Paralympic Special Edition & SPLASH! Recap

In this episode of Aquatics Only, we dive into the world of aquatic sports and inclusivity with two engaging interviews. Our first guest is Matthew Haanappel OAM, Paralympic gold medalist and aquatics manager. Matthew shares his personal journey, his experiences in the Paralympics, and his work promoting inclusivity within aquatics. The second half of the episode features Declan Gillard- Martin, discussing the SPLASH! Trade Expo 2024.

Highlights:

1. Interview with Matthew Haanappel:
   • Matthew's journey: From starting in water therapy as a child to winning gold at the Paralympic Games.
   • Paralympic Games Impact: How the Paralympics have grown and the pivotal moments, particularly after the London 2012 Games.
   • Inclusion and Ability: Matthew emphasises the importance of focusing on what people with disabilities can do and how swim schools can be more inclusive.
   • Looking forward: Matthew shares his passion for creating talent pathways for the next generation of Paralympians and fostering inclusivity in aquatics.
2. SPLASH! Trade Expo 2024 with Declan Gillard-Martin:
   • Event Overview: A recap of one of the biggest aquatic industry expos in the Southern Hemisphere.
   • Industry Trends: Discussion on the event’s impact and the importance of collaboration within the aquatics industry.
   • Future of Splash Expo: Insights into what’s in store for 2026 and how the event can further bridge different sectors of the industry.

Key Quotes:

• "We’re not just talking about change, we’re living it." — Matthew Haanappel
• "Inclusion is a priority for the aquatics industry, and we need to focus on community and equity for all." — Matthew Haanappel
• "SPLASH! Expo has grown into something truly global, and we're only getting started." — Declan Gillard Martin

Resources:

• Learn more about the Paralympic Games and their history: Paralympics Official Website
• Discover more about Splash Expo 2024 and upcoming events: SPLASH! Trade Expo

Stay Connected:

• Follow us on Instagram and LinkedIn for behind-the-scenes content and updates.

Thanks for listening to Aquatics Only. If you’re in swim schools, aquatic facilities, lifeguarding, learn-to-swim, programs, products, or anything water safety related, you’re in the right place.

Subscribe so you don’t miss an episode, and if this one was useful, share it with someone in the industry.

Want to get involved or have a guest/topic suggestion? Reach out: aquaticsonlypod@gmail.com

Transcript

This is aquatics only. 

Hey, y'all let's go. Welcome to aquatic.  

for joining us for Episode 4. Today we have not one, but two interviews for you. The first you'll hear Matthew Harnapel and myself. Matthew is a Paralympian, gold medalist in OIM, along with an interview from Declan Gillard Martin and David Stennett, chatting all things sports.

Splash Expo, which has just happened on the Gold Coast. Ayo, let's go. 

Welcome again to the Aquatics Only Podcast. This is a very special edition. Uh, today, this will be coming out right around the time that the Paralympics, at least from the aquatics position is finishing. We have a special guest. We seem to have lots of special guests on our podcast already, which is great.

But we have Matt Harnapol joining us today. Very well qualified to speak on this topic if you ask me, but I'm not going to introduce him. I'll leave that to himself. Matt, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for joining us on Aquatics Only. It's  

great to be here and thanks Luke for inviting me.  

Mate, anytime.

It's good to chat. We've connected, we've only met once, but I feel like we've connected a few times over the last, uh, year. So, I've got my camera on for the last, say six months or so, but can you tell me and our audience for that matter a little bit about yourself and what we'll be covering off on today and why it's so important to you?

Yeah, so for my background and, and I've done some fantastic work in, in all of community, particularly with disability, of course, that's my lived experience and back and my background. My personal background as a person with cerebral palsy and, you know, starting my life, um, as many children do throughout the aquatics industry and aquatic, aquatics environments is the kind of barriers that you face.

So I take that lived experience right through the work I do today as an aquatics manager of one of the major facilities in the western suburbs of Melbourne. But as a Paralympian as well, going to London. to Rio and the Commonwealth games in, on the Gold Coast, um, gold medalists and some world record records along the way. 

Look, it is a genuine pleasure to be here and genuine  pleasure to be able to talk about this work because, um, with all of my journey and that of all my other fellow Paralympians, we love talking about it and we love to be able to change the world and, uh, create the change in, in all of, not just aquatics industry, All of, all of business as well.

