Beyond the Cello: Speaking Without the Shield

What happens when your voice disappears—right when you need it most?

In this deeply human conversation, Lisa Roche, host of the Find Your Flow podcast, joins Lauri to explore what it really means to find your voice when your body says no.

Lisa shares a powerful story of freezing, sobbing, and being unable to speak in front of others—despite years of performing on world-class stages. What followed wasn’t a technique or mindset shift, but a profound reckoning with vulnerability, community, and worth.

Together, Lauri and Lisa weave theater, music, somatics, spirituality, and leadership into a conversation about why so many of us hide behind our own “cellos” like slides, scripts, or peppy masks—and what becomes possible when we drop down into the truth beneath our words.

This is not a conversation about sounding better.
 It’s about becoming more available.
To ourselves. To others. To life.

If you’ve ever felt your throat close, your breath disappear, or your truth hover just out of reach—this episode is an invitation to come home.

Takeaways
1. Your voice doesn’t disappear because you’re weak—it disappears because something tender is asking to be met
2. Performance anxiety is often unprocessed vulnerability, not lack of skill
3. Many speakers hide behind “cellos”: slides, scripts, roles, or personas that feel safer than presence
4. True safety doesn’t come from control—it comes from connection
5. Harmony is not agreement; it’s different truths resonating together
6. Speaking becomes transformational when it’s a two-way energetic exchange, not a projection
7. Community can hold what the individual cannot
8. Finding your voice also means remembering and embracing your worth
9. When we stop trying to heal others, clarity and boundaries emerge

Soul Sucker Quiz

Take the Soul Sucker Quiz to learn which Soul Sucker screams the loudest in your mind so you can release them from being in charge and set your voice free!

https://voice-matters.com/soul-sucker-quiz/

The Speaker Alter Ego Quiz

Take the Speaker Alter Ego quiz to find out which protective mask hides your natural radiance so you can learn how to get present, connect deeply, and share your vision when it matters most!

https://voice-matters.com/speaker-alter-ego-quiz/

Transcript

The moment her voice completely disappeared

Lauri 0:32

Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the Soulful Speaking podcast. I am here today with Lisa Roche. She is the host of Find Your Flow, an unfiltered and heartfelt podcast that explores what really happens when life stops working, guiding honest conversations through burnouts, breakdowns, and breakthroughs to help listeners rediscover their flow. And for nearly 15 years, even before and while doing the Find Your Flow podcast, Lisa has been guiding individuals toward deep healing. Welcome, Lisa. Thanks for having me. Yeah, I'm so excited about today. I can't wait to dive in. My first question for you is where did your speaking journey begin?

Lisa 1:28

Ooh, that's a great question. Um I was in training, in a teacher training, a certification training for um gyrotonic, the gyrotonic method to become a certified instructor. And part of the foundational training program is to teach a class. And I knew the material, I knew exactly what I was doing. It wasn't as if I weren't prepared. I literally sat on a stool with the most welcoming, loving group of um co-trainers, co-trainees, and I needed to lead a class. And I had written it out. I knew exactly how it was going to flow. I knew exactly what every minute was going to entail. That wasn't the problem. It was when I went to speak. I could not access anything in my brain. I could not open my throat. I couldn't breathe. And I panicked. I had tears streaming down my eyes. I my heart was pounding, and all I could do was leave. I said my apologies and I ran out of the studio. And I say this half jokingly, but I'm also half serious that thank God I was in New York City, where if you're out on the streets of New York City sobbing, it doesn't matter. No one cares. Yeah.

Lauri 3:01

Been there.

Lisa 3:02

Like, could you get out of the way? Yeah. Yeah. I've been there. Yeah. To be dismissed was exactly what I needed. That was exactly what I needed. Um, and then a trainer came out to the master trainer and he asked me if I was okay. And I said, yes. I just am unable to speak. And he said, it's okay. I understand. It's okay. Just come in and I'm going to give you a pass on that one. So let's not worry about it. After that, I went home after my training. I told my husband about the experience. And I said, something has to change. If I am going to at any point in time in my life work with other people, I kind of have to be able to speak. Like that's hello. And he said, well, the theater school that our daughter was already enrolled in, they had just started a class for adults that I didn't know about. But my husband said, you know, H T A C, they just started a class, just got an email about it for adults. What do you say we do that? And my husband is from an extremely theatrical family. They're actors, they um, they're debate leaders, they they speak all the time, orators. They're they it's lovely. And I said to him, okay, can they teach me to talk and breathe at the same time? Because that's what I thought I was going to learn. I was like, the benchmark's so low. Can I not cry and not pass out? Like that that's not that's it. And he said, Oh, yeah. Yeah, for sure. They can teach you that.

