A Boomer and GenXer Walk into a Bar
Wit and wisdom, some smart assery, and a Mother and Daughter questioning “Are we even related?”
A Boomer and GenXer Walk into a Bar
Breaking Stereotypes with Tattoos and Hair S1:E19
Ever wondered how your choice of tattoos or vibrant hair colors might tip the scales of your career? Join Bobbi Joy and Jane Burt as we challenge the conventions of professional appearance and personal expression. We unravel the often unspoken biases and societal judgments faced by individuals sporting body modifications. From tattoos and piercings to hair hues that defy the status quo, we question why these personal choices can sometimes close professional doors.
Expect a session laced with humor and genuine personal stories, delving into the generational shifts in accepting body art. We share anecdotes that shed light on the tug-of-war between self-expression and the need to conform to company images and it might just make you rethink what's truly 'acceptable' in the workplace.
email: boomerandgenxer@gmail.com
Welcome everyone to today's show. A Boomer and Gen X-er. Welcome to a Bar coming to you from the mobile rabbit hole studio that we're going to call the Rabbit Run Studio, where you, as a listener, will experience some wit and wisdom, some smart assery and a mother and daughter questioning. Are we even related? My name is bobby joy and my co-host is my mom, jane burt, and for the next uh 20 to 25 minutes, we're here to entertain you is that right?
Speaker 2:hey, you know, on our intro, every I'm always wondering where the wit and wisdom comes in, because I mean we're wise asses, I think, but we don't have a whole lot of wisdom going on here.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, I think we have our life experiences.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's probably all. That's about all we got going for us. So, um, you know what? Today's topic? I think uh came from a listener, didn't it bobby? I believe that it did okay and, um, I think this topic is one that kind of keeps showing up on some reels on facebook and and twitter and stuff and or snapchat excuse me, I think twitter's is it gone? I don't know I don't know.
Speaker 2:Well, it's called x now oh yeah, that's right and um, it has to do with tattoos and our, basically our appearance uh in in getting jobs, and how we're perceived in the public eye and um, so tattoos and hair color.
Speaker 1:Just call it like body modifications okay is that that includes piercings too okay.
Speaker 2:So tattoos, piercings, hair colors, maybe even how you dress, I don't really know, but this kind of came up because some people were feeling that they were being, um, they weren't given the opportunities as other people for jobs or for, uh, raises or promotions because of some of the life choices I, I guess that they've made. Is that about what you figured out out of that?
Speaker 1:I think that, yeah, anybody who has any kind of body modifications has at one point or another experienced it, whether they've been told. You know to cover them up, or to you know, change your hair color back to what it was, or you know, take your piercings out, those types of things. I think that anybody with body modifications has, at one point or another, experienced it in one degree or another.
Speaker 2:So let's talk about tattoos first of all, because it's my understanding that there's some tattoos out there that have different meanings, right, Like gang signs, of course, could keep you from getting a job at the church, I mean you know all tattoos have meaning.
Speaker 1:You know all tattoos have meaning.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, there are certain ones that you know, like, for example, you know you go into prison and you get like a swastika tattooed on your forehead, mr Charlie Manson, and you're going to have a problem. I wonder why I'm not getting hired, and I read this somewhere that the cobweb.
Speaker 1:So the cobweb is actually. It's more, it's a drug thing. It's about being like a methamphetamine distributor or seller in your area.
Speaker 2:OK, what's the tear on the face?
Speaker 1:Some places it's how many people you've killed, and some places it's um for doing hard time.
Speaker 2:Yowch, I need to pay more attention to that and see who I'm talking to on the on the bus. Okay, I don't take the bus, but I talk to people in public all the time. I mean it's like I'm a magnet because people just come up and start talking to me, no matter what, and I don't really care, you know, I mean I don't, but sometimes I need to know. You know, did you kill people? Yeah, I killed my mama. You know, it's like what? I want to know what's going on.
