69 SOUTH

How Neglect, Deceit, And A Failed Safety Net Ended Kinsleigh Weltys Life

• Chop & Julie • Season 1 • Episode 71

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A five-year-old weighed twenty-one pounds, her hair crawling with lice, her world reduced to a closet blocked by a dresser. We trace how a child’s life narrowed to that small space—and how the adults around her layered lies, delay, and denial over obvious danger.

We walk you through the full timeline: the delayed 911 call, the shifting claims about a father who hadn’t seen the children, and the last-hours visit from child services that missed a hidden room. Inside the home, investigators found tiny handprints on the closet door, a stale peanut butter sandwich on the floor, and empty Ensure bottles nearby. The mother’s story fractures under the weight of evidence; she admits to routine confinement, “one small meal a day,” and a fear of losing her other children that outweighed the risk to Kinsley. The boyfriend describes cleaning piles of feces, threatening to call 911, then doing nothing that changed the outcome. Family members float a drowning story that collapses when the autopsy shows malnutrition and almost no stomach contents.

Along the way, we examine the systemic gaps: repeated DCS contacts, school concerns about lice and attendance, and a house visit hours before Kinsley died. We ask hard questions about complicity, bystander responsibility, and what real accountability looks like when neglect is prolonged and visible. This conversation is unflinching and detail-rich, grounded in affidavits, search warrants, interviews, and medical findings. It’s not just a true crime story—it’s a call to recognize the warning signs early, to act decisively when a child’s safety is uncertain, and to build systems that don’t depend on luck to save a life.

If this moved you, share the episode, leave a review, and hit follow so you don’t miss part two as we continue to pursue answers and accountability.

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Disclaimer: All defendants are INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY in a court of law. All facts are alleged until a conviction!

SPEAKER_00:

Welcome everyone to Podcast Sixty Nine South, where we cuss and discuss true crime, code cases, current events, and hot topics, along with our state of society today. This is your trigger warning. Our podcast content is produced for adult listeners 18 years of age and older. We discuss situations that may be offensive and triggering to some listeners. Sit back, relax, and enjoy.

SPEAKER_02:

Now, this is five-year-old Kinsley Welty. Today, members of her family were in court for a hearing on her death. When she died last week, investigators say she was severely malnourished. Today Kinsley's mother and her mother's boyfriend both made their first court appearances, and WRTV's Rachel Wilkerson was there for those hearings. And you join us now. What's the latest?

SPEAKER_01:

Uh Nicole Kinsley's mother, Tony McCullough, could face life in prison. The Marion County prosecutor says she's charged with her daughter's murder because of the prolonged neglect to the five-year-old.

SPEAKER_00:

Welcome back, everybody. I'm Chop, your host, and with me always is my beautiful co-host Julie. What's good today?

SPEAKER_03:

It's cold outside. I can't believe we got that much snow.

SPEAKER_00:

Good old Hoosier weather.

SPEAKER_03:

Always.

SPEAKER_00:

If you don't like it, stick around. It'll change tomorrow.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, it'll probably no, it's gonna be cold tomorrow, but like the rest of the week, it's gonna be It's gonna be 70 next week, yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Before we get started on this case, we want to give a shout out to our new Patreon members. Thank you for supporting us and helping us keep the lights and the heat on today in the studio.

SPEAKER_03:

We have Sierra, Sheena, and then the Shingle Master.

SPEAKER_00:

The Shingle Master.

SPEAKER_03:

And I also want to give a special shout out to our new friend Cam. We love you.

SPEAKER_00:

We told her we'd shout her out, so there's your shout. Today's episode, folks, if it doesn't have you mad crying, it's going to have you sad crying because it's the story of Kinsley Wealty. This is going to be going through the probable cause affidavits. Uh, it's a pretty rough one, folks, so extra trigger warning on this one.

SPEAKER_03:

Kinsley's mother, Tony McClure, her boyfriend Ryan Smith, and her grandmother, maternal grandmother that is, Tammy Halsey, have all been charged in connection to Kinsley's death. Now, Kinsley was born on December 3rd of 2018, which is a special day because my son was also born on December 3rd. He's just older. And then Kinsley passed away on April 9th, 2024 in Marion County, Indiana. And on that day, Detective Nicholson of the IMPD Child Abuse Unit was notified to contact IMPD officer Wright. Officer Wright advised he had responded to a death investigation on Denver Drive in Indianapolis. Upon arrival, Officer Wright observed medical personnel performing life-saving measures on Kinsley, who was only five years old, inside the house on Denver Drive. Officer Wright advised that Kinsley's mother, 29-year-old Tony McClure, stated that she had just picked Kinsley up after she spent the last month and a half with her father. Officer Wright advised Tony stated Kinsley had a headache and that her legs had been trembling. Tony stated that when they arrived home, Kinsley collapsed onto the floor. Officer Wright stated Tony called for emergency services after approximately 20 to 30 minutes. Officer Wright observed a bruise on Kinsley's face and noted that it appeared Kinsley was very malnourished.

SPEAKER_00:

Twenty to thirty minutes. I mean, who would wait twenty to thirty minutes after their five-year-old collapsed on the floor?

