The Glow Up - Fabulous conversations with innovative minds.

Flow Helps Solve the Mental Health Crisis - Tristan Elizabeth Gribben

• Nathan C Bowser • Season 1 • Episode 9

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Tristan Elizabeth Gribben is the founder of Flow, an immersive meditation technology platform that aims to make meditation accessible and effective for modern, busy people.Key Takeaways:

  • Innovative Approach: Flow combines technology with a unique meditation method (Breathe, Move, Let Go, Calm, Focus, Restore) to provide immediate access to the benefits of meditation.
  • Multi-Platform Accessibility: Initially focused on VR, Flow has expanded to web, mobile, tablets, and TV, making it widely accessible across various devices.
  • Adaptability: The company pivoted during COVID-19, expanding beyond VR to meet changing customer needs and preferences.
  • Wide-ranging Applications: Flow is being used in corporate settings, prisons, rehab centers, and hospitals, demonstrating its versatility and effectiveness.
  • Measurable Impact: The company focuses on gathering data and testimonials to quantify the benefits of their meditation technology.

Tristan's journey with Flow began in 2015, driven by her passion for meditation and a vision to make its profound benefits more accessible through technology. The company started with VR but has since expanded to multiple platforms to reach a wider audience.

Flow's unique approach combines immersive technology with a structured meditation method that includes breathing, movement, letting go of tension, finding calm, focusing, and restoring. This method has proven effective even for those who typically struggle with traditional meditation practices.

The company has faced challenges, particularly during the COVID-19 pandemic, but has shown resilience by adapting their product offerings and expanding their reach. They've successfully implemented their technology in various settings, from corporate environments to healthcare facilities.

Tristan emphasizes the importance of listening to customer feedback while staying true to the core mission. This approach has led to positive developments, such as expanding to different platforms based on user needs in various settings.

Looking ahead, Flow aims to continue expanding its reach and impact, with a focus on providing accessible, effective meditation tools for diverse populations.

A "glow up" signifies a positive transformation, reflecting the journey of becoming a better, more successful version of oneself.

At The Glow Up, we humanize the startup and innovation landscape by focusing on the essential aspects of the entrepreneurial journey. Groundbreaking ideas are often ahead of their time, making resilience and perseverance vital for founders and product leaders.

In our podcast, we engage with innovators to discuss their transformative ideas, the challenges they face, and how they create value for future success.

If you're a founder or product leader seeking your own glow up, or a seasoned entrepreneur with stories to share, we invite you to join our guest list via this link.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

I think most people have a very hard time to access that peaceful, deep, calm, meditative, mindful state because we're sitting on a volcano inside of ourselves.

Nathan C:

I'm talking with Tristan Elizabeth Gribben of Flow. Tristan, it's so great to talk with you.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Thank you, Nathan. Thank you for the opportunity to connect to the community again. I love the community that you, that you're growing. And, all the founders and all the creative people in this network are amazing people. I'm a huge fan of this particular ecosystem because there's, yeah, there's so much cutting edge stuff going on. I'm, you know, it's really exciting. What I wanted to share today, part of my journey as a founder, I want to share some insights and hopefully some, yeah, some tips and tricks and also, yeah, some good news.

Nathan C:

Awesome.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

So, what we've created here in Iceland is a platform for meditation technology. It's immersive. So we started with VR, but then we created a web portal, mobile app. We were also for tablets, we're for TV, we're everywhere. So it's amazing. We're on all the mediums. What's cool about Flow is that on any given day, depending on how you feel, You can meditate, you know, you can choose, like, do I want to breathe, do I want to move my body, do I want to let go, actively release stress from, you know, tension in the body or my mind, some issues, do I want to let go, that's often a really good starting point for meditation is to let go, because, It's not easy to get into that deep, calm place.

