Kate Kindersley founder of African artisanal homeware brand, Hadeda talks butter, tahini addiction and marrying a kind man

Kate Kindersley founded Hadeda, a unique home collection sourced from artisans across fashion, ceramics, art, weaving, beading and carpentry from Africa and around the globe.  Kate grew up between Africa and the UK. The business is informed by a belief in the enduring value of craft and design over mass production.

In this episode Kate and Sophie discuss heartbreak pizza, the power of a roast and imagine a world where you only ate Greek yoghurt!

You can find more information about this inspiring business on its website and instagram handle: 
https://hadeda.co.uk/
https://www.instagram.com/hadeda_co/?hl=en

Transcript

So Kate, it's so exciting to have you on how to cook a gremlin. For those who don't know about you and your business, you founded Hadeda, with your husband Alex, which promotes craftsmanship in Africa because you grew up between the UK and Africa and you balance all of that with four children.

I don't know how you do it. And recently you've made the move from living in Oxfordshire to moving back to Cape Town. I'd just love to know a little bit about how you came to do all these inspiring things. Firstly, Soph thanks for having me, and also, thank you for getting the pronunciation right. We are Hadeda, not Hadida. We like to compare ourselves to Nike or Nike, or Adidas. 

So actually a Hadeda is a bird found in Southern Africa. [00:01:00] Years ago pre children. We were living in Tanzania. And I had this idea for a business or a dream really to sell African handmade product that I'd seen being made on the streets and in the markets And then also I was working doing up houses in Tanzania. So I was commissioning products to be made and kept thinking, Oh my God, this is just so beautifully made.

And there was nothing really like that being sold in the UK. And we knew that we wanted to move back at some point. So when we did finally move back it took a while to actually have the courage to start the business. And when we finally did Alex had, been carrying on some work in Tanzania and he was back in the UK with me and just said, come on this is your moment. And at the beginning, he hadn't really planned to be so fully involved, but as things go we really love working [00:02:00] together. And we have very different skill sets that really compliment each other. So Hadeda was born six years ago at that stage we'd just had our third son, 

He was four months old, which seems now completely crazy that was the moment that we decided to do it. Because Alex was around more at that point, it just happened. once you begin the process of opening your business Instagram account, which I had no idea how to do.

And, beginning to look into what Shopify is and what that even means. It just it took hold quite quickly. And then I started talking to friends about it. And I think they were like, what, when did you even decide to do this? Cause I don't think I really talked about it that much.

I think I talked so much to Alex about it. I hadn't really voiced it to many people. And then we had a launch event and I just thought, Oh I've got one container of beautiful products. So lots of handmade cane from Malawi, [00:03:00] baskets from Zimbabwe, ceramics from South Africa. We had one 20 foot container that was all pretty stressful.

It was meant to arrive two weeks before the dinner that we had planned in Charlbury in Oxfordshire and it was delayed as now I've learned so much about shipping. But at that time we just presumed, Oh, it would be a bit late. And we had press coming. We had the editor of Elle Decoration coming.

And it didn't arrive till the night before the dinner. So it was crazy stressful, I thought I was going to have to cancel. Anyway, it did arrive So we hit the ground running and the response was incredible.

 I was really blown away by the sales that we received and the pre orders and people wanting more.

And I'd thought, Oh we're just going to be doing a little market stand in fairs. And we realized that's not what this was going to be. And we just put everything into it and went for it and it grew really quickly. Timing wise [00:04:00] was quite good for an ecom business because it was pre the pandemic and we had decided to invest in a really good website.

We put quite a lot into that and the photography. By the time the pandemic hit, we'd already got really wonderful website. And actually the one thing it didn't really affect was shipping routes between the UK and Cape Town.

So we were able to carry on shipping and products were selling really well online. Actually it really helped us grow our business at a time where sadly small businesses weren't able to survive or certainly not grow. We were probably in one of the only industries that actually flourished.

That really helped that we were able to be at home in a sense and manage that together because I was working with Alex and we were at that time with my parents because we'd come back from Tanzania and we hadn't bought our own house yet. So we had extra help with childcare, which is always useful.

