Claiming the Fire Within (Part 1)

Beneath every mask we wear, there is a spark waiting to be seen.

Season 2 opens with a flipped conversation where voice and visibility coach Evelyne Brink turns the questions back on Lauri. Together they explore the roots of the “Good Girl” mask, how sensitivity shaped survival, and the breakthrough moment when a hidden fire finally came roaring out on stage. This is where the journey from Good Girl to Wild Woman truly begins.

Key Takeaways:
1. The “Good Girl” mask can look different for everyone — from compliance to quiet rebellion.
2. Sensitivity in childhood often turns into hyper-vigilance in adulthood.
3. Breakthroughs happen when we allow ourselves to be bigger than the boxes others put us in.
4. Archetypes like Good Girl, Rule-Breaker, and Wild Woman illuminate how we grow beyond “shoulds.”
5. Stepping into roles that scare us often unlocks parts of ourselves we didn’t know were there.
6. When we stop trying to “get it right” and let our inner fire lead, others can finally see who we truly are.
7. The moments we risk being “too much” often become the moments that change everything.

Soul Sucker Quiz

Take the Soul Sucker Quiz to learn which Soul Sucker screams the loudest in your mind so you can release them from being in charge and set your voice free!

https://voice-matters.com/soul-sucker-quiz/

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome to Season 2 (wild, untamed, radiant)
• 2:38 Confessions of a Wild Woman
• 6:20 Growing up as the “Good Girl” in a family of black sheep
• 13:10 Archetypes: Good Girl → Rule-Breaker → Wild Woman
• 14:54 The many faces of the “Good Girl”
• 20:35 Theater as home for sensitivity, fire, and belonging
• 21:44 The Crucible audition: letting the fire out
• 28:44 Different Paths to self-expression
• 35:20 Acting class breakthrough: releasing the masks

Transcript

Lauri: 0:33

Hey everybody and welcome back to the Soulful Speaking Show. I am so excited about the experience that you're going to have today and my guest my guest is Evelyn Brink. She is a voice and visibility coach for high-impact leaders, helping brilliant people sound as powerful as they are. But she's not your typical speaking coach. As a former number one Madonna impersonator, tedx speaker and one-woman show creator, evelyn brings a rare blend of performance, expertise and leadership insight and today we decided to improvise together because my story since starting this podcast has been coming into another notch of alignment and clarity and soulful focus and I could use a little help.

Lauri: 1:32

It's really helpful to have someone else ask questions and hold a mirror up, and Evelyn came into my world and offered to do that. So for season two, it's still not your granddaddy speaking show and I'm leaning more into wild, untamed and radiant as the season two focus and radiant as the season two focus. So we're going to play together and she's going to help me evoke the more wild, untamed, radiant part of my own story, so that this is my way of going first in season two. I'm ready when you are, evelyn, okay here we go, hip, hip, hooray.

Evelyn: 2:21

I thank you so much, first of all, for having me here and for this wicked intro. I feel very good about myself now we are done. Hi everyone. Hi, this was great, and I can't wait to dive in. So that's what we're going to do, because one of the things that always annoys me with podcasts is when people faff around in the beginning. Let's dive right in. Yeah, I would love to know one thing that you haven't shared with your audience before.

Lauri: 2:48

I've shared so much with my audience before.

Evelyn: 2:51

I'm sure you have, but the thing that you haven't dared to say yet have like the thing that you haven't dared to say yet.

Lauri: 3:04

I am um, I don't know if I've said this. Well, the part of the reason we're here is that there's a certain amount of good girl that's still there for me at times, particularly in how I run my business, and I notice it a lot, like looking, you know the like looking for, even though I'm like I'm a rebel, I'm one of a kind I'm creating the business that only I can create, I will get sucked into like looking for the landmine that's going to go off and like where can I step and what choice can I make? That sort of allows me to do what I want to do, but that isn't always 150% driven by my intuition and my gut and aliveness and inner knowing, which is I don't know if I've said it. So I feel like sometimes it's obvious and I I tend to attempt to share things that are happening, and yet I know like when you're sitting here and you're holding the space for other people, you're not always saying like, hey, even I still might have thin masks that creep up from time to time.

Evelyn: 4:21

So Laurie Smith's title of her new book Confessions of a Wild Woman will be out next season. Number one is even though you are a rebel and a wild woman, you are still also a good girl. Thank you for that. Thank you for your honesty, yeah. I can relate, I can. I totally relate to that. It's, I think, very human and what you described actually sounded to me a little more like anxiety than really just a good girl pattern. What do you, what do you see?

