescription formula.

Kristen:

That's amazing.

Amanda:

And they had never, and the doctor was even like, wait, Tricare will pay for this. And I'm like, did you prescribe it? Yes. I don't know what to tell you. Tricare will pay for it. You just have to get the nurse to do it. And Tricare will reimburse them a hundred percent

Kristen:

Okay. So it's just, but it, it, it's added work. It's added steps.

Amanda:

because they weren't getting it through a pharmacy. That was where the added steps were. If they had gotten it through the pharmacy, there would be no added steps.

Kristen:

I am really jealous. We have no snow. We only have sunshine.

Amanda:

Yeah, but you have Bucky's closer than we have it. So

Kristen:

Oh. Nine miles away.

Amanda:

I mean, she would live at Bucky's if it was that close.

Kristen:

I feel like I would live at Bucky's. Just to live at Bucky's. They have everything there.

Amanda:

My husband has said he will never go to Bucky's again because he cannot handle it is too sensory overload for him.

Kristen:

It's pretty sensory overload, but I really like their food, so it's, I can make a beeline for the stuff and then come back out.

Amanda:

Uh, I also w the one time we took him was from, on the Bucky's from the beach in, uh, Pensacola to the main highway back to like Georgia and to

Kristen:

So a really busy Bucky's.

Amanda:

On the day it was raining nonstop.

Kristen:

Okay. I could see why he wouldn't wanna go back in like

Amanda:

Yeah.

Kristen:

it's overstimulating on a day where it's not that chaotic.

Amanda:

And you add all that. And it was, and it was the only gas station on this road from about Pensacola into Auburn.

Kristen:

Oh my gosh. And for a unmasking human that's just, you are feeling all the things all at once.

Amanda:

Oh yeah. And um, he's like, we are, I, I'll just sit in the car from now.

Kristen:

That's, oh my gosh. Um,

Amanda:

But no, I don't think a lot of people know. Like your therapy friend who asked, she can request no PCS. She can

Kristen:

I love that. I love learning that.

Amanda:

fun fact, we priced our dance classes. I know. I'm crazy. We priced them right where I know Tricare pays for them. If it.

Kristen:

perfect.

Amanda:

They won't pay if I ask them to pay as the owner or the CEO of the studio. But if the medical team determines, especially if you can get a behavioral shrink, a neurologist, a developmental ped to sign off on it, which if you are Tricare, you are required as an autistic parent to have that for your child. I don't think most of the medical providers know that. The general prs don't know they're supposed to be sending these kids to the nearest one of those three.

Kristen:

No, I don't know that we have any of those.

Amanda:

Yeah, you're supposed to. Yeah.'cause Tricare does not consider it an autistic thing unless it is sent over by your behavioral shrink,

Kristen:

Oh, okay. So getting into activities, having the request from them can go in and,

Amanda:

they'll pay for it.

Kristen:

oh my gosh, that's really cool.

Amanda:

And if you have the right, you gotta be friends with your general prac and pediatrician. Um, just if you've got a neuro spicy kid, be friends with them. When you go to PCS, they tried to keep us in New Mexico by stating we don't know that she can get the same dance classes where you're sending her in Montgomery. If my husband's commander had even thought about filling out the right paperwork, just because her medical team said she needed dance classes for her autism therapy and she needed an X number of times a week and that was how they were trying to hold her back.'cause the receiving base was like, yeah, no, uh, she can get services in 18 months. That won't be a problem. Right.

Kristen:

Wow.

Amanda:

You are supposed to, as a commander, if any of the commanders are listening, you have the right to stop that and it's not even a compassionate, you just redo the assignment there.

Kristen:

See it's, I really love coming in and talking about military specific things, autism specific things, because not everybody knows how to advocate, how to be an advocate.

Amanda:

And it's such a niche deal that even if you have an advocate coming in from outside the military, they don't know all the, the moment you say, let's read the regulation, is the moment everyone in the room sits up a little straighter going, wait, there's rights on this.

Kristen:

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

And I know my husband absolutely cannot believe that it takes people forever to get EFMP. He got it in 72 hours.

Kristen:

Oh yeah. No, it took us weeks.

