Scales Of Success Podcast

#9 - Debunking Leadership Myths with Niten Kapadia

• Marcus Arredondo

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Have you ever wondered how Steve Jobs’s obsession with detail or Elon Musk’s quick decision-making revolutionized the tech world? In today’s episode, host Marcus Arredondo connects with Niten Kapadia to share transformative insights from his time at Apple with Steve Jobs and Tesla with Elon Musk. Discover how attention to detail, rapid iteration, and purpose-driven leadership shaped groundbreaking products and industries. You’ll also gain practical advice on scaling businesses, overcoming challenges, and building consumer trust. Whether navigating your career or creating a mission-driven company, this episode will inspire you to pursue excellence and thrive with resilience.

Niten Kapadia is an accomplished General Manager with a strong background in the consumer sector. He recently served as COO of HODINKEE, a US-based watch content and commerce company. Previously, he led Marketplace Operations and launched Beauty at FARFETCH, including acquiring VIOLET GREY. Niten has also held leadership roles at Tesla and Apple, managing sales teams and retail operations. He holds degrees from the University of Texas at Austin, UCLA Anderson, and the National University of Singapore.

Learn more about Niten Kapadia:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/niten/ 

Episode highlights:
(2:40) Lessons from tech visionaries: Steve Jobs and Elon Musk
(13:51) Apple and Tesla customer experience
(22:16) Building brand loyalty through authentic communication
(27:10) Driving commerce through content and trust
(35:17) Navigating growth and challenges during the pandemic
(42:01) Navigating growth and profitability in business
(47:03) Predictions on emerging industry disruptors
(52:58) Reflections on resilience and purpose-driven work
(58:46) Nourishment for the mind
(1:00:21) Outro

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Note: The transcript was generated by AI and may contain errors.

Niten Kapadia: 0:00

But being able to articulate what you're trying to do, what problem you're trying to solve and how you're going about doing it and, over the course of time, building, garnering trust with you know, a very discerning consumer audience that can expand through, you know, viral moments, whether it be on the internet or otherwise.

Marcus Arredondo: 0:17

Today's guest is Niten Kapadia, a seasoned operator and general manager who has held leadership roles at some of the world's most iconic companies, including Tesla, apple, farfetch'd, and, most recently, as COO of Hodinkee. We explore his insights on building successful brands, balancing growth and profitability, and the lessons he learned working under visionaries like Steve Jobs and Elon Musk. Let's start the show. Welcome to the Scales of Success podcast, where we take deep dives into the mindsets of game changers, visionaries and mavericks, exploring what success means to them and the pivotal choices that shape their journeys. Whether you're in the arena yourself or looking to elevate your game, you'll find inspiration and actionable insights from stories of innovation and resilience.

Marcus Arredondo: 1:00

I'm excited to welcome you to another enlightening conversation on Scales of Success. I'm excited to welcome you to another enlightening conversation on Scales of Success. All right, well, dude, it's awesome to have you. Thank you for doing this and carving off some time. I'm really excited to talk to you because I think you've got such an insight into consumer behaviors, among a number of things. But I wanted to kick this off because your experience ranges pretty wide on the retail side and it seems like it's sort of climbed not to suggest that your early stages weren't considered luxury goods, but the later stages certainly were in the luxury good environment. Before we go into that, I wanted to pick your brain about your experience under a culture of two of maybe the greatest visionaries we'll see in our lifetime, between Elon Musk and Steve Jobs, and I was sort of curious what's your takeaway from having worked in that environment and what do you think makes their pursuit and the culture they build so unique?

Niten Kapadia: 2:04

Yeah, I mean they're definitely. It's well documented. Both of them are icons and builders, in many regards visionaries. I joined Apple in 2003, just at the sort of like right after the release of the iTunes store and so joining the retail division of Apple and having an opportunity to sort of be on the front lines of the business, but also, I think, in the early stages of Apple building out its retail strategy. You know, steve Jobs was definitely very hands-on in the retail portion of the business, working closely with Ron Johnson and the rest of Apple Retail.

Niten Kapadia: 2:47

And you know the devil's in the details. I think for a guy like Steve, one of the things that was really remarkable was how closely in tune he was to the business and he often talked about his leadership lessons throughout his sort of journey. And one of the things that I took away was really, you know, it's the thousand little details around execution that matter, and until something's fully finished, don't necessarily put it out to the world. And I thought that that was really an interesting insight as it relates to building a store, building a product, building a service, but it was more along the lines of learning through failures, of when things didn't work and how to quickly adjust the sales or adjust the strategy and evolve. And, being at Apple for close to 13 years and seeing a variety of different products and services and new categories launch, it was really interesting to see, you know, learning from various mistakes but, more importantly, building upon a variety of different successes of products, whether it be, you know, the iPhone, ipad, apple TV, apple Watch, etc. Etc. With Elon. You know, I spent about a year and a half at Tesla and I think what I took away at Tesla, and particularly Elon, was how quick to act and how swiftly the business moves and the sense of urgency as a builder that Elon really kind of acts with as a sort of operator and visionary.

Niten Kapadia: 4:24

When I first joined the business it was just right after the announcement of the Model 3. And Model X was just coming off the lines and you started to see more Model Xs in California and other parts of the country, but primarily California, and there were some definitely consumer behaviors around obstacles and I remember sitting in the factory in Fremont with Elon in my first week and he was going around the room asking questions around like what are some ways to drive sales of Model X? And my territory was Southern California and Hawaii and I was just brand new to the business and price points, particularly for a vehicle this size, was a concern and that was like initial feedback that I had received from the team and from consumers. You know, price points, particularly for a vehicle this size, was a concern and that was like initial feedback that I had received from the team and from consumers. So I suggested maybe making a smaller battery pack and what was remarkable about Elon is he's thinking real time and he's immediately calculating gross margins and that it would be a loss making business to do a smaller battery pack, given that the vehicle had been overengineered he was suggesting these are all the reasons why that would fail. But you know what? That's an idea, let's try it.

