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The Heritage Show: Legacy in Action: Freda Bussey MBE on Leading, Coaching, and Growing the Sport
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Welcome back to The Heritage Show! After a well-deserved summer break, we’re recharged and ready to dive into another incredible season celebrating the people who’ve shaped volleyball in the UK.
In this episode, I sit down with true volleyball legend Freda Bussey, MBE – a powerhouse who’s been growing the game for over 40 years.
We explore Freda’s journey from her early playing days representing England on the world stage, to her time as a PE teacher at Ashcombe School, where she began coaching and eventually playing for the very team she led. We talk about the unique role of the player-coach, her long-standing work as a coach tutor for Volleyball England, and her passion for supporting new coaches.
Freda is the founding force behind Ashcombe Volleyball Club, established in 1976 – a club that’s still going strong today. She shares her wisdom on running a successful club, the commercial mindset it takes, and how the iconic Ashcombe Grass Tournament helped fund national league success and title-winning teams.
Still deeply involved in the sport, you’ll now find Freda refereeing at the University of Sussex with her husband, and continuing to make an impact through her roles in the Sussex and South East Volleyball Associations.
Awarded an MBE in 2013 for her services to volleyball, Freda is the definition of a doer – someone who simply gets things done and makes things happen.
A brilliant conversation with a true volleyball icon.
Let’s get into it.
Connecting Through Conversation
Thank you. That Volleyball Guy Hello. I'm Luke Wiltshire, host of that Volleyball Guy, and if you love volleyball as much as me me, then you're in the right place. That Volleyball Guy Hello and welcome back to that Volleyball Guy podcast in partnership with Volleyball England. And, like I said, welcome back.
Speaker 1:I've had a summer break, I've enjoyed a holiday to Thailand and we're now back in the flow of things ready for the upcoming season. Been lots of volleyball happening, whether that be on the beach scene, with the Weymouth Classic Tournament or the Cardiff Open grass tournaments such as Whitfield, cambridge, ashcombe and teams getting ready for the National League. It is a really exciting time to be involved in volleyball and I fully rested, ready to go again and ready for another fantastic season of volleyball. And I'm really delighted to be back with you to record a special episode of that volleyball guy podcast, a heritage episode, with a really, really special guest, and I know, I know already that we're not gonna have enough time to cover all the things I want to talk about with this very special guest. I've known this person for a very long time and, uh, sending over some bullet points to me for this conversation, I thought I knew this person well, but I learned so much just through an email with some bullet points, so I am absolutely excited for this conversation and I know you're thoroughly going to enjoy it. So my special guest then for the Heritage Show awarded MBE for service to volleyball in 2013.
Speaker 1:She has 94 caps for England from 1972 to 1981, started the Ashcombe Volleyball Club in 1976, which continues to be a powerhouse of volleyball today. She's coached national championship winning teams. She's been a course tutor for Volleyball England coaching for the last 40 plus years. She's a former board member and played a crucial role at the London 2012 Games in the Beach competitions. It's my absolute pleasure to welcome Frida Bussey to the podcast. Frida hello.
Speaker 2:Hello, hello Luke.
Speaker 1:I was saying we were chatting just before we pressed record that your list of achievements and all the things you've done in volleyball is just huge. I'm sure I'm struggling to think there'll be other people with such a big list I think.
Speaker 2:I think I have a big problem in that if something's there to be done, I tend to do it rather than not, so that's why the list is so big well, well, and and key to volleyball in this country.
Speaker 1:People like you and I'm thoroughly, uh, really, excited to have this conversation, um. Like I said I could, we could talk about so many different things, um, but I sort of want to start our conversation about, like I start all of the conversations, I guess, because I've I've got this theory, which is a lot of people find volleyball by accident, um, and I always like to ask every guest that I have on, whether that be the heritage show or the dig and deeper show um, how did you find volleyball?
Speaker 2:tell us more about how you got involved in our amazing sport yeah, by accident, there we go, um, I was training to be a p teacher at dartford college of physical education and, uh, in my year was, um, a volleyball player called wendy mattinson I'm still friends with now we still keep in touch my um year from dartford, um, and, uh, she was playing in the england squad coached by dave.
Speaker 2:Uh, no, she wasn't coached by dave pope. Dave pope was her club coach in um in liverpool and, uh, she started with one of the lecturers there, a club at the college, and we were all athletes. You know, before that I was a netball, hockey, tennis, gymnastics, swimming. You know I was one of those all-rounders, did everything, loved every sport, and volleyball, though, just hit it for me because it meant that I could jump, could jump, run, dive, do all the things that I did in all the sports in one sport and, like most people, by the time I played it for a month or two, I was completely hooked. And the other sports, I still did them, but went out the window in comparison.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's interesting when you're saying that all the sports you listed, you're right, they all do form parts of volleyball, right when you think about netball and there's a lot of similarities and crossovers and yeah, yeah, and I love gymnastic.
Speaker 2:You know I was a very keen gymnast and dancing, uh, but gymnastics was something that I'd loved and so the that really appealed to me. You know, the diving and the movements and the, the, the. Yeah, I loved it.
Speaker 1:So there it was my sport so what age were you when you found volleyball? Uh 19, yes, so yeah yeah, and there's a lot of sports, you know that. Talk about. You know, the earlier you can play, the better, but again, it's volleyball. It seems that a lot of people do fall into it accidentally, at college, university or socially, through friends or work. Yes, so so keen to sort of dig a little bit deeper on your playing, your playing days, then. So talk to me about your, your playing days and what that looked like.