That's right. So rather than just talking about it, we are, you're actually living the change and being the change. I don't think you, I think a part that you left off there is that your Order of Australia medalist OAM, is that correct? 

Yes. And I'm very lucky to have been nominated by the Paralympics committee when, uh, I came off my London performance, but it's not just that for, for my swimming performance.

It's also for my work in community and the work that I do have done with the international Paralympic committee, not just here. But in the South Pacific as well, um, used to do a lot of work with Vanuatu and the Fiji, um, areas as well. Um, so, um, my, uh, reach, uh, now is now expanding very much across, um, Well, 

I feel very fortunate to have you because as we were just getting ready for this setup, you said you've been doing a lot of media work around the Paralympics over in Paris.

Yeah, and so, um, most of that is done remotely from Australia, of course. Um, there we've got a remote crew in, in Paris at the moment for Channel 9, uh, that have been very busy. Privilege to do a number of panels, both on radio and TV for the ABC of the last 12 days or so. Uh, and you know, there's a number of podcasts just like this one, but we got still coming out, um, talking about disability and what does that mean for the games and also for the future of disability in this country.

So, um, I've been a very busy boy over the last 12 days. 

I'll bet. Well, how about you lead me into that a little bit? Let's wade into the, what does the Paralympics mean for the overall games? And what does it mean for sport in Australia, specifically aquatics, given that is the bent or the focus of this podcast, Matt?

Yeah, of course. Look, let's talk about the Paralympics. It is been around since 1960, since Rome, uh, and it had been in every single Olympic city, uh, since that time. Um, we've been very much alongside the Olympic games for such a long time. And But it has grown its platform, particularly since Beijing in 2008.

So, um, and that comes with commercial television rights, um, for the first time in 2016. And, uh, with all of the sports that are involved in the Paralympics, of course, swimming is my sport, um, but it also is one of the most successful sports that we've had at the Paralympic Games alongside athletics. Um, if you look at London in particular, um, that was the first time That we saw, um, such a, an audience over two and a half million people, uh, watching every night.

Um, and it was really just an amazing change to see. I guess the Paralympians of London, of which I was one of them, uh, inspire generations and inspire everyone that was at home, um, in Australia and in the UK as well. You know, my parents who were there in London, uh, watching me said that it was, you know, and my uncle that lived in London at the time said they would go on the Tube, um, across London and it would be one of the few times that he has seen, he's my uncle, this is, people talking on the Tube.

And of course, a very dark, um, you know, grey London and normally, but a very bright London it became during the games. So, um, great to see, um, you know, the UK community really come behind those games and that to be the launch pad for what would be change in disability sport and disability in that country and the world following that. 

And I think that's the beautiful part about the change and sometimes change is slow. And not, not as fast as we'd like, but I think as long as we keep seeing change, uh, I think that's, that's a critical part. I think I was sharing with you just in the, again, as we led up to the recording of this, the opportunity to share with my sons, even last night to go, people come in all different shapes and sizes, like it it's, and we hear phrases thrown around.

So I'm actually, this was not planned. Uh, so my apologies for this,  the phrasing and the word and the verbiage around it. Live. Disability, all abilities, where, where, where do we land with that in a, in a truly pragmatic sense, as someone with lived experience in that world?  

What we say to all, I do a lot of training sessions for all different companies, both for my one at, uh, in the Western suburbs of Melbourne or, um, certainly, um, around Australia is that we talk about, you know, focus on what they have in their ability.

Focus on what they can do, not what they can't, you know, there's been a lot of slogans along the, along the, on the, on the journey. And, you know, don't dis my ability, you know, and it's been, and that's been used in a couple of different slogan events, um, for, uh, job access, for example, as an Australian government, uh, sort of job, um, program.

And they say that very, very openly and honest that you don't want to be dissing anyone's availability. You're focused on what they can do. And, um, um, I think that's when we look to an aquatics industry of what people can do and how they can participate as in works and in jobs in this industry. I think that there's an opportunity for more people with disabilities to be more representative of the industry that we are trying to serve.

Um, and so when we convert our Paralympians into ultimately, uh, a thousand people every year, every four years, it comes off a Paralympics, they're looking for jobs. Some of those are retiring. They're retiring. This year in Paris and looking for jobs. So how can we look to empower their ability to get into an aquatics industry?

Um, and continue the love of the water that they've had for the last, however long they've had there in their career.  

And you're certainly the prime example of that being in a leadership role, particularly in the aquatic space already, uh, having achieved the highest heights as a Paralympian, a gold medalist.

