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Main Street Reimagined Podcast
This is a podcast for dreamers, creators, developers, and entrepreneurs to learn, share, and be inspired to change your community through small business.
Main Street Reimagined Podcast
Episode 27: Reviving Spaces; Lois Fisher's Impact on Marion's Downtown
From the back hills of West Virginia to the vibrant streets of Marion, Ohio, Lois Fisher has been a driving force in downtown revitalization. Luke calls her the "Matriarch of Marion". Lois has an extraordinary story that begins with her origins as the original coal miner's daughter. Her unexpected career path took her from the office of attorney Ben Maloney, to becoming a tax practitioner, and then a community developer. Lois offers insights into the perseverance and creativity required to overcome real estate challenges and breathe new life into neglected spaces.
Lois walks us through her real estate ventures, reflecting on the hurdles she faced, such as turning a flood-impacted motel into a thriving business opportunity. Her story is one of resilience and innovation, showcasing the transition from running a law office to her passionate involvement in downtown investments. Lois's story is a testament to the power of collaboration to bring back vibrancy to a downtown area.
Looking to the future, Lois discusses the ongoing journey of nurturing Marion's legacy, emphasizing the role of family and community support in securing continued growth. With profound affection for historic buildings, she highlights the significance of preserving Marion's architectural heritage for future generations. As her granddaughters enter and learn the business, and new businesses like Taco Central emerge on North Main Street, Lois reflects on the transformative journey of over 30 revitalized buildings now part of the community's fabric. Her vision underscores the importance of unity and strategic planning, inspiring listeners with the potential of thriving downtowns to benefit entire communities.
Guest Links:
Facebook: facebook.com/LJFandA
Main Street Reimagined:
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The Main Street Reimagined Podcast, Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLqfkmF5bRH0od1d3iiYKs3oEn_gvMYk7N
Henry Development Group:
Facebook: facebook.com/henrydevelopmentgroup
Website: www.henrydevelopmentgroup.com
Developing News Newsletter: https://mailchi.mp/33110524eb5c/developing-news
Luke Henry:
LinkedIn: linkedin.com/luhenry
Facebook: facebook.com/luke.henry.148
#MarionOhio #DowntownRevitalization #HistoricPreservation #CommunityDevelopment #WomenInRealEstate #SmallTownSuccess #EconomicGrowth #LocalLeadership #MarionMatriarch #RealEstateInvestment #LegacyBuilding #ReviveDowntown #WestVirginiaRoots #MarionStrong #BusinessInnovation #HistoricBuildings #TacoCentral #CommunityCollaboration #MainStreetReimagined #UrbanRenewal #SmallBusinessSupport
This was created by our forefathers that had the genius to see what it was to put Marion Ohio together and build these buildings. And the buildings have been built to withstand so much. And the buildings have withstood all of the trials and tribulations and they're still here today. And I think that's the realization when you look about and say, no, I didn't create this. I think it's my responsibility and I think it's all of our responsibility.
Speaker 2:This is the Main Street Reimagined podcast, a show for people ready to turn visions into realities and ideas into businesses. Hey, I'm Luke Henry and each week I lead conversations with Main Street Dreamers who took the leap to launch a business, renovate a building or start a movement, their ideas, their mindsets and their inspirations, as well as some of the highs and lows along the way. This is a place for dreamers, creators, developers and entrepreneurs to learn, share and be inspired to change your community through small business. Enjoy the show.
Speaker 3:Hey friends, luke Henry here, this is the Main Street Reimagined podcast and I'm so grateful for those of you that continue to show up and keep listening, keep watching. We're trying to bring you value each week with conversations with lots of great people, like my guest today, which is Lois Fisher. Hello, lois.
Speaker 1:Hello there.
Speaker 3:So Lois those of you that maybe aren't from around the Marion area, maybe you don't know Lois.
Speaker 3:Most folks here locally do know Lois and the best way that I can introduce her is to say that she is the matriarch of the downtown. So we're going to hear Lois' full story here no-transcript five or six years, as we've been kind of co-leading efforts here downtown and working together on some different projects and just sharing war stories and all of those sorts of things along the way. So I'm excited to. We've been trying to get this scheduled for quite some time for us to sit down and actually record a conversation. But here we are, so I'm excited to be taking part in the conversation today. So thanks again for being with me. Lois, yes, so let's start there. I want to hear and have you share with listeners here your story. Let's start way back in the beginning and kind of your story with growing up and kind of what the heck led you to become interested in some of this downtown stuff and maybe some of the bumps and bruises and all that that you got along the way.
Speaker 1:There were some bumps and bruises, but I'm still here, so I've got to be grateful.
Speaker 3:That's right.
Speaker 1:Actually, I'm the last of eight kids from the back hills of West Virginia and my parents, my family, moved up, my brothers I have six brothers and a sister and they have all passed. I'm the last one, but they all came up to work in the factories in Marion Ohio and I was just part of the movement, so to speak. I was the original coal miner's daughter. That's how my father and that's how we made a living in West Virginia. Wow, and when they left that behind because that was not, when we say, coal miner's daughter, that was not a big coal mine, it was just straight by a coal mine. And so we came up here.
Speaker 1:And the rest is kind of history, because I went to Pleasant and graduated from Pleasant High School and basically two weeks before I graduated from high school I got a call from Ben Maloney, an attorney that I learned to dearly love for the rest of his life and worked for and with him for 20 plus years and he let me progress into many different directions and I was able to go to school, I was able to go to trainings. I was able to go to trainings, I was able to do multiple things and through that I became a tax practitioner for the office, because we started off in the office and I was the original, there was myself and Judge Kelly and WP Maloney, and WP worked in the office until he couldn't climb the stairs anymore and I believe that was when he was 96. Wow, but he worked and he lived to be 104, I believe. And so it was an interesting atmosphere and in that atmosphere you did taxes by hand. There were no computers, you just did them by hand.
