The Blacktail Coach Podcast
We're here to share tips, strategies, and stories of hunting the Pacific Northwest.
Whether you're a seasoned hunter or just getting started, we'll help you turn preparation into achievement and passion into results.
So gear up and get ready, because SUCCESS IS NO ACCIDENT!
The Blacktail Coach Podcast
How To Hunt Blacktail Across Rut Phases
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Most hunters circle “the rut” on the calendar, then spend the best days wondering why their biggest buck disappeared. We take a step back and map the whole arc of blacktail deer hunting season, from early archery to pre-rut, full rut, and the second rut, with a simple goal: help you choose tactics that match how bucks actually behave, not how we wish they behaved.
We start with early season blacktail, when velvet and summer patterns can make mature bucks shockingly predictable. That’s where we’d rather pattern than call, using observation and trail intel to lock down entry trails, exit trails, and daylight windows. Then we dig into the “movement drivers” we track every year barometric pressure, moon phase, major weather fronts, and those game-changing 20-degree temperature drops plus how these factors can line up to create the kind of evening a giant finally shows in shooting light.
From there we move into October pre-rut strategy: when to rattle, when to grunt, why blind calling can hurt you, and why scents work best when you don’t overdo them. We also explain why the full rut can be the hardest time to target a specific mature buck, and why late season and the second rut can swing the advantage back to the hunter. With fewer does in estrus, a consistent, believable scent setup can make a buck cycle through repeatedly until he edges into daylight.
If you want a clearer plan for blacktail rut phases, late season tactics, and smarter calling and scent strategy, hit subscribe, share this with a hunting buddy, and leave a review. What part of the season do you trust most, early season or late season?
Nilch’i Wind Checks - An easy to use, must have gear addition to our hunts
Dead Down Wind
Scent Elimination Products
Tinks
Tinks Scents
Blacktail Solution
Blacktail feed supplements. Use code BTCoach for 15% through March 31 2026
Bonded Outdoors
Personalized leather tags to remember your hunts
SkullCraft Collective
skull mounting systems Ghost Hook Sale until March 31, 2026
Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.
Why Late Season Matters
SPEAKER_03Welcome back to the Blacktail Coach Podcast. I'm Aaron. And I'm Dave. This week we're talking about why we love late season. We have had some requests about covering all of the seasons and all of the ruts and phases of the rut. So we're actually going to talk about that and then answer the why we love late season, or at least why Dave loves late season. I can't go until I pick certain muzzle loading that go late season, which is really kind of hard around here because there's only one and it's all privately owned land in the battleground unit.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's it's tough now. It used to be better, but it's tough now.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. But I have a couple spots that I will try out next year and be able to do late season. So anyway, we're gonna start with early season. So this would be pre pre-rut. This is early archery season. So talk
Early Season Means Pure Patterning
SPEAKER_03about, and we want to cover would you be using scents and what are the characteristics about that particular season or part of the rut, phase of the rut, uh-huh, and what's the best way to hunt during those times.
SPEAKER_01Okay. So for me, my mindset is such that, and again, I just want to stress that this is how I feel. Yeah, I'm not saying that this is the way it is for but this is how I view this.
SPEAKER_03And you put together the system, it's geared towards hunting late season, second route, late season of archery and stuff. But first we're gonna start talking about early season. Right. So this is early archery.
SPEAKER_01Right. And the way that I feel about about early season, and in some states, archery is not the first season. Uh I know in Kansas the first season, first people into the woods are the muzzle loaders.
SPEAKER_06Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_01But my mindset about killing a big buck is this there are two times, two great times to kill a big buck.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01One is early season, and in my mind, the other one is the second rut. And the reason I say early season is because those big bucks, so long as they're still in velvet, stay in that summer pattern where they're much more visible and they're much easier to pattern. Okay. So to kill a big buck early season is not that hard because they're gonna stick to a very predictable pattern day to day. And if I maintain my observation of the five
Five Factors That Trigger Movement
SPEAKER_01factors that we've talked about before, I'll get a sh'll get a shot on that, down on that shooter buck.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So five factors again, we want to talk about it's barometric pressure, moon phase.
