2 Guys Talking Baseball
Dallas Danger and Brian Logan discuss the game of baseball. Two fans, two personalities, Two Guys!
2 Guys Talking Baseball
Winter (Meetings) Cometh!
What happens when baseball's winter meetings set the stage for potential blockbuster trades? Picture this: the Chicago Cubs eyeing Astros' Kyle Tucker, with Seiya Suzuki and Izok Paredes as potential trade pieces. We tackle the Cubs' seemingly erratic management strategies under Jed Hoyer and the Ricketts family, questioning the consistency and direction of their roster-building philosophy. Meanwhile, the Dodgers shake things up with offseason moves, including Mookie Betts' potential transition to the infield, as they strive to maintain their competitive edge. The buzz doesn't stop there, as we dive into the New York Mets' strategic leap with the signing of Juan Soto, backed by Steve Cohen's ambitious vision for the team's future.
In a poignant moment, our guest Mike Vanek, a devoted Oakland A's fan, brings heart and soul to our conversation by sharing his love for the team amid its current woes. As a concert promoter and lifelong fan, Mike's insights illuminate the cultural significance of the A's and the deep ties between the team and its community. He delves into the emotional fallout of the team's financial struggles and potential relocation, painting a vivid picture of the heartbreak felt by loyal fans. Together, we reflect on the A's past glories and ponder the challenges of preserving their legacy in a rapidly changing sports landscape.
As the baseball world turns, we celebrate the overdue Hall of Fame recognition for legendary players Dave Parker and Dick Allen, highlighting their cultural impact and the promise of increased diversity in the sport. We also question the leadership of MLB Commissioner Rob Manfred, expressing concerns over franchise relocations and media coverage that threaten the game's connection with its fans. As we wrap up, our gratitude extends to our listeners for their unwavering support, with a promise to bring more engaging discussions and surprises in the episodes ahead.
Hello again, one and all, and welcome inside the Three Crows Studios. Easy for me to say we're off to a rip-roaring start. Morristown, tennessee. This is Two Guys Talking Baseball. I am Dallas Danger, of course, and I am joined, as always, by my best friend and colleague, the sea lion himself, brian Logan. It's been a great week for baseball meetings, man.
Speaker 1:So we went from pulling you you know stories about m&ms out of our ass last week. Right now, the, the, the winter meetings have just gotten wild. I mean garrett crochet socks were white, now they're red. Spencer horwitz gets traded twice in one day. I mean this this offseason has been flipped, turned upside down. A lotside-down, a lot going on already, isn't?
Speaker 1:there? Yes, a lot. And I want to start the show by saying one of our goals at 2GTB is to not ever make you feel like we're reading you the news. We're just talking because we like to talk about baseball, right, and we just thought a couple years ago let's just hit record when we do it, right. So we're not going to cover everything. Um, we're obviously going to cover cubs and dodgers, because we always do that. That's what we're most passionate about. Um, you know, we're going to cover the obvious that everybody's talking about with juan soto and we're going to talk about two new hall of famers. The long overdue, uh, candidates for the hall of Fame will be going in this year, thanks to the Heiress Committee. Yeah, and then, in addition to all that, we were a little worried the winter meetings would not get this wild and we lined up an interview, right, right, the man behind Pirate Flag Radio, a Bay Area native, a lifelong Oakland A's fan, is going to join us later in the show to talk all things Oakland and the athletics and baseball in that area of the country, that city. So we got a lot to cover, so let's just get right into it. All right, we're going to start with the Cubs.
Speaker 1:No hard news for the Cubs, brian, but the Astros. It's been reported a lot over the last few days. The Astros are listening to offers on Kyle Tucker, maybe a top ten hitter in the whole league, very underrated, not a guy that I think we know a lot about, personality wise, and maybe that's why he's he's not thought of as highly as he probably should be. Um, but but this is apparently some serious trade talks and the cubs are potentially looking at at selling the farm for one year of kyle t. Tucker has said publicly basically he's going to try free agency after next season. It's not going to be like you trade for him and he signs an extension before the season starts. So you know, seiya Suzuki's name has come up, ezok Paredes' name has come up. We've also heard now that that the astros want both of those guys, plus either cam smith or matt shaw, who are both right at the cusp of the major leagues, barely very highly thought of uh prospects for the cubs. So, brian, you're you're usually pretty hard on jed hoyer, well, but you.
Speaker 1:Today's gonna be the same, but you've, you've also not really taken to parade days quite yet. I mean, Rex has all worked up about it.
Speaker 2:He's tore up about parade days Absolutely.
Speaker 1:So give me your take, as the Cubs fan, on all this Kyle Tucker talk here at the winter meetings.
Speaker 2:Well, I think it could be good if we don't give away the whole farm, which I mean, let's see. Okay, so an hour ago we were, we were interested, so that means in 15 minutes we won't be, but wait, wait around, because the following hour is coming up and we're back interested again. I mean, I don't know, I don't know what jed's doing. Uh, he's bound and determined to make some type of something. One day he'll do something, yeah, Even if it's nothing.
Speaker 1:You know and we were talking a little bit off air about this and I think a lot of this wishy-washy nature of, oh, we're going to spend money on a guy but then a year later we're going to do everything we can to trade him away. Yeah, it's got to be hard, I mean, I don't know that. That's all, Jed Hoyer. I think this is the Ricketts family and the ownership not making up their mind if they're going to go for it or not.
Speaker 2:That's the thing. Since they got there, they were going to go for it and that lasted a couple years and we had to rebuild again. And then they decided to buy up the whole street all the way around Wrigley and redo that, which was a good investment, but they kind of shifted oh we spent all that money over there, so we can't spend it on the team. And then they go out and get a couple of players and then we're back in. It's just so confusing. It's very bipolar in the ups and downs here, the ebbs and the flows, if you will, of what the hell is going on over there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean that that's very valid. But if the cubs see an opportunity to go for it for one year, it does kind of lend them to go. Well, we're not so invested in something because we are kind of going back and forth on what we want to do and who we want to pay and who we want to stick around. Maybe they see an opening and it's like, well, let's try to win one now, yeah, and worry about the rest in the offseason. That would be great Because you know, assuming you don't give half the team for him, kyle Tucker can be that type of player that can put you over that hump. Let's remember two years ago the Chicago Cubs were one game back of the playoffs, right. And last year, this past season, they had the same record.
Speaker 1:They were a couple more games away but they really are just looking for something to take them up a notch or a half-notch. Get in the playoffs and see what happens, because you know all you've got to do nowadays is get in, and it's anybody's ballgame.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean they've got to decide one way or the other, and I don't want to say soon, but at some point they've got to decide. And if we get Tucker for one year and don't go for it, what's the sense in that? What's the point?
Speaker 1:What's the point Exactly? So, you know, do the Cubs think that's the one move? Maybe they do, maybe they think that's the one thing they need. But again, the Cubs are kind of in that conversation with everybody. Right, they were linked to Garrett Crochet before he got traded to the Red Sox and honestly, I see why anybody got out of that, because the Red Sox sold the damn farm for him, took everybody, I mean to give up Kyle Teal and Braden Montgomery in the same trade. Is, you know, for a pitcher who he has ridiculous, disgusting stuff is not proven to be a huge game changer for an organization yet, right, um, that's kind of been the theme ever since the winter meetings hit this offseason. Teams are spending, yeah, teams are going for it. Yeah, there's just this weird perfect storm at play that we didn't have. I mean, this is like the, the polar opposite of last offseason it seems like there's so many more players this time this car, maybe that I don't know, but it's because there's all these guys, there's so many, there's so much trade talk.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we didn't have all these guys on the trade market last offseason you think any of it is the dodgers setting the pace and these teams are quietly panicking.
