Can AI Write With Soul? Marketing That AI Can't Replace | MARIE HÉLÈNE - Part 1

In this Part 1 episode of Rooted and Routed Podcast, we explore the fascinating journey of Marie Hélène, a French expat who has lived in India, New York, and Europe. With corporate experience at Renault, KLM, and Tommy Hilfiger, Marie transitioned to become an independent brand strategist, excelling in remote work before it became mainstream.

Marie shares insights on adapting marketing strategies to different cultures, key challenges in global team management, and the importance of human-centric branding. She also dive into her wellness journey as a certified yoga instructor, explaining how yoga helps her balance corporate life, boost creativity, and integrate a personal touch in AI-driven content. 

Join us for an engaging conversation on expat life, marketing, wellness, and personal growth!

Key Topics:

• Expat challenges and rewards
• Transition from corporate to independent brand strategist
• Remote work and the future of work-life balance
• Marketing across cultures and customer-centric strategies
• The role of AI in copywriting and branding
• The role of Discipline from yoga and wellness impact personal growth

Join us for an engaging discussion on how AI, wellness, and marketing come together to shape a more balanced and successful work-life approach.

Rooted and Routed is a global mobility and cross-cultural storytelling podcast hosted by Sabiya Pathan Withoeck. New episodes every week.

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Transcript

Introduction & Meet Marie Hélène

Marie Helene 0:00

No, I mean Tunis in two years. Yeah. But before that, I was in Mumbai. Yes. I was in Rushikesh. And I I never left from that point, I would say. You walked in the Budapest, yeah. I lived in um Geneva, Lausanne for a few months. In Switzerland. So New York. Amsterdam. Amsterdam. Vienna. Vienna. Amsterdam again. A bit of Budapest and Lausanne in between. And then to Rishikesh and from Rishikesh to Pune's, whatever you are to.

Speaker 1 0:32

To Mumbai.

Speaker 2 0:33

To Mumbai.

Speaker 1 0:33

Yeah. I went to from Rishikesh to Goa, then from Goa to Mumbai, and then from Mumbai to Pune. And everything happened just like that.

Sabiya 0:58

Hi, welcome to Rooted and Routed Podcast. The podcast about expat life. We're back with another episode and another interesting guest today. She's from France. There seems to be some French connection that I have. So, yes, another French expert. Her name is Marianne. She has been living in India since two years. Five years, five years. There it is. So you see, I don't know much about her. We're gonna know, try to know what is her profile like, her background, and let's hear from you more in details. Let me introduce a little bit about your profile. She is into marketing, a marketing professional who has uh been an expert in brand strategy, content strategy. She has been a copywriter, she writes, she blogs, she's a blogger. And she is also on the wellness side an expert in yoga, uh yoga practitioner, a reiki practitioner. Uh anybody therapist. I don't know if I've missed anything else. Let's hear from her. Mario, welcome. Thank you. Nice to see you. Thank you. Uh I'm happy that we do this, and I get to know more about you and more about your expat journey. I've I really thought that you were in India since two years.

Why Marie Chose to Stay in India During COVID

Marie Helene 2:28

No, I mean since two years. Yeah. Uh, but before that I was in Mumbai. Yeah. Uh I came, I was traveling a lot to India. Yeah. And I happened to be here during the lockdown in 2020. I was in Rushikesh. And I I never left from that point, I would say.

Sabiya 2:47

Rishikesh.

Marie Helene 2:48

Yes. During COVID or before COVID? Uh right before. Okay. And COVID happened, and I made the choice not to go back home.

Sabiya 2:59

Oh. Okay. It's good to know you because it's it's a move that people don't take just like that, uh, a decision of not going back home. Yeah. And what meaning to glad if I maybe?

Marie Helene 3:12

No, I was thinking, so uh I used to live in Amsterdam.

Sabiya 3:15

Yeah.

