Shadow and Starlight Podcast

Fourth Wing | Violence Incarnate

• Kaina Gillespie | Mackenzie Johnson • Season 1 • Episode 15

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Welcome wonderful listeners to Episode 15 of the Shadow and Starlight Podcast | Violence Incarnate!! It is time to wrap up our coverage of Fourth Wing with several betrayals, endless tears, ridiculous amounts of questions, and wild theories by yours truly.   

  • For next week, please read chapters 1-15 | pages 1-148 of Iron Flame by Rebecca Yarros for your reread or to refresh your memory.
  • This episode is based on Fourth Wing by Rebecca Yarros. Intro Music by Boomer, graphics by @reeseplantedesign. 
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Welcome wonderful listeners to the Shadow and Starlight podcast. We're two friends deep dive into popular fantasy and romance books. We get into the stories, characters, world building, lore, and more. And most importantly, we'll have a damn good time while we do it. Yes, so buckle your seatbelts for this wild rollercoaster ride of emotions, magical worlds, and laughs. I'm Kinsey. I'm Kena. And today we're covering chapters 33 to 39 of Fourth Wing by Rebecca Yaros. First and foremost, please listen carefully to our content warning. These are adult books we talk about and neither of us have a filter, so this podcast is rated R and for those 18 plus. Now regarding spoilers, if you have not finished the entire Fourth Wing and Iron Flame books, please come back after you do so to listen to the episodes. While we are discussing a certain stretch of chapters, we will be doing so with the understanding of what happens in both books for better understanding to help us dive deeper into the theories and appreciate the masterful foreshadowing of Rebecca Yaros. So going forward, all episodes on our show will contain spoilers for the whole series in question. Next, if you like what you hear today and want more, please come back next Thursday and next Thursday and next Thursday and next Thursday and every Thursday after that for a brand new episode. as a toddler podcast, we would love to hear your feedback to better ourselves and expand our book loving community. Please feel free to give us a views, reach out to us on social media, and follow us on TikTok, Instagram, and watch us on YouTube and Shadow and Starlight Pod. Yes, big announcement, next week we're gonna be actually getting into Iron Flames, so this is going by so fast, it's crazy. I know! That means we're close to the Ionic Storm, though. Oh my gosh, well, well, we're almost down to a month. It's 40 days away, people. 40 days. We're almost in the one month and it's flying by, which is good. Cause I thought it would be going slow, but it's not a drink of the pod. What you got? Hot cocoa and my Spider Man cup hot Chucky. I got coffee. I'm drinking it at like 4 PM, but that's because I've been so distracted all day. I forgot to make some this morning. So I gotta have my coffee. This is my equivalent to coffee. So when I drink hot chocolate, I'm imagining myself drink coffee. Drink your coffee. Okay. Alright, people, it's time to cross the parapet, everybody. Kane is going to lead us into her Shadow and Twilight synopsis, a. k. a. her Unhinged Summary detailing the events of these chapters. Okay, this stretch of chapters begins with Bazgayev under attack. The crew hustles the formation, and after Violet gives Rhea the tea on her window shattering orgasms, we find out that it's wargames. In a pretend attack scenario, the riders are called in pretend service to reinforce the wings. Father, Father Atos, aka the evil mastermind of the events that are about to happen, reads the instructions, assigning Zayden to Athbane. Before takeoff, Zayden comes to claim his woman and her babysitter for headquarters squad, and Dane has a rather unproportionate response. Reaction. Begging Zayden not to take Violet, and after another useless argument, Dane concedes and says he will miss Violet in the most cryptic way possible. Yes, we will be talking about it. Several hours on Dragonback later, the crew stops to water their dragons near the outpost. Like two teenagers with raging hormones, Zayden and Violet sneak off to make out until they are interrupted by GRIFFIN FLYERS?! Get out of here, bro. I was about to get some more spice. Unfortunately, the big betrayal of the book has arrived. Despite not being able to aim for shit, Violet is ready to roast all these flyers. However, Zayden stops her and Violet comes with a shocking realization that he and the Mark Ones have been working with Navar's enemy. Violet's heart continues to splinter as she observes the traitorous supply discussion further jolted into shock induced paralysis to the absolute impossibility of Venon and this group talking about them like they're real. The cherry on top of this clusterfuck is that Taryn knew the whole time.

Kaina G:

Not only betrayed by her man, but also her dragons. While she tries to keep her power leashed, the Flyers inform them that the Venon are headed to attack Resin, a trade post right outside of Athbane. After they take off, Violet explodes in rage, directed primarily at her bodyguard, then adds a cute little death threat to Zayden, living up to her nickname once again. Slowly and carefully, Zayden breaks down the reality outside the wards and her brilliant scribe brain begins to put the pieces together. After making sure Zayden knows she is totally not in love with him anymore, she announces that she believes in the truth. As they fly the remaining distance to Athmaine, Violet further reflects on how Navarre perpetuated this lie, the scribe quadrant, her original destination. Pulling up at the outpost, this squad finds one of Navar's most strategic garrisons strangely abandoned. Zayden's brilliant mind, paired with a letter from Father Father Atos, confirms another betrayal. Dayne took her memories and told his father that he saw Zayden tell her about his super secret trips to Athfane. Their mission? Survive if they can.. Using his farsight, Liam spots Venon approaching, and everyone prepares to fight alongside the Gryffin Flyers. And instead of giving you a play by play, which I would spectacularly fail at articulating, I am going to give you the cliff notes of this battle, and I'll try to make it funny so that we don't all cry too much. Before it starts, everyone basically accepts they're gonna die here. Super creepy powerful evil deeds attack, and to make it even worse, Wyvern are real and somehow no one but Violet knew about them. There is something unstable in the outposts at the Dragon's Sense and the Venon want in a box with the Mairi family crest on it. How intriguing. Violet catches the attention of the Venon after a few Badly missed lightning strikes a Venon sadly sucks the life out of Solail and her dragon like a slurpee Vi is a badass and kills Wyvern. Cowboy Zayden lassoes Sigeil. Liam is also a badass and kills Venon. His dragon D tackles a Wyvern that is headed right for Taryn. And Violet saves Liam's life once again in the midst of him saving hers. Our hearts all collectively get broken when D is killed. And Liam after. I'm crying at the clock! It was really hard because I was doing my reread in a coffee shop and I was like shit Shit. Fuck. Tears. Fuck. I was on my couch. I just let it all go. Okay. Violet stays with Liam and Dee until his life fades, and then our FMC gets up. Violence and vengeance incarnate. Biting on Taryn's back, Violet is stabbed but manages to kill this patronizing bitch of a Venon, gaining some vital information. Kill the Venon, kill all the wyvern they create. Our heroic woman goes after the most powerful Venon Rider left, using a surge of Terran's power mixed with a little bit of time stopping. Once she is sure all the Venon have been defeated, Violet accepts her impending doom and swan dives to her death. Next chapter, Indarna uses the strength she has left to break Violet's fall, who is in and out of consciousness in the next few days. And it's time for a Zaydenfob! Finally! He is inconsolable, awaiting Violet to wake and grappling in the wake of Liam's death. To make us forget about the emotionally crippling loss that just happened, he proceeds to reflect on how he has been falling in love with violence before they even kissed. Violet awakens in good spirits, thanks to temporary memory loss. Once