Niten Kapadia: 5:37

And lo and behold, in about two weeks' time the Model X 60-kilowatt battery came out and it was a massive flop but quickly adjusted and discontinued, maybe about three months later I mean you can cross-check that. But it was really interesting to see as an entrepreneur, as a CEO and, more importantly, I think, as a leader, tactically getting involved in the details to just see how he can drive the business through with a sense of urgency. So two very similar behaviors, but perhaps different tactics in how they went about driving their businesses. Well, I want to talk a little bit through with a sense of urgency. So two very similar behaviors, but perhaps different tactics in how they went about driving their businesses.

Marcus Arredondo: 6:08

Well, I want to talk a little bit about two things learning from mistakes and just how swift to act. And starting with swiftness, when you think of a couple of things. First of all, the fact that it's technology, the ability to act and learn from it, is probably you have a faster learning curve than maybe some other non and more analog type businesses. But when taking that approach and I'm looking at it since you were there from the genesis of iTunes and then preceding the iPhone, you were really there for the boom, the earth shattering event that took place once we got the iPhone. You were really there for the boom, the earth shattering event that took place once we got the iPhone and then sort of what followed. I'm curious, from the perspective of swiftness to act.

Marcus Arredondo: 6:54

If you witnessed from being at Apple when that phone came out, what did you see as the benefits of coming to market and how quickly was that. And then, how quickly did you see as the benefits of coming to market, and how quickly was that. And then how quickly did you see the iterations that followed? Because it seems like there's a priority in both of those entities is ease of use, the adaptability of the product over time through software updates. Those were features that really we had never experienced before, certainly in vehicles, and I'm wondering if you could just comment, as you take away from that experience and going into your own path and getting into leadership positions later which we'll talk about, how you approach the balance between research and actually putting that product in front of consumers to test and to revise.

Niten Kapadia: 7:45

Yeah, that's a great question. I'm just like shuffling my memory back towards 2007. So, I mean, iphone was definitely, very much so, an iconic product and it's still, I think, you know, close to 20 years later, 18 years later, you know, has built massive industries across, you know, multiple sectors. But looking back when the iPhone was announced at Macworld in 2007, in January, to when it was released in June, late June, in 2007, there was a lot of buildup and mostly positive press, but there was definitely some, you know, businesses that scrutinized the price points that were announced for iPhone and initially Apple had released two different models the 4 gigabyte model and the 8 gigabyte model. And you'll have to keep me honest on the price points, but I think that they were at roughly $600 and $700 or $500 and $600, respectively. And you know the initial thesis was gosh, this is the most expensive cellular mobile phone smartphone that's come out in the market. And there were folks like Steve Ballmer who were scrutinizing like who would ever buy such a thing. And, from a supply chain standpoint, apple had pretty much split its inventory between half, you know, the 4 gigabyte and half of the 8 gigabyte, and keep in mind this was, you know, sort of in the post-iPod era of people wanting to keep all their content, like music, et cetera, on phone and consolidate devices. And lo and behold, you know, I think, that one of the surprises, and a really pleasant surprise was I remember being a store manager for one of the Apple stores here in the LA area that almost 85% of the demand was for the higher price point model, and immediately it was like okay, how do you quickly adjust the sales to go back to China and produce more 8GB models and even, furthermore, push the storage capacity for future generations very quickly, particularly when solid-state memory was quite expensive at that time. And so I remember having a conversation with the SVP of retail, ron Johnson, and it was like, wow, that's really remarkable that so many people are requesting that. And you know very quickly, learning through the rollout of iPhone, how do you actually assess demand online? You know when consumers are buying online and coming in store to pick up so that you can actually get ahead of production planning as it relates to the factories, as it relates to you know securing products, etc. And sure enough, I think, over the course of from 2007, the release of iPhone to then 2008, you know, with the release of the iPhone 3G, the price points as well as the storage capacities, increased.

Niten Kapadia: 10:38

Now you talk about mistakes. I mean iPhone. The launch in 2007 was remarkably successful. I mean, you know, immediately captured 1% of the market share within less than three months of mobile phones being sold in the US. When you think about iPhone 3G and the second year, it was also the introduction of the App Store. If you look back and remember, it was also the introduction of a service called iCloud and it was also the update of iOS.

Niten Kapadia: 11:09

And so you know, thinking about those various products but also services being introduced, it was definitely not Apple's finest day in terms of product launches and it was an extraordinarily challenging time to just learn from mistakes of how do you make sure, when you're introducing not just a brand new product that's heavily anticipated on a 3G network, but also various services internet services like iCloud, as well as the App Store that it just doesn't overwhelm networks and really suffer the consumer experience as well as internally within the team.

Niten Kapadia: 11:44

You know, suffer the consumer experience as well as internally within the team. But you know Steve, as well as the rest of the Apple leadership, quickly stood up and said we're so sorry that you know we put the business through this. This wasn't Apple's finest day and we're going to make sure that we do everything in our power to. You know kind of make things right, and so you know, being a store manager of a very busy Apple store in Santa Monica at that time, you know it was reassuring to share that, not just with the customers but internally with the teams of like. We're going to get through this, but these are hard hard times as it relates to like you know, delivering a customer experience that Apple strives for.

Marcus Arredondo: 12:16

Between that time and then before you left, which was what? 2014, maybe a little bit later than that, yeah, 2016. 2014, maybe a little bit later than that, yeah, 2016. 2016. So between that timeframe, the market share that Apple had, at least in the phone market, skyrocketed right. I mean, it was completely different to the point where I remember when I first got my iPhone, I go in and it would be very easy to get somebody to help me to when you left, where it was you had to schedule, you know, an appointment to get in. I'm just curious as that growth happens, it's really difficult, I would imagine, to anticipate that growth right, Both on a not just on a product basis, to have the product available, but also to have the personnel and the staffing to tend to that demand. How did you navigate that from a strategy perspective? What did you use to predict? And I'm curious if you know what experience there even was applicable to your time at Tesla?

