Building an Ecosystem of 3D Tools to Empower Creators - Thaisa Yamamura

With over a decade in XR and a career that began in marketing and product development, Thaisa Yamamura is dedicated to bridging the gap between complex engineering and creative user needs, bringing innovative 3D, XR, and spatial computing technologies from prototype to market.

Thaisa Yamamura is the Head of XR Products and Business Development at Sony Electronics, where she leads the creation and launch of XYN, Sony’s new end-to-end ecosystem of 3D tools for creators. 

Key Takeaways:

• End-to-End 3D Ecosystem: Thaisa spearheaded the launch of XYN, a suite of creator-first tools including easy 3D capture (using Gaussian splatting, iPhone & Sony cameras), real-time motion capture (mocopi sensors), and high-resolution glasses-free 3D spatial displays—a pipeline designed to bring 6DoF content creation to professionals and beginners alike.
• Customer-Obsessed Product Development: From conducting on-the-ground CES research to incorporating real user feedback (like PC streaming for mocopi), Thaisa’s approach is deeply user-driven and iterative, often involving direct partnerships with engineers, the creative community, and early adopters.
• Versatile Applications: The XYN ecosystem not only supports creators in entertainment and gaming, but is already impacting industries such as virtual production and healthcare (e.g., using Sony’s Spatial Reality Display to view medical DICOM files in true 3D).
• Collaboration & Partnerships: Thaisa advocates for leveraging industry partners and existing tech—rather than “solutioning” for its own sake—to deliver integrated, rapidly evolving products. She sees her role as “the messenger and connector,” translating user insights into engineering action and aligning stakeholders for maximum impact.
• Empowering Women in Tech: As one of the only women at the table for much of her career, Thaisa is committed to mentoring globally and creating more opportunities for women in XR and tech—while celebrating her diverse, women-led team at Sony.

Thaisa’s current focus is on gathering feedback for XYN’s spatial capturing solution and broadening its real-world adoption from virtual film sets to next-gen indie content, with plans for expanded collaboration and community engagement in the near future.

About Thaisa Yamamura - Sony Electronics. 

Thaisa Yamamura is the Director of XR Business and Product Development for Sony Electronics, with a career spanning over 20 years across Brazil, Japan, and the United States. She currently leads XR initiatives from Los Angeles, focusing on immersive technology,  strategic product and business development.

She played a central role in launching the new 3DCG solution XYN™ (/zin/)—an integrated software and hardware platform that supports the creation of spatial content. Thaisa introduced XYN™ on the main stage at Sony CES 2025, mar

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Transcript

Nathan C: 0:00

Hello and welcome to The Tech Glow Up Fabulous Conversations with Innovative Minds. I'm Nathan C, and today I'm talking with Thaisa Yamamura, Head of XR Products and Business Development at Sony Electronics. Thaisa, it is so great to see you today. Thanks for joining us on The Tech Glow Up!

Thaisa Yamamura: 0:19

Thank you so much, Nathan, for having me. I know I'm excited to be part of the, the podcast. I've seen some of the episodes and I'm super glad to, to be here and speaking to you as my friend! It's gonna be an easy conversation we've known each other for quite some time for now.

Nathan C: 0:37

So I've had the pleasure, like you noticed, to really follow your work for a while, leading XR products and business development at Sony Electronics. Can you introduce yourself and give us a, a little summary about the work that you're doing there now? It's just so fascinating!

Thaisa Yamamura: 0:54

I'm the head of business development and product for a new brand called XYN. We announced this new brand at CES, which I was part of the, the announcement. It's really to focus on the XR solutions and develop a complete, end-to-end solution for content creators from capturing until motion, motion capture, and then seal the work in 3D. So I'm heading that product and solution for Sony Electronics for the past five years.