Speaker 1:I mean, if I say, yes, I sound like a homer, but kinda yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, that's the way I'm reading it.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean because here's the thing A couple years ago, Steve Cohen buys the Mets. One of the first things he says is we want to do it like the Dodgers are doing it, and then we'll talk about this later but they go out and get Juan Soto and they were the favorites and they pulled it off. So I think there's an element of that. I think teams are trying to bridge a gap now because they see the potential for what you can do organizationally when you commit to winning yeah, and trying to make your team better at any cost.
Speaker 2:Exactly, exactly, and that's what the Cubs have got to commit. I think that's the bottom line, even this early in the talks is that we've got to figure out what the hell we're doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because the other teams have Right.
Speaker 2:You've got to figure out what the hell we're doing yeah, you got it, you got other teams have right, you got.
Speaker 1:You got to have a vision and a direction. You know whatever that is is up to you, but but you've got to decide and you've got to go in that direction yeah and maybe the cubs are. You know, we we're not in these rooms, we're not hearing these conversations. Um, and you know, jed hoyer was just defeated at the trade deadline because everything he was trying to do nothing went their way right um, and that might be some of it too.
Speaker 2:Maybe they're not dealing with him, you know, in the most favorable way.
Speaker 1:I guess I don't know it's it's, it's crazy, but uh, but we'll see. Kyle Tucker would make the Cubs better. Yeah, you know, I mean um the paradearedes experiment could be over hopefully, and I mean here's the thing.
Speaker 2:I don't. I mean I know the whole argument, I get the whole argument. It just seems pointless. But that's emotion that I'm going on for for morel and all that yeah but the paredes was a disaster.
Speaker 1:He brought nothing to the table yeah, it seemed that way a lot. Um and morel was an interesting case study because, again, statistically it made sense. But you gave up a lot that statistics don't tell you. With Christopher Murrell I think we talked about that at length, you know at the time, right, but I don't know, man, if you look at parade days as something that just wasn't working out, you go Tucker's an upgrade from Seiya Suzuki, who they've been reported to be trying to get rid of anyway, right, For whatever reason.
Speaker 2:Which makes no sense to me either.
Speaker 1:And then you sweeten the pot a little bit with Cam Smith or Matt Shaw. I mean, I'm kind of talking myself into it a little bit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I don't know. I mean, I still think the whole thing with all the teams I'm backtracking a little bit is, I think the ones that have decided are fighting fire with fire. So they got to fight Otami's bat with the best bat they can find, yeah, and then the other teams are playing catch up because they may be on the fence of. Is that really how you attack? You know, teams like the dodgers?
Speaker 1:yeah, you see what I'm saying, or do you?
Speaker 2:go the pitching route well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, and that's the thing is it's it's hard in one move match what the Dodgers are doing, because you know they're doing so much. It's an organizational thing with the Dodgers. Yeah, they never pick high in the draft, yet they draft really well, they develop really well, they find guys off the scrap heap and change their lives, but they also are in on every big name that's on the trade market or in free agency. Yeah, the Dodgers just attack it from all fronts. So, you know, while I think there's some, you know to your point, I think teams are trying to catch up to that, but at the same time I think a lot of teams understand they can't do that. Yeah, you know, because I don't know that I don't think there's 30 organizations that can do what the Dodgers do.
Speaker 2:I mean we're kind of I mean, I know it's always like this, but we're getting into a big ball, big bat era and if you can't play on that level, you're you're not going to do so well, yeah, yeah, and I mean I know it's always it's the big leagues I know.
Speaker 1:Do you understand what? I'm saying about big arms and bigger bat well, I mean pitching is at a level it's never been at right. So the and and the hitting, I mean we just we just brought the stolen base back into the game. That's reinvigorated offense in the game. And you know, I think we are 20, 25, 50 years down the road are going to look at this time period as a golden era for baseball yeah, you've said that before I mean, I truly believe that there's so much talent on the field at the major league level right now and, you know, and teams are stacking up the odds.
Speaker 1:I mean, I mean, just look at the dodgers. The first thing everybody wants to talk about is one, two, three in that order, because it's mvp, mvp, mvp. You know, I mean maybe the greatest baseball player of all time at the top right, mookie betts, who somehow still doesn't get enough credit right in the two slot which is amazing that he doesn't get enough credit and he doesn't.
Speaker 1:And Freddie Freeman, who, as far as pure hitting maybe, I mean I'm thinking in my lifetime, guys, I've legitimately got to see a lot of Tony Gwynn. Yeah, but Tony Gwynn didn't have the pop that Freddie has. You know, miguel Cabrera is maybe a comparison, because they both believed in sitting back and hitting the ball the other way. Yeah, man, it's a great time to be a fan, it really is, and I don't want to get too out in left field. We're trying to breeze through some of this quickly today so we can get to the interview with Mike. But it's a good point that if you're not going after these big names if they're, if they're, there's even a remote chance that they're available then then you're going to get behind quick way behind, and I mean we're, we're what?
Speaker 2:six days into this, four days, how many, how many days of these meetings been going on?
Speaker 1:so the winter meetings are officially over? Okay, uh, they, they run, they only run like four days. How many, how many days of these meetings been going on? So the winter meetings are officially over? Okay, uh, they, they run, they only run like four days. But we had, we had a month's worth of news in four days. Okay, that's what I was getting at.
Speaker 2:It was the short amount of time that we've had all this. What is going to happen between now and next week? Yeah, I mean, is this going to double exponentially? I mean, is that the? Is that?
Speaker 1:because if that's the case, then this season's going to be awesome it's going to get crazy yeah because there's still a lot of free agents out there, there's a lot of guys that haven't been traded, that there's been a lot of talks about trades potentially happening. I think the the biggest thing is there's four days at the winter meetings. You know that's, that's the the jumping off point, and now it's like well, where are the chips going to fall?
Speaker 2:I mean let's do this. Let's take every even numbered player and move them one team to the left. We'll take every odd number player and move them one team to the right, and we'll just see what happens and somehow the dodgers are still the best team yeah, we'll just see what happens here and how it all works out. I mean, hell, it can't get any worse all right.
Speaker 1:So, speaking of the dodgers, uh, real quick, couple things I want to mention and just move on, um, and then one thing I kind of want to I want to focus on for a minute because, brian, I think you can, you can offer something to this conversation, uh, as well. So, uh, very quickly, uh, re-sign blake trine. In two years, 22 million, a bargain in every way you can look at it, um, and if trine breaks down in that two years, who the hell cares? He deserves that contract. Yeah, um, happy he's not going anywhere and we got this done early.
Speaker 1:Yeah, uh, the interesting move for the dodgers was michael conforto one year, 17 million, um, and at first it was sort of like, okay, well, this is a platoon player as a left-handed bat. Uh, first off, above average, most of his career as a hitter and secondly, not for the entirety of his career, but last year alone was better against left-handed pitching than right-handed pitching. And again, the Dodgers have this reputation where I think they see something where they can go. Maybe he can be an everyday guy. Yeah, may you know, maybe, maybe, maybe they see something against lefties and see something they can tweak against righties to go. He can be that 120, 115, or even better, ops plus against both sides of the plate. And it's a one-year, it's a flyer of a deal. So you know, I think it's a win-win for both sides.
Speaker 2:That's all there really is to say about that, you know no, I I agree, it is a win, win and it's a good thing yeah, yeah, so we'll see what the outfield looks like for the dodgers on opening day to.
Speaker 1:Oscar hernandez is still out there and most they got to get that that soda well, yeah, and I think most reports you're seeing are are suggesting that the whole league is of the belief that teo's going back to the dodgers. Right, I believe he is I do too.
Speaker 2:I'm just working the details out I don't think.
Speaker 1:I don't think the dodgers are going to let one year or a little bit of money keep. Keep him away. I mean, why? Why would they? Uh, it would be a blunder, yeah, and that it would be a rare blunder for the Dodgers in my humble opinion.