Marie Helene 3:16

Uh had a really nice apartment, but like everybody, a very small apartment in the city center of Amsterdam. And I thought, okay, so I can either go to go back to Amsterdam and spend three months locked in my 50 square meter. Or I can stay where I am, close to the Ganges in a very nice meditation center with a huge garden. A yoga shala. Yeah, yoga shala. So I decided to stay.

Sabiya 3:46

And was that the place where you actually got your yoga?

From Rishikesh to a New Life in India

Marie Helene 3:50

No, I was organizing a training actually. In yoga? Yeah. I uh I was organizing a course with uh French students who didn't speak English, so I was translating and I was a facilitator. And I arrived with uh at Vienne, I think I only had three students because most of them were not able to enter the country. And we lived for three months with an Indian family uh in this meditation center. So I heard that bit a little, but I didn't know that was your first was that your first time? No, no, it was not. No, no, I used to travel a lot. I was coming for yoga education. Uh so for me that was just like a nice thing to to combine work and traveling. That's why I did this project. Wow.

Sabiya 4:37

I I'm just picturing how from uh going to Russi Gage for a cause and then deciding to stay back. And then because normally people take ages to decide that, right? I mean not ages, but there's there's I think I always did it like that, actually. So you're very prompt, like that.

Marie Helene 4:56

Very intuitive, and I always did it like

Living Across Europe, New York & India

Marie Helene 5:00

one day I was living in Vienna, and I decided I wanted a change, so I looked for a job. It took me like two months, I got a new job, I went to Amsterdam. Um before Budapest, yeah. I lived in um Geneva, Lausanne for a few months in Switzerland, but I didn't like it, so I don't have much uh output.

Sabiya 5:26

You don't like Switzerland at all? Oh okay.

Marie Helene 5:29

And I spent a few months in New York. Nice, yeah. Wow. So New York, Amsterdam, Vienna, Vienna, Amsterdam again, a bit of Budapest and Los and in between. And then to Rishikesh and from Rishikesh to Pune's, whatever you are.

Speaker 1 5:48

To Mumbai.

Speaker 2 5:48

To Mumbai.

Speaker 1 5:49

Yeah, I went to from Rishikesh to Goa, then from Goa to Mumbai, and then from Mumbai to Pune, and everything happened just like that.

Sabiya 5:58

This is more like a like a hippie trend, like literally hopping from one place to the other. But with my laptop. Yeah.

Leaving Corporate Life for Remote Work

Marie Helene 6:05

Not planned. I always worked, but not planned. Yeah, I always um I I understood very quickly actually that I didn't want to have a classical corporate life. So when I started to work, I started to work at Renault. Yeah, I was a management trainee. Yeah, and after that I worked for three years in an art company. And I worked uh at KLM. And at that point, I always felt like I loved the work, but I didn't like the politics, and I really, really didn't like the rules. So I chose to work remotely way before COVID happened. And that really quickly became a deal breaker for me. Like if I had to go to the office every day, I would not take a job. And that's how I became independent.

How Living Abroad Changed Her Marketing Perspective

Sabiya 6:57

Living in all these multiple cities in countries, has that influenced you uh the approach to brand building? Because you're a brand strategist, really.

Marie Helene 7:07

So does it do you think that really affects your I mean it's not influencing, but it consolidated a lot of beliefs I had. Uh, like for example, in marketing, it's really not one size fits all because as much as people like to consume, they do not consume the same way based where they are located, based on their beliefs, on their culture. They will not purchase the same products, they will not purchase for the same reasons.

Sabiya 7:36

Yeah.