Nathan C: 1:29

Oh my goodness! I'm gonna have to push you on a couple things here because I think you underplayed a couple, like just a couple things in that introduction. So, when you said you helped to launch the XYN line at At CES, Sony had a gigantic presence with like an entire hall worth of fantastic demos. And I believe, if I'm correct, you actually helped to introduce XYN on stage as part of the Sony keynote?

Thaisa Yamamura: 2:02

Yes! I was very excited with this opportunity. I remember joining my first CES about 15 years ago and looking at the Sony press conference and looking. And imagine like, oh my gosh, this is amazing! It's like the biggest consumer electronic show in the world, right? And, now, 15 years later, imagining myself giving this speech, it was just an amazing experience. And launching something that I'm really passionate about. I love XR. I think we share the same passion, Nathan, on the community. So with such a special project and being able to be there on this stage and introducing this new brand, that really makes sense for me and for the community itself. Because I've been in this field, over 10 years. And, looking at how the XR has been evolving, it's been truly amazing to be part of, these announcements and showcase, what we've been working on very hard, on bringing to the market and really helping creators to, focus on the creativity and allowing them to bring tools that will optimize their work, so that they can focus on something that is important for them, which is the creativity. So let us handle the technology and the hassles behind that. And, let them focus on what they do the best, which is, the creative work. And it's always amazing to see what they can create. Right? I think, the beauty of technology is really to see how, the creators will push the boundary. What we provided to, to them. So being part of, of the announcements with, amazing people, with amazing team and, being able to be on the stage and talk about XR. It was really like a dream come true. I think it was one of, the best, part of my career and one of the biggest achievements, I was really, really happy on doing it. One

Nathan C: 4:17

of the other things that I wanted to get into, right, just,'cause not everybody, like you said, is as geeky about XR creator tools and like what 3D animators, graphics people need. I'd love to kind of just dive into this ecosystem, a little bit because you kind of alluded right? It's been a bit of a journey. So one of the things that I love about XYN is that you've captured probably like somewhere between three to five of the biggest trends and like, kind of tools and media types in 3D and spatial computing today, right? You've got this capture, but you're using 3D Gaussian splatting, there's like design tools in, this fantastic headset. And then there's these like design and collaboration tools within The Spatial Reality Display where you're being able to interact with and see 3D content, without glasses. You didn't start with an elegant product line that goes end-to-end. Talk us through the

Thaisa Yamamura: 5:26

Mm-hmm.

Nathan C: 5:26

how you got to here?