Speaker 1:The thing I kind of want to get into the weeds a little bit with the Dodgers it was announced earlier this offseason. The plan is Mookie Betts is back in the infield. Okay, I think a lot of people assumed second base and then, oh well, we'll sign Adamas or we'll trade for a guy or whatever at shortstop During his presser or his scrum or whatever it was. During the winter meetings, andrew Friedman, dodgers, president of baseball operations, was quoted as saying that Mookie Betts is dead set on becoming a great shortstop and because the one issue he had was the throws but he's the hardest working guy in the world. They believe in him, yeah, and they're going to see it through. So you know, all signs at this juncture are pointing to Mookie Betts planning the whole offseason and working out the whole offseason to be the Dodgers' opening day shortstop. I like that. I dig that.
Speaker 1:I really kind of do too. Yeah, well, you know, we talked a little bit when they announced he would be moving back to the infield before we knew shortstop was kind of the, the spot that opens up right field and there's a couple guys on the dodgers if you count tay oscar hernandez that are better defensively in right field than they are in left. Okay, so that kind of opens that spot up to say, well, that's where tay oscar goes, is that right? He's the everyday right fielder, right. Then you've got some options in left, you know, you've got dalton rushing, who might be a left fielder at the big league level.
Speaker 1:Andy pahez is going to be one year, you know, older, wiser, right, more seasoned, more comfortable with his surroundings as a big leaguer. Um, after a pretty, you know, overall impressive rookie season, yeah, and now you've got. After a pretty, you know, overall impressive rookie season, yeah. And now you've got Conforto as well. You know, we figure, you know Mookie slotting at shortstop, that's basically going to make Tommy Edmond the everyday center fielder, I would imagine, or at least a most-day center fielder. Yeah, I would agree with that.
Speaker 1:But I mean this just goes back to what we were talking about. Mookie Betts is a multiple-time gold glover in right field and there were flashes when he was at shortstop this past season of like, okay, I think he can do that too, yeah, yeah. And now that's what we're doing, and it's just Mookie saying, no, I'm going to do it, I'm going to go to shortstop and I'm going to be great at it. And I'm going to be remembered as the guy who was a six-time gold glover or whatever it is in right field, who moved to the infield, which is where he came up as an infielder, right? Let's not forget that. He's sort of a natural quote-unquote infielder, um and and the whole time he played outfield never stopped taking ground balls in the infield every single day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know it's part of that work ethic, but uh. But yeah, mookie Betts says he's going to be a great shortstop.
Speaker 2:I mean he Mookie goes out there and earns everything you know. I mean, if he says I'm going to do it, I would not bet against him at all and I think him at shortstop is a great look for him, absolutely 100% and you know you can talk all day about the Mookie bets of now.
Speaker 1:Let's just remember some things. Smallest guy on the team his whole life, right, his mom was his little league coach because nobody else would take him. You know it's the equivalent of michael jordan getting cut from the high school team when he was a freshman or sophomore, whatever that was and then going on to be the greatest player of all time, right in basketball right, um, mookie's just that guy, he's just that guy and he's just that guy. And I'm with you If Mookie Betts says I'm going to do it, every dollar to my name.
Speaker 2:I'm putting on it. He's a professional professional. I mean anything he does. He does great. He's Mr Perfect. He's the baseball equivalent of Curt Henning.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, he's one of my favorite players of all time's. He's, he's one of my favorite players of all time. Yeah, he's, he's one of my favorite players too. He's so fun to watch you're.
Speaker 1:You never know what you're gonna see with him, you know always hustling I mean that jump, throw, double play like the very first game he got in at shortstop was just like, of course, of course he did that. Yeah, it wasn't even shocking. Yeah, you know shohei otani's doing shit that's blowing our minds, but mookie's just out there doing equivalent or more challenging shit really and and we're not batting an eye because he's just a natural right at everything he has ever done.
Speaker 2:Well, it's like you said. It wasn't surprising.
Speaker 1:It was like oh okay, yeah, that that confused yeah it makes sense that he just moved to shortstop and you know, in the middle of the year and and did that. Yeah, I mean, and honestly, if there was an effect on his offense, I think his offense got better. Oh, I do too, because because you know, we forget before he got hurt for three months and shohei otani took off and had one of the greatest offensive seasons we've ever seen. Mookie Betts was the guy on the Dodgers that was the favorite to win the MVP, yeah, so you know, I mean, I mean I'm just salivating. It's amazing stuff there.
Speaker 1:I mean it's, it's such a good fit, it's like hand and glove, perfect fit yeah, man, so, uh, so yeah, that's what's going on in, uh, in the world of the dodgers and, um, we'll, we'll see what else they've got up their sleeve. You know, not on the format at all, but roki sasaki is officially posted. Yeah, and the the, the conventional, you know, thinking is that the Dodgers are still the favorites, because, you know, the Dodgers are a lot of times the favorite because they're in on guys that not everybody can be in on. Yeah, everybody's in on Roki Sasaki and the Dodgers still look like the favorites, right, because if you've got an offer from everybody and the offers are comparable, where, why would you want to play anywhere else?
Speaker 2:Well, that's true. I mean with the machine they got going. Now I mean that's the thing and I mean I I wish he'd come to the cups, but who knows. I mean it's in the talks there, but who knows.
Speaker 1:That's going to be an interesting courtship Because, again, roki Sasaki has the potential to be the greatest pitcher in the league, but he's coming over so young that he's not a free agent yeah, he's only allowed to make so much. And I think it's just a kid betting on himself and saying well, I'll hit free agency at the same age everybody else does, and then I'll make my big, huge, mega bucks.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a smart plan.
Speaker 1:And if that's the vision that Roki Sasaki has for himself, I think he'd be foolish to not at least give the Dodgers a very serious look.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I think he is, and that's probably where he'll end up.
Speaker 1:I think most people think that, but you know there's a team out there that we're not thinking about, that's going to make a real run. The Angels, maybe, why not? Yeah, why not?
Speaker 2:Well, they got to get rid of the sunglasses and the phony mustache first and get themselves out of witness protection. Get them acclimated with society again, you know, go up to them, poke them with a stick a little bit, make sure it's okay.
Speaker 1:So let's talk about Juan Soto and the Mets, all right. So let's talk about Juan Soto and the Mets, all right. 15 years, $765 million. That is probably, after year five, going to become over $800 million because he has an opt-out, but the Mets can block the opt-out by giving him $40 more million. Yeah, but the Mets can block the opt-out by giving him $40 more million up in his annual salary from $51 to $55 million. Right, and there's no deferrals in this thing. So this is.
Speaker 2:Gargantuan in all of it, it's a huge deal, huge, I mean.
Speaker 1:This thing is. Steve Cohen is putting his money where his mouth is. He, you know he is, he's like he's probably in like the 10 richest people in the whole world, yeah, and he's dipping into his personal money because he's such a fan and he's so passionate about this, this organization, and they got so close, well, and they've gotten better since he's dipping into his personal money because he's such a fan and he's so passionate about this organization and they got so close, well, and they've gotten better since he's taken over, and in ways that are a little unconventional. I don't think anybody thought Carlos Mendoza was going to be the manager. He turned out to be year one, right, and I think that sets them up very nicely.
Speaker 1:That's where it all begins, of course, because you can put the team together, and I think that sets them up very nicely. That's where it all begins, of course, because you can put the team together. But if you can't get everybody on the same page and you can't get the coaching staff putting those guys in positions to succeed, it's all for naught. Oh yeah, we forget that even without Juan Soto or a big name like Juan Soto, the Mets had the highest payroll of anybody last year. So you know, this is Steve Cohen going for it, yeah, and going for it in a big way.
Speaker 2:He's made his decision, he knows what he wants. A hundred percent man. And, like you said, he's not scared to go out there and get it either, and I like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, he's got his poster boy now. Mm-hmm, he's got his poster boy now Because Juan Soto's probably on that team for 15 years. Oh yeah, you know, something really weird would have to happen for that opt-out to really go through. I think that's just a formality. I think the fact that the Mets can block it by giving him more money is just, you think he plays that long, though that's a long time.
