Family vs. Child-Centered Home

In this episode, clinical social workers Kristina and Heather explore the dynamics of family-centered versus child-centered homes and why finding balance is key to a healthy family life. They explain how putting children at the center of the family can lead to anxiety, enmeshment, and unhealthy parent-child dynamics. Using the metaphor of the "family wheel," they illustrate how parents should be the hub, with children as the spokes, creating a stable foundation for everyone. The duo emphasizes the importance of keeping emotional “backpacks” separate for parents and children to avoid overloading kids with adult concerns. Kristina and Heather dive into the challenges of child-centric homes, from increased anxiety to marital strain, and offer practical advice for teaching kids resilience and emotional management. They also discuss the importance of maintaining clear boundaries, responsibilities, and healthy family roles. If you're looking to build stronger family bonds and raise emotionally resilient children, this episode is packed with insightful tips you won’t want to miss!

Gear Up! Adventures In Parenthood is recorded and edited by Dave Purnell and produced by Jen Plante Johnson for the ODC Network in Holland, Michigan.

The ODC Network is a non-profit organization that strives to advance outdoor education and conservation in West Michigan. 

Since 2000, The ODC Network has served over a million people through hands-on, outdoor learning experiences and conserved thousands of acres of native habitat through restoration and preservation projects.

The ODC Network’s vision is building a better community by connecting people, land and nature. To learn more and get involved go to: www.odcnetwork.org.

Transcript

Heather  00:00

Today, we're discussing the difference between family centered and child centered homes, and why a family centered approach is crucial for our children's well being and development.

Kristina  00:10

That's right, we've all heard children are the center of the universe, but is that really the best approach for a healthy family dynamic?

Heather  00:18

I think that's a really good question. When children are the hub of the family, it could cause anxiety for everyone, strain relationships and even reinforce selfish behaviors in kids. 

Kristina  00:30

Exactly. So we're introducing the idea of the family wheel. Think of parents as the hub supporting the structure, and kids as the spokes, the parents should hold things together while kids are important, but not at the center.

Heather  00:46

It's all about that balance. When kids are at the center, it puts too much pressure on them, which just isn't fair.

Kristina  00:53

Right. It blurs the lines between parent and child responsibilities, leading to enmeshment, where both take on each other's emotional baggage. 

Heather  01:03

And speaking of baggage, we'll talk about keeping separate backpacks for parents and kids with parents managing our own emotional weight and helping kids learn to manage theirs. 

Kristina  01:14

Exactly. Kids need to develop resilience, and if we keep rescuing them, they won't learn how to handle emotions and expectations. 

Heather  01:23

It's all about guiding, not carrying their burdens. We as parents can model emotional management so kids can grow into resilient, emotionally intelligent individuals.

Kristina  01:36

This isn't about loving our kids less. It's about creating a family structure where everyone thrives.

Heather  01:43

So let's explore how to shift from a child centered home to a family centered one, and the benefits of making that change. 

Kristina  01:51

And of course, we'll share practical tips for making this shift in our own homes. 

Heather  01:56

Let's get started! Welcome to Gear Up! Adventures In Parenthood.

Kristina

A podcast where we explore the struggles and challenges we all face as parents. We'll share ideas and offer tips and strategies for raising happy, healthy children. My name's Kristina Boersma

Heather

And I'm Heather Bouwman. Kristina and I are clinical social workers who've been working with families and children for a good long minute. We're Support Service Directors for the Early Childhood Network of ODC Network in Holland, Michigan. And we get to support parents and children as they navigate the tricky terrain of raising children and growing up in today's world.

Kristina

We're here to help unpack the hard stuff and connect with the joy of parenting. 

Heather

Are you ready? 

Kristina and Heather

Let's hit the trails.

Heather  

This project is made possible by the ODC Network, an amazing nonprofit organization based in Holland, Michigan, where we get to work supporting preschool aged students, their teachers and their parents.

Kristina  

The ODC Network is all about nurturing the community and the next generation through a wide variety of innovative nature-based initiatives.

Heather  

Please visit www. ODCNetwork.org to learn more about the ODC Network's mission and impact.

Kristina, today, we're talking about family centered versus child center homes. 

Kristina  03:29

This is a good one. 

Heather  03:30

It is a good one. I think it's something we don't think about, real readily.

Kristina  03:37

Right. And we can, without even knowing it, create a situation.