Theater class, tears, and being held by community

Lauri 4:50

Yeah. It's so funny. Years and years ago, I was teaching a voice class in the theater, and people don't realize when they're nervous, sometimes they are like breathing just a little and calling it a life. And they're actually speaking and acting, but they're not actually breathing and talking at the same time. And I had like 38 students, because it was after budget cuts, and I remember one of them had been looking at other people going among the 38 people and like, what is wrong with them? Like, she thought she had it. And then she got up there and went to actually, I had like this feel people's ribs chain of like 38 people going around the room, and then each person would move to the front. And when she was at the front, brilliant, she looked at me and she was like, Lori, I've forgotten how to breathe. Uh-huh. There it is. And then she remembered how to breathe and make sound. And that's when whatever it is that you're feeling comes back up, which, you know, the end destination is it's coming up and it's infusing your acting or your speaking with life. Yeah. Sure. So what happened when you ended up in your theater class?

Why tears, rage, and joy belong in speaking spaces

Lisa 6:14

So I showed up for my theater class, and all we had to do was stand in front of this beautiful group of people with a fabulous instructor. Um, say our name and why we were there. That's it. I stood there, I looked at the entire class, and I couldn't remember my name. I couldn't speak it. And when I opened my mouth, it was just bawling. Balling. I could I could get maybe the sentiment of a sound on the breath coming out in the midst of a sob. That was it. Now, at the time, I thought performance anxiety, I don't want to be around these people. Which, listen, in retrospect, made no sense because by that point in my life, I had played cello in an orchestra, I played at Carnegie Hall, I've been on stages. Like it should not have been a big deal. But to use this instrument, to use my body, to use my soul, and to open myself up to that level of vulnerability, petrifying. So I stood there sobbing. And even my husband, I made sure that he was right in front of me so that he was my only sight line. And it didn't matter. I could not stop crying. I might start now because that group of people, they didn't just placate me, you know, and say, you're fine, you're fine, don't cry. No one said that. They instead jumped to their feet, formed a circle around me, and tightened and held me. I didn't even have to stand on my own two feet at that point. And it was in that moment that I realized I don't have to do anything alone. I don't have to hold myself up. I don't have to pretend I'm strong. I don't have to pretend I'm anything. I can literally just be. And in the right setting, I'm supported. I'm loved. Not in spite of my vulnerability, but because of my vulnerability. And that that was that was an amazing transformation in just a moment, in a moment of time. So by the end of the class, they asked me to try again. And of course, I cried, I cried again, but I could at least say my name. And I remember the instructor, he said, okay, now instead of all of us holding Lisa up, can we all just lay down on the floor with our heads in the center of the circle? And we did. We had all these heads all connected. And he said, Now just hold the hand of the person next to you. So we did that. And he said, Now close your eyes and breathe. And we all breathed. And I felt this undulation move through us. It felt like a jellyfish. It was the most beautiful, softest undulation of breath as we all found each other and harmonized and became one. And I thought, holy cow, like if this, if this is what this class is about, I'm going to discover way more than just how to breathe and talk at the same time. I mean, way more.

Lauri 10:12

And I did. Yeah. I love when theater is like that, because having been in it, it it isn't always. And I I used to tell people I've spent my life doing the research, research for you. Like I knew a woman who was a neuroscience-based coach, and she would tell people, I went to neuroscience school, so you don't have to. And I, you know, for a while there would tell people I went to theater school so you don't have to, because there is so much beauty and magic in the theater, in spaces like that, where people are able to be present with you that deeply. And as in coaching school, I went to a coaching school that was started by three actors, and they put tissues in the room. Yeah. And then tell people, do not hand another person a tissue.

Lisa 11:12

Yeah.

Lauri 11:13

That in our society is like saying, stop crying because I'm uncomfortable. Yes. Whereas if the tissues are there, if they need them, if they can't reach them, they can say, Will you please hand me a tissue? But if you hand a tissue, it sends a different message. And it's, you know, there is so much beauty in that part of the world where what makes you human, tears, rage, uncapped joy, all of it is welcomed and loved and supported and held in the space, whether you're laughing uncontrollably or sobbing uncontrollably as you speak. Yeah. Where did that class lead you? What did open up for you?

