Stories Sustain Us #35 – Clean Flexibility and the Clean Energy Transition

Summary
In this conversation, Kostantsa Rangelova shares her journey from growing up in Sofia, Bulgaria, through her education in France, to her current role at Ember, a global think tank focused on energy and climate policy. She discusses the impact of her childhood experiences during Bulgaria's transition from communism, her passion for storytelling, and how her career evolved from journalism to energy policy. Kostantsa emphasizes the importance of understanding the geopolitical aspects of energy and the role of think tanks in shaping policy for a sustainable future. She discusses the importance of data-driven energy policy and the concept of clean flexibility in the energy transition, and emphasizes the role of storage solutions, particularly batteries, in ensuring a reliable and clean energy supply. Rangelova also highlights the need for policy changes to facilitate this transition and the empowerment of consumers through demand flexibility. The discussion concludes with a hopeful vision for a sustainable future where clean energy is accessible and beneficial for all.

About the Guest
Kostantsa Rangelova joined the Ember Global Insights Team to help spearhead the global green electricity transition through insightful data-led analysis. Kostantsa brings her in-depth expertise on global energy markets and her policy advocacy experience to foster a fact-based international public debate about the fast-changing global electricity transition.

Show Notes
Ember: https://ember-energy.org/
Clean Flexibility Report: https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/clean-flexibility-is-the-brain-managing-the-clean-power-system/ 

Takeaways
•Kostantsa's childhood experiences during the 90s shaped her interest in energy.
•She transitioned from journalism aspirations to energy policy after a pivotal class.
•Kostantsa emphasizes the importance of adaptability in uncertain times.
•Her grandfather's adventurous spirit inspired her to explore beyond Bulgaria.
•Energy is not just a commodity; it's deeply intertwined with geopolitics.
•At Ember, data is made accessible to promote informed decision-making.
•Think tanks play a crucial role in analyzing and shaping energy policies.
•Storytelling is essential in making complex data relatable and understandable.  The focus is on data and policy in energy transition.
•Clean flexibility ensures electricity is available even when renewable sources are not producing.
•Batteries are crucial for energy storage and transition.
•Demand flexibility allows consumers to control their energy use and costs.
•Policymakers need to understand clean flexibility to support the energy transition.
•Technological innovation is driving the new energy revolution.
•Consumer empowerment is key to a successful energy transition.
•The energy transition is unstoppable and gaining momentum globally.
•Understanding the energy system can lead to better consumer choices.
•A sustainable future is possible with clean en

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Transcript

Steven 
What happens when the demand for renewable electricity surges, but the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining? The future of renewable energy hinges on clean flexibility, the ability to store and distribute renewable power efficiently. From batteries to smarter energy policies, innovation is driving a new era of sustainability. But how do we ensure that policymakers, businesses, and everyday consumers understand these crucial shifts?

Hey everybody, I'm your host, Steven Schauer, and welcome to Stories Sustain Us. This is a podcast where we explore the incredible stories of people who are shaping a more sustainable world. Today we're diving into the complex and ever-evolving world of clean energy with a remarkable guest who has dedicated her career to making energy data accessible, understandable, and actionable. In this episode, I sit down with Kostantsa Rangelova.

an expert in global energy markets, and a passionate advocate for informed decision-making in the clean energy transition. Her journey began in Bulgaria, where her childhood experiences in the 90s sparked an early interest in energy. What started as a dream of becoming a journalist transformed into a career in energy policy after a pivotal college class changed her perspective.

Living in France further broadened her worldview, reinforcing her belief in adaptability and exploration, values instilled in her by her adventurous grandfather. Today at Ember, she works to demystify energy policy, using data-driven insights to push for a cleaner, more flexible, and more sustainable future. From geopolitics to personal consumer choices, we'll discuss why energy is more than just a commodity.

It's a dynamic force shaping the world around us. Kostantsa will break down the role of think tanks and policy making, the importance of clean flexibility in our power grids, and why technological innovation and consumer empowerment are the keys to an unstoppable clean energy transition. Kostantsa Rangelova is a leading voice in energy policy analysis, working with Ember's Global Insights team to accelerate the shift to green electricity.

With extensive experience in global energy markets, she champions data-led solutions to foster informed public debate on the fast-changing energy landscape. Before joining EMBER, she worked as a senior energy and climate analyst at the Center for the Study of Democracy, a European public policy institute, and led the downstream research team at JBC Energy, an independent energy market research center in Vienna.

The transition to clean energy isn't a question of if, it's happening right now. But for it to succeed, we need data, policy, and people working together to make informed choices. So how do we bridge the gap between complex data and real world action? Let's find out as we dive into this insightful conversation with Kostantsa Rangelova here on Stories Sustain Us, where we're inspiring action through the power of storytelling.

Steven 
All right, hey, Kostantsa, how are you? Welcome to Stories Sustain Us.

Kostantsa Rangelova (00:05)
Hello, I'm great. Thank you, Steven, and thank you for having me.

Steven 
Well, I'm so honored and grateful that you came on the show. Thank you for accepting the invitation. And we were chatting before the recording started and I'm here in Seattle. It's early in the morning for me and it's early evening for you in what part of Bulgaria I think you said you were in.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
capital city Sofia. So yeah, already wrapping up the day.

Steven
Nice,

Yeah, well thank you for taking some time to join me. I'm looking forward to learning more about clean flexibility and your work at Ember, but let's learn a little bit more about you first. So tell us your story. Where did you grow up and how did you, what was your journey to get to working on clean energy solutions for us and for the planet?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Okay.

Yeah, I grew up here in Sofia, Bulgaria, but it took me a little bit of time to actually get back here. So it was a very big circle I made before coming back here. So I grew up in Sofia and when I was 18, I moved to France where I did my university studies. I did political science as a bachelor's and then energy policy and economics as a master. So already by then I was very much an energy nerd.

Steven 
Yeah?

