Inside the Mind of a Derby Winner | Doug O’Neill on Nyquist & I’ll Have Another

On this episode of Horse Races Now, we sit down with 2-time Kentucky Derby winning trainer Doug O’Neill, the man behind champions like I’ll Have Another, Nyquist, and Goldencents.

Doug takes us inside his incredible journey—from working as a hotwalker to reaching the pinnacle of horse racing—and shares behind-the-scenes stories from his biggest victories on the sport’s grandest stage.

We dive into:
🔥 The unforgettable 2012 Triple Crown run with I’ll Have Another
🏆 Winning the Kentucky Derby (twice) and what it really takes
🐎 How he develops elite racehorses from the ground up
🎯 His training philosophy and what separates great horses
💼 The evolving landscape of horse racing today
💭 Lessons learned from adversity and staying at the top

Whether you’re a racing fan, owner, or just love great sports stories—this is an episode you don’t want to miss.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:19

170 million in first earnings. 250 earnings. A pretty good steak. Multiple readers cut. It's a one and only, a legendary Doug O'Neill. What's up, Doug?

SPEAKER_03 0:32

Oh man, thanks for having me. And thanks for those kind words and buildup. You're making me sound way better than I am, but I love it.

SPEAKER_00 0:38

I don't know about that. I mean, hey, listen, we're so pumped to have you on. Thank you for doing this. Um, let's just dive in. So, so Doug, you you grew up in Michigan. Uh, you discovered racing at Santa Anita as a kid. What was the moment that made you think, hey, this is what I could do with my life?

SPEAKER_03 0:57

You know, yeah. Growing up in Michigan, my first 10 years, my dad and my uncles all went to the standard breads and some of the flat racing as well. And so I was constantly heard all about racing as a kid, and but you had to be 14 or older to get in. So I was always kind of, hmm. And then we moved to California when I was 10. And the very first weekend we went to Santa Anita, and I was like, oh my god, now I know why my dad and my uncles love to love horse racing. So um that was kind of the first, my first exposure to the sport. And then uh I had a mentor and a basketball coach, um, Coach Amade, Mike Amade, and uh he hooked me up with Jude Feld, who was training at the time, and I was in high school and got to go to the barn area, the the the backstage, if you will, the locker room, if you will. And I just pretty much knew I I wasn't really good in school and didn't enjoy school. I I knew once I got out of high school, I was gonna figure out a way to um call horse racing um, you know, to my my life. So um kind of did that right out of high school and and have never looked back.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

So, Doug, you knew right away. So you knew at a young age. I mean, and listen, most trainers come from uh families who have a long history in horse racing. You know, that wasn't the case with you. You must have just had the bug and the love at an early age.

SPEAKER_03 2:23

Yeah, you know, it's it's funny because I I being a first generation horseman uh is pretty cool, and you know, it would also be pretty cool if if my dad or grandfather or or mom or grandmother was in it too. So I think any which way you can uh get involved, it's it's a beautiful thing. And and um, you know, I had uh um I got three older brothers that are all do well for themselves, and and and yet my dad uh who's passed away, but he would always kind of lead when we go to situations, he'd lead into, you know, oh my youngest is a horse trainer. That led the way over uh you know, having a brother who was a CPA and another one owned a little business and stuff. So um yeah, I just had a lot of support from from family and friends, and uh um, you know, and just working alongside horses is just it truly it's hard to explain the the the amazingness of it and uh and how amazing these horses are.

SPEAKER_00 3:30

So, all right, this might be a tough question to answer, but it what I've found having these conversations with different trainers is everybody does it a little bit different. Um, you know, obviously this is this is Kenny McPeak's baby, and and Kenny is very unique in a lot of the ways he does things. Um Doug, take us a little bit behind the scenes. Like, you know, what is it that that you do different and what is it that makes your barn successful?