that snaps, she is capital P. Pissed. After our main character is freshening up, Violet lets him know that it's over. Sorry dude, just can't trust ya. Zayden basically says, challenge accepted, and then Brennan butts into the conversation. What the f Violet's jaw is on the floor as she lays eyes upon her supposedly deceased brother who is now the leader of a revolution. And the end. For now. Yay. I love how the book ended on the cliffhanger. Yes. I was thinking about this earlier. It's interesting that both cliffhangers and fourth wing and iron flame, really set you up to be like, what the fuck is going to happen in the next book? Cause at the end of fourth wing, we're like, Are they going to go back to Bezgayath? how is this going to work? are they even able to? And then the end of Iron Flame, it's like, holy crap, Zayn's been in. We have no idea what the scenarios and the dynamics are going to be in the next book. And I feel like it makes you salivate for it even more. I feel like I love the last line of books. And I always wonder, the exact moment when she was writing this book and she was like, this is it. This is the last line. Like, that's such a important part of the book. That's a good interview question for authors. I don't know if we'd ever be able to interview the infamous Rebecca Yarrows, but that would be cool. She's a busy, busy girl. She is very busy. Also filthy rich, probably. Probably. I mean, granted, she wrote the book. These beautiful stories. And she was, she was right away before a fourth wing. I got one of her older books. I haven't read it yet, but I was like, dang, I didn't realize she was writing so much before she even wrote this fantasy. Supposedly they're good, but the endings are emotionally devastating and most of her romance books. So I don't know. I was right up my alley. It just makes me nervous for the ending of the Empyrean series. Oh my gosh, I don't know if I said this in another episode, but I was watching like one of the interviews she did. I don't remember what interview it was or who it was with. but they opened the floor for the audience to ask questions, or it was like a game they were playing or something, but the audience can perform. Could participate. And Rebecca was like, be nice or I'll kill somebody. She knows that she's got us wrapped around her finger. I just thought that was so funny. Cause I feel like she would actually do it. She told me to rob a bank so that Taryn stays alive. I would probably do it. For sure. Now that we've crossed the parapet, time to head into our Battle Brief section where we will discuss all notable things in this stretch of chapters, including foreshadowing, theories, and our favorite parts. Oh, oh, not you having a secret. So long ass theory. I know, right? I'm proud of myself. I just saw it. All right. So the first foreshadowing we're going to get into is did Dane know what awaited Zayden and the Marked Ones and Violet in Athbane? So quote, don't go, Violet, please. He's going to get you killed. And then he also says, quote, I'll miss you, Violet, which, you know, sounds really fishy. Maybe he just didn't want her around Zayden because, you know, He did just tell his father about the memory he saw, and he knew that father, father Atos was going to get Zayden in big trouble. And he maybe just didn't want to say that in front of Violet and Zayden. So, he couldn't really say, this is why I don't want you to go, in front of Zayden and Violet. And that's if he was going to. Big if. He probably wasn't going to. But maybe he just didn't want Violet to get involved or be complicit in Zayden's crimes just by association and her knowing of the trips I'm sure would probably be punished. But this also isn't the first time he has tried to beg her to stay safe and stay away from Zayden since he knows about Lilith giving him the scars. So this could just be another moment of him being like, no, you gotta stay behind. Like, This dude's crazy. I don't care what you say, but talking about this man and hating on him for five episodes has really got me thinking he's not as simple minded as I think he is. And I don't know. I think that it's definitely plausible that he knew what was awaiting them there and just accepted it. I don't know. What do you think, Kenz? Do you think he knew? I don't know if he like knew what was going on. And being there, I think he, I do think that he knew that his father was going to send them into some crazy mission, obviously. And I think that him seeing those memories solidified all the rumors that we've heard about Zayden, the whole book about him being a I don't know. I feel like if he knew exactly what was waiting for them, but while, like when they got there, he probably would have tried harder to keep up. Violet from going. Yeah, well, we know he doesn't know about Venon And so obviously his father wouldn't have said like I'm gonna send them to Venon But yeah, I'm just wondering cuz I don't know I keep going back and forth About whether he knew that they were basically being sent to die or not. I think He says later that he didn't know But also, can we trust anything this man says? I mean, but he was so cryptic before she left. Like, he's gonna get you killed. Please don't do the incident. I don't think that he knew that they were sent to literally be killed. I think that maybe they were sent to be exposed for their crimes, quote, unquote. like, if he knew that they were going to be killed, he would have stopped Violet from going. At the end of this scene, he's like, Well, if you choose him, like I just have to be, it has to be enough for me. Right. So no, I don't think he knew exactly what was waiting on them. Yeah. I mean, that's fair. also we know that war games are super deadly and Dane knows that too. And Athbane is also out of the wards, which is not what most of the other squads are being assigned. Okay. I'm going to make an executive decision. I don't think he knew. Well, I don't think that he knew about the venue, but I think that he knew the reason why they were going was to be. Exposed, maybe, he was just acting weird about the whole them being a side to Athban, is that how you say it? Yeah, I think because Violet, when she was looking at him interact with his father, she was like, quote, something about the way his smile slips for a heartbeat makes the hair rise on the back of my neck in quote, I don't know. It's, I don't know. I didn't pick up. He's just really fishy. I don't know how to put that. Dane just sucks. I think we can all agree there, whether or not we agree on whether he knew. I have a crazy theory about father, father Atos. Yeah. And if you haven't picked it up, we say father, father Atos because Dane is father Dane because he acts like someone's father and Satan is daddy. There you go. Obviously. Obviously. Obviously.. All right. Next bit of foreshadowing. We're going to talk about how Zayden refers to Violet as. The death of him? More than a few times in these two books. So in this stretch, there's a good example. Quote, Wanting you will be the death of me. And this is before they head to the urgent 4am formation. Like yeah, this is really cute and shows his devotion to his girl and how much he Can't live without her, but it's just used too frequently for me not to have a theory about it, obviously. So this is kind of a theory, but it's also foreshadowing, so it's kind of confusing. I think this could be major foreshadowing to a future scenario where Zayden dies, maybe even from Violet, or as a result of her actions, or she just perceives guilt over him dying, or getting to that point where he almost dies. So, my theory that I discussed earlier in these episodes about Malak could support this, so if she is blessed by, or connected to the God of Death somehow, maybe she can save him, so he's not gonna be gone forever? I guess? And we know her mantra in Onyx Storm is, I will save him, instead of I will not die today. There's just so much about Malik and so much from both of them about death and yeah, it is a death college, but some of these lines feel very pointed. Yeah, especially with Rebecca. The fact that she said is it so many times definitely raised flags because when you first mentioned it, Our first episode, the rest of my reread, I've been picking up on how many times he said it. And he says it a lot. It's alarming. More than like the usual character