Riding Beyond The 20% Rule

emmajenkinsondressage@gmail.com

https://youtube.com/@emmajenkinsondressage?si=Zt9ma9vtpMK2iZV7

Transcript

Episode Warmup And Tech Hurdles

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hi Karen, can you hear me okay? I can. Can you hear me okay? Yes, I couldn't find the video though, but I do now.

unknown 0:08

All right.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

So good morning. Thank you so much for joining us. I am so sorry I was late. It's not a good look. It was just, you know, I try to be on time for things, but enough about that. What

Debunking The 20% Rule

SPEAKER_00 0:23

I wanted to talk about today was plus size writers and also about that 20% rule and your thoughts on that.

SPEAKER_01 0:34

My thoughts on that. My thoughts on that are people who can't do math very well and very regularly. Um, I, as a judge, get to see all kinds of uh partnerships. And most commonly I see a ton of tall or large kids on small ponies and small adults on large ponies where the 20% rule doesn't seem to apply because the pony's cute. Uh I go to corridor shows all the time where there's no question the 20% rule doesn't apply because it's a man. And I feel like a lot of times the 20% rule is just an easy way to kind of attack uh visual uh issues with riders, right? I mean, as if we don't already know that we're plus sized, we don't need that pointed out, as if we're not already aware. So the best thing, in my opinion, to do is make sure our attack fits us and our horse well and to check for signs of tension all the time. But I do really feel like it's just an easy out and an easy way to kind of um scream that there's uh abuse going on because of someone's weight when there's abuse going on, like every other rider in some capacity, either with a forfeiting bit or a forfeiting saddle. Um, and I just think it's it's it's rubbish. I've done enough interviews with enough saddle fitters where they've also debunked it. I've taken enough lessons with enough Olympians that are they have no problem with my weight or how I manage my weight. It's about balance in the saddle and whether or not our tack fits us and our horse so that we can better aid them to lifting their back if that's what we're doing as far as exercises go.

SPEAKER_00 2:10

Excellent. I've heard a little bits and pieces of this on your social media, so it's nice to put it all together.

SPEAKER_01 2:17

Well, to be fair, I mean, it's not like we're riding small ponies, right? Or underweight horses.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

And back in the day when they have been a lot smaller horses that we were dealing with and things like that.

SPEAKER_01 2:29

I I'm fortunate enough to work with uh a purebred Spanish Mustang, which is as the original conquistures brought over from Spain as the horses here. And they're used to full-grown men back in the day who were definitely in shape, eating their protein with armor on. And this guy's petite and hardy. The Arabians are petite and hardy. There's a lot of petite and hardy horses, however, you know, I think it's just really easy for a lot of people to just blame a look whether or not we see any kind of um sensitivity or disruption to fluidity. And that's just a shame. But I do appreciate, however, that there's a lot more saddle fitters and um outfit designers that are accommodating the normal bodies that are now um comfortably riding and equestrians.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

And that's

Inclusive Riding Apparel Brands

SPEAKER_00 3:19

a perfect place to slip in here. What are a couple brands that you work with that are going to fit us plus size ladies?

SPEAKER_01 3:27

I know the bigger brands, like like Smart Pack has done a really great job. Um they used to have the fuller fill fillies, they did fantastic. Um, the Hunter people are getting more into um plus size, you know. I I started with Bell Eck. Uh, they go to an extra large. However, I'm a size 18 and on all of their shirts fit me. PH Glothing Co. is one of my first uh people who who continuously checks in with me. How does this fit you? How does this fit your plus size client, pants-wise, shirts-wise? Um, I adore her. Um, and she's always wanting to accommodate, never wants to leave anyone out. I know um the Blossom Creek lady with the the winter beautiful clothing that um I just met recently during the giveaway. Uh, also, same way. How can we accommodate both smaller, petite, and larger, um, both in height and in weight and and roundness. Um, and then Teandro, Equestrian, she is very adamantly trying to make sure no one feels left out. I actually feel bad for the men now because I I feel like we really have some great brands here that are, oh, Castell, like I'm wearing an XXL and Castell, they've really upped their game and it's too big on me. Um, so I think a lot of brands are really working on getting um much more accommodating within the size range for sure.