Thaisa Yamamura: 5:28

Yeah, it always started, seven years ago when I was, usually we go to headquarters, to Japan once or twice a year. And, we see the products that we are gonna launch in the next two to three years. Really like the early stage of the technology. I remember going to Japan for the first time seeing our Spatial Reality Display. It was like this mind blowing magical box. And I was like, how this can be possible technology wise. So the Spatial Reality Display is one of the product that it's on, on our lineup, which is a glasses-free 3D display. It has a sensor in the center of the display that senses the position of your face and eyes. Based on your viewing angle, it adapts the image for you to see images in 3D without any spatial glasses or VR headset. So I got exposed for the first time and I saw this demo, it was a Unity demo, like a dancer, an animation. How can this be possible? What is my brain doing? And then being able to talk to the engineers and see how can we bring this to the market because, this is the solution for people like me that uses glasses. I like the experience of wearing a VR headset, but I don't like the experience wearing it on top of my, my glasses. So this is, was like a magical box for me. I'm like, I'm seeing 3D and not just like the 3D movies that we seen in the theater, right? It's like the huge spatial experience. The immersive experience. It's very, very high resolution 3D. So two years later, we launched this product in the market. Unfortunately it was during the pandemic. We showcased the Spatial Reality Display, and then a month after CES, the world stopped, right? With the big pandemic. 3D is really for people who are not in this space, it's very hard to explain like how you see depth and how you have this immersive experience. Because the experience that the general public have of 3D is really like the movie theaters, right? That just one single object is in 3D. Not the whole, environment, which is totally different from what we were delivering. So it was a little bit of a challenge, launching this product, during the pandemic, but we were able to, bring a lot of developers. We were, a lot of companies who are interested and understood the beauty, and the importance of 3D. I always tell people, for me, it doesn't make sense that we are still working on a 2D screen since the world is in 3D. Right? We wanna change that! Yes. We wanted to change that perspective for not only the people who are passionate about the 3D world, but also for the general consumer. So based on our experience with the Spatial Reality Display, we realized quickly that there are not so many contents that are in 3D. And what I mean by 3D is like 6DoF, right? To be able to have that experience and whole scenario in, 3D and we were like, okay, how can we change that? And that's how we, we've launched XYN, because we wanted to bring the whole experience from content creation for helping, the general consumers, creators to, easily create the environment in 3D, as well as the physical objects. So the spatial, capturing solution solves exactly that problem. So you can connect, an iPhone to a mirrorless camera from Sony. We have an application that guides you on how many photos you need to take of the environment or the object. We uploaded those images on our cloud and we processed those images to recreate the environment or the object for you to see in 3D to be used on a headset or on a project, or in Unreal or Unity, any of the tools that you are, familiar with. So once you build the environment with our spatial capturing solution. We were like, okay, that's the first step. You have the environment, you have the object that you captured. How can we add motion to it? How can we add either like a character to be running around the environment or, how you can use like with a human, to be walking around and having this experience into the scenario and the scene that you captured. So we have our mocopi, our motion capture device, which is pretty affordable comparing to what is available, in the market. You don't have to wear any suits or any, you don't have to have a studio to be able to capture your movements. So mocopi is like the six sensors that you attach to your body and allows you to preview your body motions in real time and translate that into your animation or avatar. So you can add as part of the XYN, you add that motion to your project. Once you have the environment, you added the motion, how do you see and experience that your work in 3D with a very high resolution? That is when it comes the Spatial Reality Display that allows you to see the images or your project have a pre visualization of what you're creating. The XYN is really the complete solution for content creators in the 3D world. So we are providing easy tools that can be used on creating the project. And it fits not only like the people who have no experience creating assets in 3D, but also like the professional use cases. You know, the beauty about our technologies, we can meet, the demand for, high-end professionals who have experience, but also the early adopters who are starting to create projects in 3D. So those are the projects and solutions that we have under our XYN brand. And then the two that are available right now in the market are the mocopi, which we have two versions. Because you mentioned like, how do you get feedback from customers? Most of our products were created because they asked and we saw the demand and the need to create such a product. So after the Spatial Reality Display, we've launched mocopi. The first generation was just the six sensors and pretty, as I mentioned, very easy, very intuitive. You can, carry it on your pocket to start doing your animations. It connects to a phone, it pairs with a phone, and then you can animate your avatar, very seamless. You can do it outside, inside whenever you wanted to. The first generation was six sensors. And then at CES we, announced that together with the XYN brand, the second generation, which allows you to combine two sets of mocopi. You have a set of, a pair with the 12 sensors that allows you to have a better accuracy. We've noticed that especially indie game developers who wanted to have a better accuracy, with the first generation of mocopi, they were like, how can I add more sensors? Can I pair 2 sensors, two cases into one? We were like, great! That's what we are gonna allow! Let's, solve this issue, and come up with a product that you can combine. And one of the other, feedback was, they don't wanna connect it to a phone. Some people think that it's very nice to be able to connect when they wanted to record animations outside, but they also wanted to have a combination of recording the data on your PC, sending the motion data directly to your PC. So that's exactly what we did. We came up with a solution that you can combine two sets and you can stream live motion data to your PC directly. So that solved the accuracy and it's still less expensive than wearing a motion capture suit. And the calibration. I don't know if you have seen any motion capture studio, but it requires a lot of, calibration process, like T-pose and yeah! And we wanted to solve that. We wanted to be as simple and quick as as possible. So the calibration is very easy. It's just. You know, wear your, your mocopi sensors and do one step forward and then that's it. Like you are fully calibrated. It's less than a minute. It's very, I have a, a four years old daughter that she loves wearing it! And she's like, learn it very quickly! I'm like, okay, if my four years old daughter can do it you know, the people like that don't have any experience on motion capture can see it, can do it. And it's amazing to see, when we go to events and the reaction of the public saying, oh my gosh, how can this be possible?! We don't even need to, invest in, a very expensive, studio to be able to capture those motions. And the good thing is everything is in real time. If you're using, Unity or Unreal or Maya or Blender, we have a plugin that sends the motion data directly to your project in real time. So, you can preview your animation and customize your animation according to your preference. The pair of the XYN is just like$450, which, you know, it's more than half of the price of the suits that are available, in the market.