Niten Kapadia: 13:14

Yeah, it's a really important question. So the Apple retail stores I mean part of the sort of genesis of Apple retail was to own the entire customer experience from the moment where the company was able to build ownership and expand market share through, you know, getting more owners of Apple products, to then deepen the relationships of customers with the brand through either support as well as education, which is oftentimes in the rear part of the store where you see various classes and services, like you know, the Genius Bar, etc. In the initial stages of Apple opening up its stores, you know, pre-iphone, it was almost like you had to beg customers to come to the Genius Bar. You know, at the very onset of Apple opening up its stores I still remember my first store there was like a refrigerator in the back with ebion water to convince customers. Over my first door, there was like a refrigerator in the back with ebion water to convince customers here like come, hang out, like talk to these trained and certified geniuses who you know had experienced technical knowledge of all of the products. By the sort of expansion of the iPod era and then into the iPhone era, there was definitely a queue, a massive wait line and multiple days to where assessing the demand of when customers needed either educational help or technical support had to really be measured, based on, you know, demographics of where those physical stores are located.

Niten Kapadia: 14:38

Expanding into third party networks and other sort of service providers, and you know, I think it's the penetration of various products came about separating the staff to be able to figure out like, is this mobile support, is this desktop support? So on and so forth, to where now, I think you know, a lot of self-help has really been driven towards, not necessarily having the customer be able to actually even physically come into a space and waste their time and create, you know, negative experiences, but being able to provide, you know, virtual support, whether it be through chat or through, you know, video conference, etc. But that was a narrative process, year over year, being able to measure you know how many customers weren't able to actually get serviced and there was a fall off and, as a result, you know how many customers weren't able to actually get serviced and there was a fall off and, as a result, you know being able to then measure what the not just net promoter scores but what actually would fall out in terms of those customers likely to buy another Apple product or their sort of overall lifetime value of the customer itself. So there's a massive analytics and loyalty team at Apple, you know. I'm sure even today it's grown, but it's really interesting to see how a physical retail strategy can influence what the customer is thinking. And also, how do you measure that demand? As it relates to that, when I translate that experience to Tesla, very similarly, I think a lot of customers in 2016 and before 2016,.

Niten Kapadia: 16:09

You know Tesla was building out its you know, a combustion engine vehicle to a electric vehicle that you know range anxiety could be addressed through the supercharger network and immediately, I think, when Model 3 was announced and with the abundance of Model S and eventually Model X owners, the supercharger network became overwhelmed to where you know there was a wait. The supercharger network became overwhelmed to where there was a wait and I remember, when I first joined Tesla, going and touring various superchargers and seeing a supercharger network. You're going to be able to have to charge it at home or at work, etc. And sure enough, you know Tesla worked with various partners to do that but being able to assess the demand of charging particularly, there was a massive team involved with expanding superchargers because that was, you know, addressing a core concern for migrating from, you know, combustion engine to an electric vehicle is like range anxiety. But being able to actually then determine like what? How many supercharges do you need in an area Like, let's say, los Angeles has approximately 10 million people let's assume that you know electric vehicles represent, you know, 5% of the overall, you know, mix of cars, how many supercharges do you need and where and what do we need to go after in order to appease these customers? And so there's definitely quite a bit of work that was done around expanding charging as an infrastructure, but also retail stores, and I remember very distinctly there was a call where there was concerns about Tesla's performance.

Niten Kapadia: 18:03

This is Model S, model X, around 2017. Elon was like well, how many stores do we have? You know like what's the penetration of stores? And you know he was like there's about that time, there's about 325 million people in the US. He's like we should have about 325 stores. You know one per million. He was like in LA, how many do we have?

Niten Kapadia: 18:24

And you know like oh we have like four, I was like, okay, well, we need to double that, we need to get to 10. So there was definitely some pushes around making the brand more accessible, based on the demand as well as the supply of vehicles the factory could produce itself. So I think, some similar ways, but maybe perhaps a bit different in terms of not just in its physical spaces but also the infrastructure to support it, like in charging.

Marcus Arredondo: 18:49

So what I find interesting about. So, for example, what I found got me into Apple. I had a gum-shaped little mini right that I used to run with a iPod shuffle and that's what got me into the ecosystem. I never really sort of bought into it and when I got that and I dumped all my music on there, it was sort of game changing. And from that moment forward, little by little, I got indoctrinated into the entire Apple ecosystem Till now where it's from phone to computer to Apple TV. It's completely surrounding me.

Marcus Arredondo: 19:22

And I think that was sort of the Jedi mind trick that Apple was successful at, which was creating an environment where there was value being added at sort of multiple turns that were beneficial on their own and in their own right, but when added to other Apple products it became considerably more beneficial. And I look at Tesla. It's a little bit more challenging because the adaptations in the technological world happen far more quickly and there's an analog component to the growth of Tesla, whether it's changes to the actual physical vehicle or adding more charging stations sort of throughout. But there's an educational component that you keep referencing of consumers understanding what they're getting themselves into and then sort of the rolling out of those solutions and the patience, because there is a relationship in both of those categories that I find are extremely unique, different than maybe a Microsoft product or a BMW. There's enthusiasts all over the world for each of those types of products, but the enthusiasts for Tesla and Apple seem to be I wouldn't suggest, maybe more patient, but they are buying that product not just for the product itself but also what the product represents to a large degree, and I sort of alluding to something which is a greater purpose.