I would say when I [00:05:00] could have looked back on those early days, having that support network in my, number one, obviously my husband, but in my family was paramount to where we are now. And, it does raise a fam, raise, what's it, raise a, take a village, exactly, that's what I was thinking, it does take a village to raise a family, certainly by the time you decide to have a fourth which obviouslyit's a lot of children, but it's wonderful, we love it.

What do you think connected with your potential consumers that meant that you did so much markedly better than you ever envisaged for Hadeda? 

when you buy a beautiful woven basket made in Zimbabwe and they use the recycled plastic they find in the villages to bring in colour and it takes, one lady a day to make that basket, there's just something so magical about having that on your wall.

And, whilst it is also beautiful and you're going to love it. it definitely adds to [00:06:00] it. It's been really important for us to pull it together so that it's accessible to the British home.

And they can shop a whole look if they want or just have one basket. And it works in any aesthetic.

What makes your business so unique is that the pieces, look really beautiful in a house in London and you manage to balance that aesthetic. is that how you saw the business from the beginning.

I am half English and I am half South African. And have lived, across Eastern Africa. 

 That comes through, I think quite strongly in my vision. And. I think that people, hopefully that's what they're buying into. 

What's your relationship with food? With a big family, do you eat out or is cooking quite central to how you live?

Yes. We don't love eating out with the kids and actually now our youngest is turned three that's certainly become [00:07:00] easier and they just think it's the most exciting thing to be going out for dinner with us. So when we're on holiday, we'll probably do that more. We tend to, try and eat with the children.

It means I only have to cook one meal rather than two. And we're lucky that they're pretty adventurous in what they eat. So they'll quite happily eat a chicken casserole with some fennel in it. If I chop it quite finely,

Impressive. 

Yes. And then, Saturday mornings are always about a big breakfast or brunch.

So yes, we do a lot of brunches on the weekend which kind of means that I can cook less meals. 

I wouldn't say we're foodies, Alex and I like to go out to restaurants, but a lot of the time it just doesn't fit with family lifeNow, we've known each other for quite a few years, so we've seen each other through a fair share of heartbreak. What is a recipe or a dish that has helped you get through heartbreak?

Oh, I can [00:08:00] definitely think of moments of heartbreak and going out for a pizza with friends or I just remember my cousin once taking me to some, I think it's quite a famous pizza restaurant in Knightsbridge. It's like in a basement somewhere. I cannot remember the

god, I know the one. Pizza Pomodoro.

Exactly. And I remember him taking me there. If not once, if not twice, definitely once. And a moment of either my heartbreak or possibly his another time. And that was yeah, a pizza. You can never go wrong with a pizza. It always just, feels, I don't know, so it's not nourishing in any way, but it feels like comforting.

Yeah, that's it. That's it.

Heartbreak. That summons up images of eating pizza and are we drinking anything with that pizza? Nice.

partial to beer and pizza, actually. I, yeah, I love, I actually really love a really hoppy beer rather than a lager. [00:09:00] Quite unusual.

And actually I guess if you're having a smart pizza then that hoppy beer is bringing out like a really nice sourdough crust. 

Definitely.

But maybe not back in the day when you were

Yeah.

pizza at

Yes, maybe not. Yes, it might have been some sangria or something. I don't know.

Yeah, for sure. Oh, the hangover

My god, it's actually turning my stomach thinking about it.

My second question is there a dish or a recipe that really evokes, a fun time, a particular celebration that stands out that really connects with that memory.

I would say maybe a roast. growing up, we'd always have a roast on a weekend and that just felt a really fun time to be together. Or we'd always have family friends over and have a long fun Sunday roast.

Celebratory, [00:10:00] I felt like oysters and a glass, nice glass of Chardonnay also, that would probably be as a grownup where I would go if I was feeling like celebrating. I'm sorry, it's not champagne. I'm not mad on champagne. I much prefer a. woody chardonnay and an oyster, which is probably not meant to go together, but I'm happy with that.