The cello as shield: how we hide while performing

Lisa 12:10

Well, it's incredible. I did, I did I did laugh uncontrollably in an improv scene about buying tampons. But after nearly three years in that class and building community and experiences, and really challenging myself to not just push the boundaries of my comfort, but to really expand them showed me that I not so much was capable of more, but deserving of more. Everything about that changed. Everything. How I communicate. Um I I opened a studio. It was an extremely um successful studio with personalized private sessions, group sessions. I had colleagues come and go and referral businesses, and it was this community that stemmed from me because I found my voice, I found my worth, I opened up my throat to be able to express and receive. That was a big lesson. I mean, to go from uh like uh turning away compliments to actually receiving them, embodying them, and then and then allowing them to like tattoo to the inside of me to really own it. It changes everything. Everything. So my sense of courage has completely um redefined in in what I feel I'm capable of doing. Uh the level of empowerment. I mean, come on now. I realized all the years I played cello, I realized, ooh, well, that was a nice shield, wasn't it? It completely covers your entire body, right? Even lays against your chest and you hold it with your legs. So all of your stress and strain wraps around an instrument and literally goes into the bone of the spine of that instrument. It takes all of your energy on. So to lay it bare, to stand on a stage, because we always had to do a showcase at the end of every term.

Lauri 16:08

Mm-hmm.

Lisa 16:10

That was um for me when I realized, oh, wait a second, people aren't here to judge me, they're here to celebrate me. I had never consciously experienced that ever before, ever. That there could be people who sit and um show up just because they want to support you. We're not award-winning actors and actresses, we're not even professionals. We're paying to be able to have this experience. And they showed up, they showed up to fill the seats, which means the world to listen, to witness, to bear witness to all of our growth.

Lauri 16:56

Yeah.

Lisa 16:56

Oh my God. Talk about a sense of self-worth.

Dropping below the surface: speaking from soul connection

Lauri 17:00

Holy shit, like yeah, yeah, and there's a huge difference between performing an action like playing the cello, like doing a scene in an acting class, like singing a song, like giving a speech, where a part of us is still in fight or flight. It might be far more subtle than what you experienced when you were standing at the front of the class, and really being present and having an experience with that group of people that have come to receive from you and to celebrate you. Yes. And as you're talking about the cello, I'm thinking of, you know, number one, if you just just just stumbled on this podcast, this is not your typical speaking show. Because speaking is all that deep. Like there is that much going on when we're speaking. It's like our whole entire life comes up on stage with us, whether we're aware of it or not. So some people are speaking and it's going fine. And when I look at them, I feel like they're doing their version of hiding behind the cello. In fact, maybe even hiding more, because the cello was like your spine, and there may have been more than your average amount of life in your body, and more than your average amount of creativity because you had that spine in addition to your own. And sometimes that's the PowerPoint slides for people, or sometimes that's a like, yeah, yeah. Yeah, someone told me I needed to be, I needed to smile more when I speak. So I there's this like peppy mask thing that happens. If you could talk to those people through whatever they're hiding behind, what would you want them to know?

Harmony vs. agreement (and why it matters right now)

Lisa 19:13

If you're able to drop down, drop down right between your heart and your solar plexus is this sweet spot of like a soul connection there. And if you're able to allow yourself to get down and then connect from that point, what you experience, what you share is amplified a trillion times over because you're no longer just sort of one-sided from a flat surface projecting outward. You're now creating this infinite connection, a circular connection, this spiral of energy that allows you to get and give. And in that energetic exchange is truth. And in that truth, oh my god, you'll never be safer. Ever. So I get it that when you're coming from a flat place and you're projecting outwards and you are um just presenting, I get it. I get that you feel safe there. But because that's rooted in fear, because that's rooted in the I have to be safe, you lose that, oh my God, the nectar and the juice of that connection. You lose that um that specialness that happens when you can drop down and allow for that soul connection to happen. Oh my God, it's totally different.

Lauri 21:11

I get chills just thinking about it. It's totally different. Me too. I started, it's like the pulse, the waves and the pulse of the breath harmony that you experience. It's like that speaking from there. Even if you're recording a podcast episode by yourself, if you're speaking from there, you're still in that harmony. Harmony where you are one and a part of the whole at the same time.