Speaker 2:I mean he's 26. I know, but that's still a long time. I mean he's 26.
Speaker 1:I know, but that's still a long time, I think so. Yeah, yeah, I mean barring injury, which is a risk with any contract like this. Yeah, because you're guaranteeing him 765, so he's getting that, no matter what yeah?
Speaker 1:But I don't know, man. A lot of the conversation around this deal has been is juan soto worth it? Yeah, and I'd like to get your take on that before I make another point that I'm stealing from another podcaster, because you know I love doing that well, I mean, yeah, I, I think I think this is the is worth it.
Speaker 2:I think it's good in the market. You're going to sell a lot of tickets. You're going to get a lot of people to see him there. You're going to get a lot of people for the away team to see him fail. So that's a win-win.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because he's not the most likable guy if he's not on your team?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you market that the right way and let him ride the fence.
Speaker 2:You're selling tickets both ways yeah, um and uh, I, yeah, I mean he is well I'm. I'm speechless this week because I can't believe how much all is going on. But I mean, if they've committed to spending the money, how can they go wrong with it? Yeah, uh, you know he's going to deliver, he's going to play great. Yeah, I mean that's why he's getting the money to begin with. So I, and then it shows the team that you're willing to go out there and make an effort and spend the money. So the guys that are on the roster are going to be like you know, we're trying to do this thing right, yeah, so, yeah, I think, all in all, that it is worth it um, the point I was going to make.
Speaker 1:I expected you to go a different direction with that. It's a weird day. It's been a very weird day at the Three Crows.
Speaker 2:Studios.
Speaker 1:ladies and gentlemen, we're not going to talk about that. We're going to talk about Juan Soto, jake from the Baseball Barbie cast, which is my new favorite baseball podcast. I told Brian the first time I listened to it they were so good I wanted to quit. Uh, so go check them out. Uh, very cool, down to earth guys, very logical way of looking at things and, uh, good perspectives. If you're not listening to them already, go check them out. Uh, wherever you do your podcasting there, on YouTube too, if you like the video thing and Division III college connections all over the place and I'm always down for that because you know I flunked out of a D3 myself, yeah, and my brother, who finished school and is doing very well for himself, you know he saw it through at the same D3. So we love finding out that guys have D3 connections there you go.
Speaker 1:But the point Jake made was it doesn't matter why are we talking about if he's worth it or not, it doesn't matter, you know, what matters now is that the Mets have their guy. The Mets are succeeding at what they've been trying to do since Steve Cohen bought the team and now you've got him there to attract other players. Yeah, and I think the most important thing about the Mets being the team, you know, the Yankees were real close. They offered 16-7-60. So the Yankees were right there. I don't think the Yankees have the same capability as the Mets to give this kind of contract to Soto and then build around him and spend more money.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they could definitely build around him with all the money the guy has, I mean, and that goes with the team getting behind him. You know, I think that's what they're going to try to do. They came so close at the end of last season they could taste it, and they're going for it this year no, they, they are and and and.
Speaker 1:Kudos to them mets. Fans fucking deserve it. Holy cow that though, that fan base has been through some terrible dark days, long time too. I I mean A long time Long time, a long time since they had this much to be excited about.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And you know, outside of the Dodgers and the Cubs last year maybe the White Sox, just because we had a lot of fun with how bad the White Sox were. I don't know that there was another team we talked about more than the Grimace Mets.
Speaker 2:No, and they were on a hot streak. They were fascinating. They were very fascinating. Just kept winning and winning and winning. They were on a streak and you can't ignore when you're on a streak, like that.
Speaker 1:And the other thing is now, now that they've got the guy, they got the biggest name out there this offseason and he's there for, you know, at least five years and again probably the whole 15. You know now that, now that that's happened, it didn't hurt them one bit to lose to the dodgers in that nlcs. No, they're going to be right back and they're probably going to be a lot better.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you know, good for steve cohen, good for queens, good for the mets fans um you can learn as much from a loss as you can a victory, if it's the right kind of loss, and I think that's what the Mets went through.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that was a character loss for them. Yeah, the guys that are back. Francisco Lindor, who, by the way, looks like a bigger star now next to Juan Soto, and good for him. Yeah, you know, he deserves that too.
Speaker 2:There's your guy for the other side of the poster.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no 100%, and this is a team built with money and built with winning in mind, and they're not going anywhere for a while.
Speaker 2:No, they're going to be a problem for you and us.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, you guys, and us, oh yeah, as if the National League needed to get any tougher. Oh I know, good grief it's been a gauntlet the last two years.
Speaker 2:But they're going to bring it this year. I mean they're going to have to. That's another thing too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the expectations now are Okay. So here's the question 15 years, how many do they have to win for this to be viewed as a success?
Speaker 2:They got to win a couple In 15 years. I mean, I don't know more than a couple.
Speaker 1:That's a hard question.
Speaker 2:Four Okay, Two every six or seven years, something like that. Yeah, that's a lot. That's a lot.
Speaker 1:That's a whole lot. That's a whole lot, I think, if they get one it's worth every stinking penny.
Speaker 2:Just somebody to get them there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, because they're starving. They're starving for it at this point. Right, you know? 1986. Mm-hmm, that's almost my entire lifetime. Yeah, 1986. That's almost my entire lifetime. Yeah, you know. I mean, I think about what it meant for the Dodgers to get one and the Mets it's just, yeah, I think if Juan Soto brings them one world title, he is worth every penny to that organization. Yeah, yeah, I can see that. And here's the other thing he's probably going into the hall of fame with a mets cap on now oh, without a doubt you know, because who else would it be?
Speaker 1:he's jumped around, he's been passed around. You know, he's been a fascinating study, because every team that's had him has attempted to lock him up. Yeah, but he's a Scott Boris guy.
Speaker 1:It's hard to do and it was all about getting to this for Juan Soto. Yeah, he didn't want to be team friendly or give a discount. He wanted to get to the free agent market and see these kind of numbers, yeah, and this kind of deal. He played it right, played it perfectly, yeah, man, and he got it. Yeah, you know. So good for him for getting paid. I'm never going to be mad at somebody getting paid.
Speaker 2:Well and it's the whole uh, who's the main event and who draws this? I mean he's worth it. I mean he did his job to get it yeah you know, I mean it's over, it's a done deal. Yeah it's. It's got to be worth it because it's already been done.
Speaker 1:Yep, you know. Yeah, because there's no other option.
Speaker 2:Yeah you got to make it work. Yep I mean, no matter what it is, do they have to win this year?
Speaker 1:No, absolutely not. Yeah, no, I don't think so. Now, if they go out and get a couple more guys this year, that's going to bump your expectations even more, and then you're going to have to go. Okay, it's got to be soon.
Speaker 2:I don't know. I think if they don't come real close, like get there kind of close, I mean, I think the New York fans are going to be upset.
Speaker 1:Well, again, it's just up to the expectations altogether, because now it's it's world series or bus for the mats yeah you know, and, and juan soto, while a very good player, I mean, I mean, I want to look at it this way juan soto was on the yankees last year and they couldn't get the job done yeah and I put those rosters side by side and I'm not saying the Yankees by far or definitely have a better roster than the Mets do right now, but it's pretty close.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, there's there's no Aaron Judge on the Mets, well, and there's and there's no Garrett Cole, so maybe New York's just used to coming in second If we have any New York listeners, they just turned us off right there. I know, new Yorkers, you're not coming in second by choice, I know.
Speaker 3:I know.
Speaker 2:What's that about?
