BeTempered
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BeTempered
BeTempered Episode 69 - Doug Macias: Finding Faith, Community, and Recovery
What happens when a successful executive's carefully constructed facade finally crumbles, revealing decades of addiction, pain, and self-deception? Doug Macias knows this journey all too well. For more than 20 years, he was trapped in cycles of alcoholism, drug abuse, and emotional isolation. His story is raw, unflinching, and proof that even the most outwardly successful lives can mask unimaginable pain.
In this episode of BeTempered, hosted by Dan Schmidt and Ben Spahr, Doug takes us back to the fracture point of his parents’ divorce at 16. That painful event set him on a path of chasing acceptance through partying, material possessions, and chemical escapes. With brutal honesty, he shares how his intelligence and charm often earned him second chances after reckless and dangerous behavior, but those missed opportunities for accountability only fueled his downward spiral.
Everything began to change on December 28, 2016—Doug’s sobriety date after a destructive holiday binge. From that moment, he embarked on the difficult, non-linear path of recovery: admitting powerlessness, accepting help, walking into 12-step meetings, and rebuilding life step by step. He shares how recovery isn’t always straightforward—facing homelessness and hardships even after years of sobriety—but also how resilience, persistence, and faith transformed his life.
The most powerful part of Doug’s journey is his shift from isolation to connection. After decades of hiding behind walls, he discovered healing through community, faith, and service to others. Today, working in community development and openly sharing his story, Doug shows how helping others becomes the greatest form of self-healing. His testimony proves that no matter how far you’ve fallen, redemption is possible—one day, one hour, even one minute at a time.
🎙️ BeTempered isn’t just a podcast—it’s a movement. Each conversation with hosts Dan Schmidt and Ben Spahr uncovers stories of brokenness, resilience, and hope—reminders that transformation is possible.
👉 Support the mission and watch every episode live at Patreon.com/BeTempered
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God, I just thank you for bringing Doug here today and his testimony and I just ask that you let it hit the ears of everybody that everybody that's going to affect.
Speaker 1:Lord and God, I know that every time we share a testimony, that you're the one that gives us the testimony, you're the one that gets through the fire.
Speaker 1:Satan puts stuff in our lives that sometimes we get tempted and sometimes we go with the temptation. But wherever we come back to you at, you meet us right there and I'm just so thankful that we don't have to do anything to receive your grace. It's just there and I just ask that everybody's that, or everybody that hears his story and hears his testimony, understands that, that the grace is there, that the only thing we have to do is just understand it and accept it and also have grace for ourselves, as sometimes we're hard on ourselves, we don't think we deserve grace, but grace is all we have lord and it's what gives us the peace to be able to follow you as closely as we can. And I just ask that you um just be with doug as he shares his testimony and give him power and and and give Dan the the right things to ask, and I just ask that you just bless this and just let us feel your presence here, lord, and it's in your name we pray. Amen, amen, thank you.
Speaker 2:Hi, my name is Ali Schmidt. This is my dad, Dan. He owns Catron's Glass.
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Speaker 4:Hey, do you want to catch every episode live as it's being recorded? Log on to patreoncom slash be tempered for exclusive footage, behind the scenes, photos and a live recording as it takes place. Go to patreoncom slash be tempered. Welcome to the Be Tempered podcast, where we explore the art of finding balance in a chaotic world.
Speaker 1:Join us as we delve into insightful conversations, practical tips and inspiring stories to help you navigate life's ups and downs with grace and resilience.
Speaker 4:We're your hosts, Dan Schmidt and Ben Spahr. Let's embark on a journey to live our best lives. This is Be.
Speaker 1:Tempered.
Speaker 4:What's up everybody. Welcome to the Be Tempered podcast, episode number 69. 69. Boy, we got some beautiful weather. Yeah, it's perfect outside. Man, this is like this is my time of year Now. I know we got some heat left to come, I'm sure. But you get into that fall weather and those cool mornings and long sleeves and sweatshirts and man, I love it, I love it, I love it, I love it. Sleeves and sweatshirts and man, I love it, I love it, I love it, I love it. But today we have a special guest with a powerful story, one that I think probably many of our listeners out there can relate to, whether personally, or whether with a family member or friend or someone who's who's dealt with some of the similar situations in life that our guest has. So I would like to welcome Doug Macias to the Be Tempered podcast.
Speaker 5:Welcome, doug, thank you. Thanks for having me, yeah.
Speaker 4:Why so serious?
Speaker 5:A lot of people say that and then they want me to grow up.
Speaker 4:No, you're good man. You know, we had a conversation a week or so ago and I've been trying to make the connection for a while through mutual friends and, and we did, and I just told you a little bit ago that you know, that conversation deeply impacted me because I could, I could, see the change in you and I didn't even know you prior and um, and I can see it now. I can, I can see the emotion and the passion in your face and and um, I'm excited for everyone to hear your story because, like we talk about, there's one person out there that needs to hear it and it's going to help and uh, and that's what it's all about. So, how we like to start every episode is going back to childhood, so, so talk about what life was like for you growing up and where you grew up.
Speaker 5:Okay, thank you. I mean, before I go there, I want to say a few thank yous. Number one to Brian Ballinger. He's the one that shared my name with you. Thank you guys for the invitation. Thank you, dan, for waiting.
Speaker 5:When you originally reached out in June, I knew why you reached out I wasn't ready, for whatever reason. Kind of some of the things that we talked about is, I've been sober. My sobriety date is December, the 20th, 2016. So I'm eight and a half years in and I've given my shared my story, my testimony, whatever you want to call it uh, multiple times, the majority of the times in 12 step rooms and churches, things, platforms like that. I don't think I've ever done it on a live podcast where it's strictly recovered. Well, I mean, my recovery is going to be a big piece of it, but put it out there for everybody and it's going to potentially live forever. So I would say nerves, fear, shame, embarrassment, all that stuff, but some things have actually happened within since then. That finally got to a point where I was ready. So thank you for waiting. Thanks for Kevin for being here.
Speaker 5:So back to the original question. So, born and raised in Alton Illinois, southern Illinois, near St Louis Went to Catholic school for about five years, switched over to middle school. Parents got divorced when I was 16. When that happened and that's another I guess I want to say statement I want to make is I'm probably going to share some things today. My intent here is to share my story as honest and vulnerable and raw as I can, and I may say some things that may hurt some people in some way, shape or form. That's not my intent. I am not pointing the finger or blaming anybody for anything that's happened in my life. What recovery has taught me is I got to look at what was my role in it, what was my part in it, and quit pointing the finger at everybody else and point the finger at Doug. So if I do hurt anybody, I apologize. I owe a lot of people, a lot of apologies over the years and I'm simply doing my best to make my amends, to make it right, to be better.
Speaker 5:So I mean when I talk about my parents' divorce, I mean when I look back. That was a moment where things inside of me started to go different directions, when, when parts of me got broken and I'm not pointing the finger at my mom or my dad they did the best that they could. Everybody has challenges, everybody has problems, everybody makes mistakes, but I'm not pointing the finger at my mom or my dad, but when that happened, um cause, growing up I was relatively pretty good student. I got A's pretty easily without putting a lot of effort into it. I was a great procrastinator when it came to the books flip to the very back Um and I and I would do pretty good Um. When I played sports and anything extra extracurricular, I did pretty good at that too, without putting in very much work or effort. Um. But when the divorce happened, um, that's when I pretty much gave up all the sports.
Speaker 4:Um why do you, why do you think that?
Speaker 5:I think that's when I started chasing other things. Maybe one of the things was I wanted a car. Mom and dad said get a job. I got a job and I started getting addicted to money. I'm one of those. I get addicted to everything from coffees at Roscoe's to popsicles to Oreos. One is not enough of anything for me. So I got addicted to money. But that's when I started messing around with drinking and smoking weed. But it was. I also wanted to be the popular kid. I was always a real short kid so I always wanted to be. I thought it would be. Things could make me popular or get attention. So I mean I had to have the Jordans and the Bo Jacksons and the Reebok pumps.
Speaker 4:I had those. You know, those are sweet yeah.
Speaker 5:Yeah, and I mean I had to have the at that time, the eighty hundred dollar polo shirts. So I, I think I'd I just identified success or popularity. I wanted to. I wanted to be the cool, popular kid with the guys and the girls. So I remember the first time I had a beer, I hated it. I remember I think I even snuck into the bathroom and poured out. But I wanted to be cool because I thought that's what the cool kid, that's what the jocks did, that's what the popular, that's what the people that had money did. So I mean that's when I started just chasing all the things, um, and that that partying, uh, behavior, lifestyle just continued into my teens.
Speaker 5:I think I, I think I was before I was 21. I think I wrecked my, wrapped my car around a telephone pole and I remember and I we were in a small town and I feel pretty comfortable and confident saying I got, I got a, a get out of jail free card, and I think it was because there wasn't all the technology as there was back then and it was also because of who our family was, our family very large, very reputable family back in Alton. So I think I got my first get out of jail free card. So I didn't pay any consequences and I remember when the cop was there, he was trying to help me out. Did you have your seatbelt on? No, was it because of the rain? Oh no, as soon as I pulled out of the neighborhood I hammered it because I had the Mustang right. So I mean, it was just the ongoing cycle. In my teens and then into my 20s, it was the same thing.
Speaker 4:What'd you do so? You finished high school. Did you go to college? You go into workforce? What was your career path from high school?
Speaker 5:I tried messing around with some college. I always wanted to, but I just never made it a priority. I was always chasing the money. I mean I think I was managing a local pizza shop back home and I think when I was in my teens I think I was making close to $30,000 a year and I had the company paid pager right and I think I even had a profit sharing because I had a great relationship with the owner. So I mean back then in the 90s, that's a lot of money for a kid.
