Mark Johnson - When Strength Fails

One freak moment in a roping arena changed everything for Mark Johnson: a shattered pelvis, months of weakness, and then the gut-punch discovery that surgery had damaged his vocal cords. For a lifelong broadcaster and play-by-play voice, that is not just an injury, it is an identity crisis. Mark walks us through the fear of losing the very tool he has depended on, and the deeper question underneath it: what happens when God touches the thing you secretly believe you earned? 

We also trace Mark’s story back to the pain that shaped him long before the accident, including the suicide of his father when Mark was 18 and the long anger that followed. He shares how marriage, career pressure, and raising a disabled son forced him to stop trying to bulldoze life through intensity and self-reliance. The conversation keeps circling back to the same centre: the quiet, unseen work of Scripture, prayer, and surrender that produces real strength, the kind that holds up in the valley and not just on the highlight reel. 

If you’re an athlete, coach, parent, or sports fan trying to connect faith and performance, you’ll hear practical wisdom about humility, discipline, mentorship, and what it means to glorify God not only in wins but in losses. Subscribe, share this with a friend who needs encouragement, and leave a review with the line that challenged you most.

Transcript

Surgery Scare And Voice Fear

SPEAKER_02 0:00

When they did surgery on me for my pelvis, they damaged my vocal cords. And so now I leave this doctor's office then and I'm weak at this point in time. And now I'm driving home and I'm wondering if I'm going to lose my voice, which I've counted on my whole life. And and y you get this sense, as we know, that that God will impress upon you. And I really felt them saying to me, you know, you've always been a big strong guy. And you've been pretty arrogant about that. I gave you this enormous voice that you've used for all these years to broadcast and do voiceover stuff forever. You've been kind of arrogant about that. You know, that is all from me, and I can take it away from you at any time.

SPEAKER_00 0:45

You

Welcome And Mark Johnson’s Intro

SPEAKER_00 0:46

are listening to the gospel in the Game Sports Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Welcome to the Gospel of Games season three, episode four. I'm your host, Dan Dromarski, and usually with me is Dave Dawson. But some of you noticed Dave hasn't been around for a few episodes. Don't worry, he'll be back with us soon. I'm just flying solo for a couple weeks while Dave is doing Dave stuff. But season three is going to bring some exciting things. We're going to have a few different co-hosts, a lot of different guests, and great adventures ahead. Today we have the pleasure of talking to Mark Johnson. Mark Johnson is known as the voice of the Buffaloes with Colorado University football and men's basketball teams. He's a great guy. Mark loves to talk about the Lord. I encourage you to thoroughly listen through this episode. Mark is well reversed. Mark has some great things to say about relationships, about his story. And it's just, oh man, you are going to leave this episode encouraged. Enough with uh talk ahead of time. Let's get right into our interview with Mark Johnson.

Coffee Talk And Border Country Roots

SPEAKER_01 2:18

Okay, Mark, I'm gonna float this one out to you with a question to start our conversation together. If you could sit down and have anything to drink from around the world as a as whether it's hot, cold, lukewarm, to start our conversation together in front of you, what are you having?

SPEAKER_02 2:40

Well, Daddy, it's it's just gotta be a just a good black cup of coffee. You gotta remember where I came from. I I like to say, by the way, I'm almost Canadian considering where I grew up. I grew up in northern North Dakota, just south of the Canadian border there, south of Manitoba and Winnipeg. And uh in that country there, it's all my family, uh, everyone that lives in that part of the country. It was all the settlers, the Scandinavians, the Germans, the Polish. And uh you drank a hot cup of coffee. My grandfather in December, it'd be 100 degrees outside, we'd be working on something. Come inside, and he'd have a hot cup of coffee. And as a kid, that seemed very odd to me. But uh as I've grown up, uh I find myself doing a lot of things. My grandfather, my father did, and that's one of them. So, right now, as we're sitting here, if you can picture, I've got a nice hot cup of coffee sitting right in front of me as we chat.

SPEAKER_01 3:31

And you know what? That's so funny because some people will say to me, How in the world are you drinking iced coffee when it's 40 below in Canada? I don't get it. Don't you want something hot? And I'm like, no, something cold.

SPEAKER_02 3:42

Well, you're going the other direction of call uh iced coffee in cold weather.

SPEAKER_01 3:45

I'm doing iced coffee in cold weather and I'm doing oh yeah, same thing. Uh except I'll put a little cream in my coffee.

SPEAKER_02 3:51

Okay. All right. I just feel a little sweeter. And and by the way, uh remember this is figurative because I do have a Diet Mountain Dew sitting here if I sip on it. I want people to understand that was just for conversation.

SPEAKER_01 4:01

That was just for conversation. Well, I'm joined with Mark Johnson today on the Gospel in the Game Sports podcast. Welcome, Mark. We do appreciate having you. Now, if someone Googles, they're gonna say, is it Mark Johnson, the hockey player? Is it Mark Johnson who calls uh horse races? Or is it Mark Johnson who calls for Colorado State?

SPEAKER_02 4:24

Well, first off, it's a very common name. I mean, your name, if you're from the upper Midwest in the United States with all the Scandinavians, and your name is Mark Johnson. You've got a gospel first name and a Johnson. Uh now, depending on if you're Norwegian or Swedish, of course, there's the S-O-N or S-E-N. And so you might as well uh remember the old uh, oh, what do they call them back in the day? The the the the plain uh products you'd buy that just had the generic ones. Yeah, acme with a black and white label on it. Yeah, that that's me from the upper Midwest. Mark Johnson, as common a name as you can come up with.

SPEAKER_01 4:58

Yeah, it's the coyote who orders his parts to catch the roadrunner. Well, this is from Acme. Oh, okay, gotcha. Comes in a wooden box. Well, Mark, uh uh where I I people say, where do you start? And I often start at the beginning. Um, but there's so many directions that we're gonna go today with this episode. Um, but Mark, you mentioned being so close to Canada, and I can relate to that because so many of my brothers and sisters who are from the states think of Canada as a sibling. And we think of the Americans, same thing, as our sibling, because we we really only have one border with one country here in Canada, so we have to kind of acknowledge that. But being so close to the Canadian border, was there much Canadian influence on you growing up, or did you just think it was straight bush north of you?

SPEAKER_02 5:52

No, no, they're a great influence, by the way. I used to go up to Lake of the Woods, you know, up on the Minnesota, Montana, or Manitoba border up there, and and fish quite a bit as a kid. And we'd run up to Winnipeg. Yeah, remember, growing up where I did the eastern part of North Dakota, there there's no major cities. I mean, Fargo is growing into a pretty substantial city. Uh my hometown of Grand Forks, I was born into a town called Hillsboro. And and so uh Winnipeg was the closest big city. In fact, my youngest sister, because of some medical issues my mom had, was born in Winnipeg. And and so we'd buzz up to Winnipeg all the time, and and so that was a common deal back and forth. And then, you know, when you grow up in in North Dakota, Minnesota, uh, you get the the that that accent, the that Fargo, if you've ever seen a movie Fargo, that accent, and you mix in some of the Canadian dialect as well, it it becomes kind of an odd uh dialect that people in that part of the country had. And I get asked all the time, Dan, well, how come you don't sound that way? Well, when I was a kid, when I was growing up, I was gonna be once I realized the NBA was not gonna come calling for me, and I had to do something besides play professional basketball, uh, I was gonna be either a sportscaster or a pastor. And there was a gentleman that was the and you you'll remember this, uh we're the roughly the same uh generation. Uh there was a guy, Tom Brokaw, who was the NBC Nightly News anchor, and he was a South Dakota guy. And so I thought, well, he's a Dakotan, maybe I can do what what he does, or that kind of thing. And then I thought, he doesn't sound anything like I do, and so I have to sound more like him than I do my relatives. And so I worked very hard not to have that, yeah, you betcha kind of, you know, Minnesota Scandinavian accent. Now you're gonna love this. When I was living in New York and I was doing the games for the Syracuse uh Orangemen and called their national championship, I had a speaking event in New York City one night, and there was a group of, I don't know, 10, 12 people around the table. And I get up and go and speak, and I come back and sit down. I had met everybody but a a couple across the table from me. And as I sit down, the gentleman looks at me and he says, I I very much enjoyed your speech. And I said, Well, thank you. And he looks at me and he says, What part of North Dakota are you from? Whoa. And I I I was puzzled and furled my brow, and I said, Well, I I didn't mention I was from North Dakota. He said, No, I'm a linguist. You've done a really good job of getting rid of that accent, but you have two telltale signs. Well, what's the obvious question, Dan? What are the telltale signs, right? And so I asked him, he laughs and he says, I'm not gonna tell you. So I have no idea what they are, but I worked very hard not to have that sound, that you know, movie fargo kind of accent when I was growing up because I knew I was gonna be a sportscaster eventually. And my old joke has always been that, you know, here I'm thinking about being a pastor, a sportscaster. I had no idea how to become a pastor at that age. But uh, my old joke has been that the Lord knew that nobody needed the Lord more than the media did, so that's where he sent me.

SPEAKER_01 8:43

Uh, that's too funny. As a Canadian, sometimes I have fun with it and I play along. People say, Well, you're Canadian. And I say, What are you talking about? And I I I just toss that right in there just to just to throw them off. I said, Well, after I rode my dog fled to the border, you know, I was able to finally get into a car. Those American cars are just unbelievable, so much more efficient. But hopefully my dog sled and team stays warm a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 9:08

Well, you know, we've got to the States, we've got the movie Far going up with Candy, you got Bob and Doug Mackenzie. So we've got, you know, kind of a similar thing we can kind of relate to there.

SPEAKER_01 9:15

Yeah, very much. And then we also have the movie with an actor by the name of John Candy, who sadly has passed away, Canadian bacon. And one of my favorite scenes is when they come across the Canadian border and he gets fined for having graffiti on his van, and he's like, What? You're not allowed to have graffiti on your van? He's like, No, it's not in French and English. It has to have both.

SPEAKER_02 9:36

I'd forgot about that. That's outstanding.

