Episode 133: Welcome to The Whole Wealth Journey; Getting More From Your Money Than Just More Money.

How would your life change if your financial decisions truly aligned with your core values? Get ready as we, Matthew Grishman and Jim Gebhardt, transform your money mindset with the evolution of Financial Sobriety to The Whole Wealth Journey. We share our holistic approach to wealth, focusing on the significance of integrating financial strategies with personal fulfillment and core values. Listen as we reflect on our experiences, highlighting the power of gratitude, meaningful relationships, and the importance of connecting with new people. By finding your 'why,' this episode sets the stage for a life resonant with your true self.Join us as we reflect on our five and a half-year journey with Financial Sobriety and the evolution of our wealth management practice. We discuss aligning our podcast’s mission with our work, emphasizing the need to concentrate on clients we best serve and enjoy working with. Personal stories of overcoming health challenges and striving for healthier relationships with money, ourselves, and others will inspire you to approach financial decisions with intentionality and clarity. This chapter of our journey aims to guide you towards achieving financial sobriety, enriching both your financial and personal lives.Finally, we dive into the deeper meaning of financial planning beyond mere monetary gains. Reflecting on our experiences with clients, we emphasize aligning financial choices with personal values and passions. Whether it's investing in your children's future or supporting charitable causes, financial decisions should support your life goals. We also discuss the entrepreneurial mindset and the importance of having a purpose beyond financial success. We'll close with essential insights into planning for both wealth and well-being, encouraging you to join us on the Whole Wealth journey. To learn more about The Whole Wealth Journey and how it can apply to you, visit: https://gebhardtgroupinc.com/

Episode Highlight Timestamps
(07:09 - 08:47) Evolution of Financial Sobriety
(12:38 - 13:29) Unique Money Relationship Education
(15:31 - 17:31) Redefining Wealth and Financial Education
(19:58 - 21:23) Wealth as a Journey of Self-Discovery
(22:43 - 23:58) Wealth and Values
(34:35 - 35:37) Elevating the Wealth Conversation
(39:39 - 40:55) Entrepreneurial Mindset Beyond Business
(44:15 - 45:14) Transitioning From Corporate to Independent
(46:19 - 48:55) Entrepreneurial Journey and Self-Discovery
(51:08 - 52:15) Evolving Wealth Journey and Impact

Chapter Summaries
(00:00) Whole Wealth JourneyRebranding to The Whole Wealth Journey, aligning finances with values, gratitude for health and relationships, finding personal fulfillment.
(07:58) The Path to Financial AlignmentOur journey with Financial Sobriety and wealth management, overcoming health challenges, and achieving intentionality in decisions and relationships.
(14:22) Financial Awakening and Next StepsTransformative journey of aligning financial life with purpose and values, breaking free from generational habits, nurturing healthy relationships.
(19:58) The Purpose of Wealth JourneyFinancial Sobriety leads to self-discovery and purpose, aligning values with plans and leveraging expertise for a richer life.(26:53) Elevating the Money ConversationFinancial planning should align with personal values and passions, prioritize life goals, and distinguish good debt from bad debt.
(35:37) Entrepreneur Mindset Beyond MoneySuccessful entrepreneurs may feel empty despite financial success; aligning resources with passi

You can learn more about The Whole Wealth Journey by visiting The Gebhardt Group. You can follow us on Instagram @thewholewealthjourney

Transcript

Matthew Grishman: [00:00:00] I look at my life and I've got all this abundance of wealth. 

Jim Gebhardt: Now what? Yeah. How am I going to do this? How am I going to, when it's not necessarily a how conversation, it's a who conversation. Who can help me with this? Sure. Who has this expertise? That I want relative to these core values that I'm espousing and wanting to live my life by.

Matthew Grishman: That is what our whole wealth journey is designed to do.

Ho! Wait, wait. What? What's going on here? It, something's changed. Is that, was that new music? That was new music and I believe there's even a new New graphics? New graphics and a new tile of the show. Whoa, what's going on here? Obviously I'm having a little fun. You're probably noticing, [00:01:00] Tribe, that there have been some changes to the show.

Financial sobriety has become the whole wealth journey. 

Jim Gebhardt: Welcome to the whole wealth journey. Wealth with a Y. What does that mean? What does that mean? Are we spelling it funny? 

Matthew Grishman: Uh, no, I think it's We're using the 

Jim Gebhardt: word Y. 

Matthew Grishman: The word Y, right. Not the letter Y, the actual word Y. 

Jim Gebhardt: Well, I know Y. Why? Because we want to help people get on their path.

And the path is all about their Y. 

Matthew Grishman: And it's about aligning your finances with the people, the experience, and the passions that give their lives 

Jim Gebhardt: true meaning. It's getting way beyond the bank statements, the brokerage statements, the trust documents, the life insurance, and taking a deeper dive into your why.

Matthew Grishman: Well, admittedly, we're not for everyone. This is different. We're for the bold ones who really want to dive deeper and seek a life that resonates with who they really are at their core. Who finds value in vulnerability. 

Jim Gebhardt: Well, 

Matthew Grishman: you and I [00:02:00] do, 

Jim Gebhardt: you and I do, and that's where we want to play, but not everybody is comfortable with that vulnerability.

Matthew Grishman: Maybe we should introduce ourselves. What do you think? Oh, that's a good idea. Jim Gebhardt and I'm Matthew Grishman. We are the co creators of the podcast, The Whole Wealth Journey. Ready to find your why? Then let's get started and get you one step closer to unlocking your inner wealth and well being.

Jim Gebhardt: What's on the gratitude list today?

Matthew Grishman: That's part of it right there. Just a breath. I can do that and it doesn't hurt anymore. That's 

Jim Gebhardt: great. 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah, that hasn't hurt in a little while. I got a lot of gratitude for that. This new medication I'm on for the uh, old pericarditis. Finally seems to be doing the trick. It's been a very, very gradual process of not feeling An enormous amount of discomfort right here where the old breastbone has been, uh, stitched and wired back together.