Speaker 2:Clubs, and obviously you, as I mentioned earlier, you represented England and you had 94 caps, yeah, so tell us more about your playing days well, I um, after we finished at Dartford we were, we became college champions for England and several of us were selected to go to uh Indian trials. Um, and that would be. I'd only been playing two years, um, and uh went to the trials and got into the squad. And then, um, I started playing, for I was teaching in london for southgate. Southgate volleyball club was a real powerhouse of volleyball with uh, nicky kilkenny and joan last and others, and we won. For two years we won everything, every cup, everything going uh. It was a fabulous time.
Speaker 2:And then, um, I got the job in dorking at the ashcombe school. So I went for a club nearer to where I was, because it was a lot of traveling and it was all on the tube. You know, it was a nightmare really, um, but, um, I joined putney, which was a wonderful club actually, with mick warwick people will remember him really, he was the England men's manager at the time and it was a good, a good club. And that's where I met Ann Jarvis and Sandy Lister. We all played together there, um, and then I was teaching at the Ashcombe school and very quickly realized that these kids were so talented they would have been talented at any, any sport. I forced them into volleyball as well as everything else. And uh, they, um, yeah, within a year, we, we, you know I'd formed a proper club. We entered the london league I was still playing for putney. We entered the london league, uh, which we then won.
Speaker 2:Um and then, because there wasn't a league in Surrey at the time, and then we entered the National League the following year because three of the girls were then in the England Junior team. And then, against everyone's advice, I left the other clubs and played with my own team and then we won up to Division 1 and then we stayed there for the next 25-plus years in the top four in England. Yeah, winning everything through until well. The last time we won the double was the year 2000. We did the Cup and League double, which was fabulous.
Speaker 2:And then after that, you know, things changed. Times changed. My time changed as well, although I was still there running and doing lots with the club. I think volleyball changed. We had a lot of very, very good foreign players coming into the country, bringing volleyball with them as well, and we picked up on that a lot. We had a lot of good players playing for us from all over the world. But it did mean that I wasn't willing anymore to do the training, you know, two or three times a week and to lead everything else. And then, you know, other coaches came in and we started to go down the leagues. But actually I really enjoy it now Now that.
Speaker 2:Ashford's in Division 3, it's right for us. At the moment We've got the players that can play there comfortably. I think we will build up again and there will be, you know, an inertia and they'll want to go up to Division 2 again and so on. That's up to them. I'll just be there to do the paperwork for them.
Speaker 1:So many things in that sentence that I want to unpick. You talked about your playing days. Maybe just talk to us about your position on court and where you found the best. Where were you the most effective?
Speaker 2:Well, I started. I got selected to England as an outside hitter. I was a passer and hitter, you know. I got a very good jump. I was a real team player. I loved it playing as a four hitter. Within a year I was the setter and I couldn't even volley. Can I just tell you I could not volley. I didn't know what I was doing, but they would determine the coaches, and it was Mick Hibbert and Barry Swan that I would be the setter. We'd gone to play in france and cuba were playing um, like they do, like you do, and apparently the cuban coach said of our team he thought that I would make a good setter. So that was it. You know I was. I spent the next um several months with my fingers like this, uh, and I became the england setter for the next, uh sort of seven or eight years.
Speaker 1:So are you a born-again setter, or would you always be a four-hitter at heart?
Speaker 2:Well, my heart's always in hitting. I think I love being the team director as the setter and, of course, when I played back in those days, it was a two-setter system. So you did both. You know, know, you did both all the time. So, um, it was, yeah, it was great for me, I loved, I loved that doing. But then the one setter system came in, um, and I sometimes played opposite sometimes, but often just the lead setter um yeah, it was great and you mentioned about.
Speaker 1:So really interesting to hear about your transition for from Southgate and then to the Ashcombe school and playing with the athletes that you you know, and and and the athletes you were coaching, I guess. Um, you mentioned about spotting talent and giving and and pushing the, pushing the kids into volleyball, um, but there's so many people like you up and down the country that you know have got we've all got a lot to thank. I had someone similar who I know you know well, which is sue pierce yeah, like she didn't that squad with me, but yeah yeah, she pushed me into volleyball, and my brother and all of our friends in our school.
Speaker 1:So you know, yeah, there's a lot of people who've got you and people like sue pier Pierce, um, to thank. So, yeah, um, what about? So tell us for some of the listeners who, um, maybe newer to the sport, without mentioning names, maybe tell us, um, tell us about how maybe some of the coaching practices were slightly different back then.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, they were. We had some coaches in the England squad who really believed in the. I think it was very East European. You do a practice until you finish, until you die, really, until you get it right, just keep doing it. And you know, yeah, that was interesting times. You know that, yeah, that was interesting times. Um, we didn't um, we did a lot of learning through the drills, through and through the skills you know, not through the game um, which we, you know, as a coach educator, these days we do a lot more of learning through the game um. So we did do a lot of um continual same practice.
Speaker 1:You'll do it and, knowing your coach, educator role, which we'll come on to later, like I imagine, you look at that now and think, god, how did we do that?
Speaker 2:But things move on right, yeah, yeah, and unfortunately, I think I was very fortunate I had very few injuries, but that really did mean that some people had some injuries, you know, especially continual jumping with their knees, continual same path, same path back. You know shoulders and yeah. So hopefully we've moved away from those things now and, uh, people are much more prepared, um, and then learning by doing things rather than just continually wrong, which is what I think we did a lot of the time. It's a you know different attitude.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah and then um. So just to wrap up the bit around, your play, your playing days, so any sort of game or any sort of seasonal moment that you've looked back with the fondest memories. I'm sure there's loads, but what's been a highlight for you from a from a playing perspective?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think from for england, we used to go every year to I called it the spring cup, which was like a european championships for the slightly less teams, though there was always one or two of the top teams in it and it was at Easter every year and that competition was just the highlight. Every year we were so fortunate to go and play. So, you know, I'd play against Sweden, against France, italy, germany, you know top, top teams and, yeah, occasionally I think we beat Spain once. Once that was a highlight, uh, but often actually it was the england scotland games which we did every year. They were going to play, yeah, going to play in those playing in scotland where almost the court was surrounded by so many people. They were nearly on the court. You know that close because there were so many people. They were nearly on the court. You know that close because there were so many people and screaming girls you know, for you playing.