Why Global Brands Need Local Strategies

Marie Helene 7:37

So that's really, I think that really gave me a very personal and human approach in the way I create brands. Uh, for example, when I worked in the Netherlands, I was working for Tommy Hilfiger. Yeah. And we were, I was mostly working on the French market. And then you can clearly see that the localization is very important. Because when a brand like Tommy is communicates to an American audience, what do they do? They speak about uh very common concept in the US, like Ivy League, like the rivality between the East Coast and the West Coast. But if you bring this to Europe, to the French market, this doesn't mean anything. Yeah, yeah. You know, uh the West and the East Coast, there is no rivality, you know. We don't have we have prestigious schools, yeah, but they don't have the impact um that they have in the state because our culture is more about individuality and equality. So and and Europe is different. Exactly. And Europe, then you know, you will go to Germany, it's a different approach, you will go to the Netherlands. Uh the Dutch are a lot like the American, though I would say. Um but you will go like to Spain or to Italy, it's completely different, you know, people don't respond to the same thing. So first there is this, and secondly, there are the local taste. So, as we were saying, you know, if you look at the fragrance industry, uh in Europe, you know, you will see like in in Western Europe, you people like light fragrance, they like it, you know, fruity, but not too much, not too sweet.

Sabiya 9:18

Yeah.

Marie Helene 9:19

When if you go to the Middle East, they love it very heavy and very sweet, boom, bum, yeah, strong, right?

Sabiya 9:25

Rose. Ooh, the we were just talking about that. We were just exactly before the shoot. We were just talking about how uh the formulas for some brands are saying, but the labeling, I'm not too sure if it's supposed to talk about it in teacher. But it's interesting to say that, right? Because a lot of people must be tuning in to understand as a marketing professional, what is your approach? Uh when you live in different countries, and I'm sure like the way it has helped you, but at the same time, certain things you cannot really change uh because of the local culture. You have to adapt.

Cultural Differences in Workplace Communication

Marie Helene 10:02

Yeah, and on many ways, you know, I see it also with your employer brand. Yeah, uh, when I worked in Amsterdam, so we I was doing a lot of employer branding, but differently because uh it's very, very easy to handle in the Netherlands, you know. The people tend to have a very flat way of communicating, they are straightforward, so these things come quite naturally. And here, when I started to apply this uh directness very quickly, I saw that people will perceive me as very rude. Um, you know, yeah, so you have to do it differently, you have to integrate the same things, but your approach needs to be different.

Sabiya 10:47

It's interesting. Yeah, does it take really long for you to understand that? Or you feel like okay, there's something that you prepare mentally before you move.

Marie Helene 10:57

No, so no, it's really like I am very intuitive, so I don't really think about these things in detail because anyway it's never like you planned it.

Sabiya 11:07

Okay, your move as a was not so.

Marie Helene 11:11

Yeah, and things are never the way you expect them to be. So in India, what I've learned is like you have to be very cautious with the cultural sensitivities. Uh, you have to be uh more gentle, I would say. When when I worked in the Netherlands, that was almost like a motivating factor to tell someone this is not good, you can do better. You know, you say someone something like that, it's pretty well accepted. So okay, I'll do something better. Yeah, but yeah, it's not accepted at all. Yeah, it's it is sometimes like, oh my gosh, it's quite upfront. Yes, exactly. So yeah, you learn it, and then there comes a time you have to integrate it because at the beginning you're learning it, but you're still resisting it. Yeah, resisting it. So you're trying to go your old ways, but at some point you really need to break through.

The Biggest Brand Messaging Mistakes

Sabiya 12:04

I can imagine, I can imagine. But then besides the brand consultant and the content strategist, right? Yes. You also are a copywriter. Yes. So the copywriter, um what are the common mistakes that you see brands making in their messaging? And how do you think they can connect better with the audience? I think I will learn a bit from that answer as well, alright.

Marie Helene 12:29

So there are many things that irritate me with writing. So the first uh I will say is people talk about them. But in fact, you should not talk about you. You should talk about your audience, you should talk about the problems that you are here to resolve. So when you land on one page and you see these companies telling you, we are, we do, you know, the question is, but what do you do for your audience? How are you supporting them? What is the problem you're solving?

Sabiya 13:00

Yeah, yeah.

Marie Helene 13:00

So it's not human-centric enough, I feel. Okay. Then some brands also tend to write a lot of content.

unknown 13:09

Yeah.