Speaker 1:All right. So before we get to Mike Vanik and a conversation we're very excited about, to talk all things Oakland baseball and the the disaster that is John Fisher and the A's some very good news. This week, before we even got to the winter meetings this was already on the format because I knew we wanted to talk about this. The eras Committee voted and, for the first time maybe in the history of that committee had a perfect ballot. Yeah, if you're talking objectively, I, selfishly, was rooting for Steve Garvey.
Speaker 1:I don't want to get into it for time's sake today, but if you're not aware, I have a lot of very personal ties to Steve Garvey. I don't want to get into it for time's sake today, but if you're not aware, I have a lot of very personal ties to Steve Garvey, so that's a very selfish thing. Yeah, but objectively, it's just too little, too late for his Hall of Fame case. But Dave Parker and Dick Allen are finally both going into the Baseball Hall of Fame, yeah, yeah, dick Allen had missed it by one vote, two times in a row and unfortunately he passed away in 2020, and he's not going to be here to know in this life, on this plane, that he's a Hall of Famer, but I don't have anything bad to say about dick allen or dave parker man yeah, no, they're great players.
Speaker 2:I mean, I I grew up watching dave parker and I loved watching him, and especially in the uh older years where he would either hit the, hit a home run or fall down dry. That was the best man you're. You're like, this is going to be excellent. I got to watch every second of this at bat. You know, I really enjoyed it. I mean, a lot of my childhood hours are watching him play.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely, man. I mean, he was a big part of some really good teams. You know, you look at the. I mean I think the obvious is the Pirates the we Are Family Pirates that he was a part of, and that group that all kind of came together to create that special culture that existed in Pittsburgh at the time. You know, I'd be remiss if I didn't bring up the T-shirt. If you hear any noise, it's just me and the boys bopping Yep, I've worn that T-shirt. If you go back to the video days of this podcast, I've worn that shirt on the show. It's a classic. I mean, it's amazing, it's so cool and the story of that shirt is even better.
Speaker 1:Yeah of that shirt is is even even better. Yeah, you know one of those again. Just the personalities of these two guys, um, in addition to the fact that they were two of the most feared hitters of their day respectively, um, yeah, very cool, very awesome to see both these guys get into Cooperstown and encouraging to see such a again. I think, a perfect ballot by the heiress committee. Yeah, you know, and it was not an easy task. This was a tough ballot because there were a lot of guys that there's that you know that have fan bases that are very passionate about the idea that they should be Hall of Famers. Louis Tiant was on this ballot and a lot of people you know believe that he should be Hall of Famers. Louis Tiant was on this ballot and a lot of people you know believe that he is a Hall of Famer Again. Steve Garvey, who for a long period of time in his playing days, looked like a no-brainer Hall of Famer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, that's a story in itself.
Speaker 1:Well, we could do the whole hour on that. You know, I mean the twists and turns of Steve Garvey's reputation and the timing of him being on the writer's ballot, and sabermetrics entering the equation and just the new way of comparing players across eras. But anyways, congratulations to the Cobra and to Dick Allen.
Speaker 2:You know how many people got, or kids got, in trouble because of Dave Parker with that slap catch. He used to make Yep, don't do that. Well, but he does it. Yeah, well, when you're up there you can do it.
Speaker 1:That was the Gary Sheffield you know swinging the bat. Oh, absolutely, you know my generation.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:I didn't care. I never got a hit in Little League once, but, man, I looked cool with that.
Speaker 2:Gary Sheffield Well, I realized early that you catch the ball first and then you make the move. So you catch the ball first and then you make the move.
Speaker 1:So you know I could do it Right, but I would get fussed at by everybody. Yeah, yeah, that's a great way to get recruited to play banana ball these days. Mm-hmm, you know, Sure is. But, yeah, man, very happy for both guys and their fans. I know a lot of people you know online especially that that are have been huge advocates for both of these players to be in the hall of fame for a long time, and and and you know we're two white guys from the South. But I do want to say to the timing is really amazing for the game of baseball because this is two very black guys, yeah, american black players who young kids that don't know because they're too young right, are gonna see these guys, yeah, and go. He looks like me and he acts like me and he has a personality like me and he made it and he played baseball I want to play baseball.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because that's something that and the league is doing a great job of moving in that direction. But anything, even something like this, that's just serendipitous, that nobody did on purpose with this motive in mind. Anything we can do to get the best athletes and young black kids in this country playing the game of baseball again is huge. Yeah, because we're losing them to football more and more by the day. Yeah, and that can't continue to happen. You know, yeah, you know, especially with the fact that, as a player, if you get to that level, you've got it made. You know, strongest players union and it's not even close. Yeah, in major professional sports. Um, you don't really have to worry about cte, right?
Speaker 1:you're not getting your head back around, yeah you're not throwing your head into somebody else's head constantly. So you know all around great, great news, um, for dave parker and Dick Allen to go in the Hall of Fame. I hate that we're not going to get the rousing speech from Dave Parker we would have before he had his complications, but at least he's still alive and he will get to know yeah, at whatever level of understanding he has at this juncture that he got his due.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. That's a good thing, good thing for the sport all the way around, couldn't agree more, couldn't agree more.
Speaker 1:All right, so that's everything we wanted to cover today. Before we got to this interview, I will kind of let Mike introduce himself. But yeah, brian, unless you've got anything else, no we're good, all right.
Speaker 1:Let's go to our interview with the man behind Pirate Flag Radio and Oakland baseball fan, mike Vanek. All right, brian and Dallas here and, as advertised, we are joined by the head honcho over at pirate flag radio and uh bay area native, uh lifelong ace fan, mike vanik. And mike vanik sucks, I guess would be the proper way to introduce you, mike I am mike vanik and I do suck what's going on, guys how you doing man doing great that's great man.
Speaker 1:Thanks for being here. You know we talk all the time off the air, uh, and and on the danger zone as well, about. You know, um, how happy we are to be a part of pirate flag radio and it's just such a cool bunch of people and, uh, you obviously head that up and and you know, um, yeah, we just, we just want to thank you first off for for letting us be a part of pirate flag radio.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we love being part of the family over there well, pirate flag radio loves y'all.
Speaker 3:We're all baseball fans and you know. Uh, thank you very much for letting me jump on here talk about something that I don't get to talk about a lot that I love more than anything in the world yeah, man.
Speaker 1:So, uh, just briefly, you know, uh, you know, say anything you want about yourself, give people an idea of you know who you are, what you do, and then, um, you know. Then then kind of like, what gives you this unique perspective on the athletics and baseball in Oakland?
Speaker 3:Well, my name is Mike Vanek. I'm from Modesto, california. I was originally born in the Bay Area. I am a two-time winning Modesto Area Music Award winner for Best Concert Promoter, so I was a concert promoter for 21 years. I was also a stagehand and basically anything you would do for a local show I did. I grew up worshiping the Oakland A's and I've probably been. I think we went to about 60 games a year.
Speaker 2:Wow, that's a lot.
Speaker 3:We had season tickets for the longest time and then, when we moved here, I gave them up. It's just, the Oakland A's are the most important thing in my life. When I was homeless, when I was a scumbag rock promoter, when I was, you know, in a bad situation, you know they were the one thing that was always there. You know what I mean. And Dodger fan too, because my dad's or my stepdad's cousin was Davey Lopes.
Speaker 3:Wow that's cool, that's my favorite dodger. So when he played for the oakland a's in the early to mid 80s, that's when we started going to a's games. Well, let's say 1983 or 84. I know I started watching the A's in 83. Because I remember you're 1983, oakland Athletics. But you know, I've seen them all, I've been through it all and I've been wanting to talk about it for a long time.
Speaker 1:So yeah, so let's get into it. You know because I've met other A's fans. I actually work with a kid who grew up in Oakland and he was able to, in person, with his family, go to the last game at the Coliseum. And I know, mike, you and I have talked about your experience watching that game from a distance and you know just kind of. You know obviously you got into what the A's mean to you personally. But, like for Oakland as a whole, the A's meant so, so much, and that's what makes this whole situation so heartbreaking.
