Leveraging Leadership

Outsmarting Imposter Syndrome: Rewiring the Brain for Confidence in 3 Steps

• Emily Sander • Season 1 • Episode 135

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Emily chats with Tara Halliday about achieving effortless confidence by eliminating conditional worth and threat perception. Tara explains how her Inner Success Program helps people, including Chief of Staff Emily, overcome imposter syndrome, providing real-life examples and a three-step approach. They discuss Tara's book, "Outsmart Imposter Syndrome," and how accepting oneself reduces the weight of others’ opinions.

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Who Am I?
If we haven’t yet before - Hi👋 I’m Emily, Chief of Staff turned Executive Leadership Coach. After a thrilling ride up the corporate ladder, I’m focusing on what I love - working with people to realize their professional and personal goals. Through my videos here on this channel, books, podcast guest spots, and newsletter, I share new ideas and practical and tactical tools to help you be more productive and build the career and life you want. 

Time Stamps:
00:25 Meet Tara Halliday: Imposter Syndrome Specialist
00:48 Defining Imposter Syndrome
02:30 Personal Experiences with Imposter Syndrome
03:13 High Achievers and Imposter Syndrome
05:15 The Root Cause of Imposter Syndrome
07:02 The Role of the Amygdala
08:44 Steps to Reprogram the Brain
16:50 Symptoms and Behaviors of Imposter Syndrome
24:04 The Inner Success Program

Welcome back to Leveraging Leadership, where we unpack the art of business leadership. I'm your host, Emily Sander, Chief of Staff turned Executive Leadership Coach. This show is all about finding your points of greatest influence and leveraging them to better serve those around you.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Tara Halliday is a specialist in imposter syndrome. She is a holistic therapist and coach for over 21 years and is the author of outsmart imposter syndrome and unmasking the coach's guide to imposter syndrome. Tara, welcome to the show.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

much, Emily. Lovely to be here. Yeah.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So we'll start with a small question of. What is imposter syndrome? And I have my like working definition, but from a specialist like you, uh, what, how would you define imposter syndrome?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

So imposter syndrome is the secret feeling of being a fraud when you're not a fraud. with that of being found out or judged to be a fraud or assumed to be a fraud. it leads to a whole bunch of different behaviors that people do, experiences they have, and it massively slows people down holds them back and shows up mostly in high achievers. 70 percent of high achievers show it shows up at work, experience imposter syndrome at some point in their lives.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Wow. Wow. Yeah, there's so much to unpack there. But the first thing I wanted to key in on is that it's, it's not an assessment based on facts or anything in reality. So it's very much manufactured in between your ears. Um, and sometimes there's things where. Legitimately, we are not qualified to do like, Emily, go perform heart surgery or go fly to Mars. Like, no, I'm not qualified to do that. That's not me having imposter syndrome. Uh, that's me being prudent and smart. Um, but this is very much, you know, you are qualified. You do belong at the table. You do have something to say, but yet you don't feel like it.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

And it's not a lack of awareness of your strengths. I mean, you can know intellectually that you're capable, incompetent, you can do that job, but internally, you're just not feeling it. So imposter syndrome is when those two things clash and that's what creates all the stress.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yes. Interesting. And I remember when I first got promoted, uh, it was a director level, but it meant that I was part of the, the executive team meeting and the CEO was leading it and as, as normal, you would go around red, uh, round Robin style and get updates from everyone. When it got to my turn, I could, I could feel my heart beating and I was like, I don't belong here. Everyone's saying professional words. Everyone's decades older than me. And I literally said. No update and look down and like, hope that people just pass to the next person. And I felt like there's no way I belong at this table. And yes, I was the most junior and yes, I was the youngest, but you know, people had to work with me and say, you're on the team for a reason, and we actually need you to represent your team here. So you mentioned high achievers. Um, I'm wondering kind of how you would, how you would. Define that. Um, I think a lot of people listening to this show are in business. They're driven, they're ambitious. They are top performers. They are looking for that edge to get better. And so for them, 70 percent might have some, um, experience with imposter syndrome, you're saying,

