Season 1, Episode 4: Executive Vice President, Public Relations, Mike Cherenson

As SCG's EVP of Public Relations, Mike uses his extensive experience in the PR industry to elevate our clients every day. A 30-year industry veteran and author of three studies on the impact of reputation Mike is Accredited in Public Relations (APR) by the Universal Accreditation Board and Public Relations Society of America and is a member of the organization’s prestigious College of Fellows. He recently received The Patrick Jackson Award for Distinguished Service to PRSA.

Transcript

Tom Marguccio 0:00

Welcome to Coffee and Tea with SCG, a podcast from the industry experts at SCG Advertising and PR. We are a full-service woman-owned agency that offers advertising, public relations, recruitment, marketing, and association management. In this season, we'll be chatting with some members of our team about their specialties. So grab your coffee and your tea, and let's brew up a good conversation.

Maddie Trumino 0:25

Hi everyone, and welcome back to Coffee and Tea with SCG. I'm your host, Maddie Tremino, account coordinator at SCG Advertising and Public Relations, and I'm joined by Mike Cherenson, executive VP of PR at SCG Advertising and Public Relations. Hi, Mike.

Mike Cherenson 0:40

Hello, Maddie. How are you?

Maddie Trumino 0:42

I have my first question ready for you.

Mike Cherenson 0:44

Let's go for it.

Maddie Trumino 0:45

Do you prefer coffee or tea?

Mike Cherenson 0:47

Coffee.

Maddie Trumino 0:47

Okay, and how do you take your coffee?

Mike Cherenson 0:49

I've evolved into a black coffee drinker.

Maddie Trumino 0:52

Wow, that's tough.

Mike Cherenson 0:54

You know what? I I made the move and I uh I really appreciate the taste of coffee now. Like it was masked behind all the other stuff, so now I can appreciate good coffee.

Maddie Trumino 1:03

Okay, as somebody who likes their coffee as a dessert, I can't get behind the black coffee, but I applaud you for the I evolved.

Mike Cherenson 1:10

I wasn't there originally, but I've evolved.

Maddie Trumino 1:12

Okay, good to know. So a more serious question. Explain for our listeners what your position is here at SCG.

Mike Cherenson 1:20

I am executive vice president of public relations, and I lead the public relations uh group here at the agency, and I also am part of the entire leadership team and uh just helped guide the agency to uh ongoing success.

Maddie Trumino 1:32

Wonderful, and that you do. So, how long have you been at SCG then?

Mike Cherenson 1:36

Well, that's a complicated question. Officially, as an employee for about 34 years, but uh I've been here my entire life.

Maddie Trumino 1:43

And do you want to explain why you've been here your entire life a little bit?

Mike Cherenson 1:46

So my dad founded the agency in uh 1958. So when I was a kid, I you know, I was brought to the agency as I doodled ABC's news release paper, and and as every other kid in school had some kind of trapper keeper folder, I had a press kit folder. So uh I've been raised around the agency and the agency life uh since the very beginning, and so it's been a great ride.

Maddie Trumino 2:10

That's wonderful. And uh what services does PR offer?

Mike Cherenson 2:13

Here at SCG, we talk a lot about the the peso model, the paid, the earned, the shared, and the owned. And and in terms of uh public relations, we kind of own the the earned space and also, you know, kind of share the shared space, if you will, with the you know, our our other teammates, but definitely we own the earned space, and that it certainly includes traditional offerings like media relations, but also includes thought leadership, crisis communications, special events, community relations, media training, influencer outreach, to some degree government affairs. Uh I think I know the community affairs, internal communications. So we really kind of uh our group owns the the earned media, but we obviously work in collaboration with our other teammates here, uh yourself included. And then we also do shared media, content development, mostly social, but you know, uh uh just you know, any form of communication to you know build those relationships, which is really the key to you know organizational success.

Maddie Trumino 3:09

Yeah, definitely a broad scope for a lot for sure.

Mike Cherenson 3:12

Yes.

Maddie Trumino 3:13

So just a touchback to your family and your roots. Your father founded the agency as the Cherenson Group in 1958. Did you feel called to join the family business?