SPEAKER_00 4:48

Yes, I think nowadays there's actually some britches on the market that I can order. I just like things a little bigger because I have some kind of deformity and pain there. And so like tight britches are just not right what I like, but I like bridges. So very cool. And then there is my little thing of questions.

Finding Balance Beyond Symmetry

SPEAKER_00 5:10

So any tips for improving your riding or finding a more balanced seat if you're a bigger or smaller rider, because that's really I think what's important here versus a weight, but riding that weight differently to help your horse.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

I think balance is a relative thing that most riders are not taught to accommodate. And what I mean by this, I I was, you know, I'm I'm a child of the 80s, right? So we were taught to be in forward position in 2.4 hours on end, right? And we have that muscle memory. However, most instructors, in the time that we're allowed, um, feel kind of pressured to go ahead and push on towards you, you know, meeting your riding goals. And we tend to just, you know, evaluate what we can at the time because we don't want to be met with combativeness and or lose a client, right? The problem that a lot of people have is as we sit more, as we age, our our hips and our shoulders and our backs tend to adjust. And when we're sitting in a saddle, a lot of times we're seeing the profile of a rider. Um, as an instructor, as as we take photos, we're seeing the profile and we try to adjust the profile instead of the cause, right? A lot of people want to have even stirrups, though their hips might not allow for that. And and uh, you know, I had some riders with me um this past weekend when I was judging, and they were like, hey, the the stirrups are uneven, because they were trying to find things that they could learn to visually, yes, but the hips are even, and this rider's shoulders are even. So let's allow for their hips to be a little uneven. If that allows, if a longer stirrup allows for them to swing their leg much more freely versus having to adjust their whole body, um, then let's allow for that. I think a lot of people aren't taught to be dynamic in the saddle and really move around. And I could be using the wrong word, it might be static, but the the the word meaning can can I teach my muscles to move versus strain and push into a shoulder bag? Can I teach my body to allow and move with the movement of this horse and adjust with the movement of this horse? Can I start to really own myself and know where I need to maybe shift to help better balance an unbalanced horse? That's also a huge um impact on this statement because I can teach you to be completely balanced on a non-moving animal. And then the animal comes in and is completely unbalanced, and it's extremely frustrating at that point. Are you still with me? I hope you're still with me. I'm just gonna keep chatting. Your your face went away. Um, I'll just I'll I'm good at just rambling on. When we have an unbalanced horse, uh and I I mentioned this, I think in a video recently, where at camps I have riders play tug of war. And the goal being, of course, to get the flag across the line. And the rider never thinks about what they look like, they think about the goal and how can I adjust better to to reach the goal. And as trainers, a lot of us are much more willing to adjust our position to help the horse better understand what we're asking of them and better adjust their their own balance and become more fluid andor strong. And then, you know, if we're getting ready to show, we'll adjust uh to have a little bit better equitation. But I tend to think that most um non-professionals, amateurs, that um it's it's generally called, tend to ride towards a look, not necessarily the functionality for them and or their horse. And that's kind of where I wish our community would better help. If I've got a really top-heavy rider, I'm not gonna teach them to kind of strain back. That is a strain that's gonna cause a huge strain on their backs, that's gonna cause pain. I'm gonna teach them to maybe do things one-sided, maybe elongate their body, maybe allow themselves to shift around a little bit so that their parts are a little bit more balanced and better to help and aid into the transitions or whatever movement you may be asking for.

SPEAKER_00 8:56

Wow. Just all the technical difficulties, I guess, today.

SPEAKER_01 9:01

No worries, no worries. We're good. Okay. Where were we? Yeah, okay. So we were chatting about balance, and I did. She told me to keep going, so I kept going a little bit, and I've kind of rounded that up. Okay, perfect. There's a lot of rambling and ums.