Speaker 2:Yeah good times.
Speaker 1:And a really tricky question, which was who was, and there may be a few, but I'll let you have maybe one or two, but the best players that you shared a court with.
Speaker 2:Chris Hazel. Chris Hazel, yeah, really, I'm still friends with her now. I saw her last year. Yeah, very, very talented, very talented player. God, now you start to. I don't so many, so many good players. Um, I think the thing about volleyball is that it's such a team game. You know, I find it difficult to think of individuals. I think more of the teams. I mean, ann jarvis was always just such a steadiest player you could imagine she could pass on a sixpence. She would serve in. When you needed someone to serve, toughen in.
Speaker 2:Well she wasn't a fantastic spiker or blocker. Wonderful defender.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Awesome.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sure.
Speaker 1:You probably.
Speaker 1:After we've finished recording, you'll probably think of other names that you didn't mention, I know, yeah so, um, like we said, I do really want to focus a lot on Ashcombe and your roles within club management, but before we do that, um, I think it would be unfair to to to not cover your role as a coach. Um sort of alluded to earlier around moving from southgate to the ashburn school and setting that up, so maybe tell us more about your transition from playing into coaching well, I still continue to play until I was 60, um, and uh, I actually, um, famously played in a super eight game when I was 60.
Speaker 2:I only went on and served and then came off again, but that was. That was well. Uh. Alex bialikos I was spoken with him about it and he was determined and he did it. Last year it was the year before he was he was determined to do it and he actually played, whereas I just went on and went off again did you.
Speaker 1:Before you carry on, though, did you get the serve in? Oh, I did. All right, I thought, I thought. I thought the answer would be yes, but yeah, that was good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, I think, um I was always a player coach because I was teaching at the school as well. So all of the players for the first five years or more Ashken were all pupils at the school.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And it was boys as well. We had quite a strong boys team and girls teams and we'd entered national championships and did really well quite quickly. But I soon realised that I needed to bring in other coaches just to give, give the players different ideas. And then, of course, I had my first child. And then you know so that your time then isn't your own. I can't possibly do two or three sessions a week and and, uh, bring up two children. Yeah, so well.
Speaker 2:I did a bit, but mostly it was good to get in and I've always been keen on that getting other coaches in to work with, so yeah, and then so as a player coach, because I'm sure lots of people listening will be.
Speaker 1:You know, either you know have been a player coach, or of considering it. What do you think the advantages are of being a player coach?
Speaker 2:well. I think mostly it's disadvantages. I don't really think it's a good idea. I did it almost because I had to. Yeah, and I would always step in as the coach if we didn't have a coach, but I would always try. I think it's almost impossible, almost impossible. It's like coaching taking part in your own coaching sessions. You know how can you look at what's going on if you're also one of the lead players. It's yeah, um, yeah. No, it's a difficult one, um. I've always done it as well though with the lower teams. I've tried to do that because then you can be the coach on court with them yeah, young players.
Speaker 2:Um, it's, it's great with young players. You can be there all the time.
Speaker 1:They probably get fed up with you because you're telling them what to do all the time but it is good yeah yeah, yeah and what would you and I I agree with you completely, by the way, as a coach myself, like I've tried to do the player coach role, and I I agree with you completely, by the way, as a coach myself, like I've tried to do the player coach role and I've had much more success when I finally admitted defeat and hung the shoes yeah you're like oh, that that's what happens at a training session. I didn't realize. Yeah, so coaching.
Speaker 1:Then, um, tell us more about your coaching philosophy and your style of coaching um because you've done it for a long time and you're very, very successful at new and you, you're, you're responsible for coaching some of the best junior athletes in this. You know that volleyball england have had for a long time, so tell us the secrets.
Speaker 2:Ah, I think I'm very sympathetic. I've been there myself so I think I know what they've gone through and what they're going through. Yeah, I think, being a PE teacher and learning how people learn, how people want to achieve, talking to your players, making sure you're on the same path with them Do you all want to get to this Nationals or do you want to just play some fun volleyball? And what can we do together I think that's very important to get there. I think that's very important to get there. I think I'd like my players to feel that we are working all together.
Speaker 2:I say look, my players. You know I'm still saying that now, but I'm still very good friends with so many of these players. You know, like Debbie Frost, who was in my first class, that I taught. There were three girls in that class and they were in the what's the equivalent now? Yeah, they would have been 14. And three of them in that class of 14 girls. It was a mixed class. Yeah, played for England. Top know, top players. Um, I think I recognize talent and I also never say that anyone's failing and won't do it. I've had players who look on me you think, no, never, they're never gonna do it, but let them come and enjoy two years, three years later they're, you know, one of your top players never, say never.
Speaker 1:I think as well that's again the pe teacher in me, I think you know wanting to nurture people, yeah and as a and as a coach educator, then then we talk about your role as a coach educator and support other coaches with coaching qualifications, where you know pearls of wisdom, and what advice do you have for people that are new to coaching about you know, where do you think new coaches get it wrong, because I'm sure you've seen it in your time, and what advice would you have?