Marcus Arredondo: 20:46

I have always found that a lot of companies tend to do better when not just employees but even the consumers to whom they are catering believe in something, in aligning themselves with an identity that is beyond just the product and that you know it's most easily identified within Apple as sort of think different. Right, we want to be a different than sort of the BlackBerry user or, you know, the Dell desktop type of person. How do you think that's influenced? You know, and I'm sort of jumping aroundBerry user or the Dell desktop type of person how do you think that's influenced? And I'm sort of jumping around here. But even when you got to Violet Gray, for example, what role do you think having a sort of a greater drive, a greater purpose that employees and even consumers can sort of get behind. How valuable do you think that is? Do you think that's a necessity Like? What role does that have in driving revenue?

Niten Kapadia: 21:39

Yeah, it's a really important question. I think a lot of this comes down to communication with the consumer and having a very fluid and two-way form of communication with the consumer. You know, looking back and sort of connecting the dots from Apple to then Violet Gray and other experiences like Hodinkee, which we'll get into a lot of this. Going back to 2007, the consumer who was purchasing the iPhone the early adopter had watched so many of the product marketing videos. If you look at some of these videos from 2007 on YouTube, it's like Bob Borchers from Apple's product marketing team, talking about all the various ways in which you use a brand new product. So those customers who are waiting overnight in some cases multiple days in front of an Apple retail store in 2007, on June 29th, they were like they already knew how to do things. They already knew that there was not copy cut paste. They knew that there were a variety of things that were missing from the phone, but they were so enthusiastic and proud about how to actually use a product. In the same way, I think the early adopters of an electric vehicle like a Tesla already knew how the charging port unlocked or how to use the UX screen of a Tesla to be able to actually navigate its 17-inch screen in a Model S. And so I think when you have that early adopter, who is really, I think, the proponent for new technology, is well-documented with just product marketing in general, I think that it makes it so much easier.

Niten Kapadia: 23:21

And so, for a business like Violet Gray and for some context for people out there who are unfamiliar with that business, violet Gray was founded in roughly 2008, and it was a business that was really centered around, you know, a content to commerce business by this woman named Cassandra Gray who really wanted to educate customers about the best beauty products and the industry's best or you know, the beauty prestige, beauty industry. And sure enough, I think she and the team of violet gray built a focus on creating really great content with iconic legends in the entertainment space as well as just broadly speaking, in the beauty space. And what made that so sticky was, you know, people would watch a video and they would understand like a product that really built. I think Violet Gray's business was this Augustinus butter cream. And for someone spending $250 on a bottle of you know moisturizer face moisturizer I mean that's a lot of money. So how do you actually see the results? And it's like you know, cassandra had this line of like it's expensive but worth it.

Niten Kapadia: 24:33

And you know, and I think you know like there's ways in which you can actually convey that message, whether it be in a category like beauty products, or whether it be in consumer electronics, like Apple, or in automotives, like Tesla, and I think that that way of being able to create an authentic communication tool, whether it be via video or podcast or presentation of sorts, really comes down with a lot of personality and infusing not just the persuasion or the confidence but the conviction of this product will change your life, and I think Steve did that remarkably well and the team at Apple, I think Elon and the team at Tesla have done that incredibly well for upending an automotive industry, and particularly just energy now at this point.

Niten Kapadia: 25:20

Granted, there's ebbs and flows, but on a smaller scale when you think about the beauty sector. Violet Gray was acquired by Farfetch in 2021 precisely for its ability to drive commerce from its content and the most recent business. I was in Hodinkee, which is a watch enthusiast website. Ben Clymer and the team at Hodinkee built its business by talking about watches, and that's actually a flagship product is a Talking Watches episode that originally started with Ben and John Mayer sitting down at a bar in Soho in New York talking about John Mayer's watch collection. And I think when you're able to create really great content, you're able to actually attract an audience and build trust. And that trust, I think, with consumers is what is actually truly is able to drive a product success or a service's success, more than anything else.

Marcus Arredondo: 26:15

So a couple of things I want to dive into here. First of all, at Violet Gray, how was it as a male in a predominantly female consumer business? What was your transition like? What were some of the hurdles there, if any, in sort of responding to that demand from a male perspective?

Niten Kapadia: 26:33

Yeah, I mean it was definitely a very steep learning curve For a category that I didn't particularly understand all that well.

Niten Kapadia: 26:43

Cassandra and the team were very receptive to educating me on the products themselves. I spent an inordinate amount of time working with the store team on Melrose Place and learning about all the products and getting to sort of understand directly from consumers what they were buying and why. My wife and family and friends were like laughing at how much I knew about a variety of different moisturizers. To you know other products and Violet Gray sold and you know, working hand in hand with a woman named Sarah Brown who's the chief brand officer for Violet Gray, she spent a great deal of time of talking about, you know, the industry's best edit of Violet Gray and why products would make the shelves and how the testing process between the Violet Gray committee and the code that would work to be able to actually get products into Violet Gray itself. So it was a steep learning curve. I'm not going to say that I'm a beauty expert by any means, but certainly know more than I did from the prior experience and I have a lot of respect for, I think, those who are working in the luxury or prestige beauty sector because it's a very competitive market and lots of different brands and massive organizations working there. But when you have a product that really stands out and to this day I still use a few products that I really love my wife is making fun of me there's one particular product that I can't live without and I think about some things, like a, a Bittner's daughter facial serum that I use like religiously at night, like she's like why are you using this? I'm like it's so good and you know, and I understand it, but like only through, I think, being able to understand product and its benefits. And then I think, furthermore, like how it can influence consumers' behaviors. Uh, and then I think, furthermore, like how it can influence consumers' behaviors, um, you possibly understand why.