SPEAKER_03 3:57

Wow, well, yeah, I I yeah bottom line, the horses are the stars, right? So I I think uh every trainer has to give a lot of love and credit to the men and women he surrounds himself to surround the horses with. So, you know, I I think having a longtime assistant in Leandro Mora, we've been together longer than I can count, at least 20 years. Um and I've got so much of the staff that have been around for a long, long time too. So that continuity is huge. Um and then I you know, I really think uh it is ideal, um aside from the horsemanship and the caretaking, to have a little bit of a handicapping mindset of placement, placing of horses. So I I think got a little bit of uh help there too. Um you know, and then uh a really good horse, which I've been blessed to be around more than a few, God, if you just stay out of their way and you give them love and you give them care and you do them right, um, and you lead them halfway into the right situation, they're gonna make you look smart. I like that. Um yeah, so I think that's really uh has been a real um godsend for me is I just I've had more than a few horses make me look smart, and the ones that I look stupid with, we we try to try to move them on to other barns that maybe can make them look smart. So yeah, it's just a matter of uh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:33

Kenny, Kenny always says it's about having the right horses, the right owners. Um you've obviously had your fair share. Another thing that you've done, and this is for me doing a deep dive here, you're kind of known for having a positive culture uh and having that environment around your barn. Is that something that's intentional?

SPEAKER_03 5:53

It is. I've kind of been wired that way. Uh got a dear friend from literally when I first moved to California, we became friends and we're still friends. I was just on the phone with him about an hour ago, a guy named Mark Verge. And um yeah, he is just the most upheat guy. And we joke, we like to start the morning off like we're shot out of a cannon, and just uh try to take that looking at the the good and everything. And like every business, horse racing is no different. You can find five, ten, fifteen people that act like you know the business is gonna end tomorrow, type of thing. And it's just try to stay away from from those those people and and uh and just try to try to stay upbeat about it. And can horse racing get better, of course. And uh, but every business can. So it's just really trying to work hard, stay positive, and and try to make uh um the the sport be a positive force for good, uh, you know, a positive force for the sport as it uh continues to get a little bit better every day.

SPEAKER_00 7:02

Well you you you kind of led me there, Doug, so I'm I'm gonna ask. I mean, so so why California? Obviously, the West Coast um has had its fair share of struggles in the horse racing industry. You could easily be in Kentucky or or New York or Florida or any of those places. Why are you based in California?

SPEAKER_03 7:19

Well, I got a lot of roots here, so that that's probably the primary thing, but also, you know, here we are um mid-March and it's 80-some degrees, it's beautiful out, you know. So you got the weather stuff, which to me is really we we've been lucky to win a lot of big races around the world. Based out of Southern California, and I I think um I think being able to train every day and the the conditions that we're blessed with out here are conducive for you know year year in, year out, you know, all year long positive results. So we do have a barn at Keenan in Kentucky, so I do have uh 15 or 20 horses there, so we kind of get our toe in the water there, thanks to Mr. Kelly Kelly Mint Farms. Um he owns a barn there. And um I don't know that Kentucky is uh I mean the purses are insane and and uh you know you you you're so proud every time you step into Kentucky uh telling people you're you're involved in the great sport of horse racing. So um got a lot going for it there for sure, but just probably more than anything, the roots I have here in California and the the the conditions, the weather conditions and the you know, San Anita. I know it's gone through a bunch of craziness, political stuff, whatever, but it's still arguably one of the greatest tracks in the world, and and it's just uh a great office to come to every day.

SPEAKER_00 8:47

So uh listen, i i again I'm gonna mention Kenny one more time here. He's really good of being non-political with his answers, Doug. He's he he's an open book on some things. So I'm I'm gonna ask you to maybe try really hard on this next one. What what is it that we need to do to fix course rates in California? What needs to happen?

SPEAKER_03 9:09

You're trying to give me fixed out of standards. No, I'm not at all.

SPEAKER_00 9:12

I mean, I'm just I'm looking for, you know, just how how do we how do we fix that? And maybe maybe you say, hey, listen, this is just your view. Things aren't broken. Um, you know, it's just it's it seems that like there's a lot of news, there's a lot of everything you read is that things aren't as good on the West Coast in the horse racing industry. You know, what what could we do to make things better there?

SPEAKER_03 9:36

Yeah, you know, it it's tricky, and and uh um I I do think as we see a lot of Kentucky flourish and keep moving forward, you know, the um added gaming uh is is huge. So I I think California somewhere or another, I would love to see them figure out a way to do a deal with the American Indians and and uh and try to work alongside them and work together. Um I think if we had some form of paramutual um machines, aside from the racing, you know, we would definitely uh see the purses go up, the price money go up, and uh the marketing dollar go up, and uh we're we're our hands are kind of tied and not a lot of marketing, and it's a lot of it, just there's not enough money there to market. So I think that's probably the simplest thing would be need some form of extra family. And then you see the way I've got a 23-year-old son who uh we had lunch yesterday and you know he likes to bet one or two games every night. He's like, ah dad, who you like in the NHL tonight? Well, we were talking out stuff, and and it does bump me out there's so many of these different apps and sites that are bringing in billions of dollars in sports betting. And here we already have a ready-made, unbelievable facility that has legalized paramutual wagering and the fig uh that we it is frustrating that we can't figure out how to uh get that younger group who you know is dabbling in in this stuff. So yeah, that that's my roundabout way to th those areas would help us a ton.