Sounds really delicious. And where would you be having your oysters, your Chardonnay? If we were in London, we've been to Colbert a couple of times for a celebratory, sitting on the street, pretending we're in Paris. I don't actually know the restaurants in Paris that well, But somewhere on a street in Paris with a lovely bottle of something and some oysters watching the world go byThat

Heavenly.

Yeah. And the roast, what roast are we talking? Is that chicken A chicken. I'd really love, I love a roast chicken. Beautifully roasted chicken. All the trimmings and it's your mom cooking that.

She is, and she was a really, is sorry, mom. [00:11:00] She is a really good cook. And does the best roast. I am not sure I've quite perfected her roast potatoes. She's definitely got the knack.

And so what makes an incredible roast? You mentioned the roast potatoes, 

Crispy, yeah, crispy roast potatoes, cauliflower cheese, quite old school, bread sauce.yeah.

probably what we used to have when we were in Cape Town growing up with my grandparents who we always used to stay with when we were here. And that was their celebratory meal would be a roast and they'd always, the table would be perfectly laid and we'd have the, the silver.

Napkin rings with our, we all have our own napkin ring and that's where we were sitting and it was just really old fashioned and wonderful. And that always makes me feel warm and fuzzy and, happy.

Yeah, that sounds so happy making. It's really interesting to hear you say that you are having roasts in

[00:12:00] Africa . 

Yes. Funny. Because it's quite old fashioned or it was at the time, South Africa, There's definitely an old school sort of element to it. Now it's changed, so much people would be having a braai, but maybe it was just my grandparents were quite sort of English South Africans.

Yeah, we used to have they used to have soup. Roast every Sunday and soup every evening. Throughout the whole week they'd have soup. They'd have the same very sort of creatures of habit.

As time goes on, less people will remember a roast as fondly as we do. It does feel quite a generational thing, but my kids also love a roast. We will always sit and have a roast with them on a Sunday night, like a five o'clock,

And they love it. It's a nice end to the weekend.

Are you quite a purist when it comes to roast condiments? 

I think purists also may be not that adventurous or confident and also I suppose with the children if you do decide to think out of the box and add something really exciting in, then they're like, Oh, I don't like that. 

Are you eating ketchup with a roast?

Oh [00:13:00] no.

That was a straight no. Absolutely

Definitely not. No, we're definitely just having good old fashioned gravy.

Okay. So coming on to your next dish, what dish do you cook or turn to when you're thinking about health and something that's restorative or makes you feel really great? 

Lentils or some beans, so it's really quick and simple to make. And I always

feel like if anyone's feeling a little bit under the weather or just needs a littlenourishment I'll make that and the kids will eat that with us if I add lots of noodles and a little bit of tamari sauce.

Are you making a broth from chicken bones or,

Yes from chicken bones and then I add in some vegetables as well andif I don't have time then I'll always have some in the freezer, either that I've made before or they make over here, so it's just like a quick pick me up and just feels really nourishing.

Yeah, and so versatile as well. Yes, exactly, I use it [00:14:00] in cooking, so I'll put some in their bolognese sometimes. Yeah, I use it a lot.

Sounds like your 

kids are pretty adventurous.

Yes, they are actually. The older two will have a couple of oysters. They, yeah, they're up for it. They're up for trying things. I probably ram broccoli down their throats too much, but but they're pretty adventurous and good at eating healthy meals.

 I think. It's really important for them to be taught that there is good food out there. So often you sit at a restaurant and the kid's menu is like burgers and chicken nuggets. And yeah, and you just think that's what they're thinking is food. It's not really food.

Yeah, and also as a parent, there's something must be a bit smugly satisfying about having kids that will eat delicious food when you go out or around other people. It's yes, I've done a good

A little bit. Of course it will 100 percent backfire most of the time and they'll [00:15:00] be like, what? I'm not eating this.

Yeah.

Pass the chips. And on to our next question the key theme of this podcast is how food can really punctuate your life. And it's definitely got me through some challenging times, but I was wondering, is there a dish, a recipe, or a memory of food that's either brought joy or comfort.

I've always gone back to a really good Thai green curry. If I was wanting to make an effort to cook something that I really enjoyed, that I knew most, I'd probably cook a Thai green curry because I feel like that's, I've perfected that.