SPEAKER_03:

It almost sounds like she was like waiting for her to pass away.

SPEAKER_00:

That's that's sad to say, folks. And as you figure out as we go through this probable cause affidavit, 99.9% of this story is bullshit. Um, but we're gonna get to that. Wayne Township EMS number 81 had transported Kinsley to Riley Hospital for children. Riley Hospital physician, Dr. Ann White, had confirmed Kinsley deceased at 6 01 p.m.

SPEAKER_03:

So she was confirmed deceased at 6 01. I wonder if she um was already gone by the time that they got there.

SPEAKER_00:

I have a feeling she was, but you know when it says right there in the beginning of it, they were performing life-saving measures on her. I bet they were just trying anything they could to get the poor baby there.

SPEAKER_03:

Absolutely, but you don't give up. I mean, you're gonna try, I mean, anything.

SPEAKER_00:

Right. All they have was the mother saying she just collapsed. She just collapsed, you know what I mean. So they're trying to bring her back because several people's been dead for several minutes and then brought back to life right there. So we get into this, you're gonna realize as as we do too, we we think she was maybe unfortunately passed away for who knows how long at this at this point in time.

SPEAKER_03:

And also you're gonna hear different variations of each of the adults' stories. And um they're called out a few times, a lot of times, for their lies. So you got to pay extra close attention because we break the lies out.

SPEAKER_00:

IMPD Child Abuse Unit, Detective James Davis and Detective Caitlin Harris, responded to the house and observed two vehicles parked at the home. The vehicles were identified with the plate numbers and the making models, and on April 9th, 2024, the detectives applied and were granted search warrants for the trailer home, both vehicles, and then they were also granted a search warrant for the detached shed on the property. Also, there was a search warrant for additional items observed inside the house.

SPEAKER_03:

Because you know, search warrants are very specific. I think I've read a search warrant before where it says, Oh, yeah, you can go in, have your search warrant, but you can't seize any firearms or you know, I did I don't remember what case that was, but I I remember that. I'm like, well, oh, that was in Zara Arnold's case.

SPEAKER_00:

That's correct. That was the the hearing impaired people of the that one was a bad one too. It appeared Kinsley was severely malnourished. Kinley was thin and her eyes were sunken. Kinsley had what appeared to be fecal or various on various parts of her body, including the bottom of her feet and in her hair. The fecal matter had been matted to her hair and the bottom of her feet. Kinsley had what appeared to be lice or a similar type tiny insect crawling on her face and in her hair. Kinsley's hair was very short in length and appeared very thin. There were also what appeared to be bites or other unknown sores on Kinsley's abdomen area. Poor baby, man.

SPEAKER_03:

So she had lice crawling on her face. Or if it's not if it's not lice, it's a bed bug.

SPEAKER_00:

The sores on her belly probably was that, I mean.

SPEAKER_03:

Little red bites and that poor baby. So medical personnel at Riley Hospital had grave concern for malnourishment and uh and other neglect-related issues due to the initial observations of Kinsley's body, just by looking at her, it was advised that Kinsley weighed more at two and a half years old than what she had just weighed in at five years old at 21 pounds.

SPEAKER_00:

That's insane.

SPEAKER_03:

Now, the Marion County Coroner's office, the deputy coroner, arrived at the hospital and they performed an external exam of Kinsley. The deputy coroner also had concern that Kins Kinsley was malnourished. And then she took possession of Kinsley's body and clothing. So I mean, the first concern when anybody even looks at this girl is she's completely starved to death.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, that's just that's that's skin and bones. There's no m much and nothing left of the poor thing.

SPEAKER_03:

There's no muscle. There's I I don't even see how she had the energy to really still be moving as long as she was.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't know. Somebody had posted on Facebook, and I'm not sure if Julie, you're gonna put that on our page or anything or not, because it's pretty horrible. But the pictures of this baby's legs I can't post that picture.

SPEAKER_03:

They are literally people have, but I just I just can't. It's it's it's horrible.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, they're out there if you want to look. I don't think we'll post them, but her legs were literally bones. Just bones.

SPEAKER_03:

There's skin over them.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't think there's hardly any way at this point this baby could have even been walking.

SPEAKER_03:

Could be wrong, but uh I would be surprised. So on that day, Detective Nicholson interviewed Kinsley's mother, Tony McClure, at Riley Hospital. Now, here's her first version of events that had happened. This is what she says first. Tony stated that she had been living on Denver Drive for the past six months. Tony stated Kinsley was one of three children she had with their father. The other children were age six and age four. She also had a newborn with Ryan Smith, her boyfriend that she lived with. Tony stated that she was previously married since 2017, but they had been separated for the last three to four years. Tony explained that the children's father had previous previous issues, but that he had been recently been doing better. Now, Tony stated that Kinsley's father asked to have Kinsley come stay with him, and Tony agreed, and in early to mid-February, she dropped Kinsley off with her dad at the McDonald's located near West 16th Street and Lafayette Road. Tony stated that she spoke to Kinsley regularly during that time, but it was only through audio phone calls. Tony said that earlier the day of the interview, Kinsley's dad had called her and told her that she needed to take Kinsley back because he could not keep Kinsley due to a work obligation in Carmel, Indiana. She stated that she met Kinsley's father at the same McDonald's and took Kinsley back. Tony stated that Kinsley entered the vehicle and took off the hood of her coat. She said that when she observed Kinsley, her hair had been cut really short and was matted. Tony described Kinsley's hair as hard. Tony stated that she also observed that Kinsley had a bruise on the side of her face and stated that she looked terrible and she had lost a lot of weight. She said Kinsley had a complaint of pain in her head and in her legs, and that her legs were trembling. You know, I do believe that they were trembling probably because she was trying to make her stand up or something, and she couldn't even stand.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, they were absolutely trembling if they had the energy to tremble.