Lauri: 4:55

Yeah, I, I feel like it is and like when I'm in that like what step is right, what step will not cause something to go wrong, then I think that's when I would be like, well, if I just do the good girl thing, I know that's worked before, except it hasn't actually Like it worked when I was young and in building my own business and honoring my purpose in the world. I will say this from time to time like there are people who can like do what other people are telling them they should do and have a certain amount of success. I've been in business for 17 years now. It actually has never really worked for me when there's a traditional way to do it, when I try to cookie, cutter it and take it.

Lauri: 5:49

it's like why do I keep trying? Because it actually fails when I do it, so why?

Evelyn: 6:03

Why I relate. So why why I relate? Dang it, I relate. And what I noticed when he started talking about that is that the word, the term good girl feels like. I know exactly what you're talking about, sister, and do I really? Though? And my suspicion is that maybe our audience might have a similar thing that they play by the good girl, but do we actually know what that is? So, laurie, what does that mean in your world? Good?

Lauri: 6:27

girl where it probably comes from. In my case, yes, please. I was like the good sheep in a family of black sheep, so I was a misfit and that's the direction that I went. So my parents you have to explain this, yeah.

Evelyn: 6:50

I have to explain it. I'm like what?

Lauri: 6:52

Yeah, my parents met in Alcoholics Anonymous and had me, and so a lot of our family members have issues with drugs and alcohol.

Lauri: 7:07

We have an alarmingly high success rate of people getting sober, maintaining their sobriety, and that wasn't always the case when I was younger. So I remember like times when the phone would ring in the middle of the night and my dad would be going to get somebody out of jail. Meanwhile I was the straight A student. I actually think I thought at the time it was a left brain intellect, but I had learned, like 20 years ago, it wasn't it's, it's my intuition and my right brain and like the way I hear the world important words almost have like an aural equivalent of a neon sign, so I could just hear what was on the test. I figured that out when I was a grad student, helping others studying for the test, because the professors would get up and they would talk and everyone would be very confused and I would have these notes before they even made up the test and then I would see their test and everything that I wrote down was what they then created as a test.

Evelyn: 8:12

Oh, that's fascinating.

Lauri: 8:13

So there's a superpower, yeah, which I, of course you don't know, those are your superpowers when you're like getting straight A's at 11 years old. So I remember like working in my living room with the TV on in the background, getting the straight A's, not needing to ask anyone for help with the homework, and that, like that was my lane. I even have this thing that I put in a one-woman show that I did that I'm not sure if it was an actual memory or just a creative moment Of being in a crib and crying and being alone and then stopping and being silent and then people coming to me. I don't know if it's an actual memory or if it was like I just had this image that feels a bit like well, that's how I got attention. I didn't get attention by temper tantrums, I didn't get attention by crying and I had an impression, until this started coming to me in my thirties, that like I always wanted to be the one who was all pulled together, okay, independent, not too wild or weird or out there, and kind of named that the good girl, because everyone else was the black sheep.

Lauri: 9:44

I also think some of this. It's like you interact with the world and certain things work and when I was good, even as an adult as a woman in our world good, calm, measured, intelligent, not too emotional, not too this. That yada, yada yada. It worked. Things felt stable. But stable is not really what I'm here for now. I don't know if there's anything else that would be in good girl, but I know that some of those, like you know, don't rock the boat, stay in a pretty thin lane kind of feelings and all of the like don't be too wild, too weird, too loud, too raw, too authentic to anything Are the like opposite of good girl.

Evelyn: 11:46

Interesting, so your good girl is definitely slightly different from where I would have come in with good girls, so thank you so much for sharing that. That's fascinating.

Lauri: 11:57

Well, I'm curious like what would yours have been, because I feel like there's a spectrum where we all get to be different and also there are some themes that might be really helpful for me and for our listeners too sure, um.

Evelyn: 12:12

And before I do that I want to. I want to summarize a little of what you've said. Because your good girl came, because I was thinking whilst you were talking, I'm like, but she's a rebel. Now she talks about good girl. And then I thought, no, but your good girl is a rebellion in itself. Your good girl is a rebellion against the normative of what you call bad. The dysfunctional Part of your good girl is the deep desire to be healthy and functional, and that desire might be more compulsive than you want it to be, or more kind of like tight than you want it to be, but but it's actually an opposite reaction of where you came from, which I thought that's fascinating to me, yeah.