Heather  03:41

Oh, our children will let us build our schedules, build our environments, build our lives right around them. For so many reasons, it can be so tempting to do that. Our hearts in it. We've wanted them for so long. We've longed for them. We love them so much more than we ever thought we could love another thing ever. And when all of our emotions can get tied up into that, we can go so far down that road without even realizing it. And we can trick ourselves into thinking that that makes our kids really happy, until it doesn't. Yeah, until the moment. And there will be lots of moments where they don't get what they want, because that's the way the world works. That is reality versus this whole world created around them. And I love my children so much. My husband and I love our children so much, but we came to the realization real quickly that that doesn't mean that they are the sun and that we orbit around them. That is not good for them. It's not good for us. 

Kristina  04:29

It's not good for anybody. 

Heather  04:59

It's not good for the family. And it feels all sorts of wonky, badonkey.

Kristina  05:05

You know, and I think, like you said, it's easy for us to do because we love our children so much, and we think it makes them happy, and we want them to be happy. But the other truth, at least for me, was that it made it easier ifwe just, you know, kind of moved at the whim of my child.

Heather  05:25

Yeah. Because you're not gearing up for the wall of futility.

Kristina  05:28

Right. You're just kind of skirting around those opportunities. It's a distraction. And some of us have kids who are just a little more spirited than others, and so it's like, okay, yes, great. We'll make exactly what she wants to eat. We'll just eat whatever Grace wants to eat every night for dinner. Then we can all eat together, which is a value of mine, and she doesn't have to fuss about food. 

Heather  05:28

You had said some of us have more spirited children, and it reminded me of this little self talk I used to give myself, probably because I'm wildly competitive, and Ava is of any my more spirited child, at least when she was younger, right? She had the fierceness, which is a genetically predisposed thing for women in our lineage. And so it's really true. 

Kristina  06:20

It is true. 

Heather  06:22

We're just gonna own it and name it. And I remember saying to myself, Oh, sweetheart, you are strong, but mommy's stronger. In my head, I had to keep saying, but mommy's stronger. This little pep talk to myself of yes, we can keep doing this, because, like you said, it can become a grind. And then we can try to distract from just those big feelings and those spirited feelings, because it's easier. So Kristina, you and I like to talk about the family being a wheel. Talk to us about what the family wheel is and what it looks like and feels like.

Kristina  07:03

Yeah, so you had said our child is not the sun and we do not orbit them, right? It's the same kind of thing with a wheel, right? Many, many families in recent generations. Not so long ago, we weren't doing this as much. Children were a part of the family, but they weren't the center hub of the family wheel.

Heather  07:24

It wasn't that long ago. They were meant to be seen and not heard. 

Kristina  07:27

Yes. Right. Which, that's not good either.

Heather  07:29

Too far the other way.

Kristina  07:30

Right. But when we think about the family as a wheel, we run into trouble when we can zoom out and recognize that the child or children are the hub of the wheel, and we're just circling around them. Really. Children are intended to be the spokes of a wheel in a family, because the pressure and responsibility of being the hub is not something children are equipped for. 

Heather  07:58

No, they don't have those skills.

Kristina  08:00

They don't. And it puts a terrible amount of pressure on them, even subconsciously, some children really believe it's their responsibility to keep the family together.

Heather  08:13

And they put that on themselves so willingly, and we're gonna talk about how that happens, but that pressure is so real, and I think it's why we see so much increased anxiety in children, younger and younger and younger with every passing year.

Kristina  08:30

I don't know if you'll remember this, Heather, but when we were in grad school a million years ago, we learned that sometimes children are actually we call them the symptom bearers. I remember, yeah, and that children will actually, if there's conflict between parents, if there's discord in the home, some of them will get into trouble more to become the focus, to become the focus, because when they can be the focus, then the parents aren't focused on-

Heather  08:59

It relieves that pressure valve.

Kristina  09:01

I love when you can finish my sentences. Yes, exactly it is. And when we have the child at the center hub of our family, it's hard on parent relationships too. 

Heather  09:12

It really is.

Kristina  09:13

Yeah. Because you have so much focus on the child that the parental relationship suffers.

Heather  09:19

I think we've all seen the car drive ahead of us, where the wheels just kind of walk wonky, right? And that's what children being at the center does to those relationships. It just makes the hierarchy wonky.