I know you, uh, If I, if, if it was me on the other side of this, I would have been wearing my medal to this interview, Matt. So you're a far more humble human being than I am. Uh, and that's, that's probably of, uh, no great surprise to anyone listening to this podcast, but I think you're the prime example of that.

And you are, you are living and breathing that every day and you're right. In saying that  Paralympians coming off the back of this, looking for jobs and seeking out other opportunities. We are the prime example for it. I think since taking over as CEO of ASSA, I've had so many good opportunities to have conversations that aren't necessarily in the, in the mainstream,  whether it's, it's around the ADHD piece or the autism piece or the physical, uh, ability piece as well as chatting with, uh, Carol from Water Wombats down in Canberra, uh, who runs a beautiful.

It's a beautiful thing, uh, what she operates with and, and taking kids. And so I suppose that taking kids or adults for that matter of experience trauma, whether it's  not being able to fit into a hate this phrase, but normal swimming lesson, a group swimming lesson, and being able to go one on one.  She's telling me a beautiful story about a little boy who had, uh, such a sensory,  I suppose, tendency where he couldn't eat food, um, because it would set him off just unless it was crunchy.

And so he found himself only eating chips and within,  I suppose two years of finding an absolute love for swimming, something clicked in his brain and he went, Oh, if I want to be a really good swimmer, I have to eat food. And so they were able to work the diet and he actually doubled his body weight within two years, which had all these ongoing benefits into society, uh, and himself because he was able to.

be included and ultimately transition into swimming lessons that had more, more kids in it. And that's, that was just one example. She told other stories as well. And, and I get really, I suppose, filled with inspiration around this because of what is possible and you've got lived experience in this world.

Can you tell me a bit more? Yes, you do. Aquatic stuff for a job now. And yes, you were very successful, literally the highest level. What did it mean for you growing up? So what did swimming mean to you growing up? 

Starting from the beginning, the water and let's start with water because that's where I think it starts and everyone's love of the water  and for me.

Swimming and being part of that, you know, you are floating in a most calm sense of, um, space. And for me, um, with the recommendation of the doctors that I was working with and my parents were working with at a young age, We knew that that would be the best therapy option for me.  And in a very emotional sense, that is the starting and the beginnings of everything that comes after in the last 30 years of my life.

And when I look at every child that comes through my particular sensor or the many other children that go through, You know, swim schools like Water Wombats you've just mentioned.  That opportunity to have that connection with community, to have that social impact, and to have to converse with, you know, a swim teacher, a lifeguard, a receptionist, and have that engagement with community,  that is something that will make, um, someone's, uh, life genuinely better.

When we do so much with people with disability, And particularly in these small swim schools, the impact that they can have, um, rather versus a swim school of four and a half thousand or five thousand kids a week.  Impact comes with getting to know your children and getting to know the families and them feel that love back to you.

And you know, my beginnings in both water therapy to start off with, but then into swimming lessons comes from those small swim school environments first and foremost. I didn't go into a major aquatic center until I was 14 and 15 because that's where I needed that one to one support.  And I think that really has the opportunity.

To be the place where we can see the most inclusive work being done by our industry is no small schools, swim schools that are really doing the great work that they are doing. And, um, that's essentially the great work of ASSA as well is that, um, most of the members of ASSA are in small swim schools. So that's where the greatest work for inclusion can occur.

And that's such a beautiful sentiment. And now you work in this space in a big facility as well. And the swim school obviously has program pools and everything like that. And the ability for one to one. And so you've progressed. It's a whole journey. And that's the part that I think,  I think that's the most beautiful thing to me.

I can start. Individually one on one and end up at jobs, not even jobs. Like we're talking careers. Uh, we're not, we're not just talking about jobs. The job is, you know, a place that you go,  a career is something that you're passionate about and you, and you, you stick around and you drive at it. Cause you want to see change and you can be part of the change.

Uh, and I think you really are doing that.  I think you've highlighted a lot of the good work that we do.  Can you tell me the favorite part about.  Swim schools, but also the bigger facilities for me as I trip around and I chat with, with people like paramobility and I see, I suppose the access piece, uh, to come into fruition a lot more,  you can call me naive, which is fine.

Uh, it's probably true, but I, I, I'm encouraged by. The range of options and I suppose the focus that I see or the passion that I see from everyone that you've mentioned before from the lifeguards to the swim teachers to even the receptionists to want to invite people in. I suppose there's a level of  and I'll focus, I suppose. 