SPEAKER_03:

Tony stated that she arrived home and carried Kinsley into the entrance of their home. She stated she put Kinsley down and she immediately collapsed inside of the house. Tony stated that only twenty to thirty minutes had elapsed from the time she picked Kinsley up until she collapsed at her home. Tony stated she began CPR on Kinsley at the time and stated Kinsley had a lot of liquid that kept coming out of her mouth and that Kinsley just kept gurgling. Tony stated she did call her cor current boyfriend's mother to come pick up her other children during that time. Tony stated she eventually called for emergency services and continued CPR until medical personnel arrived at the house.

SPEAKER_00:

And you're you're constantly in contact with Kinsley through audio calls.

SPEAKER_03:

So she says, remember, this is the first version.

SPEAKER_00:

Also, you can tell that she's trying to preamp her her story, blaming it on the father. And then also you can tell that she's preamping her story about the drowning. There's a couple people that said that they had been told that Kinsley had drowned, that she was in the bathtub. We'll we'll talk more about it in the probable cause affidavit, but that's where where she's coming up with the liquid coming out of her mouth and the gurgling. She's just trying to preamp the story, her all her bullshit stories. Tony stated Kinsley had previously been diagnosed with mild dwarfism and had a floppy trachea. Tony stated that caused the food that Kinsley ate to be trapped in her lungs. She stated Kinsley had been put on a feeding tube for some time, but Riley Hospital removed it when she was around two years old. She stated Kinsley had no current medical conditions that required medication or caused any further issues. She stated Kinsley was last medical medically evaluated in December of 2022. She stated a DCS employee had just been at her house earlier that day because her newborn had tested positive for THC. She stated she picked up Kinsley after the DCS visited her house.

SPEAKER_03:

After the conclusion of the interview, Detective Nicholson explained that he would be seizing her cell phone as part of the investigation. Tony stated her phone was still out of the house and described it to be an Apple iPhone with a white case, and she also provided the passcode to the detective.

SPEAKER_00:

And you we got to talk about I mean the DCS workers there because her cord blood. The cord blood of the newborn baby tested positive for THC. So that means she was smoking a big ass blunt right before she had the baby. Or I mean at least at least a week or two or three weeks before. I mean Yeah.

SPEAKER_03:

That's some bad shit. She's like shocked that they were there that day. She says that Kinsley wasn't there, but I'm just gonna tell you this. We all know she's lying. I'm not gonna tell you what Kinsley was yet, but she was there. Detective Nicholson learned from family case manager Shepler that there had been multiple DCS reports slash assessments for various incidents of neglect that involved Kinsley and or Tony. It appeared that DCS had difficulty locating Kinsley to conduct several of the more recent DCS investigations. So it's not just Kinsley and Tony. It's Kinsley, Tony, her newborn baby, um, and one of her other sons.

SPEAKER_00:

Their other son, the issue with him was, and I'm not sure. Missing from school because of And he had headlights. He had infection, a bad infection of headlights in his hair, so that's probably why he was missing school because either the school noticed the headlights and sent him home so the other kids in the school didn't get it, or she was like kept him home for an undisclosed amount of time to try to try, or or you know what I mean, try to get rid of him so DCS wouldn't be called.

SPEAKER_03:

It's not hard to get rid of lice and little boy's hair. You cut it all off.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, you shave them bald.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

But back at the house, the detectives responded to with crime scene technicians, were also with the detectives to assist with the evidence and document the collection of evidence and take pictures and videos and just basically serve the search warrants and look for evidence. CSU technicians took photographs and recorded video of the house. CSU technicians collected various clothing items, towels, and other items with potential biological evidence. The technicians also collected lice shampoo from the trunk of the car. Her Apple phone was located in the kitchen counter on the kitchen counter. While Detective Davis was at the house, Tony's mother and the grandmother and a great aunt, they arrived. It was discovered that they had heard a different version of events for what happened earlier that day between Tony and Kinsley. The version of events that were provided was distinctly different from what Tony had just explained to Detective Nicholson at the hospital. This included that the father was not involved with what happened.

