Dancing Through Breast Cancer Into Purpose with Podcast Host Jenny C. Cohen

A breast cancer diagnosis can feel like the end of the story, but sometimes it is the interruption that saves your life. I sit down with Jenny C. Cohen, an award-winning dancer and author, to talk about what happened when her career was taking off and everything suddenly stopped. Her path moves through chemo, fear, grief, and a hard reckoning with control, then lands in something quieter and stronger: presence, surrender, and purpose that is rooted in love instead of performance.

We also go into the parts people rarely say out loud, like the anger that can rise when your child is diagnosed with type 1 diabetes, the spiral of asking “why,” and the moment you realize your vigilance cannot keep everyone alive. Jenny shares how embodiment and movement helped her stay connected to God when words felt impossible, and we explore why many high achievers use busyness to avoid what is actually being asked of them.

From religion trauma to rebuilding faith around relationship, we talk about daily practices that support spiritual growth and mental clarity. Sleep becomes a surprisingly practical theme, including sleep apnea, bedtime resistance, and why rest is not laziness, it is leadership. If you have been stuck in fear, doubt, or over-functioning for everyone else, this conversation is a direct invitation to pause for presence, stop piloting other people’s planes, and remember you are already beloved.

Subscribe for more conversations about purpose, healing, and faith, and if this helped you, share it with a friend and leave a review so more people can find it.

To connect with or purchase any products or books from Jenny C. Cohen visit her website at: https://jennyccohen.com/home or connect with her on Instagram @jennyccohen or LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennyccohen

Transcript

Why Purpose Is Not Linear

SPEAKER_00 0:02

If you've ever struggled with fear, doubt, or worry, and wondering what your true purpose was all about, then this podcast is for you. In this show, your host, Sylvia Warsham, will interview elite experts and ordinary people that have created extraordinary lives. So here's your host, Sylvia Warsham.

SPEAKER_01 0:29

Hey I bringers, it's Sylvia Warsham. Welcome to Released Out Reveal Purpose. And today is Jenny C. Cohen. Her story is it's hard to put it into words because everything that she's been through has been one dark chapter to the next, to the next, to the next, but she's here now in the light. It doesn't happen linearly. Let me explain that. For those searching for their divine calling, it's not very obvious because of the noise of the outside world, the noise of definitions from our parents and what success is. For example, that could be one. We fall into these traps early on that we think we know what we're doing, when in fact it's just the beginning of this lifelong journey of lessons we're learning along the way. They're equipping us for precisely at such a time as this. And I'm referencing Esther 414 from the Bible because our life, God is equipping us, He's turning all of that pain into purpose. Some of our choices, we have made choices on our own that have had these consequences in our lives. Sometimes, you know, God is whispering in our ear, hey, do this, do that, but the noise is so loud. In our heads and our hearts, outside of us, it's no wonder that we fall trapped to all these stupid things that we end up doing, you know. And then some of us have diagnoses that we can't run away from. And when we see what role we have played in there, we start to make the changes that lead us to our lights. So without further ado, Jenny C, thank you so

Meeting Jenny C. Cohen

SPEAKER_01 2:35

much for joining us on Released Out Reveal Purpose.

SPEAKER_03 2:38

Sylvia, thank you so much for having me. I'm very honored and I feel very blessed to be here today.

SPEAKER_01 2:44

I'm getting toes already, so I know the Holy Spirit's in the room. Um I know that what you have to say is going to be the guidance that someone on the other side needs to hear because they are currently navigating a dark chapter. So please, if you would do us the honor of sharing your story of transformation.

A Career Peak Then A Lump

SPEAKER_03 3:12

The year that was 2014, and I was about to launch my fusion belly dance career. I had won a contest. I had come back from Germany, where I actually play second out of nine people. It was huge. Even though I gave them the wrong music. They read an introduction for the wrong performance from the night before. And I start I start dancing to the competition to music I had performed in the show the night before, and I still play second up runner-up. And I came home a glow and I found a lump. And then that began uh that began an 18-month breast cancer journey where I went from looking, I thought, very healthy and vibrant to looking like a little old Asian man. And in retrospect, that was one of the breaks God gave me because I didn't know I was running full speed in the direction that wasn't meant for me. I was ready to launch my career and become internationally known. And I was about 44. My kids were entering their teenage years, and I thought, oh, we've been homeschooling, and they maybe they'll go to school and maybe we'll progress to to partial school. I have found a program and then I got breast cancer and it stopped everything. And I thought, okay, well, I'm listening, and I wasn't listening. I'll be honest. I wasn't listening. I danced throughout it to stay connected with God because that was the only time I could feel safe enough to be in my body during the treatment, was to dance. And then as my treatment ended, I started using dance as a way to run away. And I did have any clue why I was doing that.