Speaker 5:Right out of high school, right I had the keys to the kingdom and I moved around a lot. I moved around a lot. I moved around a lot. I was like you know what, I'll move. My problems won't follow me. It was the people, places and things that I was around that were the problem that was usually associated with drinking and drugging. So it was pretty much the same pattern going through my 20s and I'm sure we'll come back to some of that later on down the road. 30s same thing.
Speaker 5:Early 30s I got a DUI in the company car. Once again didn't suffer a lot of consequences. Number one, because I lied. I was a really good liar when my license got suspended. I didn't tell my I had a company car. I didn't tell my I was on the road all the time for my job. I wasn't honest with my employer and for me it was I'm going to pay. I always thought money was the solution to all my problems. I was like I'm going to get the best lawyer to fight this to minimize the damage as much as possible, and that's what we did. And I remember I don't know why I almost have a smile on my face, but it just because of how good of a manipulator I was and how selfish I was the night I got my DUI. It was the night of the time change. So one of the one of our case statements was we're going to fight this based on the time being wrong, if you catch my drift.
Speaker 4:Instead of owning it.
Speaker 5:Instead of just owning it. Yeah, you know what we're going to. We're going to try to fight this. And that was about the time that I was getting ready to move out here to Indiana and I remember when I finally got in front of the judge, the judge was like you know what? This is your first offense, here's your community service, da-da-da-da, and we're going to let Indiana deal with you. Problem anymore. Another get out of jail free card. And I remember them also saying that uh, in St Louis and this is no shot at Anheuser-Busch, but they're like Anheuser-Busch donate so money, so much money to things like this that your first DUI is you get, you get a pretty good pass. You come up, you show up for your class, you do your community service, so not a lot of consequences.
Speaker 4:You had to feel invincible, almost in a way that you could do anything.
Speaker 5:I always did, um, because one of my solutions for the longest time was when things get bad, I'll bury my head in my work, I'll make more money and the money will fix my problems. So that's, I kept just the month. I mean the money and the job elevations just kept on coming my way. So I moved out here to Indiana and, ironically so, my birth date is July the 27th. 27 was always my favorite number. My sobriety date's the 28th and I'll explain later why the 28th versus the 27th. Um, but it's ironic, today being August the 27th, this is my 15 year anniversary of, and I actually moved out to Indiana. So, moved out to Indiana, started this new job, um, and I would take periods off of drinking and this and that, trying to control and manage it myself. Um, but it was the same cycle throughout my thirties, same cycle throughout my 30s. Same cycle, just different city, different story.
Speaker 5:But I think this is where we'll really start getting into my story February 4th 2016. Something happened that day that made me finally really want to get sober. So that was in February, march I'm trying, I'm trying, but then Doug would go out and drink and then he would say and do things and then blame it on the drinking. Also, earlier that year one of my best friends growing up, he died suddenly and it really ate my lunch because I hadn't hardly seen him in years, so it was really eating my lunch that I lost out on some of the last years of this guy's life and I hadn't had hardly anything to do with him for stupid selfish reasons. So rest in peace. Wayman Lockhart A lot of you know that name. We lost him way too soon, but then also that year. So June was a big turning point in that year.
Speaker 5:So finally in June I'm like I got to do something about this drinking, like I'm a relatively smart guy. I've got a pretty good job and you work for a ginormous insurance company. You've probably got some type of assistance for this. So I pull out my wallet, get out my insurance card, call the 800 number. They refer me to an EAP. Eap referred me to a therapist in the Noblesville area. So I went to see. Went to see her, puts paperwork in front of me, the intake forms and it's score yourself zero to eight when it comes to drinking or drugging. I scored high. I know I score high, but that's not my problem. The drinking and the drugs. Primarily the drinking isn't my problem, it's the things that I say and do when I'm drinking.
Speaker 5:One of the main things I learned from her and I'm so grateful for her was her usage of words, and what I mean by that is she didn't say Doug, you're an alcoholic, doug, you need to do this. Doug, you need to do that. She would say, maybe you should try this. She would lay out some suggestions for me. I would try some things. Some things would work, some things wouldn't. And I wouldn't try some things because I wasn't that bad yet, right, and so I turned 40 that July. So there's another reason why, cause I didn't understand why it was escalating to the degree that it was that year. So I turned 40. So I'm like, oh, this midlife crisis thing is, it's the real deal. So I'm like, oh, this midlife crisis thing is, it's the real deal. And then in August my temper really started to come out in bad ways, bad dangerous ways.
Speaker 5:Other things that happened that year. My mom had some health stuff going on. My dad was diagnosed with his first bout of prostate cancer, um, and all along, I'm doing the therapy and there would be a suggestion out there like maybe a 12 step meeting. Yeah, um. And then also that year, um, I was up in Fort Wayne for work and I think I saw on Facebook or somehow I got word that one of my really good friends back home that his little brother got killed in the line of duty. He was a police officer and I remember I'm sitting in the parking lot in Applebee's in Fort Wayne and I didn't know what to do. I was like, do I just cancel this meeting? Do I head straight home right now to be with friends? What do I do?
Speaker 5:Went in, had the lunch with the client, came out, finished my day and then kind of got into my normal routine. I went and checked in at the hotel. Actually, first I went and had a couple of drinks with another client and then um went and checked into the hotel and I always got a hotel that was pretty close to a place where I could get a bite to eat, sit at the bar, uh, because that's where you get the fastest service, that's where you get the best service. There's also a TV there. It's like a multitask right. Take the laptop in and I'm sitting at the bar.
Speaker 5:And I couldn't hold tears back. So people started asking hey, what's going on. So people do what people do. They started buying shots and then the next thing I knew I woke up in a completely different hotel room than I checked into different hotel room that I checked into Phone was dead. So, uh, got juice in my phone, got into a taxi, I think and uh, my phone lights up and I'm getting messages from all kinds of people starting to, um, say things like we were getting ready to start checking jails and hospitals, say things like we were getting ready to start checking jails and hospitals. So in my mind, okay, this is finally affecting my work. But when the fog starts to lift, when people are making comments like that, they're already seeing they've got a clue what's going on.
Speaker 5:Because that's also how I branded myself I was fun Doug, I was party Doug, I'm the big time executive that's taking you to the Colts games and buying all the drinks and doing the big fancy dinners, and I was successful at doing it too. So I remember I'm coming down Highway 69 and I text somebody. I said I think I finally hit rock bottom. So I think this was, I don't know, september, ish. So the same things are still going on, october, november, and the therapist is saying things like maybe, maybe, a 12 step meeting.
Speaker 5:So I think at some point in that timeframe I did go to one. I got there late cause, looking back now, if you've never been to a 12 step meeting, finding them can be a challenge. Um walked in and I saw here's me judging some rougher looking people tattoos and ankle bracelets and that type of stuff. So in my mind I'm like I'm not that bad. But I did hear some things that kind of resonated. So when I went back to my therapist and she asked about it, I said yeah, I went. I was late, wasn't me, I wasn't that bad. And she kind of just shakes her head and she's like I'll kind of give you the benefit of the doubt on this one a little bit. The place that you went it's really close to the courthouse, so there's probably some people there that they're there to get their sheet signed. They're getting the nudge from the judge and there again her usage of words Maybe try one somewhere else.
Speaker 5:Okay, but I was getting ready to go home for Christmas and when I go home for Christmas it's the end of the year, I'm celebrating a successful work year. I'm going to be around, all my family, all my boys, all my people. So my partying is at another level because then, also here, the big shot, doug, is coming home, right. So my plan was to go home and not screw the holidays up like I did the year before. The year before the year before, I mean, I fell down my brother's steps, I lost my brand new company phone, things like that. So my therapist was like so what's your plan? And I was like I got this. And she kind of gives me a look. She's like okay, what do you got this time, doug? And I was like I got this. She's like what's this? I'm like, oh, duels. And she's like okay, so I head home.
Speaker 5:I think I got home on Friday and, yeah, my cousin was having a big birthday party, so everybody's there and I'm just killing the old duels. And then it was about nine or 10 o'clock and my dad said all right, son, we're heading home, because next day was Christmas Eve. Christmas Eve was a big deal at dad's house and I was like, oh, dad, come on your son's home, it's your nephew's birthday, everybody's here. I said stay and have one more, and I'll have one with you. So I had one, and that was three or four days off the races.
Speaker 5:Um, I should probably back up a little bit. Um the way things that were getting the bottom half of that year. Um, I was starting to. I was a really good drunk driver and I'm really proud of that. Shame on me. But things were getting so bad the end of that year I was getting scared of myself and I was starting to have the thoughts that if I go to jail again, if I get another DUI, if I lose my job, I'll either be in jail or if I have to move back home with mommy or daddy in the basement, that's okay too. That's the depth and the darkness that my drinking was taking me.
Speaker 5:So back to back to Christmas time. I'm off to the races for three or four days. On day four I come out of it and I got a gash on my head again and I'm sitting on the curb at the hotel and I'm crying and I'm texting somebody saying I think I'm 40 years old and my life is out of control and I don't know what to do. So once again I did it. Again I screwed up my holidays. So I've got the rest of the year off, but instead of staying with friends and family they don't want some of them don't want anything to do with me, right, and it's the same of the year off but instead of staying with friends and family, they I mean, they don't want. Some of them don't want anything to do with me, right?
Speaker 4:And it's the same old song and dance, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5:So and and and apologies and my sorries were worthless at that point to some people, right? So, um, packed up, headed home laying in bed licking my wounds and I'm like, what do I do now? My, it's the holidays. Um, the 800 number, they're on vacation. Uh, my therapist she's on. She's on vacation. Maybe I'll try this 12 step thing. Um, so the reason I chose December the 28th is my sobriety date is because when I went out on the 26th, I don't know when I got home. So 27 has always been my number, right.