Niten Kapadia: 28:38

You know, sitting at the store on Melrose Place, uh, you know various celebrities would send their PAs in to go, you know, run and get the Victoria's Beckham. You know, uh, number five, uh, eyeliner, and uh, you know they'd be buying them in bulk and I'm like, wow, this is amazing. Like, well, what, what does it benefit? How do you go about doing that? But you know, I think it's only through, actually, like you know, being curious and asking questions. Can you really understand a product in a category? But it was a steep learning curve and for me as a male I found, you know, there's definitely a lot of males in the beauty sector itself. But you know, I think it's like having a bit of humility to say I only know what I know and you know that's okay, it's not necessarily. I would joke anytime the team would talk about, like shampoos and you know, hair products and I'm like I can't really relate. I'm so sorry, but like I trust you. Like it's a voluminous conditioner, gonna say yeah, I would probably just trust your judgment on this.

Marcus Arredondo: 29:38

One thing you talk about, from Apple all the way to Hodinkee, is a little bit of a mixture of brand education, trust. I think we're in a unique world now where there's more than three network channels that we watch. There are a number of siloed communication. Watch one video because it'd have to be sold at 1.30 in the morning on a VHS infomercial. But now, given the speed with which we can connect to people, if you were to advise other burgeoning companies how to build brand and trust and loyalty among the constituents as it grows, what advice would you give? I mean, knowing there's a through line in all of these companies that have built successful followings of that trust. It seems to be maybe centered on an individual who has a vision and is clear and effective at communicating that vision. But I'm curious what your take is on building brand awareness, integrating that trust and developing a longer standing relationship with that consumer.

Niten Kapadia: 31:12

Yeah, while I've worked for a variety of companies I think you know we're working with some founders, like the most recent experiences at Violet, gray and Houdinki, or at Farfetch with Jose I think that there's trust starts with being able to identify what problem you're solving.

Niten Kapadia: 31:30

And I think for any business that's looking to sort of like you know, entrepreneurs looking to sort of start a business, or thinking about how do you communicate with consumers, I think it starts with the problem of what are you trying to solve. Apple didn't necessarily get iPhone overnight. It was like, if you look back to that you know, macworld January, steve Jobs iconic presentation. It was like, you know there's a screenshot of four of the leading smartphones. It's like a Nokia, a Blackberry. You know there's a Microsoft product on there. It's like these are the phones that are currently out on the market and you know here's why they're so challenged. There's like this plastic, cheap keyboard on half of the screen. Like you know, we want to be able to, you know, create this. So identifying a problem very early and being able to articulate what you're doing to solve it and I think every business and every brand that I've worked for that's done it really well starts with a problem statement and being able to then go through on a really simplified way of explaining. You know, here are the solutions that this problem is presenting or here's the challenges this problem is presenting and here's how we're attempting to overcome it.

Niten Kapadia: 32:42

I recently was admiring Sarah Blakely, starting that, you know, as an entrepreneur from Spanx. And then you know she's starting this new company that's sneakers and you know it's like okay, like women, like heels, and you know they want to wear sneakers and things that are comfortable. So she's starting with a problem statement and explaining that. Granted, it's early days for that business, but being able to articulate what you're trying to do, what problem you're trying to solve and how you're going about doing it and, over the course of time, building, garnering trust with you know a very discerning consumer audience that can expand through.

Niten Kapadia: 33:18

You know viral moments, whether it be on the internet or otherwise. I think that's how brands can grow and really, I think, foster organic growth versus. You know the early days of e-com paying. You know a variety of companies, whether it be Meta or Alphabet, et cetera, putting coins in the search engines for getting customers. Unfortunately, those days are over due to privacy reasons and otherwise. So I think being able to actually just focus on organic growth and being able to create content that evokes that. I think that's the future for any consumer-facing brand.

Marcus Arredondo: 33:59

Well, I guess, as a springboard for the future, I'm curious if you can just share a little bit about. I know that Farfetch was going through some strong growth, pre-pandemic and then into the pandemic. That was a shift of unadulterated proportions, I mean it was. It was unrelatable to any prior experience. I'm just curious if you could share with us maybe what, what were the challenges you were facing? How did you overcome that and sort of what were you? What did you find to be successful in building a cohesive team with the pressures that came from being so remote and everybody being home?

Niten Kapadia: 34:39

from a consumer perspective, yeah, I mean Farfetch, you know, was a business that was also started in 2008,. You know, really focused on the luxury fashion sector and to be a platform for luxury fashion. The founder and former CEO, josé Neves, from Portugal, was like dreaming up this way of consumers being able to shop online one website for multiple different luxury boutiques around the world. And eventually, you know, the site attracted both boutiques and brands. But you know that relationship with boutiques and brands, but you know that relationship with boutiques and brands started to get really challenging, I think, around the pandemic, as brands started to take on more selective distribution, prioritizing their own direct channels versus wholesale channels. So naturally, the supply of boutiques started to go down. But for Farfetch, you know, some of the challenges were like a really tight and focused strategy on supply and supply was like the primary moat that made Farfetch a very successful marketplace. But I think, as the business started to expand into multiple categories, whether it be beauty, whether it be, you know, thinking about its Farfetch platform solutions, whether it be on, you know, other acquisitions that the business had made Byleth Gray included in that, stadium Goods, new Guards Group, etc. You know, I think the business was catering on a very large cost structure of maintaining all these various you know employees around the world and you know the main revenue driver. The primary way in which the business was able to cover its costs was the marketplace, and so I think, when you lose sight of your core business itself and you think that that's on autopilot and it wasn't on autopilot the reality was consumers were quickly being more selective as the pandemic continued on. It was great in the early days, but I think it became even more challenging as 2022 commenced and there was obviously some macroeconomic volatility.