It's almost a negative in my view,  I still have some concerns and that will be my question to you next about what, what can we do better at and what can we do more of and I'm not going to bash the government on this forum at all, but I suppose I'm concerned perhaps around the NDIS piece and sometimes.

Uh, swimming lessons in particular, you have to come up with a particular term or it's, it's down to the NDIS planner to really be conscious and understand the actual impact of therapy. So I think I've got some work to do there as CEO of Acer and with, with my industry peers from a peak body perspective, but can you tell me. 

Let's focus on a, let's finish on a positive, actually. Tell me one thing that you think we can all do better at in a big way. That's going to shift the needle enough. And number two, what's something that just to, I suppose, finish with an encouragement almost that we are doing well as an industry in this space.

Well, we continue to do well in, um, I'll start with that is that we, we are starting to on both on disability, but also inclusion. Is that we are starting to collaborate better in Victoria, where I'm from. We have a an annual forum run by aquatic recreation, Victoria body,  which is focused on inclusion and diversity at that event.

We have an opportunity to share case studies to be able to network and to be able to talk about inclusion for one day a year. However, that that is one only one day a year. How do we convert that to 365 days per year? And so our greatest opportunity is to be able to have networks and touch points on these issues across the year and every year so that we have exponential growth on inclusion.

Community participation and equity for all. And if we, that's, that is our opportunity. That's what we're doing well. And I think that as we go along, as we continue to on this trajectory, the opportunity for us to learn from one another and collectively throw our budgets together to be able to do great work, our resources together and do this great work.

Is going to be the best outcome for the industry to take to your point around the NDIS as well. I think there is some great opportunities there to increase the capacity and knowledge of our government, of our government around the benefits of swim schools, the benefits of swimming lessons for people with disability, but it also requires us to  play.

Uh, in the space of improving the training package for the swim teaching course, which currently only covers assistance. It doesn't cover swim teaching, which we need to really work, um, hard on with the government. Uh, it is a very complex area that we are, you know, very working very hard with our, our, particularly with our, uh, national industry.

bodies, um, including the inclusion committees, um, but also our critics committees, um, there is still some great work being done and, but it comes back to work until we give our collaborating and collaborating to achieve an inclusive result for all. 

I think you've articulated that. Beautifully. Uh, I have nothing to add at all to that particular sentiment.

I think, I think that community piece in the collaboration piece, instead of wasting resources, perhaps if we can pull them together for greater effect, um, and ultimately raise awareness. Uh, I think that will be a beautiful thing too. And I think for me. And this, I suppose, outside of being focused on access and inclusion is, is really around the timing of it is to celebrate the Paralympics and all the wonderful swimmers we have there.

And I think the perfect image, and I'll share it as part of this podcast is from Lewis Bishop. I got sent this last night to the podcast with Lewis Bishop last night, taking out bronze at the time of this recording timing is always funny thing. When you're doing a podcast recording that could be listened to, you know, infinite item, but I think is it.

Tim Hodge that he celebrates with and they're hand in hand. They've just, they've just won and it's. And it's so beautiful. Just, it shows that unity. It shows what success can look like when we, when we, you know, compete sure day in, day out, no problem. But when we come together and celebrate, I'll share Lewis's, uh, Lewis Bishop's post as part of this, but I think  to me, that's inspirational.

Uh, that, that to me is one of the better shots that I've seen just to go, and this is what we do. 

Yeah. And you look at Lewis and, you know, He's a 19 year old, as I understand, and  he's, you know, first couple of teams, both junior and senior, and he's got a long career ahead. The impact of people with disability on the Paralympic team is really strong, and the stories that come out of that, you know, even Tim Hodge.

Tim is from Sydney, and his story is something really special. You know, he was told, you know, he told his mum, you know, when he was a young kid that, um, You know, when his leg was amputated that he wouldn't have a normal life to get to come and how heartbreaking that is for his mother to hear as well. But all of these Paralympians have stories of heartbreak and, um, of, uh, you know, breaking through adversity.

So, but yes, there is some images like Lewis's from the other night, uh, that will stand the test of time from the games in Paris.  Beautiful. 

Well, Matt. Is there anything else you'd like to add before we kind of wrap this podcast up? Have we covered off on most things? 

Absolutely. I think that, um, you know, if I was to cap off the discussion, I think the, the message is, is that inclusion is a priority for this in aquatics industry.