Mike Cherenson 3:23

I originally, first of all, as a as a kid, uh, you know, I actually wrote uh in uh in seventh grade that I want to be the Zamboni driver at the Ranger Game. So that was my original intent to be the Zamboni driver at the Ranger Game. But uh I don't blame you. That was not to be. And then in college, I thought I wanted to run political campaigns. So I was a politics major, went for my master's in political management. And I found while uh I appreciate my political training and uh you know what I learned there, political campaigns are about getting 50% plus one of the vote, which you know, but I'm more why can't we get a hundred? Why do we have the why do we have to why can't we build a big tent? Why can't we bring people in? And so I really appreciate kind of being more a big tent person, not just uh trying to find who I need to win and you know the heck with everybody else. So I I found that it, you know, that PR was just a good fit for who I am. I'm I'm a connector by trade. That's my my whole kind of being is one of a of a connector, of a communicator, relationship builder. It kind of fit my personality. So that's that's how I found myself here. That's great. So but it was never, again, my original intent to be that Zamboni driver going around. It's never too late, you know. That's true. You know, that's true.

Maddie Trumino 4:35

I heard they're looking for drivers, so I would love that. Do you think you use anything that you learned in your political background in college now today?

Mike Cherenson 4:43

Well, absolutely. And I think one thing that training taught me is is the strategy. I mean, I think in in because they have a very, very defined goal. I need to get 50% plus one on a specific day. It's very strategy driven. Uh, you know, whereas PR, certainly we are strategic in what we do, but it it's a much wider lens and it's uh, you know, but I think I learned that was important. Also understanding politics, um how things work, how to pull the levers of of government, how you know, politics is who gets what, when, where, and how. And I think everybody in business needs to understand who gets what, when, where, and how. And so that was certainly a key uh uh thing that I learned and I I continue to use today.

Maddie Trumino 5:26

Yeah, absolutely. So now I'm gonna take it back a little bit. How has PR changed since you started working compared to today?

Mike Cherenson 5:34

Well, it's always been about connecting people and ideas and building those strategic relationships. So the our objective has remained the same, but the tools and we use are different. Obviously, the speed and pace of communication has changed rapidly. We use different tactics and tools to reach people. You know, the written word, the ability to write, to be able to craft a narrative, to tell stories, to reach that overall objective of of connecting people and ideas and building those strategic relationships has remained the same. But the speed and pace and the and the diversity of methods in which we use to do that has certainly changed. And I I do think another thing that's changed is on the reactive front, I do think things have become more polarized. I think uh, you know, it there's this cancel culture. It's become a much more uh hostile information environment. It's not uh necessarily a welcoming information environment out there. And I think that has changed dramatically. Not that it ever was, but it's gotten worse. Uh the diss and misinformation, it and social media and the algorithms have fueled that. But so I the in the the information environment is not as conducive to building those relationships and connecting people. It the it's the there's you know the the um I think there's these conflict entrepreneurs, the attention economy, people are now rewarded for simply just getting attention.

Maddie Trumino 6:51

Yeah. That's true.

Mike Cherenson 6:52

And that I think it it it so it's changed the way everybody's operated. And even small things. Like back in the, you know, when I started, you know, the newspapers would run a an article, and they really never knew how many people were reading that article. They knew what their subscriptions were and their circulation, and maybe they would know by the number of letters to the editor they would get, or maybe a couple phone calls, but they were really just running on on what they assumed were the the the needs of the community, etc. But now the media are getting uh immediate data, and so they're almost writing to scratch the itch, not to address some of the bigger, bolder issues. So I think it it it it's drawn the media now into these kind of like what's gonna get the attention economy. There is there are I mean, and uh I there are reporters doing amazing work and they continue to do important work, but I do think a lot of the media environment has been sucked into that attention world because they get that immediate feedback. If you're a reporter now, you know how many how many uh hits, how many likes, how many shares, and you're no different than anybody else. You're driven by that appetite. I think the reporters, you know, 20, 30 years ago, they didn't have that feedback. So they was more about what they thought the community needed to hear and what discussions and I think it was it was a little healthier environment than it is today.

Maddie Trumino 8:07

Yeah, I'd I'd have to agree. I think even just growing up in it, that instant gratification is a killer. I think it's a huge downfall in a lot of ways. So, with that being said, how do you foresee PR evolving in the next five years?