Speaker 2:I think, get yourself on a course first of all. I think get yourself on a course, first of all Make sure that you get yourself basically qualified and then insured so that you are covering yourself. There's a lot to learn. In fact there's so much to learn. I find that when I'm taking the courses I don't know where to stop. I just want to tell them so much you know. But it seems I really enjoy doing that. Assistant starter coach course.
Speaker 1:It's a wonderful course.
Speaker 2:Volleyball England. Gillian has done a brilliant job on it and we just tweaked it again and it's some new things now and in fact I've just done a course and we had so many people wanted to come on it that carol gordon came with me as well, so we did a double course, um, and those people certainly got value for money. It was. It was a fantastic day, practical day, um. But I just think carol's like me. We just want to try and help people on their journey and give them enough, give them so, so much information.
Speaker 2:That's the problem that they can do what we've done and help these people enjoy volleyball. You know their volleyball career.
Speaker 1:Well, I think that hits you know, that's exactly that, isn't it? What you said about teaching as well is you know, if I think back and reflect on my days as a student and I always speak very fondly of the teachers you said about teaching as well, is you know, if I think back and reflect on my days as a student, I and I always speak very fondly of the teachers that had the experience, or the ones that you know and I know, and um, someone who went on that course, that course that you mentioned recently, who was very, very, very um, blown away by by it and just by the experience of you, and Carol Carol's been on this podcast as well. So, just sharing your knowledge and sharing your yeah, just sharing, and that's what this podcast is all around is about sharing more in our sport.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, yeah, so coaching then. So you're now involved with volleyball and still involved as a coaching educator yeah, you just alluded to that a little bit involved with volleyball and is, uh well, still involved as a coaching educator yeah, you just alluded to that a little bit. Tell us more about what that role is and and what the role is as a coach educator um, okay, so, um, I lead the assistant coaching course.
Speaker 2:Um, I have done the level two course as well, um, but I found that, um, I'm really my mind is much more into starting people on their journey rather than going in. I mean, I'm an FIVB level two coach myself and that was well, what an experience to do. That it's fantastic. But I did feel then even that that was not where my heart lies. It lies on getting people started in coaching, giving them the tools to get volleyball going in their small club, in their junior teams, in their school, whatever it is. So the level one sorry, not the level level one the assistant coaching course now is that real starter. It gives everybody the um child welfare information they need. The um keeping your club safe, uh, understanding how to do safe practices? Uh, it's not.
Speaker 2:You don't go on the course and learn loads of drills that's what some people want to this like, oh, I need, I need drills to get my players better at volleying or digging or doing. We've got bits of paper that shows them that and we do some practices, but really it's hands-on. How can they get better at coaching their players, uh, and helping them improve? So, um, it's, it's a great course. I've really enjoyed delivering it. You know, um, I've always enjoyed the. It was dave pope who got me involved straight away as soon as I was stopping playing volleyball seriously, because I had two young children. It's like, oh, now you can be a coach educator instead say, oh, can I? Yes, um and uh, that was it really there.
Speaker 2:I was suddenly, you know, doing it and I've always enjoyed, but back in those days we did teach it on the skills you know it's all now you volley yeah you volley till you need to dig and then you can dig a bit and then you play a game and then you fail and then all those things, um, so yeah, yeah, it's, it's very good on the the game based learning that we we encourage it does. Really, I think it really works.
Speaker 1:I really enjoy it and how have you then? So you know you, you've been doing it for a long time. Um, how have you kept? Because volleyball's changed. You know, for the people that are people that are new to the sport, there's a volleyball 40 years ago, as it was a different sport to look at. You know lots of different things involved no libro. Different colored balls, different rules. Ball wasn't allowed to hit the net on service. No, no, I'm not. So I know how would you?
Speaker 1:I remember, when you could only do three touches, the block didn't count, did count that was really early on but, yeah, the sport has evolved and, as you said and as you mentioned, coaching has evolved. How have you kept up to date and how have you kept yourself? You know, still still doing it now, like you must. I know you well, I know that you live and read volleyball and you know, you know, but you're not just teaching the same things you taught 40 years ago, you've kept yourself yeah, I think I've.
Speaker 2:I've just kept involved and at every level, because I've always been involved with grassroots volleyball, um, with the juniors at my club and working in Surrey and Sussex and the South East, but then always having a National League team. You're just continually learning. And then I volunteer and always have done to work. When my teams now are no longer in the national finals, I actually now go and volunteer for the national finals. So I do see I also referee a lot. So my husband and I both referee um. It's one thing we get paid for. Well, we referee at brighton and sussex, which is only 20 minutes away from us, the unis so wednesday afternoon out.
Speaker 1:For us old age pensioners, it's to go and referee and I think, like all of the guests I have on Heritage, you just and when you've been involved in volleyball for such a long time, it's really hard not to be involved in volleyball, isn't it? Yeah, it is, it is.
Speaker 2:And we go and every year there's some new players. I mean, they're so welcoming Because we are pretty good, I think, referees, which is quite, they have some shockers, but they really welcome us. And then the new people coming and thinking, well, who are these two old people? They're going to be never freeing us, but we seem to win them over within a few points.
Speaker 1:We do know what we're talking about, don't mess with me right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right, I have no tolerance at all anymore.
Speaker 1:I think, with age no tolerance, have no tolerance at all anymore. I think we need no tolerance. So before we wrap up the piece on coaching um, if I was to go and speak to people that you've coached um in the past, what, how do you think they would describe you, or how would you like them to describe?
Speaker 2:a friend yeah someone who listened to them, someone who helped them, I think, on their journey. I think that'd be the main things. I think I'm really good at observing players. I was trained to do this in my teacher training. We were really taught how to observe, how to observe what arm's doing what, and legs and what part of the body isn't working correctly. So dynamically, it's not going to work. So I think I'm able to watch players and come up with some help for them to improve. Like you know, where's the weight transference? What's happening with their follow-throughs? What parts are they hitting it with? Things like that?