Amanda:

He Googled it.

Kristen:

And that's Neuros Spice Brains Neuros. Spice Brains can do the pattern recognition, can do all the things. For the ones who I've got the neuros Spicey brain, but I had no idea where to start. I had no idea where to look.

Amanda:

I was like, Hey, I can take this. It'll take me 30 days'cause I'm good at it. And he went, 30 days sounds really long. We need this done now, Amanda. And then the next thing I know, seven, two hours later, he's like, well, she's also an echo. And I'm like, how the heck did you do that? And he's like, well, I Googled it and told everyone, no, I need the meetings in this order on this day and we're going to all sit down

Kristen:

gosh. That's amazing.

Amanda:

you the papers and we'll just pass it around.

Kristen:

oh my gosh. That, see, I love that.

Amanda:

I'd never thought of getting everyone at the same table and.

Kristen:

No, but that's genius because again, continuity of care.

Amanda:

You are gonna be getting a lot of information about the snowflakes, Kristen, but

Kristen:

Good.

Amanda:

n and then when sh, because we got her EFMP because the, um, Braveheart County wouldn't give my child speech and language therapy because she couldn't speak

Kristen:

What?

Amanda:

Braveheart County, Florida at the time would not provide speech and language therapy to kids until they could speak.

Kristen:

I feel like that would be like the entire crux of needing speech therapy.

Amanda:

You sound exactly like her pediatrician at base was that day when I was like crying, going, I don't know what to do. We both agreed she needed speech, the weirdos at Bero County and she called over and they were like, yeah, no, she doesn't qualify until she can speak. And her pediatrician knowing how to work Tricare.

Kristen:

Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

was like, we're getting her over to the developmental ped. And I'm like, well, okay. So that's six months. Um, 'cause you know how TRICARE works. And she's like, no, it's not. And we had, before I left her office, we had get, she had gotten it through for the referral 'cause she's like, oh no, I'm calling Tricare to get this referral. It's not going through the nurse. And

Kristen:

so it's, it's having people in your corner who are willing to come in and advocate, who are willing to come in and be loud

Amanda:

also

Kristen:

and be pushy.

Amanda:

the people who know how to do it, because I had to explain when we were in Montgomery, I had to work the nurse through it. Here's how you get this referral to this specific spot. And she's like, wait, try Prime. We can refer to a specific provider. Yeah, you can. You just have the doctor has to say there is no other provider that can provide this. Um. She's excited about the snow, but it shouldn't be on the civilian spouse to have to explain how this works.

Kristen:

I, it shouldn't, but so much of it is falling to it. And so, and for anyone who's listening today, and if this hits closer to home, know that there's so many resources you can access. Googling is is a good start.

Amanda:

I had never even, but he like.

Leta:

says. My dad also says Google wants invented to be the use, so just Google everything. Tip doctor stuff, but Google everything else. Tip medical stuff he says That's the only thing you said. Not Google because doctor Google is not the good. Also, just stuff like, not even for y'all.

Kristen:

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

had some within the dance world, dance teachers who they all think they're educators. And I'm like, you have not gone to school for education. Please do not true statement. Uh, well, you know how bad Google is on autism. It,

Kristen:

I still wanna say it's getting better, but.

Amanda:

it gets better if you're googling the papers. But how many people want to or have the inclination to read those papers?

Kristen:

Or even who know that the peoples are out there.

Amanda:

And know which journals.'cause there are some journals that you, we all know, do not read from that journal.

Kristen:

Yeah.

Amanda:

Not really a real journal.

Kristen:

It well, and it's, it's taking what you find on the internet with a grain of salt. Do some research beyond the immediacy of what you find.

Amanda:

And there are plenty of decent journals out there. I mean, I'm sure you're keeping up with a gazillion of the journals.

Kristen:

I just like to read. It's, that's my autism's, my hyper fixation. I like to learn about it. It's super cool.

Amanda:

There's just a couple journals that their peer review happened to be the same people publishing the papers.

Kristen:

Well, you

Amanda:

reaction, and it's not just autism, we have it in all the sciences.

Kristen:

that's, yeah, that's exactly where my brain went, is that, oh, um, this isn't, this isn't just a one sided thing.