SPEAKER_01Moon phase, rut phase, 20 degree temperature drop, and weather fronts.
SPEAKER_03And weather fronts, yeah. Yeah. And so early season, we wouldn't be looking at any phase of the rut. So that's taken out of the equation.
SPEAKER_01So mostly moon phase, moon phase, barometric pressure, yeah, and the 20-degree swing. Yes. Okay, to the cold. And so, you know, and like this year, our pro staffer Chris killed Bambino on one of those nights. Okay, and it was the same evening I was gonna go in and hunt Bambino, or not Bambino, I'm sorry, Hightower at the locker room set, and they closed access because people were up there dumping.
SPEAKER_03Dumping garbage.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I didn't get to go. So I sat there and watched him on my camera, Hightower, daylight 40 minutes before dark.
SPEAKER_03Before dark. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So we would have killed two giants the same night.
SPEAKER_03Chris had Bambino come in maybe 20 minutes before dark that particular night. But he was looking at we had a 20 degree drop in temperature. It was red moon.
SPEAKER_01And the barometric pressure was what was it? 30 point one or something like that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but it and it was a weather front had just come through.
SPEAKER_01But the pressure was holding.
SPEAKER_03And the pressure was holding.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it wasn't dropping, it was holding. Yeah, and you know, I like 30.2 and rising, but I mean you you can kill at 29. Yeah, and you're still gonna have a good chance of it.
SPEAKER_03And I think Adam Hayes, who has the moon phase, the moon guide, who developed it, uh-huh, he likes 29.9.
SPEAKER_01I think that's what it is. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03But any any over 29.9 to 30, you start seeing that, but you really, after 30.2, you really start seeing activity.
SPEAKER_01Uh a lot of deer activity. Yeah, a lot of deer activity. That's why you when I face deer season, those are the two things that I that I'm saying. Now I get the multi-season tag here in Washington. So I'm able to hunt during the rifle, but and I go out during the rut. Okay, but to pattern a big buck during the rut is really, really difficult.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because they're not they're not patternable, they're not going to be in the same spot. He's he's seeking. When you get to that phase of the rut, whether in the seeking phase or the lockdown phase, he'll disappear off your camera for two, three weeks.
SPEAKER_03And we get that a lot. Like a lot of guys freaking out. Right. Because I've been watching this buck all through September, and he was showing up every day or every other day, or every third day, and then all of a sudden he disappears for two weeks.
SPEAKER_01And everybody thinks that the best time to kill a big buck is the rut. Well, you've got to be in the right spot at the right time. Yeah. You know, because he's not patternable. He's out chasing doughs, and and his his daily routine is different every day. His nightly routine is different every night.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So it's really difficult if you're trying to pattern a big buck to kill him at that time.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So when they're in velvet, they're out of the thick stuff, they're in the open, so they're really visible, they're easily patternable because nobody's been in the woods pressuring them. And so because our tree's the first, that's a great time to kill a big buck. The second time that I feel to kill a big buck, that is best to kill a big buck, is that second rut.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I go into that in depth in in my seminars and and you know, at boot camps and all that. But in a nutshell, there are fewer doughs in estrus. And because of that, he's easier to pull into a spot because you're offering him, we create this illusion where we're offering him does, and we're putting out, you know, obviously esterus, but we're putting out pheromones and we're putting out other buck cents, and we do it in such a way that creates this illusion that he feels like he has to be there.
SPEAKER_03And because there's more doughs to breed and there's competition.
SPEAKER_01There's competition, and he already knows that it's the second ester cycle that there's fewer does. And so if he doesn't have to travel as far to find them, it's easier to bring him in repetitively over and over.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And then getting him to daylight.
SPEAKER_03So going back to early season, because we have a lot of questions about guys who ask about calling and rattling. Uh-huh. Would this well and before I get to that, when is the approximate time when they start dropping their velvet?
SPEAKER_01So it typically I've seen it as early as as the first half of August, but generally
Rut Makes Big Bucks Unpredictable
SPEAKER_01speaking, it's the second half of August, first week or two of September. Okay. Obviously, depending on elevation and temperature and all that stuff.