SPEAKER_01 9:38

Yeah, classic, classic moment. Okay,

North Dakota Grit And Quiet Culture

SPEAKER_01 9:40

so growing up in Fargo, and by the way, if you have never been to the Dakotas, go. And uh the it I always struggled with why is it called the Midwest? It's not West. I I'm from Alberta in Canada, right? And we're West. There's only one more province next to us. But Fargo, they're in the middle of the state, but yet because Winnipeg is, I think it's along the vertical line that runs through the Dakotas for the center of North America, but yet you're in the Midwest. What an interesting place to grow up. Tell me a little bit about what was it like to grow up in North Dakota.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

Well, as I mentioned, uh the the background of most of the folks are like I said, German, Scandinavian, Polish, very stoic, uh quiet people. Uh I grew up um I didn't go I I wasn't from a a a church I that I would say was a real heavily churched family, um, but but in a Lutheran uh you know uh religion, if you will, or or in uh and and so it was very stoic there. The first time I heard somebody clap in church, I was like, Oh no, no, no, we can't show any emotion. We can't smile in church. This is supposed to be very stoic, you know. And and so growing up around that, I it seemed odd to me. I I tried to explain to my kids who are all grown now that you know they they uh wonder why I work uh as a guy that speaks for a living. But when I'm home, I'm I'm kind of quiet and kind of I've got a ranch up on the mountains uh west of Denver and I go out and just by myself, the dogs and me, and I work and I'm very, you know, uh I'd say introverted probably at home. And they they said, Dad, how does it how did this happen? And I used to explain to him, I said, you know, we'd be on the farm with my my grandfather and my uncles and my dad, and we'd come in for lunch, and the men would sit around the kitchen table, the women would be in the dining room, and we'd sit there for 40 minutes eating, and nobody would say a word. And other than, hey, after lunch we've got to go do this. And nobody would answer, and five minutes later somebody'd say, Uh-huh. And and that was it. And and so uh it was an interesting uh I think childhood in that regard, that uh they weren't very expressive uh in large part, the people that I grew up around, uh much of the extended family. And then I was I end up being six foot five and and I speak for a living, and I used to joke with my parents all the time back in the day, okay, seriously, whose child am I? Right? Where how did this happen? I you know, I I do enjoy speaking in front of people, and I'd start doing that very early. And and I had a a great uncle that passed away a number of years ago. He lived up uh in a little town called Langdon, right near the border. And he every time I'd see him, he'd ask me the same question, are you still uh are they still paying you to talk? He'd always say. And I'd say, Yes, sir. And he'd always say, Who cares what you have to say? I said, I don't know, but they keep paying me. And and so it was it was interesting in that regard. I was a little bit odd, if you will, uh in terms of my family. But the I think the heart of that country, and and that that'll extend up into Manitoba and and you know, Saskatchewan, because it's a harsh country as well. And I think there's a hardiness of the people, and you rely upon each other. There's a rugged individualism, but when you need something, people are always there. And and so I cherish and I still love my home state of North Dakota. Now, I don't appreciate the winters up there, right? But uh I I love my home state because of that. Uh my wife and I were up there, oh, it's gotta be two, three years ago now, and uh we pulled up to a gas station. I I filled up and I was gonna go and get a soda or something. And I walked in and I came out like 25 minutes later, and she said, Where have you been? And I said, Oh, I was talking to a guy in there. She said, Who was he? I said, I don't know. But but those are the kind of people you meet, right? You can you start talking about, you know, hey, where are you from? Oh, I grew up here, oh, do you know such and such? And then the conversation goes. And I love the genuineness. When I lived in New York, I missed that terribly because you know, nobody looks at you when you walk down the street in New York City. They don't want to make eye contact with you. And so I loved kind of that heartiness, uh, that that warmth that people have up there, even though they might not be always the greatest talkers in the world. But but there's something about that, and then the the the perseverance. I think there's a uh oh a hardworking nature to them because of where they came from and how they live in that part of the country. And so I've I've got nothing but just very fond memories of growing up in that that part of the country.

SPEAKER_01 14:03

Well, there we go. We got our official plug for Manitoba and North Dakota.

SPEAKER_02 14:08

There we go.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Now, every every young person, not every young person, majority of young people, I'd probably say growing up, you tend to gravitate towards some sort of interest outside of what you have growing up.

Sports Path And Hard Lessons

SPEAKER_01 14:22

Right. Um, for you, being a guy who's six foot five, it was basketball. You might have got the question every time someone saw you and looked up to you and said, Hey, do you play basketball?

SPEAKER_02 14:34

Well, and coming from uh, you know, in in Grand Forks, I went to Grand Fork Central High School, and Grand Fork Central was a hockey power. I mean, one, oh goodness, it was something like 21 of the first 25 state championships in the state of North Dakota. And it was a hockey hotbed. And every year there'd be guys that finish up their junior year, they'd go up and play in the juniors up in Canada. A number of guys went to the NHL, and so hockey was important. It was like a religion, like it is in much of obviously your country. And so I'd always get the odd question, how are you not a hockey player? Well, you got to remember, um, nowadays you got very big, big, strong hockey players. When I was six foot five, back then all the hockey players were about five foot seven, right? They were all uh much smaller guys and quick on skates. Now I played hockey and and enjoyed the sport, but I always thought, well, uh, hockey players aren't six foot five. Uh they weren't back in the early 80s or late 70s when I was growing up. And so I gravitated towards basketball, fell in love with that, was pretty pretty good at it, and uh played uh c college basketball for a couple of years, and a back surgery uh ended that, but uh fell in love with that sport. And I'll tell you what, that really helped me uh then ultimately, and I know we'll get to it later, but got you know, from a career standpoint, because I do call a lot of college basketball and and uh do that sort of thing, and college football and NFL football, all kinds of things. But it it really lent that. I so I played hockey, I knew the game, I've caught broadcast hockey, I've done football and basketball and major league baseball and all those kind of things. And so uh just being around uh the sports, and then you know, you ask about growing up in that environment, you know, our community was small enough where, like a lot of small communities, you play everything. So in the fall, you played football, and you might run cross-country in between football games, you play basketball, and and you may wrestle a little bit when you're younger, and then you run track and field, and you play baseball in the summer. And so I was just one of those guys that was always doing something physical and playing sports, and eventually it kind of led me to where I am.

SPEAKER_01 16:27

Now, you're you're being pretty humble, Mark. I I saw some of the stats for you playing basketball. You were not an average basketball player. The Lord blessed you with the ability and skill to play basketball.

SPEAKER_02 16:40

Was that Okay, but but Dan, can I be honest with you? Uh I had a coach one time. I played for a disciplinarian, a legendary coach named Dick Vinger in the state of North Dakota. And he passed away here just a few years ago. But coach used to get on me because I was the kind of player that didn't like playing one end of the court. That was the defensive end of the court. I enjoyed putting the ball in the hoop now. And he said to me after a game one night, we got beaten. He was on me about my defense, and I said, Coach, I had 29 tonight. The guy I was guarding only had 21. I won my battle, right? So there's a there's a self-centered uh young athlete right there, thought I was pretty sharp because I scored more than the guy I played against. And so uh I could put the ball in the hoop, let's put it that way. Uh sometimes I lost interest on the other. When I got to college, I had to play a little bit more defense, but uh, I was a guy that liked to score. There's no doubt about that.

SPEAKER_01 17:29

Yeah, and sometimes you can get away with it at a younger age. I'm I'm a coach as well, and I I've come across those players where like you have natural talent to put it in the net, but if you could only play defense with the same effort, it would carry you a lot further, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_02 17:47

But Dan, they don't put sports center highlights of guys playing defense. No, they don't. They don't. It's always the guy hitting the three-pointer or getting the dunk or something. That's where the high and I figured the cheerleaders cheer the best uh when I was back in high school when I scored instead of when I, you know, stop somebody from scoring. So that that always uh added a little intrigue to it as well.

SPEAKER_01 18:06

Yeah, you know what? I gotta actually I'm gonna remember that for a video session this year. I'm gonna have a like an hour-long video session, and it's not gonna be highlights, it's just gonna be guys playing, just plain defensive responsibility. That's that's good. Yeah, that's no nothing flashy about it. This is exactly what you need to do.

SPEAKER_02 18:27

Winning the things that win uh in sports, I don't care what sport it is, are not exciting. Those are the things that really win you ball games or or hockey games or whatever it might be. Uh it's it's the the highlight stuff that we all appreciate. That becomes what we pay attention to. You know, I think there's something actually spiritual probably about that concept, too, isn't it? I mean, when

The Unseen Work That Builds Faith

SPEAKER_02 18:49

you think about it, it's it's not the the fact that I may get to go up and preach in front of some church. It's the time you spend uh wrestling with the word of God in prayer all by yourself in your office, your closet, whatever it might be. And so I think that that sports axiom we just stumbled upon actually has got some spiritual truth to it.

SPEAKER_01 19:06

Oh, so true. And when you are spending that quality time nurturing in God's word alone with him, I've had moments where I've like all of a sudden the light bulb goes on. Yeah, and you're like, whoa, I never saw that before. Right. And then you look around and there's no one there to tell. And you're like, okay, this actually was for me. Okay, this is this is great. I will soak this up.

SPEAKER_02 19:35

And that's where the growth comes from. That that's where when we're seeking the Lord, and we're we're you know, there are times, I'm in, this is my office I'm in right now. It's obviously my my studio as well for all the voiceover stuff that I do. But it when I'm in here and the dogs are right now, they're there where they always are, they're sleeping on the chair and on the ground, and I'm in here at 5 30 in the morning and I've got my cup of coffee, and I'm in the Word, and I'm struggling with it, and I'm I'm you know, slaving over it and laboring over it. That's always the times when when the the most growth happens for me. It's it's not when I'm when I'm talking somewhere or or presenting something somewhere. You know, that that that I always walk away and I I don't know about you, but I I walk off the stage many times and I I I just disappointed myself. Lord, I I don't think I glorified you enough. Yeah. I don't know what I did there, but I I tried, but I think I failed you. And then I I come back to him, and then then I have those great moments the next morning when I'm extra motivated and I get in there and I'm really wrestling with the word.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

Yeah, you know, I'm gonna tell you a quick story. I I have the exact same moments where like, Lord, did anyone hear that? Uh honestly, I don't know if I don't know if anyone got anything from that or it impacted anyone's lives or or anything. And I rem I remember um having that moment, and there was a gentleman who came came up afterwards and introduced someone to me and said, Hey, he's from overseas. He was just visiting today, and he just wanted to uh he he understands the language and grasps enough to be here, but he wanted me to come say thank you to you. And so I was like, Okay, nice. No, that's good. That was nice. Okay, that's good. Yeah. Okay, so month passes. This older guy comes up to me and says, Did Dan, did you hear what happened with so-and-so? I'm like, who's so-and-so? He's like, remember like a month ago, I introduced you to this guy who was only here once? He's like, Yeah. He goes, Well, he got baptized. Like like a week later, he came to know the Lord and he got baptized, and he invited everyone that he almost met while he was here and visiting. And at his baptism, he told his testimony and three people came to know the Lord at his baptise at his baptism. Then he goes home and tells everyone in his town about what happened to him in his travels, and he's like, There's people. From his town that come. And I was just like, John chapter four. John chapter four. He told me everything I ever did. And people come. And I was just like, wow, wow. And here I was leaving in that moment thinking, did anyone even hear this, Lord? And and and it's not often we ever get that feedback, first of all. And but I keep on saying over and over and over again. I don't know why so much this year, but it's like, that's why we need heaven to hear about all these events and all these chain reactions and all these things God's doing in the background.