Amanda:

Oh no, this is not just a one side thing. We have, um, I can name some of them. Um, bill NI felt so lied to when I found out that guy has no science background.

Kristen:

wait a minute, I'm just learning this. He has no science background.

Amanda:

he has a survey of mechanical engineering. He's not even a mechanical engineer,

Kristen:

Bill Nye the science guy.

Amanda:

has no background in science and all of his papers he has written, he's been the chair of the peer review board for his papers.

Kristen:

I feel like that's just gonna rewrite my childhood right there.

Amanda:

I. So nice a guy you'll never see because mom found that out before you were born and felt so, so nice.

Kristen:

Mom is salty. Mom is salty.

Amanda:

We were at a thing and he flat out told me I didn't have the credentials just because I have a PhD in theoretical physics. And I was like, well, I know I don't probably have the same PhD you have. And he is like, no, I have a bachelor's in mechanical survey of mechanical engineering and for all of our engineering listeners, they don't even consider you an engineer at that point. They consider you good enough to go work on what they designed.

Kristen:

That's so funny.

Amanda:

I told my little sister who's a physical engineer and it about broke her heart. She's like, wait. He is like not even good enough. It's pretty much you can go fix the machine. You are a mechanic.

Kristen:

You know what? That's a segue. I am. We don't have enough time to go down on this day.

Leta:

This is at the one hour.

Amanda:

she is so good at keeping track, but we talked for like six minutes beforehand. So, um, the other thing on your therapist friend is, um, she might able to, if the kid needs soccer, if the kid needs basketball, she may be able to request it from the primary

Kristen:

that. Oh, I like that.

Amanda:

Tricare, try prime. It is an extra step. You do pay, they reimburse you. But it's just like, I'm gonna say something and it's gonna shock a lot of people. It shouldn't, if you cannot get care in your local area and you have to go outside of your local area. Please for the love of God, keep all your receipts

Kristen:

Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

because TRICARE will reimburse you.

Kristen:

Yes.

Amanda:

And that's even for like us. If we have to drive up to Denver'cause it's outside the deal, we will reimburse you mileage. I don't think it's worth it for me because as mileage is so low, but I've heard of families that they're like, yeah, I do. You know how much this plane flight is costing me? Why didn't you submit it to tricare? Your husband or your wife, whoever is the active duty should be really good at submitting stuff like travel vouchers.

Kristen:

Yeah. To even know that they can do that.

Amanda:

I don't think a lot of the provi general care providers know that they can do

Kristen:

I'm pretty certain they don't. So I'm gonna spread that word to everybody.

Amanda:

There's a lot of, let's go to San Antonio for Sam Houston. Um, 'cause it's got the Better medical facility or El Paso for Beaumont. And people are like, I didn't know I could, you know, say I want my money back.

Kristen:

That's amazing.

Amanda:

Um, but yeah. And stick on Tri Prime. I cannot emphasize this enough 'cause the number of parents who, I don't know if you've looked at the, uh, copays for Tri Standard recently

Kristen:

So I'm on standard, kids are on prime.

Amanda:

as well, you probably want them if they're in all the autism therapies, the number of young, young people who, who talk to someone and they're like, oh, I was told to get on Tristan so we could pick our own medical provider. And then. It's not just Gen Z I've known a lot of young millennials and it's just young people.'cause they talk to some, they talk to another young person on post or base who says, but you can't pick your provider on prime. That's a lie. Your doctor can pick your provider for you. Um, but it's 40% for speech therapy right now as a copay.

Kristen:

Okay. Yeah. So coming in and being loud and advocate.

Amanda:

Well, and just stay on prime. Because if it's prime

Kristen:

Yeah.

Amanda:

paid, um, I had someone who went, because you can change. If you have a medical thing, you can change your deal. And they came up and went, I went standard.'cause my kid's on chemo. The copay for chemo is 35%.

Leta:

We are to an hour and three minutes. Yeah, but are you gonna take forever? Yeah.

Amanda:

yeah. But. Just don't go on standard. If your kid needs services

Kristen:

No. Stick with Prime as long as you can.