And then, you know, the pericardium underneath that, the, the sac [00:03:00] that surrounds the heart, that experiencing a little trauma as it did for me has been inflamed for quite some time now. And it, you know, it's like this feeling of sandpaper in my chest. It's just been awful. And this medication that I'm on has just been slowly

Jim Gebhardt: So you've gone from like 220 grit to like 180 grit to 150 grit to 120 grit. Yeah. Now it's like, 

Matthew Grishman: now it's like a piece of loose leaf paper. 

Jim Gebhardt: Okay. Yeah. That's 

Matthew Grishman: that's progress. It's the, the sneeze and the deep breath and the cough. Those three, those are like the last three soldiers that have finally fallen off that there's no discomfort when that happens.

So lots of gratitude for being able to just take a deep breath and not feel discomfort. It's kind of simple today. 

Jim Gebhardt: That is pretty simple but powerful. 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah, that and for some reason I got like drool coming out of the sides of my mouth today. Maybe it's that deep breathing. Maybe there's too 

Jim Gebhardt: much medication.

Matthew Grishman: Exactly. How about you? What are you grateful for today? 

Jim Gebhardt: I was in [00:04:00] a kind of a business networking breakfast this morning. I realized how much I enjoy connecting with other people. I particularly enjoy connecting with people that I know and I have relationship with, but I felt as though I'd been missing some connection with new people and expanding our network.

And it was really fun to be in a room with 25 total strangers. And as much as I don't enjoy small talk, Chit chat and small talk is not, it's not on my say no more list, but it doesn't bring me energy. The energy comes from learning about other people, what, and ideally their story, and part of the the nature of this group is that over the course of the month you break off into a group of three and you go and you have a meal, you break bread together, and you get to know their story.

Sure. That intrigues the bejesus out of me. 

Matthew Grishman: Well, it's like the [00:05:00] chitchat, the Swiss custom, we've always, we've, we've, that's evolved for you and for me. It's the warmup. I get what you're saying as far as like, uh, I don't get energy from the chitchat, the small talk, but when you're with new people, it's the warmup.

We know where we're going with this. You know, we're, we're starting here at the surface and we're going to see if we can work our way down a little bit into who the real person is. 

Jim Gebhardt: I hope so. I hope so. Because as we also have said on the show many times, Nothing bores me more than news, weather, and sports.

Sure. Keeping it at surface level for an ex, you know, an extended period in the relationship. Oh, 

Matthew Grishman: you're gonna Brother, you're gonna break through that the first time. You, you, you're gonna, you're gonna start with that chit chat. Well, I mean The very first time. It's, it's ten minutes. It's Swiss custom. It is.

Right? It's ten minutes. It is, 

Jim Gebhardt: but not everybody's comfortable. 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah, but you're moving on if they're not. 

Jim Gebhardt: I am. If they don't want to 

Matthew Grishman: play, you're moving on. 

Jim Gebhardt: I, I absolutely am. Yeah. [00:06:00] So it was really, it was really fun to, uh, get out of my comfort zone, do something a little bit different, I can feel the energy being in, you know, a group of, of new people, and that feels really good.

I've, I've been missing that. 

Matthew Grishman: Nice. 

Jim Gebhardt: Nice. 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah, 

Jim Gebhardt: I've been a little too, little too isolated on the, uh, desert island talking to Wilson the volleyball. Ha, ha, ha, ha. 

Matthew Grishman: I appreciate that. I'm finding myself wanting more of that. I'm, I'm enjoying more isolation, more time by myself, more time to reflect and think and, and becoming much more intentional with who, what, when, where, how, because the why is starting to change.

Right? So, who I spend time with, where I spend time, what I spend time doing, how I'm spending my time. I'm just, that, that's, I feel like it's going through a little bit of a shift for me. There, there's some gratitude there for that too. It just, I guess the gratitude with that is, is just the acceptance that that's happening.

Just the, the being real. And realizing that [00:07:00] it's happening, that I'm not as eager to go meet a whole bunch of new people. I want to meet, I still love meeting new people. You and I are very attracted to new, right? New's fun. We're both builders. We're not as much maintainers. We're builders. Yes. And I think that is something we have become aware of and accepting of and inviting other people onto our team who are better at the maintaining part, which is, you know, made necessary.

Yeah, it's very necessary. And I'm grateful that you and I have been honest with ourselves that. That's an important piece that we've been missing and bringing other people onto the team to do that for us has been great. Even as a builder, I'm starting to, I don't know, shift. Feel different about that. How about it?

Yeah, which I think is part of what we're here in studio. Well, we've definitely had a shift. Doing today. I believe we 

Jim Gebhardt: referred to it as a graduation. Oh, tell me more. Well, we've been on a journey with Financial [00:08:00] Sobriety for the better part of five years. Five and a half years. Mm hmm. 122, 000 episodes, I think it is.

At least. Right? At least. And in our own evolution, we've looked at the body of work that we've built with Financial Sobriety. 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah. 

Jim Gebhardt: Relative to the nature of the work that we do in the Wealth Management Group. We've spent a lot of time, a lot of energy, a lot of money looking at the Wealth Management Group and saying, who is the client?

At the end of the day that we serve best both in the context of who do we serve best and what what relationships do we enjoy the most because as you and I have both gone through some health challenges in the last couple of years we have a finite amount of energy sure we can't really be all things to all people and I think we've talked on the show about our kind of our Oscar Schindler complex of wanting to help right people a lot of people get into this business I know I know you've seen you the [00:09:00] dirtier side with people that get into this business purely from the greed and wanting to make lots of money.

Matthew Grishman: Yeah. 

Jim Gebhardt: But there's a lot of people that get into this business because they want to help people. I know that's why I did it. I wanted to do a level of financial planning when I left Smith Barney that I couldn't do at Smith Barney. And I'm thrilled with the evolution of what we've done with our planning process because now it's something that is very in depth and it's very unique.

So for us, this evolution has become let's align. the nature of the podcast, right? With, with our business, with the nature of the wealth management group. And here we are. 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah, we weren't doing that as much for the first five and a half years. There was a very big disconnect between what we do here in studio and what we do in our private wealth management practice.