SPEAKER_03Because some guys want that want to get that buttons.
SPEAKER_01They want to get that velvet buck.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Wait, and you even have one. I yeah, I've got or two. Yeah, I've got two or three, I think.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_01And stuff. And I like it and everything. I don't know. It's kind of lost its luster over the years. Yeah. The excitement of it and stuff. But and that's not to say, you know, well, he's in velvet, I'm gonna let him walk. You know, trophy's a trophy.
SPEAKER_06Exactly.
SPEAKER_01You know, so I'd I'd still like, but I just I'd like the thing I like about Blacktail is just the character, the horn color. They're either dark horned or they got that caramel look. And I just yeah, I just I love it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So early season for calling and rattling, is that would that be an appropriate time to have that in your tool bag?
SPEAKER_01It's always good to have the
When Calling Helps Or Hurts
SPEAKER_01ability to call in your tool bag, so to speak. And calling a small buck and calling a big buck can be different, uh, especially if you're rattling. Guys that elk hunt and call bulls in know that there's a difference between calling in a small bull as opposed to calling in a big bull. And I would say it's the same with with deer. Rattling sequences, the aggressiveness, recognizing when to do it, when not to do it, how much to do, or how little to do. You know, I go to Kansas, I see a buck, if he's by himself, I'm I'm immediately gonna snort wheeze at him. And I've pulled in several bucks that way, you know, but they're much more aggressive. I have seen blacktail snort wheeze, and we were just talking about that with a guy, or I was this this evening, about what we call bully bucks. And a bully buck is something that's not necessarily good for your deer herd. They're not necessarily the biggest buck, they're just the meanest buck.
SPEAKER_05Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01And they kick deer off your sets and monopolize, you know, everything and and keep other bigger bucks from coming in. So yeah, so rattling, I like to do it in the pre-rut because there are fewer doughs coming into estrus. So your dominant buck obviously checks the doughs in his core area first and then moves out of that. So if he wants to get the first dough, the first dough that come into estrus cycle, into standing estrus, and that rattling gives the perception that there's two bucks over there fighting over a dough. Or there's two bucks over there establishing a pecking order.
SPEAKER_03Okay. And does this happen during early season?
SPEAKER_01This happened. This happens during the pre-rut. So we're looking at October.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_01I don't do any calling in September.
SPEAKER_03So if we're talking about early season and art art which would just be archery here in Washington at least.
SPEAKER_01I wouldn't do any calling. I would just pattern that buck. You're just patterning the solely, solely relying on patterning that buck to find out where and w where he's at and when he's there. Right. What trail is he using to come out in the evenings? What trail is he using to go to bed in the mornings?
SPEAKER_03Because he's going to be like clockwork in early season. So that's right. It's just all about early season is all about patterning.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And it's not hard. It's not hard.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01That's the thing. Guys were like, well, I d you know, it's so hot out. Yeah, but they're going to be doing the same thing at last light, at first light, every single day. Because nobody has been out there pressuring them.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Okay. And so, and that's how, I mean, that's how Chris was able to get Bambino. He just had that pattern down. Uh, and when he saw that he had three out of the possible four factors that could be working in his favor, he told you a day or two ahead of time, I'm gonna be in stand that day because that's when he's coming in, and he did.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we were talking about it, and I says, Well, there's a 20-degree swing, and then he goes, I know they're gonna be out. I says, Well, you've also got moon phase, and uh, we have barometric pressure. And I says, You need to be in stand. He says, Oh, I know. He goes, I was planning on it. Yeah, and he ended up killing him that night instead. Yeah, my pedestal buck, that four by four, was killed September 3rd. That was an early season buck, obviously, patterned. Yeah, once you find that big one, until he loses that velvet, it'll take about a week. They don't immediately go in. Some of well, I won't say that. Some immediately go in, some don't. Typically, if they're unpressured, it'll take them about a week to two weeks before they start going back into the really thick stuff after they lose their velvet. Okay. So my pedestal buck does not have any velvet on him.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01But was out in the open and patterned him that particular season, they shed their velvet like a week before we were able to get into the woods and stuff. And so he was still out.