Lauri: 12:56

Yeah, yeah, I totally asked you a question. And then I'm like I have also had times in my life and believe that it's part of our world here in the American education system is that everybody's shitting all over you. So they're telling you what you should be and you either comply with that, which is what I did when I was younger, or you re. You rebel against that, you break the rules and in the like unformed brain of a child and a teenager, neither one of those. They're both blind. I'm either blindly following or blindly going. I'm not going to do that. Why? Because you said so, yeah, and when we get older, we probably move through a good girl to a rule breaker or bounce back and forth, feeling very confused, which some of my clients have said. And then there's this wild woman or sovereign creator, intuitive one, where it's like what the world is saying you should or should not do is irrelevant.

Evelyn: 14:07

Yeah, fascinating, hypo. There is an opportunity to grasp something that might not be as accessible as to us with, like, if I'm not a wild woman, to go like, oh, there's a wild woman, there's a queen, there's a sovereign creator. Wow, I kind of get the feeling for it and there's a danger to think it's something that it completely is different. So what you just called wild woman, sometimes I think about wild woman as the one that's really unhinged, wild as well. So that's also what's wild, what's good. So this is fascinating. Yeah, I'll answer your question. So we have that contrast or not contrast.

Evelyn: 14:49

For me, good girl is the rule, the conformist, the rule follower. You do what mommy says. You do what mummy says, you do what daddy says. Good girl is what society expects of a girl and a woman. You're a good girl and it's this.

Evelyn: 15:06

It is so non-conducive to being an individual and being free to label people, and especially children, as good and bad. I have often tried to explain to teachers or anyone please don't call my child good or bad. They're not a dog, you know. Good dog, bad dog, bad boy, good girl, you can't put a good, you can't judge them like that and you can't judge the entire character on one behavior. You've passed a test. Therefore you're a good person, what the heck. So it just doesn't even make sense. But there is an idea and it's a beautiful controlling mechanism that we, just like you said, should on people and give these norms.

Evelyn: 15:49

So for me, the good girl is the one that's compliant with norms and what your parents say. So the first line of forming you do what's expected of you. That is good, and as a girl, that means you're seen but not heard. You're pretty. Smile nicely, you look pretty, smile nicely, you look nice. You want to marry someone. You might want to be chosen. You do something that you want to be stable. You don't want to be a hassle, you want to be low maintenance. Don't be complicated, don't be too emotional, don't be too much, just be basically the B side of the record. Yeah, be the supplement to a man, really that's a good girl. Yeah, someone who's easy to be around.

Lauri: 16:41

Yeah, and those were. You know that was all definitely in there too. I think there was a lot of me, and even, like before it was said, anticipating what is this thing that's like there in our society. And if you're intuitive and sensitive, you can start to be looking for, like, where's the response? Where I get the pat on the head before anybody has even used the word good because you're ultra hyper sensitive.

Evelyn: 17:14

And in a case like yours, from what I'm hearing, you're not safe. I also grew up with an alcoholic. Well, step-parent yeah, step-parent and I learned in Al-Anon that that was the beginning of my personal development journey. What did I learn? Well, that we're hypervigilant as relatives of alcoholics. So you're not in a safe environment when people are drinking around you. So it wouldn't surprise me that you've really had to look out and almost calculate what could be happening to then respond to it in advance.

Lauri: 17:47

Yeah, the weird thing is that my parents didn't like. They met in AA and had me and were sober the whole time. Other siblings were drinking but it wasn't allowed in our household. That doesn't mean it was never around, because if you come in a certain level of drunk around an alcoholic, they're going to smell it. They're going to smell it. Years later one of my sisters, once she was sober, told me you could have taken one sip of alcohol and I would smell it on your breath. One sip and just because of the craving that she had, she would smell it. If somebody comes in on another substance, comes in on another substance. It's not always as obvious and there may have been some of that creating the feeling of the like.

Evelyn: 18:41

I'm being hyper vigilant because there's like mood swings going on with siblings because of what they might be on yeah, and there's a reason people fall into alcoholism in the first place and they might have not all been healed up. So that's a reason people fall into alcoholism in the first place and they might have not all been healed up. So that's a challenging environment and so for me it's fascinating to hear how you have taken the good girl principle and the conforming um and and being the expect, the, the expected and the unexpected at the same time in that context. For me, it's always been this I don't know that it just didn't really apply to me. I'm a very free spirit and naturally I've always been good but also quite loud, and I was probably lucky that most people let me be, but then there were plenty of people who didn't.