And I, and I felt like financial sobriety and the podcast and what we were doing here was really, and, and we got some of this feedback from clients of ours, which is wonderful [00:10:00] that. You know, although this was a very cathartic exercise, it really didn't connect too much to the wealth management practice.

I like the fact that what this really was was a process for me to heal. I mean, selfishly, that's, that's what financial sobriety has been all about is it kind of started back in 2005 when you and I first met. And I was trying to get some stuff right that I couldn't get right and going through many, many years of trying to get these three very complicated relationships in my life to have a little bit more peace and harmony within them and kind of flow together and behave a little nicer.

And just me having a healthier relationship with money and the trickle down effect that that had with my relationships and how I felt about myself to be able to write a book about that, to be able to come into studio and talk about it. And what I'm grateful for is how sharing my own journey and my own story with you, with Ace on these mics, it started to help other people.

It started [00:11:00] to get other people leaning in. And that whole process of just getting a healthier relationship with money, seeing it differently, being intentional with it, seeing how that affected my relationships in a very positive way. Because of how I felt about myself, right? Just the, the way you had me reverse engineer those three relationships.

Let's hold off on the relationship with money for a minute. Let's go right at the source. Let's, let's look at that relationship with self. Let's look in the mirror. Let's figure out how we can develop some unconditional acceptance, almost even some love for that person looking back at you in the mirror, and then just seeing how that trickles down into the rest of life.

Right. And that, and that was the journey and, and the journey of trying to heal myself and you being a willing participant. I think there was some benefit to you there as well and some more intentionality for you. Of course. And then, you know, here all of a sudden we've got this tribe that showed up that wanted [00:12:00] a little more financial sobriety in their lives.

And so I, I think in the end we did get to help a lot of people. this graduation, so to speak of, Hey, I've got financial sobriety. Now I've got a certain awareness, a certain amount of intention with how I use my money, with how my relationships work in life. I mean, that that's kind of what I'm feeling right now is just.

I'm very intentional about the people I want to spend time with. I'm very intentional with how I want to use my financial resources to support the people, the places, the passions, the experiences. That's taken five and a half years of sitting here talking with the two of you fellas to figure out what that looks like.

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah. And we, I mean, we came at this with a spirit of, of wanting to help people on their own journey with those three complex relationships. To me, it was always. almost like a public service announcement on how to educate people [00:13:00] on money, but not in the nitty gritty way, not in the nuts and bolts sense of IRAs and Roths and, you know, 401ks and all these kinds of conventional things.

We've had a very unique conversation about money and the relationship with money and how that impacts you, how that impacts your people. And that intentionality has been the thread through the whole thing for me is money is energy, right? Your time is energy and how can you be more intentional with how you spend your money, how you spend your time, who you spend it with, right?

And I love how that conversation has evolved and particularly with our tribe, uh, We feel as though that the conversation has graduated a little bit. Sure. To our, our whole wealth journey. Sure. Which is what we do in our private practice. You've got the intentionality behind you. Now let's really align that.

With what drives you. 

Matthew Grishman: Oh, there you go. 

Jim Gebhardt: [00:14:00] That, to me, is the exciting part of where we're taking the conversation. Because we can and will tell stories and have those people in studio that when they've gotten unlocked on what drives them and now how the money piece is in alignment with that. Sure. Cue the fireworks.

Absolutely. I mean, that is when the magic happens. That is some of the most intoxicating, I don't, we don't say that word on the show very often given that it's been financial sobriety. Sure. But that is some of the most intoxicating work for me is when we're working with a client and we see that happen.

Matthew Grishman: Yes. 

Jim Gebhardt: We see that moment when the shackles come off with how they've been living their money life. Sure. Not in alignment. with how they want to be living their life, right? In terms of their, their true purpose or the relationships that they're most passionate about or how they want to spend their time or these kinds of concepts.[00:15:00] 

And to me, most of it is because it's the baggage of the prior generation. This is how mom and dad did it. This is how my grandparents did it. Therefore, I, I do it this way. And the it is, Money is I want to own the same stuff my parents owned well That's potentially not even mildly appropriate for this day and age and stage of life that you're in.

That's where I think the whole wealth journey Conversation is gonna get really fun and exciting. 

Matthew Grishman: It felt like for a long time We were having conversations with people who were not sure how to do that I'm not sure that they could do that. Could do what? Could do something different than generations past.

Jim Gebhardt: Well, because where are we being taught about money? Where in our 86 years of preparation and schooling are we ever taught about money? Two of my 44 children are either out of college or about to get out of college. [00:16:00] Sure. I've had a number of parents recently with similar age children ask me, So, hey, are you, can you help my son or daughter with like understanding that I, I've got a call today at two o'clock with a dear friend who's, I'm the godparents to one of her children, wants help with her new job in her 401k.

And I always have a little funny retort, well, I mean, clearly they should know this already because they've had so much coursework and schooling on the subject. Of course. But that, that's sadly not the case. So I think we're left with a natural tendency to just go with the playbook that we, we either saw directly or indirectly from our parents.

Matthew Grishman: Yeah. Well, it's fun to be part of this whole waking up process, this knowing that we could do something different that. We can think of our money in a different way that it can serve us in a completely different way. I mean, if you've been with us up to this point, and you're doing what we've been [00:17:00] suggesting through the whole financial sobriety process, right, coming through the curriculum, recognizing this relationship with self and You know, how to, how to just really accept that person for who you are and that you're exactly who you're supposed to be and 

Jim Gebhardt: all of the tools and resources that we have, you know, been talking at you and with you about and we make available on the website.

Totally. 

Matthew Grishman: If you have plugged into all of that and you've been utilizing all that, you might be asking the same question that you and I have been asking each other. What's next? Now what? I mean, now what? Okay. I'm awake. Aware. I mean, you, you remember, I used to look at my bank account at the end of every month and wonder where the hell it all went.

Okay. I, I had a great deposit this month. It's the end of the month. Where the hell did all my money go? That was part of the plague that I lived with most of my adult life. Well, that doesn't happen anymore. I now know where it goes. It doesn't always go. [00:18:00] Where you want it to go? Where I want it to go, I don't always like how it's used, whether I'm using it or somebody else in the family's using it, but I know where it goes.