Speaker 3:Oakland. The Oakland A's are the heartbeat of that city and when the Raiders left the first time, you know, then we had the Warriors, and the Warriors are a big deal, but the Oakland A's are Oakland when it comes to, you know, going to Oakland. You know it's not the greatest city to be in. There are really nice parts of Oakland that I would take you to right now, but Oakland is the dregs of the Bay Area. And you go to Oakland for two reasons you go see a concert, or actually three reasons you go see a concert, you go see an A's game or you're trying to score a draw. So going to an A's game is an experience. You get on the train, you take the BART train, you go across the BART bridge to the Coliseum and that place is a cathedral for baseball.
Speaker 3:And our fan base in Oakland was a magical experience. You know what I mean. We loved our team and just as much as dodger fans would or yankee fans would, right, and people like, well, that place was horrible. Yeah, it was horrible and yeah, it did smell and you know, there you did see a possum and run around the hallways and they found rats in the soda machine, but it had like it was like it was what I like to call ghetto. Fabulous man, you go to the A's game. You're going to have a great time somewhere where you can take your kids and you can trust them to run around because you know the other A's fans are going to look after them. A's fans are a family and it's the biggest heartbreak our family has ever had. Is what's going on right now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So just go a little bit into what that was like being so far away and watching that last game and and the emotions and just kind of like everything that was wrapped up in that, because there was, you know, that was I sat in front of my tv and cried like a like a 16 year old girl, that her boyfriend just broke up with her.
Speaker 3:Um, I watched the pregame and they played, uh, tower of power. Tower of power is the old school r&b group. Um, and they're very oakland. Yeah, and there's nothing more fitting than playing tower of power. And you know, when they win they play cool in the gang celebration. And you know it was a beautiful day at the ballpark, the weather was great and they had the legends there.
Speaker 3:And they had. The place was packed. They didn't open up the top of Mount Davis, which I can't believe they didn't do. But you know, it's just like they had already given up on us, and they gave up on us last year and it's horrible. You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:This guy, john Fisher, took a burning brand and stuck it into our heart and he doesn't care about us, he doesn't care about the city of Oakland. All he cares about is making himself richer. He saw the Raiders do it and he's like that's what I want. And it sucks because you know, we had a stadium. The Howard terminal site was a done deal and you know I don't know how much you guys know about politics, but especially in California you have to get a zoning, you have to get approvals by unions and everything that goes into it. It was on the biggest shipping corridor of the west coast, so you had to get the teamsters to say okay and the shipping people to say okay and the warehouse people to say okay. And they had a plan to build a beautiful stadium that had affordable housing, retail, and it was basically what the Atlanta Braves did.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 3:And you know you go to Atlanta and there's this little city next to the stadium.
Speaker 3:That's what they were going to do. They had it all lined up. You know what I mean. They were fighting with the city of Oakland to get the details done and then, all of a sudden, you know, john Fisher sends out this letter saying hey, we're going to go forward with our terminal, we are moving to Las Vegas. And between that and watching the final games which was beautifully done the people at NBC Sports Bay Area my homie Dallas Braden, who calls those games, and everybody that was involved, brady Brazil, big Roberts, who do the pre and the post-game, zill Big Roberts, who do the pre and the post game they all did an extraordinary job all season, knowing that after the last game, their jobs are. Hundreds of people lost their jobs. Not just, oh, we lost our baseball team, people lost their livelihoods and they don't care. They don't care at all about us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know, I think the overarching point of this whole conversation about John Fisher and the A's is that, as you illustrated there, it didn't have to be this way. No, it just didn't have to end like this. And you know, that's something I was I was going to say about that last day at the coliseum, was there was such a finality to this, because I don't know how many ace fans there are going to be without the, the city of oakland I, I just don't know that people are following this team anymore.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the majority of people that I know have either picked another team and I'm all about the Dodgers or you know, they're just like listen, we'll always be A's fans and I will always be an A's fan, but you know, it's just hard right now. You know, and I have a family history of the Dodgers, so that's who we're rooting for. Yeah, but, dude, I go all the way back to Dave King and you know um, mike Heathath and carney lansford and terry steinbach and dave stewart and, uh, the city where I used to live, modesto california. That's where their uh, their single a team was. So I saw tansyka and the wire, all those guys come up.
Speaker 3:Ricky henderson you know, ricky henderson, this is the greatest baseball player I've ever seen in my life. Yeah, and I got to see him, like I said, six games a year when every time we could, it was part of our lives. And this guy walks in and says I'm just going to take that from you. Walks in and says I'm just going to take that from you. And it sucks, because this guy was given the team by Bud Selig. His other partner, Lou Wolf, who's no longer involved with the team, I believe, was basically given this team. Reggie Jackson had a group to buy the A's. It was guaranteed by Buck Selig that you know you're going to get the Oakland eggs, and how cool would it have been for one of our greatest players of all time to buy our team.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that would have been awesome.
Speaker 3:And they gave them to these guys. They didn't put any money into the costume, gave them to these guys. They didn't put any money into the Coliseum. Coliseum is a rotting pit of hell that I absolutely love and they could have easily thrown a million dollars into this place.
Speaker 2:It made it really nice, yeah.
Speaker 3:Like you know, you're a Cubs fan, right, absolutely yeah. How much money has Chicago Cubs put in in, really feel, to keep it monetized?
Speaker 2:oh, I know they just bought up all the streets around it and they they redo the field every year. And I mean they, they've had to.
Speaker 3:Yeah yeah, I've been. I've been to rick. Yeah, that neighborhood thrives off that ballpark. Oh, I bet you know, and it's like it that could have been us, but no, it's they. They refuse to put money into our stadium yeah and then should have been not just not, just could have been, should have been absolutely yeah.
Speaker 3:And then it's like you know, you start seeing the, the telltale signs that you know it was gone. When we got rid of Marcus Simeon to our division rival, I was like what's going on? Even before that, well, we got rid of Yohannes Suspides for Jon Lester UN is a success, but it's for John Lester. And then they got rid of John Lester. When the playoffs hit it was like something's not right here. First they were going to move to San Jose, California. That fell through because of the damn Giants. And then they were going to move to Sacramento. They were going to move to Alameda. They were going to move. And then they were going to redo the Coliseum site, which is gigantic, and that fell through.
Speaker 3:Then this Howard Terminal thing came up and if you look up the drawings for that place you would gasp. It was a beautiful stadium, we had the funding, we had the OJs and John Fisher. Just, he saw what the Raiders did. He sees how much money Mark Davis is making. He's like that's going to be me. He's getting money from his family that owns the gap and he's going to I don't know. I really hope that this all falls apart.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a good chance it might. I mean there's a real good chance. Yeah, I mean you know they, uh, they're going to lose a lot of their fans in the crossover. Um, you know, who knows what the new politics of the new city will be?
Speaker 1:well, and it doesn't start great there, because the first thing they announce is well, we're not going to carry the city, we're playing in.
Speaker 3:We're not going to carry a city anymore, we're just the athletics now and well, that's for the three years that they're going to be in Sacramento.
Speaker 1:Right, but why would anybody in Sacramento pay their good, hard-earned money to come see this team?
Speaker 3:Yeah, they see it as an open audition to get a major league expansion.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:And if all that that we've laid out here wasn't enough of a slap in the face to the fans, the people that made that place, the coliseum, what it was. Because without that diehard, you know, family-oriented fan base, like you're talking about mike, without that they don't get as far as they did, you know, in oakland. And if all that wasn't enough, now they they've left Oakland behind. They're not carrying a city with them, they're just kind of placeholdering in a minor league park. And now, because the players union is really close to this grievance, now we spend franchise record money on a guy.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and that used to be our ballpark. The Sacramento Rivercats used to be our AAA team and I've been there and you can throw another deck on that place and it's made with baseball ball, yeah, so if this thing falls through in Vegas, which las vegas doesn't even want, the team you know it's the people that live.