SPEAKER_00 11:23

So, Doug, I have a 16-year-old son, and you know, he he likes going to the we we live pretty close to Churchill Downs. So he likes going to the track and and we like, you know, just betting on a horse here or there, but it's not something he's begging to go do. How do we get, and you know this all too well with your 23-year-old, how do we get that next generation interested in horse racing to where they want to be as invested as as some of the people in our our age demographic are?

SPEAKER_03 11:51

I think the it sounds so wacky because I don't even know what the definition of this is, but you know, I think the influencers, um and Sandita, they've got a pretty good this group sales department they've got, and they are always reaching out to these quote-unquote influencers who have a lot of followers trying to get them to come out to the track, and and you see 99% of the people, if you come out to the track, you're gonna have a good time. You got the one percent that are you could send them to Disneyland and they're gonna figure out why goofy. But uh so I I think getting influencers were in that era where that would be very beneficial. And um I've always thought too if they had at every track in the country, uh like one Saturday a month where it was like a a derby kind of dress up and feel, and you had celebrity bartenders and that type of stuff, that would be uh pretty cool thing. Cause I think most and you're a couple years away, but most 18 to 35 year olds, you know, they're working, making four or five hundred dollars a week, whatever, and and they usually spend about eighty percent of it, you know. They got they just aren't aren't thinking of saving just yet. And so, you know, they're looking for a good time, good experience, and I think the racetrack has got a really good um setup to give that to them, and it's just a matter of uh you know having the the people that could put that into play.

SPEAKER_00 13:25

I love your thoughts there. Influencers having kind of the celebrity bartenders. We do this thing around here called jocktails that we have jockeys be bartenders during the derby weeks. I love it. I think that's a uh really an answer. Kentucky Derby, I'll have another. Talk to me about your nerves that day. Give me the experience. Yeah, I just want to know how that felt.

SPEAKER_03 14:26

Man, you know, I coming in uh off the San Diego Derby win, we were just on cloud nine, and Paul and Zilla Redham, arguably, I'm I'll fight for them every day, are like the best owners you could ever have. I mean, they love the sport and they're uh they're so kind and generous. And because of that, we had like a large team of people at the in the barn, some friends and family, and Paul was really adamant to try to keep it as normal, you know, trying to pick up our barn at Arcadia and our friends and our group and bring them. And just so uh we weren't overthinking anything too much. We were just still living our life. So, anyways, his appaul, we you know, he rented a really nice house with like an M T V reality TV series. We had the groom, my assistants, all of us were in a home there in uh in Louisville and um So yeah, it was real exciting, but we had just a great group that uh uh we were just celebrating every day. Every day he would he'd get to the barn and he ate up this, you know, his feed tub was empty and his legs were cold, and then he he was such a giving horse on the track. He would work out like no other horse. I mean, he'd gallop around there like two-minute lick every day, and so just hearing some ooze and ahs from you know the people that gather to watch Derby Horses train, he just felt it. I I don't know. I i it was just so exciting, and uh and then but I we were more just pumped being there.

SPEAKER_00 16:03

Sure.

SPEAKER_03 16:04

And then I remember watching the race on the rail, and I kinda knew he was coming. I wasn't sure, and I could kind of hear the name, wasn't sure, and yeah, so it it that is something that I'll never forget. The uncertainty of like, is that really oh my you know, and then the the rest is crazy history, but yeah, it's just wild, and and to be able to do it um alongside Paul and Zillaradum is just you know, it it just doesn't get any better than that.

SPEAKER_00 16:32

Did you all party that night?