Nathan C: 15:30

This is amazing! Thaisa, you read my mind and predicted a couple of the things that I just wanna dive deeper on. One of my favorite questions to ask is about how you learn from your customer. And you have a very interesting group of customers that you're needing to learn from and work with and engage. And I sort of counted three. The first customer group that you talked about were the engineers and the developers that you were partnering with. And I loved, I just to go all the way back to this origin story of how can we take this to market? I love that the beginning of this journey starts with a cross team partnership to talk with developers and learn and build a vision for where things can go. Like, that's super cool! As a leader of business development and product lines, you're also having to telegraph and learn from the industry, from the events, from, you know, there's a very interesting customer group in terms of like the creative side of Sony, that you get to learn with. But like, how do you tell that innovation story, that 3D creator story to executives of a global technology company, and then all the way back down to the floor at CES interacting with the frontline consumers and folks who are gonna be powering their VR chat avatars and their online gameplay and, maybe their own independent films as well. To be able to balance so many, customers and so many inputs and, still have such an elegant solution, like bravo!

Thaisa Yamamura: 17:17

Thank you! I always tell people that, I'm a messenger. I talk to a lot of companies. We have a lot of partners, that work with us. I try to get, what is the latest in the market. I love talking to developers, to the engineerings to see what can we solve? Like what are the problems they are facing? How can we solve bringing together the engineering side? So I'm passing the message of what the market needs to the engineering and say, okay, how can we build something that solves this issue and provide, different tools for the market focusing on the creativity, as I mentioned in the beginning. So I always try to talk to as many people as possible creators from different industry. I mentioned the beauty of technologies really, we don't know what they are gonna create, right? We provide the tools and we sort of imagine that, they're gonna use the technology in one way. But the beauty about technology is that there are so many possibilities that, when you put this product and solutions in front of the creators, they come up with so many different solutions and use cases that they can use the product that you are not even imagining. One example, when we launched the Spatial Reality Display, when I was at CES during one year, right before the pandemic in 2020. I was on the floor and I love being on the floor, to hear, the reaction of the people and talking, getting their brains and pick their brains and talk to them and asking questions. I love that part of research. It helps me to understand the customer point of view. So I was there, on the floor hearing and getting their feedback. And I remember, this customer and this person talking about, oh, this display is great for medical. And I'm like, medical, how would you, how would you use it on the medical field? He's like, oh, I have a lot of DICOM files that are in 3D and I'm like, oh, okay! So how can we and medical field that healthcare industry was not really our focus, for the display, but I remembered him saying, no, you should definitely, I have a solution for 3D, to see DICOM files, DICOM is a very, common file format for a CT scan, So I was like, oh, that's so interesting. Like to be able, because nowadays when you see a CT scan is 2D, but the doctors, when they're performing a surgery, they need to have this depth, this perspective. So I was like, oh, we should definitely study this market and have a better understanding. And we look into the market, I found some a company, that are doing some solutions that can translate DICOM files into 3D files that were compatible with our Spatial Reality Display. So it was like, oh my gosh, this is the perfect combination to address the need for this market. So that's, an example of, things that we were not even thinking about. And then we got this idea by, showing the technology in front of people. And they gave us this feedback and, this idea to focus on this market.