Evelyn: 19:31

So there's always a confusion around is it okay to be me or not, or what? Because one minute there's a lot of people celebrating my freedom and my intelligence and my questions and all that and my talent and recognizing it. People said, oh, you're going to be an actress from when I was very young. And then, on the other hand, it's like, shh, we can hear you even when you're whispering. I'm like, yeah, because I also always have something to say, often have a joke, really see the funniest, and so that's then clamped down, which is me. So we all run into our conflicts and then decide how we play with it, whether we want to be well coasting with it or starting a riot, and yeah yeah yeah, and that I feel like I was not.

Lauri: 20:21

I'm I'm way louder now, I think, because of the sensitivity I had, kind of like a shy, sensitive, slow to jump into things, and I got except, I also had this fire of like I'm here to do something. And I found theater not from people saying, oh my God, you're totally going to be an actress, but it was like I was called there and felt at home in the theater because it was an acceptable place to like tap into all of me and let it out. And I remember one key moment in my life was you know, I went away to school. I consciously chose a school that was a seven, eight hour drive away from my parents because I was like, it was like an intuitive I think I need to go find me.

Lauri: 21:23

I think, that's it's time to grow up. And if I live and go to one of the colleges, that's like I can come home to do my laundry every weekend. I'm not sure that's going to happen. Yeah, I agree, I relate. Yeah.

Lauri: 21:34

So I went to UC Davis up I-5 and was auditioning for the Crucible and I've got this fire inside of me and I really wanted the role of Abigail. And I was a little overweight, I wore baggy t-shirts all the time, I had brown, like mousy, mid brown hair with some highlights, and I got called back for Mary Warren and I really wanted to be cast. So I was trying to figure out how to play this meek, mousy character. And like trying to play meek, just in case you're out there and you're an actor, is not the way to go. It's that the person has a block and they're trying to speak up and every single word out of their mouth is like the most courageous thing ever. So I could play her very well now and the stage directions said I was doing a good job and I was sitting, and then the stage direction said she stands. And when I Lori, with this fire inside, who really wanted to play Abigail but was trying to be like good girl, quiet. When I stood up, something took over and Abigail came out in the way that I said the next line and the director I'd been hearing about these callbacks with all the red haired, blonde haired actresses that were getting called in for Abigail hours and hours long, where she was trying to pull Abigail out of them. So I stand up. It's like an Abigail flash comes out and she stops it and I'm going oh, it's like an Abigail flash comes out and she stops it and I'm going oh, no, no, most of them. And she said okay, I want you to go look at both Abigail and Mary Warren and I want you to come back on Saturday and I want you to understand that they are complete opposites. And I was like I know that. Um, so I went away.

Lauri: 23:30

I came back one Abigail scene, I think, and one Mary Warren scene and she said which would you like to do first? And I said I'd like to do the Abigail first, from her face and on the floor, because this very innocent looking, mousy, brown haired girl just channeled what she'd been trying to get out of all these other people. So she handed me another scene, no direction. She's just handing me scene after scene after scene and then says lets me do the mary warren somewhere in the middle. And then says lets me do the Mary Warren somewhere in the middle. And then says thank you very much.

Lauri: 24:16

And on the way out I remember, in a very Mary Warren-type energy, telling the assistant director if there's a question, I would love to play Abigail. And she looked at me and went, oh, I don't think there's a question. And then you're waiting for the rest of the people to get cast and your mind, that cast list that they would put up on the wall. And my mind, my soul, suckers.

Lauri: 24:42

My inner critics were like, oh my god, she didn't. She didn't direct me at all. Am I gonna even be in the play? And then the list goes up and I walked into the green room and somebody said how did it go? One of the grad students? And I was like it went well, you know, like I really want Abigail. And she looked at me and went yeah, but you look a lot more like a Mary Warren. Yeah, we know that and I even had the courage to say but that's a much more interesting choice than like she's evil from the moment that she walks out, because I was like pissed that she tried to take away what I wanted in that moment.

Evelyn: 25:20

And you had power as well in that moment.

Lauri: 25:24

Yeah, yeah, I was in touch with my power because I had been like letting the fire within me lead while reading and just following. Like I know what this person is, I know what fire is, and later both you know, I did get the part. The cast list went up. My name was there. Many people were shocked that my name was there.