Kostantsa Rangelova
I did a few internships in France in power companies like EDF and Urano. And then I moved to Vienna for my first real life job, which was market analysis on a global level. So I was working lots and lots with energy companies across the world, advising them on energy prices, supply, demand, different trends. And this got on until about

Steven 
Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
of it and when that hit basically it was a major wake-up call about you know priorities and family and it was quite stressful to be separated from my family for such an extended period of time I couldn't travel back very easily for a very long period of time and in this moment of reflection I was like okay let's think about what I want to do with my life further on

Steven 
Okay

Sure, sure, Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
And I started a transition to the NGO sector. So I joined a local think tank here in Sofia called Center for the Study of Democracy. Started working on energy and climate policy here in the context of Central and Eastern Europe. And this was around 2021. And basically in 2023, I decided I wanted to tackle global questions again and bigger picture.

which is why I joined EMBER, which is a global think tank also working on energy and climate.

Steven 
wonderful synopsis of your full circle journey. Let me take you back to the beginning a little bit and ask you what was it like growing up in Sofia? you know, family is clearly really important to you. So, you know, do you have siblings and you know, what was your childhood like a little bit? know, what was it like growing up for you?

Kostantsa Rangelova
Yeah, it was interesting because I'm a 90s kid and when I was growing up Bulgaria had just transitioned from communism to a democracy so the 90s were particularly interesting in Bulgaria and actually it's very much related to why I found electricity to be such a fascinating thing and such a magical thing because

Steven 
Wow. Yeah, yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
In the early 90s when I was a kid, still had power cuts and power shortages quite often. So we did have candles for when the electricity went out in the evening and you needed the candles to get the light. So it was very interesting and challenging, but also quite fun because we didn't have the digital technologies that people grow up with today. So, yeah, but at the same time, it was really nice to then

Steven 
Sure.

Yeah. Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
move away from Bulgaria and step into a whole different way of thinking when I moved to France. I also spent a year in Russia, very, very international, I would say, and it has been very enriching. But like going back to your roots here in Sofia has always been very, close to my heart. And like being able to come back to where it all started has been super important.

Steven 
Yeah, yeah, it's, know, growing up in the in the States and, I was, you know, late teenager, early 20s in the late 80s and early 90s, you know, finishing my high school and in my university years, you know, when the collapse of the Soviet Union happened and, you know, watching it from here is one thing, you know, seeing it on the news and.

You know, I remember as a young person, the hope that I was experiencing of like, maybe the world is heading a better direction, a more peaceful direction. I can imagine there was a lot of turmoil and uncertainty for you and your family being in the transition. Am I imagining the right?

story or, know, can you talk a little bit more about that? Cause that just seems so fascinating to speak with someone who was experiencing that transition, not just, you know, me watching it, but you were in it, you know.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's a very uncertain time with lots of things changing all the time. Very exciting things happening on the news all the time. So you have to constantly adapt, but at the same time live your life and feel some sort of normality. But it also trains you to be very adaptive to change because this was a very...

dynamic time, like policies would change or the political regime would change or the economic situation would change very rapidly. Like there was, there were periods with, as I said, like power shortages, there were periods of like very accelerated growth where people were suddenly getting lots of, you know, purchasing power, improving their standard of living. So there's lots of back and forth and adapting to all of these changes really makes you adaptable, but also very hopeful about

Basically seeing how fast things can change reassures you that this can continue happening and that with the right things done from your side, you can also achieve what you're hoping for. And I think from a family perspective, this was also why I had the courage to like go to a whole different country, completely alone, just being hopeful that this would bring something new and something better. And this is how it happened actually.

Steven 
Yeah. Were you the first of your family to venture out of Bulgaria to try something new like that? Or did you have other older siblings that did it first? Because it sounds very courageous to start something new like that in such a time of transition for your country.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, I am the oldest of three. So I was the first. But I had a very good example from my grandfather who used to work a lot in transport. So he would travel delivering fruits and vegetables across Europe from Bulgaria. So he had already traveled lots, even during the communist times. He would travel all the way to Vienna or to Stockholm.

Steven 
Okay?

Okay.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
and he had seen so much during that time. So this adventurous side of me, I this is where it comes from.

Steven 
Yeah, so even during that time of Soviet domination, was going into Western countries and bringing back stories to you about what it was like in Stockholm.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, by the time I was born he had already started a business here in Bulgaria. But I grew up with his stories about all these journeys that happened during that time.

Steven 
Yeah.

Yeah, wow.

Yeah, it sounds like an important part of your childhood and that connection to him and his story. So thank you for telling me that. Thank you for sharing that story. I appreciate it. what was growing up in Bulgaria, what were your interests? You obviously eventually got into energy and you talked about that being

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, absolutely.

Steven
part of your childhood with the candles and the loss of power and things of that. But did you know at an early age that's kind of what you wanted to do or what were you interested in growing up?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
When I was a kid, I wanted to be a writer. And I think this is kind of what I'm still doing because even now, like I work a lot with data, but I'm trying to bring that data to life with an actual story and try to tell the story that the data has. So yeah, my dream was to become a writer, a storyteller. And even in Bulgaria, we have this tradition like when...

Steven 
Yeah

Yeah.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
the baby first starts walking, it is given like a set of items. Basically, it's supposed to walk to a table with lots of items and whatever he picks up, would define what career path it will be on. And I picked up my favorite book.

Steven 
yeah?

Yeah, nice,

nice. So you did know at an early age. Yeah. And I love your connection to what you're doing today as also storytelling. I that's really the purpose of this show is I believe in the power of data and the power of facts and figures. But we need stories.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah.

Steven 
for people to understand that data. We need to be able to take all of, because not everybody, as you said, is an energy nerd, not everybody's gonna be as deeply immersed into the data as you are. So how do you get that data into someone else's mind and so that they can understand it and appreciate it and do something positive with it? It's through a story. So I love that connection that you've made in your life for...

acknowledging you are a writer, are a storyteller, even though you deal with data every day. That to me is beautiful. I love that.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah,

absolutely. And data can be really fascinating for the right person and like making it speak to people, especially with graphical representations. I think this is very important because sometimes data can sound like, very daunting and dry, but at the same time for the person who really lives with it, there is a story to tell. You just have to bring it to life and like show it and like paint a picture to people.

Steven 
Absolutely.

Yeah, that's brilliant. I love that. and I know we'll, in a few more minutes, we'll get into your storytelling about clean flexibility, but I love that part of your history, because that's really to me telling about your career path. So.

So you moved to France then and started kind of your university life there. What was that like for you? Was that the first time you'd really been outside of Sofia and outside of Bulgaria?