It still needs to be in that, you know, as we say in a lot of the business world is that more inclusive businesses are more competitive businesses and, uh, are certainly driven towards better social outcomes. And also as part of that, um, Better revenue through the business. Um, I think that there is an opportunity to be able to ensure that inclusion is part of the business strategies in our industry and, um, looking towards the Paralympics and what we can do.

I think that swimming, our learn to swim businesses certainly have an opportunity to provide talent pathways. for the next generation of Paralympians who could very well be there in Brisbane 32. I encourage the industry and continue to work together, um, so we can, uh, for the betterment of people with disability and the rest of diverse communities. 

Well, Matt, thank you so much for your time. That is the perfect summary to everything that we've talked about. I look forward to journeying with you in many different capacities as we both progress our careers through this wonderful industry that we call the aquatics industry. Thank you for joining us today and giving your time to the aquatics on the podcast.

Thanks, Luke. Anytime, mate. We'll see you again soon. 

It is excellent to be joined today post one of the biggest industry events on the planet, which was the Splash Pool and Spa Trade Expo by the man behind it all, who's had to pull the strings and bring it together. Many of you were there and if you weren't, then I hope you have what I call ROMO, which is regret of missing out because it's too late, but you don't have to miss the next one.

But I am  very pleased to be able to introduce you today to our guest here, Declan Gillard Martin. Welcome to the podcast. 

David, thank you for having me, mate. I'm absolutely stoked to be on here. And, uh, wow, what a show 2024 Trade Expo was, hey? 

Have you recovered from the event and the pressure of running what is, well, the third biggest industry event in the planet, the biggest in the Southern Hemisphere?

It's a hell of a lot of work. How are you? Mate, I 

I look, I don't know if recovery is gonna happen that quickly. I said to everyone that the week post Splash and have the week off. And then I got into Splash and I went, no, no, no, that's, that's the week to to be working. And now we're a few weeks post splash.

Yeah, I still haven't had a weekend. I've just got thoughts and feelings mate, running rampant for anyone else that's come near me. I've got note notepads and my notes in my phone is ridiculous. My Saana projects are crazy. I've got things everywhere, but hopefully things will quiet down shortly. 

So for those who don't know what we're talking about, who might've been living under a rock or now new into industry or getting exposed, tell us a little bit about what Splash is and was. 

Well, we've probably got the two best people to be talking about it here, mate, because, um, it, this show is largely attributed to you, so thank you for that. I think the industry needs to thank you as well, but Splash Trade Expo 2024. Thanks, mark, uh, was the largest trade expo in the Southern Hennas. Here we had, so far, we had.

All of the biggest, best, baddest, uh, suppliers from the industry that come into the Australian, uh, and Australasian market, um, exhibiting. It looked amazing. It looked so many people commented how European it looked. And I think that's a huge comment for us to take away because that's what we're, that's what we're aiming for.

There's a, There's a cool show that hopefully I'm going to get a plan one for next year. Um, and hopefully I get the gig to go and have a look at what we're being compared to. But we had all of those guys exhibiting in all of the exhibit halls, which we've got all four halls at the Gold Coast Exhibition and Convention Center.

And we had industry professionals, pool builders, tradesmen, everything on the floor. Everything 

around the pool and spa industry, which was, which was incredible. It really is very comparable to the Euro shows and what Declan was referring to there before, not to blow my own trumpet at all, but I was the former seat in what Declan now holds in running splash.

So it is of interest to me personally. And. I didn't deliver this show. Declan, you did. And in my humble estimation, and I'm going to judge you harder than probably anyone, you did a great job, mate. So thank you for upholding the industry and the quality of, of that event. What were the highlights for you at that event?

Not, not gonna lie. I'm walking through. The bump in on the first day, I got there nice and early in the morning, and then seeing all the calm before the storm, you know, we didn't have people walking out on Tuesday night, the show was Wednesday, Thursday, we didn't have people walking out, um, until 1, 2am in the morning that afternoon, that night, um, and just watching it all settle, and then the next day, How rampant it was, those doors open.

And I think, I think there was a group of Clark for other guys that walked in first. It was about 40 of them, all strong and uniform and wowee. Like it was just, I was actually, I was a little overwhelmed to see just like the plethora of people in the halls for 9. 30 waiting for those doors to open.  

Look, we're an industry that's passionate about what we do.