Kristina  09:33

Yep. And it keeps them from learning really important skills like compromise and turn, taking, managing their disappointment when they don't get exactly what they want, and recognizing that there are other valuable perspectives. And let me tell you what: this is tricky when you have an only. I mean, it's tricky period, but when you have an only, to keep them from being the hub, takes a lot of intention. Reality, because there's nobody thereto really kind of check them like a sibling would 

Heather  10:06

Yes to realign. You're absolutely right. I think of all the times that Zack was there to pull Luke by his collar back and be like, Don't! That's not what we do in this moment, right? 

Kristina  10:17

Well, or even things like, Hey, you want to play a game? Sure? What do you want to play, Grace? I want to play Candy Land. 

Heather  10:23

No, that's stupid. I hate Candy Land.

Kristina  10:26

 I'm not saying that, right? I'm like, great. I just want to play a game with my kid. I'm not like Candy Land? I hate Candy Land. We're playing Shoots and Ladders. Like, so when you have an only, there's not somebody there to do that.

Heather  10:42

like no, I want this. There's no just having... forcing compromise, which siblings do so naturally.

Kristina  10:52

Yes, they do. So let's talk about how we got to this place where children are the hub, where they're carrying more responsibility than they're equipped to manage.

Heather  11:03

I think it came from like we've talked about oftentimes, when history has been one end of the polarized spectrum, right, children are to be seen and not to be heard, right? And then there's a desire to shift that right. Oftentimes the pendulum swings really, really far. Oh my. And all of a sudden we're at the opposite end of that spectrum. We're still polarized. We're just at the opposite end, but now we're into family enmeshment.

Kristina  11:37

Yes, and over indulged children, yes. So talk to us about family enmeshment, because, man, it's tough, and it's it is very present.

Heather  11:45

And you can get there without even realizing you've gone on that journey. And until there are some real maladaptive behaviors to call it out, you might not even realize you're there. 

Kristina  11:57

Yeah, and it's not easy to draw it back. 

Heather  11:59

No, no, no. It's not. Just like it took some time to get there, it takes some time to get out of there. It's the we share everything place. And we're too connected in these sort of toxic is the word that comes to mind, because it leads to some toxicity. We talk about how attachment and connection is the most primal need of children, and that is absolutely true. Enmeshment is a very different thing. It's when children are carrying things they're not meant to be carrying. It's when conversations between parents aren't kept private. Everything is just a family conference.

Kristina  12:43

We share everything here. We have no secrets. 

Heather  12:47

There are no secrets. We share everything. And everybody's in all the business through everyone else. And there are no adult conversations separate from child conversations. And kids do not have the skills to be able to manage that amount of information stream and the intensity and the seriousness of all of that. You and I love to educate parents on "backpacks." Yeah, there's a child backpack and an adult backp.

Kristina  13:24

You're right. 

Heather  13:24

Talk to us about the backpacks. 

Kristina  13:27

Yeah. So with these enmeshed families, where here's the deal, there's a family system, and I want you to see that as like the family inside this circle, and the circle has some openings in it, so that relationships can flow in and out. But you're all inside the circle. Within the circle of the family, there are also two other circles, one for the parents, one for the children. And what happens in enmeshed families is there's no parental system and system with the children, they're all in the circle together, yeah. And so what happens with children being exposed to adult conversations is within their backpack, and the backpack represents kind of where they store all the things that they're responsible for-

Heather  14:17

And what they carry around with them. All the time. 

Kristina  14:20

Yes. And they and they have things that they have no business having in their backpack, like medical insurance, the cost of health care, right, inflation and the prices at the grocery store. They have no business being in the middle of the relationship between the parents. If you're having a hard time with your partner, they have no business being aware of that, right? I mean, they can sense things, but you're not going to say, Oh, your dad was out drinking again last night or or things like that. They have no ability to control those things.

Heather  14:55

And they don't know what to do with them, right?

Kristina  14:59

Mm. Yes, so things like the cost of your housing or transportation or politics, it's just not stuff that belongs in their backpack.

Heather  15:10

No, because those things are big and heavy they are and it's like dropping boulders and all of a sudden, what happens to our backpack? Well, it pulls you down, right? It's too heavy. They can't possibly carry it around, right? 

Kristina  15:23

And they're supposed to be learning and growing and building new skills, right? And when they're carrying around things in their backpack that were never meant to be there, they don't have the space and the energy to do that.