SPEAKER_02 22:35

You know, but when you think about it, it it you know, Paul uh planted Apollo Swattered, right? And we're just planting seeds. We're we're we're you know, I I was having a conversation with a guy a while back, and I like to make he said something about going out and setting people. I said, I I I've never saved, nobody's ever saved anybody. You kidding me? No. We don't save anybody. We just preach the gospel, man. Just preach the gospel, right? Mark 115, the first ministry words out of Jesus' mouth. Repent and believe in the gospel. Preach the good news. Just tell somebody who Jesus is and then let the Holy Spirit go to work. You and I are just called to be obedient soldiers, man. We're just going out and we're fighting the battle and preaching the gospel and and then letting God glorify himself with with all the work that he does uh after somebody hears the word, you know?

SPEAKER_01 23:23

Yeah, and yeah, and every once in a while, God takes the fork and puts it in the road. We're gonna go back to your timeline. You're a

Suicide Loss And A Decade Of Anger

SPEAKER_01 23:32

young man. God puts a fork in the road, and something tragic happens in your family.

SPEAKER_02 23:50

You know, so as I mentioned earlier, I I we weren't a greatly churched family. Um, as I've kind of given my testimony over the years, I've explained we went to church when you were supposed to, right? Right? Easter and Christmas and weddings and few and funerals and baptisms, that kind of thing. But as a kid, I I always felt drawn and I didn't know what it meant. I didn't understand it. I I asked at one point when I was a kid, can I go to Sunday school? And so my dad would drop me off, I'd go to Sunday school. Then I'd I'd sit through the service and I'd acolyte sometimes, and then I'd help clean up the sanctuary afterward, and then I'd go home. And and I just continued to feel this pull. Um, I tried to read the Bible. I didn't understand what I was reading. I didn't under, I didn't get I knew the facts. Okay, yes, Jesus died for our sins. Okay, I get that. Uh Easter, yeah, he was crucified, died, and was buried. And and I understood all the kind of the basics, but didn't get anything about it. And that carried me then through my teen years. And you know, I I I had uh you know a checkered past, if you will, like a lot of us are young. We we're we're thinking we're trying to do the right thing and we're not, we're messing around doing things we shouldn't do. But the age of 18, I'm a freshman in college, and my father committed suicide. And so I lose him at that point in time. And there was part of the note that he left, uh, the ballgate was to my mother, but there was a little bit of it to me. I was 18 at the time, I'm a freshman in college, and it says essentially, uh, just paraphrasing, uh, Mark, I couldn't do this. You're a grown man, now you have to take care of everything. Well, that's that's a bit of a wait, right? So you go through the tragedy of losing your father to suicide. Uh, it it destroyed my family. Um, there are members of my family that have never recovered uh from that way back in 1986. And by the grace of God, he continued to pull me through. But then you can probably imagine I I was a pretty angry young man uh for the next couple of years. I mean, and you know, I I decided, well, I'm angry, and so uh, you know, if I if I'll if I'll I'll drink all the beer I can find and maybe get in a fight or two and chase girls, and and that's I did that for about a year and a half. And and then the Lord, as he has done, faithfully and repeatedly, would continue to come and grab me and lift me up. And he's he's done that over and over and over again. And so um in that period, over the course of those 18 months, uh, kind of hit a little bit of a rock bottom, if you will. And and I've I've I felt him just pick me up. And even though there was no I've always said I one of the reasons why mentoring young men is so important to me is because I had nobody that came alongside me and put an arm around me and said, Hey, I'm not your dad, but I'm here. I'll answer the question. You know? Okay, you got car insurance issues, let me help you figure that out. Um then I I get married young and we start having kids. And nobody was there to tell me what does it mean to be a man of God or a husband of God, uh father uh who is Kylie. How does that work? How do we pursue our career and balance our families? And so I I'm trying to, as I come out of that 18-month stretch of really being angry, uh the anger didn't leave me, but the expression of it did. And and I I say that because, yeah, there was a period I uh got three children. Uh my youngest, by the way, is a special needs child. He's 29 years old. He still lives with us here in this house. So my kids very shortly here with the next few weeks will be 35, 33, and 29. So boy grew a boy. Uh my daughter's married, wonderful young man, two grandbabies. Um but it would be a beautiful Sunday afternoon, and and I wouldn't have something I'm covering or a game I'm broadcasting, and we'd be out at a park or at the lake or something. And I'm there with my beautiful wife and and my two or three beautiful kids, depending on you know when we're talking about it. Um and and I was thinking that this is wonderful. Why do I have an enormous knot in my chest? Why is there anger inside of me? I shouldn't be angry right now. Why why I just feel like I'm gonna explode. And I carried that for a number of years. I got married at what, 24, 25, and and I carried that up until about 35. There was about a 10-year stretch where that was in there. And during that time, Dan, I I'm I'm I'm seeking the Lord. I'm trying to figure it out. I'm trying to be faithful, I'm trying to be in the word, uh, sometimes successful, sometimes not. And uh there was just this, you know, like I'm pulling a boulder up a hill. It it was just, it was difficult for me. It was hard, and I I couldn't figure it out. And then in my mid-30s, um, I get a job as the voice of the Syracuse Orangeman where I ended up calling our national championship. And it was during that time period I kind of felt this almost a tap on the shoulder, and the Lord say to me, Are you in or out? Do you truly commit to me? Are you mine or are you not, or are you the world's? And I really struggled with that for a while. So I've got this this anger with my father, uh now I'm feeling convicted here, and and I'm I'm in kind of an internal mess. And I get to the point where I I basically cried out to Lord and said, Lord, I'm I'm afraid. If I really commit to you, if I'm truly yours, that means everyone, that means everyone's gonna know it. What's that gonna do for my career? If I'm the Jesus guy, how's that gonna affect? I'm in the broadcasting world, man, and I'll tell you the the media is not terribly friendly to Christians, all right? And I had conversations and people knew that I was a guy that liked to go to church and and professed being a Christian. But I I kind of struggle with that for the Lord. Here I get this first big opportunity. I call a national championship. My name is all over you know, CBS and ESPN and and these places. And the Lord's saying, Hey, if you're mine, you've got to come all the way in. And and I was terrified. And I like I said, I said to him, I Lord, what my career, I'm we what's gonna happen here? And and I really felt him say, Why don't you trust me with that? And so I almost reluctantly said, Lord, okay, I I'm yours, I'm doing it. And if this goes bad, it's your fault. And you know, and in my my youthfulness, my selfishness, but but that was so I I go from this this anger that I had and this knot in my chest to this moment, and it was not long after one day we were out doing something as a family again. And I was sitting there kind of smiling at the fact I'm with my wife and all the three kids at that point in time. I my youngest had been born. And I paused and I went, the knots not there. It was gone. And and I haven't had it since. And so that ten years of whatever that that buildup with my chest, that anger in my chest, all of a sudden was gone. And I didn't notice the moment it disappeared. Um but I knew the Lord had taken something from me there, and I didn't seem to have the anger. I wasn't angry with my dad anymore. I I I I wept over him. I I felt bad for what he went through. I felt bad for what led him to what uh what he did. Um I prayed and continue to pray for my my mother, my sisters, as broken as they are. But it was it was really a turning point in my life at that point. That that that that that suicide, the anger, the uh lashing out that I did, fighting through that, trying to just stoically do everything under my own power, I'll find. I won't be angry, I'll I'll put a smile on, I'll I'll you know, as as you're you're taught to do, I'm just gonna bull through this and I won't deal with it. All of a sudden, one day waking up and like I said, going, It's gone. And I just recently said, Okay, Lord, I'm all yours. I'll do whatever you want.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

Often when we hear these testimonies of God's greatness, um there's someone by your side and God God's n provided you with help that often men don't see it.

SPEAKER_03 32:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

And uh your wife, if she was to speak towards what you just spoke of, what was the journey like for her with you?

SPEAKER_02 32:39

Well, I guarantee you she wasn't uh that she she certainly loved

Marriage Pressure And A Father’s Calling

SPEAKER_02 32:43

me. And uh my wife's a beautiful woman. She was in a Miss America pageant in 1989, so you want to talk about outkicking your coverage. Um but and and we always joked, uh, you know, that uh uh I chased her until she caught me. You know, one of those kind of deals.