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

absolutely right, yeah. So had the experience when you're just starting a new role and that's a common trigger. But a lot of people think imposter syndrome is, is just that, when you're new at something. And they when you get more and more

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Go away.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

away, it will go. And the thing is, it doesn't. So I, I work with executives almost exclusively and their average age is 45. So by the time they come to me, they've noticed this repeated pattern and they haven't managed to out succeed the imposter syndrome, right? This idea that if I get successful enough, I'll finally prove it to myself. And that's kind of what the underlying thought is. And it, and it simply doesn't happen. I mean, we have, I mean, in the. Acting world, we have Meryl Streep, who has won more acting awards than anyone else on the planet. Yet, she's expressed her imposter syndrome and she said, When we start filming at the beginning of a new film, I think, Why would anyone want to come and see me? And so it does, it just doesn't go away with more, more awards or more experience. And that's, that's probably the most distressing part of it. Because we hope it will.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah. Okay. So if Meryl Streep has imposter syndrome, which she is masterful, one of my favorite actresses, um, how, how do you get, is get rid of the right term? How do you overcome, get rid of imposter syndrome?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

to, to get rid of it, you have to know what it is first, and you have to, have to define it. I said there's, there's symptoms, and I can go into what those symptoms are, but, but underneath all of those symptoms, there's a root cause. Now, the root cause of imposter syndrome is, is actually, it's a really, really common belief. It was found Dr. Carl Rogers in the 1950s, like one of the granddaddies of personal psychology. And he, he went on this little quest to find out why, why when we have food, clothing, shelter, you know, when we're safe, why do we still suffer? Why do we still feel uncomfortable? And he found it. He found the reason there's this one belief, which is like a hiccup during childhood, right? Not, not poor parenting, not bad childhood. Right. Yeah. 99. 999 percent of people across the globe have it, but it's this belief that our worth as a person depends on what we do, like

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Hmm.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

self and who we are and our actions are the same. So if we do something good, we are good. If we do something bad, we are bad. that is a very, very, very important belief. precarious position for the brain and that's what's causing it. So we can get rid of imposter syndrome and the way that we do it is to change that belief.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So it's, is it uprooting that belief? And saying, okay, uh, it's, it's kind of like, I don't want to say on merit because, um, you want to do things for, for a merit sake, but, but if I do something good, I am a good person. And if I do something bad, I am a bad person. That's the, that's the baby belief that we all get implanted with at a young age. And so is it, is it about uprooting that or is it about replacing that or tweaking that? How do you approach that?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

actually we approach it from science. We were looking at where do we hold things, store things in our brain. And there's a particular part of the brain called the amygdalas, the fear center of the brain. It's about here on both sides. And, um,

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

The reptile.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

It's this particular belief, the amygdala has, if you like a list of dangers, so like tiger, spider, snakes, fire, right? Basic things like that. And then it's gotten, you know, and it creates this list automatically. And this belief gets lodged in, in the amygdala. in order to change it, we have to. deprogram the amygdala, right? So we're, we're talking about a very specific process that we have to go through in, in the brain. You've involved neurochemicals and all sorts. Um, but yeah, so that, so we are replacing the belief that our worth is conditional with a belief that our worth is unconditional, and we do that. Then you're free, because if you make a mistake, it doesn't make you a bad person. If you, if you, you know, that whole idea of learning rather than blaming yourself for things, it naturally flows from that.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah. So you've thrown out some like big chunky words, like amygdala, which is like the reptilian part of your brain. You're like reprogram that it's like, that seems, that seems like a great thing to strive for, but it seems difficult when that is like our fear center, it's kind of survival, fight or flight, freeze, all that good stuff. So it's, it's that part of the brain. And then it's, uh, unconditional, you know, conditional, all these different pieces. Those are. big hefty thing. So how does one, uh, how does one go about that?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