SPEAKER_03 16:34

Oh, I'm sure we did. Yeah, I love it. Uh I know we all went to dinner and then dinner led to a few drinks, and yeah, it uh I'm sure a lot of us didn't get a whole lot of sleep uh before racing to the barn in the morning and and checking in on the big horse stuff. Very, very cool experience, and you know, anyone who hasn't been to a Kentucky Derby, you gotta do it once because uh the energy and the air of all the people, the the great horses, and uh it's just second and none. I I I I love that uh uh the whole week leading into it. You know, you go to a lot of the restaurants, they got their uh their derby horses, you know, all over the place. It's just yeah, fun, great, and uh hopefully uh we got another one in us somewhere down the road here.

SPEAKER_00 17:23

Yeah, I hope so. We'll get to that. I I'm I'm hoping you can uh shed some light on some horses you've got in the barn. But um I want to stick with I'll have another here real quick because went on to win the preakness. And then, I mean, you re had a real a real shot at the triple crown, right? Did you think that that was possibility?

SPEAKER_03 17:42

I I did, yeah, I thought I really did. And and uh um even through a couple friends who were friends type of thing, had lunch with the late Billy Turner, CL Slews trainer, and that was just amazing. And uh, you know, his advice to me was just God, whatever got you here, keep doing it. Don't change anything, because you are tempted when you're that close to like bubble wrap them and not train them much. But we just uh he was two minute licking around that uh Belmont track like it was nobody's uh business. And yeah, he if he would have got to the gate, I'm pretty confident he would have got the job done and and uh but it just wasn't meant to be and and uh you know, in in typical Paul Redham fashion when I called him about uh the injury, you know, he just said, Oh god, well you just please high five and hug everybody for getting us this far, it's been incredible, and you know, we ended up staying for the race, even though we were weren't in it. You know, yeah, just the the the sportsmanship of uh of Paul and Zilla Redum is second and none, and it really trickled down to everyone at the bar. And we went from feeling sorry for ourselves for a few minutes to celebrating the amazing journey that I'll have another uh gave us. So we it was uh it was a gut shot, but also uh uh a real blessing.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

It had to be a heartbreaking scratch for sure. Um all right. Well, what talk to me and listen, I I remember this one very well because I I was at a derby party and I pulled out Nyquist out of a out of a pot. I think it was a hundred dollar pot. And at the time I wasn't real sure I had the right horse, but man, I sure did. So talk to me about Nyquist. Uh how was he different than from I'll have another?

SPEAKER_03 19:35

God, you know, he was just so brilliant from the word go. He uh I'll have another was kind of a lunch pail, uh hard hat, you know, just uh coffee thermos type of thing. Uh um and he really gradually just got better and tougher. And but Nyquist was just I mean, he was just like a first round pick and you know, the any sports draft, whatever. He was just such a freak of a specimen. And uh pretty much from the time we brought him in Santa Anita, we were in awe of him. We were just praying every day to keep him injury free. You know, when they're that good and they do things so easily, you're just like I I can't imagine any horse in the barn area can beat this horse. And uh and he undefeated going into Derby. And so no, he he was just so darn naturally gifted, and now you see him as a stallion. He's just arguably one of the best stallions in the world, and they take a turf, dirt, print, route. It just uh yeah, I it's unfortunate that his career was cut short. He was just so valuable as a stallion, but uh I I would have loved to have seen him as a four-year-old and a five-year-old, and he was freakishly talented.

SPEAKER_00 20:55

Was that due to injury?

SPEAKER_03 20:58

Yeah, yeah. He got uh um ran him in the freakness, and he just came out of that like with a temp and that well, and then we got him better there, and I I think we ran him a few more times, and uh yeah, you could tell he was just in dire need of like 90 days rest and uh um just uh there was a lot of stallion stuff going on and it just there wasn't any time to think of a four-year-old campaign. So unfortunate part of being a brilliant horse in in the game of horse racing, but um but the reality of um you know an undefeated son of Uncle Mo uh went in the Derby. You know, he there was a lot of interest of of in him of being a sign, so that was completely understandable.

SPEAKER_00 21:53

All right. So uh I come from a golf background, and and we always talk about how anybody can get high. And win one, right? When you win two, that means you're actually pretty darn good. So what it what did winning that second derby mean to you?

SPEAKER_03 22:10

Yeah, I I think it it does. Um it's so darn hard to win because we all know the best horse doesn't win the derby most of the time.

SPEAKER_00 22:20

Yeah. Most of the times, right.