Nathan C:

As an ADHD person, I have a hard time feeling any sense of calm so I'm excited for

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

I know. I'm excited too because it's like, I just did a online course yesterday with some folks in Belgium. At a medical device company and just leading a workshop. And we did, we went through the whole cycle, breathe, move, let go, calm, focus, and restore in one guided meditation. And it was so awesome because, these things come naturally to us. You know, we, when we think about meditation, we think of something, we have to go to a special place, be in special clothes, be in a really peaceful Zen setting, with a guide and we've got to, there's so much like to do to get there. or you've got to be in a special mindset to get there. So the beauty of Flow is that we have tools that are very actionable and very accessible for modern, busy working people like you and me. Like it's to have, to be able to just breathe, you know, gentle, some gentle stretching, let go of some tension in the body and get to that more calm place. From there, you can focus your mind on what's important, what it is you're wanting, you're seeking in your meditation, and then a full deep body relaxation to sort of integrate everything. And then that's just a really satisfying and complete cycle. And we've been doing this, you know, Method, Breathe, Move, Let Go, Calm, Focus, Restore since 2016, with groups of people, corporates, students, everywhere we go, and we found out that it's hugely and highly effective. And people who say that they can't meditate or that their mind's too busy or whatever, they haven't been able to do it, they're able to get into that sweet spot. So it's not just the immersive. You know, the technology that's getting you there is also the guidance, the method that's helping you to get there.

Nathan C:

One of the things I say so frequently around innovation and working in new technologies is that it is a show tell medium and that you really, when you're trying to introduce new ideas to people, that you, you need to give them an opportunity to see what you're talking about and understand, and, you know, If we're going to talk about how a cutting edge technology like Flow, an immersive technology, like one that you're working on, is helping to solve the mental health crisis, like, what a better way, to get started that than to, To start with a meditation. So thank you so much. I do have a little anxiety. I'm feeling very fresh air today and that's not usually my, my energy level. so we'll see how this new experimental calm Nathan, is a host. So, Tristan, you did a little bit of explaining, about the work that you do and the product that you're making. I want to make sure that we have like a real succinct description of, what is Flow and what is your mission there. Can you tell me a little bit about, Flow and how you got to this, idea, in your entrepreneurial journey?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Thank you, Nathan. Absolutely. So back in 2015, I got this vision of wanting to do something with technology and meditation because I, since the year 2000, I was super passionate about meditation, wanting to get everyone to come with me to workshops and seminars. I was hosting these events and really passionate. And just wanting to see something happen, really scalable, really revolutionary. Because I'd been aware of what was in the marketplace, which were the audio guided apps. But I was imagining something so much more profound and striking. More immediate, more, yeah. More, just like, immediate access to the profound benefits of meditation. Because, you know, with the audio guided meditations, it can take days, weeks, or months. to have a profound aha experience. So, I got together with my co founders and strangely enough, we got into a program with Vodafone, we got into an Accelerator program, and we were toying with the idea of VR, but I was skeptical. I thought maybe VR was like a gimmic or a toy that would be just like sitting on the shelf and get dusty or just would be a fad that would come and go. However, week three of the accelerator program, I was invited to do a voiceover for the Everest experience. The voiceover of a woman who climbed Everest, which was in the Smithsonian, and I was super excited. So I tried VR for the first time, and when I was on Everest, it was so mind blowingly magnificent, looking in every direction, at the Milky Way and the Horizons 360. I was like, Oh my God, we're going to use VR to help millions of people learn meditation. Because all I wanted to do on the mountaintop was to sit down and meditate, like the yogis so we started working with VR at the end of the Accelerator, we had a demo project and I took it to Norway and, my first reactions were unbelievable. I was still a little bit nervous and skeptical and I had the CEO say, I want this for my 26, 000 employees. We had blended the Icelandic nature with music and guided meditation. And it was just like, wow. And I had another CEO who's very skeptical. Like, well, my wife says I should meditate, but I think it's weird. But I want to try this technology. So he tried the technology. he took the headset off and said, I found Nirvana. I would use this every day at my desk to de stress. So we had this incredible reaction to what we created with Flow. it's been a huge journey from that moment. The first trade show to today where we have a platform and we were, you know, Now we're able to actually serve large corporations. We are helping people now in a UK prison. We're helping people in rehab. We're helping people at the workplace. We're helping people who are in training and they're, you know, maybe they're tired and they can take a four minute break and Flow, and we have helped a lot of companies, especially right before COVID, we were in practically every major company in Iceland. Well, we had 30 contracts in the federal bank, in various banks. We had various energy companies. We had fashion companies. We had hospitality. We had Icelandair. We had a lot of different companies using the Flow headset. COVID was hard on us. We got pretty slammed because people didn't want to touch the headset. So we lost our contracts with city of Reykjavik. We were in 10 municipal offices. Everything kind of got shut down during COVID, you know, and, the good news is, is that we were very mission driven, very resilient. And during COVID, we learned, like you were saying, we learned from our customers, what's working, what, what was needed, and we worked with PwC and we did a 30 day challenge and we managed to get outstanding results. And we published that in the national newspaper. So from everything we've been learning, with companies, we've continued to develop the platform. Now it's no longer just VR. It's also web, mobile, and. Various mediums. And now, we're in the main national hospital and I send them the cancer ward and they want Flow for the televisions.