SPEAKER_03And then you got him. Okay, so now moving into pre-rut.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_03And so what kind of time frame is this first of October, middle of October? And I know it depends on what weather trumps everything. Weather is
Pre-Rut Scent Rules Less Is More
SPEAKER_03is the control, the biggest controlling factor for black tail going into the rut.
SPEAKER_01Right. Right. We're looking for the cooler mornings.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And once we start getting cooler mornings, and when I say cooler, when we start dipping down into the low 50s, high forties and stuff, we're gonna see some some rut activity. We're gonna see the bucks start getting ruddy.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And they'll start sparring. We get them on camera all the time in early October, and they're starting to spar a little bit. You know, they just get in and they kind of tinkle the antlers a little. And it's kind of fun to watch. They start pushing each other around. But by middle of October, the opener for rifle, if we've had any kind of weather whatsoever, yeah, then we're gonna start seeing some rud activity as far as they're really gonna start pushing each other around and whatnot. And by the end of October, it's on. Typically, it's on. This year has been phenomenal. Phenomenal. So we've had a lot of cooler mornings, and these bucks are just hammering.
SPEAKER_03So, with my sets, because I'm doing modern rifle hunting, I and I've always watched because of my particular job that I had for years where I was outdoors, I always noticed we had nice weather through that first weekend in October where it might still be hitting 70 degrees, and then it turns after that. And it really it kind of pushed a little bit longer this year into that second weekend, which was the start of the hunting season. Because I remember I went out and I had my real light. Actually, I think I just went out in a real light merino wool, the lightweight stuff, and my hex. Uh-huh. And I was plenty warm all day sitting in that.
SPEAKER_01Until the evening.
SPEAKER_03No, and actually even into the evening, I was I was fine. But by the end, I've got the heated vest on by the end of October. And it was one of those where halfway through I started doing drags and trying to manipulate, create, you know, the uh the illusion that there's a dough there, hoping to get that dominant buck in.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03And I did have the first night I had him come in and hang around my set for a while, and then I haven't seen him since because he found some other does, I guess, to lock down. And so I didn't see him after that. But I know he's there and I know he's he's working on all the does in the area. Right. So hopefully there's not a lot in that extended buck.
SPEAKER_01Right. And and and the the trick is is when it when they first start going into it, or when you think that you're gonna start seeing some rut activity, is it's the amount of scent that you put out. Okay. And what I mean by that is is that particular time of year, less is more.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. Okay.
SPEAKER_01And guys, if you approach it like that, less is more, you're gonna find that you're gonna be a lot more successful in achieving what you're desiring to do. So if you're desiring to bring more bucks into your area in that first part of the pre-rup, when we just start get less is more.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because there's not near the amount of doughs out there that are in any kind of standing esterus. And again, that's a 72-hour window. So those bucks are feeling frisky, but there's still no doughs ready to be bred.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So you don't want to overdo it. You never want to overdo it. That will always raise a red flag in the mind of the yeah, all of a sudden they've got so you know it's something that is a progression of things. You don't put it out and simply, oh hey, right away within 30 minutes, you know. Yeah. It's not scents are not made to trigger that.
SPEAKER_03And I did, I only did one run into my set. Uh-huh. And he came in following that. But it wasn't like you said, I didn't do a heavy right.
SPEAKER_01There's no dripper, there's no yeah, you know, you may put out a little bit of pheromones, but you're not there's no challenger buck.
SPEAKER_03There's it was I ran a one solo.
SPEAKER_01One drag. One solo dough, yep.
SPEAKER_03Yep. I ran that in there, and he showed up that night. So this is the time also that you would be rattling. Yes. So let's
Grunts Snort Wheezes And Bleats
SPEAKER_03talk about calls because I know there's grunts, and I heard I've and I've only heard grunts when I'm wearing my game ears. So my the magnifying ear protection for when you're out shooting, which I think are great to wear when you're out there because it helps you pick up sounds that you normally wouldn't. Always very low sound, just a few, and it's a couple of grunts, and that's it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, typically blacktail are uh, and I say typically, they're not as aggressive as White Tail, they're not as vocal as Whitetail. Typically, when you hear one grunt, he's close.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Okay. I've only seen a small handful of blacktail snort wheeze.