Nathan C: 20:36

Development is hard. Integrating products, partnerships is hard, but the solution, you know, that they presented you is effectively like, give me a pathway, make it easy for me to use the stuff that I already have in a better way with your tool, right? Like you don't have to invent a new thing.

Thaisa Yamamura: 20:59

Yeah.

Nathan C: 20:59

You don't have to build a new file type for medical imaging, right? It's like, let me help you build this pathway, to something you don't even know about, right? But let me just help you use what you already have with a little bit, more skill or, you know, there's the 2D to 3D thing is like, it's such a no brainer, right? Like if you are a 3D designer. Like, don't you wanna see what you're building

Thaisa Yamamura: 21:24

Yeah.

Nathan C: 21:25

in 3D? Right? Like, if you are a doctor who's operating in 3D, don't you want that extra dimensions worth of like information?

Thaisa Yamamura: 21:34

Yeah!

Nathan C: 21:34

And to be able to make it so accessible is just gorgeous.

Thaisa Yamamura: 21:38

Yeah, no, and hearing like physicians, when they look at the display, they said, you know, this solves a lot of problems when teaching students, because one of the hardest thing to teach is the sense of depth. Right? How deep they can go and what is the distance between one organ and the other, like that type of sensibility, and skill, it's very hard, but, you know, technologies like our display make it easier for them to understand, to train their brains, about, you know, that sense, that skill, that it's so important in that field.

Nathan C: 22:14

You said something about how like the research and data and consumer like insights are key to how you approach your work. You know, I come from a marketing background, so you're speaking my language, but I also know that not every organization values research and data in the same way. Can you talk about, navigating, a large organization and being, the messenger of data and user insights, and, what sort of skills you've needed, to help, make that so core to the work that you do?

Thaisa Yamamura: 22:50

Yeah. I'm lucky that I also came from the marketing side. I started my career 25 years ago, and it was really in marketing. And one of the most important thing is you have to hear your customers, right? Like, and I remember, before getting to the XR industry, I was doing product, marketing for TVs. I was able to launch the first smart TV in the market. I remember telling my manager, we usually do a lot of research, back in the days I used to do a lot of, house visiting. We would go to the customer house to study. Every details count. Where they position their remote control, where they place the tv, how they turn on the tv, like the usability, how they operate the product. Every single detail gives you a chance to change and provide unique experience for the product. And I always tell my team, you have to be in the shoes of your customers. What do they need? Ask questions, how they operate. Put the product in front of them, and how do they turn on the product? How do they connect the product? What type of contents they wanted to be, seeing in the product. So those are very detailed information, but these can turn into something really great. You can develop features that nobody thought about. How you place the product, how you are gonna design the product, and being able to translate that feedback by talking to your engineering to see what is possible. This is what I see. How can we solve this product using your skills, to be able to bring the best combination in the market. When I mentioned that I'm a messenger is really to be able to bridge this gap between what the market needs and what our engineering are capable of doing, right? Like, how can we solve this? Most of the time, there is no reason to involve our engineering to change the product. How can we bring solutions and partners that are already developing a technology or, a tool that bridge this gap, with the existing tools that we have available in the market. So how can we get our product and enhance that based on the feedback that we have from our customers using the partnerships that we already have in place, or if we don't have, how can we look for partners? Who are the partners? Who are the companies that are already working in this space? Most of the times we have to look into the market, what is available out there? If there is a company that it's doing amazing job, why not integrating with our products to provide the best combination? So that's the part of the product development that I work, to be able to bridge this gap between product, customer, and engineering. And the other hand is the business development. How we can bring partnerships that can enhance that without changing much about, the technology or the product that we already have. I always tell that I'm in the best position, but I'm always the connector, connecting product customer with the engineering team, and how can we bring new solutions into the market that can solve, the demand of our customers. And I'm lucky that we love hearing, customer feedback. We take it very, very serious. If there is a demand or if there is an issue, we solve it very, very quickly. We have this as our top priority.