SPLASH is largely focused just by definition with, with its history towards the domestic residential market incorporating some commercial aquatics, um, but as a strength, really there is nothing like it in the Southern Hemisphere for a domestic residential based, uh, pool and spa show for the trade, it is the highest level that there is.

You've mentioned some of those highlights being the, the quality of the stands and the engagement of industry coming through. What about some of the other events that ran around that week in that process? And you saw the networking opportunities, which is just a nice professional word for drinking together, networking means we're drinking together.

We're kind of slowly getting drunk together and doing business. What was some of the other events that went around and how did they all come off? Yeah, look, I'm glad you've classified 

that there because yeah, my entertainment expenses on my, uh, credit card. There's a few credit 

cards that got to work out 

at a corporate level.

I am sure. I think so, mate. I think so. Yours and mine both included. Look, I think the ecosystem.  I think the ecosystem of events that happened in and around Splash was awesome. Like obviously we had a few of the trade beasts, the huge companies like Poolworks have their conventions alongside the event.

Then we had ASSA, the ASSA event was, was unreal. The Australian Schools 

Association, just to expand on, on that vernacular there. So ASSA, go ahead Declan. 

And, and I think Matt, you can probably touch on that more than I can, because you emcee one of the nights of the ASSA conference and that was unreal.

Yeah. No, I got to stand on stage with my gold jacket and, uh, be up there with Olympic legend, the third famous Duncan in history, Duncan Armstrong, sorry, the third famous Armstrong in history, Duncan Armstrong, uh, who was a gold medalist in the 200 meter freestyle at the Seoul Olympics, which I am old enough to remember Declan, I don't want to hear from you on this topic.

And it was, it was a packed house upstairs, so to see the whole Swim School Association and that part of Commercial Aquatics getting together was, was absolutely first class as well and all building into the wider myriad and minutiae of detail and events going on, mate. 

And you know, I think that's really important to touch on too because, you know, So Splash, we were lucky enough actually to host the lunch for the, for the delegates of the Australian SimSchools Association Conference, which means those people came down and they experienced the trade show and they saw the complete other side of the industry, but also like what's behind closed doors that they necessarily don't get to see.

Like they were SimSchool operators. These people are servicing their SimSchools, they actually got to walk the floors and make those connections and see those, Which I think displays the synergies that are. Probably a lot closer than some of us are willing to admit sometimes in our industry. There's so much synergies and so many things that in the ecosystem can come together, that sometimes we're too siloed.

And I think that's really important. And I think that showed me, I'm not sure about you, but it showed me how much of more of a connect there can and should, and maybe will be right in the future. 

Interesting segue into my next question then, so that's the event that was, what about the events that will be, let's talk about the fact that, you know, that again, we focused on what Splash has been super strong at, but, you know, there are other events around the country, like the National Sports Convention, like Facilities and Leisure and Sport, the ALM brand as well, which is focused on many of those things too, coming together, what do you see the future of an event like Splash being?

Thanks  Well, in the future,  

well, I can only tell you, we've got the space booked at the GCSE for 2026, um, and it's a bigger space than this year, which, which only anticipates what could and what might be, um, I think ASA co aligning sounds very 

non committal, what could and what might be. Can you send us a picture of that, that, that incorporation, you talk about silos, but we've got, Facilities, leisure, sport, the ALM representing that side of things too, which is a sister brand with, with Splash really, if I can be so bold.

If I've, if I've misappropriated that, clear me up.  But how does that siloing get, get engaged together? 

Okay, so I'm lucky enough to be the brand manager of both the Splash brand and the Australasian Ledger Management brand. That Australasian Ledger Management brand has, ALM has such a unique position in the industry to probably bring those silos into that synergy, into that collaboration.

So it's going to be interesting to see what we do with that ALM brand and space alongside Splash. You mentioned NSC. 

Yeah, well, we had Martin Shepard on this show just last week as well as the NSC and it seems like there might be some synergy there, um, as there is in some of those Euro shows that we spoke about before with Facilities Leisure Sport being represented alongside the splash type of show.

And we've seen the appetite for it, mate. Like, like you've mentioned it, I've mentioned it. It was written on a piece of paper in the strategy day that you and I were both in on the Friday post splash that brought all those commercial entities and the people that are invested in that side of the industry together.

And somewhere on a piece of paper, it said, you know, splash and NSC to, um. To come closer together. So 2026, mate, I think we can see a commitment from industry. Traditionally, I can't say exactly what that would look like, but I know there's definitely one side championing and it's the ALM side to bring it together and really show everyone what we're actually capable of in the Australasian space.