Lisa 21:42

Yeah. And I love that you called it harmony. Because there's a harmonic that needs to happen. You're not taking two aspects and balancing them. You're not taking you and your audience and balancing them. You're creating a harmonic. Oh my God. And in there is this rhythm, these ups and downs and a syncopation that can only happen when you're truly allowing yourself to connect and receive and listen and tune all at the exact same time. It's amazing.

Lauri 22:19

For the non-musicians out there, uh it's beautiful. And I and I want to say what I took from that is a balance would be we both play the same note. We are agreeing. And if I were to make it like what's going on in the world today, we are agreeing with each other and saying the same things.

Lisa 22:43

Yes.

Trusting the unknown

Lauri 22:44

And a harmonic is we're playing different notes that work together. And if we really want to geek out, like sometimes they really work even when they're intentionally discordant. My head is starting to itch.

Lisa 23:00

I'm like, yeah, because someone could be flat while the other is sharp. And somehow in the middle, you get this beautiful sound. It's amazing. Yeah. And for those who are not musicians, it would be the same as saying, um, you have an opinion, and I state, I restate your opinion, and we come into agreement and we go, isn't that a lovely conversation? But nowhere in there was this is my why, and this is where I stand, and this is what I believe and hold to be true. What do you believe and hold to be true? And maybe it's different from mine. And where can we find that um that balance in a different way? Where can we find that um agreement in a totally different way? Where can I pick out one word that I go, that speaks to me? Yeah, can we maybe zoom in on that one and speak to that? Instead of this, well, because we're not in agreement, we can no longer have a conversation. Yeah.

Lauri 24:03

You know? Yeah. Beautiful. Oh. Okay. So you opened a studio. I did. And then what happened with the studio? Where did your voice take you in between then and now?

Using voice when touch is no longer available

Lisa 24:18

So cool. So the studio was fabulous. It was beautiful, it was a wonderful experience. Um, and it and I and I had it. I worked in the gyrotonic world for, I don't know, a dozen years, something like that. And I being extremely um spiritual and I meditate every day and I listen to um divine guidance, I was told one day to close the studio and I didn't understand why, but I accepted that it needed to happen. Um, and on faith, because when you find your voice, the beautiful part is you find this trust as well. And so I leaned into that trust and I closed my studio. And for the last two years, I've been trying to figure out who I am now? Who is this version of Lisa who still wants to be able to connect with people, who still wants to be able to help and have impact in the world. And I tried a couple of things that didn't necessarily work out, but I learned a ton. Um, and then what six, seven months ago, I heard the calling to start a podcast. And I thought to myself, okay, I don't know what a podcast is. I've never listened to a podcast, I have no idea what I'm doing. But it is using my voice in a totally different way. Whereas before, I very much relied on the physicality of connection. A body in front of me, I could look at that body, I could tell you exactly what was going on, why there was trauma, where it started from, how we're going to heal it and unwind it. Easy. A dozen years of perfecting a teaching through my voice. COVID was amazing for that. All of a sudden we're six feet away from each other and I can't touch them. And all in the chats were how are we supposed to help our clients if we can't touch them? How are we supposed to guide a movement if you can't get hands-on?

Lauri 26:41

Mm-hmm.

The podcast as a healing circle for guests and listeners

Lisa 26:42

And I thought, what's the problem? If you communicate it, and if you can create the experience through sound, through breath, through um a rhythm, a rhythm in your speech patterns, you never have to touch another human being ever again. So then comes this opportunity to create this podcast. And I thought, huh, this is going to be interesting. I have no idea what it looks like, but this is going to be interesting. And it literally started off with love letters from Lisa, where I just spoke to the listener. I wrote a love letter and I read it out loud. And I thought, this is beautiful. This feels like I'm putting my children to sleep again. Like that was lovely. And I had been leading guided meditations for years. So I put those on the podcast. And then I started getting requests from people to be guests. And that scared me more than the one-sided speak from a wall, project outwards. Oh shit. Now I have to connect with the person who's in front of me, except they're not in front of me, and I don't know how to do that. Except I did because I spent a dozen years working on that skill set. And lo and behold, it is so much fun. It's so much fun. I get to meet beautiful people like you. I get to enjoy these different experiences. I don't necessarily agree with every word every every guest has to say. It doesn't matter. Yeah. It doesn't matter because I'm getting to experience them in this perfect moment of who they are right then and there. And I think that comes across.

Lauri 29:46

Having been there and listened, I would say it does. And it's that harmony, again, in action, where you don't agree with every single word that comes out of the guest's mouth. And it's not about that. Right. It's about creating something with your voices together.