Niten Kapadia: 36:50

The turning point, I think, for Farfetch itself, was as the conflict in Ukraine began and Russia shut down as a region, and it was one of the top three regions. For the business itself, that was immediately. When you turn that off, it's very hard to annualize your revenue because you don't have the demand from one really important country, and so, as a result of that, that started to then cascade between Russia and China, the pressures that the business was facing to see how do you actually find growth in other places? And of course, for me, I think, looking back and reflecting some of the challenges that we faced was how can we do things with higher quality, better efficiency, lower costs and so thinking as a global team, where can we prioritize resources to be able to achieve those things? And so part of that in the US was thinking about our teams across the Americas and thinking where can we find better resourcing in a downsizing business? And so offshoring, internationalizing some of our services, et cetera, became a priority and that was the sort of downshifting of PowerPatch itself while I was there through 2023.

Niten Kapadia: 38:04

But it was definitely very challenging to see where the business ended up and you know, it sort of got a lifesaver through the coupang acquisition in late 2023. But I left prior to that. But it was definitely very interesting to through the coupang acquisition in late 2023, but I left prior to that. But it was definitely very interesting to see where the business is at. Fortunately, I think now it's stabilizing a bit, but it's gotten through a massive reduction in the workforce and a much more cohesive, focused strategy primarily on the marketplace. So I'm cheering for the team there, hoping that the business is able to stabilize and chart a new path forward for growth.

Niten Kapadia: 38:38

But, um, I think, looking back, it's like you know, how do you stay focused and committed to where you are? Imagine if apple uh said you know the iphone is great, it's fine, and abandons, you know, any innovation towards the iphone and continues to focus on, like all its efforts on, like Apple Vision Pro, when it's barely any market share and it's probably not profitable at this point. That would be devastating for the business and certainly the street and other investors would scrutinize the business on, you know, its decision making. So I think every business needs to think really cohesively on like what's your strategy and how do you stay incredibly focused and laser focused on what you're trying to do?

Marcus Arredondo: 39:19

That's super interesting. You got me thinking about something completely independent, which is a little bit off subject, but I read an article recently in the New Yorker about Elon Musk's challenging position relative to his involvement with the Ukraine-Russia war, specifically because he was providing Starlink services to Ukraine but through allegiances between Russia and China, there was pressure from China, who is one of the larger acquirers of Tesla product, to withdraw from that assistance and the operation of these different companies, the pressures that one person. What makes Elon so unique is how intertwined he is on a global perspective and I think the example that you gave I think is really salient for some of us who may not quite comprehend how geopolitical forces really do have considerable effects on our commerce. Even forfetch and Hodinkee, you had a frontline experience with investor private equity pressures and exposure to M&A type involvement at sort of a different type of level than most people get to encounter.

Marcus Arredondo: 40:51

I'm curious if you could give any advice or thoughts to, let's say, somebody who's contemplating the involvement or taking on some private equity money as a means of growth or for acquisition purposes. What experience, what takeaways might you have or advice in knowing what you've experienced so far, especially through a challenging capital market environment. What would you say to them? It's a broad question, but I'm just curious. Any takeaways from those lessons learned?

Niten Kapadia: 41:26

I think, looking back to Farfetch and Bywood, gray and Houdinki those businesses and even Tesla, to that matter at some point or another the first three businesses that I mentioned they were unprofitable endeavors and so, when you think about the polarity for any business around growth versus profitability, it's not a trade-off of one or both, one or the other. I think. It's a matter of, I think, finding a balance to be able to make a business both growth and profit oriented. And you know, in the example of Hodinkee, here's a business that had raised capital, that had Series B raise in 2020, and went out and acquired another business Crown Caliber, in the pre-owned retail space watches, and there were some pressures because that particular category was unprofitable and it was actually costing its business a considerable amount of money in operating costs to be able to actually run that and find a way to break even the business.

Niten Kapadia: 42:37

After the successful Series C raise in 2023, investors were very clear that the business needed to find a fast and swift way to break even or profit. And I think that shouldn't be like this cold funge experience for any business to say, okay, now we got to be profitable, like that's the purpose of any business is being able to be self-sustaining and there should be always an angle of not just growth but profit oriented. And so I think, getting back to just simple basics of you know what's the purpose of the business and how do you balance both growth and profitability in a way that is sensible but also like logical for any team, and so you know, for me, I think, any business that I go forward with, I think, like you know, what's the path to profitability. If it doesn't make sense, if you can't articulate it on back of the napkin math, like you know, then maybe this really like, as an investor's call it, 36 months from 2021 to today is, you know, markets will continue to go up and down. I mean, you listen to any of the famous economists I'm a huge fan of Ray Dalio and the work he's done at Bridgewater Capital but, like you think about like principles and operating with principles, you know, I think it's a really important thing to like understand, like you know, the idea of free money.

Niten Kapadia: 44:19

It's not necessarily like a real, it's a real thing. There's going to be some, you know, economic pressures associated with that. So, unless there's like a viable way of creating value uh, that's, you know, both growth and profit oriented, you're not really solving a problem. So, uh, I uh though I love listening to old things that the Bezos uh ways of like being a loss making business for 20 plus years. I don't know if that's possible in this current day and age, I mean, maybe it is, but certainly I think the span of which Amazon was able to run as an unprofitable business and reinvest it back in the business is very difficult to do, I think, in this current environment.

Marcus Arredondo: 44:58

I appreciate that feedback. So one thing I wanted to talk a little bit about some your personal pursuit. Through all of these rungs you've climbed, because it's impressive and when you look at it in totality it seems swift, but it was. I witnessed a lot of the effort that it required in order to move forward and I think it's easy to overlook the challenges that you were facing at the time doing it, for example, having small children when you were going to business school and traveling all over the world. But before that, I wanted to ask one last sort of business related question.