Nathan C:

Goodness. You got me fired up and you called out a couple of key things. one, congratulations on a journey, that spans, a number of years of passion in this space. I do find that folks who are in like the wellness and meditation space, one, are pretty gung ho about it. And two, Those that have a solid foundation, a solid practice, tend to stick with things and can, can, use that resilience, and that extra fortitude, that meditation brings. As an ADHD person, I'm one of those meditation skeptics, and I'm, took a cross patterning platform approach and a major, like, life disruption, for me to have enough time and focus with it. And, for me, horrible insomnia and rumination was keeping me up all night long. And, Almost nothing except the soothing voice of Jason Stevenson on YouTube, could get me back to sleep, and then, I started using a VR meditation app and, It started to have benefits, but the thing that I noticed, and I love that you shared this in your, in your meditation with us as well, was the thing for me that got me hooked was the call to reflect and understand. And I had enough times where I moved 10 or 20 percent, in the positive direction that it showed me, hey, this is something that works frequently. And if I'm stressed, If I'm overstimulated, if I'm dysregulated in some way, I could get a 10 percent kickback if I just go make this small gesture, and it's now become a part of my daily life. I will stop the anecdote saying that because my life has changed and shifted, the time, place, and need for meditation for me has shifted as well. And so I really appreciate having the ability to listen to something on my mobile phone in a pinch, to go into the headset when it matters, to have a little bit of an extra visual on the web, so that I'm not multitasking or, you know, I'm really in the moment. I do think, especially in today's, Communications, space, as well as in people's preferences around technology. Being multi channel, being web based, being hyper focused on accessibility, is one of those things that will help you through those times. I have too many questions, Tristan. So, you mentioned this idea of learning from your customers and making adjustments as an entrepreneur to meet the market where it's at, to meet customers where they're comfortable. Could you dive into, right, like as a founder, you have to be dogged about your purpose and your vision, but you also have to be open to feedback. And that's like a wonderful duality. Can you maybe share, how you approached, listening to these customers, how you approached that collaboration, that iterative process to, improve the product based on what you were hearing? And, when do you listen and when do you stick to your guns is maybe where

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

exactly. Well, I think the good news is that people have been much more open to what I thought they might be shy about, like the letting go part. You know, in the meditation, because what I felt like Flows a little bit more modern day, you know, we're drawing on ancient techniques, but we're getting people to scream and to move their bodies and to shake, and we were doing this in like the federal bank and, you know, all the bankers are doing it and they're like laughing and screaming. Like, ah, exactly. And I was like, well, I wonder, I wonder if they're going to think I should tone things down or whatever, but no, they actually really love that part. That was like the favorite part. So, I mean, that was a nice surprise is that, that the people who are in the corporates and they're working on this, you know, bigger level, and they, they've got a lot of people to take care of, that they actually really embraced this, so that was nice. That was reassuring. Because that's maybe what was are still made up out of people, right? And

Nathan C:

we forget, right, like that even the Googles and PwCs of the world, they're full of very high performing people who have done cool stuff, but they're still businesses run by people, and they have those human needs. yeah, and they have all of those same, fears, hopes, and desires, right?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Exactly. yeah, and I guess the nice thing is that I haven't had any big disappointments about feedback. I've just been, you know, it's like reaffirmed my own core punches, you know, what people would want or need. So it has been a good, positive experience to lean in and listen and collaborate. And I'm very excited with the new partnership we're gaining here in Iceland with the rehab and there's one in UK as well, we're working with a rehab company in the UK and they brought it to the prison and now they want Flow on the tablets, you know, that's great. Like they don't want just the VR, but they want tablets as well. So it was like, okay, that means that's a good direction. Okay. That's going to be useful in other places.