Speaker 1:So someone would come in the office during tax season and that was a big part of the practice because it was estate planning and tax work. And so during that time I would start to do the taxes and so I just kind of self-taught myself to do their taxes and depending on how long their wait was for the next one, then I would just steadily progress until I was doing the taxes and after doing that I started advising and then I started having people just come in and I would do the tax work and Mr Maloney would do other things. And during the course of that I thought I was telling people that how they could save money and how they could save taxes by investing in real estate. And then one day the light went off and thought well fool, why aren't you doing that? And so I did my first building, and that was 43 years ago, and I still own that building.
Speaker 3:Which building was that?
Speaker 1:125 Executive Drive.
Speaker 3:Oh, okay.
Speaker 1:I've had multiple partners in that and it's going through a transition, but I'm really attached to that building and so it sits in the heart of the medical community. And that one, just one thing then led to the next, to the next, and next door there was the it used to be the Holiday Inn and then it was the Sous Chalet and that came up for sale and, not having better sense, I thought, oh well, there you go, that's an investment. And so I finagled and was able to purchase that. I don't know it was my greatest purchase, but I purchased it. And then, within six months after I purchased it, we had the 100-year flood in Marion Ohio.
Speaker 1:We had the 100-year flood in Marion Ohio and everything on the first floor. It was a 165-room motel with a restaurant and banquet facility.
Speaker 3:Okay, yes, that's what I thought.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and everything on the first floor, just kind of floated away, and it was, needless to say, I didn't have a lot of equity in it since I hadn't even owned it a full year.
Speaker 1:But you know, as things happened, it was July 4th, it was over the July 4th weekend and it was hot and it was a time that everything was closed. So when the water went down, there was no one to clean it up, you couldn't call because no one was home, and so my family came in, everybody came in, and we just made due because we had at the time it was a very busy place and we had a baseball for youth. They were coming from all over the United States to Marion Ohio and we had them coming in and there wasn't a lot of choice because there wasn't a lot of places to stay, as there is today, and so we just made it through that and from there we stayed there for quite a while and that was a tough business. We ran the business in real estate and then decided that's when I had left the law office we closed the law office and from that point I still wanted to be back downtown office and from that point I still wanted to be back downtown.
Speaker 3:Now, before you move on from that story, I think you told me a story once about a particularly challenging spell you were going through and you had an old car that wasn't an old one. Maybe not an old car? Yeah, that you had to make payroll. I had to make payroll, that car had to go away. Tell that story.
Speaker 1:Well, I actually had a car. I had a Cadillac and a van and I couldn't make payroll. So I took them out of town and went to Delaware to a car dealership and said you know, I think I really have decided I just want to lease these days. And so I would. You know, I offered to look around and see what they had to lease. So what I ended up doing was told them you know, oh, you just go ahead and buy that, those two cars I don't need those, I'll just take this new Cadillac, those two cars I don't need those, I'll just take this new Cadillac.
Speaker 1:And so I got the cash to cover payroll by the sale of the Cadillac and the van and drove my new Cadillac home like I had something, but I really didn't, because it had all been washed away in that flood. So there are multiple times that you had to get creative and to say that it's been easy all the way. You know that whole experience, as you look back, wasn't so easy. But the bottom line is, when you're in the throes of it, you just do what you have to do.
Speaker 3:Do what you got to do.
Speaker 1:And so I never missed payroll. No one ever knew that I couldn't cover myself from one week to the next, and uh, but I think that that's the way a lot of people start. There's not a lot of silver spoons running around as many as we think there are.
Speaker 1:that's right, yeah, yeah. And so then, when it came time that the opportunities came from that, that the land was actually more valuable than the business that was on there the motel because that's when the new the 423 was not the main highway anymore, it went to. Everything was over on 23, and so there were new and far greater places to stay than the Harding Motor Lodge. And but the only salvation, I guess the only best thing about it was I sat in the heart of the medical district, and so when things got really tough there in more ways than one, because they weren't coming through the door as they once did, so I decided, well, maybe it should be medical facilities, and I just tapped on a few of the surrounding doors and we were surrounded.
Speaker 1:Of course, we had Marion General Hospital and you had Smith Clinic and you had the physicians all around, and so I pre-leased while I was sitting at the motel and took that to the bank and from there the rest of that's history because we still have the medical facilities that we built way back when and that is actually when I came downtown for the second round was simply because when I tore the motel down in stages because we couldn't well, we had to have a cash flow of some sort. So while that was being built, so we tore it down. And when it was all torn down and when the medical facilities were built, it was time to move on, and so we moved downtown.
Speaker 3:And that was when you tore that down and built what is now the Dell X1 building or whatever right, that was like the early 90s. Give us kind of a snapshot here and where we're at in timeline.
Speaker 1:That would have been in the 90s. That would have been in the 90s. And then we also at that time and I should have had my roundabout that time. But we also had the opportunity, once we got into the medical leasing business, that there was more people looking for new office space than there was what was available. And so that's when we actually branched out and went next door to what was the old Kro. Well, we turned the freezer department. What became a hair salon, the canned goods, was medical space and it's still today and it's still thriving. And then from that point the downtown became, I think, became really.