would say something in a book. Yeah. I don't like that. But, as much as it would suck for him to potentially die, like, any time I think about Zayden dying, I'm just gonna also, asterisk, he lives. As in, he gets resurrected, or she saves him right before he dies. I think that if she does kill him off, it won't be in the very last book. Probably the last line. I don't know. it's just also a whole nother thing with them being connected via their dragons. So if he dies, don't them and all their dragons die. There could be a loop. How does that work? Rebecca, how does it work? It could be a loophole with and Darna Maybe Andrana could be the one that keeps her alive Yeah, I think if Zayden does die It's gonna be a situation like that where probably Zayden, Sigail and Taryn all die and Andrana keeps her alive somehow But I just freaking hate that because I love those three characters so much. I know Alright, let's move on before I start crying. In the clip! So, we're going to talk about Griffins and Trouble in Paradise because Zane and Violet got some stuff going on in this stretch of chapters. This is a scene where something shifts between Violet and Zayden and her dragons while Zayden and Violet are trying to get a quickie before they enter athbane Zayden senses something or someone behind them and he realizes who it is and he goes Rigid and his eyes widen. now knowing Zaden for the last 500 plus pages, we know that he's always had a very strong grip on his control. This moment was important to highlight because he starts to lose his grip on his control, which is very, very rare. We've only seen it a couple times throughout the whole book. And in this moment, again, he is caught by surprise and he realizes that he's trapped. He's about to get caught up in all the shit that he's been doing behind Violet's back. so from this scene, we learned that he has been trading Navarrean weapons with the Griffins to help them defend their homes against Venon. And though that is very honorable of you, Zayden, and we love how compassionate you are for the people outside the wards. How can you be in a relationship with Violet and not tell her, tell your girl? It's not very honorable if she's in the dark. So this is a scene where her feelings of betrayal released it and everything that she's been hearing about this man She's like, oh my god, it's all true. Like he's a traitor and he's working with the enemies not only did the man that she fell in love with lie to her, but so did her dragons. Her dragons do it and decide not to tell her. And of course, Andorna's like, we didn't lie. We just didn't tell you. And Violet's like, well, that's lying. That's a lie. That's a double whammy. I felt so bad for her in that moment. Yeah, I know. this is why I was so sad last stretch because I knew this was coming and everybody knew what was going on, but her, like everybody. Everyone that was in Athban at this point knew what was going on, minus her, even her dragons. That has to be screwed up, literally. But this scene where she learns about The agreement between the Mark Ones and then the Venon. it reminds me of the scene in Vampire Diaries where Aunt Jenna finds out about all the vampires and she's like, who else knew about this? Everybody knew but her. She felt so hurt and betrayed. And this is kind of what it reminded me of. Yeah, she knows exactly how Violet feels. Yeah. It's so weird how my mind works. I'm typing about dragons and Violet, I'm like, Oh, this reminds me of that one time in vampire darks that this happened. I wonder if because you love, Vampire Diaries so much, that's why you love Shadow Daddies so much. Maybe. Cause there's a correlation there. Cause I never watched Vampire Diaries. Although, Damon is obviously super hot. But I never like, watched the show and got invested in that way. And that's like, my type is so different. Cause you like the Shadow Daddies and I like the Emotionally Intelligent Hembos. With man buns. Man buns. Yes, that's my type. Okay. Now we're going to talk about, a little bit about the sage and the foreshadowing to how powerful the venom actually are. So let's briefly discuss the venom since we're on this topic. This is a new, Enemy from our perspective as readers. And we're learning about them as we go. We already know the origin of the Benin from the book of fables. And we talked about last episode and we know that they get their power from the ground. But, let's talk about the power they wield in combat. We did notice the stretch that while Violet was fighting one of the dark wielders on the back of Terran, she noticed that the Venom was unnaturally fast, and she adapted to her fighting style within seconds. And it was making it impossible for Violet to deliver a killing blow. They're pretty strong and again they adapt well to other fighting styles in combat making it really hard to play the offense Yeah. So though dragon riders are obviously very powerful and fast, their dragons limit the amount of power they can use in order to keep the balance of nature. Cause that's very important to them. And then also humans will burn out, I guess Venon don't burn out. It just ends up. Making them change appearance, but burning out is something that's specific to riders only. So on the other hand, dark wielders use raw power and they have no one holding them in check and they can use as much power and pull as much power as they want at one time. Such untapped power. No wonder we were called here. You could command the sky to surrender all its power. And I bet you don't know what to do with it. So this Venon then proceeds to threaten to split her open to examine the power within her, which is like, Creepy bro, and then she proceeds to threaten Violet to let her sage have at her instead quote You'll wish for death if I hand you over to my sage And this is our first mention of this guy who we can assume is their teacher of some sort or super powerful venom That's just a pie in the hierarchy this Sage is distinguished by his staff. That's really all we know about him other than the fact that he can disappear. So that's obviously important and we actually see that Venon ability in the Excerpt of Onyx Storm as well, like we talked about. Yeah, pretty creepy. Very creepy and very interesting. Extremely creepy. I'm excited to see how they create the Venon in the 4th Wing TV show and See, I'm actually coming to life. I feel like it's gonna if they do it right, it'll be really fucking scary. I think it'll be kind of cool though. low key, I'm dying to see Zayden as a minion. I feel like it makes him even more morally gray. I mean, I'm, I'm excited too, but it's low key stressing me out. I know. Cause she's already been through so much. So like what's going to happen? Oh my God. I can't wait. Okay. Anyways, so before we move on, let's also briefly discuss their wyvern. So unlike dragon riders, wyverns are made by the venom, which is very important to note because dragons are. They're created by, um, we, you know, the reproduction process and they lay eggs. I'm trying to say it in the most clean way possible. You're like a parent that's trying to give their kids to talk about the birds and the bees. I'm trying to be as clean as possible. You should let me handle it. I'd be like, they So yeah, they, they reproduce eggs. Yeah, they do. And they lay eggs and the eggs take, what, centuries to hatch? Well, it's up to them, I guess. Yeah. And they hatch and dragons take a while to grow and once they grow, they bond to humans. Not the case of Wyvern. Wyvern are created by Venon and they use their powers to create these beasts and they can create multiple, Wyvern. And it's interesting too, that it's basically the reverse for the whole dying what happens, dying what happens situation. I am not thinking of good words to say. So it's interesting. It's works in the reverse with dragons and riders and then with Venon and their wyverns. So instead of killing the beast to kill the Venon, like dragons and their riders, you have to kill the Venon to kill all the wyvern they create, which I would say is like easier. Yeah, because you're killing more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Math. Because you can kill one Venon. You can kill one Venon and kill a dozen wyvern. Yeah. It's for sure easier. I don't know why I was like, I guess it's easier. Yeah. I don't know, but the Venon are so