Heather  15:33

No, because heavy backpacks are going to make our bodies not feel great. It's gonna affect our sleep, it's gonna affect our anxiety levels, all of those things that backpack impacts. 

Kristina  15:46

Yeah. Children don't need to know the details of any strife or worry or anything else at work, right? They don't need to know about that. They can't do anything about it. And so those things need to be kept within the parental system, not enmeshed with the child system and the children's system.

Heather  16:05

Right. So let's talk about what goes in the adult backpack. Okay, the adults backpack has to be filled with the things that a child's cognition just can't handle. That's our job. And I think sometimes we forget, as parents, that even when we have conversations with friends or just acquaintances or neighbors in front of our children, how that maybe doesn't seem scary to us - if it's about the state of whatever's happening in the world - it could be politics. It could be gas prices. It could be so many things. The latest disaster, like fires, whatever it might be, the cognitions that the child's brain is equipped to deal with are not the things that our adult brains are equipped to deal with. And that's why that separation is so important. And we can just have a neighbor approach us and begin having a conversation, and our child is there, and we maybe need to protect them from thatand say, Oh, I'd love to talk to you about this later, but right now, yes, got the little ears. I used to say that all the time. I've got the- I've got the little ears here, and it just gives a cue that, oh, not now in front of the child.

Kristina  17:25

My husband helped me gain an awareness of this. When I'm on the phone with you, Heather, we talk on the phone quite a bit, and I always have it on speaker, because then I can be doing other things, as opposed to just holding the phone. Because heaven knows the laundry needs to get done or or whatever. Even if Grace is around and she couldn't hear you, she can hear me. And it is amazing the things that she will kind of pick from things I've said and then say half of a conversation. Pretty much 100% of the time. It raises her anxiety. And so Vince will be like, she's 15, I know. And Vince will be like, Hey, not on speaker, not on speaker.If you're gonna talk on the phone, go someplace else. I'm like, but I gotta get the laundry.

Speaker 1  18:11

And it's not like we're solving the world's problems, no, like, we don't even talk about a lot of really big things, right? 

Kristina  18:18

So when we talk about a lot of really big things. Heather, where you try to get,

Heather  18:24

Oh my goodness. 

Kristina  18:26

So tell us what's in the parent-

Speaker 1  18:28

In the parent's backpack should be anything financial, anything happening in the household, just finances in general, the children should be free of worry about that planning for the family's future. One thing that I always wanted in my household was for us not to talk negatively about work ever, because I wanted kids to know the joy of work, and I had other people in my family who did nothing but complain about their work and their children did not have a desire. They just always looked forward to retirement before they even started working. Yes, and I thought, oh, there's so much joy in work. So I want any negative connotation associated with any type of thing to be a private conversation among adults, not for the children to hear, because that goes back to our values, like what they say and they hear impacts them, right? It's our foundations, job security. Kids shouldn't have to be worrying about that, right? That's an adult worry, like you had said, health insurance, auto insurance, all the money, insurance, taxes, all of it, all of those things, adult backpack. The children shouldn't have to figure out their own plans. That's ours to communicate. To them, not for them to be active participants in because, again, anxiety raising, limiting news these days, news today is not like it was no right? We didn't even have global news, right. And now everything is so instantaneous. It's so graphic. Yes, everyone has been so tremendously desensitized to words, images, except children. Yeah, if we can just protect them.

Kristina  20:32

That's exactly the word I was gonna use.

Heather  20:34

Like a little cocoon.

Kristina  20:36

Yeah, to protect their childhood. We've talked about that before, and we're really passionate about protecting childhood. Even the language we use around something, like if they want to get fast food or something, instead of saying, oh, wecan't afford it, saying we're not going to choose to use our resources that way, those are two really

Speaker 1  20:57

A great way, yep, to just reframe it differently.

Kristina  21:01

 I want to go on vacation. Well, we can't afford to go on vacation, honey. Nope. You say, Yeah, that would be really fun. We're going to choose to use our resources in a different way this year or at this time, really, really different. 

Speaker 1  21:15

That's a great example. Great example. Thank you. Hey, hey, listeners, Kristina andI are so grateful to be a part of your village. If these conversations and episodes are impactful to you, we deeply appreciate your support to continue doing the work we love so much for such an amazing nonprofit organization. Please visit www.gearup-podcast.com to make a tax deductible contribution. Thank you. Do you want to talk about what goes in the child's backpack?