Parenting Type 1 Diabetes And Anger

SPEAKER_03 4:50

So I'm gonna take it back a step further. Before my breast cancer, my son was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes at 10. And that was when I actually stopped talking to God. I was so angry. God, why did you give my precious miracle that you allowed to happen because I had to go through in vitro for my children, Sylvia? Alright? These miracles from God I was not supposed to have. And you give them this this disease that means they could die in their sleep and never reach adulthood. And I stopped talking to God for about four years and I got breast cancer. And it was during the chemotherapy session, because I had 16 cycles of chemo and then radio and surgery and then radiation, and then another six months of another infusion that they had started. It was during the first 16 cycles where you start to kind of die a little bit because chemotherapy is no joke, y'all. It was during that time that I got a download from God one day. Because I had been asking why, why Daniel, why, why? He's the elite athlete. Why does he have cancer? Uh uh type 1 diabetes, where he could die in his sleep, where he can't really become anything. That's that was my definition of that. That was before social media started showing you know the artists and athletes with type one who were you know completely thriving in their lives. And during this this download from God in the middle of my chemotherapy was first of all, Jenny, you're not supposed to know why. That's between me and Daniel. It's not between you and Daniel or me and Daniel, it's not a three-way thing, it's none of your business. But because you're being so such a stubborn donkey butt about this, I'm gonna give you a little hint. It was to slow him down. I still get emotional about that though, because it f he there was a mental picture, and it's a very cliche. I'm gonna tell it to you anyways, you know, when you when you're when you're just asking God, you know, why did you leave me? And then you see this person looking behind them in the sand, and you see one set of of uh foot footprints, and you're like, why did you leave me? And literally it was this picture I got in my head, and it was this reminder. Those are the times I was carrying you. Jenny, you didn't keep your son alive. I did. Every night he was supposed to die in a sleep. That was me keeping him alive, not you. Not your vigilance, not your not your taking care of tiny little details. And then after Daniel when I got that download, I had to get through chemotherapy and and uh the the surgery and the radiation, and I was running away, and then I thought, okay, so the I was like, Alright, I'm ready to relaunch that fusion belly dance. And I was ready to really become a big name in the dance world because I was winning competitions again. And then Mother's Day, my mother, my my were we had gone back to Boston, my kids were homeschooled,

The Moment Presence Became Urgent

SPEAKER_03 8:05

we moved from East Coast to West Coast, and my kids wanted to go back and meet up with their homeschooling friends. So we went back to the East Coast, Sylvia, and it was Mother's Day weekend, and I was gonna do our little performance with an old community. And during that time, my my one of my kids, and I have permission to speak on this, by the way. So both of my kids are legal age. Anything I speak on, I have permission to speak on, just to be clear, because we do need to ask permission, folks, when we're talking about our kids' stories. So I have permission to speak on this. Is that um this this other fraternal twin showed me scores on their body and uh told me of their plans to kind of not be around in this lifetime anymore. And I was floored. I thought they were gonna thank me. I thought this show was gonna thank me for taking them to Boston and seeing their friends, and yet they're telling me that they they had stolen like razor blades from around the house. And that was the beginning of this particular reason later when you when you address it of why I do what I do now. Because I didn't realize I hadn't been present for most of my life, Sylvia. And I had to get present fast to keep my child alive. She's thriving today.