Nathan C:

Another personal story, just super quickly on this use case, because I'm really I had some family who were recently in the hospital with some major surgery, and, I knew that they were going to be battling some, keeping their mindset positive, and that they were going to be, you know, having to wait through a lot of pain. And I thought, like, wow, maybe the VR meditation that I've seen so much help from could be helpful for them. And, for the first three weeks, they had too many devices attached to them to make putting a headset on them, approachable at all. And so we resorted to just doing audio meditations, and after the first day, they started requesting them. It was kind of my audacious, like, maybe this would help, maybe this would be something we want to try. Hard to get them to buy in. After they felt that the first day, it was part of our regular schedule for the rest of the time, and even the nurses who were in the room were like,'wow, that was kind of nice right, so there was this knock on impact, to just doing it, but What is the device? What is the delivery mechanism that fits this scenario for users? Was really hard to figure out, and not everybody's gonna have a kid with a mobile app, and having it on that DirecTV or on that hospital television channel where you could just go I am all for, how do I sign up? You're working on all of these projects. You know in your heart, the power of meditation and this interactive approach. How do you measure the impact of your work, especially when you're having conversations with, like, funders or state governments? Like, new technology plus kind of new age ideas feels hard to sell. in a business space. How do you, how do you measure and quantify and talk about those things, on the innovations on both of those?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Think it's really important to have more like mainstream ways to measure other than how you feel. Right. so we did the independent study with PwC and that was after a 30 day challenge. And that was amazing. But that was published in 2022. Now we've got a clinical trial, an actual medical clinical study that happened, actually. Because I gave a presentation at AWE in Lisbon, I got approached by two surgeons from Lisbon, from the Champollimo Foundation, and they said, we want this for our patients. Now they're doing a full blown clinical study on Flow for preoperative breast cancer patients. That's super exciting. So that kind of data, that kind of stuff is pretty hard to argue with because they're, they're measuring actually, so they have a control group has no intervention, then they have the intervention group, which has just the nature scenes and Flow, and then the third group has nature scenes, plus the guidance and meditation. they're going to measure the impact of meditation. For preoperative breast cancer patients. It's a cool study we developed as a team. They have a whole team around that. I gave an onstage presentation at AWE. How amazing is that? And then now I'm working with, as I mentioned, rehab, and there's some UK, that's an opportunity to get some data there. Very important data points. They believe it's going to help reduce violence. And then there's also the case of, which I'm starting to work with. like decreasing stress at work, that's a big one, but also if you can help prove that someone who's having a very hard time mentally is able to actually meditate, so that's what we're talking about, people who are going through rehab, that they could have the Flow in the various mediums, not everyone wants to put the headset on, maybe that's for one person, it might be heaven on earth. And another person that gives them some anxiety. So they want to have it on a tablet. So, you know, just like we're going to learn a lot and get those data points and then be able to, make a very strong case. I think once we're in more healthcare scenarios and getting more of this quantitative and qualitative data, it's going to be pretty hard to like Flow will be sort of unstoppable.

Nathan C:

I'm fascinated with your use case and this position as, right, like as a wellness app, you may not be required to have clinical research, to have that really medical, scientific, peer reviewed level research and, both user research and ethic research of efficacy, but As someone that is adjacent to healthcare fields and may want to be a part of the third of the American GDP, you know, in America, healthcare is a third of the GDP, so, you know, 33 for every

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Whoa.

Nathan C:

spent in the U. S.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

It's almost like the military

Nathan C:

is bigger,

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

I don't know.