Kristina  21:51

Oh, absolutely. The kids' things don't necessarily need to go into the parent things either. I've said to children before, like, I can promise you your father is not concerned about your history assignment because that's not in his backpack. You have the history assignment in your backpack. So things that belong in the children's backpack are things that they have control over. It's things like followingthe rules, listening to the adults, the parents and the caregivers, being responsible for taking care of their things and a chore or two or three around the house. That'stheir responsibility to contribute to the family by completing those chores. School work belongs in the child's backpack, and also their behavior, how they manage themselves outside of the home, or if they're older, when they're driving a vehicle, those are all things that belong in a child's backpack. They get to manage their relationships and practice their skills. Those are things that belong in the child's backpack. It's not a big list. It's not a heavy list. But it's heavy enough for the child. 

Speaker 1  23:07

Yes, absolutely it is. And we want to make sure we're not creeping in their backpack. Yeah, and short changing them on being in charge of it because that enmeshment goes that way as well. 

Kristina  23:20

Yep, it sure does. So, as the grown ups, we need to be aware of what we're putting in their backpack, right? There are times, oh, I've seen these lists come out, like, by three years old, your child should be able to, you know, vacuum and dust, or it's like, these ridiculous chores, right? 

Heather  23:39

Like, don't I wish.

Kristina  23:40

They're doing laundry by six? What the world? So you need to check that a little bit and make sure that you're not putting things in your child's backpack that they're not equipped for yet, right? So that is the grown ups job, but not to take things out because we think they're too hard, even though they are developmentally appropriate.

Speaker 1  23:59

Or because, ah, this is a trick as a parent, right? Maybe they aren't doing it exactly as you would, or the way you would do it.

Kristina  24:10

You stabbed me to the core with that one. Yeah, exactly. Little relatability. It's like, would you help with the laundry? And then it's like, but not like that. 

Speaker 1  24:20

We can micromanage that at times, and all of a sudden, then that isn't in their backpack anymore. It's in ours.

Kristina  24:29

Yeah, so children's backpacks are appropriate for children. They are not little adults. They cannot carry the weight that adults can they're not tiny soldiers. No. They need the freedom to play and to learn and to grow and to not worry about things they have no control over.

Heather  24:52

So let's talk about what happens when we center our homes around the wants and. Demands of our kids and what that sets them up for in the future, because we can trick ourselves into thinking that it's really helping them, and in reality, oh, the harsh truth is, nobody loves our kids the way we love our kids. Nobody is going to bend to their whims, right? The way that we bend to their whims? Yes, happily or unhappily, no one is going to flex and adapt to them the way that maybe we've made them accustomed to in our home, because exactly, real world doesn't care. And it can be a harsh environment,

Kristina  25:42

And having the child, or children as the hub of the family, it actually hurts them. It damages them.

Heather  25:50

Does not set them up well for the future and to be a high functioning member of society, right? And I know in our home, I always wanted my kids to feel deeply connected at home, but we always wanted them also to feel deeply connected to their community, and to have a deep love for that, and to want to go out and make not only their community but the world a better place, right? And we're not setting our kids up well if they're the hub.

Kristina  26:24

Nope. So let's talk about kind of the dark side of having children as the hub.

Heather  26:31

 Yes. Well, first off, there are five things we're gonna go through each of the five. The first one is it gives our kids a false sense of security, that the world is about them, that the world is centered around them, kind of like that orbit that we talked about, and it doesn't take very long for them to realize, in school, maybe at their first job, that everything in life doesn't adjust around their needs, their moods, yep, their feelings and their level of joy. Who creates their joy? Each of us is responsible,right for creating our joy, for creating our day. I think one of our teachers wrote on the board yesterday. This Monday is like Play Doh. You can make it into anything you want it to be. I love it so true, and we shape it. Yes, we've really worked hard toteach our kids. The day is yours. It's a gift. You get to do whatever you want with it. You get to make it your own right if you choose to be miserable, well, that's a choice. Yep, it's gonna be a longer day. 

Kristina  27:46

Yep. And that's not to say that children aren't going to be in moods. Sometimes we're in moods, right? We're all in moods, but what we're saying is we don't allow the child's mood to

Heather  27:59

hold everybody else hostage. 