I'm aware. I'm intentional with it. Now what? 

Jim Gebhardt: Well. 

Matthew Grishman: Now what? If it happens to be in alignment. Sure. Well, that's, most of it is. I look in the mirror now. I like the dude looking back at me. He's not perfect. I wish there were a couple of less pounds on the scale. Never, never will be. No, and that's okay. I'm, I'm good with that.

Not striving for that anymore. I look at the relationships I have in my life and they're pretty good. I've, I've gotten rid of most of the, what, what's the word now? Toxicity? Toxic. Toxic. Yes. Right. I've cancelled. I've cancelled everybody. Ah, the cancelled 

Jim Gebhardt: culture. 

Matthew Grishman: I have the cancelled culture where I've cancelled the relationships in my life that just don't feel good.

The one, they, you know, they suck the life out of me. Yes. The, the idea of energy say no more. Yes. [00:19:00] Holy cow. Conserving and protecting your energy. No, as a complete sentence. Did you know that? No. Very good. I 

Jim Gebhardt: didn't. 

Matthew Grishman: I mean, all of these really cool tools. Have brought me to a place that I like the dude looking back at me in the mirror.

I feel really good about the people in my life. I have a very defined 2 a. m. club, which is a bigger group of people than I would have expected, but I don't have a lot of situational friends anymore. I mean, I have friends in the situations that I'm in. I love the people in my life and I have a pretty good relationship with money.

I think I still might hold onto it a little too tightly. But I'm starting to let the death grip go, right? Compared to where I was five and a half years ago, right? Mr. Spendthrift, who went to the other end of the barbell, couldn't grow it fast enough. So now what? 

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah. 

Matthew Grishman: We have all that. Now what? 

Jim Gebhardt: More. 

Matthew Grishman: Is better.

So that's what the whole wealth journey, I think, is all [00:20:00] about. Is how do we take this newfound relationship with self, with people, with money? and go on a deeper journey of self discovery to find the purpose behind this wealth that I've created. I mean, that's what I feel like financial sobriety did and set me up for.

Perhaps this also is you partner, as well as our tribe of listeners. Financial sobriety set me up to be truly wealthy. I feel for the first time in my life that I have some significant wealth across all fronts of my life. 

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah. 

Matthew Grishman: Personal, financial, experiential. Yeah. I've got these memory dividends from the experiences that you and I have shared.

Yeah. That are paying me massive, massive dividends. I mean, I just, I look at my life and I've got all this abundance of wealth. Mm hmm. Now what? Yeah. Right? How do I find purpose [00:21:00] behind this wealth? That is what our whole wealth journey is about. is designed to do. Now, I don't know the answer to my own question of what is the purpose behind my wealth, and I selfishly am going to use this podcast studio and our conversations in here, not only to help others figure that out, but to help me figure that out.

We're going to kind of reason this out together. I 

Jim Gebhardt: might challenge you a little bit on the, on, you don't know the answer. I know a little bit of the answer. Right. Because you've gone through our clarity compass exercise. Sure. Sure. And for those in the tribe that have done that. You've got a handful of essential, you know, vitamins and minerals in your life in the way of things that you're most passionate about that are absolutely life essentials for you.

Sure. And you and I have, in our own health journeys, recognized that that's one of the areas where we need to invest our money intentionally in our health. Right? The program that I've been on for over a hundred [00:22:00] days, The journey that you've started with, with Jack the trainer, right? A lot of people that we meet will be struggling in the health department, but they have bags, bags of money.

And when we see how they can connect the dots and they can start to use some of the money that they have, because if they're not around in 20 years when they think they're going to want the money, what's the point of that? So then, harnessing that conversation and getting into the, Uncomfortable, messy, oogie stuff around how do we use our money to support the life that we're putting our feet on the ground for every day.

That's when it gets fun. 

Matthew Grishman: Oh, yeah. I mean, the first time we went through the Clarity Compass, I think that's what helped me discover The wealth that I want to create and how to go about creating that wealth. And again, I'm let me be clear I'm not just talking about money. No, no, 

Jim Gebhardt: no, no in a much broader sense.

Sure, 

Matthew Grishman: right now that I've [00:23:00] gotten there I almost feel like it's time to go through the clarity compass again, not because my values necessarily have changed In fact, I don't think I need to rediscover what my core Driving values are but maybe more it's the action plan of how do these now show up in my life?

Transcribed by https: otter. ai And if they're not quite showing up the way I want to, how do I go get them? I mean, that's 

Jim Gebhardt: And who can help you? 

Matthew Grishman: Yeah, that's, that's going to be a much bigger piece. 

Jim Gebhardt: Because there's something about this culture that we live in, ever since the DIY thing started however many decades ago, where I think a lot of us look at ourselves and go, How am I going to do this?

How am I going to blalalalala? When it's not necessarily a how conversation. It's a who conversation. Who can help me with this? Sure. Who has this expertise that I want relative to these core values that I'm espousing and wanting to live my life by? And we've talked [00:24:00] 800 times on the show about the whole blind spot aspect of when you're trying to figure something out.

Well, guess what? If you've never done it before, You've got 82 blind spots around you. You're going to need people to help show you what those missing pieces 

Matthew Grishman: are. Well, that's hard for entrepreneur types. That's hard for guys like you and me. That's hard for Until it isn't. The friends we Well, no, it is.

It's hard. It's hard. Think about the entrepreneurs in our life right now. And one of the biggest blind spots they have is I don't have to do all of this myself. Right? There are lots of who's out there That helped me do this. And we've met some entrepreneurs that are starting to figure that out. Figuring out the value of surrounding myself with who's so that I can stay really, really focused.

Jim Gebhardt: That's a very freeing 

Matthew Grishman: on what I'm great at. It's a very freeing, which for entrepreneurs is generally the vision, right? It's kind of seeing where. I want [00:25:00] this thing to go, seeing how this can have impact on people, seeing, you know, the direction, the long vision, the long game. 

Jim Gebhardt: Right. But it's so easy to get stuck in the how.