SPEAKER_03 22:23

Yeah, most of the time. So um yeah, I think it just makes you realize how blessed and how fortunate, how lucky uh we all were, and and to be the same team as um, you know, another Paul and Redum, Paul and Zilla Redum uh um horse was same thing. He got he got us uh got the crew same type of thing, home just so we could all celebrate life every day and and and enjoy the whole process leading up to it. So um yeah, I I think the second time maybe a little bit more loose, but in this sport, you know, you're only so loose, and then once they once they're in the post parade, I don't care if it's a five claimer or a hundred thousand dollar safe race, there's always that energy of being in a passenger on a turbulent airplane, you know, you're like, yeah, you got no control, you just gotta ride this through. This is crazy energy, but but it's uh it's beautiful energy too. But um yeah, it it uh was pretty pretty wild and and uh pretty cool uh to to win a second one, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_00 23:34

All right, Doug, you train sprinters, dirt milers, derby horses. Um what is your core philosophy behind how you develop a horse?

SPEAKER_03 23:45

I remember the the late great Charlie Whittingham. The the one blessing, one of the many blessings I had was cutting my teeth in the sport, um and being surrounded by Las Brera, Charlie Whittingham, uh Mel Studi, um I'm I'm forgetting so many legends that uh uh were out here, Bobby Frankel. And I remember Charlie Whittingham uh talking to a group of trainers and I was just a kid wet behind the ears, just kind of outside listening in. But he said uh the most brilliant thing, he said, if you got a horse and you work them a mile, if you got a sprinter and you work him a mile every week, he's still a sprinter. If you got a miler and you work them three eighths every week, you still got a miler. So his whole point was you get them fit, race fit, and then you run them to wherever they need to run. And uh, because you will get up I'll still go to owners who horses will get a little tired and they're like, Well, can you work them two miles, maybe? And I'm like, it it sounds good and it looks good on paper, but it's not the reality.

SPEAKER_00 24:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 24:54

You know, they you can only get them a certain fit, and then you gotta run them against the class and the distance that they want to go going. So um I think that's kind of my mindset. I do a lot of galloping and trying not to focus too much on works, but the really good horses are gonna work fast, even if you don't try to make them work fast. So it's just it is that's you know, a Porsche is gonna go really fast. You try to go 100 miles an hour on a Ford Pinto and probably ain't gonna go too good. So I i it's uh it's really just trying to get each and every horse fit and then try to figure out where they where they belong.

SPEAKER_00 25:36

Well, you mentioned earlier in our conversation where you're saying that you know having a a a bit of a handicapping background or mindset has helped you a little bit. Give our listeners a little bit of insight. Like what are you looking at when you handicap a race? Is there a certain rating, a certain thing that that you kind of key on when you're trying to pick a winner?

SPEAKER_03 25:59

I think my two go-tos, kind of the one thing I remember as as a younger person, I think all of us prior to the internet and stuff, I remember spending a couple hours every night handicapping the next day. I loved every minute of it. And now it just doesn't seem like there's enough time in the day that for that. But my go-tos are speed. Every race I'm in, I'm like, okay, where's the speed at here? And then kind of work my way backwards to where a horse maybe could be. And then uh I'm a big believer in the ragazin sheets. I love they do all that hard work and they assign a number to each race, and it is crazy accurate how you see horses with patterns, and you see some horses that uh um run best when they've got more spacing and um so uh generally uh it the the but even with with speed handicapping I think is more important than the the the numbers because sometimes your horse fits great on numbers, looks like the horse to beat, and then he's a closer in the speed in the race, there's like only one speed horse, you're in trouble. So uh I think more than anything for me, how the race is gonna unfold is most important.

SPEAKER_00 27:16

And you can see that by kind of the speed ratings typically.

SPEAKER_03 27:22

I just looking at the form and just looking at uh you know the fractions of of the previous races and and uh um I mean one of the amazing thing about these amazing horses is if they show speed out of the gate, they basically show speed out of the gate their whole life. You know, if they show they want to come from off the pace, they basically want to come from off the pace their whole life. So they're amazingly formful. So you can kinda you know, put your handicap and hat on and just look at the first quarter mile of the horse that are running in there and who leaves the gate best and who's gonna be the quickest, and then you you see can that horse get away with it doing it pretty easily? If if the answer is yes, whether they're two to one or twenty-one, if you're betting, I I'd bet that horse.

SPEAKER_00 28:13

That's interesting. I love it. I love that philosophy. All right, Doug, any any young up-and-coming horses, anybody on the on the triple crown trail that we need to be taking a look at in your barn?