Speaker 4:You were hungover.
Speaker 5:I probably I could have possibly been drinking or doing drugs on the 27th, I don't know, shameful right, but it's the truth. So that's why I landed on. The 28th is my sobriety date. But then on December, the 30th, yeah, six o'clock at night, I closed out the books. My best year ever made more money than I ever did in my life. I was so good. They were sending me and a guest on an all expense paid trip to Hawaii. But at seven o'clock that night I walked into my first 12 step meeting. So on one side of it, highs, but at the same time lowest of the lows, my bottom and I.
Speaker 5:At your first meeting you hear a lot of things. You hear a lot of things. You hear a lot of experience. You hear a lot of suggestions and I remember the one thing that really stuck out is your most important meeting is your next meeting. I know what that means and I get that now and then. The other thing that I remember hearing is I don't know why we give them our numbers. We should be getting theirs because we know that they're not going to use it. You go to a 12-step meeting. They hand around a piece of paper or something and all the guys write down their numbers for each other. I get it now.
Speaker 5:I mean, it's hard to pick up the phone and call somebody you'd probably don't know. And what I've learned through this journey is, I think one of the hardest things for us to do is is to admit to ourselves we got a problem. And then I think one of the next hardest things to do is to reach out to somebody else and say, hey, I need help Cause we're men, right. Yeah, we're in. Look, I mean I'm a big strong man, right, that's a, that's a, that's one of my jokes, right there. But I mean we're not supposed to be honest, we're not supposed to be vulnerable, we're not supposed to cry. Handle your business, man up, right. All those, all those things that I think a lot of us grew up with. I think times are changing. Yeah, this podcast is an example of that.
Speaker 5:So I went to that meeting the next day because that stuck in my head your most important meeting is your next meeting. So the next day, new Year's Eve, I'm in Carmel, indiana, because that's where I was living at the time. It's cold, it's dark, but I found a meeting in the back of a church at like 8 or 9 o'clock at night probably 8 o'clock and I get back there, it's dark there again. I don't know where I'm at, I don't know what I'm looking for, I don't like cold weather. So I'm starting to walk into this building and I saw somebody was walking out and they said, I guess there's not a meeting. I'm like, okay. So I turned around and started walking back to my car and once again, thank goodness, somebody else was walking in. They said, hey, you're looking for a meeting. I said, yeah. She said come on in, we're going to have one. And I think at that meeting there was only three or four of us and, um, there was a married couple there and that was something that gave me hope. I was like, oh, hmm, there's actually a married couple doing this, because I thought only losers were doing this thing. Right, all the judgment that we make assumptions, and I'm so grateful for them because they simply do what we do.
Speaker 5:After the meeting, he sat down, they took out a meeting directory and they said okay, tomorrow here's a good meeting. We suggest you go to Monday. Tuesday went through the whole week, um. So then I woke up, new year's day, I didn't want to work out, I didn't want to go to church and I didn't want to go to a meeting. Thank goodness there was some light coming on in there that said probably not the best way to start off your year. So I got up, went to church and there wasn't a whole lot of church in me at the time. The only thing that the only thing that was in me church related is because I was. I was hungry and searching and desperate for help and answers, no matter what rock it was under. So went to church, went to work out and the meeting they suggested wasn't until that night.
Speaker 5:So my goal that day was when I walk in these rooms I hear all these folks saying my name is such and such and I'm a such and such. I didn't say that yet. So got to that meeting. That night it came around to me and I said my name is Doug and I'm an alcoholic. And then just waterworks. And uh, I remember this big Hawaiian dude came over after the meeting and put his hand on my shoulder. He's like all right, brother. He was like you finally got that elephant off your chest. Now you're going to have to learn how to eat the elephant one bite at a time. Boy. Do I get what that means now? Um, so, I think it was that night I went home and, uh, I had been avoiding my mom.
Speaker 4:Why.
Speaker 5:She could see what was going on and all I did was deny it and fight it. I didn't want to be honest with people. I didn't want to talk to people. The worse things got, the more I isolated myself. And it was a new year and I didn't want to. I didn't want to hide from my mom anymore. I'm not going to cry today, even though I had Kleenex in my back pocket.
Speaker 1:You're good man.
Speaker 5:Um. So I shared with her hey, I'm doing this, I've started this, uh, this 12 step thing. And I remember her saying and it was one of the hardest things to hear Hear my mom say I was losing my son and I didn't know what to do. And she's in tears saying it How'd that hit you About as hard as anything can hit you? Cause I think, at the end of the day, that's what a lot of us want to do, is we want to make our parents proud, right? Yeah, um.
Speaker 5:So the next day is a Monday. We're still off of work. So I wake up and I'm feeling good about myself. Right, I've been to a meeting. How many days in a row? I said I'm an alcoholic. I talked to my mom. So that day there, before I go back to work, it's all about Doug. That day I'm going out and I'm getting a haircut, I'm getting a shave, I'm getting a massage, I'm getting ready because this is Doug. Two point this is a new Doug coming out the box, right?
Speaker 5:So evening time rolls around and I did what I always did. I went to the Mexican place because I'm Mexican, and sat at the bar, got an O'Doul's and a water. So the next day, tuesday, back to work and I went to a. I went to a lunch 12th. There was a 12 step meeting over lunch. So it gets around to me and I'm like it's day five. I've been to five meetings in a row.
Speaker 5:I said I'm an alcoholic. I thought I told my mom and last night I even did what I always, what I always did. I went to the bar that I got an Oduels and one of the guys is not supposed to do this, but he said stay the F away from the bars and stay the F away from the Oduels and excuse my French if I use it at any point in time, but that version of Doug, those are the words that he understood, words like faith and things like that. There was none of that inside. That was the language and vocabulary that I spoke and knew, right.
Speaker 5:So I kind of walk out of there frustrated, frustrated, and I'm like what the F? I'm like you hear all this stuff, read these books and and and work these steps and go to meetings and get a sponsor, and I'm like this is like a full-time job. How am I going to do this? I already got one. So, thankfully, when I got home I saw that original little booklet with all the names and numbers on there that I'd gotten on that first night that I hadn't picked up and used yet, cause I don't need your help. I'm Doug, I can do this on my own Right, cause I always did. I always did things a short, fast, easy way and I was good at it. Right, I've been rewarded for that type of behavior on one side of the fence for my entire, for my entire life. Right, I've been rewarded for that type of behavior on one side of the fence for my entire for my entire life, right?
Speaker 5:So I picked up the phone and I said hey say. I said hey, thank you for saying what you said, because I don't know what, I don't know and this sounds like a full-time job. And he and he did what we do. He said why don't you meet me for dinner tomorrow at such and such? And then, if you want and there again the usage of words he said and then, if you want, I'm going to go to a men's meeting. If you want to join me? He didn't say and then you're going to go or we're going to go. It was simply laying the opportunity out there, simply laying the opportunity out there. So then a big fast forward of the tape. I'm sitting here today with eight and a half years sobriety, but I'll throw some asterisks in there.
Speaker 5:So your first year of sobriety. They say there's some suggestions, not rules. There's suggestions, no big decisions. Right, because the chances are you've probably been drinking or drugging or whatever you're doing for for a little bit of time. Me, I started when I was 16, so I got 20 plus years of practice and experience of drinking and drugging and living and behaving that way, right? So your first year, maybe you focus on getting sober and staying sober. So no big decisions when it comes to relationships, jobs, things like that. There again, here's Doug right, this is Doug Doug. I do things the fast, easy, the right way the first time. So I got into a relationship with a woman that had two kids. We got engaged, we moved in together. I decided to make a big job move. I encouraged my mom to sell her house and move out here to Indiana. So lots of big changes, right. So I get to the end of year one and my sponsor says congratulations, now don't F it up. And I'm like what? I'm like, why that? Where's the party at? Why isn't it like written in the sky here? Doug Macias has done all these big things right.
Speaker 5:Um, about month 14, I remember I got sick. I didn't go to a meeting one day. A meeting led to one day led to a week. A week led to almost a month. All my stuff started coming back. And I mean there's so many sayings, but they always say you got to put your sobriety first. Anything you put in front of your sobriety, you're at risk losing and losing again. So, fiance, kids looking to buy a house, new job, my mom, all this pile full of stuff in year one, in front of my sobriety and and I'm sick, right um, what was your sickness? I think I had. I probably had a cold or something, the flu. Whatever you, whatever you had a man cold.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know how we do with that, it's severe.
Speaker 5:So me and the fiance, some words were exchanged and this and that, and I resorted to my old behaviors. What I call it now is my F it switch F. This F. You pack a bag, I'm out. Send mom an email. Mom, I'm heading out of town for work. Need you to find me a new place as close as you can to my new office? Right, so I get back. She hands me the keys. I had the movers come that weekend to move all the big stuff.
Speaker 5:So here I am in this brand new, nice, dark apartment half an hour or so away from where I got sober at and the people that helped me get and stay sober. So I remember on. I think it was whatever night it was, it's irrelevant, but I'm in this new dark apartment and I'm counting the places I can walk and have a drink. I'm having the thoughts I can go have one. Nobody can know I can go have one and I'm not going to hurt anybody, but thank goodness, and that's where I'm going to give it to God. I think God's the only thing that helped keep me sober overnight. I should probably back up and insert some of my faith journey in there too at some point. But thank goodness, the next day I woke up and my brain was trained enough by then.
Speaker 5:Your most important meeting is your next meeting. So in Indy on Sunday mornings they had the Sunday morning breakfast meeting and I laugh because I'm a foodie. So I was like, ooh, breakfast meeting, there's going to be food there. It sounds like that's the meeting I'm going to. There ain't no breakfast at that meeting. That's one of the longest standing meetings in Indy and there's still no breakfast there. I'm still a little resentful about it if you can't tell, but it got me there, thank goodness. Actually, no, I got my story mixed up.