So do you make a little paste?

Yeah, make a little paste with lemongrass and, oh my goodness, I can't even remember what's in it now. Bit of ginger?

Bit of ginger, that's it.

Chilli garlic,

Chilli garlic. Can't go wrong.

Can't go wrong with the triumvirate. It's true though, isn't

And a lot of coconut. Yeah. And a [00:16:00] good coconut cream or milk. So I love that. I actually, I find completely opposite here. The meat is so amazing.

You can really buy such good quality grass fed beef and we're eating a lot of fillet steaks here, which for years I didn't fancy eating meat. And I think quite a lot of people are the same, but I've turned back to that. And I think in terms of supporting me stressed trying to run a business and having four kids, I sometimes really feel like I just need to eat some meat and that really does keep me going.

The iron or, the vitamin B in the meat. And also I love it. So that's probably answers your question better, but yeah, a good fillet steak. 

 I definitely have moments and I wonder whether it's hormonal where I do really crave a steak and it feels like a treat.

Yes. Absolutely.

Spend some [00:17:00] money on buying a delicious piece of meat and really savour it and feel like that's quite different from what I normally eat,

Yes. I was definitely more plant-based for a lot of my pregnancies. I couldn't bear the thought of eating meat until, I had my daughter, Luca, and was really unwell with her, just with terrible morning sickness. And I think after that I felt so depleted. Having a good quality fillet steak or sirloin, ribeye, whatever is going to be honest.

I think that really helped rebuild me. And I definitely think when you're stressed I find it quite grounding. as you say, in a way, You do really savor it. Because you're not eating a huge amount of it and it's, and it feels like a treat, you just really take your time to enjoy it. And it's quite simply cooked, and I like it rare. So it's quick. It's quick!

Me too. So quick and really delicious. I'd be interested to know [00:18:00] whether you are better at listening to your body. When it comes to what you're eating, because that's what it sounds like from what you were saying about eating after Luca, 

Yes, definitely. I think As I've got older, I don't think certainly those, the pizza eating sangria days, I was definitely not thinking about how I felt. I wasn't listening to how my body was feeling. And now I think I'm so much more in tune as I've got older with how I feel on a day to day basis.

So I certainly think I eat depending on that. There were definitely some days, again, hormonally where you just can't stomach a heavy meal. You wouldn't want to have a heavy meal because your body's just saying, actually, that's not what I need. And maybe you need to snack that day and just listening to that and and being a bit more gentle on yourself.

Yeah, I think, there's a time and a place for everything, isn't there? But definitely in my [00:19:00] 20s, I was much less fussed about the mind body connection, and it was about fueling, getting mainly a caffeine rush,

As you get older, you are more intuitively in touch with your body and your feelings and food is such a huge part of all of that, 

And I think about it all the time because I'm feeding four mouths that I'm responsible for.

 I always do look at you and think, how does she look so bright and glowing? And as you say, feed all those mouths, run that business. So, day to day, how are you doing that? It feels like a lot of the time I'm doing it really badly. I'm lucky that I have a good companion in Alex, we're very

even in our responsibilities. So we co parent and we co work and that [00:20:00] really helps. Weirdly, I would say having four kids sometimes means that They actually just get on with their own lives.

They're quite kind of self contained. They'll entertain each other. So I don't have to do a lot of entertaining with them. Obviously we take them to do things, but sometimes you think how mad having a big family, but weirdly, I actually think it's sometimes easier. And they're all quite close in age.

So they have playmates all the time and they actually don't fight that much. So I'm not breaking up. Arguments all the time, which I think must be exhausting. And then I kind of work in and around them. And I, yes, I work in the evenings quite a lot in the weekends quite a lot, but I've got into a bit of a rhythm and I've got really great people that work for us.

And so that really helps.

Yeah, typically understated from you there. A quick fire round, what is the toughest lesson that you've learned in life?

 I would say to trust myself. certainly in the last monthsWe've had a lot of changes within the business.[00:21:00] 

We've obviously moved to Cape Town. We've done some homeschooling, we've really made decisions where you've just had to put your blinkers on and not care what other people think. And also not look for other people's approval. So that's been my biggest lesson.