Oh, absolutely. 

Matthew Grishman: And often the how doesn't get done because we get stuck on thinking, I'm responsible for how. That's going to be a big part of the whole wealth journey conversation is realizing that so much more of it is about who, not how. Hallelujah. Yes. Yes. So who's this for? Who's the whole wealth journey for?

That's a fantastic question. It's for the entrepreneur who's gotten to that place in life where they want more from their money than just more money. Yeah, what does that mean? Well, one thing I've learned about us entrepreneur types Is that what drives us is building and creating and wanting to be independently wealthy.

That's a big motivating factor. And what I know [00:26:00] in my own path is that once some of the money boxes got checked and the wealth boxes got checked, I found myself saying, well, now what? Mm hmm. I mean, are we just using our money to make more money for ourselves? What's the purpose of that? 

Jim Gebhardt: Well, if we take intentionality out of it, yes, that's what happens.

is we just make more money with our money. And as you and I have said privately, not necessarily in studio, that's pretty boring. Ugh. That is immensely boring for us as, as practitioners to just help somebody that has a lot of money get more money. 

Matthew Grishman: You know, I think this was something that you and I have been feeling for a while now.

Even though this is, we're, we're kind of first now talking about this more in studio, and, and we're talking about this more with clients who show up. This, this is something that was an irritant with us a while ago. This idea of wanting more [00:27:00] than just more money out of life and, and in what we do. I, I mean, for me, I think back to, oh gosh, the beginning of our Schwab relationship and that Schwab advisor network that we were part of for a while.

And I will never forget sitting in that Sacramento conference room. And I don't remember the guy's name. He was a young guy, probably early forties. with a little over 10 million bucks in a Schwab account. I was introduced. Oh, he was a, he was a prospective client. Yes. He was a real estate, real estate guy.

He, you know, flip some houses, owns some multifamily big stuff. Right. And, and had 10, 10, 

Jim Gebhardt: 10 sticks in the bank at Schwab. 

Matthew Grishman: Yes. A little bit of liquidity that he was hoping we would manage for him. The first question out of his mouth was how much are you going to make for me? Right. The second question out of his mouth was, and how much are you going to charge me for it?

And if he was on Family Feud, he would have had one strike left. Exactly. But, it wasn't on Family Feud. Right. He was with me at Gebhardt Group. Right. [00:28:00] And he used his only two strikes with those two questions. Right. And I stood up and shook his hand and said it was nice to meet him. We're not going to earn you enough and we're going to cost too much were the answers to the two questions.

Wait, wait, wait. Sit back down. What do you mean? Well, what do you mean, what do I mean? You, you have an incredible net worth pushing 30 or 40 million dollars. You've got 10 million liquid. You're in your early 40s. What do you need my help making more money for? You're really good at that already. You know how to do that beautifully.

Yeah, you don't need my help with that. Right. And that was the end of the conversation. He just could not see. Couldn't put the pieces together. That my role was something different. Right. And, and, and that's okay. There, there are plenty of people who are in our industry. There are 400, 000 people in our industry with licenses.

To provide financial advice. Most of them are in the business of helping you make more money from your money. Right. That's okay. Yes. Go find one of them. Is what I shared with this fine young man. That just got, that's boring for me, for you. 

Jim Gebhardt: Well, [00:29:00] absolutely. Because, for me it's always been about the meaning.

Where is the meaning in your life? And how do you use the money to support that meaning? Right? Whether it's your kids, whether it's your grandkids, whether it's your alma mater, whether it's a charity or a cause or a, or a, uh, an organization that you're passionate about. 

Matthew Grishman: I love the decision you made about supporting your children.

When you and I first started playing together. I mean, again, I think this goes back further for us. Oh, it does. Now we're just finally, like, feeling like courageous enough to put our stake in the sand and say, this is what we believe in. This is what we stand for. You made decisions about how you invested in your children.

Yes. A long time ago. And here I get to be your little wingman watching the results of that investment. 

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah. 

Matthew Grishman: The dividends are pretty cool. I mean, you, you went on a lacrosse trip with Grace to Philadelphia and I'm, did you have to take a new credit card out to do that trip? [00:30:00] Probably. Yeah. I mean, 

Jim Gebhardt: these were, these were investments I was making with assets I didn't have.

Yeah. And we've talked about it on the show before that, you know, there's good debt and there's bad debt. Sure. And we've had that conversation a number of times, but in this context, to me, the bad debt is just blindless consumerism. Just reckless, needless spending, swiping, clicking, beeping, whatever it is.

But then there's other investments you're going to make in life where you don't get another second shot at it, and it doesn't always line up with what the Bank of America app says I've, I've got liquid. Sure. And. God bless Beth. We were co conspirators in the decision. It was, it was never my decision alone.

It was something that we did together. 

Matthew Grishman: Yes. 

Jim Gebhardt: To be like, okay, this is a passion that our child has, and a lot of it stems from the fact that, you know, my own passion as a kid, we didn't have the resources to be able to, right, invest in it. So [00:31:00] there's a, there's definitely some deep seated, emotional attachment that I have, sure, to, you know, wanting to help a child that has a particular passion invest and pursue that passion.

Right. And to me that was good debt. Yes. And I think it was even in the last show we talked about the fact that debt is only a problem to the extent you don't believe in the investment. Right. You're probably tired as hell of hearing me say it because I've said it 42 times in the last month. It is, I can't say it enough, debt is only a problem to the extent you don't believe in the investment.

Matthew Grishman: I think you've said that was the 43rd time in the last day. Right. It's mind blowing. Absolutely. Right? Absolutely. 

Jim Gebhardt: Because if you don't, well, let's use a mortgage as an example, right? You're buying a piece of property. What do they say is the number one thing the realtor is looking for when they're showing you the piece of property?

For you to show emotional attachment to the place. Oh my God, this place is incredible. Look at the [00:32:00] view, honey. This is awesome. The space and the Done. Done. Now, you've got to be comfortable with the debt. I 

Matthew Grishman: In 2004, just before July 4th weekend, Amy and I were renting a house on the new side of Rockland, I like to call it.