Speaker 5:So the dark night was on Friday. Saturday I woke up and I went to a men's meeting in Indy Pre-COVID. It was a 7.30 in the morning meeting on a Saturday and there's usually over 100 men there one of the most powerful meetings I've ever been to and I sat in the back with my hat on because I didn't want any of you guys to see me and ask me how I was doing, because I was doing exactly how you said I would be doing if I didn't listen to you, based off of your experience. Right, yeah? So after the meeting, guys did what they did. They came over, shook my hand how are you doing? But during the meeting, when it came around to me to share um, that's what I said out loud. I said I'm sitting back here cause I don't want none of you guys asking me how I'm doing, because I'm doing exactly how I was. I'm doing shitty again. I'm doing exactly how you said I'd be doing if I didn't listen to you and everything's falling apart again. So after the meeting they came around, they shook my hand, they hugged me, they gave me their phone number. They got my number. We Next morning I go to the Sunday morning breakfast meeting.
Speaker 5:And this is funny how the recovery network works. So after I got out of that meeting I got a text message from my first sponsor. He said hey, heard you're not doing that. Great, you know that meeting you went to they're looking for somebody to give their lead, their testimony, the next week. And I was like I don't want to hear this right now. I don't want to get up in front of a room of people and tell them how I'm doing. But I also learned in the recovery network that when you're asked to do something, you simply say yes, you shut up and you say yes. So I did so. I got up in front of a room full of people but it felt so good to get it out.
Speaker 5:And then my same sponsor down in Florida again is texting me again. He's like hey, you know that meeting, they're looking for a secretary, they're looking for a service position. In my head I'm like man, no, no, I don't want to do this. I've got my life now. I go to church every Sunday morning, I've got my routine. But I shut up and I listened and that's when I really started really doing service work. Because we've got a in the recovery world we have tokens and I've got my eight-year token with me and there's a triangle and it says Unity, recovery, unity and Service. That's kind of one of the drills that we'll do is we'll kind of grade ourself what's the weakest area of your? You're in the center of this token, right? The service work I was doing before I was simply doing it just because I was checking before. I was simply doing it just because I was checking the boxes. I was trying to do the bare minimum. Um, so I did the service position and then another moment that happened that that time period is my.
Speaker 5:My original therapist reached out to me Cause, if you know me, I live. I live my life out loud on social media and I think that with a lot of people you can kind of tell what's going on in their life by, maybe, some of the stuff they're posting and they're sharing. So my therapist reached out to me. She sent me a, she sent me a DM, she slid into my DMS and that what the kids say these days. But she said, hey, I don't know what's going on, but I think maybe we should get together.
Speaker 5:Okay, we sat down and she's like I'm going to say a couple of things. I know you're probably not going to like to hear them, but I think you might need to hear them. She's like I think you're depressed and in my mind I'm like F you, I'm a man, I'm not depressed. And then another conversation in my head F you, because my mom always said that Because you could be when Doug was drinking, he could be fun Doug, or he'd be booze bag Doug crying in his beer sitting there crying at the bar. He never knew which version of Doug you were going to get, um. But that that voice also, and that voice inside my head, said you know what, maybe she's right. Maybe shut up and listen, doug, because you've been listening to yourself for 40 years and it ain't been working. How's that been working out for you, right? And she said God bless her, you know who you are, cause you're probably going to listen to this, cause I still stay in touch with her. Um, she said I'm not just going to write your prescription. She was like maybe medication is a tool or a solution, maybe it's not. She's like do like you do in your recovery program, reach out to at least 10 people. I didn't want to reach out to 10 people, just tell me what to do, but I did it. I shut up and I listened and she said and make one of them your doctor, make some of them people that are in recovery, make some people reach out to some that aren't in recovery. Okay, and this is where I'm so grateful for my doctor. So I go see my doctor.
Speaker 5:I was very I was always very open about my drinking and drugging and he said um, so you believe you have the disease of alcoholism, right? Yes? And you treat it accordingly daily, right yes? He said maybe, just maybe, you had this other disease of depression and anxiety, and they love to hang around each other and they love to fuel each other and press each other's buttons. He said maybe. He didn't say you're depressed, he wasn't, you know. He said maybe.
Speaker 5:There again the usage of words. He said maybe we need to treat that accordingly, daily and separately from the alcoholism. Like you do your. Like you do your alcoholism. I'm like okay, I can buy this. He's like maybe we're going to suggest a prescription, maybe it's short term. Maybe it's short term, maybe it's longterm, maybe it's permanent. Maybe you work on this, like you are your alcoholism, and work on what's ever going on inside your heart and head. Okay, so we, we, we did go down the medication route and we had to adjust it, but it helped, because what they always say is 2016 was my bottom right? There's always another bottom. I'm eight years in. There's always another potential bottom out there and it could get worse. I know where those bottoms could lead, but I think, but I did the work, I did the work.
Speaker 4:I did the work was that the first time you felt like you truly listened to somebody?
Speaker 5:once I got into recovery, yeah, and then after I hit that kind of next bottom about 14 plus months in yeah, I think that's when I mean after I hit that kind of next bottom about 14 plus months in yeah, I think that's when I finally started listening. I remember things that I heard and the tools I got in recovery. Maybe it's time we take the cotton out of our ears and put it in our mouth. That's why God gave us two ears and one mouth, so that way we can listen twice as much. All the corny sayings that are just gold, and I'm grateful for the people I got sober with.
Speaker 5:A lot of people say that I work a militant, aggressive program, whatever you want to call it. You know what I drank aggressively. You know my disease that's still inside of me. It's aggressive, it's militant. At the end of the day, it's not going to rest until I'm dead, right, yeah, there's the saying that it's it's out in the car and then the car is running or it's out in the parking lot doing pushups. So I have to work. I believe I have to work a program as as aggressive as I did when I was out there doing the things that I was doing. Um, I know I'm kind of bouncing all over the place now, but you want me to go down my faith journey at all, how that played into all that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, absolutely, because what I, what I see when I hear you, when I hear you talk about the addictions in your life and your work and all these things, I see this wall around you. I see these walls around your shoulders, around your ears, around your head. But then I see where, once you start to listen a little bit, not to yourself but to others I start to listen a little bit not to yourself but to others I start to see parts of that wall fall in. But then there's somebody trying to build that wall back up. And then you listen again, or you talk to someone or you recognize your faults, and then I see the wall come down. But somebody's always trying to build that wall back up and I don't know if that's you, I don't know if that's the devil, I don't know who it is, but I keep seeing you build the wall and then the wall comes down.
Speaker 1:And every time.
Speaker 4:Every time the wall comes down, I see your shoulders come down, and so I don't know what that is. But yes, I want to hear about your faith journey, because I know that that is a pivotal moment in your life, to where you are truly starting to tear those walls down.
Speaker 5:Absolutely, and it's, it's, it's, it's. It's pretty cool how you can see right through me and you really don't even know me because you're so right and it's, it's all the things that you said. It's me, it's, it's the devil, it's, it's, it's, it's all, it's all that stuff, and I can't believe I left out some of the faith stuff in there and that's why I have it written down on the script over there. But I said, doug, come in there and don't just have the conversation. So there you went to school, for went to Catholic school for about five years. There was really not a whole lot of church or religion in the family. What I say is there were crosses on the walls. Both families were Catholic. We went to church for the big three weddings, funerals and holidays, if that but also didn't have any bad experiences, because I know that there are a lot of people out there that did have bad experiences, but I never did. I would say I was always curious, um, and, like I said, in 2016, I started going and visiting this church and that church just simply looking for help. Um, but when I got into recovery, seeing how, how rooted, uh, the 12 step program that I worked, what um worked, was and is in spirituality. I was open to it. I was open to anything and everything that you were selling me just to help me out with this drinking thing. Right At first I didn't want your God, your Jesus, your church. But if that's part of this package I'm okay with it. But it's also kind of in the wording that the 12 steps use. They don't tell you what God, they don't tell you what religion, they don't tell you what church you know. But I think some of the highlights. I was open, I was open to listening, I was opening to suggestions and the more open I was, the more the more gifts I was. The more gifts I was receiving, the more the more help, the more answers I was receiving.
Speaker 5:And in about day 50 of sobriety a buddy of mine reached out, wanted to get together for lunch, a guy that I know for over 20 years. I met him through work. He reached out to me and wanted to get together for lunch and I really wanted to get together with him. And the reason I wanted to get together with him is that in June of 16, he invited me to this retreat and I was curious about this retreat. I was curious why he invited me, big man of faith. But I thought he knew what was going on with me, because when I would get drunk sometimes I would send him messages because I thought he might be somebody that could help me.
Speaker 5:So we were set to go to lunch and, uh, he reached out to me at the last minute. He said, hey, instead of going to lunch, why don't we meet at the gym? And I'm like, oh, I don't want to meet at the gym. But I was like, shut up and listen, doug, maybe to say hey, instead of going to lunch, why don't we meet at the gym? And I'm like I don't want to meet at the gym. But I was like, shut up and listen, doug, maybe just say, yes, this guy is in better shape than you, maybe you can learn something from him. So we get to the gym and we're on the treadmills and we're doing, oh, how's the wife, how's the life? All the normal blah, blah, blah, the catch up. I was like, all right man.