Nathan C:

We hear about this multi trillion dollar industry that XR is someday going to be. Well, that is healthcare today in the U. S. And to be a part of that, you know, especially if you want insurance companies or hospitals, it's a whole sector that expects years worth of clinical research. by medical It thereby, yeah,

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

that's going to take, I think that's going to take some, there's going to be some sort of critical mass before that buy in really comes in companies or insurers or healthcare chains. but I feel like that's, it's going to come faster than we anticipate because of. the immersive tech is so cutting edge and because healthcare wants cutting edge solutions. And so I feel like there's going to be a faster, you know, the acceleration into that is going to happen, hopefully faster than the typical long road. But I, so I think that that's, yeah, it's on a very fine line about whether it's. You know, the way I like to think about it is Flows kind of like the coffee machine. it's a coffee machine. It's not a medical device. It's something that provides someone something that they need.

Nathan C:

It, is part of, a successful business supporting the needs of the people who work there. I love it. I'm very curious to see how all of this testing turns out. I think it's an interesting challenge, that most startups aren't required to take. But my hypothesis is that by Investing the time and effort to understand the space to do that last mile efficacy testing to do that measurement of impact, probably puts you ahead not just in a business approach, but in a strategic approach, you're actually learning about when and where your product is helpful and right. That last mile of research and product market fit, I think, is where so many products are like,'we know there's value here. We see the use case,' but that's it. You know, that's as far as it goes. And I think this extra effort that you're. sort of being pushed to do, to be close to the healthcare space, probably benefits the innovative product side, of your whole ecosystem. A

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

that.

Nathan C:

Awesome. So we're talking about impact. let's talk about the future. Let's talk about goals. So, the glow up, the title of this podcast is The Glow Up, right, which is a notable transformation, a rebirth, a leveling up. So in the next six months or a year, what is the vision that you have, for Flow and your work in this digital wellness space?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

So my vision is in the next six months, we're going to get some great. proof of concept for Flow in healthcare and in rehabilitation. And that's going to help us to really crack into the American and Canadian market, the North American market, where I think we have a great home. I also think that the UK market is quite ripe for Flow. So, those areas and, We also have some, legs in the Nordics. We love the Nordics. We're kind of a Nordic brand and Nordic. We love it. We love those places. we have friends. We have friends here.

Nathan C:

There's such interesting pockets of XR innovation. The Nordics is one. The NHS healthcare system in the UK is actually pretty forward. They're working on policy way ahead of The U. S. and others around how to implement these tools. So, while sort of smaller and more, bifurcated, trifurcated, pockets you're in and amongst a lot of great innovation in that space.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Yes. So that's going to be Exciting to get those first, really significant contracts in those areas. And just such a great, kind of a homecoming feeling also for me, because I'm originally from California. I live in Iceland. I love this country. This is where I gave my soul birthed Flow because I'm completely surrounded by nature and it's amazing. It's an amazing country. So they've never had a military, it's peaceful. It's really stunningly beautiful. it's very, nurturing.

Nathan C:

your values are aligned with your location,

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Yes. So Iceland is going to become one great big spa. In the healthcare space, one of the questions that often gets asked is that the user of a technology may not necessarily be the customer of the technology, may not necessarily be the Payor for the whole program.

Nathan C:

as you think about the healthcare space in your equation, where are you targeting? who is your market? Is it health systems, like hospital networks? Is it payors, like insurance companies? many of which have, bits and pieces of wellness tools and apps? where's your focus within that space?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Well, I'm just kind of putting it out there. I'm going to be going to an innovation summit in Canada shortly, in next month, I mean, I think that it's kind of like about getting those key stakeholders. And seeing is believing, get the headset on their head and get them to see the possibilities. Cause that's what happened when I, in here in Innovation Week in Iceland, I met some folks from Canadian Healthcare System and they were like, we see so many possibilities with this. So following up and, and then, but just really getting Flow into the right hands means you kind of need to be in the right place at the right time, going to those right trade shows and trusting, yeah, your gut the burning question is, is who's going to pay for this, right? Who's got it in their interest to do that? Well, I think in the longer run, it's going to be the insurers and the healthcare systems, they will be in their interest because it's going to save them a lot of stress and time and money. However, until they get there, Flow has been being funded by some foundations, like charities. They want to take care of the people who are going through healthcare and make sure they have a good experience. And so, that's kind of where it comes from in the initial stage, I think.