SPEAKER_03And I've had one last year for me.
SPEAKER_01You know, and that's not saying that I hear him blow all the time.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You know, they have a gland in the roof of their mouth, and they when they get your scent, that warning blow, that sh that you know, and typically it's small bucks and does that do that, and it's a warning to everything else out there.
SPEAKER_03So, what would a how does a snort wheeze sound different?
SPEAKER_01A snort wheeze is and I mean, if you're able to see the buck, yeah, you'll just see him just strain like every vein in his neck, okay. It's just gonna, you know, because he'll as he's blowing out air and whatnot, and you just feel the intensity of that.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01But you'll have that first inhale, exhale, yeah, a couple times. And it's just a very, very aggressive, like that buck is looking at the other. It's not a blind call, he sees that other buck, and it's a warning to him. So and he's generally within 20 yards of each other.
SPEAKER_03Okay, and that is a response to another buck, a snort wee.
SPEAKER_01Yes, it is a it's it's a dominance challenge.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_01Warning, get out of here. She's mine, kind of thing.
SPEAKER_03Okay, okay. So would you use are there doe calls or like a fawn bleat?
SPEAKER_01There's doe bleats and there are fawn calls. Larry D. Jones had a really good fawn and distress call. And guys, I tell if you want to just get a small buck or a dough, Larry D. Jones fawn and distress call is slam dunk all the time. You'll you'll pull in fork and horns and doe's like crazy to that call.
SPEAKER_06To that call. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Right. And that's a font. Larry D. Larry D. Jones fauna distress. And as far as a dough bleat, I just use that Primos dough in a can.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01But don't just, you know, guys, when you're doing a call, mix it up. Don't just turn it over and you know, blah, you know, blah, you know.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Turn it over slowly. Extend that call or shorten that call. Do something to mix it up. Don't sound like the same thing all the time. When we're calling, we're you guys are they're just you got to put effort into this kind of stuff if you want to fold. They're not stupid animals, you know. Guys that pick up their bugles, you know, a week before season that have just, I'm gonna learn how to bugle this year. And you know, they go out and they sound like a you know, like a a flute, you know, a piccolo flute or whatever, and then and it's just like, come on.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, come on.
SPEAKER_01You're you're not fooling anyone.
SPEAKER_03You have to figure it out.
SPEAKER_01You gotta put some kind of effort into it, you know. If you want it to be effective, otherwise you're just gonna get frustrated. Number one, because it's not gonna work. Number two, you're gonna frustrate everybody else out there because your bad calls are scaring everything. All you're doing is notifying the animals that that man is in the woods today. Yeah. Well, and and and not everybody's gonna be a great caller. And that's fine. That find your niche. Yeah, find your niche. You know, I as far as rattling, some guys have got that down and they they rattle in just buck after buck. I don't I've rattled in some bucks, but I don't have the confidence to solely rely on that for an entire season.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You know what I mean? I I I couldn't go to a season and say, you know, I'm gonna rattle just this year. That's all I'm gonna do is just rattle, and I know I'm gonna get a buck to come in.
SPEAKER_03But you would just be rattling pre-rud.
SPEAKER_01For me, that's what I like. I like rattling during the pre-rud.
SPEAKER_03But will they through any season they can rattle in a buck?
SPEAKER_01Pre-rud is, in my opinion, the best time to rattle.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_01Because those does aren't tired of being chased, number one.
SPEAKER_06Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01There is typically several does coming into a standing estrus. And so we see a lot of bucks getting really wound up and and chasing, seeking, and chasing.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01That's what we want.