Speaker 5:I was like you know that retreat thing you invited me to last year, like, why did you invite me to that? And he said, douglas, he was like the only answer I can give you is that for some reason God keeps putting your name on my heart and me just boom, because the day 50, my mind and my heart were starting to open up. And he's like, what makes you ask? And I'm like I'm like, all right, let's go sit down on a bike. So I just, I just word vomit everything that's been going on in my life for I don't know how many years. And he's like, wow. And then he shared some things with me and I'm like, wow, Right, you made here's another successful man that he's actually had some problems to his own problems, his own situations, his own story. But I'm like this is another grown man that on the outside I thought had everything put together Right Cause I think a lot of us just think and assume that way, or at least I did for the better part of my life.
Speaker 4:Okay, a lot of people.
Speaker 5:Yeah, and he said you know that retreat last year. He was like there just happens to be another one next week and I knew where he was going with it. My wall started coming up, my shoulder started tensing up, like you said, and see, and I was like, well, send me some information, I'll check my calendar Right. One of the one of the normal responses we all have when we're already planning a no, a no thank you in our head. He said, douglas, just say yes. And that was one of the things I had heard in sobriety is when people you just start saying yes. And I was nervous about it and I remember sharing that in my 12-step meetings and somebody wrote down on a piece of paper. They said, hey, when you're going through stuff like this, we simply need to ask ourselves what's in the best interest of our sobriety. You're going through stuff like this, we simply need to ask ourselves what's in the best interest of our sobriety. So I said okay. I said, uh, this is one of those retreats where you don't take your phone or nothing. There's no technology. So I was like it probably wouldn't hurt to go off the grid, leave my phone off for 72 hours. Um, it is probably isn't the best interest to my sobriety, and if it helps me out and with my spirituality at all, it's a win, win, win. Because when I was going in there I didn't want your Bible, I didn't want your G, I didn't want your Bible thumping right. So they pick you up at five o'clock on a Thursday for this, and right before that I'm on the phone with my mom, I start a fight, I'm yelling at her, I'm crying. She did nothing wrong. I was scared. I was scared Right.
Speaker 5:So hop in the car with this guy. We're heading down, we're heading down to Indy, and I remember he drops his bomb on me. He was like oh yeah, when I, when we get there, I've got to go to the airport. I'm heading out of town for work and I'm like what? I'm like you mean, you're not going to be with me this whole weekend, you're just dropping me off with all these Jesus freaks. I'm like right, and he was like whoops, sorry. He was like just look, just look, for this guy named Sky Ho. Sky, if you hear this, thank you, love you, brother. And I was like who is this fruitcake in my head? I'm like who is this fruitcake named Sky Ho? You're leaving me with and uh, and we get down there and I'm I'm petrified right Cause I'm seeing all these people that all these Jesus freaks?
Speaker 5:Bible thumpers, right, I have no idea, right, but I'm just scared. So I remember one of the first things that we, uh, we did is we sat down and they gave us some note cards and look at the guy on your left, that's your new best friend. And I'm like, oh, this is. And, uh, one of the questions was tell us something interesting about yourself. And in my mind I'm like there's nothing interesting about my life right now. I'm not here because I'm on a winning streak. My life is hell right now. My life is in shambles right now. Right, and I was like write down that I'm going out of town for 30 days next week, which I really was. I was going out of town for work for 30 days and, uh, he kind of just gave me this look like what's interesting? I'm like he probably, he probably saw the walls now and at the last minute I said I scratched that out and I put on there that I'm sober for 50 something days. And you saw, just I realized what I had tasked him with, that he was going to get up on stage and introduce that, this guy that he doesn't even know, as the alcoholic Right. And God bless this guy, my new best friend, Peter. He did it with such grace because I remember standing up there and my heads I'm not looking at anybody, my head's on the floor and I remember when he said it. I remember lifting my eyes up and other guys going giving me thumbs up and welcoming me with acceptance and grace.
Speaker 5:And then, um I don't know if anybody knows his name is this guy's name is Dave Calabro. He was the, the lead sports guy on the NBC network in Indianapolis, a local celebrity. And I remember when I picked my head up off the ground, he's looking at me and he's giving me a thumbs up. So that gave me some. That gave me some strength and hope. Um, and they, they sat us at a table, at our own table. I was the table of Luke, and God blessed those guys that I spent that weekend with because I was, I was broken and I was, I was. I let a lot out that weekend and I'm still. I'm still connected with those guys. I text them this morning saying, hey, here's what I'm doing this morning, Thanks for being a part of this Cause they, they helped me. They helped me get sober and stay sober and they helped me find my, my, my faith, my connection.
Speaker 4:Isn't that amazing how, when you let down the walls and you have all that fear and anxiety of going and doing something, that you think that you're better than right. That's what you thought. You know I don't need this. And how many years later is this now? I mean over eight, over eight years later. It still impacts you that those, those three days had on you. What if you wouldn't have went?
Speaker 5:I mean other pieces that were so hugely transformational. That weekend is so that Sky Ho guy, that fruitcake, he was at my table and he's there nudging me the whole time and even on Saturday I still don't want to be there, kind of, I'm still fighting, I'm still fighting it, I'm still fighting, all of it, fighting, surrendering. And the church that it was at right across the street is the FBI building and we would get breaks every once in a while to get out and walk the parking lot. It was nice weather outside and all the guys were walking together, but I would walk by myself. I was still the loner, the isolator, right, because you're not my people, you guys are different, this or that. So there was a big rock between the church and the FBI building and I used to go sit on it and I had an escape plan in my head. I'm like, if I just can't take it no more, I'm just going to grab my stuff. I don't have a wallet, I don't have a phone, I'm just going to go over to the FBI building at their little security shack and say, hey, I'm a recovering alcoholic, I need one phone call, help me out, help me out, bro.
Speaker 5:But Saturday the wall really started to come down and I didn't want to go home. That addiction to my phone. I finally let that go and I was like man, I don't want to go home because I know as soon as I go home I'm going to grab that phone. And the whole time Sky was nudging me to get baptized and at first I wanted nothing to do with it. But some of his words were like use this as an opportunity to leave the old Doug behind. Um, so I was like you know what I think I want to. So I got back, I got baptized that weekend and, uh, just in a, a huge transformational weekend that helped me get and stay sober.
Speaker 4:Can you go back to that baptism? When you felt the water, what did you feel? What'd?
Speaker 5:you feel, um, I felt like it was an opportunity to leave the old Doug behind, to leave, to leave, to leave as much of it there as I could, and really not understanding what it meant then, and to have the support of the men, the guys that were there, the 30, 40, 50, how many of our guys were there that were doing nothing but volunteering and serving, sharing their testimonies Because that was another big piece of the weekend is men sharing their stories, whether it was related to drinking or drugging, or depression, or relationships, or being in the service, whatever it was, the vulnerability, the honesty and the vulnerability. So that was a transformational weekend. But I think what is worth sharing is when I got out of there, I got addicted to Jesus, which was great, but the other battle, the other internal battle that started I was like so which is more important? Because on some there's some is God number one or is my sobriety number one? And I struggled with that for a while.
Speaker 5:But where I landed is I use my, I use my faith, I use my spirituality for my heart and I use my, uh, the things that I do for my sobriety from my head, cause my prayer used to be hey, god, keep me sober today. Thanks for keeping me sober Now. It's help me do the things that I need to do, because just praying and meditating and going to church and reading the Bible that type of stuff, memorizing Bible verses it's all great. I don't think that those are the things that are going to keep me sober. I have to continue to spend time with alcoholics and addicts to remind me what it was like, because I'm a great forgetter.
Speaker 4:I'm a great forgetter. You and I've used this a lot on the podcast because it's almost relatable to every single person that we've had on here. But ed my let, someone who who was was really inspirational in my life here in the past couple years and master motivator, just amazing man with words, and his dad was an alcoholic and, um, you know he talks about and he shares his story a lot about how it hit him one night when he was laying in bed here in the past couple of years that someone helped his dad, who had the same issue. That he had.
Speaker 4:So he talks about. You know, in life we're most qualified to help the person we used to be. And when I hear your story and a lot of people that have been through addiction, recovery and those 12-step programs and AA and all those things, those are the people who have been down the road you've been down, who have faced the demons you've faced, who have overcome them but recognize that overcoming them might just be that day and then you're going to do it again the next day. You know, kevin asked you when you got here what you wanted your title to be on the screen. What'd you tell him?
Speaker 5:One at a time, Because that's what I learned in the 12-step rooms. The reason a lot of people ask how does it work? Why does it work as good as it does? It's simply one person sharing their experience. I mean, 12-step programs are around 80 years old, but there's not rules. Here's what you have to do.
Speaker 5:They say things like thoroughly follow the path of the person in front of you.
Speaker 5:So I mean, I got sponsored because of my sponsor, he had a sponsor, and it's simply us sitting down and sharing what our experience was like.
Speaker 5:And then here's the tools in front of you, and at first it's one day at a time and early on it's not even one day at a time and I actually have a sign in my office at work. And I also want to thank my employer. Thank God that I have an employer that allows me to be as open as I am, from my boss, which is the president, to my coworkers and my peers and the board of trustees that entrust me to do what I do for them and to be able to live this out loud as much as I can, because I believe I don't do it for me. There's a part of it in there for me because I know at the end of the day it's going to help. But hopefully there's one thing in my, in my message and my experience that helps others. But early on, it's not just even one day at one day at a time is too much. Sometimes it's one hour at a time, one thing at a time, one minute at a time.
Speaker 4:Um, that's powerful, it is and and. It doesn't matter if it's addiction, it doesn't matter if it's fitness, it doesn't matter if it's food. Um, you know, you have to truly break things down in small segments. You know, if you try to bite off the apple, you know put the whole apple in your mouth it's not going to work. But you eat it one bite at a time. Right, your sobriety is one hour at a time. I mean you're surrounded. I mean, in this world it's glorified to drink, to be cool. Right, we see it on TV, we see it in social media. You know, young kids talk about it all the time, about how many beers they had, how drunk they got the night before. You know it's a celebrated thing. So to be on the flip side of that and recognize, man, there's nothing good about it, like there's really truly nothing good about it. The only good that came from it is that you recognize how bad it was and now it's your goal in your life to help others, which, in return, helps you.