Speaker 1:I'm very good at observing things that they're my new tie of it these days as well, even still, um, but I still, I think, really I hope they they knew that my heart was there and wanted them to improve and do well and I know from years of either coaching teams that I've played against your teams or I actually played for ashcom myself as an under 18 that you, that you're in it that's what I would say as someone who's known you for a while. You're in it, you're not a spectator. As a coach, you're very much where. You know, you celebrate with the team, you support the team. You can see it in the sort of nurturing way in a timeout that you will care for those athletes that you're looking after.
Speaker 1:It's an honour, isn't't it, to be able to coach it is.
Speaker 2:It is. I also think I'm I'm quite good at stepping back, even as a coach, um, when my team is playing. I don't try and play every point for them. I think it's very important that I can give them a bit of information, but people need to get on and learn by doing it themselves. I'm not one of these coaches that says serve there, dig here, pass there that down, get down the line, move up there, you know, jump higher, hit harder all those things yeah, great coaching things.
Speaker 1:Um, so I think I do let people you know get on as well as help yeah, awesome, I could talk to you for hours, but but selfishly, as a coach myself and you did mention earlier that spotting talent and I think you actually supported me in my coaching journey and gave me an opportunity to coach South East.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Under 15 boys and I was only 21, 22, I think 23 maybe at the time. Yeah, 1, 22, I think 23 maybe at the time, and that that whole experience has been a huge, um, a huge marker for me on what wanted me, wanted me to progress in coaching. So yeah, so yeah, thank you, we won and we won and we won inter-regionals and we did win inter-regionals. We did win inter-regionals, so I would like to spend some time talking through club management. So you have been running African Volleyball Club since 1976,.
Speaker 2:I believe when I started at 75, I started the players playing at the school, but 76, we got ourselves organised. So next year will be our 50th anniversary of both the tournament and the club, because I had to do the tournament in order to raise money so that we could play volleyball. You know it's a bit of a circle, isn't it? Yeah, you can't just charge these 13 and 14-year-old girls loads of money. Well, I couldn't, definitely back in 1975 and 6. And they were achieving and we were doing really well.
Speaker 2:We needed money, so, yeah, so you learn quite quickly that as a club, and especially as a women's club and a girls' club, you don't have the finances that that perhaps um men would have, or you know people who earn more, um, we also had back in those days. I have to say this straight away, though volleyball has been the most brilliant sport at being equal women from back in 1972, when I first was playing. It was equal then and it is. You know, I think, when I talk to other people who've been in sports which have been very, very male dominated, with women having not even allowed to play yeah I was playing, you know, back 60 years ago um no, not not quite.
Speaker 2:55 years ago, I was playing in a sport that was equal, absolutely equal.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm so proud of that volleyball and, and to this day, a sport that is very welcoming and tolerant of people from all different you know life and I think it's one of the the best things about our sport, isn't it? Um, it is so equal and it is so welcoming and it is so acceptable. Yeah, so so you mentioned the tournament, so, for the people that may not know, tell us more about the ashland volleyball tournament.
Speaker 2:And yeah, um, well it, as I said, I had to. I had to. Um, we decided on the school field to do I had to go and borrow, because we didn't have these lovely posts that we have now borrow metal um posts from schools. I knew that had them, and then we tied them up and luckily my husband's an engineer, so we make um guys and somehow land, you know, tie them into the ground, and then, oh my goodness, and we had three or four courts to start with and charged a small amount of money, but it was it, you know, gave us an income.
Speaker 2:Um, and I would say well, at our, our biggest, which is probably now about 15, 20 years ago. It was a two-day tournament and we would well, it was well, it would raise enough money for me to fund the club, you know, with your subs and everything else, for the following years. It was always a bit hand in mouth because you know it's expensive, isn't it? Hiring courts and travelling, the travel was so expensive, so it was something that just got bigger. It then it sort of became its own beast. Really. It was enormous two-day event with big parties on the saturday night I remember them well big festival of volleyball, um.
Speaker 2:And then we stopped doing that, with lockdown, of course, yeah, um. And then um two years, the following year, we couldn't do it. Then we did do one day tournament and it was so popular, unbelievable I think I had 26 courts, just you know, crazy um.
Speaker 2:And then now the last two or three years, it's it's too much for me and my husband to do um and when it comes down to it, although I've got some good support at the club, you need people in there and back in the day the first team would run it because they knew that was their money for the year, yeah, so the first team never played.
Speaker 2:They were the ones who did everything organized with me. But now people don't want to do it. I've got I would say I've got some good people who help and then it drops off totally the players, the parents. They don't see it as a thing that they really want to do. So we're going to do next year. The last two years we've just done one-day tournaments. That have been very successful, made good money for the club, but exhausting for me and my husband in particular.
Speaker 2:So I have to thank my daughter and my son, who come nearly every year and do it as well. So, yeah, it's a great event. These events need volunteers.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, so much of our support relies on the goodwill of volunteers, doesn't it? And you know, I've always said this and maybe a bit of a controversial thing, but maybe you've relied too much on volunteers in places. And when those volunteers call it a day or have enough, um, it's about making it sustainable, making sure that it will always continue, and because you know that's what it's about.
Speaker 2:but, um, and I've tried to have succession planning in everything it sounds good, but I've never managed it In the coaching, in the secretary work, in the tournament. No, I think there's certain people who lead things like this, and I'm one of them, and there's people like Ron Richards. I can list loads. But when that person decides to stop, it's like your baby and your life. You can't really expect somebody else to take it on.