Kostantsa Rangelova
I had traveled like tourist style like for a few days like visiting different countries with my family but I had never like ventured out completely alone so it was super scary I even remember basically I took a bus from Sofia to

Steven 
Sure.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
to France, which took like more than 20 hours. And I had two extremely large suitcases and I almost got lost at the train station and I had to find my dorm and I had to completely switch from Bulgarian to French for the first time because I studied French in high school. And then starting to actually speak that on a daily basis with everyone was pretty challenging, but it was also very exciting. And I think this is something that is better and easier done

Steven 
Yeah.

boy.

Sure.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
you're young and when you're not too scared because I think that at my age now I would be a lot more scared knowing what I would what would happen to me and what to expect like at that age you're more hopeful and you're much more courageous in terms of like you're like okay let's wing it whatever happens

Steven 
Sure. Yeah, yeah,

you have that invincible confidence of I'm young and I can do it. and you moved, did you say Paris or what part of France did you go to? Dijon, okay. Yes.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, I was in Dijon first, which you might know from mustard, like Dijon mustard,

yeah. And that was pretty much what was most exciting about this relatively provincial city in France. But it was actually really, really beautiful. I spent two years there and I met lots of very, very interesting people because the university was very focused on bringing in international students. And there were lots of people from all across Europe and even

beyond. So meeting all these different people was really enriching. So it was really fun, even though Dijon didn't have much of a nightlife. It was quite exciting.

Steven 
Sure.

Yeah, well just that experience, like you said, of meeting everybody from across Europe is, I'm sure, very expansive to your young mind and help you get that global perspective that you have now in your career. So that's fantastic. And you said it was political science you were studying at the time? Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah, political

science, which was mostly about like constitutional law, a little bit about economics, a little bit about statistics. So very, very random, but very enriching things, I would say.

Steven 
Yeah.

Sure. Did you have an idea at that young age of what you thought you might be doing in the future? Because I know for, you our stories, we evolve, we change, we grow, we think we're going to do this, but we end up doing that. So did you think you were going down a particular direction?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
When I chose political science, it was because I wanted to be a journalist, which was like in the same direction as like storyteller, writer kind of thing. I was like, okay, I want to be a journalist. I want to come back to Bulgaria and be a journalist here.

Steven 
Sure you're righting. Yeah.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
But then, like in my second year in that political science journey, I had a class on energy diplomacy. And we had this really fascinating teacher that was telling us about these gas and oil pipelines and how they connect to energy security and geopolitics. And I got super excited about that. And in the third year, basically the bachelor's degree had three years. In the third year, we were supposed to go abroad.

Steven 
Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
either to do an internship or an exchange year somewhere. And I was like, where is the most exciting thing for energy from a geopolitical perspective? And I was like, let's go to Russia. So yeah, so I went to St. Petersburg and took lots of energy related classes there as well. And from that point onward, I was like, okay, energy nerd, through and through.

Steven 
Russia, sure, yeah, absolutely.

Yeah,

perfect. And let me tell you what I'm what I'm thinking and make sure that I'm I'm thinking the correct thing. I was thinking Russia, too, and you're like, what is the most kind of kind of important place? And what I'm imagining, why that was and still is such an important, you know, geopolitical place with regards to energy is is as I understand it, you know, the oil and gas that's, you know,

produced in Russia, they're obviously the pipelines that are running across Europe and feeding power and energy to Germany and to France and to other countries. So you have these pipelines going across multiple countries with the energy source originating in Russia. We're in a time still where Russia and the West doesn't always maybe see eye to eye to say it politely.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
year.

Oh yeah,

and also like the context now is so much different than when I left. Like when I went to Russia, was I think 2012, 2013. So it was even before Crimea happened. And things were still pretty calm and people were talking about Nord Stream and gas from Russia in a very, very positive context mostly. So how the tides have changed since then, I would say.

Steven 
sure. Okay. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah

Sure, because

Crimea, if I remember correctly, that happened in 2014, if I'm remembering my timeline correctly. So, yeah, that I'm, and then obviously with all of the war and troubles in Ukraine and everything, it's only exacerbated the challenges, I'm sure, with the relationships between European countries and Russia. Can't even get into the, my nations.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah.

yeah.

Yeah, yeah,

absolutely. It's a very hard topic. But what I do remember from that time is that when I was doing energy classes in there, most of what they teach you is about how energy is geopolitics. And this was in such a big contrast to what the official political narrative was like. It's just business. But no, it's not.

Steven 
Yeah, changing perspectives.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's such a great insight. And could you say that again, just to make sure the audience heard that? Because I think what you just said is really, really important about that energy is geopolitics. Yeah. Yeah, that's, think, such a crucial bit of information that I don't know the average person always thinks about. Because I just like, just want to make sure.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, mean energy is political. Yeah, it's never just business. Energy is political.

Steven 
the light turns on when I flip the switch on, they don't really think about all the geopolitical infighting that's taking place to make sure we have enough, whoever, wherever you are located. So.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah,

and it makes you think about how crucial it is. Like, I just think back about the candles we had and like how there were periods of time where power would go out and you didn't have an alternative and like you really understand how crucial that is and that it should never be taken for a given.

Steven 
Yeah, wow, that is such a powerful personal history that you have and an understanding of that that I think a lot of people in the United States may take that take energy for granted and not have that that appreciation that you do for it. So thank you for kind of.

bringing that to our attention, because I think that's very powerful and important piece of information. So your 2014, 2015 time frame, is that when you moved to Vienna or I'm forgetting the timeline?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

No, that was the last year of my bachelor's. So from then I moved to Paris where I did my master's degree and I stayed there until 2016. So doing two years of my master's and then one year of working at different power companies in France. And after that I moved back to, like I moved to Vienna because I was actually very disappointed with Paris. I didn't really like living there. So I was like, where should I go next?

Steven 
Paris, that's right. Yeah.

Yeah.

Vienna.

Okay.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
That sounds nice.

Steven 
Yeah, please tell me it was because it's on our list of places to visit.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Paris is magical to visit as a tourist. And I did visit it. Yeah, absolutely.

Steven 
Yeah, we've been to Paris for our honeymoon, but we want to go to Vienna for another

vacation.

Kostantsa Rangelova
When I was in high school, there was this competition where the prize was a trip to Paris for a week. basically, I fell in love with Paris during that one week. So I won the competition, went to Paris, and I was like, oh my God, I want to study in France. I want to go to Paris. And then when I actually started living there, I was like, oh no. Very dirty, very dangerous.