Silence From God And Surrender

SPEAKER_01 9:15

You know, I can relate on so many levels on that. I want to start off by first saying thank you for being so courageous. Thank you for sharing the vulnerability of your story, for being raw and real with us today. Number one. That takes courage, that's not an easy thing to do, and it needs to be commended and and recognized. So thank you. Number one, number two, there's so much relatability here, so much relatability. I've been angry with God too, especially after diagnosis, not mine, my children's. And I was so angry at him last year, so angry. I couldn't even speak to him, and that's rare for someone like me who wakes up every day at four o'clock in the morning to have my one cup of coffee and chat with him. He's my first appointment of the day. I couldn't even look at him. And I have I have this. Um, my husband is a brilliant woodworker, aside from being a brilliant electrical engineer, and he carved out this um the Christ's uh face on a cross. And it's in front of me every morning, so I physically see him, you know, the representation of Christ, and I couldn't look at him, and I told him, I am so angry at you, I can't even look at you. Why? Why of all people? And there was silence. Silence, Genesee. Do you I've always felt them, I've always been a part of him. I abide in him just like he abides in me. We co-collaborate on everything. We are like two keys in a pot. I couldn't even look at him, and the silence was deafening, and it went on for weeks, like no inkling of his presence whatsoever. But you know what I did? I stayed in his word. As mad as I was, I knew that the enemy of lies was close by because he wanted to separate me from the purpose I had to fulfill, and he was trying to distract me with this diagnosis, just like he had distracted me with my husband's like attitude when I started to launch my business. I thought my husband was the enemy. No, he just twisted everything in my head, and every time I tried to launch my business, some big thing would happen with my husband that I started to blame my husband for everything. This was years ago, and all of it was training for such a time as this because we need that training, we need those dark chapters, we need to be angry with them, we need to feel like we need him until our knees hit the floor in total surrender and submission. We don't really begin to live our life to the fullest. We don't really know, we're just playing at it. This is a direct quote from Marianne Williamson. She had this, this is a quote I I put into one of the collaborations I did as an author. Uh, during the years that he had me just writing, he's like, You just keep writing, you just you'll be invited, just keep doing it. I'll tell you when to stop. And then came my father's terminal diagnosis. And now came not surrender just when things got tough, but every day. Surrender, surrender, surrender, surrender. Every day was to him in his presence. When he finally spoke to me last year, when I got so angry at him, he said, You don't believe it, you don't believe in who you are in me. You don't believe in any of that. You talk about it on your podcast, you talk about it in the book, you believe in me, I know you do, because you talk about me all the time, but you don't believe in who you are, and you are achieving to get to me, and that is not what I'm asking you for. I'm asking for your heart and for relationship. Yeah, that's all I care about. You are trying to achieve love by what you're doing to check off that box, okay? Because that's all you know, you are a high achiever, you've been that your whole life. And when I sat with that truth, Jenny C at first is stung. But if I'm being honest, I need to hear it because, like you, I was a stubborn daughter of his. I could not turn it. I mean, it was like, what are you doing? You're giving the enemy all the ammunition he needs to tear you apart. Yeah, he is using everything that is happening to you. Now, we have free will, we forget this aspect. We forget that we make choices, that our parents made choices before us, and our grandparents made choices that biologically put us in a really big rut, if if you will. And there's not much that God can do when people make choices, he's not gonna stop us. But what he does is he turns that pain into purpose. So tell us more about how he took all of this pain for you and turned it into the purpose that you're living out today.

Overachieving Versus Being Beloved

SPEAKER_03 15:30

It wasn't an easy, simple pivot. I'll be very honest, to you, Sylvia, and your audience. I mentioned I was a sub donkey butt. So I need little nudges in the direction that I'm meant to go. It I love to learn and I love to take choice out of my own hands and put it in other people's hands, so then I don't have to be responsible for the end result. I'm being very honest. Like, you know, I am an overachiever, I'm an author, my books on awards, I'm an award-winning competitive dancer. Uh in every contest I enter, I pretty much place either win or um I'm one of the top-facing people. There's only been a few that I haven't, so I know how to play games of what people are looking for. That's never been the issue. It's been the trusting that I'm beloved, whether or not I'm achieving it.

SPEAKER_01 16:25

Yeah. Right? You're the earner. You're the you're the ester architect like me, and the one who's not great.

SPEAKER_03 16:34

So we're the elder daughters. We're the people who carry the burden and it's expected. There's no thank you. No, there's no acknowledgement, so we convince ourselves that that's what our roles are are, and we're not. We're actually meant to be leaders. Like the fact that you and I were just chatting about me getting because I've been really connected in the last, I would say, last six months, because I've been doing a lot of self-reflection and making sure I'm in my body. Because, you know, we have souls that are are existing inside these meat sacks, right? And our souls require our bodies to be very, very strong receptors of God's messages or source or connection to nature, however, people are defining it. You know, I don't care what people defining it. There's a bigger power than us that's helping us get through.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Oh, yeah. I'm a most strength and understanding, you know that. Because we would have stayed stuck longer than usually.

SPEAKER_03 17:35

And you know, I've been a part of a mastermind where they refer to God as happy face, and when you don't listen to God, happy face turns into unhappy face. Oh yeah. Pretty quickly, too. Right? And it's it's almost like the the for me it's been, oh, oh, so you mean unconditional love I can get from happy face, but I don't need to give it or expect it from my partner. Because that's been a big stickler. I've been married, we're 33 years in June.

SPEAKER_01 18:02

Oh, congratulations. When in June?

SPEAKER_03 18:04

June 20th.

SPEAKER_01 18:05

Okay, I'm June 14th.

unknown 18:07

Ah!

SPEAKER_03 18:08

Come on, university babies. All right, so for me, most of the running joke in our relationship is that I I raised my husband. His, you know, his his parents got him to a level that that he and I could find each other and realize we're good partners. And then from that point forward, I did a lot of work to help him be as much as he can be. And that's two-pronged though. One meaning I listened to God to guide him, and two, I I also listened so well I was piloting his plane. And I had to disconnect and go, wait a minute, if I'm piloting his plane, who's piloting my plane?