Speaker 1:My memory came back to why I love downtown so much and that was because I was young and it was thriving. And that was in the 60s and you walked all the shops. I shopped when I worked in the law office. I had an hour and a half for lunch and during that hour and a half I made that count. I shopped every day. Now you didn't make that much, let me assure you. I took home $47 a week but I could still shop a lot. Look around might be the more appropriate word, but that was when we had the Sutton and Leitner's and Euler's and Frank's. But that was when we had the Sutton and Leitners and Eulers and Franks and the Kresge's had the you know food counter and it was a thriving time downtown.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I think that is what prompted when everything changed, my Mr Maloney passed and the law offices were closed and we built the offices downtown. And it was kind of a starting point again, a start over point, because downtown was somewhat bleak. It was, there wasn't quite shops, there weren't very many shops downtown. There were more empty buildings than there were anything at that time. And what was there? Certainly closed up at 5 o'clock. And that's how I became very interested because of my love for downtown. It started back in the 60s, as I said, and so it just became a natural thing, but it was a movement that was starting really across the country. It wasn't just Marion, ohio or Ohio, and that's how I became involved in the Main Street program and learned, just not so much by joining, just by reading a lot and studying and taking quite a few chances back in the day and knowing, I think it's more of what you don't know. You're better off to just go for it. I agree with that, yeah.
Speaker 3:So I got into this too.
Speaker 1:If you look back and you go, why did I do that? But that was the start of the revitalization of downtown.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah. So you saw really the full cycle the heyday in the 60s and I get from what I understand this was before my time, but kind of early 70s and then into the late 70s and 80s we really saw a mass exodus, yes, from the downtown, a lot of drying up of those thriving places and spaces, and unfortunately it's not like they left and something else came in.
Speaker 1:It was just no, it was gone.
Speaker 3:Closed up.
Speaker 1:It was closed up, and gone and you could buy buildings 10 cents on the dollar really Right. It was still the legal district, though that did not. Yeah, it was the courthouses and city hall and attorneys, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, I'll say, fortunately, you know, being the county seat. You know I mean I visit a lot of small towns that don't have that luxury and so you know they didn't even have the benefit of having the law offices and the courthouses and some of the city and county offices that you know kind of kept some life around. So I mean I feel grateful that we've had that. But there was, we had a big downtown, or we still have a big downtown, and again back in the heyday when it was thriving, there were some really large businesses, multi-floor shopping and department stores, not just like one. I mean there was a lot of them.
Speaker 1:Yes, kiefer, you had Kiefer's, you had the Sutton and Lightner's and, like I say, you had Bueller's, had the sutton enlighteners and, like I say, you had a reward. Jc penny yes, learners yeah, you, you name it, it was.
Speaker 3:This is where you came yeah, yeah, and, and like you, I mean I've learned the history of all of these buildings, uh, from seeing the old photos and what they were in the day and hearing stories from some folks that were here for those heydays, and there was really a lot of great memories.
Speaker 1:A lot of feet on the street, a lot of feet on the street.
Speaker 3:Absolutely yeah. But it went away and you began to have the vision of what could we do to get some of that back. Now the department stores are not coming back. You know, I think you realize that then. But how could those spaces be reimagined, how could they be redone and reused in a new way? And you know, I think that's what started your journey.
Speaker 1:Well, and that would have been like we said in the 80s I suppose. But I had traveled, not a great deal, but traveled a bit and studied, and that's when the loft living came into play. We had. I read an article in Newsweek, as a matter of fact, and it mentioned the architect and it mentioned Palm Beach, florida, and how they had taken one of their worst streets that had great deal of prostitution and dilapidation, and turned it in Clematis Street and turned it into one of the biggest attention getters of the area. And so I got very interested when I was reading that and I thought, well, I just this architect had to be the greatest thing ever. And so I did.
Speaker 1:From the news week I made a pic, traced him down, made a phone call several phone calls actually and made a trip to Florida and met. Well, of course, before I went, he said now, where are you calling from? And I told him Marion Ohio. And he said oh, where are you calling from? And I told him Marion Ohio. And he said, oh sure. He said, come on down, you're not competition. I said no, I don't think we were competition in Palm Beach.
Speaker 1:And Marion, well, I love Marion. There's a little bit of difference there, weather mainly. But anyway, that's how I really started researching and looking and, you know, went to Milwaukee, went to New York and thought, well, there's no difference. Why can't we do this? Because I did realize that it was back. The handicap accessibility to the second floors was not going to bring offices to the second floor if you didn't have an elevator, and it was cost prohibitive to put elevators in buildings that didn't have them. And so you had to figure out in order to make the whole building work, you had to figure out what to do with the upper floors, and loft living became the catalyst that helped bring it back, because the rents from that made the whole building work versus just the income from the first floors.
Speaker 3:Right. So what was your first loft project and what time frame was that?
Speaker 1:I think the first one was the 148 West Center Street, which— Citizens, Loan Building yes. And took the second floor there, had my office there, and the reason I fell in love with that building was because that was a building that, because I was in the law office before I went down there multiple times to deliver documents, because the attorneys was in that building also, and I fell in love with this office that had the fireplace and the wood paneling.
Speaker 3:Yes, the bookshelves yes.
Speaker 1:I think you're well aware of that building. Yes, yes.
Speaker 3:So the irony here for listeners is that we just purchased this building, not from Lois there's been a longtime owner in between but yes, as we are familiar with a lot of the same spaces because we've come to own a lot of the things that Lois earlier owned. So, yes, I'm picturing this in my mind. Others wouldn't be able to. You can Now a loft apartment your beautiful office there, Actually a few different apartments in that space there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there were like 10 of them, I think, and we worked on that one and that was learning to deal with the state, to deal with the state, learning to deal with the fire department and learning to go through the hoops and make sure that everything was covered that was supposed to be covered, and also making people understand and realizing what law of living was. And it was kind of an introduction.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, so I think that was like 2005,.