SPEAKER_01 32:58

That's right. No, you gotta you gotta do the old beauty and the beast. No one's gonna be able to do it. Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

Well, let me let me throw one more wrinkle in this in this story here. So there was a time after we met, uh, right before she went to the Miss America page where I her sister was married to to a guy that was an old friend of mine. And uh so I I did a uh they had a big send-off deal for her to go to Atlantic City. And since I was a local disc jockey at that time, which I refer to, Dan, as my long-haired maggot-infested disc jockey days, right? Had long hair and played rock and roll, that kind of stuff. And so I I MC this deal, and she said something uh when I left, I went and said, Hey, well, good luck with that whole deal. And you know, she was obviously a beautiful woman. And and she uh she she they were she was signing autographs for kids after this deal, and she wrote down this this headshot. She wrote on there, hey, thank you for helping out. Hey, when I get back, let's have dinner. She gave it to me. I'm walking out of the building. I looked at and went, Oh, how about that? So um she uh, you know, we we we were together, but I I as much as she loved me, she had to admit it was probably kind of a wild ride because uh with that knot in my chest, I probably was not very easy to deal with, right, at times. I probably was very moody. I think I was I was the type of guy that very short-tempered. I'd snap my dad had a short temper. And and that's changed for me over the course of time. I've become much more relaxed and calm and patient, and that's why I've gotten to the horse world as much as I have, because I just I love the casualness and the patience that you need for stuff like that. But I think she would say that, and I and so what did I do? Uh, you know, like like a lot of us that are athletes and you want to drive and you want to want to get to excellence and win championships, you you look at things like I will outwork everybody and I will just out intense everybody, and and that's what I'll do. And so I don't want to deal with whatever that lump is in my chest. Um, I'm not gonna deal with the anger. So I'm gonna outwork everyone and be the best broadcaster I possibly can. I'll just be the best father and I'll be the best husband and I'll do all that kind of stuff. When when none of it's true, but I'm just gonna put more work in anybody else. And so the intensity, I I'm sure at different times, you know, just you know, she she was was was getting the the heat was too much. She's getting burned by it because I I was just uh over the top a lot of times. And so I don't think that was probably a real enjoyable, you know, decade between uh us getting married and kind of coming to this point in my life. And then of course it didn't happen overnight. I mean, it was a slow turn, like there is a lot with a lot of things when the Lord's working on it. So um she'd probably say that period was a little bit longer than I recall, but I know for that first 10 years I probably wasn't real easy to deal with.

SPEAKER_01 35:28

I love the picture that you gave, though, about working with horses now and enjoying that now, where uh I've often equated it to where people have asked me, he said, Oh, your wife, like uh what what was her secret? Or what and I just said God God knew in his infinite wisdom that I needed him first and foremost. Yes. And she was willing to take the place of second, and vice versa, where I can go to the Lord and I and God's like, hey, I got someone that can calm your heart. You can say the right thing at the right moment in order to make me stop and think and and just do exactly what needs to get done. And it and when you and I'm not like I'm comparing my wife to a horse, but uh but but you know what, but you know what it's like when you're when you're with a wild animal and and even though uh uh if a horse is broke and it will listen, you have to have the right approach to it.

SPEAKER_02 36:29

Without question, it's a relationship. It's a relationship, it is a trust factor. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 36:33

Oh, totally. And I've seen some people try to work with the most stubborn of horses, and I've been the most stubborn of horse.

SPEAKER_03 36:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:40

And I've seen people just walk up to it and just put its hand on it the right way, and the horse's whole demeanor just goes, right down. Unbelievable to see.

SPEAKER_02 36:52

Well, and I and and if you want to continue with this analogy here, um, you know, I I I was I was kind of the wild one, and they show you how how dense I am and and how the Lord's had to beat me up a number of times over my life. So she and I start dating after she gets back, and then I get a job in California, and I move out there, so we're doing long distance, and then I'm I'm young and stupid, of course, and so I I break up with uh this wonderful woman, and uh we continue to have contact, and I was supposed to go back uh and and actually escort her at at when she was giving up her crown. And the day before I left, I got I literally this happened. I got run over by a car at 40 miles per hour. I got hit as a pedestrian by a car at 40 miles per hour. And so she ultimately then comes back and helps nurse me back to health. And that's how we get together again. And so I joke all the time. I am so darn dense. The Lord literally had to run me, nearly kill me with running me over with a car to get me to marry the woman I was supposed to marry. Wow. You know, and so yeah, I listen, man, I I never claim to be the smartest guy in the world, and and the Lord knows that about me. And so he is, I I'm uh, you know, as I train horses, there are some that are easier to train than others, and I'm one of those that is not easy to train, and I need I need a lot of uh reinforcement, let's put it that way.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

There you go. And for the rest of the world that's listening, that's 60 kilometers an hour.

SPEAKER_02 38:14

Thank you for that for for that. Yeah, I wasn't gonna, I'm sure they didn't understand miles per hour. Yeah, yeah, no, they they got that.

SPEAKER_01 38:19

That that's fine. That um the the Lord has a wonderful way of giving us a nudge every once in a while. Yeah. Um, building that relationship with your wife, and okay, you have this career in Syracuse, and you're you're building up in life and the kids and the family, and things are growing. Change change comes.

SPEAKER_02 38:41

It does, yeah. You know, the one thing that we didn't touch on is what I mentioned, my youngest son. So so here my wife and I come together. We're both broken human beings. So she had a traumatic experience uh as well in in college. And you bring these two broken people together, we get married, and then we ultimately have a disabled child. Which, if you know anything about that world, uh which we do over the last uh 29 years, it it the divorce rate uh for people that have disabled children is like 90 percent.

SPEAKER_01 39:06

That's huge.

SPEAKER_02 39:06

Yeah, yes. And and so on top of I'm here, I'm talking about this knot in my chest anger at my father for his suicide, me trying to figure out, overcoming just a bulldozer trying to steam through all of it. He brings then into my life this human being that first off, this wonderful woman, obviously, uh two kids, a boy, girl, and now the third child comes along and he's disabled, and they tell me he's not going to live. And then here we are 29 years later, he's still with us. But he is toddler-like in his being, and uh his name is Jacob. All Jacob knows how to do is love. And so when I'm out battling the world, as we all do, you know, I I frequently say to my wife when I head out, I say, Babe, uh, I will come home either carrying my shield or being carried on it uh when I get home tonight. When I come back after battle and I walk in, all Jake cares about is that dad's home. And Jake has got a very rote communication, kind of a rainman-ish uh type of thing. And uh and so we've got a pattern little routine that we go through every time I come home, and and he loves it. And and I I sing for only three people in the world, my two granddaughters and my son. And so we've got songs that I sing to him. And uh, and so, you know, isn't it interesting? And all of that, so here they the anger in the chest, and I'm fighting through all this, he brings this innocence into my life that that I am now a hundred percent responsible for, and that's not going to end. He's not gonna turn 18 and go off and do his own thing. Uh he's mine, and and I'm gonna care for that for the rest of time, you know, as long as the Lord allows me to be here. And and so, you know, all of that is going on, and and then we get to that point where I'm finally like, Lord, okay, I I'm I'm yours, I'll do it uh reluctantly, and sometimes I fight you and on and on and on. Uh career changes. We come out here to Colorado, and so you know, you continue to grow, you continue to be in the Word, and and then I I think what you're referring to is a couple of years ago I had a heck of an accident. Uh I I am I I've got a little ranch I live on up

Rodeo Crash And A Threatened Voice

SPEAKER_02 41:14

in the mountains west of Denver, and I'm a horseman and I'm a team roper, and uh I get in the roping arena one night.

SPEAKER_01 41:21

Are you a healer?

SPEAKER_02 41:22

Uh I'm a header.

SPEAKER_01 41:23

Oh, you're a header? Okay.