SPEAKER_00 9:17

Thank goodness she's here. That's why we do this as a team. Um,

Advice For Young Equestrians

SPEAKER_00 9:21

so this is something I've just started. I'm gonna try asking kind of the same question in all of our episodes. So, what advice would you want to give, like your top advice to a younger person? I know your daughter's going into the industry, um, possibly. And just what would you want to tell them about going into your industry?

SPEAKER_01 9:46

What advice would I give a young person going into the industry? Observe and take uh take what best suits you, your core, uh, your heart. Um, be willing to adjust, be willing to advocate for yourself and your horse. Um, be willing to learn from as many as you can, be willing to ask questions. I think uh a lot of times we kind of go with the flow and are pushed to go with the flow. I did talk to somebody about this yesterday that most working students are youthful because they're much easier to manipulate and kind of um adjust and keep quiet. And I think asking why we're doing things and and stick to your core. Like, is this something that you're comfortable with? If not, be be able to move along. Take what you can, and that might even be a I will never do that. Um, and then try to stay off social media. Uh, I I I'm fortunate that I did not grow up or go through my first divorce um on social media, uh, or my life would probably look different now. But uh yeah, find a core group, find find some sort of like release, but stay off social media with the negativity. Try to find grace and and professionalism if you can.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

Yes, I think I was just writing about exactly what you said of thinking about my internships back in the day, and I just I didn't know who I was quite or what I wanted, you know, what my morals were in the first place. I didn't know what they were doing, and then so hard to hold your ground. And and I also really didn't know, I didn't even have any questions to ask. I was just very starstruck. I think it's really important.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

I I do say this fairly regularly. I have no issue admitting I have been an abusive person, either due to my environment, due to the pressure of my environment or the coach in front of me, or because that's what I knew. That is why I am where I am now. I'm now able to see differences and adjust. So I I was telling someone, um, like same person yesterday, uh, when I was in Europe, we we pulled horses, we popped them as they went over fences. And she was like, Why would you do that? And I was like, Well, I was 18 and everyone I lived with did it. And I just I just assumed I didn't know that this is how we did things. And I think to really see the deep, dark side of our industry, there's a lot there, which is why I'm not on that aspect of the industry that I'm not comfortable with and I will not do. However, I am happy to own that I have done horrible things and will never do them again. But that also helps me to understand that some of these forces that have come from situations, I know what they might have been through, and now we can better um adjust and guide them to a more positive training scenario.

SPEAKER_00 12:32

Awesome. Yeah, I think biggest one like question everything doesn't matter if you're new and even for people taking lessons is to it doesn't seem right, ask why. And if they can't tell you why, like yes.

SPEAKER_01 12:45

Why are we doing this? Why are we adding this? Why are you adjusting this? Yes, because remember, as instructors, our job is to teach you to be able to ride without us. As trainers, my job is to be able to explain to you why I'm doing this now and may not be doing it later. This is the point in training, right? And and that's that's our job. We have to be able to explain it. There might be moments where I'm like, hey, I'll get back to you in a minute. We need to address this right now, but we should be able to be knowledgeable and confident enough to answer that question and humble enough to say, I don't know the answer to that. I will reach into research it and get back to you.

SPEAKER_00 13:19

Yeah, and that, yeah, at least that. And we love that. We love teachers who are also already learners. Listen, keep learning, right? We can all keep learning, and it's great. And on

Putting The Horse First

SPEAKER_00 13:32

that note, the other question I'm gonna start asking everybody is what are one or two things um equestrians can do to put their horse first? A little nod to Isabel's past podcast called Putting the Horse First. But just in your opinion, one thing that people can do to put their horses first.