Lisa 30:10

Yes, exactly. And what I will say is feedback from guests overwhelmingly tell me they're so appreciative to have been welcomed, to have been heard, to have been seen. And for me, that's everything. Because then that means the listener gets to show up to that episode. And it's as if they were sitting here with us. Where they are welcomed, they are seen, they are heard. And it doesn't matter who you are, where you are in your life, where you are in your journey, you're validated. And to me, like that's the best gift I could ever receive. So that's thrilling. It's thrilling that that's a gift that I get to give as well.

Lauri 31:13

Yeah, it reminds me of the acting class. It's like a virtual version of the acting class where you're holding the listeners and the, sorry, you are holding the guest, and the listeners are like the other people in the class, energetically circling, and also being a part of. Because, you know, when you've taken group classes like that, there's a way that sometimes someone is the one on the stage, yet six other people in the room are also receiving the transformation, you know, a touch of the transformation, the healing, the inspiration that's happening for the one who's up on the stage that day.

Lisa 32:04

Yeah, it's like being able to, I don't know, sort of experience your own mini transformation through someone else's experience. That's that's how I learned growing up. Like I learned what not to do because other people got in trouble. And I was like, hmm, maybe I shouldn't do that, right? Or you see somebody, somebody does something successful, and you're like, hmm, okay, maybe I'll try it that way instead. And that was like the the underlying um goal for the podcast was to be able to offer this buffet of options. Wherever you are, whatever works for you, by all means, come on over, come to the buffet, try something, see if this works for you. If it does, great. If it doesn't, bring it back, put it back down, try something else. There's zero judgment. What supports you, what helps you? Because at the end of the day, I I truly, truly believe when every single person finds their voice is able to speak from a place of such confident vulnerability, meaning you're able to speak your truth without judgment. And when you're able to do that, you don't receive judgment either. Because it doesn't matter what anybody else says, because you're coming from a place where you understand I have value, and if I understand that and accept it so deeply, if my voice deserves to be heard, and I do so in love, without judgment, with only acceptance, that doesn't mean agreed, but acceptance, then you too deserve to be valued, deserve to be loved, deserve to speak, deserve to be your radiation of truth, without judgment. And there's that equality. There's that relationship built on your worth every bit as much as I am. Yeah. And I am worth every bit as much as you. Yeah. And then the world changes.

Strength, contrast, redwoods, and the power of community

Lauri 34:37

Yeah. My my mind just went to so many different places. This is one of those moments where I 1000% agree with you. I feel like humanity is an orchestra of voices. And when we're all playing full out, and what you just described is what full out means: drums being drums, violins being violins, when humanity is speaking from that place of full expression, not agreement, that's when we will get to global harmony. Agreed. And I've had someone in my world in the last several months looking for healing that the rest of us in this person's world could not provide. Like the wound is so deep. Yeah. And I go I'm in a lot of spiritual circles too, where um people would say, like, you know, something would happen and I would grow and get stronger because of it. And people would say, Aren't you thankful that that happened? And I would be like, this time I have to tell you, it's been one of the most challenging experiences of my entire life. Because when two forces come together like that, and one is craving this healing that no other human on the planet can provide for them, it triggered all kinds of stuff in me. Sure. Like people pleasing, which I thought I didn't do. And it was like in that circumstance, I was doing it.

Lisa 36:33

Yeah.

Lauri 36:34

And I got so much stronger from the experience, and so much clearer that I am honestly grateful for one of the most challenging experiences of my entire life because of how much stronger. For sure. And stronger meaning boundaries, like the clarity of, well, there's no reason to people please, because it doesn't matter where I step. I cannot heal this for this other person. So watch the part of me that wants to people please and then choose what's right. Knowing it's like this paradox, non-paradox, if there is nowhere to step that won't cause a reaction, then it becomes obvious and easy to do the thing that is right from intuition. Yeah, absolutely. And that, you know, it's not, we're not saying it's going to be a comfortable road for all of us to get to this global harmony.

Lisa 37:49

The opposite, actually.

Lauri 37:51

The opposite. Just like if I'm, which I am, there's weights on the floor right next to me, um, lifting a weight. My bicep feels stuff. My legs feel things when I lift the right weight. And then I also feel the like, wow, when I go to carry a suitcase up a flight of stairs, I am so much stronger.