Kristina  28:01

That's exactly what I was gonna say, Yes, hold everybody else hostage. It's like we can manage when they're in a bad mood, when they're frustrated, when they're upset. We go back to that, remembering that you know, shepherding them to the wall of futility helps them grow their resilience. 

Heather  28:18

And you take them back to what you know. Do you need to go outside? Do you need to go to your happy place? Do you need a hug? Do you need to go for a little run? Do you need to climb a tree, whatever it may be, taking them right back to that, but not allowing the space to be held hostage and the people in the space to be held hostage by the little ones, the moods and the feelings and the needs, yep, another big thing is it puts a significant strain on marriages within children as the hub. Yes, things get out of balance very quickly when we put the kids in the center of our home, and if we put our children in front of our spouse that is felt quickly and it doesn't feel good. 

Kristina  29:06

Oh, it's really hard not to do that, especially when you are not necessarily agreeingwith your co parent and how we're going to do this discipline and how we're going to, you know, create space for children to learn and grow. It can get really hard to interject ourselves in the relationship between the child or children and the other co parent.

Speaker 1  29:31

And those conversations must take place. We've talked about Mom and Dad time. Yep, right? Yep, that's time set aside for parents, and we don't have those conversations in front of the children, right?

Kristina  29:45

And I just want to say it's not easy. We live in, again, a very busy world. We work a lot. It's not easy to necessarily get, you know, Mom and Dad time, but it's something that's really important. So figuring. No, prioritizing, yes, prioritizing when and where those things can happen, so you can have the conversations you need to outside of the awareness of the children. So number three on this list of five is that when we center our world around the child, it reinforces selfishness. Oh, it sure does, and that's not something we want to teach. Children learn the word mine pretty early on and constantly letting our world revolve around the child and their demands and their wishes. It just reinforces selfishness. It absolutely does. There's something that I recommend to lots of families, because this is a thinking man's game, I tell you what. And I'll say so, establishing family toys versus individual children's toys can be super helpful when you have a first born, right? All the gifts coming in are for that child, and you got to work with your gift givers to say, No, we're giving something to the family. Because guess what happens when you have a second child?

Heather  31:09

Oh, girl, I know I had a second and a third, yep. And we did this in our home. We had family toys.

Kristina  31:16

Yeah, and so they can have a couple things that are just theirs that, you know, it's like, yep, that's your fire truck that you got from grandpa. That's yours. And then they get to decide if others get to use it, play with it, engage with it, things like that. But the vast majority of things are family. That's a family toy, and anybody can play with it. 

Heather  31:38

I remember my husband and I saying, Oh, those are our toys that we share with you. Like we just had those, and our kids truly believed that. Remember one time, I don't even know which child it was, it was like, Are you and dad gonna play with that after we're in bed? Oh, I think they really believed that we played with the family toys once they were in bed. I was like, Oh my gosh, are you kidding me? We have no energy. We're gonna collapse in a heap.

Kristina  32:05

So setting up family toy versus individual children's toys opens up the opportunity to do a lot of teaching about sharing. Doesn't mean that sharing is gonna be easier, but they get to choose if they're gonna share their individual toys. We don't force the sharing of their individual things. That's another skill to teach children. It's not like everybody has access to everything all the time. You do get to, you know, have some things be special and just yours. You know, I have two sisters, and growing up, we shared a lot of clothes, and you got to decide if there were things in your closet that anybody could use, or if there was something that's like, Hey, you can wear anything in my closet, but not those couple things. And so learning to actually share the things that are ours with others, or to withhold that share set some boundaries. Yep. So that's another little great thing that you can do that limits the selfishness that we're kind of instilling in our children, because that's another pitfall of having children as the hub that learned selfishness. What's number four? Number four is having children in the hub puts a pressure and a responsibility that they were never meant to carry. We talked about this a bit. Yeah, we did. They are not designed to be in charge. They are not designed or equipped to manage that power. No, and they crumble to the pressure. They do. And not only is that unhealthy, kids really believe it or not, they actually want guidelines. They want restrictions. They want boundaries. 

Heather  33:43

They absolutely do. And they want security. Yes, safety and having all of that does not feel safe and secure. 

Kristina  33:52

No, when they have access to all of that, it's too much. It is too much. And so having the boundaries and keeping things in the parent backpack, and not having, you know, this shared family backpack, and everybody's got everybody else's stuff in it, it's actually a way that we can demonstrate our love for our children by protecting them from the weight of things that only the adults have the ability to control or manage. Oh, so true. Yeah, so true. And so powerful. So bring us home. Heather, what's number five? 