SPEAKER_02 18:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:49

No one's piloting my plane, or Unhappy Face is piloting, other people are piloting, and that's why I'm gonna bring back to this whole looking for answers from other people that appear to know the answers.

Religion Trauma And Real Relationship

SPEAKER_03 19:00

Because for me, I remember when I was very young at a Chinese Bible church in Worcester, Massachusetts, asking questions and no one would answer them.

SPEAKER_02 19:13

I love that. I love that you're so inquisitive like that.

SPEAKER_03 19:17

I was a valid, you know, uh, there were valid questions, I thought, anyways. I was in my teens, like, you know, what do you mean? Like he didn't have he was sinless. Didn't he go through puberty? Like, like that's not a relevant question because it's like it's an Asian culture. So they're like, why are you questioning? You should just on faith. I'm like, what is faith? What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_01 19:35

No, you don't understand why. You do, and there's a reason why your mind is like that. He created you that way for that reason.

SPEAKER_03 19:44

It's a question, however, I ended up still finding God again through uh I converted to Judaism because the rabbi that I took a conversion course with by myself, Sylvia, I was in a in a room with like 20 other couples, and uh, me and this other woman were the only single people taking this class by ourselves. Because I was like, okay, I'm gonna marry someone who's Jewish, but I don't know about anything about Judaism, so I'm gonna learn about it from this conversion course. No plan to convert, because I was very leery of religion, right? Like establish things with people interpreting things for me. Uh-uh, no more of that, Sylvia. Like I need I need dialogues from God. People are people can do the best they can, but they're human. We're all human. The rabbi says to me, you know, there could be like, you know, a hundred Jews in the in the room, and there's 200 ways to be Jewish. What's really important is your relationship with God. And I went, all right, almost date for the rest of this course, Sylvia. I'm done. This is great. That's great. I'm gonna I'm open to your learnings now because you're allowing me to question.

SPEAKER_01 20:36

Yeah, and and he talked more about the relationship with him. It's not about the religion. See, and that's where most people get stuck, Jenny. See, I don't know if you realize if you've encountered that, but in my coaching practice, I've I've had people with major religion trauma, and I always remind them listen, like I'm a non-denominational Krishna, but I was raised Catholic. Jesus, when he was here on earth, detested religion. I mean, he didn't like the Pharisees, he called them out, called them hypocrites. He was like, hey, if you're gonna if you're gonna tell the people um to be this way or that way, you need to model that because you're the leaders. You're not supposed to just stand at the altar and just you know, command people. You're not God. That's not your role. And so I would remind people that I heard this from a coaching client of mine, um, and I got permission from her to say this publicly on a podcast. She said, Jace, uh, Jesus Christ for me is the cool guy, the one we can all turn to. And I just started laughing because I thought, well, he's my he's my friend. He's the one that I turned to, he's the one that knows what it's like to be human and to die. Right? And and to die, not just any death. I I for the first time in my life, I saw Passion of the Christ last year, no, two years ago in December. I thought I couldn't do it. But then Jonathan Roomy, who um placed Jesus on the chosen, very recently in an interview said, Why are you gonna abandon Christ on his greatest hour of need and not watch that scene? Because it's not comfortable for you. Do you imagine what he went through? Like, you need to be there with him, you need to understand that sacrifice, you need to know what he went through. And I sat back and I was like, oh my gosh, he's right. Why am I doing this? You know, and so I I asked him for strength. I said, I want to be able to watch you suffer even though you're my best friend and you're the reason you're the voice that I listen to now. And yes, do I fall into temptation? Yes, I'm human, I am fallible, the sins of the flesh are very strong within