hard to kill. Yeah. I guess. Well, I mean, they are, but they aren't because our girl's just a first year. And she slayed. She did. Literally slayed. Okay. Let's talk about Father Atos. I know you're going to talk about this in your theories. It's not really a theory. It's just all the evidence that we have to support your theory, if that makes sense. We're giving this man way too much attention. I know. Just like Dane. That's why I didn't talk about Dane a lot. Ugh. He really won't be that big of a part of Iron Plane. In terms of like theories and foreshadowing, I don't think we'll have to talk about that much. Thank God. Cause So we all know the part that. Dane Atos played in the almost death of the mark ones and violet his quote unquote best friend But let's talk about the role that father father Atos played in this whole ordeal So after being given the information as a then the mark ones had been outside the wards carnal This word always fucks me up. Thought it was funny to assign them there during the wargames. And when they Wait, what did you say? Carnal. Cornal. Carnal. Kernel. It's not carnal, it's kernel. Kernel. Kernel mustard from Clue. Kernel. I don't like that. I mean, I don't really like it. I'm gonna call father, father atos. Yeah. I hate the word in general. Because where's the R? Somebody, tell me where's the R. I look at it in my head and I'm like, Co lo no no. I'm like, colonial. Co lo no no. Co lo no no. Like, what is even English? What is this? The stupidest word ever. Anyways, so after being given the information that Zayden and the Mark Ones had been outside the wards, father, father Atos thought it was funny to assign them there during their war games. And when they arrived right outside the wards, Griffin flyer showed up to warn them that Ben and were on course for the very spot they were headed to. And as soon as they crossed the wards, oh my God, I said wars like 50, 000 times. As soon as they enter, as soon as they entered, as once they arrive to Afvane Taryn and everybody else voice how off it felt and some dragons even sensing something else in particular Quote, there's something in the trading post. We all feel it in quote so this is the same trading post the sage was drawn to while the other Venom fought and the trading post that was abandoned And this is very fishy, not surprising, because, all Atos are fishy, but the Venon and Violet ends up fighting, saying that they were called there, which is what we were talking about earlier. Now, we don't know if it was like, they were called there by Father, Father Atos, or by their Sage, but it seems like they were drawn there because of the very power that was being emanated In the trading post, what they were sentencing, but not only did father, father, eight toes plan to send them to F bane, but he planned to send them into active battle against the enemy by luring them there with whatever it was that was in that trading post. And because we all know that been in, never even traveled that far West, according to imaging, because imaging does voice, they've never traveled that far West before he even left the missile with an ultimatum. They can either leave the innocent people of F bane to die, which was Over 400 people and they could finish word games or they can abandon the rest of their wing and leadership to save the people of Athbane. And of course, being the good people, they are, they fought to save the innocent lives and lost two valuable lives in the process, R. I. P. But my thoughts on whole role that father, father Atos had in this was one Navarre. Has known about these attacks and have done nothing to aid the people beyond the wards, like hundreds and hundreds of people are being killed at one time for this source of power that they're looking for. And Navarre is doing nothing to help them. And the father, father Atos was willing to use 400 innocent people as collateral damage to prove a point. Just really sad, just shows why the revolution is happening. Yeah. When you put it in that perspective, cause I've never really intentionally thought about. Thinking Carlitos was like, yeah, I don't care about wrestling. well, obviously they don't care about any lives outside the wards, but he would do that just to kill Zayden or test his loyalty or whatever. Ugh. What do you think Dan's mom is like? God, she's definitely got to be a Karen. We don't hear about her. Does she ever appear? I don't know. Is she even alive? Oh, I don't know, but I don't think we ever hear about her. So maybe she got out while she could. All right, time to get into our theories. I'm excited. Mine are like a whole essay today. Same. Let's do it. I have a theory and it revolves around Liam wielding ice in the end battle. one of the most talked about moments I've seen on social media and read it as far as this end battle and ending of Fourth Wing goes is that Liam is described as wielding ice from Violet's perspective. Liam flies for the griffins above us, wielding spears of ice into the injured wyvern's throat. So, what? Sir, I thought you could just like steer really far or something, but here's our thoughts and theories on why this is. So option number one, Liam has two segments and I don't really love this idea cause I just feel like it's repetitive and it doesn't make sense Since he dies also, like, would he have to give him two signets like right before he dies? But it is a possibility that his dragon bonded someone in that familial line. And so he has two signets just like Zayden. And we didn't know until right up until he died. Option two, you. Violet maybe just didn't see what happened correctly because we know Mason was there, a marked one, and he also wields ice. So maybe it was him wielding the ice spears by Liam and it just looked like Liam from Violet's perspective and the whole chaos of the battle. But I don't know. I'm just like, why include that in the writing? This very specific detail that's confusing. If it wasn't Liam just to confuse us or throw us off. I don't know. anyways, option three, this could just be an editing mistake, maybe she meant to say Mason or I don't know, but that doesn't really make sense to me because I don't think at this point she knows who Mason, like the three other marked ones that are there. She doesn't know what their names are, because in the beginning of Iron Flame, she's like, shit, what are their names? I just went to battle with them, and I don't know who these people are. And then, Option 4, which is what I like, and it's also, inspired by a Theory on Reddit I found by explanationborn3318, whoever you are. And this theory I think is the most plausible. So Liam, I think, uses runes for his farsight abilities and ice wielding is his actual signet. So we know from Iron Flame that Liam's mother and his family was very fluent in runes and into that shit. And Violet made a rune in Iron Flame that was reminiscent of a sound seeking signet, where she was able to boost her hearing. since Liam was raised by Zayden in a way, and we know that Zayden says that the best currency you have is hidden abilities, Liam could have been following his advice and hiding his signet this whole time. the devil's advocate to this is that ice wielding is a really basic signet. Sorry, buddy. Sorry, who is it, Riddick, that has ice welding? Yeah, sorry. But, yes, it is, it's a pretty basic signet, so why go to these lengths to hide it? I don't know. maybe he's just trying to give himself as many advantages as possible, but I do wonder if this is true. I wonder if any other marked ones or writers are employing this tactic that Zayden maybe told them to do. We know that Imogen's signet is memory erasure, but she's described all the time as being super, super, super fast. So I was wondering if she could possibly. Be one of those but I also don't think so because I don't feel like a rune would give you the power of memory Erasure that feels like something that could only be a signet, but that was just a random thought I had But I do think that just because this detail is so confusing and specific I do think that there's something to it with the runes. I feel like this is probably the most plausible theory explaining this So could it have something to do with like their Rebellion Relics and them being Marked Ones? Because we do know that when they arrived to Athbane, there was a box in the trading post that had