Nathan C: 26:31

+1 to it is a benefit to being at a consumer obsessed company when you're trying to do innovation, like, oh my gosh! You're fighting only half as steep of a hill. This idea as well, that like you're leading with questions and that there is an assumption, that development may not be the answer, to make a more robust product, I think is like kind of shocking in the world of 3D. I've literally been in conversations with like Fortune leaders who were convinced that if their spatial experience wasn't completely photorealistic and specific one-to-one match that like people just wouldn't be into it. But it was still a tool that was like an XR tool that was actually selling product. It was like, you have a major win that nobody else has ever done, which is sell stuff with XR in the checkout process and that it's not 3D is like, maybe not the thing that the customer is focused on so, bravo for really listening, instead of, you know, what I call like"solutioning" what a customer might want. You know, like actually fulfilling what they ask for.

Thaisa Yamamura: 27:50

Yeah! And I always tell my team, we are in a unique position because, being in charge of product and business development, this market, it changes a lot, right? Nathan, you are in this industry, and sometimes you know what our customers wanted and our engineering, what our engineering can deliver, it takes time to develop and I'm like, why not getting like a partner that have already developed and, and bringing them together, to be able to provide this solution quickly to our customers. Right? That's the problem that we are solving, within the organization. You know, how can we change quickly to adapt it to the customers? What they need and what are the tools to enhance their work using our hardware or software. And I always tell my team, you know, put yourself in the shoes of the customer. Is this what they need? What are the feedback that we receive? Not your personal opinion. What are the exactly words that they said in terms of feedback? Let's translate that into what it really means in terms of technology. What do we need to provide? One of the, the main tasks for our team is to be the translator, and connector.

Nathan C: 29:04

Oh my gosh! Fantastic leadership, right? When a solutioned approach would be to say, our customers want this. Go build it. Right? An empowering leader's approach is to say, here's the problem I want you to go solve. Really solve the problem. Like, wow! So we set up this fantastic seven year journey with this product and building and growing and adding. The name of the podcast is the Tech Glow Up, right? Which is a notable transformation, a rebirth, sort of a coming of age. I use it to talk about big goals. Having built this product line and built so much insights and to have aligned with your customers, seems like fantastic success. But what's the six month goal that you're working on? How are you gonna top this, record setting year?

Thaisa Yamamura: 29:57

Yeah! We are very excited with our spatial capturing solution. It was announced at CES, but it's still a prototype. Soon we are gonna bring back access to, the public. Which we are very excited because again, we wanted to get feedback on ways that we can improve how customers are using it. We already have collaborations, in place, but I think in the next six months we really wanted to get feedback from our people. So we are gonna start giving back the access for this solution so they can really test and, push the limit of the technology, provide us feedback and see what they need and, what we can improve to provide the best solution, for their work. So really focusing on that area of the business. Because without content, without 3D, good high quality 3D content, you cannot start a project, right? You cannot create a 3D, project without this base. And we, we were able to showcase in different tech conferences the work that we've done. The environments that we've scanned and the object that we scanned. The feedback was really nice. I was at SIGGRAPH last week. People were very excited. They were like, oh, I wanted to try this! So wait a little bit longer. It's coming soon! This is gonna be my team's focus on bringing that to the market. We will start with Beta access and then move it to the market soon.

Nathan C: 31:32

Amazing! I know so many people, designers, developers, photographers, drone pilots, who are just obsessed around 3D capture and whatever the next innovation in 3D, and splatting may be. You were talking about environments, I realized that I was paying attention mostly to objects. I'm gonna have to go back and check my notes. That's amazing!

Thaisa Yamamura: 31:59

Yeah, no environments, especially like for virtual production, a lot of entertainment companies are now using virtual production. Our technologies is perfect for creating the background, for the virtual production.