Speaker 2:So, anyway, the topic came up because some people were feeling like they weren't getting hired for jobs because of tattoos, and some of them are very, very extreme, wouldn't you say? I mean, when you cover your whole face with tattoos or you know your entire body with tattoos, that's a little extreme. I mean I don't care what you do with your body. Really, I mean I don't care. Whatever you choose to do, that's your choice. But don't be surprised when people are judgmental about what you look like and how you are coming across for their business, how other people may perceive you. You know, don't be surprised at that. You can't just go.
Speaker 1:I think a lot of it has to do with context as well. Like you know you're, you're not going to be judged so harshly. You know, having roses on your body versus, um, you know, a naked lady who's bound and tied, you know, or something, something along that lines, because you know, and delving into it.
Speaker 1:You know there actually isn't any kind of protection for people with body modifications, like there is for other things. So, yeah, it is. It's completely up to that employer, um, and that business and that company as to what they want their you know representatives of their company to look like. And so, you know, people are like, well, I was discriminated against. Well, I mean, yeah, technically you were, but there's no laws, right? No, there's no legal repercussions, right? No federal law banning tattoo discrimination or anything like that, right?
Speaker 2:and I looked that up because I wanted to know that too. You know, could I get fired, could I not get hired, could I not get a promotion because of that?
Speaker 2:absolutely you're absolutely right. I mean, the employer can refuse to hire you for any reason except your race, sex, age, you know which is really 40 plus now used to be 50 plus, I don't know when that dropped Religion, national origin or disability. Not hiring someone for having a tattoo or how you've modified your body is perfectly legal, right, and so you know that's called a condition of employment and it, you know, the way I look at jobs and I always said this to my employees because I had to make that decision every day is, you know, I make a decision every day to either take it or leave it, and an employer does too. They're either going to take what you've got to offer and what you know. They don't have you there because you're a pretty face. They have you there to make their business profitable. That's why you're there, and if they feel that that's being hindered, they've got a right to let you go or not promote you or or not give you, you know, or give you the lower paying jobs yeah, that is true.
Speaker 1:That is true. I don't agree with it, but that is true I think, in in some cases.
Speaker 2:I think people do it for shock factor. You know, when I see somebody who's got tattoos all over their face and or it's you know what I would consider kind of a disgusting topic on their body, I think they do it for shock value. Now again, I don't care if you do it, you're not shocking me. I don't have to live with you, so you know. But let me ask you this Do you have any tattoos, bob? I already know the answer to this one.
Speaker 1:I have a lot of tattoos actually. Yes, a lot of visible tattoos, a lot of covered tattoos. Yeah, I've been getting tattoos since literally the day that I turned 18 yes, you have, and, um, I have tattoos.
Speaker 2:I don't have near as many as you and your sister have, and I just want to make this clear. They're not disgustingly covered with tattoos. Do they have several tattoos? Yeah, they got several. She have any on her face and you know, is or does she have anything that's really disgusting? Um, she's got one on her neck and one on the back of her neck, but, um, I would say, if somebody said, hey, listen, you know, uh, we need you to cover those up. Most of yours are on your arms, legs, wherever else you've got tattoos right and so you could very easily say, yeah, I can comply with that.
Speaker 2:Um, I can cover them up now, when you get them on your hands, yeah, and when you get them on your hands, that's a little more difficult, um, or your neck, that's a little more difficult to cover up, but, um, I don't, you know, I guess I could cover mine up. Let's ask Dr Domain. He's in the studio. He doesn't have the same viewpoint, I don't think, on tattoos as we do, because do you? Have any tattoos? Dr Domain, and I already know the answer to this one, but I don't think Bobby does.
Speaker 3:No, I do not.
Speaker 2:You do not you do not, and is it because you're just totally against tattoos or it's just not something that you've? I mean, what are your thoughts?
Speaker 3:it's. It's nothing that I would have or had the inclination to do do you look at people differently when they because they have tattoos? Yeah, I think it's I, I think I do you do.