Right. So, so there's, there's, there's three, there's three parts to it, and, and, and the first is to, to get calm. Because when your amygdala is triggered, like you said, into fight, flight, or freeze, then, well, you can't do anything. The brain's not going to change when it's in emergency mode. So the very first thing you do is, is, is develop the skill of regulating your nervous system, keeping yourself calm. different people have different ways to do that, so that's a little bit of tailoring. Then to change the, the belief, actually have to take the brain through a little wave, if you like. a little process, which is how the brain actually formed the belief in the first place. Right? So there's three, three, three things that it needs. Um, it needs to be relevant. So anything that's fearful is, is relevant to the brain. Um, there needs to be surprise involved and or strong emotion. And so when you have any of those three things, it releases I'm going to get more, I'm sorry, technical in here. It releases a neurochemical called acetylcholine into the brain, which allows the amygdala to change. And when you, so what we do is we set up this step by step process. And it's not complicated. It's an exercise that we do. and we take people through deliberately through these three things that releases the and then we can reframe it. As you know, look at things in a different way and, and that changes the way that the amygdala responds to another event like that in the future. So I'm sorry, that's awful.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So you're going to like the neurochemical level of this thing. So you're, you're intentionally introducing these three, um, stimuli, these three kind of And then when the brain is in that state, is in the condition state you want, then I'm assuming you, you take it through its steps and reprogram it, so to speak, but at the neurochemical level. Those

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

fears that should be there, like and snakes, but yeah, we can keep those and fast moving cars, you know, all of that, you know, we keep intact. We're just narrowing right down on this one belief.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yes, so then connect for me. Um, so it's, it's thinking that I don't belong here. I'm not qualified. And then you were talking about distinguishing between if I do something good that I am good, if I do something bad that I am bad. So how do those interrelate?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

Well that's, that's the conditional worth belief. That's it in a nutshell, that, that we believe that our worth as person is variable and depends on what we do. Yeah.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So the outcome of the, of, of the conversation. The wave process, the outcome would be I'm no longer conditioned by that.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

That's exactly

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

So it's so,

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

that, and that's, and that's the liberating part then because you, it makes you resilient in a way that you stop worrying about whether people judging you, because, because it doesn't trigger, You know, this a good or bad danger. Yeah. Because if you go back into like from a primitive society, we lived and survived as a group. So if you were kicked out of the group, that would mean death, right? we still have that as a, as an underlying default in our, like you say, primitive brains. That, that is, that is it. So, you know, when you, when your worth is unconditional, then you're resilient to other people's judgments. You're, you're, you don't take things personally anymore. You can stay calm because less things are triggering you, which means that, you know, everything becomes easier. But you also stop. Judging yourself. So you have a deep self acceptance and a deep self compassion.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay. Yeah. There's a lot you said there too. So when you mentioned the like the. Caveman societies where if you got, if you got kicked out of the group, you were dead. So that, that is survival. So paying attention to the social cues and do people in this group like me, I think is hardwired in there. And I remember for me, I would go into board meetings. That was my big kind of, um, event where, Oh my gosh, I see these people, you know, in this format four times a year. And they are the board. And it was done, done, done. Cause they could, they could make hiring and firing, firing decisions like that. And I, I'd seen him do it. And so to me, that was literally like walking into, okay, the group's tribunal. And you know, do you, are you a survivor on the Island? Are you going to get kicked off? Did elicit that survival mechanism, um, in me for sure. And yeah. Is it once you go through that wave process and kind of reset, you mentioned self acceptance and things like that. Is that, uh, something you need to fill yourself with? So is it kind of like an emptying or neutralizing? Let's get things to baseline and then fill it with other beliefs, uh, in that, in that area or how does that work? Okay.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