Liam's family Chris, on it? So it could have something to do with that. It could have something to do with them being Marked Ones and having those Rebellion Relics. I don't know. Because if that is the case, because Zayden has Marked Ones. two signets and it seems that Liam was wielding ice and he had his get the sight and Imogen is showing signs of that too. It could be a sign of all the marked ones having multiple signets. That would blow my fucking mind if all the marked ones have both had two signets. That's a lot to think about. I think we learned an iron flame. I'm not totally sure, but I think the reason that the rebellion relics are able to give them the advantage of hiding from Melgren's whatever. I think that we learned that it was Liam's family's runes that were applied to the relics or something that made them. Gave him that ability. I don't remember for sure. I need to, I'm getting into my reread of Iron Flame and I'm realizing stuff. So we'll have answers for you in those episodes. If we don't now, we will soon. Okay, so I actually have something to contribute to the theory section today. Five episodes later. Literally, I usually don't answer this section unless I have concrete evidence because I am very competitive and I hate when I'm wrong and I want to get stuff right, so I'll try to make sure I have concrete evidence. And my theories are always just, super outlandish, so I try to keep them to myself. I love that, though. Because I'll be thinking some, like, crazy stuff. Gimme, gimme, gimme! So, my theory today is actually about Violet's second signet. Rebecca has confirmed many times that Violet will have a second signet, since she has two dragons. And she has also told us that the signet has been foreshadowed in both books, and that the answer is, quote, on the pages. Very cryptic, but Okay, here's what I think. Thanks to at originally urban on TikTok. They're the ones that gave me this idea. They made a post and it just got my wheels turning. There's been a minimum research on feathertails and why they don't bun. but it is mentioned several times throughout this book that quote, feathertails shouldn't bond because they can accidentally give their powers to humans in quote, Oh wait, no, not in quote, still going dragons can't channel. Not really until we're big, but we're all born with something special now in quote, it also stated that this happens when the human uses too much of the feather cell's power, usually from greediness. We know that Violet didn't do this to be greedy, but Violet promises to use only what she needs, but what she needed during the battle was enough to send Andorna into her dreamless sleep and cause Andorna to lose her ability to stop time. So I think that on accident, Andorna gifted her ability to stop time to Violet, and that's why she is no longer able to do it. And I think there's some, I think there's some slight foreshadowing towards that in both books. So in Fourth Wing, in the scene where they are fighting the Venen and the Wyvern, Violet describes some parts of the battle in heartbeats. While she is using Endorna's power, she says, quote, I have only a few heartbeats or this much power will burn through me and take me under, end quote. So while she's physically using this power, she's describing time as heartbeats and right before this, she's describing the scene where Liam is about to die also in heartbeat. So quote, in the span of one heartbeat, I look over my shoulder. Then she goes to say at the second beat, I draw a shuttered breath. And then she goes in the third heartbeat, I turned back towards Liam. So she continues to describe, the battles and fights like this and iron flame as well. So it could be possible that we already know her second And it's her ability to stop time because maybe Endorna gifted her signet to Violet. I've never heard this before and I like it. Well, also this made me think back to us talking about Zayden possibly dying earlier. If this was her second signet. Or, she has the ability to stop time now. She can stop time when he's dying. Yeah. Okay. Time to dig into my theory on father, father, a toast and Venon. So thanks to my love of Reddit once again, and at my yellow roses theory, I have a Venon or Venon complicit. Let's talk about it. So, Colonel Atos had to set up his evil plan for Athfain and Zayden and the Marked Ones between the reunification dinner party and when everyone awoke for wargames at 4am. So not a lot of time, which makes me think he was maybe planning it to Already killed Zayden because he is a terrible person, which fits, we know. But either way, I do have a theory that I think he was working with the Venon to do so. And then we also have the issue of the unstable box with Liam's family crest on it that seems to be luring the Venon. And I want to just acknowledge there is a lot of mystery here and we will unpack it in Iron Flame when we get to more of the runes and Liam's family specifically. But this was possibly placed in Resin to lure the Venon there or was already there and Colonel Atos knew the Benin would attack there to get it. So my thought process here is that if Dane is a product of his father, we would expect Colonel Atos to be a stringent rule follower as well. But, this dude's evil. When Dane tells him about what he saw in Violet's memories, wouldn't we expect him to, take the formal route of, reporting to leadership? if you think about who Dane is, which is very much just, a black and white role follower, you would expect his father to be the same, but the fact that he doesn't Take the formal steps and report this to leadership like you would expect any military ranking member to do. Instead, he emptied the outpost, likely placed that box, slurring the Zayden dies. So going out on his own like this makes me think that he's working with someone else, aka Venon. It's probably likely that the Venon know someone in Bezgayath, the Marked Ones, are using the Luminary and making supply runs to the Gryphon Flyers, because I'm sure they've noticed that the Gryphon Flyers keep getting their hands on more and more weapons, and they want to take out this threat. And if they're working with Father, Father Atos, that would be the perfect, um, Time to do so. And this theory could also explain how silly it is that only Violet has heard of Wyvern up to this point. So if Atos said this, uh, maybe he tipped off the Venon that dragons would be present, causing the Venon to summon their Wyvern to defend themselves aerially. Griffins are obviously easier to kill than dragons because they're a lot smaller and they can't channel full cygnets, so maybe the Venon have just been using their other means of destruction and murder to raid and kill outside the wards and they haven't needed the Wyvern until the dragons actually start coming over here. And also if the theory is true, maybe father father Atos was the one overseeing the whole mending Jack Barlow's soul and I'm guessing he passed his little Jack Barlow project to Varys after he was reassigned and caught by Lilith in his little scheming. But, yeah, these two assholes, Definitely, we're friends because they sound like very evil people and I'm convinced he's working with the Venon. Yes, that's it. I think that it could be possible for him to be working with the Venon because again, woman that Violet was fighting, I just can't get over the fact that she said they were called there. And we know that they were lured there. So it could either be Father Father Atos just planning this attack to get them killed or he was working with them. I don't, I know they're not blind to the knowledge of all the taxes been going on outside the wards. So they either could be working with the Benin or they're just turning a blind eye and just hoping that these wards hold up and the Benin don't come for Navarre. So touch on the whole Dane thing. Dana's very naive. I feel like we've, had proof of this throughout this whole book, how naive he was, and he thinks everybody is so caught up in the codex and the rules. And I think that he realized that wasn't the case when Amber Mavis tried to kill Violet in her sleep. I don't think it was surprising he didn't turn out just like his father because he was very naive and he probably just assumed that everybody was so caught up in the codex and the rules, but he soon learns that's not the case. He's the only one that cares