Speaker 5:Yeah, and for me is because I never like to paint a picture that I don't point the finger at the Anheuser-Busch's or the Crown Royals it's I'll never point the finger, that I'll never point the finger of blame. Yes, we do live, and I think it's a fair statement that the society and cultures that it's it can be a big part of it from a tradition standpoint. Uh, but for me, um, and that's where I'll back up a little bit, uh, cause, if I'm going to be here and honest, um, when I started peeling back that onion, that layer of that onion, um, I love to smoke weed. Looking back now, that was a tool I use for my anxiety. That's why I liked it so much. Um, I tried acid, had a bad trip one night. It started snowing in July in St Louis. It doesn't snow in St Louis in July. So that's when I was like, okay, acid, bad, and I put it in that box.
Speaker 5:In my 20s I got into cocaine. I loved cocaine, loved it. There was a stage where, um, because I was doing such a good job of managing my life, I had to move back in the basement with mommy and my 20, in my early twenties, and um Easter Sunday morning I'm in the basement by myself and I left my face up and I've got blow all over my face. Luckily, that little voice inside my head went something's probably not right with that, right? So I put Coke in that box of bad too. So here I am, trying to manage, right, yeah. And then in my early thirties I got into pills. I had a bad back and a bad neck. I had an. I had a resource to get Vicodin. I loved Vicodin and I loved taking it about one or two o'clock in the afternoon while I was at work, because it helped me. What I realized? It helped me concentrate, help slow my brain down that anxiety, right, because I was also very hyperproductive, because I'm Doug, right, I get things done. So, looking back, it was always something. It was always something else. And then I would just try to box it up, compartmentalize it, manage it, control it.
Speaker 5:And then when I got sober, I had the chance to smoke cigarettes, because when I was drinking I was smoking and I was scared to put. I hated smoking when I wasn't drinking, but I had to have it when I was drinking. So I had a chance to smoke a cigarette. I'm like no, I got scared to put those two hands close together.
Speaker 5:And then I had the opportunity to smoke weed because, yes, a lot of opinions and laws have changed on it, but I'm living this new lifestyle now. Right, I'm working this program where there's principles, I'm trying to do things the right way and not justify doing things just for my selfish benefit. So the conversation in my head was if I get popped on the job, I could lose my job and at the end of the day it's illegal. So end of conversation, Doug, so no weed. And then I actually, and then I was on a big golf trip, that 30 day trip. I was on and, um, we were golfing, and one of my buddies, johnny the Greek, he busted out the cigars at 10 o'clock in the morning.
Speaker 5:I love smoking cigars because I love to do everything right, and I got that little bit of, got that little bit of buzz or rush feeling from a cigar. And that's when I said you know what the definition of my sobriety? Because the only person that's going to define what my sobriety is is me and I'm not going to judge you. If your definition of sobriety is doing this or doing that, that's you. If your definition of sobriety is doing this or doing that, that's you. But the definition of my sobriety is I don't want to put anything in my body that's going to alter my mind in any way, shape or form, outside of, maybe, starbucks and things of that nature.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's amazing. And I think the other amazing thing is what you're doing now Talk about, talk about your job now, um, and how different it is from what you did before.
Speaker 5:How are we on on time? Do we need to do the short version of the long version? It's this year show man, cause I don't think it's fair. It doesn't make sense for me to share what I'm doing now If I don't include some of how I got here. Um, so I'm four years sober. Well, I'm backing up a little bit. So this would have been 2020, 21. Um, I'm four years sober. Um, I'm I'm bouncing around in some jobs because I was trying to find what's my purpose and this and that, trying to find something meaningful.
Speaker 5:So I'm bouncing around and on a Friday night I go to a church event from this same retreat that I went to because I'm still staying connected to that family. And I look at my bank account and I've got enough money until payday for food, shelter and gas. So on my way to the church, I stopped at another church because I saw this. You know those little houses they have sometimes on street corners and stuff with food in there. I got a box of the. I got a box of food out of there. So I go to the church event and everybody's asking how things were going and great.
Speaker 5:After that church event, I parked in a parking lot at a hospital in Carmel, indiana, because that's where my shelter was going to be that night, didn't have a place to live at the time because of circumstances and choices. Right, because the whole time I was making all that money I was blowing it as fast as I was getting it, because my solution was things are bad, bury my head in my work, make more money, solve all the problems. No, so about 12 or 1 o'clock in the morning I'm cold, trying to sleep in my car and I'm like I can't do this, no more. So I finally get on Google and I'm looking for men's shelters. So I finally get one of them to pick up the phone. They say we can't get you in tonight, but tomorrow we got a bed for you. So the next day I go check into this place and I'm very grateful that they gave me food and shelter.
Speaker 5:I was there for a while, but I wasn't telling anybody I was there. I was telling some people, but I wasn't being honest. So while I was there during COVID, a lot of everything got shut down. Right Recovery rooms got shut down. We had Zoom rooms. So a guy that I knew in Carmel asked me if I would get on Zoom that night and do my testimony. It was a 12-step meeting online for a guy that he knew in New York, based in Miami now. So I'm like, why me Right? And? But I said yes, I shut up. I said yes, and for some reason that night I got on there with a bunch of people I didn't know, four years sober and I finally started sharing Some more things that happened in my life that I think uh, contributed why I like to put so much alcohol and drugs in my body to try to fill holes. Um, and I'd love to share more specifics on some of that stuff, but I know if I do share some of those specifics it could possibly harm others or hurt people.
Speaker 4:Um, but you essentially shared that the struggles from a shelter right.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I shared it from a yeah, from a shelter, um, and why that's important to the story is also why I'm in the shelter one night. I'm back in the food pantry which I. That's one of the things I also why I'm in the shelter One night. I'm back in the food pantry, which that's one of the things I loved. I can't believe I'm sitting here saying I love being in a shelter Because I'd have full access to a food pantry 24-7. I'm back there grabbing potato chips and cookies. There's a chip clip from Natco Credit Union back there.
Speaker 5:For those that are local, natco Credit Union is based and rooted in Richmond, indiana, and they're in Wayne and Fayette County. That's it, natco Credit Union. I had known people there for over 20 years. We met at a conference 20 plus years ago. We stayed in touch. Then in my other walks of life, they were a client of mine in two chapters. I still stay in touch with them because they were helping me. They hadn't repossessed my car yet I'm in a shelter, right, they didn't repossess my shelter. So I see this Natco credit union ship back here. So I see this Natco credit union ship back here. So I sent it to, I think, the CEO and God bless you, cindy at Natco and everybody there. So that was about November-ish, december-ish. I moved down.
Speaker 5:When I got out of the shelter I went to Greenfield because that's where my mom was, and I remember being on the phone I think it was with Cindy, the CEO at Natco on December the 15th and we always joked around about working together. She was like I can't afford you, but when I'm in Greenfield I'm. I was like you know what? I think I'm closer to Richmond now than I am Indy, and I think that's when the wheel started spinning March the 4th. She reached out to me. She's like hey, I think I got something for you. My community development manager's retiring. I think I can bring you in. I said, yes, I had a pretty good job, but this was an opportunity.
Speaker 5:So getting ready to start working in Richmond, indiana, and people are like back in there, like they're like why Richmond's got it struggles, right? So I'm living in Carmel's and Fisher's and Westfield, but I can't afford it, right? People are like why are you going out to Richmond Really? So then the next, and I didn't have to move out here. But at the same time I'm like if I want to be the community development manager. I probably need to live in that community and know what's going on.
Speaker 5:Right, it's an hour, both ways, beautiful drive, but sometimes it's dark. And one morning I'm on my way to work and it's really dark, it's really foggy and I almost hit something right in front of me School bus Because it was so dark coming up 40, so dark and foggy, I could hardly sit and I'm like okay for safety, I got to start making a move. Uh, so that day there, um, I'm leaving the office to go to lunch. Half a mile from the office I see a sign of a new apartment for rent. So I go to lunch and I'm like Mike, mom set, are you on staying in Greenfield? She's like I'm not, my rent's going up. So I go back by this apartment clean enough, nice enough, price is right enough. They say give us a call tomorrow, we'll let you know. And I'm like I don't have to fill out an application, I don't have to do an application fee, because I'm used to that living in St Louis and in Indiana and stuff. The next day they call me back an hour early. They're like if you wanted a, cheers. And I'm like Whoa, whoa, whoa, this is going. I'm going really fast again, cause that's what Doug does, and I sat on it for about 45 minutes. I'm like, what are you doing If you don't jump on this apartment? Somebody else is. So the next thing you know I'm moving to Richmond. So here I am again making big decisions fast. So everybody's like, whoa, you're working in Richmond, now you're moving out there and, um, I call him one of the one of the God shots I got.
Speaker 5:That next day on the in the Indianapolis news the headline story was the cookie problem in Fishers, indiana, and if you guys heard of crumble cookies, so the headline news that morning was the cookie problem is the long line that people had to wait in to get their high dollar cookies. So that was my affirmation moment right there. It's like, doug, you are going where you're supposed to be going, or maybe you're going to be doing a job now. Maybe you are going to be serving some real problems, not that you're going to solve all the problems, but maybe you're going to be involved in some work and have the opportunity where there's real problems and not cookie problems. Um, so came out here to work for Natco and I think reasons that are really important, important to share that story is um that first year that I'm here um, september is recovery month. So how amazing is it that it's August the 27th and we're getting ready to kick off recovery month and the very last day of the month there's um a lot of regional events.