We had a lovely brand new home on a postage stamp. My real estate agent told me that this is the side of town we're going to need to look for a house because they're all brand new and they're going to be, No, no, no. I want an older house. I want a piece of land. That's what I want. No, you're not going to want that.

No, trust me, that's what I want. And I made sure he was clear of that. Well, sure enough, he figured out how to tug on my heartstrings when he found us the house we live in today. Miles and I, he was four years old, we walked through the front door of the house. And looked right out the back sliding glass sliders in the family room to see this incredible acre of [00:33:00] land with a sport court and fruit trees.

Done. Deal was done. Had no idea that half the house was falling apart, but I fell in love with the idea that I could raise my children in that backyard. 

Jim Gebhardt: Right. And so now you were very comfortable taking on the debt. 

Matthew Grishman: Absolutely. To do that. Absolutely. Yeah. Oh, it was great. I think about. What we're doing here in studio and what we've been doing for the last five years.

Talk about you and me reaching a point where we wanted more from our money than just more money. We've invested in this podcast because you and I have had a passion for helping people develop a little bit more intentionality with how they use their money. Stop dropping so many damn nickels. Stop spending so mindlessly.

Stop using your money for things that don't serve. Your highest and best values and use and, and we never really came into this with any intention of making money doing this. I don't [00:34:00] know that we've made any money doing this. No, 

Jim Gebhardt: well, I mean, we're aren't we sponsored by who are we sponsored by, Ace? Ha, are we even sponsored by 

Matthew Grishman: We're 

Jim Gebhardt: sponsored by Gebhardt 

Matthew Grishman: group.

We're sponsored by Gebhardt group, there you go. We're sponsored by Beth Grishman. Who, uh, don't give us Too much grief for coming into the studio and doing this, but this has, you, you've always referred to this as one of our passion projects where we have invested time, energy, financial resources into something that we believe strongly in, you know, without any need for a return on that investment.

So who this show is most appropriate for is that type of entrepreneur. As we've shared some anecdotes here and some thoughts about. Who this makes sense for. You've kind of grown up with us through financial sobriety. And you're at that point where you can kind of check the money box. Okay. I've made the money I need to make in life to be free, to be comfortable, to do the things that I want to do.

Now what? [00:35:00] Well, 

Jim Gebhardt: I, I think the recognition that the tribe member is their own creator of wealth, right? Oh, number one. Absolutely. I think the awareness and the. The insight that someone can have to the fact that they are their, their best source of wealth creation. You are your most valuable investment. 

Matthew Grishman: It's not somebody else.

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah, I mean, it's not us, it's not, we, we do not see the responsibility for creating the wealth coming from us. And the next NVIDIA. 

Matthew Grishman: Or, exactly. 

Jim Gebhardt: Right? And that's where we look to elevate the money conversation with the whole wealth journey. is on exactly that for the very successful business owner entrepreneur type, right?

They've created a very successful business. They are checking the boxes on a lot of the economic or traditional scorekeeping around money. And they're kind of wondering, like, what am I, what am, why am I feet hitting the floor? I've got all the money. Huh. My business is booming. But I [00:36:00] want more. 

Matthew Grishman: Now what?

Yeah, now what? That's what this is all about. There's a can be stuck component to that. And that's, those are some more of the entrepreneurs we're starting to meet, is they have this incredibly thriving business. They appear on the outside to be incredibly happy, but yet deep down inside there's this feeling of There's an ache.

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah. I'm a little, I'm a little stuck. I'm a little stuck. I'm a little bored. I'm a little lost. I'm a little To me, that always comes back to, to use some of Dan Sullivan's favorite language, the freedom of purpose. Yeah. Yeah. Right? That There's a, a movement underway in the money conversation around this thing called FIRE, which is Financially Independent Retire Early.

Oh boy. I couldn't be less interested. Yeah. Right? You know, this get rich quick thing, this overnight success thing, this tire at 40 thing. 

Matthew Grishman: Let me starve myself for the next 20 years and be a complete miser and a complete loser. Jerk, so that I can have [00:37:00] enough money in the bank that I never have to work again at the age of 40.

Jim Gebhardt: Right. I mean, I just, just, that's not what we're building here. That's not what we're about because you and I see this as there's something much more to life than just money, right? You've got to have, I mean, we've seen it in our traditional conventional years of practice where when clients retire, if they don't have a plan, Or they don't have a purpose for how they're going to spend their time.

I mean, I hate to say this, they're not going to live very long. 

Matthew Grishman: No. No, they're 

Jim Gebhardt: not. That's, granted, there's no scientific data to that. That's in our own experience. But you have got to have a reason for your feet to hit the floor in the morning. Even after you've crossed that ethereal finish line of retirement, right?

Well, 

Matthew Grishman: everybody does, brother. Everybody has a why that drives them forward. Everybody does. They don't always know what it is. Yes. Right? And [00:38:00] that's kind of what our purpose at Gebhardt Group has become, and it's what we're starting to do more with this show, is helping people align those financial resources, figure out How to align those financial resources with the people, the places, the experience, their passions that give their lives true meaning.

And sometimes we've gotta take a little step back to figure out what that why is. That's part of what this show is going to be all about, is giving people a little bit of that, that process for how do I figure out What that looks like in my life and once I figure out what that why is and I get really clear on it Then I can start this kind of realignment process of Just getting after it just going 

Jim Gebhardt: well that to me That's the fun part when we can help a client tap into that It generally comes at this kind [00:39:00] of unique intersection of intention and action.

Yes. 

Matthew Grishman: Right? And Very unique intersection. 

Jim Gebhardt: Oh, yeah. 

Matthew Grishman: I mean Lots of pe there's lots of intention out there, but whether there's a willingness to take action to actually do something about it, that is like an endangered species. It just doesn't exist on a mass scale. Lots of intention, not enough action. 

Jim Gebhardt: I think the multi billion if not trillion dollar fitness industry is a great example of that.

That's how we want to play. That's the level that we want to play and elevate the conversation to with the, the graduation of financial sobriety into the whole wealth journey. 