Nathan C: 32:12

Like The Mandalorian kind of?

Thaisa Yamamura: 32:14

Yeah, and it looks very realistic. We have a location, here in LA called the DMPC. And Nathan, if you're ever in LA, please let me know! I would love to give you a tour there. They have these virtual production sets and I was able to bring my team and they were like,"Oh my gosh, this is perfect!" We scan some spaces in Shibuya in Tokyo, and they're like,"Oh my gosh, this feels like in Japan!" And if you look at our reference monitors, you cannot tell it's virtual production. It's so realistic! My team, they were very impressed. They know the technology and they're like, oh my gosh, this is, now I get it. Like, why we're we are doing this! Because it looks really realistic!

Nathan C: 32:57

It's also like super telling at how complex the ecosystem is.

Thaisa Yamamura: 33:02

Yeah.

Nathan C: 33:02

Like if you're working on the tool and can still be amazed by what it can do when some other person, you know, puts it through what their part of the, that value and production chain is. So amazing! We like to make time for a spotlight or a shout out for somebody that's doing good work, whether it's a nonprofit or impact org or creator that you're just obsessed with. Is there anybody that you'd like to share a spotlight with today?

Thaisa Yamamura: 33:29

Yeah! So I collaborate a lot with the VR/AR(VRARA) community, the association. They are great. I think they are pushing this market. And we love to collaborate with them on how we can support, bringing the XR world into more creators and more developers. And I think they do a really good job, but also, you know, not naming any specific, community specific, but I'm really focused on also bring, how can we bring more women or girls into the tech world? I always try to, set up, at least five hours of my time within the month to dedicate about, mentorships, especially for my home country in Brazil. And I mentor some people in Japan as well. So how can we bring more women into this space? I'm proud also to have my team, a lot of amazing women that are creating a lot of amazing technology and, I'm really proud of that. Most of the time within my career, I was the only woman sitting at the table and I'm like, which we have to change that. Right? And I have to be part of the group that we will change it. Like how we can, bring more people to, provide tools for those women to be in the tech world.

Nathan C: 34:52

I'm gonna let that sit. That's just gorgeous. And thank you for that! Bravo for, in many cases, being the first woman, to bring some of these products to market. You know, bringing products to market like this for a company the size of Sony, building these kinds of partnerships, right? Learning from users, whether they're an enterprise that's trying to make movies or whether it's, you know, a bunch of teenagers who were trying to make movies. It doesn't matter where the studio is, right? This dedication to building conversations around what is possible I think is absolutely got to be the strategy that has, helped you build these partnerships, bring people along, let them discover what they see in the data. And really push both long-term strategic thinking with that, what are the optimized, ambitious things we can do today to really answer the questions that we're getting. Just like a epic, masterclass in how to think about a product and build over time, while you learn and grow. Like an amazing example of, product led leadership for The Tech Glow Up. Thaisa, I really cannot thank you so much! I do need to make sure to ask, how can people follow up? And is there anything, do you have a call to action or anything that you're looking forward to?

Thaisa Yamamura: 36:19

Yes, yes! Yeah, please feel free to connect, via LinkedIn. I'm Thaisa Yamamura there. Follow our page. It's XYN, X-Y-N. We have a dedicated website. We have a LinkedIn page. On our website we have all the solutions. You can sign up for the newsletter. We are always here to hear the feedback and get connected. If you have an idea or if you have a opportunity to collaborate a partnership, me and my team, we are always open to hear, especially new ideas. So please, follow us on our social media and, feel free to connect!

Nathan C: 36:59

Oh my goodness! I think we just have to leave it there. Absolutely one of my heroes and a total boss woman in spatial computing. Thaisa Yamamura, thank you so much for sharing your journey and innovation on The Tech Glow Up!

Thaisa Yamamura: 37:14

Thank you for having me! I appreciate it.