Trust yourself,

Trust yourself.

I like that. What's the best piece of life advice you've ever been given? 

 My grandmother always said to me to marry a kind man and I feel like I really did marry a kind man and that stands me in good stead to do all the things that I've been able to do

That's a great one. What's your biggest food turnoff? 

not mad on fried food. Like the smell of anything frying. I'm not keen on.

Like deep fried.

You're not having a deep fried Mars bar anytime soon.

Definitely not. That's just the smell of it turns my stomach. 

And what's your food turn on? 

a lot of the foods that I love are often just naturally quite [00:22:00] healthy. I'm just drawn towards healthy, crisp, fresh food. Having said that, I've talked about roasts and Pizza.

pizza. I'm not sure I've talked about any raw vegetable at all, but Yeah, I love something fresh and citrusy something with a crunch,

Yeah, really fresh. What is your favorite restaurant or cafe?

there's a restaurant here in Cape Town called Haut Bay that I love going to sorry, it's called the Harbour House in Haut Bay, it's right on the rocks, you can smell the sea, you can often see whales and dolphins, and they just sell beautifully put together fish and oysters.

And it's family orientated, relaxed, but just invokes happy memories.

Oh, I want to go there now. Which, I want to come. I'm there. What ingredient couldn't you live without? Butter. Butter.

yes. I'm with you.

smothered on everything. everything cooked in butter.

[00:23:00] If you were a food, what food would you be?I might be an apple. It looks like something really simple and every day, I'm not saying that's what I look like, 

it's understated

maybe that's what I was going for. It's understated, but it's hearty and it's good for you 

Everybody loves an apple.

Everyone loves an apple, even though they don't think it's their favourite, 

Yeah.

They revisit it and they think, what was I doing without the

Yeah.

in my life? I

I think I've answered a terrible answer.

I really like it. What's your weirdest food habit? 

I love tahini, so I will often put raw tahini on everything. I love tahini. I just love it. I love it on vegetables, on salads, so people think I'm quite mad, but I I'm quite addicted to tahini for some reason. I can't really put my finger on why, 

I'm Sophie and I'm tahini addict too.

oh, I'm so glad. I'm so glad.

Otherwise it

you [00:24:00] whip yours.

No, ooh, how do I do that?

I might be about to change your life. So I went to a demonstration with the chefs at Honey and Co, which if you've never been, they actually own about three restaurants now in London. There's Honey and Co, Honey and Smoke. I think Honey and Spice, might've got that wrong.

Ottolenghi restaurants. And I didn't realize this either, but you whip tahini. What that means is you mix tahini with cold water and salt and a bit of lemon juice, whenever you're using it, and basically it doubles in volume and becomes really silky and moussey and it'll change your tahini game.

I'm in big trouble

Yeah. You're in big trouble now. What is the one thing that if you could only eat for the rest of your life, you would eat?

I love [00:25:00] a really thick and creamy Greek yogurt.

most evenings will have some Greek yogurt before I go to bed. I'm not sure how I would survive, but,

I was going to say, don't know what you'd look like after that, but hey,

I would be happy. I'd be really happy. I could put it on as a face mask as well as, okay.

final question for you is if you were having a dream dinner party, who would be your dream three dinner party guests alive or dead? 

I would have to have Nelson Mandela and it doesn't have to be someone famous.

Whoever you like.

I would have my South African grandmother, because she passed away before I really got to know her. And

Is Alex invited?

Oh, I see. They don't have to be dead. Oh yeah, I did say alive or dead

Alive or dead?

Not only dead people.

oh. I might invite my grandmother that still is [00:26:00] alive then, who's 97 and an absolute hoot, and she used to get on really well.

With my South African grandmother, and I never really saw that. 

I could invite Alex, but I hang out with him all the time and have dinner with him all the time.

Yeah, you can just tell him about it afterwards. Kate, thank you so much. 

Oh, thanks for having me. So nice to see you and chat to you.

So lovely to see you and chat to you and to hear more about your inspiring life and how many wonderful things you're doing at the moment. So I've really enjoyed it. It's been so much fun.