SPEAKER_01 13:54

Realize that each horse is an individual, and that horse is your partner, and you are their partner, which means you're their advocate, you're their coffee buddy, you're their vent system, you're their caretaker, you're their everything for the hour, two hours, three hours that you're with them. Document how they are, how do they adjust to things differently? And start to think instead of maybe a lot of people want to take the horse into that corner and she just keeps showing them the corner and they're not observing how the horse might be reacting to the corner. Does my horse need to feel like they have a partner or someone that's pushing them, right? Can I feel like I have a partnership here, which means now as a partnership, we're going into the scary corner? Or is this a horse that needs to see it, address it, and then be like, okay, I'm good. So I think knowing your horse, knowing your horse's response, being able to really kind of think about what your horse needs in a situation, and then be comfortable telling your instructor, hey, I'm gonna stay out of that corner right now. It's it's not worth it. He'll get really hyped up. But I really like to keep him below threshold. So I think really knowing your partner well, as if, you know, you could go buy them a Christmas gift or birthday gift without even thinking, right? You could order their coffee before they get there. That kind of relationship is the goal, in my opinion, to have a really good partnership connection and be a good advocate for your horse. So if you know your horse well enough, you should be able to know when they're not feeling right, when they're not mentally right, when it's just not the time, and or when they can be pushed a bit.

SPEAKER_00 15:21

Well, thank you so much, Karen. I'm gonna start wrapping it up. I know that you have places to be and go, but thank you for joining me. I've been looking forward this for a long time. So I don't know why all the technical difficulty.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

Um, I we always we always have hurdles, don't we? As equestrians, we always get to have a hurdle first. Yeah, no worries.

SPEAKER_00 15:39

Well, thanks so much for being a good sport.

Karen’s Subscription Group And Clinics

SPEAKER_00 15:42

And at the same time, I would love to uh have you now just talk about your online program and what you have to offer that people who might listen might come and come to you for.

SPEAKER_01 15:55

Yeah. I appreciate that. Thank you. I do have social media, uh, I do have a YouTube channel, uh, TikTok, Instagram, which throws everything over to Facebook, which I'm very rarely on, um, as far as my business page. I do clinics and I judge and I apprentice a lot because again, I'm here to learn in every industry that I possibly can within the equestrian world. And that said, I keep a private subscription page. Thank you so much for mentioning that. Uh, we do meet on Facebook, it's just easier. Um, and I do a live uh once a week, sometimes with the horses, sometimes I bring in videos or magazines or we just discuss. Um, and that we meet on Mondays. And I also share lessons that I'm teaching throughout the week that I will not post on social media. I am not here to let anyone be subject to what I'm willing to put myself out there for because I want people to realize they're not alone. They're not alone in how their hips work, they're not alone in how their reaction is, they're not alone in, hey, it's too cold for me to ride, or I'm riding in the rain. There's so many different aspects, and none of them are wrong. It's just where we are on our journey. So I do have that group. Um, you can sign up on my website for it, or you can message me about it. And I thank you so much for even being supportive and mentioning it. I really appreciate that.

SPEAKER_00 17:04

No, I'm looking forward to that. And you know, I'm friends with um Gabby. We met through podcasting, and we've gotten quite close. And um she has mentioned what you said. She's like, you know, I had I wouldn't have known, and I even have been on your website, but she's like, you get that 20-minute mindset call with Karen if you do that, and I think that's so cool.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

So I I I do hope to start my own podcast this year. I have wanted to for a long time, and and my own anxiety holds me back, my own feeling not worthy enough holds me back, and technical difficulties, right, holds me back. But I think this year is the year, right?

SPEAKER_00 17:40

It's well, let us know if we can support you in any way in that.

SPEAKER_01 17:43

I appreciate it. Yes, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

I have been wanting to do virtual and but I don't really ride um because of my health. Like winter's got me inside anyway. However, I have quite an interest in learning how to judge, but I don't know how we would do that online. Kind of

Virtual Judging Lessons And Show Day Optics

SPEAKER_00 18:05

want to learn the ins and outs, especially of maybe some little dressage tests. So I was wondering if that's something we could do over virtual.