Amanda:

and you can stick with Prime for a while,

Kristen:

Yeah.

Amanda:

like ever,

Kristen:

Yes.

Amanda:

it's also easier to stop the PCs if you're on prime versus standard.

Kristen:

Oh, that's good to know too. See, I, I love all of this information and where I might not be near a base, I know, uh, clinicians all across the US who are working with people who are near bases, who can use this information and share it.

Amanda:

The difference is Prime is within DHA, so it's within the military standard is considered an insurance. Do not ask me how Standard works'cause we don't deal with it. It's a completely separate thing from tricare.

Leta:

And we are to, uh. Four minutes. If anybody who's autistic who barely has the capacity mentally to go a out where all the podcasts, congratulations to you. You probably watch this sleep since it's so long the dog gets

Amanda:

But we, we just want, I just wanna get a few more Tricare things on because I mean, I feel so terrible'cause providers don't know this. Um, and the key also is figure out who it is. Never your general prac, but there's always a office at your clinic or if you're at the hospital, there's a floor of them who their entire job is to be your advocate their

Kristen:

find that area. Go find your advocates.

Amanda:

They are listed on the directory. No one seems to know they're there. They love it when you show up in their office because no one knows they're there.

Kristen:

Yep.

Amanda:

Um, and they will, they are your advocate. They're, uh, civilian employees of the United States military or they are military personnel themselves. And you have never lived until you've seen a three star general decide he is upset at Tricare.

Kristen:

Oh, that's amazing. That's, oh, yes.

Amanda:

And these guys are buddy buddies with the head of the clinic. They're buddy buddies with the head of the hospital because they work in their job. Even if you're seeing civilian care off base, they can be your advocate for the civilian care off base. They also can come to your EFM or not to your EFMP meetings. They are supposed to come to your EFMP meetings if you remind them that they're there or remember they're there.

Kristen:

Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

They also fun fact can come to your IEP and 5 0 4 meetings

Kristen:

I like that too.

Amanda:

and when they show up, they tend to show up with the JAG guys.

Leta:

We are now to hour.

Amanda:

Just

Leta:

This long. Seriously, you need the metal. Well, that'll just go to a candy store and treat yourself and just get more candy than you probably need for the whole entire year. That will last you until Halloween when you have to probably give

Amanda:

one, one, just a, the other thing that I don't think a lot of people understand is the Army. Of course, it's the Army I. The army is great. The army is wonderful. We love the army, right?

Kristen:

Yeah.

Amanda:

Your, your navy husband definitely loves the army, right?

Kristen:

Loves, loves.

Amanda:

Uh, if you are at a decent sized army post, which aren't they all decent sized army posts, their behavioral shrinks that see the PTSD guys also have autism and other neurodiverse, and you could go, you're we're both older. Uh, you can go do your PTSD while they go see their behavioral shrink.

Kristen:

That's really cool.

Amanda:

Um, I know if we could just get the OTs, the PTs, and the speech and language pathologists on post to

Kristen:

Yep. That we just need everyone there.

Amanda:

Um, but it is, the army has amazing, I say this as. A wife of a Space Force guy, so you can guess how much if you are military. This is hurting me to say, if you can get to them, the Army has the best autism care in the military,

Kristen:

See, that's good to know. That's good to know.

Amanda:

so all you have to do is figure out how to get your spouse near.'cause we've got Leta at Carson. She's not at Peterson. Where Jacob station, she's at the Army Post in town.

Kristen:

See Army, oh my gosh, this is so much fun.

Amanda:

I mean, at least it's not the crayon eaters.

Kristen:

But good. No Marines,

Amanda:

We all love Marines. One of the parents that danced yesterday just died laughing. She's like, does, she's like my husband's navy. I didn't know. Everyone calls 'em crayon eaters.

Kristen:

everybody. It's so funny. It's so, yeah, just the rivalry between the, the military branches.

Amanda:

And, you know, space force, they're all like, what do you guys do you, um, and then when the fire broke out yesterday, our news had to actually say, do not worry. They're evacuating the base except for the GPS guys. They're not evacuating. Your GPS on your phones will still work.

Kristen:

Oh my gosh.