Marie Helene 13:09

And the idea would be to get to get a clear understanding of what a brand is doing in 20 to 30 seconds because there is such a high volume of content we're consuming, you know. Lengthy doesn't mean it's good. Lengthy, spending hours writing a copy doesn't mean it's good. It's better to spend two hours defining 30 very good words that are going to clearly explain what you're doing. And that that is different everywhere else? I mean, a lot of companies do it. A lot of small companies do it, I feel. And that's preventing them from growth. Really? I think so. So it is really different here. Yeah, if a company wants to communicate about themselves, about what they do, yeah, the end goal should be to start speaking about the problem you are solving and how you are solving them. And then you can tell who you are.

Sabiya 14:06

Yeah, okay.

AI, Copywriting & Keeping Content Human

Marie Helene 14:07

So that that's more like that. So then if you if you're writing a blog post, like it's great to share knowledge, yeah, yeah. But you also need to do it the right way. Like I always tell the copy, no, I don't write so much anymore. I'm working with a lot of copywriters. So, what I always told them is AI is okay. Yeah, however, don't copy paste a text stupidly. AI is your assistant, but you're the boss, you're in charge.

Sabiya 14:32

Yes, yeah.

Marie Helene 14:33

So you should not have more like more than 20% AI generated uh content in your copy. You know, you need to be able to bring diversity in the language you are using. Also the human touch of it. Exactly, the human touch because AI use is a lot the passive form. Yeah, and it's very descriptive. So this is not engaging.

Sabiya 14:54

Yeah.

Marie Helene 14:55

So it just you can use AI with a fair balance, and that is and use the right words because a lot of weird expressions come from AI. I think it becomes repetitive, right? Yeah, and they were also making fun of it. Like someone from Chat GPT uh shared a mem last time where it was saying today is we are delving. Because Chat GPT always delves.

Sabiya 15:19

Yes, yes, and you can make out I think so. Now we have come to a point where everybody sees something. Everybody's delving.

Marie Helene 15:26

Oh, that's tough to do. Oh, you know, it's things that you would never say. Like, I think I never wrote, you know, copy, like today we are delving. I will just today we're talking, we're exploring, discovering, delving.

Sabiya 15:42

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Marie Helene 15:43

So and yeah, I think it's like you know, it's like any tool, you know, it can really help you as long as you do it in a smart way.

Can AI Replace Human Creativity?

Sabiya 15:51

And I think like now more and more people need to really train themselves in it? I mean, is it enough for them to tell it, okay, you on your own use the tool carefully, wisely, or do you think there's we need to have some training on that to really identify, hey, that's chat GPT, that's not human. You need to be more personal. Do we need to do that, or people need to learn on their own?

Marie Helene 16:18

I I don't know. I think honestly, I really think like the younger generation uh might have an issue at some point. Yeah. Because uh, for example, I have received cover letters where I had your degrees, your university that had to be filled. So that really gave me the feeling they are just asking chat GPT and copy-paste it. Uh, so we have two ways to go. Either you're appropriate about it, and you say I'm not allowing you to use ChatGPT. And it's a bit like when you tell 30 years ago to teenagers don't smoke. Doesn't prevent them from smoking. Or you train them. Yes. You tell them how you can use it, how can you benefit from it, how can you save time. Uh, you know, it's a bit like a kitchen robot at the end, you know, you can cut the vegetables manually and spend one hour doing it, or you can put it in your robot, and in five minutes it's finished.

Sabiya 17:10

You have to train yourself for that, and that chat with your AI also needs to be trained.

Marie Helene 17:16

Yeah, yeah, of course, it's a give and take. Yeah, it's a give and take, it's uh it's a conversation, it's a dialogue, and you're the master, you're able to identify what is acceptable and what is not. Yeah, what can stay and what must go.

Sabiya 17:29

Yeah. I think like if we are dependent a lot on it on a daily basis, on a daily task that you do, if you really are dependent on that, I feel at some point you will be like, oh, but you have to really have an impromp conversation.