SPEAKER_03:

Specifically, Detective Davis learned that the following from Tammy Halsey, the grandmother, which she is also charged in connection to this, and another witness named JB. JB stated Tammy had told her that Kinsley had fallen in the bathtub and that Kinsley was gone. Tammy stated she learned Kinsley had fallen in the bathtub from her other daughter, Tony's sister, LM. Tammy stated LM told her that Tony had walked away from the bathroom and when she came back, Kinsley was underneath the water. Tammy stated Tony tried to do CPR, but it was unsuccessful. Tammy stated Kinsley's father was not involved and had not been involved with Kinsley for some time. She also stated that the father had no contact with any of the children because he had some of his own problems, and he would not even know what the children would look like, and she did not know where he was located. Timmy also stated the children have been staying with Tony's boyfriend, Ryan, for some time.

SPEAKER_00:

Sounded like somebody's didn't get their stories together before they were talking to the law dogs.

SPEAKER_03:

Detective Davis also spoke to several of Tony's neighbors, AS and MC. They had cameras that motion recorded footage of the front area of Tony's trailer home. On April 10th, Detective Nicholson went to a house in the 2900 block of Roberta Drive. This address was what the father had most recently listed on his Indiana ID card. Upon arrival, Detective Nicholson met with another witness, C. L, and this is what they said during that interview.

SPEAKER_00:

That witness had stated that the children's father was a friend that she had known for approximately seven years. She explained that she had lived at the said address for the last 14 years, and that it had been about one year since the children's father had lived at the house, but he still stopped by all the time to visit and, you know, say what's up. She stated that he had just been over there at the house earlier on April 9th, 2024, around 5 P. So like he was just there, like that day. So he must have just left. She said that it did not appear as if he had seen the children, including Kinsley, for some time. She stated that when she believed that the father had been there, she had been with a he had been with a girlfriend in a small car, and that if he would have seen the kids, he would have said, Hey, I got to see the boys and Kinsley because I guess he was really upset about it all the time. And she just said, I would have known if he saw the kids. He has not seen the kids as far as I know, and he was literally just here.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, she seems like she could make a phone call and be in contact with him instantly.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, if he just left there, that's exactly the way it seems. So meanwhile, detectives and crime scene unit technicians go back to where Kinsley had allegedly passed away.

SPEAKER_03:

And this is the next day.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, this is the tenth.

SPEAKER_03:

Mm-hmm. So detectives and crime scene technicians observed the back bedroom. It had bunk beds and appeared to be the bedroom belonging to the two boys. The closet door had been blocked with a large dresser. The dresser was moved away from the door. Detective Nicholson opened the closet door and immediately smelled the strong odor of urine and feces as it just hit him in the face from the interior of the closet. Detective Nicholson observed what appeared to be human fecal matter on the carpeted floor and along the walls of the closet. There were small clothing items that appeared to belong to a young female child. These clothing items were heavily soiled. There had been what appeared to be small handprints on the interior of the closet door.

SPEAKER_00:

That gets me right there. Just when it says small handprints.

SPEAKER_03:

Because you can just picture Kinsley on the inside of that closet door. And these handprints were covered in these handprints were like fecal matter handprints on the door. And you it just gives me an image of my head of this poor baby standing in this closet, just banging on the door, trying to get somebody to come and help her and get her out of that situation.

SPEAKER_00:

Or wanting some food or toys to play with or anything.

SPEAKER_03:

Additionally, there were three insure protein bottles that were empty on the floor of the closet. The expiration dates for the insure protein drinks were dated for February and March of 2025. So they were still good at this time. Detective Nicholson observed what he discovered to be white bread with peanut butter laid on the floor. The sandwich had not been eaten. The bread was noted to be dry and hard, but it appears otherwise fresh since there was no mold found on the sandwich. Technicians began to collect the clothing from the closet, and the detectives observed what appeared to be more human feces that was located with a hot dog bun underneath one of the clothing items. The technicians took additional photos and recorded a video of the closet, which was measured to be five foot by three foot. The technicians also collected the clothing items from inside the closet.

SPEAKER_00:

That's like smaller than a jail cell. That's like the size of a small bathroom in a like in a mobile home or something. It's like tiny. Detectives and technicians located what appeared to be the same peanut butter in one of the kitchen cabinets. There was an empty package of white bread that was laid on top of the trash in the kitchen. The expiration date for the bread was April 6, 2024. So that was like three days before this incident. There was peanut butter smeared on the outside of the bread packaging.

SPEAKER_03:

Like she just like dipped, took like the the empty bread package and dipped her hand in the peanut butter and slopped it on the bread.

SPEAKER_00:

Like real quick, probably just throw it in there.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh sh she gave her two seconds of her time.

SPEAKER_00:

Right, right, and didn't even use a freaking knife, use the outside of a dirty the outside of a packaging that who knows how many hands have been on. It's already three days expired. That's just pisses me off. They were also hot dog buns that appeared to be the same as what had been previously found in the closet. These hot dog buns were also in one of the kitchen cabinets. Detective Davis also located a vacuum with what appeared to be feces inside of the vacuum's canister. The contents of the vacuum were emptied and documented.