SPEAKER_06Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Right. But as we get farther into the rut, I feel like it's almost detrimental to rattle. Because if I don't see that buck and see that he's by himself, then I'm blind calling. If I'm blind calling and I've got a buck targeted and he's coming into my set, but he's following a doe and she's tired of being chased by bucks, yeah. I start rattling, she'll turn and go the other way. She'll turn and go the other way. She doesn't want to take and be chased by more. She's already got a buck on her tail. She doesn't want two more.
SPEAKER_03And she'll take that buck.
SPEAKER_01She'll take my target buck with her. Okay. So it's like, well, I never even saw him. Well, there you go.
SPEAKER_03So if you heard, let's say, because I've like I said, I've heard a couple of buck grunts. Real quiet, not real loud. And typically they're not. Would that be an appropriate time to respond to that with a call of some sort? Or is it just you let him walk because you you're going to see I always like getting a visual, Aaron. Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01You know what I mean? I I mean, I could say either way, yes or no, it's a good time, it's not a good time. I gotta be honest, I'd be guessing on that one. I like the visual confirmation before I throw a call out at a buck. I want to see that he's alone.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01If I see that he's alone and I know that there's not a dough with him, but I heard him grunt, well, yeah, then I'm gonna grunt back to him because then he's thinking, I've got a dough.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01You see what I'm saying? Yeah. And I can pull him in that way. Or I do a snort wheeze if he's close enough. And that challenger usually I know on Whitetail, it man, when I do a snort, it's almost a slam dunk. He's coming in. I've had him look back at me from 80 yards out and then turn and go parallel into the timber 120 yards out. And what they do is they make this big circle, and then I've had them pop out. When they do that, they'll pop out like 10 yards from my stand or my blind. Because they just made this big circle to get the wind in their favor to come around and see what's, you know, figure out what where's that buck at?
SPEAKER_03Where's
Full Rut Tactics Follow The Does
SPEAKER_03that buck at? What's what's talking to me?
SPEAKER_01But they've every time I've snort wheezed, they've always come in.
SPEAKER_03Okay. Pre rut, we're starting to move into there during start uh Of October, we're moving into it. But by the end of October, we're generally if the weather's cooperating like last year it didn't. Correct. It was it was seventies, I think, in uh November. It was it sucked. But by the end, you're looking at cold days. I mean, towards the end, I think I had low forties was the high temperature.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_03So by then you're in full blown rut.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And at that time, at that particular time, what I like to do is latch on to a dough.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01I'm more apt to do that than I am to try a bunch of this because I know that those bucks are searching. And when they hit that search in mode, I mean they're gonna just go all day. All day. And what I want is I don't want necessarily a dough out in the open. I'd rather have a doug that's in thick stuff that I can just sit there and watch because he'll want to stay to the cover most of the time. And if she's in there, then I typically get more bucks coming into that thick cover than I would out in the open. Typically.
SPEAKER_06Typically.
SPEAKER_01So what I do is I I'd search for does and just sit there once I found one, just latch onto it and just follow her for the day.
SPEAKER_03So that is full-blown rut. How long is that that lasting? It probably depends a lot on how many does are in the area and how many dominant bucks are breeding them.
SPEAKER_01Right. How many does, how many bucks, weather, you know, weather controls a lot of it. It really, really does. If if we've got good weather where everything is just right, it's cold, it's it's wet, I'd say about a week and a half, two weeks are really good on fire hunting for that first rut cycle. And then it'll taper off, and then we hit kind of a lull. And we're kind of experiencing that right now on our cameras.
SPEAKER_05Yes.
SPEAKER_01All of our sets, we we're not seeing any branch bucks right now. Whereas it was going crazy here last week. You know, we just every day was a new buck, he was a fork and horn, he was a three point, he was a four-point. And then once we get through that first estra cycle, then it's kind of a post-rut where things start settling down. Dogs are hiding because they're tired of being chased. Bucks are locking down the does that that they can find, but it just it hits like this low. And typically from November 6th through the 20th, it just begins to ramp back up again. Okay. As we come into that second estrus cycle.
SPEAKER_03Okay. And so that, and I know you you've talked a lot about the numbers, that about 70% of the doughs get bred in that first estrus
Second Rut System For Daylight
SPEAKER_03cycle. Right, right. And so then you're dealing with 30, and the and and this is moving into more of answering why you love late season, is this system, it's creating the illusion that there's another dough out there that needs to be bred.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_03So or that is available to be bred.