Steven 
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Hahaha

Yeah, it's a big, big giant city. Yeah. We we want to visit Vienna one of these days. We just a little side trip here. My wife and I got married about 15 years ago and our honeymoon was in Munich and Salzburg and Paris was our little almost two week kind of European honeymoon.

I love Munich. I think it's a wonderful city and Salzburg is just so beautiful and wonderful with the fortress on the hill and the kind of the old feel of the city. And Paris did it. We're glad we did it. there's more we'd like to go back and see. I got the sense that even in our short time, was like, yeah, this is kind of a city. Beautiful and lovely and so much to do.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, you're more perceptive than me when I was in high school

then.

Steven 
Yeah.

So, but yeah, we want to go. We're fans of the painter Gustav Klemp and he's got some of his work in Vienna and we'd love to go see that. But enough about me and why I want to go to Vienna. so tell me about. Yeah. So tell me about your time in Vienna. Tell me, tell me why it's lovely and what you did there.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
No, Vienna is lovely.

Yeah, it's a very livable city. I Vienna has been rated like best city to live in in Europe or in the world even, like for many years in a row. And it's very green, very well organized, like public transport is so smooth, like you don't need a car.

Steven 
Yeah.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Life is a very good balance between a relatively large city with a good nightlife but at the same time is not super dangerous or super big like Paris is. So I think it was a very very good balance between all these things and it was also much closer to Bulgaria so trips back home were also much easier. I could do them more often as well.

Steven 
Yeah.

Sure, nice.

Yeah, that makes sense. So, and what were you, the work you were doing, is that was one of the think tanks that you had worked at, or was you still in the private sector in?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
No, was a consultancy.

Yeah, it was a consultancy. So it was in the private sector, business analysis, market analysis for energy companies. So it was also very much focused on oil prices or gas prices, power prices, things like that. very...

interesting in terms of it involved lots of travel because working with energy companies across the world means that you also get to visit them, talk to the people who work there, explain to them some different trends, like discuss these trends with them, get some insight back. So it was very exciting but it was not as rewarding as working for I think thank yous.

Steven 
Yeah. So tell me a little bit about that. You left then Vienna because of COVID and eventually wanted to get home and you wound up at a kind of a Bulgarian think tank before you wound up at Ember, the more global think tank. So what is life like at a think tank for someone who may not know? They've heard that term and they know think tanks exist. What do you do at a think tank? What's the kind of, you know, a daily work for you?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, it really depends on how, because...

I would say that it's very different in this Bulgarian think tank compared to Ember. And I think size has to some extent due to it. But I would say that a lot of it is about thinking about what kind of impact you want to achieve and thinking about different policy issues first and thinking about impact first. Because when you're doing business analysis in the private sector, it's about what is going to bring money to companies, what should companies know to increase their profits.

Steven 
Yeah, your return on investment.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
And

when you work in a think tank, you're thinking about what needs to change and how do we change it. And it basically is about analyzing...

different policies and trying to understand why they work or they don't work, trying to see, can these policies be done better in this country? Can we transfer them? Things like that. So it's very different in terms of like topics as well. It's very diverse because the things that you want to work on really much depend on what's going on policy wise. And it's very reactive as well. So for example, if

suddenly something becomes a very hot topic in Bulgaria, for example, you have to look at that with a clear eye and provide an alternative voice that basically says that, okay, politicians are saying that, but they have an agenda, they are thinking about something. And then you have, as an independent thinker, you can say, okay, objectively, this is how this policy is being done here and here and here, and the Bulgarian context is this.

Steven 
Sure.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
and then this is how we need to change it to make life better. So I would say this is how it's like. It's about identifying issues and trying to solve them with an independent perspective.

Steven
Nice.

Yeah, thank you for that explanation, because I'm sure most people have heard of a think tank, but they might not know what happens there. I appreciate that. It makes a lot of sense. So tell me. Oh, go ahead.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah,

sorry, I was just going to say like, there are lots of parallels in terms of like, what you do. when I was in the private sector, I would write reports as well. So basically, you write a report that explains things, and then you write them for your audience. But then the reports in the audience are completely different when you're in the private sector and when you're when you're in a think tank.

Steven 
Sure, and I like that explanation of, you know, private sector. Obviously, you're trying to drive revenue, return on investment, you know, trying to make sure that shareholders are, you know, making their money or whatnot. But it sounds like in the think tank, you're thinking more broadly about, you know, social, political context and policy and how you can help, how your ideas and your reports can help shape.

the future direction of society, whether it's Bulgaria or the globe, you're really trying to think of policy positions that you can share then with those in power who can, you can convince them, influence them that your idea is the right way to go and then they have the ability to enact a new policy or change something based upon your studies and your reporting. So, am I telling that correctly?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And also it's very different like when you think about, for example, what Ember is doing. So we are collecting lots and lots of data about power generation in different countries or electricity demand. So all of these data is freely available. So you provide it and you want people to go and look and you want as many people as possible to have access to this and to easily look and check and see what's going on. And when you're doing this in the private sector, it's completely opposite. So basically your clients have to

pay for you to give them the data and the insight that this is hidden and behind paywalls and you want this like it's the perspective of as little people as possible have to know and you share as little as possible with the general public and it's only a few eyes that actually have access to the data.

Steven 
Sure, that makes sense.

Yeah, that's also, I think, an important distinction. So thank you for clarifying that too. And that makes, you know, obviously a lot of sense from a private business. They don't want to share their data with competitors or others. So that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. So tell me about life at Ember. Tell me about what it is that you, what is Ember and what is it that you do there?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Yeah, Ember is an amazing place to work, both in terms of like the energy and the people who work there, but also in terms of like access to this amazing data that team is collecting. So basically it's an energy think tank with a global focus.

the focus is very strongly on data and policy. And we have a whole team dealing with collecting, curating all this data and then lots and lots of analysts that actually trying to bring the data to life and tell the story behind the data and a whole team that tries to do like beautiful visualizations that show the data as clearly as possible and trying to really bring forward these messages that the text is also trying to explain in a story. So

Steven 
Yeah, yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
So yeah, and we have several focuses. So we have European teams working on European energy policy, but also we have teams in Asia doing local policies there. And we also have...

a global perspectives team, which I'm actually part of, which is trying to bring everything together and try to look at the big picture about where the world is going in terms of the energy transition, because this is essentially what we are trying to do. So the world is currently going from a past where we just burn fossil fuels to provide our energy into an electrified, clean power.

clean energy system and then trying to do that as efficiently as possible, as beneficial, making sure that all these opportunities are being, you know, harnessed by people. And doing that by providing this data freely available to everyone and trying ourselves to analyze this data and bring forward the key messages like looking at this data on a daily basis and seeing like, okay, what's going on? Where's the world going? Where is it going fast?