Speaker 3:There are like yeah, whatever, it was barely voted in. So if this thing falls through las vegas, they have a ready-made ballpark in sacramento. Yeah, and you know it's a backup plane, but it's like now where the river cat's gonna play right.
Speaker 2:It's kind of a long shot that everybody would have to relocate in the scenario. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So again, you know they give severino this contract and you know and I think the funniest thing for me is, you know we covered on the show today the wildness that was the winter meetings and it's been a crazy week with everything going on. Max Freed gets his big deal with the Yankees, and good for him. But then this report comes out. Bob Nightingale reports that the A's were in that conversation till the very end trying to sign Max Freed, and then, as if I mean this is how poorly run from a PR standpoint this organization is now they just flat out come out and say no, they're wrong, we weren't really going to sign Max Freed, we weren't going to spend that money when they could have just shut their mouths and taken the W on that to a certain degree. I don't know, mike. It's deplorable what's being done by John Fisher and his whole crew out there and they're taking this historic organization and this historic ballpark and, like you said, they don't care. They don't give a crap about any of that.
Speaker 3:Let's talk about the Severino thing though.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So I've done some research. So Brody Brazil, who did the pregame for the A's and the San Jose Sharps, he lost both of those jobs. So it's not like they just said oh, you can't do the A's no more.
Speaker 3:They said you're fired, you know what I mean. So he has a YouTube channel and he does a masterful job at delivering the details of this going on. So the whole Luis Severino thing, which is something that he could have done while we were still in 100%. So in the last collective bargaining agreement they made it to where the Oakland A's have to spend X amount of dollars before a certain time forward. They will get a grievance from the players association and that's why they went and got severed, and I don't think it even mattered who it was. You know your list of free eagles. They had to do this so that they didn't get in trouble with the players association. And they still have about 28 million dollars to spend before they reach the quota that they were given to spend on the payroll.
Speaker 3:So I just that makes me so mad as an ace fan because, dude, we had had Matt Chapman. We had, we just got a huge contract from the Jets. We had Marcus Simeon, who just won a World Series with our division rival. We had Matt Olsen, who was killing it with the Braves. We had Sean Murphy, who's also a player, and these guys are all all-stars and probably a few of them are future Hall of Famers. We had the team. We were a playoff team. Then the final year, the next year, they started shopping off all our players. Then, you know, $7 seats to go see the A's became $70 seats.
Speaker 2:Yeah that's no good when they up it like that.
Speaker 3:And everything went up. You used to be able to go to the game to give you a jersey for going to the game. Now you're going to pay you know what $40 extra to get the you know the recrint jerseys they give out. It's, what he did is a damn shame. They raised the season ticket price, they raised the individual game prices, they raised the prices for food and meanwhile you know you're spending $15 for a Pepsi and they're finding rats in the Pepsi machine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's not cool yeah.
Speaker 3:So you know, I mean, unless they have little jerseys on.
Speaker 2:I mean that might be okay, yeah.
Speaker 3:But you know, that's the thing, the merch store. The last time I went to an A-Stream, which was last season, you know the merch stores were empty and the concession stands were all closed. It literally looked like. You know they had already they've already closed the book on Oakland and you could tell by going to the game yeah, that's not good when you show up and like the.
Speaker 3:The money makers are not there that's not good at all and you know I have friends that work there. They waited till the very last minute, even their two-week notice and said, all right, later they cut off their health insurance. You know usually a good company would be like, well, you can finish off the year with your health insurance. They cut it off immediately. Wow. And you know they have good players that are coming up, but it's a minor league team playing in Major League Baseball and the A's did put up a fight but it wasn't good enough and you've got to feel for their manager, mark Hotsett. He's doing the best he can with what they're given. So I don't know, it is what it is, yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's a disgrace. I mean, and we've talked about it quite a bit on this show over the last couple years and you brought this up it's easy to forget that, like you said, two years ago, this was a playoff team. Yeah, I mean, this was a team that was maybe a piece or two away from really competing. You know All those names that you mentioned, you know, and they've all gone on to success. You know, since leaving the A's it just you know, and I'm the type of guy, mike, that I try to play devil's advocate. I try to look at everybody's perspective on certain things, just to try to understand where people are coming from. I can't wrap my head around any of this. It just flat out doesn't make good sense, no matter which way you look at it.
Speaker 3:Well, it all comes down to one word, and that word is greed. And just the way that it's been handled. You know the way that he went about doing it. You know the A's are there since 1968. Doing it, the A's are there since 1968. We've won four world championships there out of our nine titles. We have made a movie about it. They have gone above and beyond to be a historic franchise. I can't think of Major League Baseball without the Oakland A's. Yeah, you know what I mean. They were there. They were the World Series that the earthquake stopped.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:It is the mustache gang, the swinging A's 72, 73, 74. We would have won If it wasn't for free agency. We would have won into the 80s. Yeah. And you know, we had Ricky Henderson, who I still to this day is the best damn baseball player ever in my office.
Speaker 2:He was exciting to watch, wasn't he?
Speaker 3:Yes, I watched Ricky Henderson go 0 for 5, with three stolen bases and four runs scored.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, on like a Tuesday he still had the rest of the week.
Speaker 3:Or like Reggie. Reggie was a movie star on a baseball field.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 3:And when he came back to that last year, it was a huge deal. And last year we had the all-star game. You know, I mean it was, it was. It makes me sad, like I said earlier, when I, when I watched the last game, I sat in front of my tv and cried and then I watched the announcers cry and you know, for somebody that's from that area, it's like growing up in the Bronx and all of a sudden they're like we're taking the Yankees back. We're growing up in LA and they're like, oh well, the Dodgers are gone. You know what I mean. And, being from California, you know the Dodgers are gone. You know what I mean. And, being from california, you know the dodgers are everything. And then the most historic franchise that we have and probably the most, uh, famous baseball team that we have, and it's like somebody kicking you in the gut and saying we're taking away your childhood, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. There's a true identity there, man, and I'm feeling the connection with you, man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I want to just real quick. You've brought up Reggie Jackson a couple times. Lots of people learned what a real motherfucker that guy is this year when they were at Rickwood Field and everybody's like, oh, it's a celebration, we're at rickwood field, everything's happy, and he's like, no, no, no, no, no. You don't understand. For some of us coming back here ain't all puppies and rainbows, because here's what we dealt with here. You know this is the conversation we need to be having and um there is go ahead.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry I was just gonna say I gained so much respect for Reggie when he did that and he took that stand, and he wasn't rude and he wasn't crass and he wasn't trying to take the spotlight off of anything or anybody. He just said, hey, let's remember what this is really about at the end of the day.
Speaker 3:Well, reggie is a character and there is a great documentary that came out. I don't know if it's last year or the year before, I think it's on netflix, but, um, that guy is the oakland a's. You know what I mean and I know he spent a lot of years working for the yankees and people consider him Mr Yankee, but Reggie Jackson was our first superstar. And Reggie Jackson made baseball fun. Yeah, you get to see Reggie play. Even when he was an old man, we used to go see him play against the California Angels all the time, and because Angel games were cheap, it was like five bucks. Reggie made it fun to go watch baseball. Always had a smile on his face, always had the sunglasses on, had a swing that was smoother than butter and you know when he would come back. Never said no, it was time to sign autographs. Never said no to a picture. When he would come to Modesto the most gracious man. He was like Vita Blue.