SPEAKER_03 28:25

Yeah, we got a couple outsiders. We got a horse named Pablovian for Paul and Zilla Redum again this Saturday in the Louisiana Derby. And he he drew the rail, which isn't the greatest, but uh again, good horses. You gotta be able to navigate not the perfect post positions all the time.

SPEAKER_01 28:43

So how do you like your chances there?

SPEAKER_03 28:46

I I like him. It's a wide open race with some really there's actually a Nyquist in there named Autobahn that looks really good. Um he just broke his maiden, but these horses can get so good overnight uh at this time of year for three-year-olds. But I think we got a really good chance he's a cowbred homebred and um just a grinder. Ed and Edwin Maldonado's uh rode him for the first time the other day at Sunland Park and got the job done. So he get he's back on him. So I think he's got a good chance. And we got a horse named Robusta for Calumet Farms that ran second in uh the San Anita Derby prep a couple weeks ago, and he we're pointing him back for the San Anita Derby. So um he's a big, good-looking son of Accelerate that uh he's really starting to figure it out and enjoy it. And uh um Emisuel Heromeyo, a great writer from Florida, is out here now. He's um getting along with him great. So those are probably our two best chances. And we got a long, long, long shot named Civil Liberty. He was pointing to the Wood Memorial. He's still a maiden, but a talented maiden. And if you were able to talk the the world in the wood, you could see him get in there as well.

SPEAKER_00 30:02

Okay. So Kenny loves going to the yearling sales and picking out the horses from a very early age. Do you do any of that, Doug? Or do you kind of take what what's brought to you?

SPEAKER_03 30:16

You know, for the longest time, I was as grateful to train whatever I got. And I have gotten a little spoiled over the last five, six, seven, eight years. Part of it's HISA, too.

SPEAKER_00 30:29

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 30:29

Because now with HISA, I mean, it's so important to have certain things, you know, good foot, good, fairly good confirmation. Because um some of these horses that aren't don't have the greatest confirmation, don't have good feet, you know, they tea they need time to warm up. And a lot of times you'll get regulatory vets who aren't as patient as you and I, and they they'll scratch horses that are sound but just don't look sound as they warm up. So I I I've been more adamant with when I do go to the sales and people let me buy anything for them, is trying to look for horses that I think, okay, this is gonna be an easy one for a regulatory vet to uh say looks fine. So um, but yes, I I have done more of that. Um I do enjoy it. It it is uh uh it's like going to the NFL combines, you see so many great athletes and they're all going pretty quick. So now you're just trying to figure out what's between the ears, and I try not to get too caught up with their pedigrees because you just see I see too many horses outrun their pedigrees, and I see too many horses with amazing pedigrees not fulfill that. So I I try to try to look for the individual and then try to imagine them how they'll handle and the great thing about those sails, there is a lot of pressure on the horses in the back ring, and as they go into, I always think the back ring is like the paddock. So if you're watching them back there, how they're handling themselves and trying to imagine them with a saddle on in the paddock, and how would that go? So it's uh definitely an art. I think a guy like Kenny who's been doing it way longer than me would have an edge, and it's it's uh but also I think you can have ten good horsemen and they can if you showed them a hundred horses, they might all pick five or different ones. But it's yeah, it's uh I think we all have a different eye for what we're looking for, but it's uh we just got back from OBS and we bought a few there at the two-year-old training sale, and it is uh it's interesting, and you're all excited, and then you you see how they run when they start running.

SPEAKER_00 32:44

All right, a few more here, Doug. Thank you so much for your time. Um do you think we'll do you think we'll ever see a triple crown winner at any time soon? You know, Kenny and I talk about this a lot because he has a little bit of an issue between the time between the races and thinks that maybe it should be uh a normal time in between that's a little bit longer than it currently is. Um what do you think? Do you think we'll ever see another triple crown winner?

SPEAKER_03 33:10

Poof. I I I do. And uh there's just some horses like a Nyquist, if you were to say injury free, that are just they're so darn good. Um but I do agree in the climate we're in, you know, if you did um I know one of those months got five weeks. I always say that it'd be cool to have the first Saturday in May, first Saturday in June, first Saturday in July, but I think that might be.

SPEAKER_00 33:35

I think that's Kenny's take. I think that's what he'd love to see too. Yep.