SPEAKER_01Right. So in my seminars, I explain if you take your deer herd and you say, let's say we've got the range of a buck. We know there's a dominant buck in the area. And then that area, there's about, oh, let's on average, what would maybe 30 deer.
SPEAKER_06Okay.
SPEAKER_01So of the 30 deer, we're gonna say, let's say under half of them are breedable does. Okay. So let's go you want to go 13? Let's go 13. So 13.
SPEAKER_03That means there's four left of 30 percent. Yeah, I already did the math. I can do the math faster than you can type in the numbers. You know that.
SPEAKER_01So if there's 13 breedable doughs, 70% of them get bred during the first ester cycle, that means that in the second ester cycle, there's four doughs.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So that buck, that dominant buck, is looking for four doughs in that second ester cycle.
SPEAKER_05Yes.
SPEAKER_01Now, if I sit there and I offer him in a if I sit on my set and every time I go in or I go in every other day and I refresh my scents, then what I'm and every time he comes through, he's smelling those scents and the other, and you know, everything I put it together, the way I lay it out, the portions I do, and everything, he thinks there are multiple doughs in that area at that spot that have been coming through every day in that spot, and they're still coming into standing estrus. They haven't been bred. Yeah, so what does he start doing? I start watching on my camera, and as I'm watching him on my camera, at first I'm only getting, you know, nighttime picks of him. And first he comes in once a night or once every two days at night, and then all of a sudden he's multiple times during the night, and it may be two hours apart, three hours apart, but he's coming in three, four times a night, right? Well, then it's all of a sudden he's coming in about every 45 minutes or every hour and 15 or hour and a half. He's frequently quite a few times throughout the night, and I see that he's getting closer and closer to either in the morning or in the evening, because he's figuring out they're not there at night. So he's like, I must, you know, he's thinking I I gotta come by through the day in the daylight, you know. And so now once I figure out, okay, he's gonna daylight in the morning before he daylights in the evening, because he's getting he's closer to the morning. Yeah, okay, well then that's when I'm gonna set up well in advance before he gets there. And when he comes through in the daylight, that's when I'm gonna kill him.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and when you figure out whether it's morning or evening, you want to be in and settled long before well before he's gonna come by.
SPEAKER_01I like to be there like four hours before.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, because he could shift his timing a little bit. Right.
SPEAKER_01And you want everything to settle back down, you know.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01You know, because and to think that that like right now, I know on one set I've got five small bucks.
SPEAKER_05Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01I gotta get in there, and if I bump one of them off the set, I gotta have time for that to settle back down by the time that I'm expecting that big shooter.
SPEAKER_03Uh-huh. Okay. And another reason you like late season is because of the the coats, the winter coats that are growing. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I it I love Bill Hunting, but I gotta be honest, that summer coat is just ugly to me. I really do love the late season coats. Yeah. It's so that all the grays and the browns and the blacks that are in that coat.
SPEAKER_03And it doesn't look as I don't want to say mangey, but yeah, it does. It looks a little more mangegy.
SPEAKER_01The summer coat looks like they've got mange. When they're losing that summer coat and transitioning to the winter coat, it just looks like okay, it makes them look scraggly or just like he's unhealthy.
SPEAKER_03That in-between haircut phase where it's like, well, it's not quite long enough. I need to go get another haircut, but I'm I'm having trouble combing it in the right right direction. Okay, so that that would be the second rut. And it just it's comes down to it's just easier to create that illusion. If you're adding another buck to four or adding another dough to four versus adding another dough to thirteen right, because I make him feel like he he has to be there.
SPEAKER_01That's where the patterning part comes in. He starts cycling through so much, he's patternable.
Post-Rut Food Weather And Wrap-Up
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because there's so few dough that are in estrus versus the first rut, where there's so many does, there's no rhyme or reason to where he's gonna be outside of the fact that there's a dough over there in standing estrus, or there's a doe over here in standing estrus.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Okay, so kind of to wrap things up, post-rut. When does that kick in?