Marie Helene 17:43

Yeah, and also it's hard to think, you know, it's you need to use it as a tool so that your brain can continue to work, to function. Uh, because if you don't check, your brain is no longer functioning, you know. Uh you just do it tack, tack, tack, this is done. Uh, but for me in my work, like I really wish at the time I was exclusively working as a copywriter. Yeah, I believe that I could have increased my uh performance by uh three times or something like this, because what you know, writing an article, like writing the the body of your article, uh, it requires a lot of research. So you need to gather your research, you need to summarize it, then you need to start mapping your uh article, and then you start writing. And the copy only becomes relevant after four or five rounds of edits.

Sabiya 18:33

Yeah.

Marie Helene 18:33

So for me, that really spares me a lot of time because I do my research, I put them in one document, and then I ask ChatGPD to organize it. Yes. And that's helping me a lot, that's saving me time.

Balancing Marketing, Yoga & Wellness

Sabiya 18:46

So I'm sure like if people really understand how to news that they'll be exactly from that, okay. I'm gonna now shift the gear to your wellness section. Okay, your wellness practices. Yeah, okay. Um how do you balance between a corporate job and a wellness practice? Like you are into yoga. How do you get time? What makes you go to your mat and regularly? Because I know you are I I see your videos online and I see that you really are dedicated towards yoga.

How Yoga Built Discipline & Focus

Marie Helene 19:23

Yeah, but I think it's I don't have, you know, it's I don't have to balance it actually. They are both necessary to each other. Yes, I would say. So um I tend to be a very undisciplined person. Indisciplined? Yeah, very indisciplined, very I could be very lazy actually. And yoga brought me this discipline because I really believe, you know, in life, if you want to grow, you need to stand exactly where you're not comfortable. You need to really face your discomfort, you need to face your fears. So I I was a very messy teenage girl, for example. I was performing well in school, but everything was really disorganized and messy, I was always late. And I started yoga in university.

Speaker 2 20:10

Okay.

Marie Helene 20:12

And it brought me like really a love for discipline because I really understood that if I'm able to be disciplined, I'm loving myself enough to give myself my best chances. That is such a good point, right?

Sabiya 20:26

I hope that people listening are really uh being inspired because sometimes uh you know it, what to do to balance your personal and your work life. But they don't they never never approach yoga with that mindset, like you said, like at least try and then see how it helps and balances you.

Marie Helene 20:45

But it came like that, you know, at the beginning I was just doing it. I didn't really, I think I went there even a bit by vanity because I always thought, okay, I don't want to age badly, I want to look good. Oh uh, I don't like sport. Uh what can I do? Oh, yeah, let me do some yoga. I think it will be fine. And I loved it. I got hooked on it like very quickly, and it was really there to support me, whatever I went through in my life. It really felt like home.

Sabiya 21:10

How many years how many hours have you done in yoga?

Marie Helene 21:14

Uh education, like 1800 hours or 2000. 1800 hours? But then that is in which uh Vinyasa Ata. Vinyasa. I did one Ashtanga training as well. Okay, and uh, I'm about to do the second one next month. That I heard.

Sabiya 21:30

Oh my god, how how so? What is the motivation for you to go on and on? Because you have a corporate job, right? You have a responsibility uh with that to start learning something like an advanced one, this is the basic

Why Yoga Makes Her Better at Work

Sabiya 21:43

one that you do now.

Marie Helene 21:43

Yeah, but it's making me actually it's helping me with my job, it's really uh empowering me to do things. It's nice, it's really like I need it, and I know this has a positive impact on work, you know. Uh when I do when I don't do yoga, yeah, in the Morning, my day is not as good as it is when I practice. Uh, if one morning, let's say I don't didn't sleep well or I get late, or my day is just not as good and as productive, you know, it's really giving you the structure

The High-Performance Daily Routine

Marie Helene 22:15

you need.

Sabiya 22:15

And you do that every day?