SPEAKER_03 33:39

Uh yeah, there's something to if there's something to be said about that. And um because it's hard to um support PISA and everything, the conservative nature they're taking, and then at the same time say, hey, we've got to run back in two weeks. My horse came out of the Derby and great, I gotta come back in two weeks. That's not easy to get by the regulatory vets. I I it's not and we've got all the most of your owners are all aligned with being more conservative, more spacing, and and uh so I I do think I mean it's amazing when you look back what how horses used to run and they raced to run every week and all that stuff. And I don't think we can ever forget them and how amazing those horses were. But I do think we're in an era where you know most horses in a regulatory vest mines need three to five weeks in between. So why are we, you know, you got the triple crown, arguably one of the most popular theories in horse racing? Why should that be any different?

SPEAKER_00 34:45

I love it. Man, I love that take. All right. We're gonna we're gonna end with three fun ones here. This one I like a lot, and and I'm hoping I'm getting this right. Um, I coach a uh one of the top 16-year-old baseball teams in the country, and I use the motto all the time, why not us? I found that you use that quite a bit as well. Where'd that come from for for for you?

SPEAKER_03 35:07

Yeah, you know, I think um God, as a kid hearing it somewhere, and I was just like, God, that is so great because uh so many young athletes beat themselves up, you know, or have a lot of negative self-talk just because of the pressure. And and uh I had a great basketball coach one time, you know, we'd be getting blown out. You'd be like, okay, let's just try to win the next two minutes. And I was like, oh, okay. You know, so just trying to um, you know, why not us can even mean why not us in the next couple minutes. And and uh to me, it's just a a a mindset in our sport, it kind of works too, because a lot of times you're 15, 20 to 1, but your horse is training good. You know, why not us? Why can't we do this?

SPEAKER_00 35:51

I love it. I love it. Um, all right. If you could train any horse in history, who would it be?

SPEAKER_03 36:01

If I could train any horse in history, any horse, Wowser. Um God, I I mean I'm I'm biased. Uh I would say it's Nyclass, if we can put him back, you can't say my own horse.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

No, no, it's okay.

SPEAKER_03 36:15

I love that answer. Okay, good. Yeah, I think Nyquist, I I it puts a smile on my face when I say his name. So I I would love to be able to have a Nyquist every year with the game.

SPEAKER_00 36:26

I love it. That's a great answer. It's a it's a it's it's a formal answer. It's perfect. All right. Listen, Doug, after all these years of of thousands of wins, um, what still gives you the biggest thrill in racing?

SPEAKER_03 36:40

I think uh having a horse compete on a day where you know you've got 20,000 or more people there that are celebrating the sport and and all the men and women that work alongside the sport. But I think just having horses um racing on those big days is still like wow, how blessed are we. And then uh just being in the barn with so many men and women that have chosen to work alongside horses for a living like I have is uh very inspirational and and cool. So uh I think that definitely keeps me fired up and um I'm blessed enough to have some good horses that can show up on those big days.

SPEAKER_00 37:19

All right, now last question, and you may have given this to us already. Give us some winner coming up. So give us somebody we can look at and say, hey, Doug O'Neill's got this horse running, we need to put some money on it.

SPEAKER_03 37:31

Ooh. Um I'm gonna say uh I'm trying to think of a maiden that I might have. That would be pretty good. Can't be a claimer, though. I don't want to get the claimer. That's right. We'll give him a heads up. I I got a really nice son of Nyquist. He ran the other day, definitely needed a race. So horse name decisive win. W-I-N, decisive win. I think if he stays injury free, he's a big chestnut, uh, and he just can really, really run. I could never get him tired in the morning. And the other day he got a little tired for the first time in his debut, and I think he's gonna move way forward off that. So decisive win would be my my horse I'd give out.

SPEAKER_00 38:16

Oh man. Doug, thank you so much. And we really appreciate your time in doing this for us. Our our listeners are gonna absolutely love this.

SPEAKER_03 38:23

Oh man, I love being on. Thank you so much, my man Ryan. My man Ryan loves you guys, and he's got me hooked up listening to you guys. So I appreciate Ryan and everything he does, and appreciate you guys.

SPEAKER_00 38:33

Well, thank you so much. Doug, we'll be in touch soon.

SPEAKER_03 38:36

You guys take care of it.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

All right, ladies and gentlemen, hit that subscribe button. We're gonna give you a lot of it.