Lisa 38:15

Yes. Yeah. I mean, when you think about your nature spirit, a tree, a tree is can only grow as strong as it needs to be because the wind whips it around. Yeah. We as humans grow through contrast. And while I'm really sorry that's a sucky human experience, it is the a rule of nature that things grow through contrast and they grow stronger when they have to grow against another force. Right. A tree's roots are only as, well, for most trees, are only as deep as they are tall. The only tree that doesn't live by that rule is the redwood. The giants, the great giants. Because their root system grows into the root system of the tree next to it. So you have a network of roots that hold all of these massive trees up. Tallest trees. Tallest trees. Why? How? Because they're connected through community.

Lauri 39:34

Yeah. I could talk to you forever. Amen, sister, me too. I have a feeling we will have more conversations over lifetimes. I hope so. Um, I always love to ask, it this will all be in the show notes if you're driving a car. And sometimes people like to hear aloud. Where can people find you? To you mentioned buffet. There's the buffet on the podcast. Come to the buffet. How can they find the buffet?

Pivot Pivot Closing Questions

Lisa 40:08

Well, you can go to nagare life.com, n-a-garlife.com. Nagare is Japanese for the flow of water. So if you go to Nagarelife.com, that takes you actually directly to my link tree, to the buffet that is my life and my existence. There you will find links to um everything to find your flow, to the podcast. It's available on wherever you get your podcast. Um you can get the audio, you can get video. So that's always lovely. There's a blog that um I have just started populating, little thoughts, you know, just thoughts that are shared. And I believe that that will mostly be meditations to give some place um for people to go and sit in reflection. And then you'll also find Lisa's favorite things. So that takes you to um literally my favorite things right now.

Lauri 41:17

Awesome. Thank you so much. And I have to say, um, we all have every once in a while something comes up that lets us know, like, oh, here's how you're maybe hiding behind the cello. And I've had one today. The I lead meditation type, they're not totally meditations, and yet they are. And I've had so many people in my world recently say, you should share more of those. You should share more of those. And I have my own buffet on the podcast. And today, while talking to you, I've been like, you know, I think you're a little low on that element of the buffet because you don't think of it as valuable as often, even though the world is telling you that it is. So thank you so much for the reminder. One in a symphony of signs in the universe saying weave more of that into the buffet. People are hungry for it. So thank you for that. Yeah. Yeah.

Lisa 42:23

Where can we find your meditations? That'll be lovely and wonderful.

Lauri 42:27

Yeah, there are some on my website, which is which is voiced matters.com. I'm gonna start doing some here in the podcast, and there may be an insight timer. Thing that happens, or it may simply be that the universe is saying, just do some of your mini sods on the podcast where you give that.

Lisa 42:51

Just saying, that would be nice.

Lauri 42:56

I have an appointment after this. And I take your meaning. I do take your meaning. Okay, let's slide into the pivot pivot. Okay. Lisa. What is your favorite word? Oh shit. What is your least favorite word? No. What turns you on creatively, spiritually, or emotionally?

Lisa 43:35

Feeling connected to whatever it is that I'm doing and with whom I I get the pleasure to be with in that moment. What turns you off?

Lauri 43:48

No. What is your favorite cuss word? Fuck. What sound or noise do you love? Oh.

Lisa 44:06

You know that sound that an infant makes when they're sleeping where they're suckling on nothing? That sound.

Lauri 44:20

What sound or noise do you hate? Chewing. What profession other the ones other than the ones you've already tried in your life would be fun to try? Ooh.

Lisa 44:38

You know what's funny? My daughter sent me this video where there were, I can't remember where it was. But there was this competition for sleeping. Like how long could you stay in bed? I really feel like I could be a champion at that. I really do. I love the Herkelderkle. So I that I would work at that. I don't know if I get paid for it, but that.

Lauri 45:08

Oh, I love it. I love it. And uh what profession would you not, under any circumstances, like to do?

Lisa 45:22

I would never be in a profession where I have to take a life, demean or discredit anyone for a living.

Lauri 45:43

And Lisa, what do you hope people say about you on your one hundredth birthday? That she lived a life that was good. Thank you so much for sharing your heart and your story and your presence and your passion and all things you hear on Soulful Speaking. Ugh.

Lisa 46:15

We started with tears, we're ending with tears. This was a good one. It was.

Lauri 46:22

It was. Oh, and if uh you're a listener and you're out there with some tears or some laughter, and this touched you in some way or helped you in some way, please share it with someone else. Take a moment to review it, to to review it, to rate it, um, all those things, and come back and listen to the next one.