Why is it going faster here and not there? What is making the change? What is driving this? And can this be replicated elsewhere? This is the questions we're trying to answer. yeah.

Steven 
Big questions, those are particularly,

all the teams, but your team on the global scale, these are big important questions. I've stumbled upon your work, I look through news services and all kinds of different sources to find stories that are fascinating to me that I can then go, I'll invite this person on the show. That's how I came across your work. I saw an article about...

clean flexibility report that I believe you were one of the key authors of and I read the report and it was it made a lot of sense to me and it was yes technical beyond you know some of my understanding of energy but it was still it it just resonated with me of like this this makes sense this is a direction we should be going in so

Kostantsa Rangelova 
This is

really good to hear, thank you.

Steven 
Yeah,

well, thank you for your work and thank you for accepting the invitation because I wanted to know more about it. So tell me and tell the audience what is clean flexibility and what is kind of the basis of this idea that you had in this report.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, absolutely. So clean flexibility is how you make sure.

that electricity is clean, not just in the sunny and windy hours. And it is a solution to what you would call a problem. Because when you talk to lots of the naysayers about the energy transition, like when you talk about wind and solar energy, they would tell you, but the sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow, as if this is like a big mystery being revealed. Like, OK, we didn't think about that.

but.

Basically, clean flexibility is how you make sure that you still have electricity even when the sun is not shining and when the wind is not blowing. And there are different ways of doing that. And the way you can kind of explain it is that if you understand the energy system, especially the power system as an organism, wind and solar would be the heart because they're the main sources that are currently growing. They're providing all of the growth in clean electricity globally. And they're pumping

this energy into it, but at the same time you also need a brain and clean flexibility is the brain that makes sure that the whole system keeps working and that all of this clean electricity is being distributed when it's needed and that it doesn't break down.

Steven 
Yeah.

I love that analogy and that makes, helps me and hopefully helps others kind of understand this. And I think there in the report, there were kind of like nine different tools that are used by this brain in that analogy that can then help regulate and manage the energy produced by the heart.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah.

Absolutely.

Steven 
So that to make sure that that it's all of that energy is getting to where it needs to be regardless of the you know clouds or the the wind so Can you talk a little bit about what those tools are and first did I if I captured that right if I didn't please correct me but if but

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. No, no, no.

This is like you understood that perfectly. This is exactly how it is. So you have the heart and you have the brain. And then the brain has these nine tools about how it does it. Because the thing is, when you have electricity, you basically...

have to match supply and demand perfectly at all times, otherwise you're going to have a power cut, which means that at all times supply needs to match demand. And this is

seems like it's difficult to do when the sun stops shining and the wind stops blowing, but there are different ways that you can actually make sure that these two match and this is what the brain is doing. So the first thing is that you can store the electricity and you can do that in different ways, but basically when there is more than you need, you put it in storage and then when there is less than you need, you take it out of the storage and this is how you balance it out. The other way is to do

Steven 
Right.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
some shifting of the demand and then basically making sure that you consume a little bit less when there is not enough and then when there is a very big abundance you try to concentrate all of that consumption in that period when there is more sun and more wind.

Steven 
Right.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
There is also the sharing aspect of it because you have different electricity systems that can be interconnected. And in certain parts of the world it might be sunny and windy, but in other parts of the world it's not as sunny and windy and you can transfer electricity between these places or there are different demand patterns. So there could be very high demand in one place, not as much in another place and you're trying to share that across space, not just across time.

And finally there is the supply side that can also be adjusted.

to make sure that it matches better demand. And there are two ways to do it. So there's the fossil fuel plants that we currently have. So this is how currently the system works is that when the sun is not shining, you turn on the coal power plant. When it stops shining, when it starts shining, you turn it off. And then you try this like almost like an impossible game of like following that. And then the problem is that in current systems that have very little wind and solar,

Steven 
You can turn it down, yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
This is not as challenging but the more more wind and solar you have the more challenging it becomes to do this like following and lots of power plants can actually not do it properly because they have some limits as to how much they can go down how much they can go back up and Making sure that they're flexible enough to do it while wind and solar keep growing is like in the early stages is very important and Also making sure that you know wind and solar when there's too much

Steven 
that yeah.

Right. Right.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
that you can sometimes turn it down when this risks, you know, threatening the system stability.

Steven 
So, and that also makes sense. Obviously with a coal power plant or a natural gas power plant, they don't have just on and off switches that, these are big industrial places that.

They take time to power up to full capacity and take time to power down. And as you said, they can't necessarily fully power down because, you know, then the restarting, the rebooting, if you will, is incredibly challenging. So that is a complicated dance during this transition time.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah,

yeah, absolutely. And I just wanted to say that basically as clean flexibility and as the energy transition advances, this like...

complicated dance is actually coming to an end. So basically clean flexibility is how you move away from this in a gradual matter and you move into something a lot more efficient where you have all of these other solutions like storage and like shifting across time and adjusting demand being enough to make sure that you don't need these coal power plants and gas power plants to just power up and down and just go on and off all the time.

Steven 
You're right. I like... yeah.

Right, so is, to me, the storage and the shifting and the sharing and the supplying those four different aspects of the tools, is there one of those, I they all need to be there, they all need to be functioning and working at capacity, is there one of those tools that...

is lacking that we collectively as humanity needs to put a little bit more research into or effort in improving. So is there a place where there's still growth potential? And I'm imagining storage as a place that still needs some work, but I don't know if that's a correct assumption.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah,

so storage is actually one of the most promising new technological solutions that have come and become a real game changer, especially for solar. And when we say storage, there's all kinds of different ways of storing electricity and different tools. Because when you say store electricity, there are actually different tools within that storage subsets that help you store.