SPEAKER_03:

DCS members had made detectives aware of various inconsistencies in Tony's version of events. This included that Tony had told the DCS caseworker that had visited the house earlier that day on April 9th, the day Kinsley died, is that Kinsley was with her grandparents instead of the father. So that was another story Tony told. Now, additionally, family case manager Shepler stated that she had located Tony's boyfriend, Ryan Smith, and several of Tony's children in Plainfield. Ryan initially told family case manager Shepler that the children had been with him in Plainfield for the last several days. But Ryan admitted that was a lie, that Tony's mother, Tammy, had told him to tell police and DCS this story.

SPEAKER_00:

I wonder what the what the purpose of that lie was. Why do you think she said, hey, when the cops come and talk to you, tell them that the kids have been there for a while.

SPEAKER_03:

Uh Ryan Smith's parents' house. I don't know, but there's your first red flag. I mean, everybody's lying. You have the grandmother lying, you have Ryan lying, you have Tony lying.

SPEAKER_00:

Crazy. Well, while the detectives processed the scene, Tony had voluntarily talked with voluntarily talked with Officer Dillman and Officer Bennett about the closet. Officer Dillman advised that there was a closet in the house that one of her sons would use to urinate and defecate on the floors and walls. Officer Dillman advised Tony, told them that her son had seizures, and that was what he did when the seizures occurred. That's strange. So the little boy would have a seizure and he would go and then he'd pee and poop in the closet.

SPEAKER_03:

You have no control. You're not I mean, I don't know the what do I want to call it? Um table of like how seizures go from worse to bad. I know there's like grandma's seizures, and then there's other types of seizures that are uh I want to maybe milder, not as bad. Like levels.

SPEAKER_00:

Some people kind of just space out and some people go down on the floor and foam at the mouth and shit. I've never heard of a a seizure that caused you to do what she's seized.

SPEAKER_03:

Or you know, I I have seen where people have had seizures that like real bad grandma seizures where you gotta their whole body's convulsing and you have to lay them down. They have no control over the muscles, they have no control over anything like that, let alone walking to a closet to defecate.

SPEAKER_00:

Right.

SPEAKER_03:

It seems like they would only defecate during a seizure if it was like a real bad grandma's seizure where you're unconscious and you're not able to walk anywhere. I mean, I'm not a professional or anything, but that's just my logical explanation.

SPEAKER_00:

I've heard that you know, when people the seizures like you're talking about where they just shake and they seize up, it's probably why they call them seizures, but that you stick a lighter or your fingers in their mouth so they can't swallow their tongue. But I've also had people say, try to swallow your tongue like you can't really.

SPEAKER_03:

You know, you they'll buy you the their jaw might lock and they'll bite your fingers if you do that. I mean, you can't your tongue will go back in the back of your throat. But I I've seen these seizures many, many times in person. I mean the bad ones.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, anyway, the detectives must have no pun intended, but smelled her bullshit, and they requested that Tony come back with detectives to the child abuse office. Tony had been asleep inside of her car during the execution of the search warrants. Tony agreed, and with the assistance of IMPD Southwest district officers, Tony was transported to the child abuse office.

SPEAKER_03:

On April 10th, Detective Nicholson and And Detective Davis interviewed Tony. They read her her Miranda warning, and she stated that she understood. She agreed to speak with the detectives about the case, and she signed the advice and waiver of rights forms. Now, here's what she said during this interview. Tony provided various versions of events and explanations for everything that had happened with Kinsley. Eventually, Tony admitted that she had lied to detectives about the versions of events with Kinsley's father. Tony stated that the father was not involved in any manner and that he had not been involved with the children for over one year due to her withholding the children, is what we've been told. Now, Tony stated that the father likely had no knowledge that Kinsley had even died.

SPEAKER_00:

Tony stated that she had been Kinsley's primary caregiver. She stated her mother, Tammy, helped watch Kinsley at times. She felt that Tammy shared some of the responsibility for what happened to Kinsley because she knew everything, but she never helped or did anything. Tony stated Ryan was a great guy and that he and his family had nothing to do with it. She expressed that she was always with Kinsley. She stated nobody would help her when she asked for help with Kinsley. She stated Ryan never paid any attention to Kinsley, even though he lived at the house and was there every day and night. She stated Ryan never put Kinsley into the closet or interacted with her while she was in there. She stated Ryan had never physically assaulted Kinsley. Tony stated Tammy brought it up to her that Kinsley did look not well and had lost weight. Tony expressed that Tammy and Ryan had told her that Kinsley needed help and that she would die if she did not fix how she treated her. She stated that a few months ago, Tammy and her sister LM did take Kinsley to give her a break. Tony stated that while LM had Kinsley, Kinsley had smeared feces in her bathroom. She stated that she did not understand why everyone said Kinsley drowned. She stated that she had just communicated with Ryan and Kinsley had fluids in her airways when she started CPR. She stated she also communicated with her sister LM and that she could not get Kinsley to breathe. She stated LM told her to do CPR on Kinsley.