that it actually kind of bubbles up naturally. The, as you go through the self acceptance, which is the opposite of self judgment, right? So you go, so as we flip the belief that our worth is conditional, we have more and more, um, self acceptance. And part of the way that we do it. Is through, um, developing first an understanding of other people and then a compassion for other people and then an understanding of ourselves and a compassion for ourselves. So it's a very structured, logical way to, to address this. It's not a, um, it's not, it's not vague.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So you're saying that that naturally bubbles up in the space that you've cleared off. So it's kind of like a well with water. And if you've put a whole bunch of rocks and dirt on it, if you clear that away, then the water will naturally spring forth and you'll naturally have these, um, I guess, naturally formed beliefs about what other people are and mean and what you are doing and what you mean.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

that's exactly it. You don't see people as a threat to you anymore. And when they're not a threat, then you interact with them in a different way. Your,

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

curiosity comes out, bubbles out. Yeah, same way. Your, your When you're less focused on worrying about what other people are judging you for, you're more present. You pay attention to the people around you more. And in you, you automatically start doing the social thing of becoming more of a mentor to your team. So rather than either worrying about them or being frustrated about them, become more, how can I help them? And so it changes people to the, not to the way they should be, but to the way they already are as, you know, a positive and impactful human being.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah. That's beautiful. Yes. And I think a lot of people, when they hear, Oh, what happens if I don't care what other people think of me in a healthy way. But if, if you went around your day or your week and your life with not caring what other people think, that frees up a lot of emotional energy that frees up a lot of space and time for you. So that just feels like, Oh, like a weight off your shoulder. So it would be amazing. That's amazing. Thank you.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

many people describe it. This is like one who said, taking off a really heavy old coat. You've And, and the way that people, so this is kind of like the end. You know, what happens when you get rid of it, when people are experiencing imposter syndrome, there's, there's three kinds of symptoms that they notice. So, um, you know, one of the symptoms is, um, imposter syndrome, thinking, feeling like you're a fraud, feeling you're not quite good enough, that self doubt, self criticism, overthinking, comparing yourself to others, feeling you've just got lucky. I've seen people who feel like they got lucky in the role that they had. And so they're convinced that if they ever. to, to go to another job, they wouldn't be accepted. So they get, they get stuck for, for years and years in a role that they have outgrown and they're very frustrated. that is the kind of thing where when you clear that away, then. Oh, okay. What would I like to do? What job, what would be exciting to me? And so that's, that's the shit. the other symptoms, uh, are around, um, the behaviors. So there's, there's behaviors where we try and make ourselves better, like perfectionism, like over

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

mm hmm,

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

These are very, very common. Um, thinking that if I get one more qualification, then that will solve everything. That there's, there's all those behaviors. And then there are behaviors like hiding, hiding, like staying out of the spotlight. So passing up opportunities for promotions on not speaking up enough in meetings, um, uh, procrastinating and, uh, and sometimes people just grit their teeth and. through, thinking, hoping that it'll all go away. So those are all the behaviours and the thinking. And then that causes, like we're saying, the fight flight freeze, physiological response that affects people's sleep, emotional mood, everything. So that's, that's why imposter syndrome can often look quite messy. Okay, because all of them, but their own combination of all of those.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah. As you're going through, I was like perfectionism, check overthinking, check all these different things. Like, yep. And I've seen, I've had clients who have so many qualifications. It's like alphabet soup behind their name and they always want one more. They never feel good enough. I'm like, um, when you have two PhDs, I think you're doing okay in that category. Yeah. Um, but, uh, but yes, it's, it's so funny how the mind works. A lot of people go, Oh, imposter syndrome. What you need to do is, um, Tell yourself that you are good enough and say all these mantras and affirmations and things, and you say, no, those actually aren't, um, effective. So can you give us your take on, on why affirmations don't work?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