Marie Helene 22:17

Six days a week. And uh sometimes, you know, sometimes it's full power. Uh sometimes I'm gonna spend uh 30 minutes in child pose and reinforcing myself because not every day is the same. But I I just decided okay, no matter how I feel, I have to go on my mat, even if it's for five minutes. Yeah, and yeah, it's you know, it's really like you build your life around it. So I have some friends, a friend of mine was very traumatized because one time he came home and in my office he saw my daily schedule. Okay, and you could see that I have like prepared every morning like what I do when I wake up, like everything is written when I do have lunch, what project I'm working on at the time, and everything is giving an hour and everything is written, yeah. And I called it MH High Performance Schedule. MH High Performer. High Performance Schedule. Okay. And since then, every time you write to me, you always mention I hope you don't follow too much the schedule.

Sabiya 23:22

Oh, that's gonna be hard.

Marie Helene 23:23

No, I uh I was very uncomfortable with it, but uh actually I I love it.

Sabiya 23:29

But I think yoga is also beautiful that way because for every day I feel that for every day, for every day that you have um a feeling of excitement, you are with energy that you can go for a power yoga, right? Exactly, right? The days when you don't feel like doing much, but you still want to be on the mat because you're addicted, right? Yeah, I can call you a yoga addict, type of yoga addict. So then you have this restorative pose, days when you feel like okay, more into dancing, and whenyasa like a flow, and ashtanga is more uh aligned, right? They they focus on the technique and alignment,

What Ashtanga Yoga Taught Marie

Sabiya 24:05

yeah.

Marie Helene 24:05

And ashtanga, so it's more Ashtanga based, but ashtanga is really like the discipline, you know. Okay, ashtanga is really the yoga of discipline. It's uh I like to think of it as uh the victory of the mind over the body, you know. Because the first time I went to an Ashtanga class, I was really like, What are these people? How are they doing this? You know, my god, they can be on their head. And then you realize that when you understand how you should breathe, how your body is working, and when you really surrender yourself to it, you can do it. And then you know it's easy, wolf always tell me, Oh, yeah, you can you can do that, you're super flexible. But anyone can if you don't do something properly, it's because you didn't practice enough. Yeah. You know, because you will do it in your own way. You may not look like an Instagram model, which is completely okay, you know. Yes, and maybe you have to bend your legs to do it. Uh, maybe you need a break to modification, whatever. Yeah, but everybody can do it somehow, somehow.

Sabiya 25:08

Yeah, I think so as well. I used to practice your guys when you wine that I'm not doing that often. Yeah, exactly. You have to be into it, you have to be, it's really showing up for yourself. You cannot do a headstand when you're thinking of I don't know, but then that's when you lose your balance, right? You always lose your balance when you think, oh yes, I can do it.

Marie Helene 25:26

Yes, and then you fold it.

Sabiya 25:27

Yeah, yeah. Have you many times? I have listened one time, that's it. Um, I'm gonna move on to the next question now from here, okay? Um what are your biggest challenges and rewards of living abroad, and how do you think that has shaped you personally, professionally?

How Living Abroad Changed Her Personality

Marie Helene 25:48

I think every experience changes you actually. You know, everything you do, even if you uh how it changed me. I think I I became a better person. Um I I don't have an easy temper, I would say. Corsica? Yeah, Corsica, yeah, typical Corsica.

Sabiya 26:08

She's from Corsica, so apparently people from Corsica are known for the temperament. And uh yeah, I mean I have not seen like that, but if you say so.

Marie Helene 26:20

No, like you know, you're pretty much into resistance, you know, like you're very stubborn. Like uh, if I want something to be done this way, I want something to be done this way. So I think I've gained a lot of flexibility. Um, like when I was like maybe 19, 20 years old, my friends used to call me uh the commandant. The commandant. Yes, okay, okay. So that was that was because of your because if I wanted to go to the beach, to that specific beach at that time, we had to do it. If I wanted to go to eat that food, we had to do it. So I was really much like there is one way to do it, and this is mine.

Speaker 1 26:56

Yeah, my way or high way.

Marie Helene 26:58

So I think I've learned to meet somewhere in the middle now and to to be more flexible also to other people's desire. I think that comes with age as well. I think it's it's traveling and it's also if you want to socialize, you know, at some point you need to find a middle ground. Yes, yeah.