Heather  34:22

Oh, number five is a big one. It's a really, really big one. It's gonna be hard to hear number five, deep breath. Having children as the hub makes children a challenge outside of the home, and it makes settings and relationships outside of the home challenging for them. It absolutely does, because they're used to having everything bend and flex to them, and when that doesn't happen outside of their home, oh, the emotions are big, the fits. Can be off the charts. Yep, they get de railed. It can be kicking, screaming, gnashing, 

Kristina  35:10

biting,

Heather  35:11

All of it. Tears.

Kristina  35:14

Because they don't know how to be in a world where they are not the center. 

Heather  35:17

Well, they're asked to manage something they have not been trained or taught to manage. And oh  that looks so debilitating and devastating and just hard to watch. And then we have to support that, right? We see this. This is becoming a more common thing, I would say, than we've seen in previous years. And we get called in to support these situations in our preschool setting. And it can be over anything and nothing at all. But kids will be on the floor, writhing, screaming, kicking, shouting.

Kristina  36:06

Because they wanted the napkin with strawberries on it. And they got the blue napkin.

Speaker 1  36:11

Yep. And they were just used to having somebody say, Oh, you were hoping for the strawberries. Here you go. And what I will say, because this can be challenging, because there's so much dysregulation that happens if you're in the situation, thereare some clues. If your child is having these big fits, it might be a clue, right? It might be a clue that we're in a place that we never thought we were going. And I like to think of it as go or grow, right? We all have times in our life where we have the time to grow. There are other times where we have to go. And so I will say to our teachers, is it a go moment? Is it a grow moment? Because during the grow moments, we want to move that child to the wall of futility. Yes, be like, I know you can do it. I'm gonna support you. I'm with you. That is a beautiful napkin with strawberries. Maybe you'll get it tomorrow. And maybe it's a moment where we're packing up and we're supposed to be headed out the door because parents are arriving in three minutes. And so that is a go moment. And so we can come to some sort of agreement that we're going to go and we are not going to die on the strawberry napkin hill today. This is not the moment to grow. When a child is in extreme dysregulation, it is not the moment to grow either. We have to get them out of the dysregulation, which we've talked about how to do that in past episodes, and then bring it to the wall of futility, right? And, oh, there's so much power in that. But man, oh man, when our kids are the hub and everything bends to them, it does not set them up well for the great big world. And it's goes back to what we said before, what we do in these first five years, unpacks the next eighty. 

Kristina  38:12

Uh huh, sure does. 

Heather  38:14

Let's get our kids to be a spoke and not a hub. So important

Kristina  38:19

It is. For healthy functioning within a family. It absolutely is. So we need to take a little space and reflect on our families and look at the backpacks and the sharing of information and the access to things that only the adults should really have access to. 

Speaker 1  38:39

What content is in which backpack. Where are we too heavy? Where are we too light?

Kristina  38:44

And really evaluating that. And then again, if you're fortunate enough to co parentwith somebody, taking steps together to realign the kind of powers within 

Heather  38:56

The hierarchy. 

Kristina  38:57

And if you have an only it's going to take that much more intentionality. 

Speaker 1  39:01

Yeah. Absolutely it is. And you'll get there.

Kristina  39:05

Being aware is the very first step.

Heather  39:07

It sure is.

Kristina

Thank you so much for joining us for Gear Up! Adventures In Parenthood. I'm Kristina.

Heather  

And I'm Heather. And we're so grateful to join you on your parenting journey, until next time…

Heather and Kristina

See you on the trails!

Kristina  

The Gear Up! Adventures In Parenthood podcast is brought to you by the ODC Network in Holland, Michigan. It is produced by Jen Plante Johnson, recorded and edited by Dave Purnell, with original theme music by Dave Purnell,

Heather  

The ODC Network is a nonprofit organization that strives to advance outdoor education and conservation in West Michigan.

Kristina  

Since 2000 the ODC network has served over a million people through hands on outdoor learning experiences and conserved thousands of acres of native habitat through restoration and preservation projects.

Heather

The ODC Network’s vision is building a better community by connecting people, land and nature. To learn more and get involved, go to www.ODCNetwork.org.