Mike Cherenson 8:19

It's going to change dramatically. You know, so much of uh of the focus was how are we gonna get the message out? And I think to some degree, you know, it's gotten easier. I mean, we we there's so many channels now, and now you have to obviously select which one is the right channel. I think the challenge is gonna be focused on the receivers of the message and how do we help them navigate this chaotic information environment? What we can do to help them be better consumers of news and information. I think the role of counselor, strategic counselor is gonna be more important, helping clients navigate this complexity, helping clients navigate the chaotic uh world that we now live. So I think that role of strategic counselor, so much time and effort used to be put in crafting the message and picking the channels and getting it through the channel to the right people. And listen, that's still gonna be important, and we're still gonna need, you know, people with skill and and and knowledge and ability to do that. So I'm not be I don't want to belittle the importance or role of that, but I do think it's gotten a little easier. And AI will certainly improve that, but I don't think anything's gonna replace helping organizations with their with their judgment and making good decisions, and also helping consumers be able to kind of see through the fog of the just the chaos of it all, and to be able to be better consumers. So I do think it's just gonna be more strategic, I think, and more uh targeted towards helping both parties aid informed decision making. Really, I think it's really aiding decision making, helping the clients make better decisions, helping consumers, the people receiving the information, weed through all the you know the what's going on and for them to make better decisions. I think all the the channels have gotten just so corroded and filled with noise and and and it it just at the end of the day you scratch your. I think people are exhausted. Yeah, I think people are exhausted. They're all information overload. And it's not only just pure information, but it it just seems like it's just oversaturated. Yes, it's just a lot. I think it's a lot for people.

Maddie Trumino 10:11

I agree. And I'm glad you actually mentioned AI because that was a perfect segue way to my next question, which would be how is artificial intelligence changing the way that PR professionals like yourself work? Is it making it easier, harder, and different?

Mike Cherenson 10:24

Both, all.

Maddie Trumino 10:25

Yeah.

Mike Cherenson 10:26

Um, I think certainly, you know, I use it every day to help craft messages and fine-tune messaging. We certainly use it to help disseminate messaging. We use it to understand audiences better, to have more information at our fingertips. But it's also made it more complicated. We can't always, right now, the way it is now, we can't always trust that information. And so that I think that's a huge problem. The the the information coming in, you know, we don't know how accurate it is. There's a lot of falsehoods being spread on using AI. And I I do worry whether we're building a communication environment on efficiency and not resiliency. In other words, we're gonna be so consumed with how fast and quick, and I can't, I can get this done so quickly and get it out so fast and so easy and all these kind of things, and it sounds great, but is it the right message? It still comes down to what do you say and who do you say it to. And that still takes strategy. That AI lacks judgment. AI doesn't know ethics, AI doesn't, at this point, doesn't know right from wrong. There's a uh story that I heard about this grandmaster in Asia played uh an AI computer in this game. And uh I and right now it's escaping me the game that it would that they were played, but there it's uh infinite moves in this game. And came down to the last move, and the AI made a move that no one would ever make, ever. And the the grandmaster was insulted and walked out. It was so insulted by that move. How dare the computer make it? It was so like out of the ordinary, it was like it couldn't believe it. And the AI won. And but the the interesting thing was the AI made that decision not because of what it knew, but because of what it didn't know. It didn't know ethics, it didn't know norms, it didn't know how someone else would perceive it. And that's the danger of it. It doesn't know how someone will perceive things. It could, you know, maybe guesstimate, and and that that is the the benchmark of what we do. The intangible assets in which we work are things like credibility, trust, relationships. And I don't think AI really understands those yet. So while it could help assemble words, it could help, you know, do all the mechanical things, it doesn't really understand those intangibles, the human nature. And I still think that humans are gonna play, at least for now, a huge role. And I just fear we're gonna fall into this trap of being intoxicated by the the the speed and pace and the ease and all this. Oh my god, it's great. And don't and don't get me wrong, it it's cool as heck, and I use it every day. But I think we have good there's a time and a place.

Maddie Trumino 12:52

Absolutely. I don't think AI will ever replace that human connection either. Or at least I hope it doesn't.

Mike Cherenson 12:57

I agree. Believe me.

Maddie Trumino 12:58

The day that happens will be a very scary day. And you talked a little bit about how with AI comes some of that disinformation or misinformation, and things can be misconstrued. And anyone that knows you knows that you're passionate about that topic in itself with misinformation. What do you think is the most or the single most important thing that people should be concerned about when it comes to misinformation and disinformation?