Spiritual Warfare And Daily Discipline

SPEAKER_01 23:00

us. There are two things that every day when we wake up, we need to realize. And this I heard from another person I interviewed on the podcast in November of last year, around the time that God was training me with silence. And he told me two things. He said, Sylvia, demons are very strong. They don't care about your accomplishments or your credentials or anything, they will beat you all day, every day. Number one. Number two are the sins of your flesh. That's why you must crucify them daily to the cross. Just like Christ crucified his body to the cross for your sins to forgive you, to give you a place in heaven with God. You must also crucify those sins of your flesh because they're strong. And you got to take the thoughts that you have in your head, which is how the enemy will twist these things in your head and bring them to the word. The only thing they recognize is authority, and the authority is the word of God. That's that's the only way to get demons off of you. So remember scripture, get into the word, read it, let it let truly understand what you're reading. Truly understand what I'm telling you of who you are in me. You are so much more than that broken piece of you that you're operating from, that operating space, that old self, it's gotta die. You gotta die to it, you gotta surrender that one. And that's what I did. I started to like you this year, 2026. This is why I was like, this is a divine introduction with you, and I'll tell you why. In 2026, he he basically said, I need you to pause for presence. You're doing, you're not being. I did not call you to do, I called you to be, to embody love, to embody understanding, to embody patience, embody joy, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, kindness. That's who you are in me. That's the fruit that you will bear when you abide in me, and I abide in you, and you allow me to guide you, instead of you taking the reins of your life and mucking it up. Because I mucked up my life more times than I could count, and he's still having to sit me down and go, What are you doing? Do we have to have this conversation again? Do you have to like do I have to use another pulmonary embolism episode in your life again? And another lovely choice of yours? And I was like, nope, you don't have to do that. I don't want to go there again. And he said, Well, then I need you to learn this now. So, Jenny C, tell me, what is the greatest lesson he has taught you?

SPEAKER_03 25:55

Oh, there's so many of them, Sylvia. Which one shall I choose to share with your

Sleep Apnea And Caring For The Body

SPEAKER_03 26:00

audience today? All right, there's one, there's a good one. I know that my one of my biggest focuses that's been downloaded to me many times through many people has that I must take care of my body. I need to role model that for people and like on a really honest full out being present because otherwise I I can't help people. I can't because I'm not clear. And I say that to you because again, the whole meat sack analogy I shared with you all before, because we all got different packaging, right? God gifted us different packaging. Some of us were six feet, size four, and some of us are Asian American, like you know, facades, you know, going through menopause, post-cancer, you know, and some of us are like my bipockheads who are the wage and white presenting in Asian mixes, and they have their things they have to achieve. And the the key has always been for me, a pivotal thing is sleep. I'm not getting enough sleep. Sylvia and Sylvia's audience. Listen, I'm now in hormone replacement therapy because I have osteoporosis, so I had to really make some draft. I was led towards hormone replacement therapy. And there's progesterone that you take that actually makes me sleepy. I even have extra magnesium in my diet. I f I we found my husband had CPAP issues, like sleep apnea, so he had to have CPAP. And then he said, Jenny, you gotta snore, let's test you out. And I had worse sleep apnea than he did, but mine was very quiet. I didn't snore loudly, I just stopped breathing many times an hour, you know? Right? So I didn't know. I mean, the O2 ring showed my heart rate was going up into the 90s in my sleep. I was hitting no REM sleep. So now that the C B machine works, when I do sleep, it's wonderful. Yet there's been a resistance to getting to bed on time. A hard, hard, like I'll get into C dramas, I'll be scrolling online, I'll be postponing my which as a download that I need to be more visible on social media, but I'll wait until the end of the evening to do that instead of putting it at the top of the agenda if that's something assigned to me by God, right? I push that to the bottom of the day because I'm resistant to being seen. And then that affects my sleep because I'm taking moon brew, night hot chocolate drinks, and the gummies to get me to sleep, I'm still not wiring myself to sleep. That's my resistance. Because then I can't get up and be very actively producing what I need to do, and then I miss my messages, and no matter how much in touch I am with my body, if I'm not resting enough to get my brain, because your brain actually, when you're sleeping, it is cleaning itself and rewiring you for the next day.

SPEAKER_01 29:03

Well, and they're intricate, it's an intricate system. My sister told me that she when she went to medical school years and years ago, she's a medical doctor, and she said, Sylvia, there is a God. These bodies are too perfectly made. I mean, this system is wired perfectly. We're the ones that muck it up by like eating wrong, not getting enough sleep, the holistic part of things. Like for you, sleep was a big thing for me. This this go around too. How funny that you said sleep. I was like, okay, yeah, yeah, I'm getting your message. Got it. You know, I got it. I got it. You just shared it with Jenny C. I appreciate that. Because I'm like you. I'm like, I don't know, I'm resisting the sleep. And my husband's like, why are you resisting the sleep? You are the crankiest person if you don't sleep.

SPEAKER_03 29:59

I just got it downloaded, Celia. You know why? Why? Because where were during the pandemic? Well, I I have trouble sleeping before, however, there was a period with the sleep acne machine that I got sleep and then the pandemic hit. And I became a watchdog. Like I thought if I sleep, I'm gonna miss something happening and I have to witness everybody. And I was getting very little sleep because I was worried about the whole world coming apart and it's come back around again. I'm worried instead of just letting God do what God needs to do.

SPEAKER_01 30:33

That's what that's God's

Get Back In Your Own Plane

SPEAKER_01 30:35

job. What you're doing is getting in his way of doing his job.