Marcus Arredondo: 45:37

It's a little bit of a flyer, but when you look at especially Apple and Tesla, these were massive disruptors in their respective industries. You also mentioned Amazon. I mean, these are meta alphabet. These are companies that, when you look at their growth on a market cap, sure, but I think NVIDIA now their astronomical growth on a market cap, sure, but I think you know NVIDIA now their astronomical growth on a market cap, I think in many ways is telling to some degree of the impact they're having on either the world or that respective industry. Any predictions on what you see now, having your experience of what those next disruptors are going to be whether it's an industry or a company, I don't know, but this is open to your interpretation.

Niten Kapadia: 46:26

Yeah, that's a difficult question. I mean, certainly. I think a lot of businesses are in vogue around AI and automation and being able to drive that NVIDIA as one within that space, that's obviously become the poster child of AI. I do think that, as technology advances, businesses that are either focused on the services with natural language processing and natural language models, or the infrastructure itself to be able to compute whether it be the Microsofts, the Amazons, the NVIDIAs of the world those will benefit. But you know I go back to the simple basics of you know what problem is a company trying to solve for and you know, as a consumer, both as a business or as an individual consumer what inspires me about that business itself. You know evoke and share. You know why I find value, why it garners my trust, et cetera, and I think there's a variety of businesses that are doing incredibly well and great things.

Niten Kapadia: 47:26

I'm a huge fan with the family, as you mentioned, businesses that are focused in the experiential market. I think travel is one of those. I think this summer I spent traveling in Europe. We spent some time in Romania and Switzerland as a family and being able to use services like booking to be able to find places that make the most sense. Or Airbnb is another great example of that, where, you know, brian Chesky and the team have done remarkably well at, you know, creating an experience that makes sense. At creating an experience that makes sense. Brbo I was laughing at the new advertisements with Nick Saban around. How do you actually rent out your home in a way that is not creating so many rules and things? But I think that sector itself is going to be really interesting as people continue to travel around the world and, post-pandemic, I think that will only continue to grow and the unit economics are sound.

Niten Kapadia: 48:27

I think that there's other sort of spaces where people are trying to solve problems in the consumer sector, whether it be on, you know, fast-moving goods. I think, like you know, with two young children, I often find myself in the toil aisle and thinking about what my kids are doing and what they're buying. And you know, I think about brands like Mattel you know it's the world's largest. You know, toy manufacturer, but as they think about expanding their franchises beyond the toy aisle, I think that you know building my daughter's huge Barbie fan and the movie was an incredible success. My daughter is a huge Barbie fan and the movie was an incredible success. And so, thinking about some of the other productions that they're doing and building ecosystems within this, whether it be brands like Mattel or Hasbro partnering with Disney, I think that those are really interesting because you're creating not just collectors from kids but also adults as well. My son's like really proud to dress up for Halloween every year, and this year he's going to be a storm trooper, so our home is being flooded with Star Wars gear, and so you know, I think that there's ways in which companies can get ahead of it and do it and grow their businesses beyond maybe just one particular category, through entertainment and through other sort of experiences.

Niten Kapadia: 49:40

And then, of course, I think technology you know, I think you know the front runners of this space, particularly in health I think is really interesting as people are looking at, you know, choosing a lifestyle that's more healthful. I saw that recently the brand Aura I think you wear the Aura ring did an application of a berry, a data nation, of a very uh for uh glucose monitoring, and I think that that that is a really fascinating space. I secretly wish Apple would do a similar acquisition to make the Apple watch a continuous glucose monitor, but I think that, as people are looking after their cardiovascular health and their overall mental health, et cetera. I think that the these spaces, you know in these sectors, become really interesting around converging products and experiences. So those are a few examples of things that I'm following, but there's plenty more, I'm sure.

Marcus Arredondo: 50:33

That's great. So back to you, and I want to bring up a phrase that you used before, which is you know, problem solving is solving a problem. When you first came to LA and you started working at the Apple store, you came with a degree in film and television and we wondered what you were doing at Apple. And then, slowly but surely, we just saw you continue to climb the ranks and do more and more and more, and at each turn you had challenging decisions. I mean, I remember when you became GM, there was a whole series of challenges, including the Third Street Promenade front glass windows being broken at three o'clock in the morning because people were waiting for the iPhone release. I know you got involved with the Santa Monica City Council.

Marcus Arredondo: 51:27

It was bizarre, walking down the street and you saying hello to a number of police officers who knew you by name and greeted you as a good friend, and then making the decision to go get your MBA, to move on to Tesla and then to go into Farfetch and Hodinkee. All of these required inertia, it required discipline, it required tough conversations with yourself, I'm sure with your family. A lot of this was done during a time when you had very young children, and I'm just curious what problem were you solving and what did you think you know, looking back, what has been maybe the best or most reliable trait? You had to keep that pressure moving forward, to keep that motivation in challenging times. I'm sure there were moments where you said, like, is this even worth it? Talk to me a little bit about that.

Niten Kapadia: 52:21

Yeah, thanks for what you just shared. You know, seldom do I take time to look back in the rear view mirror and think about the roads and the journey that's come about since I came to Los Angeles, but I think it's important to look back and sort of think about the various chapters in one's career and the experiences more importantly connected up For me. I think that I gravitate as a just as a person, towards businesses that are have some form of a purpose. Coming out of film school and thinking about, you know, the tools and the products that I admired the most at the time, it was like using my Power Mac G4 with Final Cut Pro and I was, like you know, staring at this product in this tower and thinking, like God, this is an amazingly engineered product. I love this company. Like I would be so cool to work for Apple.