SPEAKER_03:

Tony explained how Kinsley was asleep and underneath the blanket in one of the back rooms when the DCS was at the house just before Kinsley died. So within hours, within hours, let's say DCS was there and they would have gone in that room and just checked. Kinsley could, you know, hopefully still be alive. But they didn't. They failed her again. Tony stated she had also lied to DCS and told them that Kinsley was with her grandparents. Tony lied to DCS because she knew that it would not have been good if DCS saw Kinsley. Tony stated DCS had just been at the house a month or so earlier and they took a picture of Kinsley. Tony stated DCS did not express any concerns with Kinsley at the time. Now I'm sorry, but when DCS goes into somebody's home and they're obviously she opened the door and talked to them because they talked to her about her newborn baby having THC in the in the cord blood.

SPEAKER_00:

Right. And they were literally just going through her with a case for the boy in the headlights in the missing school, like we had spoken about.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

There was also, which we're going to get into this much later in the case, there was also in the previous much several calls to DCS about Kinsley. So, you know, I mean, DCS didn't look in that room. They must have been real busy that day.

SPEAKER_03:

Usually they're uh seeing if you got running water, making sure your lights are on.

SPEAKER_00:

Making sure you got food, taking pictures of everything.

SPEAKER_03:

I mean, inside your refrigerator, they go in to every room, take a picture of every room, bathroom. I mean everything.

SPEAKER_00:

As they should. She also explained that Kinsley had a lot of behavioral issues. She discussed the various issues with Kinsley's behavior. She said that Kinsley hated her. Tony stated that she did not get Kinsley help because she was scared to get in trouble. She said she did not want her other kids to be taken away because of Kinsley.

SPEAKER_03:

Because of Kinsley? Look how she's blaming Kinsley. It has nothing to do uh with Kinsley. You failed to take care of her. It's not her fault.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't know too many five-year-old girls that hate their mother and express it in a manner to warrant this type of shit.

SPEAKER_03:

What five-year-old knows what hate even is? You know, she probably she probably knew exactly what it was because I can just picture her mom looking at her saying, I I I I can't stand you. I I hate you. You know, I just I can she probably said that.

SPEAKER_00:

Kids are only taught, you know, they only know what they're taught. If you teach your children love and affection, that's all they're gonna know. They're gonna not, you know, they're not gonna know hate and all that shit.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

Tony stated that Kinsley had a resentment towards her because she had been taken away by DCS earlier in life. Wow.

SPEAKER_03:

I think that's I think that's Tony just on some bullshit because she was really I mean, she was younger, and that can a five-year-old like express resentment? Usually they would love to run to their parents if they loved them. Especially their mother love. She must have never showed her love.

SPEAKER_00:

Must not have. She also said that her and Kinsley just did not share a connection or bond. She was apologetic for lying to detectives. She stated she was going to go to jail. She stated Kinsley did need help, but she did not help. She stated that she had, quote, fucked up really bad. She explained that it was true that Kinsley had told her that her head and legs hurt right before she collapsed in the kitchen and died. She stated that she was not going to lie. Kinsley told her that she just wanted to die prior to her death.

SPEAKER_03:

How does a five-year-old know what death is?

SPEAKER_00:

I've never heard of a five-year-old. I mean, maybe I live in a perfect world or something, but I've never heard a five-year-old saying, I just want to die.

SPEAKER_03:

Like, how would they even know what it is?

SPEAKER_00:

I don't know.

SPEAKER_03:

Do you think her mom told her, I wish you were dead? I wish you'd just die. You think she told her that too? It wouldn't surprise me.

SPEAKER_00:

It wouldn't surprise me. I mean, we've read the whole story and we're gonna go through it, you're gonna hear it, but by the time you hear the end of it, you'll probably think the same way. She also stated that a few weeks prior to that she had cut Kinsley's hair because of the feces in her hair. Now, if you got shit in your hands. Well, you don't cut a kid's hair because it has poop in it, you wash it out. You know what I mean? You cut their hair probably because you found the bugs crawling in it. Sad to say that the Probably both. Probably. But I mean just cut it, not wash it.

SPEAKER_03:

I'm surprised that bitch didn't wash her own ass, you know. That's what we've been told. So how's she gonna wash her kids' hair if she can't even wash her own ass?

SPEAKER_00:

You'd think it'd be quicker to wash a baby's hair, especially a pretty little, cute little blonde headed.

SPEAKER_03:

A 21-pound little girl. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00:

She explained that she had never looked at Kinsey close enough to see the bugs on Kinsley. So you're not even close enough to see the headlights and bugs on her, but she cut her hair. I mean, do you not brush your baby's hair? Do you not hug her? Do you not kiss her good night? Yeah, there's just so many reasons that you're gonna be close enough to your baby to see bugs crawling on their face and their head infested, is what the the enforcement said.

SPEAKER_03:

Tony admitted that for the last few months she had routinely put Kinsley in the back closet that detectives had discovered. Tony stated her memory for four timelines was not great, so has it had likely been longer than just a few months. Tony stated Kinsley physically declined over the last several months, but she did not help because she did not want to lose her other children or get in trouble. Tony stated she neglected Kinsley. Kinsley was let out of the closet every day for a short time whenever the family had to go somewhere, and she had no choice but to take her.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't know if I believe that or not.