Speaker 1:2006, something like that.
Speaker 3:And so, yeah, that was kind of where you cut your teeth on that type of project, which now we've, you know. But both learned a lot about bringing buildings up to commercial code and how you can work with code officials and fire officials to say, hey, maybe this isn't 100% to present day code, but it's a heck of a lot safer than sitting here vacant. So how can we work together to make it as safe as possible, as economically as possible? And those are sometimes very challenging conversations to try to come to that middle ground, because we each think that the middle ground might look a little different sometimes.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I mean, so that was the project where you learned some of those things and I mean, tell me about, you know, if you can remember back. I mean, this is almost 20 years ago now. You know what were the sentiments of people you know in the community in terms of is this going to work, you know? I mean, did you have a lot of naysayers? Did you have cooperation from some of those entities? Was this like totally cutting edge or you know what was.
Speaker 1:I think it was pretty cutting edge at the time because you know, there was the thought process of educating people about the wonders of downtown, and I remembered them and I loved them and you know it was always in my head. It was I guess I could see these buildings being done. You walk into a building and you can see what it could be, and I think that's something. I know that not everybody has that, but I was blessed to be able to do that and so, creating them in my mind, I knew exactly how I wanted to look and I had my own work crew. I didn't hire a construction company because you really couldn't afford to do it. You had to find people that you could work crew. I didn't hire a construction company because you really couldn't afford to do it. You had to find people that you could work for. And I would say no, no, no, I don't want the wall there, move the wall a little this way, move the wall a little that way. And I'd still visualize them Literally, you know they would pick the wall up and move it four feet, or pick the wall up and go the other way four feet.
Speaker 1:And it was because what you do? You deal with the originals, you don't you know. If it was an office suite, great. If it was just a one-room office, you made something out of a one-room office. It wasn't going in and redefining the whole building and gutting it, it was using everything that was there, and so that's where the imagination and the decor and the furnishings came in in a great way, and by starting to have people see them, I think Loft Living in Marion was just a matter of having people see what it really was, and that's where the loft tours came in to play in around that time across the street. Then to the Euler building. I know we had three, 400 people come through in a couple-hour period to look to see what Loft Living was. Yeah, yeah, and I think the community has embraced it and I think that they're very familiar with what Loft Living is now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I would agree. I mean I think it's become very commonplace, pretty popular. I mean we operate, you. You know we've got over 70 units downtown now and there's a lot of people that are seeking this out.
Speaker 3:You know, because they want something fun and funky and cool, and you talked about some of the constraints that you bump up against with trying to renovate old buildings and, on the one hand hand, it's very challenging but on the other hand, some of those constraints with the space and the way you have to lay things out and leaning into some of the historical features. That's also what makes it really unique, right and fascinating for people to see. You know what it was and have this. You know, beautiful bookshelves in their front room.
Speaker 1:that's, you know, 100 years old and you know something thatshelves in their front room that's, you know, a hundred years old and you know something that's authentic.
Speaker 3:you can't recreate that in a vanilla box that's out on the outskirts of town.
Speaker 1:No, no, you cannot. And it's the same with that building.
Speaker 1:You own that building, but you also own the building that had my office in started working in your other office, right yeah, the other office when I worked in the law office and that one was in I think it was 1916, that one was built and Mary Thompson, hayes Thompson was Mary Thompson's father and she was a client of Mr Maloney's and Hayes was an attorney and he started there. And so there's just this long line of history and it is. You've got beautiful lofts in there now. I called the upstairs the originals, but where my office for 20 years was is now loft. You've turned that into beautiful loft space.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And the building itself has been preserved for another 100 years.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Beautiful building. You have to orient people that are familiar with downtown Marion. So this is the building that Lulu's Toy Co and the Convention and Visitors Bureau is in, on the first floor, which has been renovated they're beautiful. And then the second and third floor are lofts. And, yeah, the second floor used to be offices and there again another you know area where there was, you know, bookshelves and books. I inherited a lot of books from you.
Speaker 1:Yes, I want to make sure you kept those. Yes.
Speaker 3:I do still have actually quite a lot of those books. Thank you From the law library. She left me with like 500 books and we had, you know, 20 tons of books or whatever that you know equates to. But just, you know, that was part of our story and the quirkiness there. Now, if I recall you telling me so, that was your first office downtown but then that also, like you, were only, I think, the third owner of that building or something, lifetime.
Speaker 1:And then you're actually the third owner. Oh, I think the third owner of that building or something lifetime You're actually the third owner.
Speaker 3:Oh, okay.
Speaker 1:I was the second owner because Hayes Thompson and the Mary Thompson, the daughter, the family owned it. And then I purchased it from that estate. Then Okay. And so I was the second owner and you are the third owner. Okay, yeah, and so you have to keep it for another 100 years.
Speaker 3:Well, we'll see.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're you know, four years in or something now We've got a day or two to go, yet.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, so yeah, but just you know, knowing that history and feeling that history and then us being able to share kind of the pieces of that building and everything are just really fun and special to me. I know that was a special building to you.