Nathan C:

I appreciate the complexity of that question, right? it benefits everyone. from the workforce, to the office, to the home, to the community, to the incarcerated population, for those of us who have felt the impact of having that rest, that moment of being okay, a bit more focus, less agitation, yeah. That kind of value permeates, but who, who wants to own it, who wants to be the flag bearer is a very interesting question. And In the U. S., right, like, we're still battling about, like, is healthcare really, like, a human right? And so, we often have to have, major problems to fix in order to move anything and, and the stress and fatigue and worry that, the coronavirus pandemic brought to the U. S. I think unlocked healthcare as a conversation just in general, like, shit, everybody got depressed and like, wow, you know, things are hard. Oh, my God, what happened to all the school age kids who, you know, there's like 25 percent absenteeism across the entire country. It's directly related to a health care crisis and lack of support. And so, being able to have services that are multichannel, that meet people in many modes, right, like, is going to be a part of, the care of the future, but actually getting it into people's hands, getting people to care about it, does feel like a gigantic challenge. Let's talk about success. like part of. a founder's journey and a success of a founder's journey is this end goal, right? the thing that the north star that keeps you moving every day, even when, nothing feels like it's working or everything feels like it's working. So, how do you know as a founder who's been on a journey for some time that you've made it, that your ideas made it, that, Flow was a success.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

I have this vision that 10 percent of the population of Iceland is using Flow. Because we're going to have it on TV and it's the mobile app. And it's like, you learn about it on the planes, you know, going to and from Iceland, it's being promoted, it's on the radio, it's on the TV. And I was like, okay, so Icelanders are meditating and the kids are benefiting from it at the schools. And it's also, you know, something that you can access in various places where you need it the most, like in rehab or hospitals. So, that's going to be amazing because Iceland has become the nation for meditation. And like, it's such a beautiful concept. And then, of course, it's going to be, so the idea being Flow is significant player in the meditation technology space, kind of like shoulder to shoulder with Headspace and Calm. We're not biggest, but we're among the best.

Nathan C:

My, idea radar totally got lit up when you said, Flow is going to be on airplanes. The idea, right? There's so many, like, old, uninteresting touch screen apps that, like, poke the back of the person in front of you on those planes these days. And there's so many people that I see on online joking about watching the progress bar of the plane flying across the ocean, right? Like the idea that you could take 20 minutes in that really stressful, crowded, noisy environment and just lower your stress level. Or maybe even, you know, the flight attendants or the pilot gets on and helps you do it. together so the whole plane is in sync, like, I'm mad, I'm, I'm mad about this

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

breathing.

Nathan C:

let's get everybody on planes, doing some breath work together.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Oh my

Nathan C:

be a little bit nicer?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Absolutely. I think it's going to happen in the next five, ten years. It's happening.

Nathan C:

That feels like it could happen in six months, but

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Yes. Now I'm with you.

Nathan C:

so Tristan, Thinking about the future, and this fantastic community of folks working in XR and innovation, what's something you're looking for? how can the community help and support your work?

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Thank you so much. I love this community. I was at the last AWE that was in Long Beach and I had such a good time. I just feel like every time I go to the AWE conference, I'm with my tech family, this international family. It's amazing. See the same great people again and again. it's such a vibrant, Diverse. I appreciate the community and I think we lift each other up. we help each other along the way and I am always open for, ways to reach, new places, new people. I'm always open for looking for strategic partnerships, that can help bring Flow to places where it's needed most, I'm definitely always kind of actively fundraising. That's just part of the founder's journey or just continual always fundraising and looking for Yeah, just like people who understand the vision, get the impact, what this can do, and want to see that to support the mission. So yeah, connect with me through LinkedIn. let me know if you've got some ideas on how we can collaborate, get Flow for your organization or for an organization, you know, would benefit the most. let's get the party started. Thriving. I would love it if more people would download the Flow mobile app and just play with it, experiment, make a playlist, use it before bed, take it with you on your drive to work, meditate with your eyes open on your walk with your dog or on your run. Go with the Flow.