Speaker 1:you know if you'd be very lucky if you find somebody or let know yeah so so, talking about like club management and so, um, ashcombe has been a really successful club and, like you said at the start, it's gone ups and downs through the leagues. You know winning the league and the double in 2000, I think you said yeah, and then you know loads of maybe dropping down the leagues and up and down, but what? What do you think? Do you think the Ashcombe volleyball tournament has been a been a huge part of the success of the club over the years?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it has. I think the name, then, is known by everybody, which is good, I think I like to think of it as a festival of volleyball rather than because it's you know, it's playing on grass. Although some people come and take it really seriously playing on grass. Although some people come and take it really seriously, it's a game of volleyball on grass. Don't take it seriously. Have another drink or have a burger, but people do and they love it.
Speaker 2:But it is a festival, and I think that's become more and more now and it's only a mixed tournament now I found that that's really saved me, because some of the men's teams were just so difficult and some of the women's, but mixed just seems to. It's the spirit, isn't it? It's the down and it's the fun. Yeah, yeah. So that's good. So I like to think of it as a festival for Surrey, for the South East to showcase.
Speaker 1:You know.
Speaker 2:For some people locally, every year they know nothing about volleyball whatsoever Every year in this little village of Brockham, this great big festival appears. You know, big festival appears, you know so, and dorking around who colin used to play for have been wonderful for us. For the last about 45 years we've held it there. So, um, yeah, yeah, it's gone. It's gone really well. Um, but, as I say, I think of it more as a festival of volleyball and a showcase for yeah our locality for it to go.
Speaker 1:Yeah and one of the risks, then. So you mentioned it. So one of the risks to volleyball in this country is, like you mentioned, the cost of the sport. It's an expensive sport, um, and I don't think and again I'm being quite controversial here as someone who's run a club myself um, players don't always understand the costs associated with running a club, whether that be hall hire, referees, registration fees, travel. Um, so would you say then, having some sort of commercial income, like a tournament is, is a? If you were, if you were, advising someone who was just about to set up their own volleyball club, what would your 40 plus years at ashford, what would you be telling them to do from a sustainability?
Speaker 2:definitely get yourself on a firm financial putting yeah, I mean you.
Speaker 2:We have, over the years, applied for grants and been very successful in getting grants all over, um and um. I think I learned how to do them well. You know, fill in the forms well, but you can only do that for certain things and you can only really get grants for beginner things or new initiatives, um, and also, you know, if people are playing a sport, they've got to, uh, got to pay for it. Yeah, and we as a club, we are very, very cheap, very cheap. You know yearly subs, um, I know clubs near us who are three times the amount we are. Yeah, there are some clubs now paying a thousand pounds. Yeah, paying a thousand pounds. Um, and I think, yes, you need to make sure you've got, and if it does mean you've got to do that in order for it to be viable, then that's what you've got to do. I mean, in London, the cost of haul hire now is you're lucky if it's £60 an hour. It's much more usually.
Speaker 2:And that's where what you've got to do is you've got to get your own sports centre built and then run it on a cheap way. That's what you got to do is you've got to get your own sports center built and then, uh, run it on a cheap way. That's what you need to do.
Speaker 1:That would be my advice get your own sports center built 20 years ago, yeah, yeah well, I was gonna say and and that is something that you've done yourself right, so maybe share with us a little bit more about that experience of yeah, well, that was um.
Speaker 2:So we were still training in the small gym at Ashcombe and playing everybody used to play at Guildford by then, I think, and the head teacher at the Ashcombe school, because we were still training there and we were still quite close. You know the volleyball, even though I'd left there in 1982. I left Ashcombe. I've had nothing to do with it as a school since then, except the volleyball in the evenings. And he said, um, I've been told by sport england, if we go with the sport, we might be able to get a facility for the school. Would you, you know, would you come and work with us to do it? So we did. We spent two or three years crikey, raising, money, raising, profile, applying for this, applying for that um, and got the ashburn center built yeah, and the ashford volleyball center home of two volleyball courts, isn't it?
Speaker 2:it's a two court venue, two and it's, uh, you know, top level size. It's international standard. In the middle we've got a court in the middle as well. You can play um, but it's it's national league, um, super eight standard.
Speaker 2:You know the, the run-up behind the court, the size, um, it's got everything there for volleyball and um, it's now 25 years old, my goodness, um, and the school is still incredibly supportive, so supportive for volleyball. We, you know it is about a quarter the price you pay anywhere else. So we do have the South East squads there train regularly, because we can then make the funds which allow us to then send the teams to the inter-regionals and pay for the coaches without all the players having to pay everything. It means that we have Surrey and Sussex. We have the Seafed tournament there every year. Um, yeah it, it just means that, as a couple, the school still gives me two sessions after school sessions. Uh, I can't always get coaches for that, but for free. So, and that's still a legacy which I can only thank the school for letting us, letting us have us have.
Speaker 1:So your advice then would be for anybody you know because you do see it and I've seen it myself over the years of clubs that appear and disappear and you know, rebrand and come back a few years later with the same people but a different name now and all those sorts of things, whereas Ashcombe has been stable, consistent, and you think that's down to having good. You know, having you involved has obviously been a huge, a huge part of that, but having good finances, because I do think clubs in our clubs, in our community and in the sport do need to think about the commerciality of volleyball because, you're right, you can't keep if we, if we. My opinion it's my opinion is if we continue to raise the prices for players, we make our sport very inaccessible and we want to be a sport that is accessible to all, don't we?
Speaker 2:we do, and especially young players. I mean most. Most clubs have a cheaper rate for young players, um, and then you know it goes up, uh, the more expensive, uh, because they're playing more, or they're training more, or they're traveling, all the things you have to do as you get better and play more matches. And then you've got the problems now around us and probably everywhere, that you start the players all off, you get them to a good standard and then they go and join another club because, they're offering them something else.