SPEAKER_03 30:40

This is like the final frontier for me. Like I've already like so last month, Sylvia, I went to Seattle and learned and was like it was it was shown to me that I was trying to pilot everybody's plane. So I had to physically and like figuratively like remove myself out of my kids' planes, my husband's planes, my parents' planes, my brother's planes, like my friends' planes, and get back in my own damn plane. Yeah, like you know, there were repercussions, y'all. Like people felt it.

SPEAKER_01 31:05

Oh yeah, they do our light is very bright, like our attention to those people. When we remove that attention, they feel it. It's tough on them. But if we don't do that, we can't give.

SPEAKER_03 31:20

Well, we can't give what we don't have. Yeah, I I'm blocking their own life from God. That's the key that that was like, oh, you're trying to help them, but you literally stop them from actually connecting. And then you don't even I don't even make my own connection available. And that's what most of my platform is about, Sylvia. It's like, are you connected? Like, are you being a good vessel? Like, you know, it's like there's a mirror being shown to my face, like, no, you're not.

SPEAKER_01 31:52

Like what like he told me, like he showed the mirror, and he said, You're you're basically empowering people uh and who they are in me, but you don't believe it. Excuse me. Like, so get back with it, you know, like get get back to it, get back to that that that space. And to do that, you need to pause for presence. That's what he told me. So, you know how people pick the word for the year? I told my my my people, my community, my tagline is pause for presence. Pause for presence, like pause, completely pause, step back, look, don't react, don't you know, take off your old self, heal that, you know, stay curious with that, pause for presence, come back to the present moment because in the present moment is where you find him. That's where he's at. He's not in your past. I mean, he's helping you turn that pain to purpose. He's helping you by the promptings of like, hey, listen to me. Yeah, you wouldn't listen to me before. You I prompted you years and years ago to to write your first manuscript, and you told me no. Because you didn't, and that's and that's what he told I I had told him no. Who was I to write a book? Who was I to lead anybody? I was a you know, in my mind, I had messed up. Everybody was better than me. I had imposter syndrome all over the place, and he was like, You have plenty to say about being one of my chosen. You have plenty to say about that. You didn't survive this this long and and in this fashion with without gaining some wisdom along the way that you need to share with people. And I gather just from the way you're talking to me, is that you got the same download of like, hey, yeah, this isn't yours to keep. I know you think this is yours to keep, but this is not yours to keep. You better put that out there.

unknown 34:05

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:05

Because that's what I'm asking you to do. And I died for you, so you know what you owe me. Just kidding.

SPEAKER_02 34:11

I I don't we don't owe him anything.

SPEAKER_01 34:13

He already did that. He already he already died for all of us. That's how beloved and loved we are.

Dropping The Layers And Receiving Rest

SPEAKER_03 34:21

That's so true because I think I think very few people in this moment of this lifetime understand how little they believe that they're beloved, no matter what. No matter what. There's I mean just to be able to receive the belief, forget about feel the love. Just receive the understanding that we are beloved, no matter what you have not done, what you've done, what you're supposed to have done, that that that unconditional love is there right now, even if you don't even feel it or even understand it, it's there, it's there, yeah, and he's been with you the whole time. The whole darn time.

SPEAKER_01 35:11

You're the one that abandoned him. You're the one that turned away. I turned away. I turned away in my first marriage because we would go to Catholic Church and I would see these people like be upstanding citizens inside the church. The minute they stepped out, it was like Jekyll and Hein. And I witnessed it over, you know. I even witnessed it with my first husband too. He would put on a show of affection in public, and then in private was the most cold person. And I I was in my 20s, I was young, I was inexperienced, and I blamed him. I blamed him, and I turned away from God for 10 years, didn't talk to him, didn't consult with him, yeah, and was in corporate America, golden shekel, you know. I did really well because I'm a high achiever, because I'm the first daughter, and I carry it very well. And like you, I'm multiple best-selling author. I have this podcast, I'm doing five episodes a week. Yeah, for the first quarter of 22. People are like, how on earth do you do this? I'm so used to it. I'm so used to producing and achieving, but it is so heavy to carry this load. It we're not meant to do this.

SPEAKER_03 36:37

We're not meant to. We're not meant to. And and and the biggest thing has been for like for me, um, I I've always gotten the download that the things that I've experienced were to equip me. And it's kind of like, really? Am I do I need that many tools?

SPEAKER_01 36:58

I can just part of you that is not you. I'm not being the one that I'm created you to be. How good is that?