Speaker 3:Vita Blue was another guy oh yeah, absolutely Love Vita Blue. Like vita blue by the blues. Another guy oh yeah, I absolutely love that blue. Uh, real quick, when they had the 72 um world series uh, reunion. In 2012 we went to media day. My wife works in the country radio, so we got media passes and we went to the holiday inn that was right next to the Coliseum and that whole team was sitting there and I got to meet Raleigh Fingers and Joe Root and Sal Banda and Vita Blue. You know what I mean, and these guys were as cool as hell. You know what I mean. And people weren't bothering them. It was just another night. You could go to Ricky's and San Leandro and the players were there drinking. It was where they went to have a beer after the game and nobody would bother them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, part of the community.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you'd see Daveart at the bar having a beer and he'd be hella cool. If you want an autograph, he'd give you an autograph, but the bartender would look at you weird and be like man, don't bother him. Yeah, you know what I mean they were. They were the working man's team. Being from the bay area giants fans, and I hate the damn giants. I hate the fucking giantsants, me too.
Speaker 1:Mike, me too.
Speaker 3:I think that's another reason why I chose the Dodgers is because fuck the Giants, but Giants fans same thing with the 49ers. Those guys are all the wine drinkers and the suburban. That's not A's fans, man. We all drink the same beer out of the same bottle.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, man, yeah. So you know, I have a great T-shirt that I bought several years ago that says Baseball has no Owner and I love wearing it because I believe in that so much. This is a game that I mean the. The roots of, of the game in our country come from. Like, you know, all the guys at the manufacturing plant formed a team and played, all the guys that worked at the mill, you know, and, and, and it grew and it grew and it grew from there. But you know, in the wake of this, in Oakland comes this independent team called the Oakland Ballers.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, and they were supposed to play at the Coliseum. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Which was crazy on all levels. But we are huge 2GTB, huge supporters of the Oakland Ballers. We cover any cool thing they do. We cover it on the show.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we've talked about Billy Joe Armstrong, you know, going to the Coliseum and spray painting the A's logo with the B and you know, yeah, where they play, romandy Field was a negro league field and that place is full of history and I'm sure once the a's are gone they'll be playing at the coliseum. Um, there was one more thing I wanted to talk about.
Speaker 3:you guys yeah, go for it and you know, none of this would happen if we had a decent commission. Yeah, and I, I have a bone to pick with rob manford. Um, that's a long line to stand in, you know, first of all, he did this with oakland, but I have another. So, as you guys know, I live here in Bristol. We had the Appalachian League and in order to pay his minor league players and this is a billion-dollar industry we're talking about, headed up by billionaires running what? 30 teams? So that's 30 billionaires. Billionaires running what? 30 teams? So that's 30 billionaires. And they couldn't afford to have the low a ball um affiliates anymore. So they got rid of our league. They got rid of, I think, the cape cod league and it really took an impact with me. And then, almost at the same time, you know, he really advocated for the A's to go to Vegas and I think he just wanted a team in Vegas.
Speaker 3:And if you look around at Major League Baseball, you know the game is coming apart at the seams. Look what's going on with the White Sox. Look what's going on with the Tampa Bay Rays. Look what's going on with the Pittsburgh Pirates, which I would never believe because they have a brand new stadium. That's still like what, 20 years old. They have a gigantic fan base and their owner is falling in line with John Fisher. Other owners are falling in line with John Fisher and I believe this could be a major downfall with where teams are based.
Speaker 3:Valley Sports just pulled I don't know 10 or 11 teams baseball coverage and that's millions of dollars in rights fees that these teams aren't getting anymore. So it's like Minnesota Twins are selling their team. It's falling apart. Cities are going to lose more teams and it breaks my heart. And the Oakland A's and the Tampa Bay Rays were the last two teams that needed stadiums before we could get expansion and the frontrunner and I've talked to people that work in baseball it's a done deal. We're getting a team in Nashville as soon as this comes through and rob manfred has handled major league baseball since he started with clown shoes on. You never know what this guy gonna do. I hate everything he says and when we did our reverse boycott in Oakland, where all the fans showed up on a random night, he was like oh yeah, that was an average game, that was an average attendance for one of our other teams, and it's like if I ever met that guy, I'd punch him in the damn face.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because all he had to do with any of this was put his foot down. Yeah, you know, and and that's, and that's more complicated than than it sounds sometimes because, at the end of the day, he works for the owners and you know, we understand that, obviously, but at the same time, like you're the commissioner of baseball, and when an owner does something like this and starves a team out just to have the excuse to take them somewhere else, you're right, that can't be happening over and over. It shouldn't have happened once.
Speaker 3:He's done a few good things Like. I like the pitch count, the pitch clock. I do not like the idea of having robot empires and this golden rule batting thing where you could pick anybody to go up for terrible, absolutely horrible. You know that would ruin baseball for sure, because you can just go get anybody. You know you can go get a retired player. You could go get anybody and just be like this is a matter for this, I bet. And then they say you know, frank Thomas is walking up.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's just, it's stupid and uh yeah, I don't.
Speaker 2:I don't go for that rule either. There's no way they're going to implement that. I mean they can't, they just can't.
Speaker 1:They can't. And the blowback has been so bad since Manfred let it slip out of his little rat mouth, that you know it's been bad and I think that's all it was. I think he knew. I think he said I'm going to float this out there and see what people say, you know. But at the same time, like you've illustrated a lot of the times with Manfred, you know he'll bring something up and nobody likes it across the board, and they'll do it anyway.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I wish baseball fans could vote him out. I wish baseball fans could go up and say we want somebody else to be our commissioner. Please give us a good commissioner.
Speaker 2:Well, they've always had that commissioner locked down from the get-go, From day one. There's always been shenanigans with that office.
Speaker 3:And he has his heir apparent picked out, and he was Bud Selig's heir apparent. Bud Selig wasn't a good commissioner either, but I don't know. I really wish we could have somebody that was a genuine baseball fan that's going through these things or putting us through.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Well, mike, you know we've run a little longer, I think, than we planned. That's not a bad thing. We've run a little longer, I think, than we planned. That's not a bad thing. But we sort of unfortunately booked you to be on the show and then the winter meetings happened and I was like, oh God, now we've got to fit Mike into the show because we've got all this other shit to talk about.
Speaker 3:Thank you very much, you guys. This means a lot to me, hey, thank you for being with us, man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, thank you for being with us, man. Yeah, man, Thank you, Mike, for everything you do at Pirate Flag and thanks for coming on and talking Oakland baseball with us. And yeah, man, we're just stoked as can be to be a part of Pirate Flag and hope that that relationship will continue for as long as all of us are crazy enough to do this weird underground radio stuff we do.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, definitely Long long relationship.
Speaker 3:You guys will always have a home at Pirate Flag Radio.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you, thank you very much. That means a lot.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, thank you for having me, man. It's really cool to be on your show.
Speaker 1:We want to thank Mike Vanik from Pirate Flag Radio one last time for coming on and talking all things Oakland baseball we really enjoyed that conversation. It ball we really uh really enjoyed that conversation. You know it was a little emotional uh of a note to end on, but you know we wanted mike's perspective, you know we uh his lifelong fandom, being from the area, understanding what the a's meant to oakland and what it's doing to that city to pull them away when, again, as we mentioned a couple times, it didn't have to be that way. So thank y'all for uh being with us, as always and, if you like what you hear, head over to be that way. So thank y'all for being with us as always.
Speaker 1:And, if you like what you hear, head over to 2gtbstore. We got jerseys, hats, shirts, sweatshirts, stuff for your dog, some practical stuff like notebooks and things like that All kinds of different things that you can buy with the 2gtb logo on it and it's free to look around. So that's 2gtbstore and we have a patreon at patreoncom slash 2gtb and we've already been talking today about, um, you know, over the off season, some things we're going to do to add some bonus content to the patreon. So go ahead and head over there and see what that's all about, listen to our original episodes from 2022 and all that good stuff. But uh, yeah, we've covered a lot today. We've went a little long, so thanks for taking the ride with us and, yeah, we'll be back next week with God knows what, because this offseason is completely unpredictable. I bet it's wacky. Yeah, so for Brian, I'm Dallas.
Speaker 2:We'll see you at the ballpark.