Steven
Sure, it's not just batteries.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, exactly. Batteries are the game changer because there's different ways of storing electricity, including like you can pump water up a reservoir and then release it back. And this is also storage, but it's limited geographically. Like you can't build such a thing everywhere, but with batteries, you can actually install them anywhere because it's a modular solution and modularity like wind and solar. This is what makes them game changers because you don't depend on geographical conditions or

Steven 
create hydro. Yeah.

Sure.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
fuel supply, you just build a manufactured good, you place and you can place it anywhere and scale it up very, very fast. And with batteries, it's really a game changer because they are super fast in terms of response. They're even faster than they're much faster than fossil plants, for example, in them, like how fast they can respond to changes in supply or demand. And also they have very limited losses, like almost no energy is lost in between like the charging and

Steven
Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
the discharging and they can scale up super fast. And for batteries...

like you're seeing how developments in terms of innovation is really changing the game in terms of like they're becoming cheaper and cheaper, easier to produce, which means that they can scale up faster. And it's this virtual circle where the technology needs an initial push to start developing. But once it reaches this like virtual circle where the

the deployment makes the technology cheaper because we learn how to make it more efficient and we make more and more and more. And then when it becomes cheaper, it gets deployed even more. And this helps it further reduce costs and then so on and so on. And batteries have already reached this stage, especially for, yeah, they have like you have so many markets that have already deployed so much batteries. Like for example, California in the US, this is like one of the best examples of like large

Steven 
Yeah. Yep. Yeah.

We have already. That's great.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
scale battery deployment where already in April 2024, batteries were the biggest source in terms of like.

producing, like giving the most energy to the grid in the evening when the demand is highest. So they're even producing, they were like giving back more to the grid than gas power plants were producing, more than any other energy source. And they basically can take around a third of the solar output in the middle of the day and then transfer that to the evening, which really is a game changer because it means that when it's super sunny in the middle of the day, you might, you can take a

Steven 
Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
very big chunk of that and just place it in the evening when the sun has already set and even through the night. And this is really huge. And you have all these kinds of very interesting projects that are already popping up. For example, in the Middle East, there is this company that is currently building a large solar power plant with a battery next to it. And it will be providing one gigawatt, which is like huge amounts of energy on a constant level. So basically 24 seven.

Steven 
Right.

Right.

Kostantsa Rangelova
constant supply from solar with the battery.

Steven 
Yeah, well, that's exciting. I hadn't heard or learned yet that battery usage has gotten to that tipping point. I know solar and wind power have gotten to that tipping point where it's actually now cheaper to produce energy with solar and wind than it is for fossil fuel in most cases. But that battery technology, that is a game changer because that

That's wonderful news, that's exciting news. So thank you for enlightening me on that, because I didn't know we were that, I know advances are constantly being made with batteries, but I didn't realize there was tangible, successful evidence of how this can be deployed en masse to move more and more towards a clean energy system. So that's exciting.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely. mean, batteries have already reached the stage where they're super cheap and they can make a very big difference and they're being deployed at scale, like in different markets, like in Europe, in the US, in China.

The thing that could be stopping batteries from deploying in the market is no longer the cost of the battery, but it's rather the policy and how the market works, so that allowing the battery to be able to participate and to be able to provide all of these benefits. So basically opening up the market and providing these opportunities will create this virtual circle in other markets in the world as well. But already, like the decline in costs

Steven 
Yeah.

Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
costs in just the last few years in terms of what has happened to batteries has been so tremendous that it's basically going on this very steep curve in terms of deployment. And this is just the beginning. As I said, this is a true game changer and more and more markets are starting to pick up on this opportunity that batteries offer, especially together with solar.

Steven 
It's wonderful. Yeah.

Yeah, that's super exciting in a world full of not always good news. That sounds like it's some really positive news. And it kind of gives me, the next question I wanted to ask you kind of came out of what you were just talking about. Markets, they're created by man, they're created by policy, right? These are not natural, like gravity, they exist because we created them.

So with your expertise and your knowledge, what are the top three priorities or policy suggestions you would make to those in charge of politics and policy to help facilitate this transition? What do you think that our elected officials should be doing or we should be demanding that they do if they're not? What's your suggestions?

Kostantsa Rangelova
I would say that thinking about clean flexibility is very important because for a lot of policymakers and for a lot of people, like...

This is not even considered as a concept. Like they don't even understand what this is. For them, they're still living in the world where you just turn off on and off like the coal and gas power plants and shifting your mindset to this whole new toolbox of tools that you can use to enable like a fully clean power system is really key because it's relatively new in the sense that this is

a new energy revolution that is driven by technological innovation. And this technological innovation has brought us wind and solar and now batteries and also digital technologies because something we haven't talked about as much as this demand shifting, which is really, powerful and it's very often ignored. And it's actually something that empowers consumers as well because demand flexibility means that people are empowered to consume

cheaper electricity when there is abundance of wind and solar.

This means that your power bill, you have more control and ownership of how you consume electricity, when you consume it, and how cheap it is. if you just have one fixed, for example, power tariff, the chances are that it's relatively high because it balances out all of these more expensive versus cheaper moments. You don't have any risk, but you also don't have any ownership of your consumption, and you don't understand your consumption.

to this new system where you have smart meters basically allowing you to understand your consumption to monitor it but also to control it better to adapt to these price signals which means that for example you charge your electric vehicle when the sun is shining or if you're using electricity to heat your home your

preheating when there's lots of wind for example and this means that your power bills can be significantly reduced compared to not doing anything and not understanding your consumption.

Steven 
Yeah, that makes the smart meter at your house or the smart appliances that you can then program to pay attention to the grid while you're off doing something else, because we don't have maybe the time to watch the grid and know that, hey, this is peak time or this is not. So these smart appliances and smart meters can do that for you and adjust automatically throughout the day. that correct? Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Absolutely, yes.

So there is, for example...

In Norway like you need to have a smart charger for your EV so you plug it in and you just press a button saying enable smart charging and you just leave your electric vehicle be like you don't have to do anything and then you can earn up to 70 to 100 euros per year from just pressing that button saying enable smart charging and this means that your EV is charging when the electricity is cheaper, so you're saving on electricity bill, but you're also getting paid

Steven 
You're getting an incentive. Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
for the fact that

you're anticipating in this year.