Amanda:

I am like, so the important part here is not that we're evacuating the military, it's, don't worry, the 24 7 commands are not evacuating while the fire's there.

Kristen:

Yep. They can stay and burn

Amanda:

Um, I have a feeling they moved where they were doing stuff.

Leta:

Hour and 10 minutes.

Amanda:

Hopefully,

Leta:

anyone left on.

Amanda:

Kristen, we gotta have, we're gonna have to have you on as a recurring guest, obviously.

Kristen:

I know

Amanda:

Um.

Kristen:

do a different theme every month.

Amanda:

I know 'cause I think next month needs to be, uh, masking. Um, because

Kristen:

Well, it's autism Awareness month too.

Amanda:

I know, and we'll record it in April and I'll put it out in May, but it's

Leta:

Mom, if we get two hours, 11 minutes, we

Amanda:

one will be going out in April.

Leta:

you. Yes, this one will be going out in April. That is the other Dr. Krista that I know. This is my mother. Just,

Amanda:

no, it's not the end,

Leta:

it tooth.

Amanda:

but, so if anyone's got any questions on, uh, masking and stuff, reach out to you. Reach out to us. DMS 'cause we will answer the questions. Um, I think we definitely need to do one. I don't

Kristen:

I think a masking one's important.

Amanda:

Yeah. And I think that leads to all the breakdowns everyone's having.

Kristen:

Mm-hmm.

Amanda:

If someone could just do a few more papers on this.

Kristen:

No kidding. No kidding. I would like to read them.

Amanda:

I do not have the time to do them. I have, but I have a few papers that it's like breakdown and masking. The other one is if anyone would like to do it, was the evolutionary biologist. I will not say what we all think about the evolutionary biologist and their order or place in the pecking order for all of us in the sciences. Right. But they've got a new one saying that, uh, dance is language. Well, new one, it's 2010, but 2010 in the sciences is new. Um, suggesting dance is just a language and that doing dance classes, uh, helps repair language and TBI patients

Kristen:

I know exactly what you're talking about, but yeah, that okay, that's gonna be a thing for another day because.

Amanda:

we need to do, uh, someone needs to do that with.

Leta:

and 12 minutes

Amanda:

Left

Leta:

this.

Amanda:

watching.

Kristen:

anyone's left watching, that means they love us.

Amanda:

Yeah. They love us. And I think Dr. Kristen is so full of information and this one we could do like three or four just on what military things are out there. Dear your commanders, please learn your job.

Kristen:

Or reach out and ask questions because we want to give you the information.

Amanda:

I mean, it would be, or you could Google what your job is with dealing

Kristen:

that too. That too.

Amanda:

uh, because some of this is, but it would be so much easier on Neurodiverse families if commanders knew where their part in it was.

Kristen:

Yep. That's, that's the best takeaway.

Amanda:

the number of times I'm trying to rewrite stuff.'cause when you go to move, your commander has to submit the report that they were supposed to make when you showed up. And the number of times I'm getting a call going, what was this supposed to be three years ago? Two years ago? And if you've changed commanders, that new commander is supposed to come in and have a deal. Also, real quick, active duty. They're supposed to keep an eye on you every month.

Kristen:

I feel like you're giving your kid a stroke.

Amanda:

But thanks Kristen. We love having you on.

Kristen:

Thank you for having me again,

Amanda:

We're gonna have you, we'll have you on next month, uh, and from she, she's had a week and she was looking so forward to having you on, so thanks for coming on. You were the highlight of her week.

Kristen:

It's awesome. And now you've got snow.

Amanda:

Yes, we have. It is piling up, so let's hope it, because last I heard all three fires were still going here in town.

Kristen:

Geez Louise. Well, hopefully the snow puts out the

Amanda:

Oh yes, and we will see you in a month probably

Kristen:

Bye.

Leta:

Okay, well thank you for watching the PIT podcast and please subscribe and also look at the Adorable Don't Watch Subscribe for. And also please like, and if you'll, if you'll any of our new podcast and also you see the Adorable Don, you Like It.

People on this episode

Contributor

Amanda Trisdale

Host
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Leta Rundell

Host