Speaker 1:Oh it was. It was a hard one. I knew it was the time and I knew you were the person that it was to go to, but it was still. It was difficult. It's difficult to you become very. I said I was fortunate to have a love affair with buildings and my husband was very happy about that also. But I did. I think you do fall in love with these buildings and all the potential. But the memories are are what make it all. Uh, continue, because you know. A prime example is okay, wyant's bookstore was downstairs. When I was in the law office, you would run downstairs to get whatever you needed form or paper or, uh, whatever you needed but you just ran downstairs to get it. Instead of picking up the phone now and placing your little order on Amazon, you would just run downstairs and it was very necessary. And the Weintz Bookstore prospered and where the lofts are, that's where they sold office furniture.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's so interesting to hear some of those stories and just again be connected through all of the people that have inhabited these buildings and been. I mean it's just there's just a lot of history and there's a lot of authenticity that you can feel in some of these old buildings and so, you know, you and I obviously share that passion for, for the buildings and then the people that are coming in that are, you know, being continuing to be pioneers opening businesses downtown, living downtown, being continuing to be pioneers opening businesses downtown, living downtown. Just as you were a pioneer very much 20 years ago. I mean, I'm curious, you know, when you first, you know, not only did you develop these apartments downtown, you also came and lived yourself downtown, had a gorgeous, very large loft that you lived, and I think that again, that helped catalyze the vision because you could show and tell.
Speaker 1:Yes, and that, literally, is what we did, and we lived in 9,000 square feet my husband dog we just had. I always said the reason we got along so very well we never argued because all you had to do is walk, turn your back and walk, you know 20 feet and you could say what you wanted to say and neither one of us could hear. So we just had a great still have a great relationship, but it was, that was. There is a season for everything, but that time, that season, was a glorious time for us and our granddaughters.
Speaker 1:We were very fortunate that during that time they were in, lived in Marion and came back and they grew up visiting the loft and they had their proms at the loft, they had homecomings, uh, and parties and slumber parties and that's what they, they remember, has always been downtown, has been a wonderful place yes, yeah and so, and from that you don't that, you don't know what you don't know, like I say, but I just feel so blessed and so fortunate and so awed by the fact that my granddaughters have taken hold of the downtown and they're developing their own buildings and they're running their own businesses.
Speaker 1:And Greta is my oldest granddaughter and along the way we had bought the Harding Center, the old Harding Hotel, and she has taken that over and is a fabulous manager, takes the best of care for her. It will last another hundred years under her supervision, and so I'm very happy about that. And, of course, lily and Sophie have done Fable.
Speaker 3:Yes, we had them on the podcast. If folks haven't listened to that episode, a few back here. We talked, like the other side of this perspective, where they did talk about coming and staying at grandma's loft, and just how cool it was and all of that, and yeah, I mean this just whole full circle of kind of family and community and you know how this has all come together. It's just really really neat.
Speaker 1:It is, and I think you'll probably see the same thing because your children are growing up right in the heart of it. They're right alongside you, working beside you, and I admire that so greatly because it is theirs. We're the keeper of the keys, yeah yeah.
Speaker 3:So that's one of your famous sayings that I've used before and I wanted to, if you didn't say that I have it written down here that I was going to bring that up. So you've always said that that you're the keeper of the keys for these old buildings, and talk a little more about what that means, and what that means to you and where you, kind of like, started thinking that way.
Speaker 1:Well, I think probably when you work in the downtown and then you get in your car and you go home to the suburbs, you don't become as attached to it as I did when I moved into the loft downtown and I lived there for, like I say, 16, 17 years and I think through that. You saw it morning, noon and night. You saw, you know, I could go up on the roof and watch the sunset and I could watch the first snowflakes and it was just an amazing time, watched the first snowflakes and it was just an amazing time. But then you also look about and realize, no, I didn't create any of this.
Speaker 1:This was created by our forefathers that had the genius to see what it was to put Marion, ohio, together and build these buildings. And the buildings have been built to withstand so much and the buildings have withstood all of the trials and tribulations and they're still here today. And I think that's the realization. When you look about and say, no, I didn't create this, I think it's my responsibility and I think it's all of our responsibility to care for it, because it is the heart Marion, is the heart of the county and it's the county seat and it is everyone's responsibility. But if you say you're going to take it on, you have to take these buildings on and love them, but you also have to realize that somebody else created them and therefore you are just the keeper of the keys.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and we have a responsibility to continue to take care of them. You know, and really, these buildings are built such that if we care for them, we keep a good roof on them and keep them in mechanical shape, they're going to last another hundred years. Are built such that if we care for them, we keep a good roof on them and keep them in mechanical shape, they're going to last another hundred years.
Speaker 1:They are and that is our responsibility, and I say that to anyone and that's why it was kind of not kind of. It was very intentional handpicking you to take over these buildings because you did, you love the community. You weren't, you knew it wasn't a get-rich-quick scheme.
Speaker 3:No no.
Speaker 2:I would have been wrong.
Speaker 1:If you didn't know it by now, you should know it by now. But it is very true, you do have to have a passion and you sometimes just have to put blinders on, because not everyone has that passion and you know they're slinging a little mud at you on both sides as you go down the street. But I think in the end and that's Well, I'm not at the end of my rope. I do think that, looking back, I can see that the dividends have paid off greatly, simply because the buildings are all in good use, have been. They're not the same thing as what they were. You have to be innovative at all times to figure out how can we make this work, how can we make it work financially, and that's you know.