Lauri: 25:46

Uh, you know, they did put me in a wool outfit that had like muslin the cream colored muslin underneath, with more of a cutout than the other characters, and gave me more of a shape. And then I realized like hey, I'm actually not all that overweight, I'm curvy, and they put me in something where I had some curves instead of like just put her in a brown paper sack, called this huge t-shirt. Um, that was a huge moment of like there's this good girl thing and like it was like my chance in theater to be like but I don't want to be mary warren, I gotta let abigail out the bad one. Except that that is not how the director and I saw it. Like she was born in the wrong time, a very oppressive time, and then when she found this like power lane to save herself, things go a little crazy, but it wasn't from like this evil, you know the female version of like some dude with his mustache, she was a full three-dimensional human being.

Evelyn: 27:01

Oh my gosh, I love this story and when I hear that I'm sensing that's why you are a great actress, because you will have brought a depth to the profession and to the role that you get from. And I kind of envy the quiet types from that suppressed quietness where the volcano is waiting to come out.

Lauri: 27:23

Whereas.

Evelyn: 27:23

I'm your opposite. I was hyper. I'm masked with confidence. So, just like you and dear viewers and listeners, what we found out, laurie and me, is we have a lot in common. It's really spooky, on the surface at least, but we must be different. So this is really fascinating, yeah, um, but I'm, I am so just like you. I'm very sensitive and I.

Evelyn: 27:48

I discovered that later that it's like the the hedgehog, that the hedgehog's belly can will only be shown on this one side, but mainly where there's a lot of spikes, and then we put ourselves on the ball. Don't get too close. My ball is called confidence. So I've developed that skill of confidence and fun and humor and wow, ta-da, and that I'm the kid in the theater production that everybody notices. You notice me. I will make sure of that, but it slightly. It can be a bit over the top, very so theatrical, but they don't really like it in theater. That much turns out, which is annoying because I'm really good at exaggerating.

Evelyn: 28:29

So, from that place. It was always more like tone it down, tone it down, and I'm like where's my freedom? Where do I really get to go for it? Because I've got this excessive energy that needs to go, that needs to channel, and everyone's like, no, you need to go inside. I'm like I don't know what you're talking about. What do you want from me? Just let me play. I've got literally life force in buckets 10 times as much as most people, so I'm clearly a star. So let me be a star already.

Evelyn: 28:57

I couldn't pull it back until this director found me and he did a really clever thing that I'm going to call outside-in acting versus inside-out acting, and he just gave me a bunch of props and he says here's a bunch of props. Your role is Ilze in Spring Awakening. You've got this bunch of props. You're this crazy girl that's an artist and you're just 13, 14 and you're going to show off to Moritz the character about how great you are, with whom you have sex even though you're so young, the money that you can get People are giving you money You're going to put lipstick on your lips. You're going to do your hair. You're going to do all this whilst you deliver the monologue, so he overloaded me with tasks and I shone because I could do that and it's complete chaos whilst going to hyper energy, and so I did that and it blew him away because I could do that.

Evelyn: 29:51

It doesn't take much and so, because I was so busy doing all that, the energy was channeled in a proper way, whereas most other people go like come on, just. And I tried to channel my Anne Frank Cause I'm a third generation, you know, I was with survivors, so surely I'm Anne Frank and it's just I wasn't getting the same thing. So yeah, all this to say we're coming at it from different ends, but I want to go back to your story, cause it's fascinating.

Lauri: 30:20

Yeah, it's fascinating. Yeah, I'd have to say I love that director and there is a difference between suppressing and channeling for people out there. If you're like, oh my god, you know some people try to suppress you, control you, tell you there's only one way to do it. Other people help you channel your genius, and that director helped you channel your genius.

Evelyn: 30:40

Yes, and he really. It was to the extent that the you know. I only had one scene in the play, but the poster was me.

Evelyn: 30:48

The newspaper review, my picture, big paragraph about that scene. It was the central scene of the whole piece and I'm grateful and satisfied that I got it out with that scene and he really let me go wild. He let me go wild and I can go wild, and by wild I mean I'm going to go and say more on the unhinged side, yeah, untamed unhinged, it's go. It goes into what people call me crazy a lot. I now stop them because I'm like tell me what is crazy about me, because you'll find I am not crazy.