SPEAKER_03 37:06

You know, and it's like exactly.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

Well, can you give me the download of what that's supposed to look like? Because I really don't know. I and that and that's where we start from. But the thing is, this is where you start is acknowledging that that's not who you are. And if it feels heavy, there's a reason. You're not supposed to carry it. That's not your role, that's his, and you're getting in his way. He wants to give you the most joy you'll ever experience. But you know what, guys? Listening, if you put on layers all these years, like I'm 52, these layers started when before the age of seven, those layers started. That identity that you're currently living, that's not the identity you were born to be.

SPEAKER_03 37:53

Oh no.

SPEAKER_01 37:54

And you can do the math between seven and fifty two, and that's how long. That's how many layers you piled on. You've programmed your mind to respond in certain ways of behaving that are not in your best interest, just like she and I did. You know, Jenny and I, we both piloted other people's planes except our own. Somehow we made it through, you know, because we we were hustlers. We knew how to hustle, we knew how to achieve, we knew how to do that very well. We could do that in our sleep when we slept. Because, like you, hello, I suffer from no sleep. And in this season, he was like, You've got to rest. I want you to be. I don't want you to do in this season. I want you to be.

SPEAKER_03 39:16

And this this that event where he, you know, went to the hospital for a week and then came home and had to be on insulin shots, and then a month later was on an insulin pump. Uh for our family, it was life-changing, and at the same time, it was part of whatever God had plans for day for my son. And it wasn't it wasn't meant for me to understand, just to be really glad that I was there to assist him as a recovery, Sylvia. That's the biggest thing. Yeah. And then what what other what other lessons was I supposed to be learning from that experience? Besides me, you know, having a temper tantrum and not talking to God, and then getting cancer later. It it if I were to look back at all the pivots that I've had, they've all been, even though I might have felt like I did the work, it really wasn't me. Like I was actually being held.

SPEAKER_01 40:08

Yeah.

unknown 40:08

Right?

SPEAKER_01 40:09

Oh, he held me a bunch of times. A bunch of times. And I actually felt it in the ICU when I faced six doctors. I felt it in the ICU on Easter Sunday morning of 2012. And I find this timing comical because he really wanted me to understand crucifying the old self. And he picks resurrection weekend to do that. That's really come on. But that's just his interesting sense of humor with someone like me. Because I need visuals. See, I'm a visual learner. So every time I wear the cross, it's like, okay, so yeah, crucified dual self. Like, let it be. Like, I need you to just surrender it. Because you're you're here in this world to make a difference, you're a leader. You need to stop hiding behind these ideas in your head and the ideas that Satan has placed in your head to keep you small. You're not meant to be small. Yeah, you were never meant to be small. And so I just want to end this interview. And Jenny, just give you one last space to give us some last words of encouragement. Because I really want to hear. I love I've loved your humor on your show and your rawnness and and and realness. Thank you for all of it today. Um, I've loved it. I've loved every minute of it. And I know that my audience and listening to this interview will love it. Because two women just being raw and real with each other, we we laid it out all bare, literally, all bare. Nobody knows why I'm saying that except Jenny C and I. And I'm gonna leave you some some space here, Jenny, to to take us, give us some last words of encouragement, and tell us how we can purchase your book, how we can support you, what you need from us.

Grace, Unity, And Final Encouragement

SPEAKER_03 42:21

I really would love for you, whoever's watching and or listening to this, to please give yourself grace. The things that we experienced before we could understand the world when we were babies was not our choices and it wasn't our control, it was out of your control. And you need to forgive yourself for any decisions and beliefs that you brought into up until today. And you have to understand you actually have a choice to shift your life. You do, all the power is with you, and when you reconnect with your definition of what God is, that's really important. Because you don't you're not meant to do it alone. I'm sorry, like you're just not. The four astronauts just that just came back to Earth came back home safely by the grace of God, because I know it's science. My voice always breaks when I'm about to hit a truth, and it's just I just hit a truth. The scientists measured to the point oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh digits of of physics to make sure that they came back into Earth's atmosphere at the exact moment they needed to, although they would have exploded or bounced back out into space. It was so intricate. Yes, they were in danger until they landed in the water. Even when they were in the water, there were also dangers of the capsule rolling over and all the astronauts drowning before they could be safely retrieved out. Every moment of that was protected. You have to understand there were so many ways everything could have gone wrong. I'm old enough to have been remembering the challenger that exploded in. Takeoff and watching it in school. Some of you may not know what I'm talking about lookup challenge explosion on YouTube if you understand what I'm saying. There were millions of children watching, and there was a school teacher on that shuttle that died instantaneously with the rest of the crew. To have these people come back safely and be these amazing people talking about how they were us and we were them, that we're all connected. We're in a pivotal part of humanity where we're supposed to reconnect with bigger than us. Know that you're not alone. You're really not. Even if you feel like it and you see aloneness, you're actually not alone. We're here for you. Sylvia's here for you anytime. I'm here for you. You can find my book. Uh, what is my book? Outside in Recovery, uh, Dancing My Way Back to Myself After Breast Cancer. You can go to my Dance to Heal podcast. And I always have guests like Sylvia, which you need to come to my podcast by the way. So I gotta make sure you snipe send me the links. The report has been set, so it's like, okay, please come to my podcast. You can always go to my monthly masterclasses. They're subsidized by a 501c, so they're free to the public. And we dive deep into how do you connect with God through your body. Because really, it's your tuning fork, folks. And how do we fully be in the moment? I I want that for you. You have that's your birthright.