Yeah. Well, so, so, when you're saying affirmations, actually what you're doing is, you know, you stand in the mirror and say, I am enough, right? There's classic one. what you're doing is you're bringing your attention to a particular idea. And there's a part of the brain called the reticular activating system. Yeah. Right. And the RAS. And, um, this puts your attention on what you want it to. So back to caveman times, if you were looking for food, you'd be paying attention to the leaf, carrot leaves, right? You, so there's all this jungle all around you and there's a carrot. Right? So that, that's what the, the, uh, reticular activating system does. That's what an affirmation does. So you, you on something, tell yourself something, yeah, it'll, it'll keep bringing it up. So that's how affirmations work. Do they work when you try to convince the amygdala that this is not true? No, because the amygdala says, Hey, I've lived this long, right? This list of threats has kept me alive. No, no, no, we're not changing this. is why we had to go through that whole process with the wave of generating the acetylcholine and the leaf

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

very specific way.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So is that like the amygdala almost overriding all the other parts Affirmation pieces. Cause the affirmation kind of like the amygdala is like the core. I mean, that's what we had when we were like back in, like, they call it the reptilian part of the brain because it is like the base part and then we have the neocortex neo new, so that's our higher level thinking, but when we are reverting back to our instincts, we're back in like our amygdala and that's kind of overriding when we're in that state. Is that, is there something in there about that?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

very fair to say. Um, you know, the, the, the Amygdala's developed its, its list of these threats through your life, through, from a whole variety of, of inputs, and some of them it's developed automatically. And if you like, that's, that's, that's great. The brain's treasure, right? The

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

the state.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

brain is a predictive machine. That's one of the latest theories of consciousness actually. You know, the whole point of having such a crystal clear model of the universe is to be able to predict what's going to happen in the next few seconds, hours, days to keep you as safe as possible. the

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yes,

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

that is, the safer you're going to become. That's, that's the hard wiring of the brain. So the amygdala holds on to some of those lists of dangers. ain't letting them go. Yeah,

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

it's like the master list is like if anything is on that amygdala list, you can add something to like the surface level like affirmations, but it's not penetrating the

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

exactly. So, so if the amygdala doesn't believe it, then the

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

It ain't good.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

work. If the amygdala does believe it, Then that affirmation's gonna be helpful. But if the

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Right.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

does believe it, then you wouldn't need to do the affirmation in the first place.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yeah. So for a lot of people, it's kind of like bouncing on the surface. It's like you can do that all day long, but if you really want to do it, you have to get into the process that you described, which is kind of at the, at a deeper level, have to take a deep dive,

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

that.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

um, into that. Okay.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

that's

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay. Our affirmation. So our affirmations, if you haven't done that deep work, are they actually. Is it counterproductive because you're drawing attention to something that's just going to rile you up or is it like, uh, like it doesn't really do anything but you're not, you're not making any headway.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

Yeah. They, it, it can actually rile things up. I mean, one of, one of the, you know, there's. There's lots of opinions out there about what to do about imposter syndrome. One is to become aware of your strengths, for example. I

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

yeah. Yeah.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

morning read through his list of strengths that he made to try and convince himself that he was good enough. And it was so frustrating. I mean, he was almost in tears because it's like, I'm doing this. It's not working. And he felt helpless. He felt like. I don't know what to do. I can't change this. And it's okay. You're just using the wrong tool. You know, you're using a screwdriver where you should have a hammer.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

And so you, so you take people through and in your training and your coaching and your programs through the, the three stimuli and putting them in a condition state that you want. And then kind of what happens from, from there, not, not saying to give away your program, but you know, kind of, if someone is interested, what else would be involved in that process at a, at a high level?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

we've got three, three steps to the first is to get calm, get that tailored, neuro regulation. regulating the nervous system. Then we do the um, belief change. So, you know, we clear the belief, the the wrong belief by by going through this process quite a few times. different scenarios. So it's, it's, it's not, yeah, it's not therapy. not, but it's very helpful. It's, it's a lot of, there's a lot of letting go involved in it. And then the third step is really creating new habits. All those, all those things that you've tried to do before, all these, you know, great techniques for, for, you know, a peak performance. When you clear that block. that conditional worth belief is, is forming, then you look at it in different ways. So we develop, you know, um, we look again at values and authenticity and, and, and really refine the way in which you want to lead as a leader. So it's, it is a whole complete development program.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yes. And so how long does that process take altogether?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

uh, so it's eight modules and the fastest you can do it as eight weeks. Uh, so there's,