Speaker 1:Like we said, loft living came in and bringing different businesses in, because the economy has changed greatly, the buying habits have changed greatly, changed greatly. The buying habits have changed greatly, and so you have to bring in things that will serve the community. And when you look about and see that there are great investments as far as event space, as far as restaurants, new restaurants are coming in there's one opening this week, as a matter of fact, and I understand there's potentially a couple more and as you develop and you really have taken on a tremendous project. When you took on the Lydia project, yes indeed, yes indeed. I shook my head when you did that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, well, rightly so, you know. But, just like you, I think that there's we've just seen that there are certain buildings that are worth preserving and certain you know, I know that you've done the same as me and you've looked back at historic photos and some of the missing teeth that our downtown has. We have some beautiful buildings and we have a lot of them and everything, but there was also some that have been lost along the way. That, gosh, you know, just feel like they shouldn't have been had there been people with the courage to, you know, to take them another round to the next iteration and really breathe that new life into them and reimagine what they could be.
Speaker 3:And Lily was one of those projects. It's a really prominent corner and, you know, right across from Founders Park and right on Main Street and Church Street, and so, you know, as you well know, as you said, you know, this is not a get rich quick thing. I mean, it is a real estate investment. So we do hope that we generate a return at some point on these projects, but it does have to be patient. Capital in these cases and it is what I say, and I know that you would agree with this too, with your approach is that we work at the intersection of for-purpose and for-profit, and that is where we truly are doing this, because we love the community, we love being able to build a place where we can all be proud of where we live and where we're from and what's going on and the momentum that's occurring. But at the same time, from a strictly investment standpoint, there are easier and more lucrative ways to turn a nickel on a dollar by far.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you don't have to sell your Cadillac and go rent one and be in debt again all over.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is.
Speaker 1:But you know, I think the payoff and, like I said, the payoff for me is the fact that the next generation and the generation thereafter is already seeing the benefits yes, and I just that just warms my heart just to see that. But it also makes you realize that it was the right thing to do. Preservation is so very important and finding new beginnings for these buildings is what it is about.
Speaker 1:If everybody just vacated, you wouldn't have there would be no heart of a community, and I think that's one of the hardest lessons. It is to try to teach people, because they will. Even today, you'll hear people and I do become a little irritated by it when they say there's nothing to do downtown. Well, excuse me, when was the last time you've been downtown?
Speaker 3:That's right.
Speaker 1:Well, it's been 10 years ago, but there wasn't anything to do. Right, right, well, okay.
Speaker 3:A lot has changed.
Speaker 1:A lot has changed and we have to be grateful for those changes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we've got some people listening that I know are in communities where maybe they're just at the very beginning stages of this type of project, and there's so many downtowns throughout Ohio and really throughout the United States that need reimagination. You know they're ready and you know there's some courageous people that are ready to take on a project, renovate a building, start a business. Maybe they're doing both to really catalyze this in their own community. And, as you think back, how was it that you rallied support and articulated your vision to people in those early days as you were starting to try to get this going?
Speaker 1:in those early days, as you were starting to try to get this going, I was well. I really was blessed to have a husband that never tells me no. That's the first thing. Okay, yes, support a spouse. Yes, key.
Speaker 3:I agree. Key to that Number one yes.
Speaker 1:And then my children didn't know any difference, so they just grew up in it. But persistence does pay off and no matter how many times I tried to explain things and if the answer came up no, I was quite certain they didn't understand what I was trying to tell.
Speaker 1:So I would go back again and say, could we just talk about this one more time? And finally it did get to the point that I did have quite a few people tell me this that you know they said when I would call for something, they said, well, you might as well give it to her, because she's not going to shut up until you do. And so it is just being persistent but doing what is right, not persistent and being wrong, but it's a community effort to do what is right for this downtown. Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:And if they didn't understand it, I was sure that if I could have one more shot I could make them understand it. And to study and to, as you have done. You travel dramatically to so many communities and look and see how it's been done, right, and you don't have to reinvent the wheel for everything. That's right. But you can take and tweak the ideas of other communities because you know ten heads are better than one. I say that's right. Yeah, yes.
Speaker 3:Exactly yeah. So I mean 10 heads are better than one. That's right. Yeah, yeah, exactly yeah. So I mean what you're talking about is some of the early, like tenant recruitment or, you know, sponsorships for downtown events and just all of that that goes into, you know, getting the ball rolling.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 3:You know, I think that you know, if we were to describe the way that this has went from a macro level, like I say, that you got the ball rolling and then we came along and started really helping push.
Speaker 1:Right very much so.
Speaker 3:To really try to develop some more momentum. Some other people have come along and helped push and it's starting to get lighter and better and faster.
Speaker 1:Right, and I think that one of the— there is one thing that I don't want to overlook is the fact that the whole community, back in late 90s and 2000,. There was the envisioning process that went on, and that's it was through the chamber and it was through the chamber and they literally went out and interviewed almost 1,800 people in the community on a one-on-one basis and asked what is it that you want to see for Marion? And out of that came one of the things that they wanted to see they wanted their downtown back, and so that was one of the great motivators for myself and others around, not so much to invest, but other leaders, knowing that they're doing what the people wanted. They wanted their downtown back.
Speaker 1:Yeah that they're doing what the people wanted. They wanted their downtown back, and so, with the envisioning process and talking and seeing what 1,800 people there was 1,765, if I remember correctly but what they really wanted, and so you weren't really alone. You knew that you were on the right track and then, like you say, I've been to other communities.
Speaker 1:I studied it. It's a study. It isn't just oh, I think I'll do this, you have to know. It's like learning to cook, which I never really picked up. That art too well, says my husband, but it is something that you just have to learn about it. And it's not a class that you can go to. It's not a college that you can go to. It's experience. That is your best teacher.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, Well, and it's seeing what's working in other communities and definitely trying to rip and duplicate as we can. Seeing what's working in other communities and definitely trying to rip and duplicate as as we can, but at the same time, there is a degree of faith in this where you just got to build it and and see who comes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, you know, that was as you talked about close your eyes and just go through it.