Speaker 2:Now, this is interesting that he answered that way, because, for anybody who doesn't know this, dr Domain is my life partner and I have tattoos, and now I know that you're looking at me differently. Is that right? Fall back, fall back, yeah, yeah. In what way? Like negatively?
Speaker 3:Well, no, not necessarily.
Speaker 2:No, I want you to answer this, and I want you to answer it right now.
Speaker 3:I mean it's nothing new. I mean I've had members of my family have tattoos. My dad, had a tattoo.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:He got a tattoo when he was younger and my older brother's got a tattoo and I don't know. There's probably others in the family I don't know about.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:But I just don't have the inclination or the desire to spend the money on a tattoo. I have nothing, there's nothing that I can think of that I want to permanently have on my body. Really, so yeah, really okay, all right yeah, so what color is the frame around the mona lisa?
Speaker 1:black no brown gold.
Speaker 3:Why would you see? You don't even know, because that's not the important part, it's the painting. So yeah why would I, why do I, why do I worry about that?
Speaker 2:oh, is that your way of getting out of it, so that you you just said that you look at me differently as your life partner, since I have tattoos.
Speaker 3:But now I'm gonna put you on this piece of art oh my goodness, oh my yeah, he went the other way with that, yeah he could have.
Speaker 2:He could have dug himself out of the hole he's in right now, but he didn't. What about, um? So, again, you know, people have indicated that they're less likely to get hired since they have tattoos, primarily on their face, on their neck, that sort of thing, and that's probably true. They may be offered lower wages or less desirable positions due to tattoos. An employer can definitely do that legally, yeah, positions due to tattoos an employer can definitely do that legally. Yeah, um, in some cases, a refusal to hire somebody solely based on tattoos could be considered discrimination, but that would be a really, really hard hard case to yeah, that would be a yeah.
Speaker 3:I find it entertaining when people go out there and whine like I didn't get the job or I got fired, and guess what? They're not looking after you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they're looking after them, the bottom line of the business is the bottom line. Right, it's not you. Right, and it's always entertaining when you hear that, oh, I got fired for this or that.
Speaker 3:Well, you know you're hired and fired at will, Right.
Speaker 2:That's exactly right, so right. So I I saw a reel with a guy that had hundreds of piercings on his face. Now he had them all over his body, but he had them all over his face plus tattoos, and he had indicated that he was struggling to get a job. And he I've got to be honest with you, it was hard to look at, it was hard to look at and for me and uh, he and maybe he's a nice enough guy, I don't really know but I think it throws people off initially, you know, and there's probably some stereotypes out there, but to me I question you when you put hundreds on your face. I'm going to question your decision-making, decision making skills well, now I I've had a lot of you look at people differently with tattoos do I look at people differently?
Speaker 3:with tattoos.
Speaker 2:Yeah, if they've got them that are disgusting all over their face and stuff. I question their decision making skills objective, isn't it?
Speaker 3:what's disgusting?
Speaker 2:yeah, it is subjective. Yeah, absolutely. I want to be clear. I said different, I didn't say bad or good, I said skills, subjective, isn't it? What's disgusting? Yeah, it is subjective.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, I want to be clear. I said different. I didn't say bad or good, I said different, right and you know?
Speaker 2:somebody would say you know, are you prejudging or are you being biased? Yeah, you know. When I picked you as my partner yeah, when I picked you as my partner, I was being prejudiced. I said that's the one that I want for for my partner. Yeah, you betcha, I'm going to judge and you, betcha, I'm going to. I'm going to have a bias on it and a biased opinion and, um, I'm not saying.