Nathan C:

in the car with your eyes closed. not operate a motor

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

One of our 30 day challenges was just with the mobile app, not the VR app, and people were reporting that they were using the time to and from work to meditate, and they said, I've become a better driver, I'm much more patient, I'm more attentive, more mindful, and that was so great to hear that. So that's why I threw that one out there, but another way to use Flow is before bed. Amazing. Make yourself a playlist for before bed of like breathe and calm and focus and restore, and I've done that. And just cause completely knock you out. Take you to a deep state of sleep. Wonderful.

Nathan C:

that meditative sleep that you, the rest that you get from a meditative sleep is really quite amazing. idea 30 day challenge on building a new practice. Dr. Muhsinah Morris hosted a VR wellness challenge, and the goal was to go into VR to meditate, move, socialize, and then talk about it. I did, get into Meditate and play Beat Saber. And, I have, my anecdote for you on this, especially around this idea of Flow, is that by being in a challenge to go into Beat Saber and practice for 30 days, what happened was I started, I bought a couple new music packs that, like, I was excited about, I was eager to hear the songs, and they were fun to sort of, you know, Beat Saber is a game where you slice bricks with, you know, with, lightsabers, and it's kind of a facilitated dance, you know, your body

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

Totally. That's amazing.

Nathan C:

I could get to a state of Flow using the motion, the rhythm, the facilitated movement, that started to feel really good and started to actually slow the levels down. And I did, and I had to level up, like, go to the harder settings because I had kind of slowed time down a little bit and the levels felt easier, I had this persistence and now I only play on this higher level. It's not the expert plus, but I am playing on pretty expert and, It's the only way I like to play now. And it was practicing connecting with my body and being in a state of flow leveled in this game. But then it planted the seed that I'm mad about. And I'm so glad I get to share it with you. It planted the seed of if some practice and regular engagement with an idea can slow the speed of things and help me level up. What else should I start leveling up on? And what else should I sort of apply this 30 day challenge or this mindful engagement and practice to? And, that's a lot of what led me to launch Awesome Future and the new strategic initiatives and consulting agency that I'm building today. And it is this connection. to my body, to movement, and this feeling of being in a creative flow. So,

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

How cool is that? That's so

Nathan C:

Beat Saber.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

I see Beat Saber as a form of meditation, absolutely, because I've been meditating since the year 2000 with a lot of movement. That's what I wanted to see coming into the space. Not just like sitting, not just mindfulness, not just quiet everything and listen to everything. move, you know, get going, let your blood pump, let yourself sweat and get into that Flow. It's a great space.

Nathan C:

us, you know, who have been resistant to meditation, especially ADHD brains that are always kind of vibrating, that the idea of like, sitting and being quiet any amount of relaxing just feels horrible. It feels like a death. An challenge.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

too.

Nathan C:

And the idea that, like, you could get focus, that you could feel in the groove, that you could center your thoughts on dance and, like, slicing bricks. Beat Saber as a business tool.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

This can help your business to thrive. Go into the Flow web portal or the app and do the move and let go meditations and test those out and see how you feel. You're not in the battlefield, which is really cool. I love that. But what you are is you're in your internal world. the music is very carefully selected to get you shaking and moving and just getting into this feeling of freedom, you know, like a freedom of expression of just allowing yourself to. Move like you have never moved before. move like an animal or move like the wind, move like the water and just break out of the box and be loose, get loose. It's really

Nathan C:

Get Get connected with your body. get in the present moment and get All of the benefits that a clear, quiet, calm mind can bring you. Tristan, it has been such a fantastic conversation today. I love hearing this vision, such a concrete vision of making, interactive meditation so every day that 10 percent of the country that you're living in is going to be using it on a regular basis. Thank you I love, this passion for bringing, new modalities and a little bit of new age thinking into prisons, into hospitals, into businesses, and, That you're really measuring the impacts of this technology so that you can tell the story in a way that resounds with your customers and helps other people get interested in these new ways. Learned so much and so inspired from our conversation. Thank you so much.

Tristan Elizabeth Gribben:

This is such a joy to have time with you. And to share with the community. Much gratitude.