Speaker 3:Exactly Some of those. You know early loft projects and and different things that have come about, and you know things we've done as well. It's like well, we have a strong sense that we believe this can work, but there's no guarantee until we do it and see who shows up.
Speaker 1:No, and what you have done is take just, for instance, the space we're in now. I mean this is a great building. Just, for instance, the space we're in now. I mean this is a great building. You purchased that, we owned it, you purchased that from us. But when I walk in and see the lower level, it's gorgeous. You've breathed new life into it, you've found purpose for it and it's working. It just takes multiple minds and multiple processes to get it where it's supposed to be. Yeah, yeah, and so you know I've said this before and I will say it again I am so grateful that Luke Henry has come along and taken this on, maybe not knowing exactly what he was getting into maybe not knowing exactly what he was getting into.
Speaker 1:But it is a family affair and your children have grown up in it and your wife has certainly been involved from beginning to end in multiple ways.
Speaker 3:Yes, she has, that's right.
Speaker 1:Running businesses, making buildings work when nobody else would come along to do it.
Speaker 3:And I think that is the beauty of it and more and more people are seeing that, yeah, yeah, well, I very much appreciate that and I feel the same about you and your family and you know what the way that our paths continue to stay intertwined and just being able to really work together. You need some allies in these types of projects to feel like we're working towards the same vision and we're crystallizing that vision day by day and we're seeing some things work and some things not work, and taking the hits on what's not and continuing to try to work forward on what is working.
Speaker 1:And I agree.
Speaker 3:it's so gratifying to see additional generations coming through and really this is what cities are all about. Cities are places for all people and all ages and just the diversity of thought and age and background and all of that coming together and really building a downtown and a community overall that's different and diverse and you have different people working together. It's just really cool to see it.
Speaker 1:It is, and living downtown and I'm an expert because I've lived here for so long but it's wonderful just to be able to walk across the street and do your shopping, to go and go to the bookstore or go to the now the coffee shops and and the it's wonderful to have a grocery down here now it it really and truly. There's been such development and the you know Cliff has. Edwards has had great vision in in doing the things that he's done and I just think that that brings a lot of people into the downtown to the medical facility, center Street Clinic, and it's all about everybody working together and being good neighbors working together and being good neighbors.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and that is something that when all of this started, way back when the downtowns were here, but when, I think, originally way back in the 40s, when they were coming home from wars, they were back in World War I and World War II.
Speaker 1:Basically, you know, they built little houses and everybody moved out and you know they would go to their jobs and they would leave their jobs and they would go home and pull the blinds down and pop down in front of their new TV and that was, you know, starting the demise of and we've started the resurrection not we, as you and I, but across the United States, has started the resurrection back up again, and that is the Main Street approach, and we are soon to become a Main Street community, and that's going to be something that is very worthwhile, something that is very worthwhile, and it will also be a great tool to bring more business in, because when you have that designation, other communities and other business they pay attention because you've had to meet a certain criteria and we have met that criteria.
Speaker 1:And so I think, from way back then to the realization now that the malls I think the mall era has pretty much had a demise also and they're having to figure out what to do with that space Rather than coming and taking away our business they have to reconfigure and figure that out again too.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah reconfigure and figure that out again. Yeah, yeah, I think what a lot of people are realizing is that the way the downtowns were built to be walkable and to have mixed uses, with people living and working and having entertainment and food and beverage and all of that all in one place that's actually a really, really human centric way to live and to exist and to have community. And you know, I often point out to people that a lot of the new communities that are being built out in fields are just fake downtowns.
Speaker 1:They are, that are brand new. I can name a couple of them in Columbus, but you know, it's true, yeah, which is you know which is which is great.
Speaker 3:You know they've recognized what people 100 and 200 years ago that were laying out all these towns said hey, we need to be close to each other, we need to have community, we need to see each other as we're walking about and we need to make this walkable. And it's it's so impersonal and lonely to ride in cars all the time. We want it to all be in one place. And I think now we're kind of realizing like, oh, this is actually pretty cool and you know when we can live and work and do all these things in close proximity.
Speaker 1:It is and you know you bring up it's like the Harding Center. I mean it went through almost a demise because the roof was gone off of it and it was in the mid-90s that I was not involved. But there was a group of wonderful human beings that lived in Marion, ohio, that said we can't let this happen and got very involved and had a leader that wouldn't take no for an answer and saved the Harding Hotel.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I can't imagine not having it in our downtown.
Speaker 1:And you know it's 100 years old. Its birthday depends on how you calculate it. Its birthday was last year, but it's really. The birthday is in February of this year, but it's really. The birthday is in february of this year, but it's, uh, a hundred years ago. And if people walk in today, they still say the same thing. And it isn't. It isn't my creation. It was a hundred years ago. They created this beautiful, beautiful structure that you walk in and we get the same response from everybody that comes in first time. Oh, I can't believe this.
Speaker 1:And you're so lucky to have this Spectacular. And so that is back to being the keeper of the keys again. But in the mid-'90s another group figured out how to make it work, and so we just continue. We've had that one for 12 years. 12 years, yes, and seems like yesterday, but everything seems like yesterday.
Speaker 1:So, but you know, you've got 67 apartments of people, 67 portions of families that live there, and the same across the street. You know, introduction and finding that, and you'll see them walking on the streets. You see them walking to the restaurants as it did, like you say, 100 years ago. That was the way it was built.