Speaker 2:I don't know what. It doesn't usually happen, but it does now and again. Players decide. But players have to make their own choices. They're not professionals. If they think the grass is greener somewhere else, then they're going to go. But it is an expensive sport really, unless you get your own sports centre built and run a big tournament.
Speaker 1:So there we go free does free, does golden. Nuggets of advice if you're thinking about running your own club and starting your own club, build your own sports center and um and have an income stream, such as a tournament that's right.
Speaker 2:Well, and of course I. The thing is travel. I used to do so much traveling with england, playing um. I also saw what was happening on the continent, and on the continent, especially in France, belgium and Holland, you have community, so the school facility is also the community facility and it's not attached to a school. The expense of a school caretaker doubles your cost.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So when I got the Ashcombe Centre built, it was done on a keyholder status which. I've seen happening in Europe, so that you don't have the caretakers, you have an alarm system and you have, you know, each user has their own keys and it's worked, actually considering really quite well, and that's another thing. You know, you've got to be worldly wise really to what's going on and the expenses and the expenses are people, you know, caretakers, expensive things.
Speaker 1:Amazing. So yeah, and did you say 50 years of Ashcombe, then next year?
Speaker 2:Next year Next year's our the tournament will be 50 years old, and the club really as well, so we've got some plans. Well, I don't have plans, but everyone else seems to have them Every time. Yeah, lots of people. Our chair is Susanna. These days, susanna Restotarova is the chair of our club and she's determined. And then I keep getting emails from old players saying well, what we're doing next year?
Speaker 1:because we did do a big celebration on the 40, we did a big celebration on the 25, so, yeah, perhaps we will and obviously uh and again mentioned it at the start, but recognize you were recognized in 2013 for your services to volleyball and mbe.
Speaker 2:So yeah, well, that was a shock. Yeah, that was a big shock, was not expecting that at all. Um, and when I told my best friend, I phoned her up and said you'll never guess. She said oh, have you got that mbe at last? I went what she does other sports, she's not a roller. And she said well, all the work you've done, I'm not surprised it didn't happen earlier.
Speaker 2:It's like oh okay but, yeah, it was um a great thing. Uh, so, prince charles, he was then, yeah, awarded um, yeah, the whole event was fantastic at buckingham Palace, you know, yeah, with the family it was lovely, so um you.
Speaker 1:You suggested earlier about there was no story league, so um so I'm interested to find out and and like I say with every guest to have, there's so much we could talk about, but I'd like to take your brains really about, about that. How did you find yourself setting up like a regional league or association? Was it just wrong person? You were in the right place at the wrong time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had to put Ashcombe into the London League because there wasn't any organised volleyball in Surrey. So at the time it was, pete Wardale was at Volleyball England and because of all the other stuff I was doing, I chatted with him and said you know what do I do? And he said, ok, well, I'll come down. So we met in a pub with him, with somebody I'm just trying to think somebody who was in and then out. Anyway, there were three of us and we just talked about what we should do and how we should set up the association. And, yeah, volleyball England gave us a lot of help. So we formed the Surrey Volleyball Association and we started a league, a men's league and a women's league, about four or five teams.
Speaker 2:When I say we, I think that was me as well. But then I passed that on to other people and that was it really. But then I passed that on to other people and that was it really, and that was probably in about 1978, 79. So it's quite new, isn't it really? I think most of the associations you'll find are quite new. You know, they had to come from somewhere. It didn't miraculously happen and they all came from people like you who happened to give up your time.
Speaker 1:You know they, they had to come from somewhere. They didn't miraculously happen and they and they all came from people like you who happened to give up your time and do the hard work, and all the people that have benefited from it since have all been down to people like yourself, who who persevered and did all the hard work at the start to get these things off the ground yeah, yeah, and there's quite a lot of us, which was was good.
Speaker 2:A lot of people did it and, yeah, very pleased that it did. Obviously, you look now, you know Surrey and Sussex because I live in Sussex, so I've been quite involved with the Sussex Association. It's quite interesting actually, this year I've actually stepped down from the Sussex Association. I've been on their board for 25 years because my club, my, my school club at durrington high school, played in the local, you know, in the sussex league, and then I fed into worthing uh, a lot into worthing volleyball club, which is a really successful club now, really well, it's got the men's and the women and most of those are my ex-pupils and you know I feel like I've really helped that club a bit. You know quite a lot, but it's quite funny really. So I've got a very successful volleyball club about a mile from my house that I have nothing to do with. So that's right.
Speaker 1:Well, you do have something to do. You probably have a lot more to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but I don't go and coach or referee or do anything there. Yeah, yeah, but it's good to see that flourish there.
Speaker 1:It really is nice yeah yeah, and it and it is a very, very successful region of volleyball in this country, isn't it? So, you know, putting some great clubs, some great teams, some great players, some great coaches from the southeast um region. So, yeah, so, um, yeah, and and interested to find out, and for the people listening about your transition then to being on the board of volleyball england, because I believe you've been on the board for you know, on and off. I think um is that right, so maybe on and off actually.
Speaker 2:well, it was 20 years I did, but it was nearer 30 or 35 on and off, I know.
Speaker 1:And where are you now?
Speaker 2:It changed so much. Well, I was first on the board when my son was born and he's 40 this year just after Sam was born and I went on and that was with Richard Callicott, and then I came off for a while and then I went back on it again to do and then I was doing a lot of the coaching side for Volleyball England. You know, I was leading the coaching, which I found really good and I've really enjoyed actually going. Over the last 10 years I've been away several times as like head of delegation, um, with our national squads, just like a, an older, wiser head, really with people, which I've really enjoyed. And I should have gone this year to um, um, the beach as, um a head of delegation you know, up in was it um riddlington? Yeah, yeah, they asked me to do that. I couldn't do it because I was going on holiday. You know I'm always going on. So it's like, well, it was actually the african tournament till the sunday and then my daughter said let's go on holiday next weekend, so I couldn't do it.