SPEAKER_01 18:13

It is something we can do over virtual. Um, I I have thought about doing um uh like a month thing where we meet on a certain day at a certain time within a group, potentially on a Zoom, where we discuss. Um, I think enough people don't realize how to break down what we are as judges are allowed to judge you on, allowed to comment on. We cannot coach you. We have to be kind and guiding without coaching. Um, and and I think enough people do not realize where the criteria of all the movement is. It's written on the page, right? Um, why some horses do better than other horses. Um, and and generally it comes to tempo and fluidity in between. And then I don't think enough instructors right before a show sit where the judge is going to be sitting to see where our flaws are. Um, most of us are on the side or in the middle of the arena, and that changes the angle drastically. Um, and so it really, and and again, I I do videos where I seem so catty and I feel so bad about it. Of what you wear makes a huge impact on what we visually see. Um, because if you're coming down the center line and your spurs are and your stirrups are all sparkly, you look frantically moving those legs in the saddle. If you've got pinstripes and you are a little unbalanced, I'm now glancing at you, and now I'm freely able to say you're now my problem versus the horse being the issue, right? Um yeah. And so I think we we do talk about those a lot. We do talk about it in the subscription page. Uh, last night we actually discussed uh profile photos and how lighting angle, uh you know, even placement makes a huge impact on how the confirmation looks. And so we do discuss that a lot, but I'm more than happy to discuss that.

SPEAKER_00 19:51

That is very encouraging to hear. And on recording, just Karen has virtual lessons. I know several people who just take lessons that way. It is quite effective uh for someone like her who can really see what's going on on a video to really give some good instruction.

SPEAKER_01 20:11

Well, I will mention so what I do is and I I encourage a lot more people to do FaceTime versus Pivot. Pivot quits tracking and then I have to like go in and override it, and I keep kind of losing, but I can hear your tempo, so I can kind of keep talking through that. But it becomes a bit of a mess sometimes. Um FaceTime, it's just it's just a screen, like you're right. And I'm able to then take my phone and video whatever I've got. And let's say you're on the computer and I can even have the laptop going if I need the tablet going, and then you can hear my voice coaching you, and then I send it back to you in Facebook Messenger. Um, and that makes a huge difference because I don't think a lot of times we get to see ourselves in the saddle. We get to see that moment. Um, most of the time, people want the scary moments or the the fiasco moments, but and that's fine and that's for them. But I will always say, Hey, do you mind if I post this on the group? This is something I see so common, and I want people to realize you're not alone in this. And so um, everything that you'll see when you join the group is is people have said yes, share, share away. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 21:13

Well, awesome. Well, I don't want to take too much of your time. I know you have a lesson after this, but thank you so much, Karen.

SPEAKER_01 21:20

My pleasure. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_00 21:22

Of course, and I do hope to have you on again for a couple other subjects.

Online Business Reality And Closing

SPEAKER_00 21:26

I'd love to talk to you sometime about online business and how that's going because you do have quite a bit of followers, and we're just very curious, honestly.

SPEAKER_01 21:35

Uh, I make no money. I I genuinely. I think people need to hear that. Like, I make I make no money. I have done everything in my power to figure out how to make more money. What I do is I try to stay positive and think it's going to come back to me in other ways. Um, and it it has been a long time coming. Uh, I don't get frustrated online. I do get frustrated with like hauling to like driving to lessons when I think people are rude to me. Um, because that is like me spending time and money and effort. But I no, I don't make money. And most of the equestrian world isn't gonna pay. They'll send you clothes, but they don't pay um us, they don't have the ability to. The equestrian world's pretty tight. So um the money is is not there as far as this.

SPEAKER_00 22:19

I think I think we could all use the reality tech, but I also think that the online aspect of business is just a reality now for everybody. And there's so much about it I would love to just discuss with you sometime because people don't quite a lot of older school people are are coming around to virtual instruction, um, online horse shows, and the fact that if they want to run a business, they may have to branch out to going on the online.

SPEAKER_01 22:46

Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 22:47

We have to adjust sometime or something like that. Absolutely. But I will just definitely reach out and thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. Looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_01 22:57

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 22:58

All right, I will let you go. Thank you. Bye.