Speaker 3:That's right. That's right, yes. So as you look back over this, now coming up 25 years in the downtown, you said 43 years really, since you started real estate investing. I mean, what are you most proud of as you look back over that period of time?
Speaker 1:I'm very partial to say I'm most proud of my granddaughters and my family that have seen the value of all this and have learned to love it the way I do. That makes me so happy. But I think sometimes, like I say, you just do what you do, you don't really think about it too much. But when you people start to talk to you about something, you go well. Yes, you know, I went well yes, I did.
Speaker 1:You know I went in and we used to own that, or we did that, or, you know you don't really think about it. I think when you don't really think about it, I think when you. When I will think about it most is when I quit, totally quit, because we still we're slowing down, but you know we haven't thrown in the towel yet.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:But we're looking toward drying off pretty good.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, I mean that is you know, as you think about legacy, I guess you know it's not a single project or you know I'm sure there's. You know all of your buildings you love I mean we talked about a lot of them, that you've been part of projects there.
Speaker 1:Truly, you know, the legacy is if the people coming behind you, especially family, are willing to continue it on and carry on that flag based on the example you said and the vision that you cast. That's truly what it's all about. That truly is what it is all about. And we've done over 30 buildings and I like to say that we've gotten them to their rightful owners, where people are taking them and have created their own vision with them. We've kind of saved them and moved them on to the next one, and I think that that is a very good thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely so. If that's what you're proud of from the past, I mean, what are you most excited about for downtown Marion as you look ahead to the future here?
Speaker 1:Well, I think one of the things that, as you know, you've done Main Street Reimagined on South Main Street. I really started on Center Street and did Center Street, and so now I'm excited about what we're calling the St Mary's District of North Main Street and looking at the businesses that are going in there and the attention that that's going to be getting. And I think it is just one more, because there have been some buildings that really did decay over the years, which is very sad. But I think that is the next exciting adventure is the St Mary's District and, of course, the church is there and it's such a beautiful facility. And so, from Center Street going north, we're looking at that and redeveloping that, and it's so interesting to see that, well, taco Central is opening this week, and so it isn't, and Fable is there and the Nest is there, and Shovel City is there, and there's more and more coming, and it is that is what I find so amazing to watch.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I agree and I mean I'm totally in support of all of that, as we've talked many times. A rising tide lifts all boats here and you know we don't we sort of have the monikers of some of the different districts, but in the end it's all the downtown and it all benefits one another, because the more restaurants there are downtown, whether they're on this block or that block or the other, people still see it as downtown Marion, and that's what you know. We want to encourage them to continue to view positively because there is so much, and that's what you know. We want to encourage them to continue to view positively because there is so much great that's happened in downtown Marion, certainly in the last 20 years, but especially in the last, I'd say, five years. You know, as we look, we've got some of those statistics in the last, you know, five or six years, with 50 new businesses and over 50 buildings that have changed hands, and just you and just so much that's really activated these places and spaces and I too am excited about you.
Speaker 3:know, we're not done.
Speaker 1:None of us.
Speaker 3:We continue to have vision for the future.
Speaker 1:And you know you talk about the generations. I have three daughters and four granddaughters and there will be more generations coming out of that and it will be as that's when you look back and, I think, say you know, we did make a difference.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And it was all worth it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yes. Well, I appreciate you being on with me today. This has been such a fun journey and also just appreciate for you having the vision that you did, putting in the work that you have, and just for helping me as I got started. I still remember when we ran into each other and you said I heard you bought some buildings. If you want to talk, come and see me. And I did.
Speaker 3:And we had a great talk that first time. I still remember it very well meeting in your office in the Euler building there, and we've had lots of conversations since then.
Speaker 1:So it's been great to be working together. Thank you, I agree wholeheartedly. Yes, yes, thank you, I agree wholeheartedly.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes. So yeah, if you want to share any parting words or you know contact info or any of that, I'll give you an opportunity to.
Speaker 1:I think my only parting words would simply be that this is there is no they, it's us, and it is all of us that make a community and it's all of us that have to work and support one another and in the end we're going to have a great community and it will continue to thrive. And as far as me, I'm kind of an open book, you know. I still get ideas. I think, oh, we should do this, and so we just kind of go off and do it.
Speaker 1:And, like I say in the beginning, probably my greatest gift is I have a husband that you know would say to me, if I told him I wanted to go to buy the Empire State Building, his only request would be do you think you'll be home for dinner? You know, it was never so. I think those are the things that we have to look at, but all in all, I would say it is a wee effort. It is a wee effort and not everybody has to own a building, but people do need to support one another so that we don't go through what we've been through in the past. That is it.
Speaker 3:I agree. Well said Well. Thank you again, lois. Thank you to our listeners. If you've been listening along, you'll definitely recognize kind of the culmination of a number of different conversations that we've had that this represents, with chatting with Lois. With chatting with Lois If you've not listened to the episode with her granddaughters, lily and Sophie, be sure to listen to that one and all of our episodes, just to be inspired, educated. If you're doing this work in your community, you are our people and we appreciate what you're doing. Here or elsewhere, there's a lot of good work to be done. There's a lot of great buildings out there that we want to be diligent and thoughtful keepers of the keys as well in those other communities. So best wishes to you. Thanks again for listening today.
Speaker 2:Thanks for listening to the Main Street Reimagined podcast. To learn more about Main Street Reimagined Henry Development Group, more about Main Street Reimagined Henry Development Group or our work in downtown Marion Ohio, please visit MainStreetReimaginedcom If you want to connect or if you know someone who we need to interview. Shoot us an email at info at MainStreetReimaginedcom. Until next time, keep dreaming and don't be afraid to take the leap.