Speaker 5:That's International Overdose Awareness Day, and one of the churches was having an event and Dana Sinclair, my coworker at NatCo. She asked me if I would do, I think, a 10 minute testimony and I'm like, yeah, I do my testimony, I do my leads all the time, right. So I walk into the church that night and, oh my God, the fear. Because I saw this person that I serve on a chamber of commerce committee with. I see this person, I'm seeing all these people because I'm the new guy in town. Right, I'm the community development guy. Now, right, I'm getting ready to get up on stage and out myself as the new guy.
Speaker 5:That's also the alcoholic recovering alcoholic addict. And I sat in the back like I did. Shoulders are getting all tight, hands are sweaty and I'm like, oh my God, what am I going to do? And for some reason, a voice inside my head said stop running from it, stop running from it. So I got up on stage and I said some of those things like when I got here, I got scared and afraid and embarrassed and shameful because I saw you that I serve on a chamber committee with and that's when I started saying things like my name is Doug Macias, I am an alcoholic and I am the community development manager at NACO Credit because I had my NACO shirt on. So that was a huge moment for me where I drew a line in the sand and really owned who I was past and present and reasons.
Speaker 5:I share things like that is because in our first year of suggestions, that's one of the things that I share with other people now when they're curious about getting sober, because me, when I first got sober, I wanted to let everybody know that I was sober and I was doing this 12-step thing right.
Speaker 5:But what I've learned is maybe you should sit on that, maybe you should put that on that list of big decisions in your first year, because once you let it out, once you break your anonymity, there's nothing that I can say or do to control what other people say or do or feel about the information that I've shared about me.
Speaker 5:So I say it out loud, but I don't say that you have to say your story out loud. That's a personal choice and decision, but for me that's what really helped. So NACO Credit Union Richmond, wayne County, has been so supportive and embracing on me, living it out loud as out loud as I have, because all I want to do is help other people, because I know it does help other people, because I can sit here and tell you all the great stories. But I remember my sponsor saying things like if you want to stay sober, you're going to have to step over a lot of dead bodies. So for a while I was able to say that the guys that I was sponsoring, they're doing good. But I do have the individual that did die from drinking, that did die the way that you hear people, that that people do die when it comes to alcoholism and addiction, when it comes to, when it comes to suicide and things like that.
Speaker 4:Suicide and things like that. I'm going to stop you for a second Because I think you hit on. The key to this life Is when you finally realize man, woman, husband, wife, son, daughter, and when you realize it's not about you, it's about helping others. When you make that realization, I think that's when your life truly changes. And I don't know how many people will be watching this and watch you, but as you were telling that story and you were talking about being in the back, getting sweaty hands, sweaty, nervous, your shoulders dropped. Like I saw it, like I saw the change, like we've been doing this now for an hour and 26 minutes and when you started you had those walls up and I just watched you change. Your shoulders dropped and they dropped right when you said I don't know that you exactly said it, but it came out that when you realized that it wasn't about you, it was about helping others, that's when you made that change.
Speaker 4:And I think that's the most important piece in our life is when we stop thinking about ourselves and we start thinking about others, and then sometimes that's relating our story and we start thinking about others, and then sometimes that's relating our story, sharing our story to help others, Because people can relate to that vulnerability. Whatever that story might be, but I just saw it. I just saw it. It's an awesome thing to see, man. Thank you for sharing that. Thank you, yeah, what you got, ben.
Speaker 1:So, if you can just talk a little bit about you kept mentioning like the what, like the approach, the words that your therapist would say and like the way that they would say it, like they're not like commanding you to do something right, like you should, you need to do this, we're doing this. When you got invited to the retreat, can you talk about like that approach, a little bit Like the way that you said, like the way that they worded it was, like it was like inviting you to do something? Can you kind of go back on that Cause you mentioned it like several times when you were talking and it seems like if somebody would have approached you in another way, like you would have probably been like no, like, absolutely not.
Speaker 5:Yeah, and I think it goes back to just how we are as humans. I don't think anybody anybody likes to be told what to do, so the language that I gravitated to and the language and the communication style that I try to use now is simply here's my experience, here's my suggestions, if you want them. Sometimes I ask permission. Do you want me just to listen or do you want me to respond? Here's what worked for me.
Speaker 5:I consider myself a collector of tools. Now I've got this bag sitting here and I've got all the tools that I've got from 12-step programs, from Celebrate Recovery, from Recovery Church, from the church or churches. I think there's many paths to recovery. There's many paths to help to better. I want to have a bag with every tool that Lowe's has.
Speaker 5:Right, because when we're working on our car or something at the house, if we don't have the tool in our toolbox, we go to the garage.
Speaker 5:If it's not in the garage, we go out to Menards or Lowe's and sometimes we think we bought the tool that's going to work, but then we have to go back, and I also use the season analogy, like right now we've got lawnmowers and weed eaters and about a month or two, and I don't like wintertime, but when the leaves start coming down we're going to have to get out of our rakes and then the snow is going to come right.
Speaker 5:If I take my lawnmower out to try to plow the snow, it's probably not going to work that good. So I look at our recovery and life in general. We're going to go through different seasons and sometimes I'm going to use a tool that's going to help me today, but I might be going through the same thing two weeks from now. That tool ain't going to work. So I want to try to collect as many tools as I can for myself, but then to also to provide to others. Hey, this tool worked for me, but it might not work for you, and I know your question started off with the language, but I think it's just the way that we communicate.
Speaker 1:It's just another tool.
Speaker 5:And it's. It's not telling people what they have to do. It's not my business to ever say that anybody is an alcoholic or an addict. That's up to them. I'm not going to ever tell anybody what they have to do. I can give you suggestions on what worked for me and what has worked for others in the 80 years of 12 step programs and things like that. But it's um, it's just it. It's it's open and it's. It's based on experience and suggestions. At that makes sense and it's I try not to use words like I or you a whole lot and make it more we.
Speaker 5:And that was one of the big things that I learned in 12 steps. You probably heard I'm a huge believer in 12 steps. There's 12 steps, but there's about 200 words in those 12 steps and I remember people telling me earlier that sometimes the about 200 words in those 12 steps, and I remember people telling me earlier that sometimes the most powerful words in the steps are the smallest words. And the most powerful word in the 12 steps is the first word, which is we. If I've learned anything, it's I can't do it alone. I don't want to do it alone anymore. I see where that got me. I see where that got me. I see where it got me.
Speaker 5:I mean, the first step is when it talks about managing your life. My life had become unmanageable. My mindset on that is is I've given up full custody of my life. I never want to have it again. I've given custody of my life to the 12 steps, to the rooms, to my sponsors, to God, to other people that have shared experience, to other people that have shared experience, because I prove over and over again, when Doug tries to manage his life on his own, things get messed up real quick. So I hope that answered your question. I don't know it does.
Speaker 1:And I also like the we thing, because you said you know that you can't handle it Like like the we as in. Like I've handled, I've tried to handle it, I can't handle it. I can't handle it Like like the we as in. Like I've handled, I've tried to handle it, I can't handle it, I can't handle it. But I'd also imagine that's a pretty lonely place too. So when you hear somebody else say we, it gives you that power to like you're not doing this alone, like I'm here with you, like you're not alone, no more. Like we're going to battle it together.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I mean we is the most powerful word, because the experience that I connected to is I think I was about a year or two in and for some reason it was a Sunday afternoon I was driving somewhere, it was nice, and I stopped to get gas, so I had to go inside and go to the bathroom and it was a Sunday and I walked past the beer coolers. I wasn't tempted, but the thought came in my head. I was like I wasn't tempted, but the thought came in my head. I was like I wonder what the it thing will be that will ever really really test my sobriety, Because that's something we what's going to be that it thing, right, and it was my dad. I was like, if and when anything happened, because my dad was, my dad was dying from cancer.
Speaker 5:I got sober in 16. He died and he died in 18. And, um, so it was my dad. That was the thing in my head.
Speaker 5:Um, and I was still in a frame of mind that if I go back out, I'm not coming back. If you catch my drift, if I go back out and drink or drug again, I'm not coming back, I'm not going, I'm not going back to that hell again out and drink or drug again. I'm not coming back, I'm not going. I'm not going back to that hell again. I'll take myself out of the game some way, shape or form. That's a terrible place to be in. That's a terrible place to be in. That's a terrible mindset to be in when you're sober and supposedly work in a program.
Speaker 5:But that's where I realized how selfish I still was, because, thank goodness, there was enough new thought patterns in my mind that said how selfish would that be, Doug, that you'd put your parents in a position to have to bury you. How selfish would that be? That? That's the example, that's the memory that you would leave for your niece and nephew that their uncle took himself out the game, and also the reminders of the 12th step is. It talks about carrying a message and helping others. Everything that I do, I'm carrying a message that represents 12 steps recovery, sobriety faith. So everything I do, I'm an ambassador of that. Sobriety faith so everything I do, I'm an ambassador of that.
Speaker 1:But my selfish just can get wrapped around. That real quick, real quick man, that's powerful. If I can ask one more thing, yeah, and this is this is one that I wish. We just had a podcast a couple days ago and it was kind of on the same thing.
Speaker 1:But when you're at that spot and you know, I'm trying to think from a family aspect right the part where you're going back to the holidays again and you're struggling again and you didn't want it to be that holiday, you know the same thing that happened the last holiday again.
Speaker 1:At that point, is there anything that your family or coworkers um and this isn't like your family or coworkers but when somebody's at that spot and you're a family member or your coworker and you see somebody from the outside in that spot, what would be your advice to them, how they could help, how they could? Is there a spot, like do you have to hit rock bottom before you get pulled out of there? Or you know what I mean Like it's not a your situation type thing, but putting yourself back in that situation. Somebody that's listening to the podcast I might be seeing somebody heading down that same exact path what would be the I wouldn't say answer, but what would be the approach. They could go to meet them there at that spot and pull them out before they get to rock bottom, if there is.