SPEAKER_01 45:23

I got chills, literally. And they're not multiplying, by the way. But I did as you were speaking, Jennings. I I just did.

SPEAKER_02 45:31

I know that I kept visualizing the world from the perspective of the astronauts.

SPEAKER_01 45:42

And I I read something recently, one of them said it there's no us or them, there's no division here.

SPEAKER_02 45:50

All you see is a blue planet in the midst of like this expansiveness. We're all his children. She's my sister, Jenny C's my sister in Christ, and my brother is you know, they're all around me. I don't compete with you guys, I co-collaborate. Just like we co-collaborate with Christ himself, we co-collaborate with each other.

SPEAKER_01 46:21

The gifts he's giving you, the gifts he gave Gen D, the gifts he gave me in in writing and expressing and being on these interviews and being hosts, we weren't meant to keep it for ourselves, for our own selfish ways. And I know that the fallen world keeps telling you that message over and over. Oh, it's yours. Mine, mine, mine. We don't share. You need to compete. You have to wonder who really is pulling the strings.

SPEAKER_02 46:53

And I don't mean human-wise, I mean spiritual-wise.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

Satan is alive and well in this world, and he has been pulling the strings for far too long, and we've allowed him to twist our thoughts around against our brothers and sisters.

SPEAKER_02 47:13

It has to stop with us, it ends with us.

SPEAKER_01 47:17

We need to put an end to it. Because the messages that she and I are being downloaded day in and day out by God Himself is there has to be unity.

SPEAKER_02 47:29

That's the only way to break that that spell, that that energy that is surrounding all of us, that negative, hateful division energy out there.

SPEAKER_01 47:45

And it's across the world.

SPEAKER_02 47:47

This isn't just here in the United States, this is everywhere. We are all one body of his. We're all his children. She's as much of a daughter of the king as I am.

SPEAKER_01 48:02

We're equal in his eyes. There is no favoritism here, and I want you guys to hear that from me directly because that is a message that was downloaded to me not too long ago to share on the podcast.

SPEAKER_02 48:16

He does not have favorites. You cannot buy yourself into his good graces, you cannot do it through your good deeds or your faith. Okay, you already have his love, you don't need to achieve it. You do need to believe.

SPEAKER_01 48:46

That is the good news. That is what it's so unrealistic to some of us because we grow up in a world where achieve, achieve, or you don't get entrance. That's why it was an upside down kingdom when he came on earth. It was so backwards the way he did it. They needed the rules at the beginning of time, they needed that because we were so fallible, we kept messing up. They needed those rules to keep them in line. But then when Christ came in, everything turned upside down, but in our favor. That's why it's good news. We don't have to work so hard, but we do need to get out of his way, that's for sure. And if you got anything from this podcast interview with Jenny C and I is get out of God's way.

SPEAKER_02 49:35

Do your purpose on purpose. Those gifts he gave you, give them.

SPEAKER_01 49:42

Give them to others, let them receive it and learn how to receive.

SPEAKER_02 49:47

By the way, for those high achievers listening, our biggest issue is receiving, receiving rest, receiving the the idea to just be loved and know that you're loved without having to earn it. You don't have to earn it. He loves you, anyways, and he loves you so much, and you're never alone.

SPEAKER_01 50:11

And as you know, how I sign off is to remember Matthew 5.14 to be the light, be the light like Jenny C was a light tonight, today. She shined it so brightly and with so much humor. It was so fun. Jenny, thank you so much for joining us on release that reveal purpose. And for the rest of you, have a beautiful, blessed rest of your afternoon. Love you all. Bye now.

Subscribe, Review, And Free Gift

SPEAKER_00 50:35

So that's it for today's episode of Release Doubt Reveal Purpose. Head on over to iTunes or wherever you listen and subscribe to the show. One lucky listener every single week who posts a review on iTunes will win a chance the grand prize drawing to win a $25,000 private VIP day with Sylvia Worsham herself. Be sure to head on over to Release Doubt Reveal Purpose Podcast.com and pick up a free copy of Sylvia's gift and join us on the next episode.