SPEAKER_02 41:24

I always tell people the the the good-looking smart guys are on the head side. It's this because you know, if if if I miss the healer, doesn't get to do anything. And still uh but uh so I come out of the box, and and anybody knows much about horses, this is an oxymoron I know, but I had a uh a mayor that was half crazy. And uh I come out of the box and she starts bucking. I hadn't ridden her in a couple weeks, I'd been out of town. And she was not a hard bucking horse, but she bucked a few times, and I'm kind of chuckling at it. And it was a freak deal, Dan. The saddle horn hits my pubic bone. And for your folks that are watching right now, my pelvis just goes pop. They call it the open book. And it's don't ever do it, by the way, Dan. It's the worst thing you oh my goodness. I don't wish that upon my worst enemy. And so I'm on this horse, you feel this explosion inside me. The first thing, you know, you think of thousands of thoughts in a split second. I'm like, what in the world just happened inside my body? Then I realized I don't have any legs, I can't hold on to the horse anymore, so I'm gonna come off. And I didn't want to go over the front and break my neck, so I bailed off and broke all my ribs on the right side. And I roll up on my hands and knees, I'm trying to catch my breath, and all my buddies come running on over. And they're like, okay. And I said, My skeleton feels like a tuning fork at this point. I'm just vibrating inside. And I said, Get me up. And so they stood me up and I and they said, Can you walk? And I said, I think so. I went to take a step and felt my my pelvis buckle. And if if if there are any paramedics or doctors out there, they're gonna know this. Said, that can be a really bad. I didn't know this until weeks later. Uh, when when that happens or your pelvis breaks like that, you can burst one of your blood vessels and bleed out and die very quickly. You can have spinal issues and get paralyzed. Here I'm trying to walk on it. And praise God, none of that happened. But what it did, Dan, and this has really been a big part of my ministry talking to men the last uh couple of years now since this happened, happened on my birthday, July 30th of 2024. So nearly two years ago. Um, over the next four weeks, I lost 70 pounds. All right. I got down, I look like a prisoner of war. I look, my wife at one point said, My goodness, you look horrible. And so I I went from being this big, strong guy that that never worried about you know anything physically, to now being an infant. I could barely move. Uh, they bolted me back together. I got more titanium in me, that I've got boned at this point. Now the kicker to this story was, and I'm kind of feeling bad for myself. And what happened, I'll tell you in the moment, I'm laying in bed one night and in terrible pain. I'm just laying there and I can't sleep, uh, sweating profusely. My wife's laying next to me. My son Jacob uh is up in the middle of the night. You can hear him making noises frequently, and I'm listening to him. And and there was a noise out in the kitchen, our our godforsaken cat that my wife has knocked something off the kitchen uh counter out there. And I knew it was the cat because the dogs didn't move, right? They just they just lay there. And it it hit me at that point in time. I thought, Lord, I'm I'm I'm supposed to protect this this woman and this child that you've got me in the house right now. If somebody broke in here, I couldn't do anything. I'm laying here, I'm totally helpless. And and so that began to work on me over the next uh few weeks as I'm thinking about how how weak I've become. There I'm a shell of the man I once was. Now we get to the football season, and I didn't miss a game, by the way. I made the first game, it was something like 27 days from the time I had served. Until the time I did the first ball game. A reporter asked me after the game, he said, How was it? I said, I only cried during the commercial breaks. They got me a very comfortable chair, and I was in bad shape, but I made it through. The second game of the season, we go to Nebraska, Lincoln, Nebraska. And it was my first flight after surgery, and I was in excruciating pain all the way there. But before the ball game, we're sitting and talking about some of the things we're going to talk about in our pregame show. And if anybody's out there's ever sucked a mosquito down where you're talking, right? You're talking, right? One of those kind of deals. That's what happened to me. Well, I'm Lincoln, Nebraska. Mosquitoes are everywhere, so I didn't think twice about it. We go and do the broadcast. The next week during the game, it happens again. The founding week it happened twice during the game. My engineer, who was as dear a friend as I've got on the face of this earth, who was a guy that was a living mess for many of the years he had been together, and I prayed over him for years. And about eight, nine years ago, he called me one day and he said, I want you to know I'm getting baptized. And I sat front and center. And so he is a dear brothers and brother in Christ. He waits until everyone leaves the booth, and he stops me and he goes, Hey, you've got a problem. And I said, What do you mean? He says, What's going on with the voice thing? And I said, I don't know, I've got a little bug or something. And he goes, No, no, no, no. You've got a problem, and I'm worried about you. Well, the next day I get a phone call from an ear, nose, and throat doctor here in Denver. Uh, my buddy called him up and this guy calls and he says, I'm Dr. Such and Such. And I said, What how did you get my number? He said, Oh, uh Shannon uh gave it to me. And I said, Is there not a HIPAA issue we're talking about right here? He called you and talked to you about my medical issues. So anyway, the the guy says, Listen, um, I I was listening the other day. I heard it happen to you. I think I know what's going on. So I went into the doctor the next morning, so I'm not going to tell you until I take a look at it. I got there, stuck the camera down my nose, looked in my throat in about five seconds. He goes, Yep, there it is. When they did surgery on me for my pelvis, they damaged my vocal cords. And so now I leave this doctor's office, Dan, and I'm weak at this point in time. And now I'm driving home and I'm wondering if I'm going to lose my voice, which I've counted on my whole life. And and you get this sense, as we know, that God will impress upon you. And I really felt them saying to me, you know, you've always been a big, strong guy, and you've been pretty arrogant about that. I gave you this enormous voice that you've used for all these years to broadcast and do voiceover stuff forever. You've been kind of arrogant about that. You know, that is all from me, and I can take it away from you at any time. And so I really sat in that for quite some time. And, you know, you think about Hebrews 12, where it talks about God discipling his sons, right? And if you are not disciplined, or I should say disciplining, his sons. If you're not disciplined, you're illegitimate. And and you think also where Paul wrote about for when I am weak, uh, then I am strong. And and I got into the word, and I've been preaching on that now for the last couple of years to men's groups, because we we as men get so self-reliant in many respects that I'm the one that's creating success. I'm the one that's doing this, I'm the one, and that steals glory from God. And we know he does not share his glory with anybody. And and so you look at all these different things we that we've talked about over the course of my 58 years, and you know, losing my father and the anger and a disabled son, and and all these different things, and career changes, and loss of jobs, and you know, and then this physical injury where he said, I'll take it away, Mark. This is this is all I give it to to glorify me, and you've been glorifying yourself. And and so you look at all the times, and I I've referred to as God puts me on the anvil, right? I mean, you we all know that the the great uh Bible verse that gets a lot of debate about Jacob I loved and Esau I hated, right? And I always I always thought it was interesting. Esau had a wonderful life, was a highly successful man. Jacob was basically beaten up his entire life, had all sorts of troubles. He he limped his way into heaven, as we well know. And and so isn't it interesting that Jacob, the one that God says had his favor, he disciplined and he he he put on the anvil, informed, and continued to work on over the course of his life. And that really resonated with me as I kind of went through that physical uh issue here a couple of years ago.

SPEAKER_01 48:59

Well, Mark, I love how you share that story because as you're sharing about the events and everything happened, uh you can what it's like watching a it's like watching it happen in front of me as I'm picturing it in my head. And I I guess that's kind of what

Weakness, Discipline, And True Legacy

SPEAKER_01 49:14

you do for a living as a play-by-play guy. And you but at the same time, you you're not mentioning what people might know you for. I and it's you and I are talking here, and I think this is important to address because so often we associate the athlete or we associate the person with the sport they play. And if you remove the sport from Wayne Grecksky, Wayne Grezky's just another guy. Just so many people. At the same time, it's like, Matt, you're the voice of the buffaloes. And and God's put you in a spot where you can use that voice and that moose thing, but you share that humbling moment. And it God's allowed you to have a have a voice in a wonderful place. And I love how you give him the credit for it.

SPEAKER_02 50:05

Well, you know, what what I've what he's done in in me all all these years, it led me to the point I was I was speaking at an event here a while back, a group of men, and a lot of times I'll do a little Q ⁇ A afterward. And you know, a lot of many times guys went, okay, what's good? Tell me about working with Coach Prime, right? I get that a lot, obviously, but uh sometimes the questions are about, you know, kind of our spiritual life or biblical things. And and I I made a point during the speech where I said, you know, there are group are no great men of God. They're only weak, sinful men who serve a great God. That that's what all of us are. And and I tell people all the time that, you know, nothing saddens me more than when I go to or even even officiate. Well, when I officiate, I try to make sure this never happens. But you go to a funeral and everyone talks about what the guy did for a living.

SPEAKER_01 50:51

Oh, oh, oh, oh, man.

SPEAKER_02 50:53

You know, oh, he was a great, you know, name, broadcaster, great athlete, whatever, whatever it was. He was oh, he's he's he's up in heaven golfing right now. And and it it just it it pains my heart. It grieves me when I say, and I I told my wife all the time, I said, God forbid that in the day that I'm laying in that pine box, somebody comes up and all they want to talk about is the fact he broadcasts some silly sports.

SPEAKER_01 51:16

You know what?

SPEAKER_02 51:17

I said, Yeah. Yeah, I I my my daughter, I was with my my daughter this past weekend, and and she loves to kind of interview me. She's got a little bit of my personality in her. She said to me, She said, Dad, Daddy, what do you want your legacy to be? And I said, That's a pretty deep question there, sweetheart. And she said, Yeah. And I said, Well, can I be honest with you? She said, Yeah. And I said, You're you're you know you're dad. You're you're probably gonna be surprised by this. I'm gonna preach the gospel, I'm gonna die and be forgotten. That's what I want to do. I I want I want to be, I want, I want my my legacy to be in the Lord's book of life in in heaven. That's where I want it to be. When this is all said and done, I mean, God blesses, Dan. I mean, he's allowed us to do great things within our life, but we get to enjoy that kind of stuff. But when it's all said and done, the fact that you've done what you do, and I got I've broadcast a few games really doesn't amount to a hell of beans, right? What did we do for the kingdom? And and I really try to focus on that in everything that I do, knowing full well that okay, this broadcasting thing, come on, man. Yeah, it I didn't change the world. I I I might have made people entertained on a Saturday afternoon someplace, but uh for for me, what did I do that helped advance God's kingdom? How was I used by him? That that's all that really matters when it's all said and done.

SPEAKER_01 52:34

And sometimes you have to answer the motive question. You do. Uh it was over ten years ago. I I helped out a a a good friend, one of my best friends growing up, and he was in a car accident with his wife, and I took care of his kid for a month and a half, and he was just a little guy. And I remember going to visit him at the hospital, and he had asked me, and he just said, Why are you doing this? Right. And I just said two things. I said, Because I love Christ and because I love you. Yep. And I uh this exact same thing, Mark. What do I want to remember be remembered for? Because I love my savior, and then because I I wanted to show other people that he also loves them. Amen. And and and how how do we do that as guys? Because I think it's important for the listener to hear our conversation that life is so much bigger than all these cool things and quote quotations. Because you know what? The the you talked about Coach Prime. Okay, Coach Prime, um, uh a person who's very vocal, a very person. The greatest words I heard out of the guy's mouth was his experience driving, trying to drive off of a cliff after he won the Super Bowl.

SPEAKER_02 53:47

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 53:48

And he and his realizes that he needs a savior.

SPEAKER_02 53:51

That's right. And it's like you know, I've had that conversation many times.

SPEAKER_01 53:55

Exactly. And it's like, let's talk about let's talk about that, because in heaven, that's what we're gonna be talking about. We're gonna be talking about the longest field goal, we're gonna we're gonna be talking about our savior. And uh it's hard for someone who doesn't know the Lord to to grasp that. Yes, um, because it's easy to focus on people and it's on and on their achievements. If you had to share with someone what is the greatest joy that the Lord has given you in all the things that you've experienced, what has been your greatest joy?

SPEAKER_02 54:50

Oh man, that that's a that's a heck of a boy, you're hitting me with a with a deep question there, Dan. Holy cow. My deepest joy. I I think it's it's always the simplest things for me. It okay, you know, I call a national championship or you know, major league baseball or NFL or whatever else I've done. And that's that's a lot of fun, right? Don't get me wrong. It's it's great. It really, for a guy that loves to do what I love to do, it's awesome to be able to do that. Right? But I wouldn't say that's my greatest joy. My my greatest joy. Um we talk about earlier, we talked about those moments when we're in here, you know, wrestling with scripture, wrestling with the Lord. There are moments in that when when I I it it's phenomenal how I I walk out of this room with that feeling. Um there are moments with my son, uh Jacob, who uh, like I said, is the best person I know on earth, right? Because he he just loves every single day. There are times with my granddaughter, their granddaughters, I should say, with my wife, obviously. Uh those are the things that, you know, and I know it's cliche, and I I know that people like to say it, but when you know the Lord, and more importantly, when he knows you and he's impacted your life, and he is he is worked within your life, those things take on greater meaning at that point in time. And you know, isn't it interesting? Uh oh goodness, I was trying to think what I was speaking at here recently, but but you know, the the that quote by Karl Marx where he said that uh religion is the opiate of the masses. And and somehow somehow that came up in a QA afterward or something, or or somebody guy indicated something along those lines, and isn't religion just to control people? And so I brought that quote up. And I said, obviously, Karl Marx knew nothing uh about Christianity because if you lay it out, there's nothing easy about it, number one, right? What did Christ say? You are going to have problems. They they hated me, they're going to hate you, right? So so it's not the easiest thing in the world. But what is stunning about it, you're you're one of you're you're a slave one way or the other. You're either a slave to sin or you're a slave to Christ. And what did Christ promise us if we're a slave to him, is we've committed to him, is yoke is easy. And Paul said, I have learned to be content in all circumstances. The book of joy, for goodness sakes, was written when he was in chains in prison. And so what you find in the Lord, it's counterintuitive. The peace that passes all understanding is what you find in the Lord. And you begin to, when when he is in control of your life, the big things don't seem so big anymore on the outside. Yeah, there's troubles, and yeah, you get frustrated about stuff. Make no mistake about that. But you always know where the trust is and where your deliverance is coming from. And and so it takes some of the pressure off. I think back to those early years we talked about where I was so angry and I'm so caught up and frustrated, anxious, and mad and nervous about what was going on. And now, all these years later, I sit here and go, I was wasting my time because I was I was still carnally connected. I was still a slave to sin. I hadn't totally committed myself to the Lord. He wasn't the Lord of my life. He wasn't in control of everything. I didn't trust him for everything in my life. I thought I was the one that was going to overcome everything instead of allowing him who has already overcome to control me. Okay. And so, you know, that that that it's I think that that right there, I don't know that it's a moment, but it's just it's because I am his that the joy of those simple things becomes all that more poignant.