Matthew Grishman: There is one thing I want to be impossible to misunderstand here. When we talk about entrepreneur who wants more from their money than more money, we're not necessarily limiting the conversation to just a business owner.

An entrepreneur is a mindset to us. I was an entrepreneur [00:40:00] working for corporate Wall Street for 20 years before you and I settled up together. But in my mind, there was an entrepreneurial spirit. There was this idea of wanting to create something and be a part of something bigger than self. Wanting to thumb my nose at the rules, at the status quo, what was the acceptable norm.

And so. This is for anybody who embraces that mindset, whether they own a business, whether they work for somebody else, whether they play professional baseball. If you have this mindset of wanting more from your money than just more money, wanting to have massive amounts of impact, whatever that might look like in your life, wanting to.

Really thumb your nose at the conventional thinking that exists out there and kind of march to the beat of your own drum and not conform. That to me is what the entrepreneur is all about. That's who belongs in this tribe with us. Yeah, 

Jim Gebhardt: certainly [00:41:00] it's the business owner that has a thriving business.

Absolutely. The self starter, right? The person that is responsible for putting their own bread on the table. 

Matthew Grishman: Yes. 

Jim Gebhardt: Right? Whatever shape that forms. I mean, it's not as, it's, for me, it's not as much thumbing the nose at conventionality. I know that's a big driver for you. Sure, 

Matthew Grishman: sure. 

Jim Gebhardt: But it, because that, that was, that's never been my thing.

My thing has always been, I want to be in charge. I want to be responsible for success or failure. And I want to report to the chairman of the board that's looking in the mirror. Right. That's my thing. Sure. Right? And 

Matthew Grishman: Isn't that a little bit of your own rules, though, and kind of not the other people's rules?

Because isn't that what kind of drove you a little bit out of Merrill Lynch Smith Barney to do what you wanted to do the way you wanted to do it? Right. I just 

Jim Gebhardt: don't think of it as thumbing my nose at the organization. Sure. I think of it more as, okay They're not interested in doing things the way [00:42:00] I want to do them, I will go do them myself.

Exactly. Which I think is what happens to a lot of people in, to use your language, the conventional space. Yes. You're working for a large corporation, maybe even a large privately held business. Yeah. And you realize, you know what, there's a way I want to do this. Sure. And the mothership doesn't see it that way.

And it takes an outrageous amount of courage to step out of the biosphere and think that you're going to be able to survive as an entrepreneur. 

Matthew Grishman: Yes. 

Jim Gebhardt: Right? Whether it's the business owner and they sell the business and what's life after, like, you know, like after that. Whether it's some of the professional athletes that we've worked with and helping them prepare for what comes after their sport.

Matthew Grishman: Especially professional athletes who are doing it different and different. than what all the other organizations are doing it like. They're, they're trying to create something new and refreshing and different. It's been awesome. It has been 

Jim Gebhardt: awesome. [00:43:00] Or you're the budding entrepreneur. Maybe you've got some side hustle that's really killing it, but you don't know how to, you don't know how to step away from, you know, I'm, I'm thinking stammering that really he was a frustrated developer.

His passion has always been real estate. And. He was in a software position, selling software, at a, you know, pretty good sized firm, making a lovely living with benefits and all the, love, love, I don't know, all the trappings. Sure. All the comfortable trappings that come with corporate America. And there probably were issues and these kinds of things.

And I just kept reminding him, I'm like, that doesn't light your fire at all. Right. You snooze through that job, and yet everything that you talk to me about when I see you, either professionally or personally, has to do with your real estate projects. 

Matthew Grishman: How many people do you and I know? That are there, that are like that, that are [00:44:00] trapped in the hamster wheel of feeling like I'm 

Jim Gebhardt: talking 

Matthew Grishman: to one that used to be there.

There's jobs. Thank you. It's so nice to be out of the hamster cage. Yes. But how many people from friends of ours that we've gone on golf trips with to siblings of ours and friends and neighbors that are these entrepreneurial geniuses. stuck in an old way of thinking. 

Jim Gebhardt: Well, part of it is the blind spot that we always talk about, which is they don't, they can't see how they're going to exist outside the biosphere.

I mean, I had that myself when I came to the realization at Smith Barney 400 years ago, that I, I should, I don't know what an independent financial advisor is. I should probably go talk to some. I mean, I don't see what they're like. I don't know how, I leave the mothership of Smith Barney City Group. It was just a constant tape of how and scarcity in my mind.

Right, right. On I don't know how I'm going to do this, right? [00:45:00] And I think there's a good segment of our tribe that probably feels that way. Like they don't, they don't know how to transition from the corporate world to the independent world, whatever that is in their space. 

Matthew Grishman: Well here, here's the first thing that will help that transition at least get instigated.

Right. If I'm supposedly uniquely great at helping people get unstuck, right, we don't, we don't to get, like you've said, we don't get the anchor all the way in the boat to get in motion. We just got to get it up off the floor, like an inch. Here's that first starting point. I think if you're that person who's stuck, you have to have this belief that all the job security in the world, all the success in the world that I'm going to have is on me.

I'm responsible for my success, right? And I think where Transcribed You and I have been successful in making the transition is realizing that the minute I take away everybody else who has [00:46:00] a Say in my future and I put it all on me That my success is purely about my ability to show up and do what I'm great at I have all the job security in the world if you can start getting your brain around that the younger the better 

Jim Gebhardt: That's step one.

That was I was 26 years old when I worked at a large insurance company in Walnut Creek You And I routinely would see on a Friday, somebody my age today, 54, probably, you know, two kids getting ready to go to college, mortgage, right, uh, walking their box to the car. And I looked in the mirror and I said, that will not be me.

I had a strong interest to get into financial services. Like I've shared with, in terms of, you know, some of my, my background and my desire to want to solve this money problem for people that they could really go chase their dreams. Sure. And money wasn't going to be an issue. So at [00:47:00] 26, when I joined Merrill Lynch, I mean, since that age, the whole show, uh, God bless with Beth's support has been me.

Yes. I probably could have done it sooner, but even at large corporations where I was technically a 100 percent commissioned sales person, right? I did not have a salary. I, I, yes, I was provided, provided benefits sure. But it was all on me to hunt and kill and deliver. 