Niten Kapadia: 53:19

I think that what Steve Jobs and the team were doing in this sort of renaissance, it was a brand that I admired and, you know, looking back, it wasn't just about the person or the product. I think it's about finding a company that has some form of a mission, a vision around what its aim, what its purpose is and, you know, for me, you know, enriching people's lives through easy to use technology was something that brought me to Apple. And I think when you're having those difficult moments in your day to day or your quarter over quarter or whatever it is you know your experiences with a tough conversation with an employee or customer or whatever employee or customer or whatever you know I think it's going back to the purpose of why you're there. That really can kind of help, I think, transcend through those moments of challenge and change. To, you know, kind of like continue that. And you know, from Apple and going from that mission of enriching people's lives with easy-to-use technology to Tesla, around accelerating the world's transition to sustainable energy. Granted, there was conversations of, you know, from that moment I joined around all the problems with Model X and Model S and charging, et cetera to you know, the eventual, you know growth of the business. I think it's like reminding yourself of what the mission of that business was accelerating the world's transition. And you know I believe in that, I believe in that mission still to this day even. You know I've not been a part of that business for several years and you know, I think that the EV transition will continue and I'm hopeful that the solar transition will continue to expand across the world to make the world a more, you know, sustainable space. And so you know, my advice, and sort of connecting the dots and looking back on my career is buying businesses where there's a strong vision, there's a strong purpose around why they're there and what problem they're trying to solve. But like, more importantly, like why they're there For Front Touch, it was about, you know, really democratizing the access for luxury fashion and you know, though I'm not necessarily a I wouldn't say like I'm a luxury fashion shopper on a day-to-day basis I mean, I'm still a fan of many brands, particularly, like us fashion brands.

Niten Kapadia: 55:28

I'm a huge fan of tom brown and, like you know, being able to find products that like actually like you enjoy and find the inspiration. I think there's sites that help garner that trust and being able to do that in a way that like is sensible and you know that's what gravitated me towards farfetch to do that in a way that is sensible, and you know that's what gravitated me towards Farfetch and doing it in a really efficient manner in terms of like it's not carrying inventory, so I think it's finding businesses that can disrupt but, like you, you find that there's a vision associated with its purpose. That's what has led me. I think through that and certainly I think other businesses as well. But I think that that's what will continue through my career and hopefully other people's is they're finding, like you know, how do you find success? Don't just do it for you know a bigger title or more money etc. Find like, how are you like fitting in with? You know a vision of this business? Or, if you haven't found that vision, come with it yourself.

Marcus Arredondo: 56:22

You know, know a vision of this business or, if you haven't found that vision, come with it yourself. You know, yeah, and what do you think helped you in sort of facing those challenges? I mean, you, you, uh, what was the largest number of people you oversaw?

Niten Kapadia: 56:32

gosh, I think what you know, my sort of span of control was probably like upwards of 300 at one point, yeah, and you know, you know it's less about the quantum of the people, but it's like you know, finding, you know, individuals who you can influence and you can contribute ideas towards and create an environment of trust where people want to do their best work.

Niten Kapadia: 56:56

And so usually it's like thinking about my direct reports and that the team that I sort of work most closely with to be able to find out like okay, like how are we working towards a certain goal?

Niten Kapadia: 57:06

And now, um, I look back to my experiences before my career started. Like you know, I in college spent some time at university of Texas on the rowing team and, like you know, you find that the people in your boat I rode on an eight person boat like who you really trust and you spend a lot of time with in the mornings on the water and you know some days are uglier than others. Some days your boat may capsize and everyone's swimming in Town Lake. But you know, I think it's like you know, when you're finding that you really are committed towards showing up and being there with your teammates, with your colleagues, that's what creates that. So for me, I think it's less about the quantum of the number of people whom you oversee or you lead. It's more like find that small group of people that you know will do great work and then have trust that they're going to hire the right people that will support them, et cetera, et cetera.

Marcus Arredondo: 58:00

That's great feedback. What are you doing now to feed your mental diet? What books, podcasts, movies what's in that rotation right now?

Niten Kapadia: 58:09

Listening to your podcast, amazing people.

Niten Kapadia: 58:14

I recently I've been on this sort of health journey this past year, thinking about my own health and longevity, and I think I've been on this sort of health journey this past year thinking about my own health and longevity and I think I've shared this with you.

Niten Kapadia: 58:29

But I've nerded out over Peter Atiyah's book Outlive. I think that's a great book. If you have some time to sort of pick it up and do a chapter at a time, I think it's like a really nice way to sort of, you know, I think, just maximize your health span and your lifespan and, like you know, things that are important around sleep, around nutrition, around exercise etc. And, yeah, podcast wise, uh, you know I'm always a sort of thirsty sponge for a variety of different interesting things, but, um, yeah, I mean I I'm a huge fan of, like, what tim paris uh has done. I think he recently just re-released a new episode that's in my sort of queue with Kevin Rose, and so I'm curious to hear that and hear when they nerd out and talk about, you know, a lot of different things. So, yeah, those are a few Great feedback.

Marcus Arredondo: 59:15

What's the best way for people to get ahold of you and you know who would you want to hear from.

Niten Kapadia: 59:20

Yeah, I'm curious for any operator or any business looking to continue to sort of achieve growth and profitability and scale and do something with a purpose. Linkedin is probably the best channel to reach me at. I think that's probably where I'm most active in social media and so you can put the link in your podcast.

Marcus Arredondo: 59:43

Yeah, we'll include that in the show notes. Thank you so much, man. I really appreciate you being on. Any closing thoughts before we go?

Niten Kapadia: 59:49

No, thank you so much for your time, wishing you all the best, and thanks so much for the time. This has been really great. I've enjoyed myself a lot.

Marcus Arredondo: 59:56

Thank you, brother. Thanks for joining us on another Edge West Capital production of Scales of Success. If you found today's episode valuable, subscribe to the podcast and our newsletter at scalestofsuccesspodcastcom, where we'll share even more inspirational content on growth and resilience. We've got more incredible stories from independent thinkers and achievers who are challenging the status quo and actualizing what once was only the seedling of an idea. If you know someone who's also committed to uncovering what frameworks drive progress, consider sharing and help us spread the word. Until next time, I'll leave you with the words of Lao Tzu the journey of a thousand miles begins with one step.