Speaker 1:I've, I've had piercings, you know this. I've had a lot of piercings on my face, um and other places, and I don't think that I think there's been maybe one or two jobs where I actually didn't, I wasn't required to remove those piercings, and it was either because of a safety issue during my job you know, if it was just, you couldn't even have earrings or regular rings on your finger because of safety or it was, it was a literal image you know that they wanted to put forth of their company, because when you work for somebody, you're the face of their company, right? So when somebody walks to the door, you know, regardless if you work at Starbucks or you work at, you know, downtown CEO office, if they walk through the door and yours is the face that they see, you are the face of the company for those people. Yes, and so, yeah, absolutely that. You know I've been asked to remove piercings. I've been asked to cover tattoos. I've been asked to alter my hair because you know, there was a time when I had a different wild hair color every month and it's it kind of comes down to. I had the education, I had the training, I had the knowledge to do the job and I did the job well and they wanted to give me the opportunity to continue to do that job for them, knowing that I did the job that well, versus fighting over.
Speaker 1:You know, my hair being purple Right, and at that point the ball's in my court, you know they're giving me ways around it. They're giving me ways to resolve this so that I can continue my job, or they're saying I'm sorry we got to let you go. Do I think that it was fair? No, because my purple hair didn't determine the fact that I could, you know, be a paralegal and walk into court. But I'll be damned if I was in court and needed a paralegal, if I wanted somebody who had purple hair and piercings, walking in an eight inch, stilettos and fishnet stockings. You know, I mean, I'm not saying that they weren't able to do it and they weren't able to do it Well. You just question it, that's. I'm not saying that they weren't able to do it and they weren't able to do it well.
Speaker 2:You just question it. That's all I'm saying. Is I question your decision making skills when something like that happens. Now, the reason you were asked to take your piercings off was because remember that one time when you were magnetized to the, to the pizza oven by your tongue, that was, that was hard to take Bobby, I mean that was hard to take bobby, I mean that was hard to watch, and so, um, I think that's why they told you to remove that stuff. So, um, again, you know hands, arms those are. You know, hands are a little harder to cover up. I can cover up my arms. I can cover up the rest of my body.
Speaker 1:Well, you're really gonna hate this, then what? Um? So got some news for you. What your? Uh? Your your your granddaughter, who just turned 18 years old in august um you know, she went and got her first tattoo on her 18th birthday and that was on her arm. Yes, memorial tattoo. Uh, she went and got her second tattoo last week, okay, okay.
Speaker 2:Why is it no one tells me this at the time? Why is it you guys show you oh yeah, you won't, because she wants to see my face okay, so what is it you need to tell me about that one?
Speaker 1:um, it's on her hand. Okay, it's her entire hand. Okay, it's her entire hand Okay.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:What the listeners don't know is okay, I was 18 years old and I got my first tattoo. I didn't tell my mother. My mother did not have tattoos back then. I did not tell my mother because, even at 18 years old and I had been living out of the house for a while at that point, you know, my mom scared the hell out of me. Your mom sounds like a real witch.
Speaker 1:She's half my size, she's half my weight, but by God, I was scared to death of her and I just happened to be trying on a pair of jeans that she bought me. And she goes, turn around, pull the shirt up so I can see it, and my first tattoo I had gotten was on my spine, going up my back. Me, being a dumb 18 year old, forgot that I got that tattoo and I pull my shirt up so mom can see it.
Speaker 1:And I turned around and I could see the look on her face immediately.
Speaker 2:I was looking for a razor to cut that thing off of you. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's. That's what happened. Well, I mean, you know, wait a minute because let's back up a second. You were the same kid that shaved your head. Um came home with your head shaved in your senior year of high school we were going to she had won the Midwest art contest.
Speaker 1:So yeah, so it was the Scholastic Art Competition. I won the highest award, which was the Golden Key, which also came with an optional scholarship to New York City for art school.
Speaker 2:And so there was this big awards banquet.
Speaker 1:It was in a facility in downtown Des Moines, iowa, and it was a big deal back it up because, because the week before we left for ROTC, we were in competition for rifle and drill team for that entire week, leading up to to this revelation that my mother had when I whatever whatever.