Yeah, very good. So your perfect picture of what you say could and might be, if it will and can be, what would that look like for Declan Well, 

mate, it means an even bigger event. It means It means my head for the next two years is going to be just as scrambled, if not more. But there's a, there's an arena that we, the only place that we didn't book out was the space ASSA had and the arena at the Gold Coast Exhibition and Convention Centre.

Probably good 

ASSA might want that space again, I suppose. 

And you know, ASSA might be able to stay upstairs, but mate, I think if we're looking at Brilliant Splash and events like NSC together, that arena is going to be packed. And I think if we bring, if we liken ourselves to further to the Euro, Um, and we model ourselves off that.

I don't think anyone's going to say no to an event that's going to bring thousands more people with such a diversity together. I just can't see it not happening. 

Do you see it being more of an exhibition or a conference symposium or a mix of the two? And if it is, what, what's it going to talk about?

What's it do? Well, I mean, and I think 

that's the interesting one too, cause you know, about the coalitions and, and each state, um, bodies in certain different, um, industries or sides of this industry, we want to bring them together for 2026. I think the best picture there is to have a bit of everything. I think Royal Lifesaving has such success in their symposium platforms.

We've seen that over the last 24 months, Royal Lifesaving bring their side of the industry together for research and advocacy. That has been  From an implementation standpoint, that has just been second to none. So I think we've seen the success of that and we've seen the buy in from our industry. We've seen the trade shows, seen the exhibition at the likes of LIWA conferences, um, or LIWA exhibitions.

We've seen trades wanting to come in there. I think the education thing is going to be an interesting one. I think the convention space or the expo space, not to coin it early, but I think it's almost going to be an all in one. What ACID did really well was those education days, and I think the feedback I've heard from that, and you might be able to test it further,  But the, the Monday, Tuesday, and then I think some of the preceding days where they had those specialist education days where they really empowered  particular things, 

I think we're going to see it all.

Righto. So is, is there an overarching theme that is cooking up in your head for that? Or what would the overarching  questions, topics be for the industry to come together and solve an answer at, at such an event?  

We see, I think I'd actually like to go to the broader industry. So I actually like to pledge something to the audience.

And if I can, mate, I'm not sure if you have an email address, but please plug it in here. I'd actually like to hear what people want to see in here in 2026 from that collaboration standpoint, because I've got amazing ideas. I'm young and enthusiastic, much like yourself, mate. And I know what I want to see.

But, um, why don't I ask around?  

I 

think you're both of those. 

So you've heard it there from Declan, dear audience. Declan at spaza. com. au.  Um, reach out to Declan. What do you want to see? What do you want to have, have covered? In your mind, Declan, is there a brewing theme or a particular series of, of topics that could, should be covered?

I think, I 

think the ALM brand and having the word leisure in there is, is really for us. Um, I think us keeping that word and us leveraging what leisure really, um, encompasses, I think that allows us to have some strong themes. And I think that allows us to, to push and pull and mold. Look, there's been some trends in the industry.

Um, and 2025 is going to be an interesting year. I think, I think we've. And not to speak out of turn mate, maybe, you know, other people have a different opinion. I think we've finally overcome that last downward turn of what COVID has done to the economy in our industry, individual industry. I think that's becoming less and less of a topic now.

And I think the bounce back has been evident. So I think, um, operators of aquatic facility swans. Want more assistance. That's a, that's a theme. They're crying out for, for help and synergy and collaboration. I think those are the words, mate, 2026 needs to embody is, how does parks connect to leisure? And how does rock climbing connect to aquatics?

And how does trade connect to consumer? Um, I think it's all of those things, because Without them and without protecting, promoting, we can't promote. So  it's going to be an interesting, interesting topics for 2026. What would you like to see, mate? 

Well, I'm the one doing the interviewing question here, Declan.

I haven't considered that myself. I don't want what's in your head. No, look, I think. Congratulations to you, Declan, that you have done a great job of picking up and moving things forward. It was a very successful show, uh, expo for those of us that were lucky enough to be there. Uh, for those that didn't, make sure you lock it in your calendars.

I'm sure the dates will be out sometime soon for 2026. Uh, this is a once every two years opportunity. Declan, Gillard, Martin, what a pleasure. Thank you for being so generous with your time. Congratulations again, and thank you for joining us on. The podcast today.