SPEAKER_01Post-rut usually so I usually kill a big buck sometime between you know, it used to be between the 12th and the 18th of December.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01After that, I mean, and and even it during that time, we're looking at post-rut where things are winding down and and then food starts to become a factor in where these bucks want to be as well. Before that, when they're rutting, they don't care.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You guys are like, well, you know, you guys are baiting or whatever, and guys will put out whatever apples, carrots, pears, whatever they use, you know, and and guys will look at well, he's cheating, you know, he's doing that. And the reality is is during the rut, they just they don't care.
SPEAKER_03No.
SPEAKER_01Big boys, I mean, those those box aren't looking for food, they're looking for the girls.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So yeah, if you get the girls hooked on food, yeah, because they might still be looking.
SPEAKER_01And even then, though, I mean, the food's out there at dark. So it's like what's stopping them from coming at night when they feel safe versus when it's daylight. Exactly.
SPEAKER_03You know, so it's just manipulating that position or that pressure and stuff.
SPEAKER_01That's where the scents come in.
SPEAKER_03And I know so last year when we talk about the rut and everything, it's it would cool off and then things would start picking up rut activity and then it'd warm up and then it'd shut it down. Yeah. And so it'll shut down and then it has to start up again. And it did that really up until they were doing rutting into January, weren't they, last year? It would just or showing behavior of that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it was just a real trickle last year. It just it really never got going because uh you know, I said it, weather trumps everything, it doesn't matter. Yeah, if it's if it's too warm, their activity just slows down to a crawl. It really does. And we really struggled last year. It was it was a tough season.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01But this season's much different. We've got a lot more buck activity on camera on our sets than we've had in a long time.
SPEAKER_03A little more actually, it's been I would say the activity has been even more just knowing you than it's been in quite a long time, especially big bucks and coming in early because we did have kind of a cooling off period in August and in September, and it's La Nina year. Right.
SPEAKER_01Last year was El Nino, so it was really warm and dry.
SPEAKER_03Warm and dry, and this is cold and wet, and it's supposed to actually extend till next year, too. Which, if everything's going great this year, hopefully that bodes well for next year as well.
SPEAKER_01And I think you know, we we're seeing higher buck numbers out there because there just wasn't a lot killed last year.
SPEAKER_03Well, you know what's interesting with that is I was reading an article, the harvest report, Northwest Sportsman, and they actually said in Southwest Washington there were more bucks harvested, the most amount of bucks harvested in 10 years. They had the most last year, but it was the fewest three point or better bucks harvested. And it was basically so a lot last year a lot of guys just got spikes and fork horns, and which is with the big bucks, which is typical.
SPEAKER_01That those numbers are always high. Yeah, you're always gonna have a lot more guys killing fork and horns and spikes than three points and four points and whatnot. And a lot of it is not the skill of the hunter that has nothing to do with it. Yeah, it is the confidence of the hunter. They're gonna shoot the first thing they see because they feel like they don't they may not have another chance at a buck all season. So they they take those, you know, and that's fine.
SPEAKER_03But what we've talked about with the rut and all of this behavior and and when you're hunting and all of that is more for if you're trying to get that dominant big buck, right? And those were the ones that just weren't taken last year. Right. So the weather affects their behavior, and so last year it there there's your proof, is there just weren't as many big bucks taken. There were a whole lot of little ones, the most in ten years, but the big bucks And there's been a lot of people. They just weren't out there because they weren't, and yes, this year has been. We've seen a lot of really good pictures so far.
SPEAKER_01So beautiful deer.
SPEAKER_03All right, thank you again for joining us this week. We want to talk about how we wrap up our season with some of the episodes coming up. So keep listening, and we will see you next week.
Podcasts we love
Check out these other fine podcasts recommended by us, not an algorithm.
The Young Guides Podcast
The Young Guides Podcast
NOCKAHOLICS: THE EVERYDAY ARCHERS
Nockaholics
PNWild Podcast
pnwild
The Born And Raised Audio Experience
Born And Raised Outdoors