Speaker 1:So yeah, um you said of on and off, so you're currently on or off no off.
Speaker 2:I finished last year because you could. You, you're meant to do um these days. Governance only allows you to do so many things and I've done two, two, lots of um four years I think it was, and it was time to step aside, and you know, new people coming on, so it was just right for me as well. When my time came up last summer, it was like, yeah, I need to have a break from it as well and, yeah, and do other things.
Speaker 1:Well, we talked about your love for travel. So those of you that don't know, frida, like I know, you love to travel. We were talking before we pressed record about recent travel trips. So, anywhere nice on the plan, any anywhere, are you off? Anywhere nice?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, well, we actually did a caribbean cruise in january, which is was lovely. I I found it a bit restrictive, it was nice I'd rather do that than be in england in january. So yeah, um, but uh, yeah, we got a motor home so we'll be off in September.
Speaker 2:Once I got all the leagues and everything started, I'm off in September for a month to um, probably down to Spain yeah, still doing the volleyball, still getting you traveling, but you know, yeah, yeah gotta get all the fixtures, all the fixtures done, all the referees, you know all those things, before I'm allowed to travel yeah, you're always going to be involved in volleyball and I think that's, yeah, amazing.
Speaker 1:So, um, so, before we wrap up, I could, I want to pick your brains about so many things. It's always these conversations where I finish the conversation, press, press, stop and then think, oh, I didn't ask that, I didn't ask that we didn't talk about this. Um, and, as you know, with richard callicott, we did two episodes because oh, yeah, it would be.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we didn't, we're just completely right out of time. He was talking about something and all of a sudden it was an hour later, so, um, but we did look. I would like to wrap up the conversation, then, really by um talking about what has been your proudest moment. You've been involved in our sport for such a long time and done so many things, whether that be playing, coaching, refereeing, on the board of volleyball, england surrey association, southeast and what's your proudest moment in the sport, do you think?
Speaker 2:well, I think I'm playing for england is has got to be one of the best things, hasn't it, for you to do, and then seeing my son play for England. So he played for the England juniors and then played for the senior team as well. So, yeah, wonderful for us both to do that. I received a fabulous award for volunteering and I received it from award for volunteering and I received it from Bobby Charlton, my childhood hero. So that was the thing volleyball gave me I could meet my childhood hero. So, yeah, things like that, running with the torch through the streets of Southampton.
Speaker 1:Yes, before the.
Speaker 2:Olympics. I mean, oh my God, my heart just goes now just thinking about it. It was a magical moment, magical, and I took my torch into my grandson's school last year to show them all you know before the Paris Olympics. Yeah, yeah. And he's now seven and, of course, understands a lot more about it. That's a more proud moment, you know.
Speaker 2:Understands a lot more about it that more proud moments, you know, to he, to see him proud of me, which is lovely, you know, to be able to um, yeah, to see next generation's love of sport yeah and both my grandsons are the fastest things on two feet. So watch this space. They are. They playing volleyball? Yet they are. They are playing in the garden because they're very young. They're only four and seven, but they obviously play football because that's what you do and they're great fun.
Speaker 1:They'll see the light, won't they? They'll see the light, they will.
Speaker 2:He actually said to me. Artie said you do know that I like football more than volleyball, don't you Not at?
Speaker 1:the moment, give it to them.
Speaker 2:I at the moment give it some.
Speaker 1:Of course you do. Yeah, I'll change that. Um, uh, so we we talked about volleyball now, so he's still involved in the sport now. So, uh, before you get off on your holiday, you've got all the fixtures to to sort out, and the southeast got get all that sorted as well, so yeah, yeah. And then, finally, my final question to you, which is a very tricky one. Um, but if you had a magic wand and you could fix or improve anything in volleyball, what would you? What would you do, I think?
Speaker 2:I would like to see it more recognized in england. People in England just don't realise what a world sport it is. I don't know how you can do that. It's a shame. But we're not going to really achieve unless Sport England helps, you know, and they don't see us as a large sport. So you know the money. I'd like to see people be willing to pay for their sport more to Volleyball England as well as to their clubs.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, money makes the world go round, doesn't it?
Speaker 2:Well.
Speaker 1:I know, yeah, yeah, wow, look at that, let me go An hour, an hour. How did that happen? I know?
Speaker 1:I told you it'd fly by um, but for for me, a huge thank you. Thank you first for agreeing to come on and share. Like I said, this podcast is all about sharing in the heritage, sharing the stories and the wisdom of people that have done so much for the sport over a long period of time. So, um, a huge thank you from from all of the volleyball community for everything you've done. Um, and, and personally to me, you've, uh, you've given me so much, whether that be playing at ashford or helping in my coaching journey.
Speaker 1:So I want to say, and now, with I'm now finding myself in one of those seats as chair of hampshire volleyball association, I'm sure I'll be sending you emails and asking for your advice um finding myself in one of those seats as chair of Hampshire Volleyball Association, I know I'm sure I'll be sending you emails and asking for your advice. But a huge thank you and thank you for your time.
Speaker 2:Oh, you're welcome and good luck with everything, Luke.
Speaker 1:Thanks, frida. So remember, guys, whatever you're up to, keep playing, keep supporting, but, most importantly, keep that volleyball spirit alive. I'm Luke Wiltshire, the host of that Volleyball Guy. Thank you for listening.