about the rules. Literally. And where did that get you, buddy? Single and alone. Shake my head. I don't think so. All right, we're gonna get to our favorite moments notable parts Yeah. Yeah. And of course, I'm obviously going to talk about my favorite dragon first, Taryn, you petty king. Little things make me love this guy even more. So, quote, we make it to our dragons and I can't help but notice that Taryn is standing in what should be Kath's spot, forcing Dane's dragon to the side. My egotistical dragon is already saddled with Indarna under his wing. I just love that, like. He's just sitting on Dane and his dragon by standing where the squad leader's dragon's supposed to be. And obviously, Kath ain't gonna do nothing about it. Okay? It's just hilarious. And also, side note, I was assuming at how Zayden made a little hookup for Andarna to be connected to Terran's saddle. Cause he knows how much Andarna and Violet love each other and how Violet, hates to leave her behind and feels really bad about it. Yeah. But, that's just so sweet. Anyways, back with Taryn. I love his big dog energy. Even in the final battle, he is the man in charge, or the dragon in charge. Quote, Zayden might command the riders on this field, but Taryn is clearly leading the dragons. Yes, he is. Taryn, you are everything. Flay brah. All right. I'm going to dedicate a favorite part to Liam, a true friend. I'm not going to cry. You better not cry. That was tears back up. Anyways, I really appreciated the little things that Liam did for Violet on this free read. Specifically one moment at the lake, Kenzie, stop, I'm trying, I can't help it, I'm trying to hold it together, get some tissues, okay, all right, anyways, so specifically at the lake, he goes to check in with Violet, specifically concerning her relationship with Zayden. He doesn't give Zayden a glowing recommendation and actually tells Violet, quote, It's just that I know about his priorities. So we know Liam is talking about the revolution, Arisha business, Venon, and all those secrets Zayden's hiding. And so that's why he's not giving a glowing recommendation. He's just telling her. being honest how he can to his friend that he loves, Violet. He's concerned for her getting hurt when she eventually finds out how many secrets Zayden has, which does happen pretty soon after this. But I just love that he checked in with her and was just looking out for her despite owing Zayden literally everything. He still seeks to just protect her emotionally as a friend and takes the time to check on her when shit's happening in her relationship. That's like crazy. And yes. All these little things I appreciated even more this time made me cry even harder about his death. Yes. Rebecca, I love you so much, but you tore me to pieces in this scene. Okay, I'm not even gonna talk about him dying. I'm gonna talk about the fact that Like again, how much we love Liam. Liam was, I can't talk about him in the past sense. Liam, he was, um, why am I like getting, like, I actually know this man. Actually know this man, I'm sorry. Okay. Anyway, the big brother we all need or something. Literally, he was so sweet. He never complained about being her shadow or babysitter. And he, was. Super loyal to Violet, even though he's like his lawyers, he lied was Aiden. Like you said, he still went out his way to make sure that she was okay. And checked on her. I thought they really bonded a lot in the time they had together and he risked his life. Multiple times for her and I don't know, it's just really sad. There were no red flags with that man. I know. Oh, well we do get a little bit of him in Iron Flame. It's not real, but it's basically, yeah. Thank you, Rebecca. That's the least you could do. All right. My last favorite part was, So at this point in the series, we've gotten a lot of action, but as a fantasy girly, nothing hits quite as good as an intense battle scene. So not just like the sparring or the squad battles or all that stuff. Like we're actually in battle here. And I love the way that she wrote it. She's very good at writing action scenes, but I highly, highly recommend when you're reading. Something like a, just a fantasy book or especially a battle scene, put on an epic movie score in the background, it really sets the vibe. But seeing the Venon in action for the first time and our Marked Ones and Violet work to save people really got me excited for where the series is headed. this is our first glimpse of the big, bad enemy and it was sufficiently creepy and they're very powerful. So our characters are going to have to progress to be able to defeat them. So I'm excited to see. How this develops over the course of the series. But my favorite part of it all was seeing how quick while it was just, she was just like quick on her feet and she was really clever on the spot and just not afraid to go and get the Wyvern and the Venom, just total bad ass overall. And I just love that. Taryn really helped empower her and make her confident by putting her through really strict training and it's just all coming to play here. And it was cool to see. And her moment of vengeance after Liam's death was just. Damn girl. That's what I needed after that low. I needed to go high and she got me. And the dragon dynamics were so interesting in the scene also. And stuff that Taryn was saying in the midst of all this action. So this particular line, quote, I will bet my life on you as I have from the first day. Why does that make me want to cry? But this was a, this was so cute. It was a proud dad moment for Taryn. And also for me, I love how much Taryn supports and believes in his writer. And it's even more meaningful that he's saying this, like from day one, he had this faith in her. It wasn't something that she earned or he built up over time. Um, Like from day one, he was ride or die for her. Before our girl was even a super powerful lightning wielder. Yes. I love how I love his faith in her. I love her bond. I've said this a couple of times. Their bond is so cute. How they just instantly just clicked. Yeah. It's written so well. So I'm more of a more romantic while Kayla is more of she likes the action stuff, so I didn't have a lot of favorite moments. I have a lot of favorite moments, but I do want to talk about a couple of things. So first, I would love to discuss Dane's jealousy, because I feel like this is our payback for all the shit he's done all book. Anyways, nothing made my heart smell more than Dane's pride being absolutely deliberated, like damn dude. So the scene when they're on the flight field getting ready for their, Like going, getting ready to go to their assigned stations for war games. And Zayden comes up to recruit Violet and Liam and Dane's like, no, you can't have her. Blah, blah, blah. And Violet's like, where you go, daddy? I go. And then Dane's like, him? Really? And I just, this scene gave me chill. I'm still on over the, where you go, I go. I did not expect that. No, that's funny. But, I love this scene because I love Zay getting his feelings hurt here. Like, he was so crushed to figure out that her and Zayden were together. He was like, I heard the rumors, but I just assumed they weren't true. I assumed you were smarter than that. Oh my god, so patronizing. She's causing lightning storms out here with your enemy. That's funny. So, eat that. Anyways, moving on from Dane, I want to briefly talk about Brennan. I know you're suspicious about him, but I just wanted to welcome him back to the chat. Just wanted to welcome him back. I thought you were going to hate on him with me. No, I was going to, but I'm suspicious. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome. What the hell? Welcoming him. I don't know why I couldn't get that out. Welcoming him. I was reading the first two chapters of Iron Flame and I was like, Brandon. And I was like, everything you say is suspicious. Well, he does lose some major cool points for pretending to be dead for six years. I will give him that, but he has been building a revolution in order to save those outside the wars of Navarre. We think, and it's almost, we think, well, kind of thinks, and it's almost nostalgic though, that he's doing something about the discoveries of their father. I think it's really sweet that his father didn't get to finish his research. And. Really exposed the bar and Brennan took notes from Finn's failures and decided to build his revolution in secret and do a surprise attack when it was time. So I just want to welcome him. Welcome back, Brennan. Welcome back to life. I've never. Really thought too hard about how nostalgic it is that he's doing something. That his father would be really proud of. Well, we think he is, but I've just been blinded by my suspicion of him to notice that. It's okay. I got you. All right. That was a long stretch, but time to close out our better brief section and move on to the book of Jia, where we would discuss in depth the sign that we know of and that we learn in Fourth Wing Feel free to skip ahead to our miniseries if you feel like you're already an expert. Due to the length of our Signet breakdown, we are going to take a breather from Mythology and really dive into all the Signets in this world. But we'll be back into our Mythology section in our time. Yes. Like we said last week, Signet abilities are a result of the unique chemistry of a dragon and their rider, usually reflecting more about the latter than the former. Today we will be talking about all Signets, known, unknown, and any other relevant information to these magical powers. And it is definitely possible and highly likely we will come across new Signets in Onyx Storm, seeing that some people will get sick. Second, Signets and Byleth. Most Signets seem to be limited by a writer's creativity and also the teaching at Beth's guidance. Undocumented Signets. Precognition or resurrection sickness have never occurred and likely never will, but we'll see, we'll see, I've seen theories that Violet will be able to resurrect people because I feel like she includes foreshadowing. There's in the chapter header about resurrection like how it will never be a signet and I'm like I feel like just because you said that it it's not it probably will I like the fact that you highlighted that should raise red flags for us Yeah, everything this is a book of red flags, but it's like resurrected I don't well we're gonna get into that in iron flame because it's very like weird how he describes it he was like nailin didn't fail, but it cost him everything so I was like so you didn't die. So you did die What? I don't know. Anyways, okay, so let's get into, and this is going to be long, but lots of good information in here to touch upon your Cygnet wiki information in your brain. or you can skip ahead because it is a lot. So error manipulation, let's start A to Z people. We're starting at the A's. Well, let me preface this by saying that I get all the information from the Empyrean wiki. You can actually look it up and they have All the information there, but I think it's a website like Wikipedia where people can upload. So I'm fact checking as I go, but that's where I'm getting the bulk of the information from. Go check it out if you want to brush up on your information there. Okay. So air manipulation. So the people who we know that have it, Emery, Sienna and Colonel Fremont, whoever the fuck they is. And this thing is as it sounds, the ability to wield and manipulate air. So this is useful for directing dragon flame, cutting off air supply, and I'm sure many more applications. Imagination is probably the only limit here. Astral projection is Quinn. And she's in our squad. So this is the very unique ability to send the consciousness out of the physical body. So I'm sure this would be very helpful for like, recon and spying and I think if I could pick a signet for myself, this would probably be it. When we learned about this in the book, I was like, what? That's actually so cool. You get to walk around anywhere. It's chilling. I think I would be, but I feel like I'm too large to be a spy. I'm really tall. Oh, damn. The like spies need to be five foot two so they can hide in places. Yeah. All right. So the next thing that we're talking about is battle foresight. General Melgren, this is his signet, and this is reminiscent of precognition, but it has limits to only see the outcome of future battles. And this signet is countered when three or more marked ones are grouped together, like we know, due to the use of runes. And this is just a very interesting signet, and has been talked about a lot, and has confused a lot of readers, including myself. There's so much gray area here. What is considered a battle? Does there have to be X amount of people for him to see the outcome? Are they visions or something he identifies? Through his thoughts. Just so many questions as to how exactly his signet works. So much mystery around it, but this is definitely one of the strongest six signets in existence. And it sucks that we don't know more about the nuances and I'm wondering if we're going to learn more about it or if it's purposely left kind of vague, because it may not stand to logic once you get into all the itty bitty details, but I don't know, we'll see. General Malgoren is kind of sus. He is. Might be a Venon, who knows. Okay, next we have the countering signet. So this is Bodhi's signet. And this is another one that is also vague, but I think it could be really useful depending on the limits it has. And I don't think the signet will be of particular use to Venon, but he can use it against other riders, potentially the riders in Bazgaith that are helping the Venon. Or maybe, I don't know, he would have to use it on someone In our inner circle. I don't know. It's kind of interesting that that's a signet and you can't use it against Bennett, but you can use it against riders with segments and then an iron flame when making the ward stone. Bodhi is regarded as a very powerful writer, but we really haven't seen him use his segment in a super impressive way. So. Sorry, Bodhi, but I don't, I haven't seen anything amazing. So, I don't know if he's that powerful, like, he just can't use it, or, I don't know. So much more mystery. But, to be on the nice side, I do think the Signet reflects who he is in a cool way. As a child of the Rebellion, Bodhi knew he would have to protect himself and Mark Twain's family because of the corruption and the cowardice of Navarrean riders. So he actually manifested a signet that could protect him from riders using signets on him or other people. So distance wielding, two unnamed historical writers have this ability and I would bet money that someone is going to be revealed as a distance wielder in Onyx Storm or future books. There are theories that this could be Violet's second signet, but personally we don't really think that, because We haven't really gotten a lot of proof on it, but I don't know. We don't know what could happen. Rebecca is full of surprises. We can assume that distance wielding is being able to travel far distances. Extending wards. We know that this is mira's signet and she is very useful to the bar And she's able to extend the natural wards that protect the bar She is also able to create small wards As an iron flame farsight is Liam's ability RP. Yeah. And this gives him the ability to see long or far distances, like in the battle at resin, when he's able to see who is coming or entering the battle. F bane to fight them. Yeah. Fire wielding is professor cars, signet. And this is the stability to will fire and manipulate it and use it in battle and comeback ice building. Riddick and Mason have this signet and. We wonder if this is a reflection of Riddick because he's so cool. Yes. And he even says so himself, but of course ice wielding is pretty self explanatory, this ability to wield ice. Okay, so an illusionist signet, Professor Kaori, has the ability to project mental images as three dimensional illusions for others to see. If anyone's read the Stormlight Archives by Brandon Sanderson, this reminds me of the light weaving search finding skills. Random. intrinsic. Zaden Ryerson, I'm looking at you, is the ability to read someone's surface level thoughts and is outlawed and executable in the bar due to security risk. And there are different types of intrinsic abilities. Since no two s are alike and in Za Aden's case, he can see a person's intentions as a series of mental. Lightning wielding is Lightin Motherfuckin Sorengale, and she has the ability to wield lightning regardless of current weather. The wielder acts as a conduit, creating lightning from the sky down, the ground up, or directly through the wielder's hands. It is a form of pure power or energy that takes the shape of