Mike Cherenson 13:20

Well, I think you've gotta be a better consumer of news and information. I think you've gotta be somewhat skeptical. And that doesn't mean you, you know, you should should lack trust, but you've got to, you know, verify what you see. You don't put anything in your mouth when you go to a restaurant. Maybe you do, you know, but you do want to make sure that you're, you know, people should be trying to eat healthy foods and putting healthy things in their body. So why won't you do the same thing with information? And I think you've got to diversify your media diet. Don't consume just one form or one ideology. I think you've got to verify what you read. I think you've got to be able to put things in context. I think you've got to be able, humans have to learn to deal with ambiguity. You may not know the answer to everything. I think that is a huge problem. As humans, we just want to know everything. So when we don't, we start building up this these conspiracies in our mind. We start, oh, they must have done that because they really don't like me or whatever that is. The other thing that's really interesting is strategic ignoring. In most of human history, we needed more information to make decisions. Whether it was like, is the saber-toothed tiger really gonna eat me? Is it behind the wall? Where is it coming from? Right. Or is my where's my next uh piece of food coming from? You were trying to gather as much information as possible. Yeah, absolutely. But now we have the opposite problem. Now there's so much information coming in, now we've got to be able to ignore stuff and just be able to get rid of, you know, the focus on the signal and ignore the noise. And learning how to do that is key. I think, and I think the one word that I the key to all of this is humility. I think people need to know I don't know everything. I've got to be curious, I've got to be open-minded, I've got to to be okay with uh things I don't know, I've gotta be willing to learn from other people. I think if we can be more humble, I think that is like uh a magic pill. I mean, I hate to say it, but just simple humility, like maybe I don't know everything.

Maddie Trumino 15:09

Okay, goes a long way.

Mike Cherenson 15:10

Maybe that's maybe the four the the maybe my in-group isn't always right. Right. Maybe the the news sources I use are not always perfect. Maybe the candidates I follow are somewhat flawed. And that doesn't mean and by the way, the other thing within that whole soup is that multiple things can be true at one time. I think for some reason we we don't want to do that. And uh that's why I think the practice of PR has to help the consumers of news and information develop these skills so they can weed through all this information and make better decisions. So I do think, you know, and and the information environment unfortunately is is prey's on our pre uh primitive brains. They they they they love to trigger us, they love to, you know, it's it's all about just getting triggering people. So they want to like, you know, the outrage machine. It just that's what it's all about. Take a breath. That's the other thing I tell people, just take a breath. Yeah, you know, uh don't share when you're outraged. Take walk away because it's when you're outraged, and then when you frankly you dig a little deeper, you realize maybe it's not even true.

Maddie Trumino 16:10

Right.

Mike Cherenson 16:11

You know, so there's a lot of little things people could do, but you know, people have agency. Be humble, be open, be curious, be the scientist, don't be the preacher, the prosecutor, or the politician. Be the scientist. Always, geez, I want to learn more about that. Instead of as soon as you consume it, you want to go out there and beat somebody over the head with it. Right. And there's a lot of little things that we can all do to make a difference.

Maddie Trumino 16:30

Absolutely. Well, you've said so many wonderful things here today, and you've given so much information, valuable information. My last question for you is do you have any advice for people who are interested in a career in PR?

Mike Cherenson 16:42

Be curious. Uh write. Even if you don't want to go into public relations, the ability to sit in a two-hour meeting and write a uh short memo summarizing it will serve you well. So the ability to write is key. The other thing is learn how to take things from different domains and put them together. There's a famous uh strategist, John Boyd, who talked about building snowmobiles. And he he talked about this uh what he he used he used this analogy of, you know, you see a bicycle, you see a set of skis and a lawnmower. Three different distinct things that it have nothing to do with, but in your mind, if you can build a snowmobile and see different things in different domains, create- I think a lot of people think creativity is is is the ability to do interesting things with words and pictures, right? And that certainly is creativity. I think creativity is to be see things people don't. And I think if people can learn how to do that and just open their minds up to seeing things, how things are connected, and maybe things that maybe shouldn't be connected, but maybe really are. So that curiosity, writing, uh understanding how domains, you know, things in different domains can come together. Be a student of the news, be a student of the world, don't be afraid to ask questions, be a team player. Life is a team sport.

Maddie Trumino 17:52

Yeah.

Mike Cherenson 17:53

And if you don't know that, if you don't know life's a team sport, you're in trouble. The people that win are the ones with the most alliances, the most partners. You know, the uh and I mentioned John Boyd. He would always talk about, you know, from a military standpoint, you want to isolate your enemy, you want to isolate them, whereas you want to build your alliances. So, you know, I think as a PR person, you want to, you know, join organizations, uh uh develop mentors, create a kitchen cabinet, identify people in your life from different domains who you can turn to for questions and answers, and who you can just people you can just turn to. And also the returns of favor. Become a mentor, become part of other people's kitchen cabinets, be a leader. So those are just some ideas.

Maddie Trumino 18:33

Beautiful. Thank you so much, Mike. You've given us so much amazing knowledge and so many great tidbits and stories, and we appreciate you and thank you for coming on the show.

Mike Cherenson 18:42

Well, thank you for having me.

Maddie Trumino 18:43

No problem.

Tom Marguccio 18:48

Don't forget to subscribe whenever you listen to your podcast so you never miss an episode. And leave us a review. Until next time, keep those mugs filled and those ideas flowing.