SPEAKER_01 58:32

I love how you keep on saying that. I am his. I always think of that, and I say, but also he's mine. Yes. Yes. And I think that's really important as a as a believer to acknowledge that this is a relationship. God, uh for so many people, they have this picture of God and they think of it as a one-way street. And they think, okay, God is there. I have to do this, I have to do that, I have to do this, I check this box, I'm going to church, I'm going that. And where it's like, no, no, no, no. It's a two-way street. Our Heavenly Father cares for us, He loves us, He provides for us, He does so many things that are unseen. And you talked about those treasured moments of joy. It's heaven's stage where we find joy. It's that moment where no one's watching and we're just with him. Or we're we're in a spot like you mentioned with your son. There's no cameras on, there's no one seeing you there soaking in that moment. That's a moment that he's given you. And isn't it just so awesome how it I find myself over and over and over again when I'm spending time with my kids thinking, Lord, you you brought this person into my life out of a relationship with my wife, and that relationship was given to me because of my relationship with you. Everything just keeps coming back to you.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:04

Amen. Amen. And it it's it's a fascinating thing, the way you know, you you talked about this. Well, I've got to do, I've got to do, I've got to do, I've got to do. And and so many times people get that wrong. What what did what did Christ say in John uh 14, 15, right? If you love me, keep my commands. We you know what what he also said uh uh um we love because he first loved us, right? Our our obedience, our love is a response to him because of what he's done for us. I tried to explain this to uh some folks that we're not believers, and and I said it's it's not it's not that I'm following rules, but I said, think of the person in your life you love the most, whoever that might be, child, spouse, parent, whatever it might be. You think of that person. What do you want to do? You want to do right by them, you want to do for them, you want to serve them, you want to care for them. I said, that's the response, only compared to human love, it's on steroids, right? Because the love, the Lord's love is so great, we respond to it. We want to be his, we want to please him. You know, every child wants to please their parent, right? You just when you're young, you want you want to do that. It's when we get our teenagers, yeah, we don't want to do that. But when you're a child, you want to do that. And and our response to the God's love and his grace and his mercy is that we want to please him. We love him, we love others because they are his children. Uh, we care for them because he's loved us. We know that that even though we're sinners and we're not lovable, he still loves us. So we learn how to love uh unconditionally as a result of that. And and it's just such a response. And you're right. So what does it all do? It always goes back to him, and that we respond through him and because of him. And and I think a lot of times the outside world thinks about Christianity that it's always this, well, I have to do, I have to do, I have to do. No, no, no. It's I want to do. I said this to somebody the other day. It it whatever you talk about, it's not because I, it's always because he. That's where it always starts. It always flows from him. He's the living water, as he told the woman at the well. And it always flows from him, and we respond.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:20

Yeah, and then that exact same passage, his response is says, You'll be thirsty again with this water.

unknown 1:02:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:28

And it's it's just the reality check that God puts into us. Okay, let's give a little bit of reality check for our linner listeners. Uh, someone's been sent this podcast, they're listening in. Uh, maybe they're new to Christianity, or maybe they're they're they're not a Christian. Uh, we talked a lot about relationships. Where does someone go to find find the right relationship? Where do I start?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:55

You know, it that's that's

Meeting Jesus And Relating To Athletes

SPEAKER_02 1:02:56

always a fascinating question. Uh I I've sat down with a young man and they said, I don't I don't know where to go. I don't know what to do. How does this how does this work? How does it work? And I said, Well, what I try and tell guys is this you know all the all the things you're struggling with? And I say, Yeah. And all the things you're afraid of.

unknown 1:03:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:18

You cannot overcome those by yourself. Look at the evidence of the world around you, right? We live in a world and everyone's medicated, or they're drinking, or taking drugs, or or in pornography, whatever it is. So they're they're they're doing a thousand different things, looking for something to numb that feeling. I said, All I'm doing is inviting you to get to know the man Jesus Christ. The gospel is the life, the crucifixion, and the resurrection of Jesus Christ. I'll I I encourage them just to get to know him. You know, many times I I I preached on this before that we we get so self-focused all the time. We're called to have a relationship with Christ. Well, how do you have a relationship? Information and time. Okay? That that's what develops a relationship. And so I say many times when we are young in our faith, we go to pray, and it's always or we go to God's word, we're looking for answers from me. I'm I've got a prayer. God, I need this. I need help with this. This is happening. God, I need that. Okay? And God wants to hear that stuff. Make no mistake about it. But ultimately, our goal is that we get to know him. He already knows us, right? He knows everything, knows the number of hairs on our head. And I said, So let me help you be introduced to Jesus Christ, the Messiah, and and I'll lead you in the scripture, and you and I can pray together, and and then you know, you you can kind of seek him on your own. And and so it it seems counterintuitive to a lot of people, and and sometimes you get guys go, That can't be that simple. I said, No, it actually is. And and so that that's how I just help guys when they're in that moment, when they're trying to figure it out. I said, All I want to do is introduce you to Jesus Christ. He's gonna love you, he's gonna call you to repentance, he's gonna call you to obedience. Over he is going to transform your mind. He's gonna ask you to take off the old and put on the new. He's gonna ask you to deny yourself and pick up your cross and follow on daily. That's all stuff you're going to learn. But the first thing I want you to do is just get to know who who Christ is and what he is offering to you through his sacrifice. And and it it's a simple thing. Uh and sometimes I've had guys just totally reject it, other times guys have taken it and run with it. Sometimes it's it takes years, and eventually they, you know, uh the Lord kind of works in their lives. But yeah, I think that's about the simplest thing we can do because, like I said earlier, you and I aren't saving anybody. I know Christ is, and so I just introduce them to Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:53

We're on season three. This will be episode four uh of the podcast. Um our listeners are predominantly associated with athletics. We're our sports podcast. Uh probably predominantly male. Um we cover a lot of different sports. Some of our listeners are not athletes, they're the parents of athletes, or they go to church and they're listening to this podcast because they're trying to find out how do I be relatable to an athlete? How do I support an athlete? You get to speak about and probably with a fair bit of athletes. How does one build a relationship with an athlete while having a faith component with it?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:50

Right. Well, I think there's there's depending on. How you wanna want to kind of approach that question? Um, in my role, and I work for the University of Colorado.

unknown 1:07:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:02

So I have to be careful about how much I proselytize, how much I evangelize within my official role within the confines of my job. I work for a government institution, okay? I gotta be very careful. Now, when an athlete comes up to me and asks me a question, hey, can I talk to you about your faith? Hell, dude, you've just opened up the door. Let's do it. Okay. So I've got to be careful in that regard. Now, I've talked with pro athletes. Uh, you know, Tim Tebow came through Denver years ago, and I got to talk with Tim about his faith. Peyton Manning and I have talked about faith things. Todd Helton and I have talked uh a lot of faith things over the years. Uh Clint Hurdle, the former manager of the Rockies, he and I are great friends. We communicate on a daily basis about faith things.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:44

Jerry Schemmel, who wrecked him.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:46

My good friend who you've had on your podcast. Jerry, uh Jerry Shemmel is a dear friend of mine, and he and I communicate almost daily as well about our faith. And and so, you know, when you're dealing in particular, well, athletes in general, let's be really honest about it. Athletes in general are very selfish human beings. They are by nature, because they have to be, right? My life is about my performance, and my performance has to be about my preparation, it has to be about my diet, has to be about my sleep, has to be about all the things I put into my body, has to be how I approach everything in life. So just being an athlete generally, not so much as a youth athlete, but once you get into organized sports and you're pretty good at it, you have to be pretty self-focused and self-centered. And so that's a hurdle a lot of times to get over with, with young men uh that I've dealt with over the course of time, beginning to understand, going back to what happened with me in the rodeo arena, right? That, hey, guess who gave you all this ability? Guess who gave you the ability to run a 4-340 or bench press, you know, 350 pounds, or you know, score 25 points a ballgame or hit 32 home runs or whatever it might be. God gave you that. And, you know, it's it's easy sometimes to give it lip service. You know, you hit the game-winning home run, the post-game interview like, oh, praise and glory to God. Okay, we appreciate that, and I like that. But what did you say when you struck out in the bottom of the ninth inning? Was God getting glory then? I'll tell you a great story about this. I won't say who it was. There was a coach I worked for years ago who was on the verge of getting fired. And in in sports, when a coach is on the verge of getting fired, everybody knows it's coming, right? We all see it. It's like the slow-moving train coming down the track. You can see it coming, you know it's gonna happen, and Sue's on the verge. And and this coach was a believer, and he and I used to have some very, very honest and and deep conversations about our faith. And we're sitting there at one point uh in his office, and he was lamenting about how this was gonna about to happen, and and he was kind of kind of shaking his fist at God a little bit. How can you I tried to glorify you and look what happened. And I I kind of sat there and listened for a long period of time, Dad. And finally I said to him, I said, Coach, let me ask you something. Are you willing to fail miserably in the eyes of man for the glory of God? And he stared at me for about 15 seconds. He said, What what do you possibly mean by that? And I said, Well, think about something for a second. The secular view of the story of Jesus is it is utter failure. Right? He's a 33-year-old homeless guy who hangs around with 12 other guys, has nothing to his name, goes out, you know, preaches a little bit, people don't like his message, and they ultimately kill him. That's not a very good story from a secular standpoint. Now, when we know what the biblical meaning of all that is and what happens, it's the greatest story ever told. But I said, in the eyes of the carnal men, Christ was an utter failure. Uh look at Paul. Paul was one of the great teachers in Israel. He has his Damascus Road experience. Next thing you know, he's watching it walking around and preaching to the Gentiles for goodness sakes, and the entire uh uh uh Israeli world, the entire Jewish world turns on the guy and ultimately has his head cut off for goodness sakes by the Romans. I said, all these great stories in the Bible were not great stories of success from a worldly standpoint. And I said, So, coach, all I'm saying is, listen, first off, you've made a lot of money, you're gonna be just fine, nobody's starving. But if you fail, what is your opportunity to glorify God through that? How you handle yourself, how you conduct yourself, what you say, how you impact those on your staff that are losing their jobs. All these different things that we can do to glorify God when we're failing in the eyes of men are enormously powerful. And so you ask about dealing with athletes. Um, when I've had those honest conversations with those guys, I've tried to help them understand that it's easy to cheer and give uh God a high five when you're standing on top of the mountain. When you're in the valley and the rain's pouring down on you and you're hungry and you failed, and you're on your hands and knees, or you're for me, I'm laying in the middle of the arena with my pelvis split in half. That's not the easiest time to glorify God and to praise God. And that's the time when we need to really turn to him. And so that's kind of the message I preach to athletes for many, many years.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:26