Speaker 5:So I mean my suggestion based on experience. So I'm an AA guy. Aa is for me. Then in 12-step programs there's other programs like Al-Anon. That is for people on the receiving end of us, if that makes any sense. So that's one of my. I would say that's one of my biggest, most popular suggestions for people that are on the receiving end.
Speaker 1:So wives, moms, parents, coworkers, yeah.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I mean, that's my, that's the best tool that I suggest, Um, but I don't want to say what's funny, but what I? What I also see in my experience is so let's say here's this Al-Anon book. Mom knows it's there but won't pick it up. Wife knows it's there but won't pick it up. Friend knows that that book is there but won't pick it up. So, as much as we want you to quit your drinking, we want you to quit your drugging. Here's all the ways that we can help you out Go to treatment, Go to rehab, Go to all the things that we hear. But on the other side of the coin, the person that loves and cares about that person so much they're just as stubborn, and that person should do it because he loves that person. That person should do it because they've got a great job. That person should stop the drinking or drugging because of the kids.
Speaker 1:So I don't know if that makes any sense. Oh no, it makes sense. And that's where I feel like we get to. So many times, especially now that people are starting to tell their stories and we get these testimonies on here, there's nobody in here. That's like, well, you know, my husband was an alcoholic, or at least that we had. Yet my husband was an alcoholic. But you know, I looked at the things and nobody's telling that. Testimony right, so, testimony right. So it's like, how do we get the people that don't want to deal with the confrontation, don't want to deal with the, the fights or the dirty work that might have to happen, to just pick up the book and try? You know what I mean. It's not just a one-person battle like that's what you kept, the we, that's what's powerful. And I feel like if the family members, if the co-workers, whoever's seeing it, go down that hole, if they they came and approaches the we tried to pick up the book, I mean the resources.
Speaker 5:Yeah, and I think, um I mean we, as there's a lot of us, I mean in the community and beyond that we we have those conversations quite often um is, how do we do, how do we do more of it, how do we do a better job of it?
Speaker 5:I think that we're seeing a world of change in the world that we live in when it comes to stuff that life throws at us. I mean, that's one of the things that I look at. I think COVID helped out with, as I think COVID really exposed I use the analogy that if I open up my front door and look down the street, when you knock on the door, at every house somebody's dealing with something, either it's alcoholism or addiction, whether it's legal or legal depression, anxiety, issues with my job, issues with my spouse, and I think COVID made it a little bit easier and acceptable for people to say man, I'm struggling, man, I need help. So I think that we're seeing a lot of change and mindset shifts and habits and behaviors in all ages and all generations. But I still think that we have a long way to go, but I think it's conversations like this and platforms like this that are making it a little bit easier and acceptable to do things.
Speaker 4:Yeah, for sure, all right. Last question If you could sit on a park bench and have a conversation with someone, living or deceased, who would it be and why?
Speaker 5:this is the question I've been dreading, because, um, because I'm not gonna to cry my dad my dad.
Speaker 5:He passed away on December, the 15th of 2018, from cancer and way too early in my mind and a lot of our minds in my mind and a lot of our minds, um, because of um, when mom and dad got divorced, um, and I started to rebel, um, I was mad at my dad and I fought my dad. I was all I met anger and hurt and pain. Um, and I fought my dad. I was all I meant anger and hurt and pain, and I'm not dad. I'm not pointing the finger at you, I'm not blaming you for anything, but I think that's just what we as humans do. We'll take our pain and anger and hurt and and point it at somebody and we'll drink at it and we'll drug at it and we'll run from it and we'll fight it and all that stuff, but for years, just fought my dad and didn't have a good relationship and it sucks to say it out loud. I don't like saying it out loud, but I remember it was in my early 30s my dad was coming down to my office or something and I said you know what? You can either accept your dad for the way things are, or you can continue to have the broken, messy relationship you've had with him, to have the broken, messy relationship you've had with them, and I chose to accept forgive whatever you want to call it. And we had a much better relationship during my 30s. And I remember when I moved out here. I remember my stepmom saying that my dad was struggling with me moving out here and I remember one time, me and my dad we didn't talk about things either, because I think that was even more common back then, but still common is men don't share their feelings and talk about their emotions and stuff, right. And I remember one day I was walking in. I was walking in for lunch down at Elro cause. I was meeting Cindy from Natco and right as I'm walking in the door, my phone's ringing. It was my dad calling. My dad didn't call that much and he was like hey, dougie. He was like I just wanted to call you. I got Mexican music on and I'm vacuuming and I miss you, son.
Speaker 5:And then when he got cancer, I didn't go home enough. I always say it's interesting to say what comes out when I do these. I didn't go home enough. I think life makes it hard for us, right, if we're in debt. You got to go to work, but I'm glad I got sober when I did. I'm glad that my dad got to see me sober. We didn't talk a lot, but I think we talked a lot and that was one of the reasons I posted on Facebook all the time. Him and my mom would be like post when you get wherever you're traveling to. So I'm like I can kill two birds with one stone. I can check in at the hotel wherever I'm at, and now mom and dad know I can check in at the hotel wherever I'm at, and now mom and dad know. But I think that was a way that we got to travel together when he wasn't able to travel at the end.
Speaker 4:What would you say to him right now?
Speaker 5:That I'm still sorry. I don't know if it's a Hispanic or a Mexican thing, but with our family being big, we're still proud of our last name, the Macias, which we are. But I feel like I disappointed and embarrassed the family, and I always use the baseball analogy because I can sit here today and my life is great. Right, my life is so good. There's still so many things in my life that aren't. There's still a lot of messes, but what I share with other people is the score of the ball game.
Speaker 5:I lived the way that I lived for over 20 years. I've only been sober for eight years, which is a long time, but the score of the games only eight to 20. I got a lot of innings that I still got to play. So I just hope that when I get about 20 years of sobriety that I've been able to clean up some of the messes with some of the broken relationships with friends and family that I still have. But I tell him that I'm sorry. I tell him that I miss him and that I'm trying. I feel like I'm trying so fricking hard.
Speaker 4:It's amazing. It's amazing man, and this is a good spot to end it. I mean, you've shared so much, so much that people can gain from you. Know the trials that you went through in your life and the redemption is where you're at right now and recognizing that, um, you know those walls will keep trying to be built right and you got to take that step every day to keep knocking them back down, to be open, to be vulnerable, to share your testimony, to share your story.
Speaker 4:It is the reason that we do this is because of what you said of you know men don't do this. You know men don't sit around a table and talk about their failures and their faults and show emotion. That's not something that we're taught to do, but it is so important because we all carry that baggage, whatever it is big or small to some, not to others, but it's our, our own unique story and, um, I knew this one would be powerful and, uh, you, I knew this one would be powerful and you far exceeded my expectations. So I appreciate you sharing and being so vulnerable with your story.
Speaker 5:Thank you, can I leave? Can I leave two last statements on the table? So number one is if there's anybody out there that wants to talk more, that wants to hear more, because I always say is this is a 49 year old, this is a 49 year old, your story that you're hearing. Yeah, we probably talked for almost two hours, thank you, but I could. There's still. There's still a lot. There's a lot more that I didn't talk about and I'm willing to share any and all of it. I don't care who knows what.
Speaker 5:To a certain extent, if there's something in there that can help somebody, because I know that it does, and not because I'm Doug Macias, because that's what we do when we share our experience, we know there's going to be something there that can help somebody. So, if anybody, local or beyond, because there's a lot fast forward the tape. I've been here for four years now. There's a lot of really good things happening in Richmond, wayne County. We can do a lot more and we can do a lot bigger things. So, near and far, if there's something that I can help with in some way, shape or form, and if I don't have the answers, maybe I can point you in the right direction, cause I look at it as two ways. I've got my personal resume and I've got my professional resume, and if there's anything that I can bring to the table together and help you out, that's what it's all about.
Speaker 5:And then the second thing that I want to close with is when I always share my story. I start with February the 4th is when I always share my story. I start with February the 4th of 2016. That was the moment where I really wanted to get sober, the moment I wanted to get sober for and it's helped me get sober, it helped me stay sober, and there's a person behind that story, and I hope that they listen to this and I think that they'll know who I'm talking about. But what makes it all worth it is that when I was walking in today, I got a text from them that said good luck. And that simple text right there, for everything that's behind the story, is a tool that I'm going to put in my bag that will help me stay sober and help others. So, thank you, you know who you are.
Speaker 4:Thank you, Doug.
Speaker 5:Thank you guys, Thank you.
Speaker 4:We appreciate the vulnerability and you know again, we ask all of our listeners out there you know somebody, family know again we ask all of our listeners out there you know somebody, family member, friend, that has battled some, or maybe battling some, of the same demons that Doug has just shared and be sure to share, be sure to support and do all those things that we need to keep to keep the momentum going for the Be Tempered podcast. We appreciate it. We love you guys, appreciate Doug and his story and all those stories that have been shared to this point and those who are to come, and we pray that this helps somebody today Go out and be tempered. Hi, my name is Allie Schmidt.
Speaker 3:This is my dad, dan. He owns Cajun's Glass. Thanks, allie. Go out and be tempered. Also, ask for custom shower doors and many other products and services. Call 962-1636. Locally owned, with local employees for nearly 30 years. Kitchen's class, the clear choice.
Speaker 4:Hey, do you want to catch every episode live as it's being recorded? Log on to patreoncom slash betempered for exclusive footage, behind the scenes, photos and a live recording as it takes place. Go to patreoncom slash betempered.