Matthew Grishman: Yes. 

Jim Gebhardt: And frankly, I think you're either hardwired for that or you're not.

Right. 

Matthew Grishman: You're either hardwired to be here or you're not. 

Jim Gebhardt: If you're trapped, then there's a process of self-discovery that you gotta go through to figure out how you're gonna get out of where you are and, and where you're stuck. Well, and your point is a good one. 

Matthew Grishman: So we're, I, I think we're talking to. the same person, but just in different spots on that journey, right?

We're, we're talking to you at that point at 26 years old, where you're still working for the big company, but you got that entrepreneurial brain that's just aching for something different [00:48:00] because you believe in yourself and you're all caught up with, how do I do this? How do I do this? Well, guess what?

We're going to show you, right? You might also be that, Entrepreneur who's like where you and I are a little more now in our lives where we've kind of broken free from working for other people and we're the boss and it's our vision and now maybe you're a swim still uh huh we've got to show up yeah but like you said it was all on you right you were responsible for it all well you and I both know that there's a certain ceiling of complexity we're shouldering the whole thing so somewhere along the entrepreneurial journey.

You have to realize that the answer becomes who, not how. Oh, 100%. Right? And now we start inviting more people to be a part of our vision and what we're trying to accomplish. More like minded, like hearted, entrepreneurial types. Everybody who shows up at Gebhardt Group has that entrepreneurial ownership mind.

[00:49:00] Everybody. On our team owns their role on the team. They treat it like they own it. They treat the firm like they own it. They treat our clients like they own them. I mean, it's incredible. This ownership culture that you and I have attracted, 

Jim Gebhardt: those are always the best businesses. When it's, when it's entitlement based.

Eh, 

Matthew Grishman: I don't want any part of that. 

Jim Gebhardt: Yeesh. That's not a, that's not a pretty conversation. 

Matthew Grishman: That's not our entrepreneur. That's not who we're talking 

Jim Gebhardt: to. Culturally, in terms of the, the business, right? If they've, if they've got people on their team that have this kind of, uh, entitlement mindset. You know, I'm entitled to my job, I'm entitled to my benefits.

Sure. There's a certain lack of energy that comes with that versus this kind of this, this owner culture, this owner, you know, this, we're, we're building something together. Well, I'm going to 

Matthew Grishman: put that on the owner. I mean, if, if you're here and you're listening and that just triggered a little owie, a little son of a bitch, don't tell me, right?

If you're feeling that frustration that there are [00:50:00] people on your team that reflect that type of culture. Well, guess who's responsible for setting the culture and attracting the people. The type of people they want to attract. So we're going to show you through this whole wealth journey process, how to begin to shift your culture, how to attract that ownership culture that I think you and I have done an incredible job ourselves at this point, you know, if you're in the right place, if you are one of the entrepreneurs, one of the many entrepreneurs along the journey and stuck somewhere, somehow you're in the right room, welcome to the whole wealth journey.

You've arrived, you're here, in the next episode, we're going to show you exactly how we're going to accomplish what we've talked about here today. How are we going to help our tribe of entrepreneurs get unstuck and realize how we use this wealth to create more true wealth in life that has real meaning [00:51:00] so when our feet hit the floor in the morning, man, we're feeling great.

How do we make more from our money than just more money? Amen. Amen. It's been an honor to be 

Jim Gebhardt: in the chair and to watch this and to watch your evolution and to watch how We've both grown in the process and that financial sobriety isn't going away I don't want people to have a thought or a sense that that is dissipating, right?

The nature of the conversation with the whole wealth journey is evolving Yes, and the body of work of what we've created sure We had special episodes, but a lot of it a lot of it. Most of it is timeless And I've always been attracted to timeless concepts and materials, because if they were true in the past, they're true in the present, and they will be true in the future.

Amen, brother. And so much of what you created with the book, we created with the curriculum, can live and breathe a hell of a lot longer, And while we're both a couple of, you know, voices in a, in a microphone. 

Matthew Grishman: Part of the impact we'll always be able to have [00:52:00] brother, long after we're gone. 

Jim Gebhardt: Yeah. So that I'm thrilled that we've been able to do this and I'm thrilled also and looking forward to what's to come with the conversation.

Matthew Grishman: Awesome. Let's spend the next episode going through what the whole wealth journey is all about and what to expect. And I just want to finish with one point of gratitude. I want to bring it back full circle. I am so grateful for our financial sobriety tribe, the five and a half years of bringing more financial sobriety into this universe, because I am so proud to say that financial sobriety is now the whole wealth journey.

And with that, that's a wrap. Thanks for joining us today on the whole wealth journey. Whatever your path may look like, our purpose is to make sure that your way forward aligns with your core values and intentions. Are you ready to start planning for a future that's rich in wealth and well being? Then click like and subscribe and make sure you don't miss a single [00:53:00] episode of the Whole Wealth Journey.

So if we've struck a nerve with you today, where do people go? You can find us at GebhartWholeWealth. com. That's G E B H A R D T, wholewealth. com. And once you get there, make sure you connect with us so you can take the first steps to finding your why. We'll see you next time. 

Amy Bingham: Jim Gebhardt is a registered representative of and securities offered through Brokers International Financial Services LLC, member SIPC.

Jim Gebhardt and Matthew Grishman are investment advisor representatives of Gebhardt Group Incorporated, a registered investment advisor. Brokers International Financial Services LLC and Gebhardt Group Incorporated are not affiliated. The opinions in this podcast are for informational purposes only and are not intended to provide specific advice or investment recommendations.

To determine which investments or financial advice may be appropriate for you, consult a financial advisor prior to [00:54:00] investing. Any reference to market performance is based on historical information and there is no expressed or implied guarantee of future performance. Opinions expressed on this program do not necessarily reflect those of Brokers International Financial Services, LLC.

The topics discussed and opinions given are not intended to address the specific needs of any listener. Gebhardt Group Incorporated does not offer legal or tax advice. Listeners are encouraged to discuss their financial needs with the appropriate professional regarding your individual circumstance.