Wow, that's huge. I think um brokenness is one of the key ingredients in building relationship. Yeah. And we like you just said, it's easy to speak about the success and ride that wave. Um, it's tough when things are down and out. It is tough to it's never easy.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:49

You know, a few years ago, so uh ten years ago, when I first came to Colorado 22 years ago, I was a sports director at one of the biggest radio stations in America, Kway Radio here in Denver. And ten years ago, I got swept up in a in an enormous nationwide uh cost-cutting deal, and I ended up losing my job there. And so I go from from you know, being the sports director, one of the largest radio sports departments in America, and and covering all the sports, you know, the NFL and Major League Baseball and NHL and NBA and everything here in Colorado, including college athletics, obviously. And and all of a sudden I'm sitting uh here without a job for the first time in my life, I get fired. And um my wife and I sat right here in this office, we talked a little bit, and she said, What would you like uh to do as we're sitting here? And I looked and I said, Uh, you've got some appointments. I said, Go to him. I need to spend my time with the Lord this morning. And and I sat here and I felt compelled because now it's it's hitting social media and and it's becoming uh big news here in the Mile High City. And and I sat down and and I wrote this piece and I I published it that morning about how good God is. And and I and I said, I know this is gonna be counterintuitive to everybody. But I said, I'm sitting here, and certainly I've been shocked because I got you know caught up in this this nationwide uh cost cutting venture, and I don't have a job right now, and I don't know how I'm paying my bills, and I'm not gonna care for my family and all these different things. But I said, I'm sitting here and I have utter peace in the middle of it because I know who is on the throne, I know who's in control. And and so, you know, when when you're in those low points, I you know, I I go back to Job frequently and and you know what what he went through and and and his the accounts of Job's story and the oldest book in the Bible. And uh I just got done uh I I do a public Bible reading every morning on social media uh where I'm reading through the Bible in a year, we just got done with Ecclesiastes here uh a short time ago. You know, a vanity of vanities, all is vanity.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:47

I love it.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:48

Yeah, and I I think of those things all the time. Whenever you get into those moments, and and you know, I've listened to we we've had a couple of instances of just you know craziness this this week. And and I was driving down the road uh yesterday, taking my horse someplace, and and I was kind of shaking my head, and I caught myself in the middle of it. And I said, Lord, I I said, I apologize, Lord. I'm sitting here whining, complaining, feeling bad for myself right now. You have been, you know, it was somebody once said, You have got always remember you've gotten through every tough circumstance in your entire life to be sitting where you are right now, and that's a hundred percent uh batting average. That's pretty darn good, right? And Lord, you've been faithful my whole life. You brought me through all of these, and I'm whining right now and feeling bad for myself, and I apologize because I know that you're in control and you'll provide. Yeah, and and so in those those tough times, but but Danny, and you well know this, that that comes with with spiritual maturity. When you're a young Christian, it it's tough to get there.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:45

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:46

But the longer you've walked with the Lord, the more the more you know about his trust, trustworthiness, his faithfulness, all he's done. You've got history that you base it on. And so it's easier to some degree always to turn back to him and go, Lord, I was whining and I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:01

Yeah, and as soon as he says, gird up your loins like a man, or where were you when? And all of a sudden you go, I'm just gonna stand here and be quiet.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:10

Job 38, man, is one of one of the best pieces of scripture ever.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:14

Yeah. Where were you? Where were you when? And then you just stand there and be quiet and just take it. Just take it.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:21

Brace, brace is it uh Job 38, three, I think he says, brace yourself like a man, and you'd be like, holy cow. Yeah, you know what's coming next is gonna be a kick in the tail.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:29

That's right, exactly. Oh, I just I just love that. I just like boy, Lord, Lord, I hope in heaven I just get to see the expression on Job's face when you said that. Uh but I'm sure there's gonna be a lot of play-by-play of my expression on my face when God has corrected me as well.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:48

Without question.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:49

But you know what? I'll take it because he who rejects correction is stupid, as Proverbs says.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:56

Yes, exactly right. And I I go back to that Hebrews 12 thing all the time. If you're if if you're without discipline, you're an illegitimate son.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:03

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:04

And so when when the Lord is disciplined, when he's correcting, when he is working on us, when he's molding us, when he is, you know, transforming us, that that's that's done out of love. And it's for our betterment and for his glory.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:16

Yeah. And that I talked with um Ed Joseph a couple episodes ago. And Ed is a former CFL football player and a parent of athletes, and we talked a lot about discipline, and we talked about that and about the love of the Lord and discipline, and and about doing it correctly, and it always ends in love.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:40

Yes. That's that's it interesting. I mentioned we're we're reading through uh you know the Bible. You know, I've got a schedule, and so every every morning as I read uh on social media for for people, um, you know, we read a couple of different books in the old uh, a couple of chapters, some couple of different books in the old testament, normally do a psalm and then and then something out of the new testament. And and isn't it interesting? You you think back to the story of uh the Israelites, uh, and and the the the cycle is always the same, right? It's it's they're they're they are worshiping the Lord, they're turning to God, uh, there is prosperity, there is peace, they eventually get fat and happy, they turn their back on the Lord, they have trouble, they have all sorts of issues, they have war, and eventually, and they've got bad leaders, they've had bad kings, and and I don't know, that eventually somebody comes up, he brings them a king that then uh walks in the way of the Lord of, you know, like his father David, and then all of a sudden prosperity and peace return. And and we have that cycle over and over in our lives. We all do it. And and again, it goes back to what you and I were talking about. It's not that we're following rules, but it's that we're serving the Lord all the time. And and through that response to him and our obedience, uh things begin to line up. When when you're walking in the way of the Lord, it's amazing how things seem to unfold nicely for you. Right? It's when we get uh uh when we're unsubmissive, when we get rebellious, when we begin to honor ourselves more than we honor God, that's when we we generally have problems.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:07

Mark, um, I just want to tell you something. Although you lost your earthly father at a young age, God has shown you what a wonderful heavenly father he is, hasn't he?

SPEAKER_02 1:19:19

Oh, amen. Amen, brother. There is no doubt about that. Yeah. I I miss my father daily. I'm I'm I've got a photo staring at me right over across the office here right now. And I I think about him daily. But uh the the Lord has done far more than my earthly father ever would have. And so I count that as a great blessing, although I my flesh still mourns the loss of my dad. Um I have been fathered wonderfully the last 30 years, there's no doubt about that.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:47

Okay, now you go to being a father.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:51

Uh huh.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:51

That's the next step, isn't it? God provides us with examples, and you mentioned about one thing that really stood out for me from our conversation was you mentioned about how there was no one that had come along.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:07

How has that encouraged you to have that as part of what you do now

Mentoring Men And Rapid Fire Questions

SPEAKER_01 1:20:13

coming along as a father to maybe the fatherless?

SPEAKER_02 1:20:16

Yeah. And so what it's done for me is is it's given me a heart when I see lost young men. And the Lord over the years has brought in uh many young men kind of just just crossed paths with that seem to be kind of searching. Uh sometimes the relationships have have uh you know been rather brief. It's been uh a few times we'll go and have a cup of coffee or or lunch someplace, and I can kind of uh you know give them a little bit of advice. Sometimes they've gone on longer than I've got a couple of guys that I've I've mentored now for years. And it it's nothing more than just the presence of being there, uh loving them, telling them, hey, I know this is stuff. You're confused by that. Well, guess what? I'm older than you, I'm still confused by that. Here's why that's okay, right? Uh I like I like to tell guys all the time, Dad, I said I don't have all the right answers, but I can give you a whole lot of wrong answers that I've figured out about your. Right? And and so it's sometimes it's not so much that I've got there's a there's a gentleman I'm I'm uh I'm mentoring right now. We've been meeting now for oh goodness about eight or eight or nine months, I guess. And and he's actually a relatively mature guy, he's younger than I am, but he's he's in his late thirties. And so he's lived some life, and he's married and has has children. And and I I frequently will tell him, you know, I I I don't I don't know that I've got the the exact answer for you, but I know who does. And and so it the fact that I sit and listen and let him kind of explain things to me, and uh tell him I understand or how I've kind of dealt with something along those lines, and then we'll pray about it. Just kind of having that that that Paul Timothy type of relationship, the value of that. We know that's godly, we know that's God designed, we know that there's there's plenty of areas where older men are teaching younger men, older women are teaching younger women. That's part of how this is supposed to work. Um there we I know we live in a culture right now that uh they kind of look down. Guys like you and me, they got a little gray in our beard, they kind of look down on us. You you guys are old. We don't need you anymore. No, actually, that's not what the word of God says. The word of God says that that gray in our beard, that's actually honor. We've experienced, we've lived, we've struggled, we've fought, we've battled, we've had success, we've learned through that. God has taught us through that. And we are, I think we're called by the Lord to pass that along, certainly to our own children, but those also those young men and women around us, and to help them kind of find their way. And so I I've never fixed a problem for any one of these young men that I've talked with, but but I've kind of shown them maybe a different avenue. I I've I've saved them the struggle of taking the wrong turn like I did a number of times, and kind of helped them. And and every time we do that, they always know they kind of laugh at me, you know, like well, I know you're gonna tell me that that I need to take this to the Lord. Yeah, every single time. You know? Uh I once heard a great story. Um somebody once said there was there was somebody who was leading a conference, and and every time that uh you know they they would talk about something, the the response of the speaker of the conference was, uh, let's let's go to the word of God. And and so after the conference, somebody said, you know, every time you somebody asks you a question, that was always one of your responses. Why do you say that all the time? And the response uh by the speaker was because you need to go to the word of God, right? And so so I I just lead them back to Christ, back to the word, back to prayer, take it to the Lord. He is going to lead you through. He's always faithful. And so that's become so important for me just to have that sounding board that I didn't have. And you know, it it it just it it gives a little bit of confidence and a little bit of lift up uh or step up for all these young men that that I get a chance to sit down and and talk with over the years.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:56