Speaker 2:Anyway, I hadn't seen her the day of this event that we were supposed to go and get her award, and we're all dressed up and I'm ready to go, and she walks in with her head shaved and I didn't say a word.
Speaker 2:I didn't say anything it wasn't bald, bald, though it was pretty darn close. Oh no, you were, it was awful and and I just I just looked at her and I didn't say a word. And I think she was more shocked that I didn't say anything because you know, I I'm pretty vocal and yeah, when I want to say something, I'm gonna say it.
Speaker 2:Okay, and I, that's how I've always been said it and I just, I just kind of looked at her and walked away. And about an hour later we got ready to go to the event and I went out and got in my car and and she comes running out of the house. She goes, wait for me. And I go no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you're driving yourself. I said, life is all about choices. And you made a choice to shave your head. Now that's your choice. A choice to shave your head. Now that's your choice. You want to shave your head? Go shave your head. I think you look stupid, but go shave your head. And I said but I'm going to make a choice right now. I don't have to appear with you, I don't have to be with you and I don't have to sit with you, and that's a choice I'm making. And I got in my car and I went to the event. How she got there, I don't know, because she didn't even have a car, but she was, she was there, she wasn't sitting with me, uh, but anyway, let's keep moving on here, because I want to move to hair color too.
Speaker 2:And um, I just want to say real quick that back in the day, when I was, you know when I was much younger, um, way back when, way back when, uh, it was really the beginning of women starting to wear their hair colors way different than what we had seen in the past, like if you were blonde. Now they're. They're dying it black, which was really kind of shocking back in those days. And we had a gal at work that she had her hair dyed really really bright white, except for the very ends, which were all black, and I'm not kidding you, at that time it was like and she was the receptionist at the front desk of our company and I worked for a big big company and I'm not kidding you company, we and I worked for a big big company and I'm not kidding you, you would have thought that that the gates of hell had opened up and was ready to swallow everybody in because they acted like somehow she had murdered people and buried them under her desk and I just thought what the heck is the problem here? It's hair and it's not that big a deal.
Speaker 2:And now I look at some kids, and not just kids. I saw a woman today. She must've been 90 years old and her hair was purple and pink. And I'm walking in the store, she's walking out, I said, hey, I love your do. She goes oh, thank you, did I? No, I didn't, but it made her feel good, right, I don't care what you, I don't care what you, don't care what you do with your hair. So I think that I think that you know it's really kind of a personal choice when it comes right down to it, but you have to understand there's consequences based on your decisions.
Speaker 1:I can say I agree with the consequences, but you know it is what it is and you know when you work for someone else, you have to work for them. And if that includes you know your body modifications are not on that list, then they're not on the list. If you want to look like how you want to look like, you're going to have to work for yourself.
Speaker 2:That's probably the best thing to do self that's. That's probably the best thing to do. And the other thing is is, if you've got that many tattoos all over your body, you don't need a job because those things are expensive and you've just spent, uh, your all your retirement and everything, and your parents retirement, on all of that okay, but look at the look at it this way.
Speaker 1:I just sat for five and a half hours while someone jabbed needles in me repeatedly in the same areas. I think that I could sit through a board meeting at any company.
Speaker 2:That's probably true, bobby. Well, with that, I think we're going to say so long for the day. We really appreciate you tuning in and we appreciate hearing from you. So thanks for bringing this topic up. I don't even remember who it was, but thank you, uh, for bringing these up and uh, we do like talking about them. And uh, if you have any positive feedback, if you have an idea that you want us to talk about some topic, let us know. Just drop us an email. We're at boomer and gen xr dot. We're at boomer and gen xr at gmailcom and we also have a facebook page which is boomer and gen xr. Uh, walk into a bar, official, correct, bobby? Yes, okay, and so again, we appreciate y' and thanks for hanging with us as we're on the road. We know that our audio isn't the best, but we're doing the best we can. So for now I will just say I'm Jane Burt, I'm Bobbi Joy and you're stuck with us. Peace out Later.