SPEAKER_03:

Right. I believe she probably left her in there even when they left. You know, could you imagine taking a 21-pound five-year-old out into public and people seeing it? I mean, they probably wouldn't even know that she's five. Tony stated when they would return home from somewhere, Kinsley would just go back to the closet on her own. Tony stated it was just easier to keep Kinsley in the closet because she did not have to deal with her while she was there. Tony stated Kinsley would sit in the closet and and talk to herself. Tony stated Kinsley would yell for her and tell her she was hungry and thirsty. Tony stated that Kinsley, expressing that she was hungry or thirsty, became her quote unquote slogan. Tony explained how she recently struck Kinsley in the face with her hand because Kinsley bit her arm. Now she also stated that she knew that the way she had treated Kinsley was likely to lead to her death, but did not want to believe that that would happen. She stated she did the and this is I quote, these are Tony's words. She did the bare fucking minimum for Kinsley, and she expressed a desire for Kinsley to be out of her life. Tony stated she had wished that Kinsley was never born and explained she had only been providing one small meal a day to her. Tony admitted she had given up on Kinsley and that she repeatedly had failed her and stated she knew that everything she had done to Kinsley was wrong.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, there you go, right there. Now we know how Kinsley knew what hate and death was. You know, she's she's pouring this light drink for these cops. I could only imagine what she screamed at that baby. I wish I'd never had you. I hate you.

SPEAKER_03:

That's that's all she heard from her.

SPEAKER_00:

And and I call bullshit. Do you think this little baby girl starving to death, starving for attention, starving for food, you think she walked back in the house and oh, I'm gonna go back in here where where there's poop and pee on the floor and and why she's banging on the walls to get out of there all the time.

SPEAKER_03:

She don't want to be in there.

SPEAKER_00:

No, she just went back to the closet on her.

SPEAKER_03:

She went back in there probably because before you even got in the house, you were like, You know where you better go, or you're gonna get your ass whooped or have to stand in the corner, or I mean, those were other punishments, but I mean, wasn't it punishment enough to be locked away? Like you're on death row, which she was.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely, she was. And I have a hard time believing that Kinsley was out of the closet when they went somewhere.

SPEAKER_03:

This is my opinion, but now it should be noted that Tony had a prior conviction in 2018 in Morgan County, Indiana for neglect of a dependent, an F6 felony. And the cause number to this case is 55 D03-1812-F6-002069. If anybody wants to go look at that case. Now, on April 10th, 2024, Detective Nicholson contacted Tony's boyfriend, Ryan Smith. Ryan agreed that he and his mother, MS, would meet detectives at the child abuse office. Isn't that funny? He needs his mommy to go down to the child abuse office to go with him. Kinsley couldn't have a mommy, but this guy who lived in the same house and watched her be starved and mistreated and abused. He needs his mommy.

SPEAKER_00:

I'll bet he wasn't starved and abused like that.

SPEAKER_03:

No.

SPEAKER_00:

So anyway, Ryan went to the child abuse office and they read him his Miranda warning, which he stated he understood. He agreed to speak with detectives further about the case. He signed the advice and waiver rights form, and he stated the following during the interview. Ryan stated that around 3 30 PM he picked up the six-year-old from school and returned to his family's shop. He stated around 4 15, 4 20 PM he received a phone call from Tony to come to the house to pick up the children because Kinsley was dead. Ryan explained he went to the house with his mother and picked up the children. Ryan stated Tony had told him that Kinsley had drowned, but he did not visibly see Kinsley while he was in the house to get the other children. There's where the drowning story come from. And obviously, if he's telling the truth right now, then the baby was already passed away before she even called 911, like we were talking about earlier.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

Ryan stated that Tony was on the phone with dispatch while him and his mother were getting the kids from the house. Ryan explained that as they were leaving, he observed the emergency services headed to the house. He stated that there were text messages between him and Tony about the case because he had told her to call 911 after she first told him something had happened with Kinsley.

SPEAKER_03:

But she didn't call 911 immediately. And this is just my thoughts because had she called 911 immediately, I'm sure they would have been there within five to ten minutes. And from wherever this shop is located to get all the way back to Denver Drive is gonna take uh quite some time.

SPEAKER_00:

More time than it would take an EMS to get there if the baby had a heartbeat, she would still be alive, I think.

SPEAKER_03:

So she called Ryan and his mom to come get the other kids out of that. To come get the other kids.

SPEAKER_00:

So they wouldn't be taken one hundred percent.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh, that makes me so mad. Ryan outlined the dynamics and situation with Kinsley since he entered an intimate relationship with Tony approximately one year ago. Ryan discussed the various issues with Kinsley's behavior. Ryan stated Kinsley hated him because she wanted her real father. Ryan confirmed that they had lived at the house on Denver Drive for around six to seven months. Ryan stated his parents had not seen Kinsley since around Christmas of 2023, but Tony's mother, Tammy, took care of Kinsley often on the weekends. Ryan stated Tammy took Kinsley because Kinsley did not always want to go with them to family ventures. I think he's lying there. I mean, about Kinsley wanting to go on family outings and ventures. I'm sure she wanted to get out of that closet and go see the world and not be stuck inside. But anyway, Ryan stated Kinsley was not allowed to be around his family because she had told them that Ryan's father told her to pull down her pants. And Ryan stated that this was not true.