Well, this brings me to the next segment of our show. Five on the spot. Quick questions. Oh, you're gonna grill me now. I'm gonna grill you now on your toes. And every time I say that just I want to say gonna keep you quick on your toes. You're like, I'm not so fast on my toes anymore. It's a figure of speech. Come on. Okay, so quick question, quick response. All right, you're are you all ready?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:21

I'm ready for you.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:22

Hit them. Why mountain dew?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:27

Here's the reason. Uh, I was we actually was a Diet Mountain Dew. Uh for years I hated Diet Mountain Dew. And I don't know what happened. You know, they they say as you age that your taste buds change a little bit. Okay. And my wife drank it all the time. I was a straight dew guy for many, many years. And and then all of a sudden I used to hate it, and I'd say I can't drink it. That stuff is horrible. And and one day uh she were in the in the truck driving down the road and she had it sitting here, so I picked it up and I thought, well, that's not too bad. And and then, you know, because you know, I'm getting older and you, you know, I'm I'm drinking the fat guy soda. So uh there are multiple reasons as to why diet Mountain Dew. And by the way, the University of Colorado is a Pepsi school, the Mountain Dew is a Pepsi product. So, you know, that works out pretty well for me as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:06

There you go, you got the connection. Uh favorite Colorado sports team?

SPEAKER_02 1:25:13

Well, it's gotta be the Colorado Buffaloes. I mean, so for your listeners and viewers who have never been there, when I open up every broadcast, we play at Folsom Field. All right, we're at 5,345 feet above sea level. It sits right in front of the flat irons. If you don't know what that is, uh just Google, you know, Flat Irons, Boulder, Colorado, Folsom Field, and you'll see it. And then the stadium is made from this red stone. It's gorgeous. And so I open up every broadcast exactly the same way. We come to you from Folsom Field, the most majestic setting in all of college football, as the Colorado Buffaloes will open up today against Kansas State or whatever it is. And it's just, it's the most spectacular setting. And I've done in virtual, I've done games in virtually every major stadium in America after all the years I've done this. And there are some that are pretty darn nice, but none are more beautiful than the setting there at CU. And then when Ralphie, the Buffalo runs before the game and the weather in Colorado is spectacular, it's it's just the best ever.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:10

Okay, sold. I'm gonna come to a game. You gotta come down. Let me know. Come on down.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:15

We'll take care of you.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:15

Absolutely, absolutely. Okay, next question, because this is a good one, Kate. Number three, um, if you could have gone back in time and play any sport outside of basketball, what would it have been?

SPEAKER_02 1:26:30

It would have been hockey. I would have, I would have stuck with hockey growing up where I did, and and your listeners and a lot of the folks in Canada are going to appreciate that. Hockey was so important. Although I will tell you this, that this is you want to know the most embarrassing hockey moment of my life. Right here it is, right here. So my cousins lived down the road from us. And and being that they were older, I'd get the hand-me-down stuff all the time, right? And so when I was a kid, I don't know, I was probably seven or eight, uh, and I was growing out of the skates that I had. My cousin, my aunt gives us the hand-me-down skates, and I put them on, and the very next weekend we had some tournament I was going to play in. They were red, white, and blue skates. And I played in that tournament and I actually played pretty well, but I got made fun of the entire tournament because I was wearing red, white, and blue skates. When I got home the following weekend, I took black shoe polish and and blacked out the entire skates. But uh I loved hockey and playing it as a kid. Like I said, I grew so much, I thought, well, I got to play basketball or something because I'm so darn big and I'm pretty good at it. But I would go back and play hockey. I love the atmosphere. I I love the the what the game is, uh the humility of the game. Uh, you know, guys who've got I love dealing with the NHL guys because they're the best professional athletes to deal with, because at some point in time, you know, they were on a on a bus driving a Saskatoon or something, right, in a junior game. And so there's a humility about them. Although I will say this the stinkiest locker rooms in sports are hockey locker rooms.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:01

Easy, hands down, hands down, easy, easy.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:03

Yep. But I'd go back and play hockey if I had a chance to do it again.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:05

Ricole, the only way your story could have been better is if you said my skates were red, white, and blue, and then I discovered they had picks on the front of them.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:15

That was not the case, but uh still that would have made it even worse.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:19

Okay, we last season we asked those people that we interviewed. We said if you could go talk to your 10-year-old self, we're going the opposite direction this season. If you could write down a note of advice for 20 years from now that you want yourself to remember and never forget, what would you tell yourself?

SPEAKER_02 1:28:43

Study scripture more. Dead serious. Study scripture more. The older I get, the more I realize the more I need the word of God. And and so my my Bible, I'm sitting at my desk right now and I've got I've got three different translations laying out in front of me and a concordance over here and and I just it's it's becoming just uh almost an obsession with me. I want to be in it all the time. And so um that that's becoming so more real and rich as time goes on. Don't ever give that up. In fact increase it. Pick it up do more all the time because the results of it and the uh what it does for me, what it does to me, what it does through me, what it does for those around me is is exponential and and that's what I would say.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:33

Do you have a favorite Bible verse right now?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:37

First Corinthians 2 2 is one that that uh I I always go back to right I resolve while I was with you to know nothing but Jesus Christ and him crucified. That's that's it. You know Paul's sitting there and as he writes that to the church in Corinth while I'm with you that that's all I want to know. Jesus Christ and him crucified that's it. That's the turning point in history. That's what changed everything. That's what we focus upon. You can add to that but it it it's it's the gospel. Jesus Christ his life his crucifixion his resurrection that's the gospel. He did it for us the propitiation for our sins so that that in fact I just uh it's kind of funny uh you know being being a cowboy I've got I've got a couple of belt buckles I just ordered a belt buckle and we call our ranch call county line ranch we've got property on both sizes county line and and so I just had a belt buckle made it says seal ranch up top a little team roping logo in the middle on the bottom it says 1 Corinthians 2 2. That's what I had to put on the buckle. It's supposed to be here any day now so I've been waiting on that. And that's one I've gravitated towards for years that that is always the center of it. It's go back to what we talked about. It's always about him it's about what he has done and then our response to that.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:47

So that that's one I always gravitate towards once you get it you realize he really is the chief cornerstone isn't he?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:54

Oh without question without question no doubt you know and and Dan one thing I do before before every broadcast I do and I and I got this uh I don't know if you know the name Red Barber or not Red Barber was one of the original play-by-play guys one of the guys that actually developed what I do for a living way way back when. I did the Brooklyn Dodgers way back when and he was one of the guys and and Red was a was a believer and so I I found out that he did this he was the guy that trained Vin Scully by the way and so that's that's where Vin came from he Vin's off the Red Barber tree. And and Vin was a great believer and I had a chance to chat with him years ago about that but but Red was was such an influence upon Vin and I found out that Red Barber before he did every broadcast he would say the same thing to him out loud. He would quote Psalm 1914 May the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart always be acceptable in thy sight O Lord my strength and my redeemer right he said that every time I stole that as a young man. I think that was okay to steal that from Red I'm pretty sure uh and I stole that and I've been doing that since I was 25 years old before every speaking event the I did it before I came on the screen with you before I preach before I talk before I broadcast when I'm on ESPN whatever it might be I say that every single time because even though it's a secular setting and I can't preach the gospel when I'm doing it I always figure Lord if you center me on you in that that that will be enough because you can use that and I'll tell you the the best the best story about uh kind of that mindset oh it's gotta be ten years ago now I got a letter one day from a guy and he just sent it to the to the radio station when I was still there and he sent it and it it just said uh my name is such and such I I'm a pastor in such and such town uh I believe that you were a believer in Jesus Christ. You've never said anything in the broadcast but there's something when I listen that tells me that Christ is the center of your life. And I looked at that and I smiled like a butcher's dog man. I was like Lord thank you. That's all I've ever wanted. I want it to be centered on you so my thoughts and my words reflect you somehow and that guy picked up on it somehow somehow even though I didn't say a word about it on the air. And so you know those two verses I think are really kind of probably front and center of my life.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:10

I'll make you a deal mark one day if I attend your funeral and someone starts talking about your broadcast broadcast career I'll make sure I run up there and tackle them okay please please do say yeah I think he did something with the microphone outside of that it really doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:26

Please do that for me.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:27

I will well a wonderful time together Mark it's been an absolute pleasure let's pray and thank the Lord for our time. Heavenly Father I come before you right now thank you so much for the time that Mark has been able to have in order to join us and record this podcast. Lord it's often we are capped by the limitations of time and Lord we are trapped in human flesh.

Prayer, Thanks, And Final Encouragement

SPEAKER_01 1:33:50

But Lord we know that the hope that we have in you through Jesus Christ will allow us to have eternity together and just talk about you and all the wonderful things you've done. And Lord we thank you for your son we thank you for Mark we pray that you would give him more opportunities to show the love of Christ to those around him in Jesus' name amen.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:12

Amen if you have enjoyed this episode please follow the podcast and let us know your feedback this podcast is listening to support and you can be an encouragement to us by sharing this episode with your health we can read with the gospel in the game