Steven 
Yeah, no, that makes that that was another question that I was going to ask and touched on it is that there are are then government incentives that can be made into these into these programs to discourage people from using energy during the, you know, the peak times or the difficult times when and or, you know, charge your car, for example, when the energy is abundant, you know, so there are there are these financial tools that

government could institute if they wish to to help citizens use these smart appliances and use them to their advantage so it benefits everybody that the the power is being distributed more efficiently but then I might get a little extra money in my pocket if I do this program yeah yeah that's that's

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, with little, no effort.

Steven 
That's brilliant. I think that is such a creative use of this technology. I don't know when that will happen here because of the world we're living in now, but it's so exciting to know that it is happening and that it's possible and that it is a future that is not.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah.

Steven 
too far off, it's actually now and it can be, as you said, with a change of mindset, we can do these things now, we don't have to wait, so that's exciting.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, absolutely. And it's also about changing the debate a little bit because we are getting stuck into this debate about all power prices are too high and this is because this and that. And then...

this doesn't enable people to have ownership and to really understand what's going on. And I think that the more consumer electricity becomes like having a mobile operator, because it's quite similar, like being able to change your provider and having different plans based on what you need and how you consume. Like it could be like changing your mobile operator if there is enough demand from people to just like become more aware and build

this awareness and helping people understand and being like getting more and more knowledge about how the system works and what they can do and how they can be empowered can really change the debate in a meaningful way and get unstuck from this all renewables are leading to high power prices and it's all their fault where in reality this is not true and all of these like very populist debates can can gradually be phased out into something more productive and some

more grounded in what is actually happening.

Steven 
love that. That's critically important as well in the times that we're in with populist conversations happening, not just here in the States, obviously, but in Europe and other parts of the world. That's a rising issue that needs to be addressed. And that sounds like a wonderful way within the realm of energy to have these conversations in a more realistic approach.

Kostantsa I want to make sure that I'm Giving you enough time here is I want to be respectful of the time I keep talking to you about this for another hour But I want to make sure I'm here. It's evening time for you. I'm sure you want to get on with your with your night as well Is there any anything else about?

clean flexibility or your work at Ember that we haven't touched on yet or that I haven't asked you about that you want to make sure that you get out and tell me about and tell us about. I just want to make sure that I'm not missing something that you need to make sure that we know.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, I would say that I think we covered the most important tools that exist. I would say that one of the... I would really invite people to get more aware about...

how the power system works and how it impacts them because as I said, like for many people turning on the light is something super mundane and you don't realize like this very big system that is behind it. But in reality, it's a very dynamic and interesting world that...

the more you understand it, the more you realize how this is going to change radically over the coming years because we have all these new technologies that are changing the way we produce and consume electricity and this can change people's lives for much much better not just from the perspective of know reducing emissions and improving

air quality for example from not burning fossil fuels but it's also about

It's also about democratization of energy because wind and solar, especially solar, this is something you can install on your roof. Controlling your energy consumption, this is something you can do as well. And this helps the whole system to become much closer to people and for people to take ownership of it. I think clean flexibility is very strongly related to that.

Steven 
That makes a lot of sense to me and I like that idea of getting more ownership of such an important aspect of our life. all rely on energy. We all need energy to power our lives and the lights in our homes and our mobile phones and the computers that we're using on our desks and our vehicles that we drive around the community. So having a better...

personal knowledge of that and understanding of it and some ownership of it by having solar on your roof or smart appliances and smart meters makes a whole lot of sense to me. So I appreciate all of that. Where can people go? I'll make sure I can put in the show notes links to Ember and links to the smart flexibility report. But is there a place you want to tell people now where they can go to get more information about your work?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, our website Ember Energy, we actually revamped it quite recently so it now looks much sleeker and much better. So emberenergy.org would be where you can go and check our reports. We publish very often all kinds of new reports, not just this clean flexibility report, but updates about what is happening across the world in terms of the energy transition.

So if you want to know more about where the world is going and looking at the data yourself because we have all these colorful, very easy to use data tools where you can visualize for your own country. You can see where the power is coming from for the year, but also on a monthly basis for many countries. You can check how much different power sources contribute to your country's electricity generation. You can see how much solar produced over the past

month you can see how many emissions were produced from the whole power sector. So all this data is freely available for everyone on our website. There's different tools that you can use to look around and play around.

Steven 
It's a great website and it is clean and it's very user friendly. So I encourage everybody to go check it out. It's a great resource. And again, I'll make sure to include information in the show notes so people can get there and learn more about your important work. You already mentioned kind of this idea of encouraging people to learn more about their energy sources and taking a little bit more personal ownership.

Is there anything else as a call to action? we're kind of near in the end here of this conversation and hopefully folks are as excited and inspired to go learn more about this as I am, what do want people to do now that they've heard your story?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
I would say get informed and demand that the clean energy transition happens because this is what makes electricity cheaper. But also we talked so much about geopolitics. Like if you want locally produced energy, is the way and this is the way for you to have clean and cheap electricity. You don't have to import gas from certain countries or just

Steven 
Yeah, those guys. Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, exactly. basically, this is a transition to a much safer, cleaner energy system. demanding that this happens and keeping pressure on policymakers to not succumb to all these populist narratives that can sometimes derail.

the throughout the transition and slow it down because actually it is like what we have seen in Ember is that it has the transition has reached this critical point where it is now unstoppable like countries across the world are switching to wind and solar because they are cheap not just because it's some like random policy decision and and so many more countries are also trying to do that as well and they're growing like these are the fastest sources in terms of like growth that

like wind and solar growing more than any other source of electricity globally for many years already. And this is where the world is going. It cannot be stopped. Some countries could possibly slow it down, but it will not stop from a global perspective. basically keeping that in mind would be very, very important.

Steven 
I appreciate that message of encouragement and hope because you can get lost in the news sometimes and not recognize that reality that the world is moving forward. This transition is happening and it is unstoppable as you said because it's gonna happen. It is happening and it needs to happen. So, love all of that.

We do talk a little bit about hope on the show and in kind of ending on that idea that there's hope in the energy transition is unstoppable. But I also want to talk to you a little bit about what makes you hopeful. And hope is this idea. It's not just a fluffy emotion. It's actually those who study hope.

don't even define it as emotion. It's really kind of a mindset. You have a vision for a better future. You have an idea of how to get to that future. There's steps or a plan or process you can take to get there. You may not know it all, but you have a direction to go in. And you have this sense of agency that there's something I can do to make this vision happen. Doesn't mean it won't be difficult. And doesn't mean there won't be challenges. And you might fail, but that's...