lightning. Memory Erasure, Imogen, the ability to erase or alter a person's recent memories. So basically she could be a master gaslighter if she wanted to. And it's unknown how recent a memory has to be for it to be erasable. Mending, our guy Nolan, you traitor. And Brennan, Sorengale, who also might be a traitor. This is an exceptionally rare signet, which makes sense, considering most people joining the Writers Quadrant probably aren't the most, like, gentle, healing nature type people. And it's the ability to fix, restore, or return anything to its original state from cloth, bridges, or broken bones, and receiving mending is actually extremely painful. You can't mend missing limbs, and mending yourself is more difficult than mending someone else. And I wonder what this says about who Brennan is, it doesn't really fit with my traitor theory if it's reflecting who he is, but I don't know. and then metallurgy, metal wielding, we'll just go with that. Sawyer, and it's the ability to wield metal and change shape, which is pretty cool. I like that segment, but I don't know what it says about him. also we're only halfway through and this is taking a hot minute. So we're going to move on. And then in our first episode of Iron Flame, we're going to do the second half of the segment breakdown. So tune into our Iron Flame episode for that. Yes. Moving on time to head to the flight field where every week, Ken and I will do two to three minute series, unique to our podcast. They won't be the same every week. So keep tuning in for all the fun this episode, we're going to do unhinged one sentence summaries and character rankings. Okay. So I came up with three unhinged one sentence summaries. Cause I had so many good ideas. Okay. Fourth wing, Harry Potter meets Top Gun. If wizards flee dragons, train for war, and got caught up in a scorching romance so intense it might set the entire college on fire. Hmm. Basically. Basically. Alright. Fourth wing, aka, how to train your dragon and how to get your heart broken in ten days or less. Yes. Yes. Literally yes. Alright. Alright. The last one. Thanks to her mom, a tiny woman accepts she is probably going to die, but in the sexiest and most dramatic way possible. Pretty much. Pretty much. So good. I saw you had three, so I just, I came up with three. Nice. And my first one is the book about the girl flirting with two guys who lied to her and still fail for one of them. It's Basically. That sums up that situation. Literally. My second one is the book about Dragon's Foot. Not really foot. Yeah. Basically. Yeah. And the last one is the book about students attending a college that teaches them how to die. Sometimes by their own dragon. Damn. Yeah. It's like funny, but yeah, that's really the reality. Yeah, it's just like, yeah. Okay. Our next one is character ranking where we're basically just going to list the characters 1 through 10 on how we feel about them. 1 being our favorite, 10 being our least favorite. And some of them did not even make the list. Dane, I'm looking at you. So my number one is obviously Tan. Obviously. Obviously. Then Violet. Love my girl. Zayden. And Darna. Sigeil. I forgot Sigeil, but I just added her in. So, um, Jacenia, you're getting booted off the list. Oh, no. Then Riddick, then Imogen, then Rhiannon, then Mira, then Liam. Liam? At the bottom? Well, he's dead now. I gotta talk about other favorites. I'm sorry. Okay. Well, my favorites are Taryn, Violet, and Riddick. Zayden. Top three. I was contemplating on where to put Violet and Zayden, but Zayden is a liar, so I had to stick him in number three. Then, Liam, Rhiannon, Seagal, Imogen, Jesenia, Riddick, and Mira.

Okay if you'd noticed why we look completely different all of a sudden, it's because my computer glitched and we had to record this on a separate day. So, yes, that's why I look different. But I did do braids. So again, matchy matchy. Okay, before we close our episode for today, time to spar. Each week, Mackenzie and I will give each other, our listeners, two trivia questions, or in this case, Three since it's our last episode of fourth wing and after this, we will tally up who has the most points between hosts and loser has to do something embarrassing or funny or disgusting that the winner or you guys as fans come up with. So, if you have any ideas, let me hear your feedback ideas and participation, and we will be releasing the punishment video on our first iron flame episode release day. Which I think will be December 19th. Shit! Okay, I'll start us off. all right. This is going to be hard for you because they're very specific. And this was a while ago. What outpost is Dane squad going to claim for the final war games challenge? I don't know. It's, I don't even know how to pronounce it. A two, a two ball? A two ball! Okay. so in the beginning of this chapter. We know that Violet and Zayden were like, doing the thing, and then, uh, um, Garrett comes and knocks on the door. What time was it? 4 a. m. Close. What? It was 4. 15. 3 a. m. What? You gotta be that specific. I don't know. Motherfucker. Alright, I'll give it to you. I mean, my questions are very specific too. Alright, my next question, and it doesn't have to be a specific number, but you have to be within a range, I would say, of at least 50. Okay. How many people live in Wreson? 400. Nah. In the book, someone says that, I think Violet asked how many people live there, and someone else says more than 300. 400. Oh, okay. I'll give you half a point. I guess you're not wrong. But I don't think it's 400. But you said it's a 50 range, right? It's like, not really. I know, I'm just trying to be nice. You have to be nice. Okay, this is always happening. I'm giving you hints on how to fuck me over in trial by trivia, and then I'm also trying to be nice and giving you half points. Okay, you ready? Sure. How high? Are the mountains of, athbun. Very high. Is it an elevation I have to give you? Yeah, but it's like a certain feet. She says it multiple times in the stretch. at least two. I don't recall that at all. Twelve thousand. Twelve thousand? No. Feet? No. Fuck. How many? A thousand. I was worried it was going to be like 200 and something. It was a thousand feet. Fuck, man. Fuck. I just gave you the answer to this one. What were the last words of Fen Ryerson? the bar was cowards. Yeah, I forgot this was my last question. You can change that. Um, no, that's too much work. I don't have my book handy. So, I'll give you a point because I'm nice once again. Okay, my last question is also very specific. Oh, fuck. All right, when was the first known Griffin attack, after unification? Like what year? It's something AU after unification. It's not very high, but just say that. So don't go saying like 200. Do I have to get in a range of 50? I'll give you a range of 10. Fuck, babe. Is it within the first 10 years? First what? Within the first 10 years? I would say the first 50. I'm gonna say the 30 to 40 year range. It was one, it was one AU. God damn it. I got it from one of the, the I guess that makes sense. One of the headers. That's a good question. Alright, well, you got one point right. But I still won, bitch! The final score was I have four and a half and Kenzie has three. So, if you have any ideas on what I should make Miss McKenzie do, let me know! I'll be thinking on it, and we will air whatever we She has to do, first episode of our Iron Flame coverage releasing December 19th. So check out our social media at Shadow and Starlight Pod that day. And that's a wrap on today's episode, folks. Thank you so much for tuning in to the last of our fourth wing coverage. We are so happy you're here, and we can't wait to dig into Iron Flame with you guys next week. Yes! Join us next Thursday as we start our iron flame coverage, where we'll be going over chapters one through 15, pages one through 1 48 for your reread or to refresh your memory. Yes, it means the world to both of us. We love it when we hear any feedback from you guys. So leave us a review, check out our socials, reach out to us. If you want to talk to either of us about books, we would really love it. And then make sure to just subscribe and follow on YouTube and on all major podcast platforms for a freshly baked episode to be delivered to you next. Guys, bye friends! See you next week! Bye friends, we'll see you next week for Iron Flame! My Outro For My 20th Birthday