SPEAKER_00:

Ryan stated Tony decided it would be best to put Kinsley in the closet because it was safer for everyone else. Everyone else safer to put a five-year-old baby girl in a closet. Ryan stated she started to put Kinsley in the closet around Thanksgiving of twenty twenty three. He stated that in the last three or four months he had only observed Kinsley out of the closet about ten times. Ryan stated Tony would let Kinsley out periodically for an hour or two, but she would always have to go back in the closet. He said that about four or five months ago he became upset with Tony about the way Kinsley looked and acted. Ryan explained Kinsley had deteriorated. He expressed to Tony that she needed help because she had lost too much weight and threatened that he would call 911 if Kinsley did not get help. Ryan stated Tony was scared to get Kinsley help because she did not want to get in trouble. Ryan expressed that he had last cleaned the closet about a month prior to the interview. He stated that when he saw the condition of the closet, he thought, quote, oh my God, unquote. Ryan explained there were piles of feces in the corners. He told Kinsley to quit pooping on the floor and that they could change this.

SPEAKER_03:

How could they change it? Where was she supposed to go to the bathroom at? She was locked in this closet. Like they wouldn't even she would be banging to get out. Maybe to use the bathroom, and they would just ignore her. I mean, what did these ignorant people expect to happen?

SPEAKER_00:

He threatened to call 911. He should have called 911, and I bet he wishes he did now.

SPEAKER_03:

Now Ryan stated he continued to express express the issues with everything to Tony, but she was scared to do anything else about it. Ryan stated he did not seek any medical attention for Kinsley because of his love for Tony. Well, what'd you love about her, Ryan? Her lice-invested head? Because I'm sure Tony, if she's letting her daughter have lice in her hair and her other children, I'm sure she's got it crawling in her head too. Would you love? Did you love that lice? Did you love the way that she was a parent? Was she a good mom? Did you like that?

SPEAKER_00:

How could you have love or respect for anybody that you watch treat their daughter in that way, especially when you just had a child with her? I mean, it has to be running through this somewhere in the back of this dude's head, man. Is this way Oh no?

SPEAKER_03:

He loved her. If she's gonna treat her own flesh and blood child that came out of her body like this, how do you think she's gonna treat you when she gets sick of you?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, when she gets tired of your ass, how you gonna get treated, and then how she's gonna treat your baby when she's got a new dude and has another baby with him.

SPEAKER_03:

Ryan explained he never interacted with Kinsley or fed her while in the closet. He stated Kinsley would scream and call everyone names when she went into the closet. I don't blame her. Ryan stated he would observe Tony bring Kinsley food every night, but he was not sure if she ate the food or what happened. Mind you, she's throwing this. They didn't find evidence, no paper plates or anything. This food was literally thrown in there on the floor in feces in urine for her to eat. Now, Ryan said Kinsley would ask the boys to get her something like a toy. And Ryan even thought her brother might be taking her drinks or granola bars or crackers, but the kids are not allowed food outside the kitchen. Well, apparently Kinse is in the shit-infested closet. She's allowed to eat there.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, sad.

SPEAKER_03:

Ryan believed Kinsley died of malnourishment. He felt that he should be punished, but not on the same level or as extent as Tony. Ryan stated he and Tony or that he told Tony that Kinsley would die if they did not change how she was treated. Do you catch that? If they did not. So he knew he was just as responsible for this baby living under his roof as Tony was.

SPEAKER_00:

Dr. Jung and Dr. Paul conducted the autopsy of Kinsley. Detective Boyce and Detective Harris observed what appeared to be lice covering Kinsley's hair, face, and body. Kinsley weighed 21 pounds at 38 and a half inches tall. Dr. Jung noted bruising around Kinsley's right eye and cheekbone. Dr. Jung noted in the internal examination that Kinsley's intestines contained a light pink fluid and no solid fecal matter, so she hadn't been eating. Dr. Jung noted Kinsley's stomach contained less than five millimeters of stomach fluid. Dr. Jung and Dr. Paul provided that preliminary cause of death was likely to be ruled malnutrition. They also provided that the preliminary manner of death was likely to be ruled neglect. They have to use that likely word just because of legal reasons, but you know they said this is what fucking happened to this poor baby.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03:

So on April 10th, Detective Nicholson placed Tony and Ryan under arrest. Public safety officer Copeland transported Tony and Ryan to the Criminal Justice Center. So that's part one for today.

SPEAKER_00:

Unfortunately, unfortunately, we are out of time on this.

SPEAKER_03:

Um if you'd like to support 69 South and help us keep the lights on the studio, go to www.patreon.com forward slash slash forward ass 69SAD.

SPEAKER_00:

Forward slash. Thank you for your time, and you gotta come back for part two and probably part three. It gets really deep, folks. So we appreciate you being with us today until tomorrow. Have a good day.

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Chop

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Julie

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