You know, you have a vision, you have a process, and you have a sense that you can get there and do it. So I want to ask you three questions about your hopes. So the first question, Kostantsa, is what is your vision for a better future? It can be for you personally or professionally or for the world. Like what's your hopeful vision for the future?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
This is so.

Yeah, I think I'm mostly hopeful for an acceleration of the clean transition. And I'm saying that from the perspective of like seeing more solar panels, seeing more windmills, producing electricity. I think this would help in terms of not just making sure that the air is cleaner and that climate change doesn't happen as fast, but...

You know, just empowering people and countries to have access to that because this is a completely different world because...

If you have a situation where electricity was produced by very big power plants and then distributed to everyone and you don't have any power, you either plug in or you're not connected and you don't have access to electricity. And this is so much more empowering because you can install a solar panel on your roof, you can have a battery, you can even use your EV as a battery and you can be self-sustained or you can have whole communities that can build together and co-own

a solar power plant or you can have agricultural like you know farmers building solar next to crops and then you can have this very beneficial coexistence between like solar and crops and all of these things means that you give the energy back to people themselves and they can have more ownership about what's going on you don't depend on

larger coal power plants. don't depend on different countries and on like the fuels being delivered. So I think I really hope we can get there. and not like this is this is a hope for, you know, all kinds of countries, but especially for global self countries, imagining all of this electricity access, getting there with these technologies. I think this can have lead us to a more

peaceful world as well, where fossil fuels are not as critical and where geopolitics and energy is not as political as it is today.

Steven 
Yeah.

Yeah.

want to dig a little bit deeper. love the vision. And you kind of touched on this a little bit. But the second question is why? And again, you kind of talked on that a little bit. There's peace involved in this transition. There's empowerment, personal empowerment involved in this. But is there anything else you want to add into why is that your vision, the transitioning to clean energy faster is a part of your vision?

just want to add on to that answer.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah,

I think just the elephant in the room, would say, which is climate change. would say that making sure that we don't have...

extreme weather events or we limit that as much as possible this is really critical and I really want to think that we can we still have time and we can still do this it just means that we need to keep going not forget the end goal and yeah I really hope that this is something we can achieve

Steven 
The last question about your hope for a better future. Imagine for a moment that the future you just described is real and it's right now.

completed the energy transition and globally in the global south is seeing the benefits from it and you know, there's a more peaceful planet because we're not in these geopolitical conflicts over oil and gas and so we're living in that future you just described. How does that make you feel to know that that's the world we're living in?

Kostantsa Rangelova 
I would say relieved. I think I would feel lots of relief if that were true and we would get there. And I really hope that this is going to happen during our lifetime because this is something like we are living in a truly historical moment and this can be at the same time scary but also very empowering and full of hope. And I do think that

Steven 
Yeah.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
this generation like this, where we are as humanity right now, we can change the world into something much, much better within our lifetime. And we have the technologies to do it. So, yeah, I think I would feel relieved and happy.

Steven 
Perfect.

Well, Kostantsa, thank you so much for your time today and thank you for your expertise and knowledge and sharing it in a way that's attainable to me and an average audience who aren't, as you described, energy nerds. So appreciate your.

that storytelling ability that you have to take this really data-driven analysis that you do and explain it in a way that is understandable for all of us. That was really brilliant and I'm grateful for your time and I'm grateful for your work. Thank you for all that you're doing to help expedite that energy transition to get us to that better world that we're all trying to get to.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Yeah, and thank you so much for the opportunity to share this story. It was a really great pleasure to talk to you and to share this story. So thank you for that.

Steven 
All right, well,

I wish you all the best and look forward to reading your next report.

Kostantsa Rangelova 
Thank you so much. Bye.

Steven 
All right,

bye bye.

Steven 
What an insightful conversation with Kostantsa Rangelova. In this episode, we explored the evolution of global energy markets, the critical role of clean flexibility in the energy transition, and the importance of using data to drive informed decision making. Growing up in Bulgaria in the 90s, which was a time of uncertainty and transformation following the fall of the Soviet Union, Kostantsa shared how

her early experiences shaped her resilience and passion for energy policy. And her journey from an aspiring journalist to energy analyst also demonstrates the power of adaptability and lifelong learning. And for me, one of the key takeaways from today's discussion is the power of storytelling and making complex data accessible. Kostantsa is a master communicator and not all scientists and data analysts have that skill set. She explained clean flexibility,

beautifully. Using the analogy that renewable energy is the heart while clean flexibility is the brain. And storing, shifting, sharing, and supplying are the tools used by the brain or clean flexibility to keep our heart or our clean energy sources reliable and efficient. It's this ability to break down difficult concepts into digestible pieces that make sustainability issues more understandable to policymakers,

everyday people alike. Kostantsa reminded us that compelling narratives aren't just about numbers. They're about real life stories, clear language, and relatable analogies. This is the kind of storytelling that drives real change. I deeply appreciate her ability to bring these ideas to life for us today. I want to thank Kostantsa for joining me on Stories Sustain Us and for her incredible work advancing the global clean energy transition, which she said

Thankfully, with so much passion and just belief that this clean energy transition is unstoppable. Her insights and dedication are making the world a better place. For those of you listening, I hope Kostantsa's story inspired you just as it did me to take action in your own community. Whether it's learning more about clean energy policies, advocating for better renewable energy initiatives,

or simply making small changes in your daily energy consumption, every effort counts. So thank you for what you're doing to make the world a better place as well. If you enjoyed this episode, please support Stories Sustain Us by sharing it with your family and friends, liking and following the show, and leaving a comment. Your engagement helps me to bring these inspiring stories to you. So thank you for supporting the show. And be sure to join me for the next episode, releasing on April 1st, where we'll dive into the incredible work being done

protect and restore the Anacostia River. My next inspirational guest will share how they are bringing partners and communities together to achieve a clean and safe Anacostia River for all who live in its watershed, now and for future generations. Catch the next episode of Stories Sustain Us on April 1st. It'll be available at StoriesSustainUs.com, wherever you listen to podcasts, and on YouTube. Thank you for being here today. Please keep making the world a better place.

one story at a time. Until next time, I'm Steven Schauer. Please take care of yourself and each other. Take care.