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

there's, there's, there's exercises to do. There's videos to watch to understand, there's exercises to do, and there's a one to one session. Fastest you can do it is eight weeks. average is 13 weeks and the longest has been 21. I

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

just go at the speed that you get the results so that nothing skipped and that, and that gives just phenomenal results, doing complete, complete change.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Wow. Okay. So if I have it, it's get calm. I'm assuming there's like breathing techniques or something to kind of get calm baseline. And then it sounds like clearing that conditional, um, element is like different scenarios. So you're kind of, you're kind of like shining a bright light on it and saying, Hey, I see you for what you are and all these different angles and perspectives. I can see it. And then it is, uh, doing the work where, okay, now that that's that huge boulder has been cleared out. Now let's take a look at your habits and your techniques and the tactics you're using out in the world as a leader and, um, maybe replace those, but maybe just reassess them and tweak part of them, or maybe do an overhaul, but just say, okay, now what kind of tools and how do you show up in the world? Is that kind of a general funky recap there?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

very good repack. Excellent. I should take, take notes. Um, yeah. And, and, and really it's, um, making things how you want them. When you take away the conditional worth, you take away a level of. Threat perception in your brain, right? Where, where there is no threat, right? You know, so you've taken away that threat perception and it means that now you can, you, you just look at things in a different way. And so you, as you say, you kind of just tidy up and, and, and, and, and expand. And it, and it really, it feels like a blossoming, you know, effortless confidence is what people. the talk about because it's that feeling it's like you don't have to try but you're just Forgetting to doubt yourself that that's a shift and it frees up tremendous tremendous amounts of energy mental space um time of which you know, if someone's a high performer, then all of these things are absolutely precious and it's absolutely What what you want? Yeah,

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

So where can people, people want to find out more about this program or reach out to you? Um, what is, what is the best way to do that?

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

so if you go to my website, it's outsmartimpostorsyndrome. com, um, and you'll find, you'll find there's a quiz that you can take to see if you have imposter syndrome, because the first thing is, you know, Let's make sure this is imposter syndrome. currently I'm running a low cost research program where I'm training up a bunch of coaches and they are, um, they're taking clients, once they're trained, they're taking, um, Practice clients, if you like, through the, um, through this, this process, the inner success program, it's called. And, um, so I've got a low cost version for anyone who wants to experience it. Um, and, uh, so that's. the details are on the website.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Okay. And if you go to the website, um, you might hear that, uh, Tara has one of one on a word, so you're up for that shortly. You're going to a gala, you're getting all your, uh, gowns and everything ready. So tell us a little bit about that. It's for outsmart imposter syndrome. Yes.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

Yes. So, so my book published last year out, Smart and Positive Syndrome is now a finalist in the 2024 Business Book Awards, which is very exciting.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Wow.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

And, uh, as we're recording this now, the gala is two days away. Uh, so already, um, you know, the books are finalists, which is fantastic. And

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Yes.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

big, know, Oscar award style, you know, where the judges come back and they say who's won a particular category and

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Wow.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

won overall. So yes, I'll, I'll definitely put that on the website that people can find it.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

to be a finalist. That's amazing. So well done. Congratulations.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

you.

emily-sander_1_09-17-2024_090319:

Very cool. And we'll have all of those links in the show notes where to reach out to, um, get in touch, where to buy the book, where to look into the programs and all the rest. So I know imposter syndrome is a huge topic for a lot of our listeners and they are driven and they want to lead well and serve their teams and be good for the people around them. And I think, you know, effortless confidence and having more time and energy, um, are huge, are huge pieces that people will benefit a lot from. So thank you once again so much for being on.

tara-halliday_1_09-17-2024_170319:

pleasure. Thanks very much, Emily.

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