Evelyn: 31:25

I battled with this thing and be are you so crazy? Like am I? Turns out I'm really. I'm really serene, yeah, but I'm very alive and that's not something you come across in that way that often. So you think that crazy, that's just more expressed than we know. But look, it's that. How is that crazy? And it's not dysfunctional, it's not ungrounded, it's not. No, no, I'm actually. This is, this is life, this is healthy. It takes a long time to find that. Anyway, I want to go back to your story. We are good girl, we are wild woman, we're kind of touching on these concepts and what I'm hearing is really there is the what is formed, and then there is, we become more distinguished, and then there is what is real and what.

Lauri: 32:10

I mean by that?

Evelyn: 32:11

is what is true to you. What is true to you? The acting scene. You got a chance to channel something that needed to come out, and I'm so happy that you had that experience, because after that, how did that change Laurie as a person?

Lauri: 32:27

Yeah, I had a lot more confidence that rippled into day-to-day life from like I know this, I know I'm born to do this my email address is one of them is born to act and has been. Um, I I'm born to do this, I know I'm good at it. When I listened to my intuition, my gut, what I feel is here, it comes alive Um, so I had that. You know, that was like a big breakthrough and I had that and I went off and I acted. And then there were some other key moments on the journey, many of which happened in acting classes and continued to ripple through life. I did find myself. You know, it was like the confidence was there on stage and the confidence was there in my acting and it's just continued to get stronger and stronger and stronger until I'm like, yeah, the wild, untamed, intuitive, creating. In the moment, laurie is 150% in charge. Every time I'm doing something that has to do with theater, from directing to acting, and it's still rippling into the other areas of my life.

Lauri: 33:50

I found myself in my favorite acting studio ever while working in the Silicon Valley. So, in the Silicon Valley, it's the most masked up place, one of the most masked up places in the world. So I was very known for my jaw tension while I was working there and it was like the last line of defense, like my whole body was actually tight. But I was such a sensitive person that like emotions would be there. I just sort of walked around like that and at one point when I was leaving one company in particular, somebody said I always thought you were angry, but now you look so free and so full of joy, like they would pass me in the hall and think that I was mad at them and they would say hi, and I wouldn't even realize they were there Around that point. The like smart version of Lori and the passionate version of Lori that would just kind of get very intense. And the porcelain doll quiet version of Lori. It's like three ways that I could be, depending on the circumstance, with a whole lot of the smart pulled together and I was doing an exercise in an acting class. That was an improv exercise, which isn't really the important part. I was on stage all by myself instead of having a partner or three up there, and they were throwing in prompts and it was not to be funny. It was called stretch work, to like stretch into your full capacity and I kept like pulling myself back together and putting on what was still left of that, like I'm fine. I'm fine, armor, in front of the heart and jaw tension.

Lauri: 35:40

And Richard said whatever that is that you're doing, stop doing it. And I said I'm not that comfortable having everyone's eyes on me. And then he took off his glasses and said then you've picked a strange set of careers for yourself. Part of you wants this. Part of you knows you're meant to be here. And it was like he was talking to like the, the lori who came out as abigail. The lori who was like playing make-believe with their friends, who all left. And I was like dancing in my backyard, finishing the story by myself. When my mom walked in and opened the garage door, that lori was like yes, I am, I'm meant to do things here. And he held an incredibly safe and sacred space and I'd been there for two years at that point.

Lauri: 36:32

So I jumped back into the exercise and was like releasing the jaw tension, releasing the stuff in front of my heart, noticing the thoughts of like.

Lauri: 36:40

But it doesn't make any sense to be completely sobbing when somebody walks in and says isn't the best ice cream flavor ever? And would just be like, well, you got to, yes and it, and be like I know I love this ice cream so much and just like ride this wave and go with it, scream so much. And just like ride this wave and go with it. And when that exercise was over, I looked out at all of my classmates and it was like that sensitive being who could always feel what was going on with people and had channeled it into. Let me have this kind of like oneness and sense what's going on and then immediately turn that into like how do I protect against you? Getting upset Was like, oh, I'm in tune with everybody and I can stay in tune with everybody and I can have me and my knowing and my power and I don't need to like go hide that or suppress it. We can be here together. That was huge.

Evelyn: 37:45

That is a huge advanced lesson in being yes, yeah and yeah.

Lauri: 37:51

And that that was like you know, they're related that one wouldn't have happened if the Abigail moment hadn't happened 10 or 12 years earlier, or whatever it was.